irclog2html for #gllug on 20050905

00:12.46Leedsbye angelchild and good morning jonny1
00:20.01jonny1Hello.
00:38.08*** join/#gllug Erwin (n=erwin@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/Erwin)
01:01.42rhowegregj: heh, cool
01:01.50rhowegregj: I'll be pretty knackered though :P
01:01.56gregj;]
01:02.00Leedsgregj: this is on the way back from Spain?
01:02.03gregjbut than next day I go to Cracow again
01:02.05gregjyes
01:02.21Leedshad fun?
01:02.24gregjI am leaving Malaga tomorrow :(
01:02.35gregjyes, I managed to catch some cold today
01:02.39gregjbut appart from that, it was fun
01:02.52gregjit is damn hot up here, and we don't have aircon at the "residence"
01:02.57LeedsI caught a cold on Saturday
01:03.16gregjwhich is basicaly university's hostel
01:04.20gregjanyway, I am knackered as well, we were walking around for 3h
01:04.47gregjI have flight tomorrow at 12:30, which means I have to leave like 10 o'clock
01:04.58gregjthat means, shower, and go to bed like now
01:04.59gregj:-)
01:05.09rhowe'night
01:05.15Leedsfor a 1230 flight, we'd only leave our flat at 10ish
01:05.23Leedsyou don't need to be there before 11
01:05.37Leedsanyway, g'night
01:23.03JAVmorning... and good night :)
01:27.53gregjJAV: it's quite a problem when you want to improve driver support for exa, and play around with Xgl ;)
01:28.00gregjs/it/that/
01:28.14gregjanyways, I'm off to bed
01:28.43gregjgot the shower, girls are still having party downstairs, unfortunately I have to leave tomorrow, so can't join in
01:28.46gregj:(
01:40.46Leedsgregj: sleep is overrated
03:09.50*** join/#gllug Leeds (n=richardc@202.82.163.139)
04:49.49Leedshttp://tinyurl.com/9vqrt
05:41.51new2unixmoin all
05:52.44Leedsmorning
05:58.28new2unixmoin Leeds
05:58.33new2unixibot pi
05:58.34ibotsomebody said pi was 3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944592307816406286208998628034825342117067982148086513282306647093844609550582231725359408128481117450284102701938521105559644622948954930381964428810975665933446128475648233786783165271201909145648566923460348610454326648213393607260249141273724587006606315588174881520920962829254091
05:59.58Leedshttp://maps.google.com/maps?ll=22.420114,114.208878&spn=0.003835,0.006788&t=k&hl=en
06:00.18new2unixLeeds: the original link killed opera.
06:00.50Leedshttp://maps.google.com/maps?ll=22.279546,114.151801&spn=0.003839,0.006788&t=k&hl=en
06:01.02Leedshttp://maps.google.com/maps?ll=22.366686,114.116889&spn=0.003836,0.006788&t=k&hl=en
06:01.34Leedsof the three, the first is where I am right now, at the office... the second is where I'm going in a couple of hours to hear RMS speak to a Chinese audience... the third is where I live
06:02.14new2unixOpera found the tinyurl unfriendly.
06:02.50Leedsworks for me in Firefox :-)
06:03.25Leedshttp://maps.google.com/maps?ll=7.174220,79.891033&spn=0.032927,0.054305&t=k&hl=en is approximately the factory in Sri Lanka - they don't have detailed imagery for Sri Lanka
06:04.47Leedslovely and sunny here today
06:14.53new2unixlaters y'all
07:00.20Leedsmy problem is that I don't know how much of the Chinese email I get is spam and how much is valuable business mail which happens to not be in English :-)
07:09.06mozratMorning
07:09.14Leedsyou just became less stupid?
07:09.19mozratyes!
07:09.30mozratseeing as I am now reunited with my house/car keys
07:09.36mozratthat I left on my desk on Friday
07:09.48Leedsheh
07:11.36LeedsI assume you have spares
07:14.07mozratluckily wifey did
07:17.56Leedssomeone comments elsewhere that fosssl - which I'm off to tomorrow, apparently - could either be foss-sl (a Sri Lankan Free/Open Source Software convention) or foo-ssl (a package for securing 'stuff' without defining what 'stuff' is - with of course the client-side being bar-ssl)
07:23.24mozratheh
07:45.31Leedshttp://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/620868.html
07:47.44mozratDodgy Google
07:49.08mozratLeeds, I'm going to take you up on your kind offer to ship me some PSP games - how do you want me to pay you?
07:54.32Leedsum, ah...
07:54.44Leedsyou may have picked an amazingly bad time to say that...
07:55.36Leedsmozrat: in about 5 minutes, I'm leaving the office to go find RMS...  and I'm not expecting to be finished there until it's a little late to go shopping... and then I'm going to Sri Lanka tomorrow afternoon for a couple of weeks
07:55.56Leedshope you don't mind waiting until I get back
07:55.57mozratLeeds, ah no problems
07:56.00mozratno!
07:56.03mozratthats cool
07:56.46Leedshmm... I don't know how much individual games go for, but if I can fit it under 18 quid, there should be no VAT issues
07:56.52Leedsibot_: change 18 gbp to hkd
07:57.35Leedsibot_ hello
07:57.54Leeds$250, approximately
07:58.36Leedswhich, frankly, is cutting it a *little* close, but I'm sure the taxman wouldn't look too carefully at it :-)
08:00.50mozrat:)
08:04.26Leedstime to go... be back online later...
08:12.22*** join/#gllug Leeds-Treo (n=richardc@203.142.120.3)
08:12.45mozratwb Leeds-Treo
08:13.26Leeds-Treogood to be back
08:14.58Leeds-Treonot that they'd ever use it in London, but the advantage of *only* accepting octopus (oyster) on the bus is that they can easily charge for distance
08:16.10Leeds-Treomy bus in this morning cost $15.something (about £1.10) - this one is $6.60
08:17.09mozratI think they might go oyster only - they already have cash free buses in London
08:18.04Leeds-Treobut they'd still charge a flat fee, I think - and the average fee here must be well under £1
08:18.23mozratyes, true
08:21.27Leeds-Treoanyway, once I'm back from SL, I'l be happy to send some PSP stuff your way... SL is a great place for dodgy DVD/Xbox/PS2/PC stuff, but I doubt they're up and running with umd yet
08:21.53mozratWell I'm happy with legit stuff at the moment - just not paying £40 for a single game
08:22.57Leeds-TreoI would think around £20 each, plus p&p, assuming no VAT
08:23.14mozratSounds good to me
08:23.15Leeds-Treoshould be less than 25 anyway
08:23.40mozratI'll have to find out how to encode movies so they can be watched on the PSP
08:23.48mozratand get a 1GB card
08:24.20Leeds-Treoat the weekend, I bought a little dongle which tricks the DS into running native code from the GBA slot, and downloaded about 95 game images...
08:24.32Leeds-Treodongle cost $110
08:24.39mozratNice
08:25.49Leeds-TreoI have a GBA 'flash' cart which takes SD cards - cost £20 - so I can play pretty much all GBA and DS games :-)
08:26.28mozratibot GBA
08:26.29ibotextra, extra, read all about it, gba is Game Boy Advance from Nintendo, Inc.
08:26.33mozratah
08:28.10Leeds-TreoI'm waiting for the new xbox to come out so I can buy a dirt-cheap chipped original one - they go for about £100 atm
08:29.45Leeds-Treochipped for easy Linux-ing as well as dodgy games, of course :-)
08:30.46Leeds-Treoback in a mo
08:33.16*** join/#gllug Leeds-Treo (n=richardc@203.142.120.3)
08:33.41Leeds-Treowent to take a couple of photos...
08:45.05*** join/#gllug Leeds-Treo (n=richardc@203.142.120.3)
08:48.31Leeds-Treohmm... am in very Chinese Hong Kong, just passed a J.P.Morgan building with Ikea at the bottom...
08:51.15mozratThat Ubuntu tour discussed on -admin sounds alright
08:52.13Leeds-Treodon't think I'm on admin...
08:54.09mozratgllugadmin?
08:54.52Leeds-TreoI unsubbed... wrong side of t'planet and all
08:54.56mozratah
08:56.55Leeds-Treowow, expensive cab - £3.50!
08:57.01mozratshocking
09:06.56Leeds-TreoRMS starts by arguing with the guy who introduced him...
09:07.40*** join/#gllug wh00dini (n=myke@194.203.40.131)
09:08.00Leeds-Treoafternoon wh00dini
09:08.05wh00dinihello all
09:08.12mozratLeeds-Treo: good start then
09:08.22mozratdid the guy mention the dreaded L word?
09:08.29mozratwithout prefixing GNU/ ?
09:08.36Leeds-Treo4 freedoms now...
09:09.08Leeds-Treonah - he complimented gcc, emacs, gdb, etc on quality not freedom
09:10.42mozratthe fiend
09:11.01Leeds-Treo:-)
09:12.49Leeds-Treo"gnu is the funniest word in the English language"
09:13.44Leeds-Treonow he's onto the GNU/Linux thing
09:14.37mozratshame theres no streaming audio
09:15.26Leeds-Treoyeah... I can keep commentating if you like :-)
09:15.33mozratyes!
09:16.39Leeds-Treotalking about having to defend freedom or lose it - stay pure
09:17.02Leeds-Treoin theory, I probably could so one low-quality stream...
09:17.40Leeds-Treothere is wifi :-)
09:18.29mozratwhat kind of turnout / reception has he got?
09:21.14Copemorning from work!
09:21.40wethrinCope! You still have a job!
09:22.12Copeso far...
09:22.28mozratHows the new digs Cope?
09:23.58CopeHui seems to like them - lovely location.  I'm still in Romsey, though.
09:24.15mozratbit further for you to travel though?
09:24.16wethrin:)
09:24.17mozratto work
09:27.13Georgemoooo
09:27.24GeorgeI'm about to be kicked out :(
09:27.35mozratwho has ops here?
09:27.36wethrinha
09:27.39wethrinme
09:27.43wethrinLeeds-Treo:
09:27.45mozratoh you mean in real life as well!
09:27.59mozrathome time then George
09:28.06Georgeyes
09:28.11Georgethen school tomorrow
09:28.25wethrinheh
09:29.14Georgeblahl.
09:29.34Leeds-Treobugger, got to login
09:29.34*** part/#gllug JD (i=jd@light.bluelinux.co.uk)
09:29.35Leeds-Treorecording :-)
09:30.19Leeds-Treofull lecture theatre
09:36.46mozratSo George.. was aKademy a rousing success?
09:37.31Leeds-Treohe's on good form...
09:39.10Georgeesy
09:39.11Georgeyes
09:39.14Georgeblog.gwright.org.uk
09:39.15George:P
09:39.36wethrinblogs suck
09:40.03Georgewethrin sucks
09:40.12Leeds-Treoalthough I wonder if he realises that he's not in a democracy - he's in a palce where - legally - the parliament is elected by industry associations
09:45.36mozratwethrin: most blogs do suck
09:45.45mozratthe ones that don't are quite interesting
09:45.50wethrinmm
09:45.52Georgemozrat: mine sucks, eh? :P
09:46.14mozratGeorge: I don't read it that much.. seems OK
09:46.35George:P
09:46.43mozratI think planet.gllug.org.uk would be a good idea as discussed on ml and in here
09:47.17Georgeanyway, I need to pack the laptop
09:47.18Georgecya people
09:47.26GeorgeI'll prolly be online again when I'm back in .uk
09:47.34Georgein about 5 hours :)
09:47.39mozrathave a safe trip
09:48.11wethrinbye
09:49.19*** join/#gllug Leeds-Treo (n=richardc@203.142.120.3)
10:33.12*** join/#gllug kbsingh (i=kbsingh@cure.hiihaa.org)
10:40.02mozrathey z00dax
10:40.56kbsinghmozrat!
10:41.22mozrathow are you?
10:42.13kbsinghnot too bad, kinda upset a bit
10:42.18mozratoh :(
10:42.48mozratwhats up
10:42.52kbsinghmy prev employer.... snag'ed off 25% of my redundancy payout
10:43.05mozrathow did they justify that?
10:43.40kbsinghI only get tht bit, once I complete 4 years in employment
10:43.46kbsinghwhich happens to be 3 days down the road
10:44.02mozratgrr, bastards
10:44.12kbsinghso while the management had agreed to give me benefit of 4 years in employment - the finance and hr guys disagree
10:44.47kbsingh( the case I argue now, is that i had 6 days of pending holiday last year and 3 more the year before )
10:44.58kbsinghso techinically, I have indeed worked more than 4 years
10:46.03kbsinghanyway, how are things with you ?
10:46.10mozratgood enough
10:46.27mozratreading the news about the southern United States
10:47.55mozratmakes me glad to live within a very dull but fairly predictable weather system
10:57.08mozratyou're cuddlying who now?
11:02.31Copeooh - activity
11:02.42Copemozrat: what time is lunch?
11:02.52rhowemozrat: fdupes - a utility which finds duplicate files
11:03.00rhowemozrat: I think it's about to save us large amounts of disk space
11:03.08mozratCope, I don't have a set time but normally about 1230 for me
11:03.12mozratrhowe: cool!
11:08.32wethrinrhowe: How does it deal with hard links?
11:08.59rhowewethrin: However you tell it
11:09.22rhowewethrin: By default, it treats them as non-dupes, but you can tell it to do the opposite via a commandline option
11:09.40wethrinaha
11:12.48rhoweLoading Canon PowerShot S70 image from /usr/tmp/dcim/103canon/crw_0301.crw...
11:12.49rhowewhee :)
11:28.41mozrat"Swiss Cheese, Sweet peppers, asparagus, alfalfa sprouts and basil pesto mayo"
11:29.02mozratI don't know hot sandwich chick gets her sandwiches from but I like them
11:29.31mozratI don't know _where_ ... etc
11:29.53wethrinmm
12:24.02*** join/#gllug Leeds (n=richardc@ipvpn095205.netvigator.com)
12:25.09mozratLeeds!
12:25.18mozrathow did the RMS talk end?
12:25.23mozratanything interesting?
12:27.53Leedswell... he had some trouble understanding the questions from the Chinese people there...
12:28.02Leedshad a few negative questions/comments come at him
12:28.19Leedsbut essentially it was his plan for reforming copyright
12:28.29LeedsI did sort of record most of it
12:29.02mozratwhat kind of negative comments?
12:29.25Leeds"how do people make a living?" mainly
12:30.01Leedsand in a lot of cases, the answer was effectively "they don't - I don't consider what they do to be worth anyone paying for, so they shouldn't make a living doing it"
12:30.11mozratthis kind of comment? >> http://www.bash.org/?219418
12:30.47mozratI think thats very blinkered - he is very lucky to be making a living doing what he does
12:32.07Leedsnot really... although he didn't phrase it quite like this, he was effectively arguing that the Internet disintermediates between content producers and consumers, and that the existing middlemen who are fighting to preserve their market are only doing it because of inertia - their business model has become largely obselete
12:32.53LeedsI think that's what disintermediate means, anyway - if it doesn't, it should :-)
12:34.14mozratlol
12:35.10Leedsthe point is that he presented a method for content producers to continue making a living - some making more, some less... but was quite happy to say that the people who participate in the production of content but aren't the actual producers should largely be done away with
12:35.52mozratinteresting
12:35.57Leedsit is, of course, a somewhat naive view, but our Richard's never been about putting practicality above ideology, really :-)
12:36.04mozratyes
12:37.04Leedsin general, you can look at him as one end of a scale, and the status quo (4 chords!) or possibly the demands of 'the industry' as the other - somewhere in between is normally a good place to be
12:39.39Leedsquality is pretty bad, but the recording is understandable
12:39.52Leedsit's bad because it was made with a laptop microphone :-)
12:40.59Leedsmight have a go at cleaning it up and publish it somewhere
12:43.01mozratI'd be interested to have a listen
12:44.49Leedsthere will be bits which are very noisy, where I used the keyboard, moved around, coughed, etc. - I was sitting a few rows back, trying to point the laptop at the speakers in the ceiling :-)
12:47.44mozratstretch legs etc
12:50.01Leedsright, there's 85 minutes of him... missed the first 20-30 or so...
12:50.22Leedsgot me talking to the guy next to me at the end :-)
12:58.27Leedsmozrat: (and anyone else who is interested) http://marmite.j-colo.net/~richardc/rms.ogg - if you think you want to and/or can clean it up, you're welcome to the .wav
13:00.33Leedsand now, I'm off to the local English-style pub/restaurant for fish'n'chips :-)
13:20.13JAVgood afternoon
13:24.07mozratHello JAV
13:57.56rhoweheh, from a posting made to bacula-users
13:58.04rhoweSubject: [Bacula-users] Compiling problems on AIX 5.2
13:58.14rhowethen, the first line of the body: I have tried to compile bacula  1.36.3 (22 April 2005) on AIX 5.3.0.0
13:58.23wethrinheh
13:58.26rhowe5.2 or 5.3? Make your mind up :P
13:58.59wh00dinihi all
13:59.05wh00dini, i have a question about using crontab to launch firefox, would this be the best place to ask?
13:59.18mozratwh00dini: !!
13:59.25wh00dini:)
13:59.31wh00dinihi mozrat
14:00.19wethrinThis may or may not be the best place to ask
14:00.42wethrinLaunching firefox from crontab would be fraught with problems
14:01.05wh00diniwhy is that? b/c it is an X app.?
14:01.09wethrinNot least getting the display to work
14:01.22wh00dinithere in lies my problem
14:01.23wethrinThat would be the major problem, yes
14:01.33wethrinWhy do you need to launch Firefox periodically?
14:01.41wh00dinifor a time reporting application
14:01.43Leedsmozrat: yes, I'm getting over a cold
14:01.57wethrintimesheets?
14:02.10wh00diniyes, web based
14:02.29wethrinCope: Google?
14:02.36wh00dinibut it needs to launch once a day, during the week
14:02.53kbsinghwh00dini: elinks cant do what you need ? or even wget feed the url's around
14:03.04wethrinkbsingh: Wouldn't help if it needs user input
14:03.08wethrin(which I presume it does)
14:03.32kbsinghin which case, the user can click on the 'firefox' icon and wait the <1.5 seconds it takes to load up
14:03.39wh00dinikbsingh haven't gone down that alley (yet)
14:03.43wethrinThat would be easiest
14:03.51mozratwethrin: wh00dini does so little work he could fill his timesheets in using wget probably :P
14:04.03wethrinIs it always the same user that sits at the same workstation?
14:04.04wethrinmozrat: :-)
14:04.09kbsinghor leave firefox running, within a master frameset (!) that refreshes every 7 days or whatever
14:04.19kbsinghcan you have such a long term refresh ?
14:05.00wh00dinimozrat: my issue is that i am so busy i seem to forget ;)
14:05.20wh00diniyes same user all of the time
14:05.58Leedspersonally, I'd probably use at rather than cron for firefox
14:06.26Leedstrivial enough to make it open a page in a new tab/window if it's open, or open a new instance if it's not, then schedule a new one for tomorrow
14:07.08Leedsput it in their .login/.profile/etc.
14:07.08mozratsounds perfect
14:07.26wh00dinii've never used at before, would i an issue auto-launching it daily?
14:09.15Leedsyou need to write a script to do the actual work, then you just do "at 1600 <script>"
14:11.26Erwinor "at teatime"
14:11.45Leedsindeed :-)
14:11.47wh00dinino work during "teatime" allowed :)
14:12.17Leedswh00dini: in case you think he's joking, at does accept "teatime" as a synonym for 1600, 4pm, etc.
14:12.43wh00dinisorry i'm a yank :-)
14:12.48Leedsbah
14:12.54wh00dinidoes it do coffee talk time?
14:13.20Leedsnot according to the man page :-)
14:15.24wh00dinii think i am going to have to use "teatime" simply b/c it is available
14:30.33mozrat4pm is normally "snoozetime" for me - I wonder how hard it is to recompile with that option
14:36.49Erwinyou can settle for a binary patch if you can keep it to exactly 7 letters. "snztime" for example.
14:38.49Copehow can you make the machine 'beep'
14:38.57Copelike on a bbc you could do VDU 7
14:39.03Erwinpress control-G :-)
14:39.05wh00dinithe back space key always does it for me
14:39.17Erwinor echo -e '\a'
14:39.19mozratI have a beep.mp3 file I could play
14:39.28mozratseriously from the asterisk install files!
14:39.53ErwinUsually the pc speaker bell can be hard to hear though, so playing an MP3 file might be better. Provided you have a multi-channel card or software mixer.
14:40.20ErwinOTOH the echo -e '\a' has the advantage that it's played by the terminal, not the computer, so remotely connecting via ssh plays it too
14:48.29Leedsdoes the bloke on the right of http://www.flickr.com/photos/34015977@N00/40044896/ remind anyone else of skugg?
15:05.13rhowehm, good week for Debian to break JPEG support in the GIMP
15:07.34rhowehuh? Now it works? wtf?
15:13.14Leedsroy g biv
15:13.30rhowerainbow?
15:15.33rhowe/usr/lib/gimp/2.0/plug-ins/jpeg: fatal error: Segmentation fault
15:15.35rhowebleh
15:15.59Leedsblah blah Debian blah blah
15:17.02Leedsblah blah trust random people to trash your machine blah blah
15:17.39rhoweheh
15:17.54Leedsblah blah Slackware blah blah
15:19.30Copeblah blah lfs blah blah
15:19.57JAVhttp://www.therawfeed.com/2005/09/nintendogs-virtual-pet-game-sold.html   ---> nice shot
15:19.58Coperhowe: have you played around with cron-apt at all? or something similar?
15:20.17rhoweCope: Nope, I still update manually
15:21.25ErwinI used to just use the apt-get -d option -- so the packages are downloaded but I have to manually install them and supervise it
15:23.48LeedsJAV: it's a great shot - also a great game
15:25.42Erwinre nintendogs: http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php?date=2005-08-24&res=l
15:32.06mozratcatch you guys later
15:33.54Leedsseeya
16:22.34*** join/#gllug eye69 (i=magnus@ipv6.upcore.net)
16:29.51Leedsibot change 1 isd to hkd
16:29.55Leedsibot change 1 usd to hkd
16:36.21skuggbah. bored.
16:36.26*** part/#gllug skugg (n=stig@ggtl.org)
16:36.41wethrinbored, and he leaves us? Bah
16:46.28Leedsibot change 20500 hkd to gbp
17:53.44*** join/#gllug agk (n=agk@nat-pool-surrey.redhat.com)
17:58.41Leedstwo by two, hands of blue
18:32.50Georgeback in .uk
18:33.33Leedsnot back in .su?
18:35.44George.su?
18:38.09Leedsoh, come on
18:39.45Leedshey - it's even still active!
18:57.54Leedsback in the USSR
19:33.04*** join/#gllug ufo (i=ufo@kasztan.il.pw.edu.pl)
20:45.14JAVhi
21:24.55wethrinCOPE! new2! EVERYONE ELSE
21:26.02new2unixwhoop!
21:28.12wethrinI have PORT
21:30.44new2unixWethrin: Havent we all?
21:30.54wethrinI don't know. Do you?
21:36.37new2unixWethrin: Sure. We have sockets too. Dont you?
21:39.12wethrinI have tasty port!
21:39.28Copegrep -i tasty /etc/services
21:39.38wethrin:-)
21:41.46new2unixCope: Wine is for weenies. Get the real thing. Install windows.
21:42.44ErwinWhere's my Pedro Ximenez sherry? :(
21:44.35wethrinwith rum?
21:45.11wethrin:)
21:45.22new2unixRum lola rum
21:46.13wethrin:)
21:49.23Copenn chums
21:49.34new2unixNight Cope.
21:54.55wethrinnn Cope
23:19.25z00daxhey guys
23:19.29wethrinhello
23:19.32wethrinand good night!
23:19.53z00daxis it normal for [social] meets to usually be a work-week thing ? or do some meets happen over weekends as well ?
23:20.06wethrinOrganise something :-P
23:20.17z00dax:) fair enough.
23:20.28wethrinThey tend to happen on Friday evenings because that's normally when I'm coming back from Durham
23:20.39wethrinAnd I seem to be the only one stating that we're going to the pub
23:21.08z00daxsince I am based in Bexley, getting into the city is a major trek after work, and getting out even more of a problem - during the work week, weekends i dont care
23:21.40wethrinFair enough. Fridays are generally the only times I'm out in London
23:21.51wethrin(well, occasional Fridays)
23:23.50z00daxhumm.. will keep a lookout for something, othewise will organise something ...
23:23.59z00daxbed time for me.
23:24.02z00daxzzzzzzzz
23:24.17wethrinnight!
23:44.50Leedsugh
23:48.16Leedswaking up = bad idea

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