| 00:10.05 | *** join/#gllug eye69 (i=magnus@ipv6.upcore.net) |
| 01:07.06 | *** join/#gllug shai (n=Shai@l192-117-111-15.broadband.actcom.net.il) |
| 01:31.15 | *** join/#gllug Leeds (n=richardc@202.82.163.139) |
| 03:01.03 | *** join/#gllug ibot_ (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 03:01.03 | *** topic/#gllug is Greater London LUG - Next Event Thursday 25th May @1900 (tbc) - Christopher Fraser (Digital Cinema & Linux) and the Great GLLUG Quiz night (There will be *prizes*!!!). http://gllug.org.uk http://planet.gllug.org.uk. Channel stats http://silenceisdefeat.org/~mozrat/gllug |
| 05:00.00 | *** join/#gllug SlammerXP (n=Tram@ti521110a080-6171.bb.online.no) |
| 05:02.00 | Leeds | lunchtime... |
| 05:26.32 | mozrat | breakfast time... |
| 05:30.49 | shai | morning ... |
| 05:31.08 | shai | what's the deal with channels with the ## in the prefix ? |
| 05:37.17 | mozrat | Hmm |
| 05:37.31 | mozrat | Aren't they meta channels of some description? |
| 05:37.37 | mozrat | channels about a channel? |
| 05:37.45 | Leeds | nope |
| 05:38.14 | mozrat | Anyway - I gotta run. |
| 05:38.45 | Leeds | they are unofficial channels |
| 05:38.47 | Leeds | seeya |
| 05:40.18 | Leeds | in theory, they are for channels which have no connection with the official organisation to which they refer |
| 05:50.27 | mozrat | ah right |
| 05:50.33 | mozrat | makes sense |
| 05:51.02 | shai | oh |
| 05:51.02 | shai | thanks Leeds |
| 06:46.40 | SlammerXP | Leeds: if you want my address you just have to ask :) |
| 07:14.40 | morsing | 'morning |
| 07:15.02 | morsing | Leeds: At what local time did you get out of bed? |
| 07:16.26 | morsing | My Squirrelmail problem is really odd |
| 07:17.04 | morsing | rhowe? |
| 07:17.04 | Leeds | morsing: 0715 or so |
| 07:17.23 | rhowe | morsing? |
| 07:17.37 | Leeds | Rocky? |
| 07:22.42 | morsing | rhowe: Why are you avoidinig me? |
| 07:22.51 | morsing | s/avoidinig/avoiding/ |
| 07:23.02 | morsing | Rocky? |
| 07:23.12 | morsing | Leeds: So you got less than 6 hours sleep? |
| 07:23.46 | rhowe | morsing: Why won't you give me a job? |
| 07:24.19 | Leeds | morsing: yes |
| 07:24.20 | Leeds | zzzzzzz |
| 07:25.56 | morsing | rhowe: I will. Hang on |
| 07:27.12 | Leeds | rhowe: I thought you had a job? |
| 07:27.17 | rhowe | Leeds: I do |
| 07:27.20 | morsing | rhowe: An email was sent out last night about new client solutions coming in during the summer. Two of these are running Linux |
| 07:27.27 | Leeds | for that matter, what is morsing doing? |
| 07:27.36 | rhowe | morsing: Is this a good thing? |
| 07:28.23 | morsing | rhowe: Huh? What do you want to do then? |
| 07:28.46 | morsing | The job as my manager is still up if you want it? |
| 07:29.31 | rhowe | morsing: URL? |
| 07:29.35 | Leeds | ibot_: convert 10 lb to kg |
| 07:30.26 | rhowe | hm, bugtraq |
| 07:30.36 | rhowe | 's pretty high volume |
| 07:32.28 | morsing | http://www.attenda.com/who/vacancies.aspx#3 |
| 07:33.24 | SlammerXP | i should apply |
| 07:36.07 | morsing | rhowe: Interested? |
| 07:47.46 | morsing | rhowe: Why are you ignoring me? |
| 07:50.22 | mozrat | good morning |
| 07:51.22 | morsing | mozrat! |
| 07:53.09 | mozrat | no wireless.... sucks |
| 07:53.32 | morsing | Have I ever met Ben Fitzgerald |
| 07:53.33 | morsing | ? |
| 07:53.42 | SlammerXP | mozrat: Windows 95 Networking For Beginners ? |
| 07:53.46 | morsing | RHOWE! |
| 07:53.57 | morsing | SlammerXP: You suck! |
| 07:54.05 | morsing | SlammerXP: Fucktwat |
| 07:54.44 | mozrat | SlammerXP: :-) |
| 07:54.49 | SlammerXP | morsing: hiding your affection behind such coarse language doesn't fool me |
| 07:58.16 | morsing | How do I start the RedHat control-panel? |
| 07:58.23 | morsing | Through SSH |
| 07:58.36 | SlammerXP | what's the redhat control panel? |
| 07:59.56 | morsing | Exactly! |
| 08:08.20 | yzenezy | mornin' |
| 08:08.28 | morsing | 'morning |
| 08:09.08 | yzenezy | what beast be redhat control panel? |
| 08:27.51 | Leeds | this is far too much like real work... |
| 08:27.53 | Leeds | hi yzenezy |
| 08:32.36 | Leeds | ibot_: george |
| 08:35.44 | Leeds | since I've only made one meet in the past year :-) |
| 08:42.38 | wethrin | Yes, you are |
| 08:42.43 | SlammerXP | i love job adverts |
| 08:42.44 | SlammerXP | "Sound conceptual, problem solving and analytical skills. |
| 08:42.45 | SlammerXP | Possess an expert leve of computer hardware and software knowldge. |
| 08:42.45 | SlammerXP | Attention to detail. |
| 08:42.45 | SlammerXP | " |
| 08:42.56 | wethrin | heh |
| 08:43.08 | wethrin | "Must be able to proofread carefully to make sure they do not words out" |
| 08:43.08 | SlammerXP | also "Strong written oral communication skills." |
| 08:43.31 | Leeds | SlammerXP: they're going to make a verbal job offer which isn't worth the paper it's written on? |
| 08:43.48 | SlammerXP | "Demonstrative good practice for system administration." |
| 08:44.01 | SlammerXP | "An ability to see technical issues within a business context and vice versa." |
| 08:45.40 | *** join/#gllug mouse (n=ogradka@ns2.afp.com) |
| 08:45.53 | Leeds | mouse: good afternoon! |
| 08:46.01 | mouse | Hi How you doing? |
| 08:46.18 | Leeds | not too bad... you? |
| 08:46.30 | mouse | yeah, good just starting work for the day |
| 08:47.10 | Leeds | got maybe 90 minutes left here |
| 08:47.17 | mouse | where are you? |
| 08:47.25 | Leeds | at my desk in the office |
| 08:47.40 | mouse | lol |
| 08:47.45 | mouse | what part of the world |
| 08:48.07 | Leeds | guess :-) |
| 08:48.30 | *** join/#gllug lucychili (n=jhawtin@ppp197-168.lns1.adl4.internode.on.net) |
| 08:49.50 | Leeds | lucychili: uh, hi |
| 08:49.56 | lucychili | greets |
| 08:50.07 | mouse | I'd like to say yorkshire, but the good afternoon bit kicks that into touch |
| 08:50.21 | lucychili | just waiting for mr and mrs smith to arrive for dinner |
| 08:50.24 | Leeds | not exactly Yorkshire, no... not been there since Christmas |
| 08:51.03 | mouse | Most of my family live there, I am guessing given the time shift stuff you are in east europe somewhere? |
| 08:51.12 | Leeds | not by quite a long way :-) |
| 08:51.21 | murb | mouse: greater eastern europe :-) |
| 08:51.25 | murb | like greater london |
| 08:51.31 | Leeds | lucychili: you're hosting a fictional pair of assassins for dinner? |
| 08:51.32 | murb | Leeds: greater eastern london? |
| 08:51.34 | mouse | oh well doesn't really matter, its the linux stuff that matters |
| 08:51.41 | lucychili | something like that |
| 08:51.51 | lucychili | gllugers |
| 08:52.12 | Leeds | for the record, Cantonese is a great language for arguing in - even if you're not arguing... |
| 08:52.14 | lucychili | christian smith |
| 08:52.25 | Leeds | mouse: so, distro/editor/desktop? |
| 08:52.46 | mouse | mix of redhat work debain home always vi kde |
| 08:52.58 | mouse | debian even |
| 08:53.21 | mouse | playing with fedora 5 and ubuntu at the moment, getting them running on my laptop |
| 08:53.47 | lucychili | there arent any italian speaking folks here by any chance |
| 08:53.50 | Leeds | vi or vim? |
| 08:54.10 | mouse | vi |
| 08:54.17 | Leeds | bah! |
| 08:54.20 | mouse | always used it since my sco days |
| 08:54.29 | mouse | so just stuck with it |
| 08:54.44 | Leeds | your what days?!?!? |
| 08:54.58 | mouse | remember the heady days of sco unix? |
| 08:55.08 | Leeds | hmm... |
| 08:55.13 | mouse | long time ago and much solaris under the bridge since then |
| 08:55.25 | Leeds | double hmmm.... |
| 08:55.30 | mouse | I try |
| 08:55.40 | wethrin | lucychili: Occasionally there are |
| 08:55.44 | Leeds | I assume you mean as a user/admin |
| 08:55.53 | wethrin | lucychili: But currently no |
| 08:55.53 | mouse | for the record sco unix sucked back then and most things sco still suck today |
| 08:56.15 | mouse | yeah been doing UNIX/Linux admin for ten+ years |
| 08:56.44 | Leeds | ah, you were worrying me there... thought I might know you |
| 08:56.58 | mouse | which prison? |
| 08:57.07 | Leeds | SCO followed by Sun :-) |
| 08:57.41 | mouse | I worked for SUN for a few years then went to the banks |
| 08:58.05 | Leeds | triple hmmm... |
| 08:58.57 | Leeds | I left Sun slightly over a year ago |
| 08:59.16 | lucychili | np wethrin thanks |
| 09:00.12 | mouse | what you doin now? |
| 09:00.25 | Leeds | making bras in the far east |
| 09:00.38 | mouse | that would explain why they fit so bad |
| 09:00.56 | Leeds | not so much doing the sewing myself :-) |
| 09:01.13 | mouse | you just can't take the sun model and transplant it into fabrics |
| 09:01.57 | Leeds | massively multithreaded bras? write-once-run-anywhere bras? hanging-on-being-killed-by-Linux bras? |
| 09:02.13 | *** join/#gllug cbz (i=chriseb@vortex.ukshells.co.uk) |
| 09:02.19 | mouse | although I kind of like the idea of a kill -9 clasp |
| 09:02.29 | lucychili | heh |
| 09:02.34 | mouse | save a lot of fumbling |
| 09:03.00 | lucychili | depends what it killed i guess |
| 09:03.17 | Leeds | we do somewhat make the bra equivalent of big iron though... |
| 09:03.21 | rhowe | morsing: Very droll :) |
| 09:03.34 | mouse | howabout ethtool -s bra-clasp autoneg |
| 09:04.15 | Leeds | yes ; yes ; touch ; fsck ; etc. etc. etc. |
| 09:04.28 | cbz | bash.org levels of sad |
| 09:04.46 | mouse | enough of the joviality |
| 09:04.57 | Leeds | cbz: excuse me, I am a Unix/bra professional! |
| 09:05.57 | Leeds | mouse: did you want anything in particular, or just to hang out (as it were) and discuss women's underwear? |
| 09:06.33 | mouse | no, nothing in particular, just thought i would check out this channel |
| 09:06.51 | Leeds | have you been to any meetings? are you on the mailing list? |
| 09:07.06 | lucychili | heading off cya |
| 09:07.22 | mouse | no to both at the moment |
| 09:07.46 | Leeds | well, welcome :-) |
| 09:07.50 | mouse | cya lucychili |
| 09:08.19 | mouse | thanks, always nice to find a friendly face/voice/text |
| 09:08.39 | mouse | brb |
| 09:15.08 | mouse | leeds, what distro, desktop |
| 09:16.34 | Leeds | slackware, vim, afterstep (not a desktop) |
| 09:17.11 | mouse | oh hardcore |
| 09:18.26 | Leeds | I try |
| 09:18.40 | mouse | is that work or play? |
| 09:19.09 | Leeds | both |
| 09:19.28 | mouse | unusual to see slackware in the workplace |
| 09:19.41 | Leeds | I run whatever I like at work :-) |
| 09:19.45 | mouse | most companies are frightened by it |
| 09:19.48 | Leeds | everyone else runs windows |
| 09:19.57 | mouse | what is wondows???? |
| 09:20.03 | mouse | windows even |
| 09:20.43 | Leeds | it's that thing that makes all the trouble: viruses, spam, shitty browser, etc. |
| 09:21.06 | mouse | oh yeah, think I heard about some guy that is getting rich by ripping people off |
| 09:21.41 | Leeds | I'm not sure how much it's a ripoff when people lean over and shout "put it in me, Billy!" |
| 09:22.45 | mouse | would you buy a washing machine that refused to do the washing and then tipped water all over the floor |
| 09:23.21 | rhowe | I'm sure that if you were to ask a washing machine repairman, you'd find that many people do :) |
| 09:23.36 | mouse | trouble is open source needs more exposure in the workplace |
| 09:24.15 | mouse | its getting there, but if people could be persuaded to try it on the desktop it would take off for sure |
| 09:24.47 | Leeds | mouse: for the record I'm in http://maps.google.com/?ll=22.366467,114.116664&spn=0.002247,0.00338&t=k&om=1 |
| 09:24.48 | rhowe | mouse: Openoffice and Abiword just don't do what people are used to doing in Word though |
| 09:24.50 | antiphase | Maybe when it's actually productive to do ao it will happen |
| 09:26.26 | Leeds | rhowe: yeah, they're good, but neither good nor slick enough |
| 09:26.52 | mouse | yeah, but how many end users actually use even half of the abilities of word or orifice |
| 09:27.02 | rhowe | mouse: It's the old problem of people only using a tiny subset of the massive featureset, just that everyone uses a different subset |
| 09:27.28 | Leeds | it's not about the feature set - oo.o is plenty featureful... it's actually more about compatibility and sheer polish, I think |
| 09:27.53 | rhowe | Leeds: Let's not forget VBA |
| 09:28.09 | Leeds | I was actually about to mention VB/A - that is, VB and Access... |
| 09:28.46 | Leeds | a lot of what goes on here is custom stuff in VB running against Access - we're moving away from Access as a backend, but we'd have to port or rewrite all the front-ends |
| 09:29.26 | rhowe | One of the "applications" in use here (forced upon us by a client) is actually an Excel spreadsheet chock full of macros |
| 09:29.26 | mouse | I just converted my wife to linux, even if I had to use redhat so it was easy for her, but she now uses it at home instead of windoze |
| 09:29.37 | rhowe | The macros manage a bunch of XML files and post them to some HTTP server somewhere |
| 09:30.05 | rhowe | Excel is actually just used as a dialog and grid engine... none of Excel's spreadsheet functionality is used at all |
| 09:30.09 | Leeds | rhowe: in principle, that sort of thing should be relatively easy to auto-port to something like python or perl |
| 09:30.19 | rhowe | Leeds: In principle, yes |
| 09:30.20 | Leeds | the data-munging, that is, not the interface itself |
| 09:30.28 | rhowe | Leeds: Oh, and the XML is a joy to behold... |
| 09:30.56 | rhowe | Leeds: <customfields><custom1>Some value</custom1><custom2>Some other value</custom2></customfields> |
| 09:31.00 | rhowe | That type of thing |
| 09:31.33 | Leeds | indeed |
| 09:31.42 | Leeds | woo, hometime bell! |
| 09:32.00 | rhowe | I actually think it's a database schema with column names directly turned into HTML tags |
| 09:32.06 | rhowe | s/HTML/XML/ |
| 09:32.12 | JAV | good morning |
| 09:32.16 | rhowe | s/ibot_//g |
| 09:43.03 | Leeds | http://tinyurl.com/s7kle - they're idiots |
| 09:52.15 | Leeds | well, maybe not idiots, but the retailers should be putting as much pressure as possible on TfL to get it done |
| 09:52.46 | mouse | small purchases would make sense but where would this kind of tech lead? |
| 09:53.15 | mouse | trouble is you would be carrying around a card charged with cash that was incredibly insecure |
| 09:53.32 | Leeds | that is exactly what I'm doing, yes |
| 09:53.48 | mouse | I use one for travel, and if it got stolen there is very little I could do about it |
| 09:54.15 | Leeds | I should mention that the same system (different implementation) here is used *very* extensively for e-cash, but does not have things like travelcards or - AFAIK - season passes on it |
| 09:55.34 | Leeds | I can use it on the bus (mini and full), ferry, tram, train, MTR (underground) - but also at convenience stores, fast food, bakeries, supermarkets, pharmacies, vending machines, car parks and parking meters... |
| 09:55.40 | mouse | it would definately be good for stuff like papers ciggies drinks etc, but there needs to be a charge limit to prevent people loading them up and then losing them |
| 09:56.24 | mouse | sounds like you already have the work done, tfl should think about knowledge share or buyin |
| 09:56.25 | Leeds | the whole thing is predicated on keeping small amounts of cash on it, such that if you lose it - well, you've lost at most a couple of hundred $ - the default fill-up is $200 AFAIK |
| 09:57.33 | Leeds | where it's about HK$14.4 to the £ - in other words, about 15 quid |
| 09:58.05 | Leeds | rhowe: at some point, I probably owe you a beer or two for the deposit :-0 |
| 09:58.48 | mouse | that sort of money makes sense |
| 09:59.00 | mouse | although that ain't gonna buy much in london |
| 09:59.16 | mouse | you definitely wouldn't be buying a round of drinks |
| 09:59.25 | Leeds | note that a typical public transport journey (apart from island ferries and end-to-end MTR) is under $10 |
| 10:00.27 | Leeds | it's also great for things like going into a 7-11, picking up a bottle of water, the woman waves it at the till, I wave my wallet at the till, I walk out with it |
| 10:02.10 | mouse | yeah sounds good, i often leave for work with no money but I always have my oyster card, |
| 10:02.22 | mouse | would be handy for can of coke etc |
| 10:02.30 | Leeds | I actually had a Visa Cash card about 12 years ago - a contact-based e-cash card from Visa which was trialled in Leeds |
| 10:03.44 | mouse | how was it? |
| 10:03.45 | Leeds | the thing which makes it useful is that HK is relatively compact, and there are lots of ubiquitous retail chains which take it (e.g. MacDonalds, 7-11, etc.) so there doesn't need to be that many actual companies involved for it to be useful everywhere |
| 10:04.30 | Leeds | the Visa Cash thing was cool when it worked - for example, I remember using it coming out of a car park, when they still had car parks where you paid at the gate - being able to stick the card in the reader and pay without having to sign or mess with change was great |
| 10:04.39 | Leeds | the problem was that there were very few places which accepted it |
| 10:05.06 | Leeds | apparently it was only 9 years ago or so |
| 10:06.27 | Leeds | de la rue via google claims over 1400 outlets, but I don't recall anything like that |
| 10:07.04 | mouse | thing is we have problems with chip and pin fraud at the moment so how much are people gonna trust oyster |
| 10:07.50 | Leeds | the whole thing is really done on the basis of not having to trust anyone, simply because there's not much cash involved... you could keep your balance below a fiver at all times if you wanted to |
| 10:08.35 | Leeds | the main worry might be that you're trackable - touch in, touch out, touch for your lunch, etc. - but the cards can be 100% anonymous - yes, they can track me, but they would have to match me up with my card somehow |
| 10:09.42 | mouse | they can track us already so that shouldn't be an issue |
| 10:09.59 | Leeds | the main differences between visa cash and octopus (oyster in HK) are that Octopus is contactless - wave your card at the reader - while Visa Cash meant you had to put your card in the reader and hit the "authorise payment" button |
| 10:10.38 | Leeds | the other thing is that octopus is independent, in the sense that it's a join venture between the participating companies, while Visa Cash was part of your cash card, and was run by Visa and the banks |
| 10:11.20 | Leeds | apparently, at least when it started, they funded the system on the interest on the held balances, so neither users nor retailers paid anything towards it |
| 10:12.09 | Leeds | oh, and out of a population of just under 7 million, there are over 12 million cards issued :-) |
| 10:13.08 | Leeds | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octopus_card - 13 million |
| 10:14.04 | Leeds | can Oyster go negative? |
| 10:14.13 | cbz | no |
| 10:15.40 | cbz | CnP in the UK is locally authenticated but remotely authorised, that may or may not play a part in what happened at Shell (it is unclear) |
| 10:16.15 | Leeds | Octopus can... as long as you have a positive balance on the card, you can make almost any journey with it, even if it costs more than you have |
| 10:16.44 | cbz | "One way ticket to mars" |
| 10:16.46 | wethrin | Oyster can go slightly negative |
| 10:17.18 | wethrin | It won't let you on if you have less than the minimum fare, though |
| 10:17.32 | wethrin | I don't know what happens if you use it on a bus when the credit's run down |
| 10:17.41 | Leeds | you can go down to -$35 here |
| 10:19.41 | *** join/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165) |
| 10:21.25 | *** join/#gllug angelchild (n=Catalyst@jamesmorse.plus.com) |
| 10:21.36 | wethrin | ac! |
| 10:21.47 | *** join/#gllug shaibn (n=shaibn@pptp-il.jungo.com) |
| 10:21.50 | shaibn | hi :) |
| 10:21.55 | cbz | hi |
| 10:22.19 | Leeds | shaibn! |
| 10:23.04 | shaibn | Leeds! |
| 10:23.44 | Leeds | almost hometime! |
| 10:28.27 | Leeds | and... hometime... may be back online at home, may not... |
| 10:39.07 | *** join/#gllug togster (n=sapt@cpc2-lewi2-0-0-cust874.bmly.cable.ntl.com) |
| 10:39.24 | togster | Greetings #gllug |
| 10:39.48 | wethrin | 'ello |
| 10:42.25 | togster | Can anyone recommend a wireless router that isn't going to keep crashing every ten minutes? I am getting fed up with my current one. |
| 10:42.46 | wethrin | DSL router? Or just WAP? |
| 10:44.06 | SlammerXP | togster: assuming you mean DSL router, buy Draytek |
| 10:46.47 | togster | Ideally, I'd like one that can be used both with ADSL and cable internet services, as I'm going to move in the not too distant future. |
| 10:54.31 | mouse | w |
| 10:58.53 | *** join/#gllug kbsingh (n=kbsingh@nat1.lon1.uk.xinit.com) |
| 11:03.35 | *** join/#gllug keithlard (n=john@host217-34-140-129.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 11:07.23 | wethrin | HONK |
| 11:09.05 | angelchild | HONK |
| 11:09.44 | keithlard | hiya :D |
| 11:09.47 | keithlard | what is happening |
| 11:14.16 | wethrin | I'm going back over some old data, and working out what order I've done measurements in |
| 11:15.21 | keithlard | :) |
| 11:40.53 | morsing | beer |
| 11:41.17 | morsing | keithlard! |
| 11:41.27 | keithlard | hi |
| 11:42.18 | rhowe | keithlard: You weren't at the social last night |
| 11:43.00 | keithlard | I WASN'T INFORMED! |
| 11:43.13 | morsing | rhowe: neither were you! |
| 11:43.38 | morsing | keithlard: yes you were! |
| 11:44.11 | rhowe | morsing: Well, I was there in body, at least |
| 11:44.34 | rhowe | keithlard: I emailed the social list and the main gllug list |
| 11:44.35 | *** join/#gllug shaibn (n=shaibn@pptp-il.jungo.com) |
| 11:44.54 | keithlard | aah ok i am not on that list i guess |
| 11:44.58 | keithlard | i better subscribe |
| 11:45.16 | rhowe | keithlard: Yes, you better had |
| 11:45.33 | rhowe | social-request@gllug.org.uk, IIRC |
| 11:47.27 | TimMagic | yo everyone! |
| 11:47.49 | rhowe | It's Tim Jones |
| 11:48.44 | TimMagic | im offended! everyone knows who i am :-s |
| 12:03.35 | rhowe | keithlard: On the social list? |
| 12:04.00 | mozrat | Good afternoon |
| 12:06.26 | mozrat | *woof* |
| 12:06.39 | TimMagic | hey mozrat... uok? |
| 12:06.50 | mozrat | # burn baby burn |
| 12:06.56 | mozrat | # disco inferno |
| 12:07.08 | mozrat | hey Tim... good thanks |
| 12:07.50 | mozrat | TimMagic, new to the channel? Welcome!! |
| 12:07.51 | TimMagic | splendid! up to much? |
| 12:07.58 | TimMagic | fairly |
| 12:08.08 | mozrat | TimMagic, on a dull course this week |
| 12:08.16 | mozrat | queing in bank currently |
| 12:08.31 | TimMagic | had a brief spell on here between employments but now am doin a real job |
| 12:08.56 | mozrat | oh no.... not a real job |
| 12:09.11 | TimMagic | i know! |
| 12:09.34 | TimMagic | but its money for something i enjoy so cant complain |
| 12:09.51 | mozrat | not too bad then |
| 12:13.39 | TimMagic | yeah its fun |
| 12:13.50 | TimMagic | just spotted a huge irony though |
| 12:14.10 | TimMagic | i get a well paid real job and have moved to a free os! |
| 12:16.33 | rhowe | I'm sure this must be simplifiable |
| 12:16.51 | rhowe | http://siksai.co.uk/~rhowe/visitquery.txt |
| 12:17.45 | TimMagic | i dunno |
| 12:19.19 | rhowe | for each mkt_company_name in the table, I want the tuple with the highest mkt_visit_date (i.e. the most recent visit to each company) |
| 12:19.53 | rhowe | It doesn't seem possible to do via "group by", as I want the full tuple, not a portion thereof |
| 12:30.08 | TimMagic | hmm |
| 12:30.55 | rhowe | select * from marketing where mkt_visit_date = max(mkt_visit_date) group by mkt_company_name, is pseudo-SQL approximating what I need |
| 12:31.06 | rhowe | hm, time to go look at a PBX |
| 12:35.23 | *** join/#gllug Erwin (n=erwin@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/Erwin) |
| 12:43.46 | z00dax | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:44.05 | keithlard | w00t |
| 12:44.25 | z00dax | hey keithlard! I had an interesting call today at lunchtime |
| 12:44.37 | keithlard | :D |
| 12:44.58 | keithlard | yaaay :-D |
| 12:47.42 | keithlard | i'm looking forward to having some help as i have 136,000 things to do here :> |
| 12:48.15 | z00dax | :( |
| 12:48.22 | z00dax | 136k ? /me rethinks |
| 12:48.38 | keithlard | oh they are all fun things mostly. i just can't do them all at once. ;) |
| 12:49.04 | keithlard | '135,999: Install Quake server' hmm that one needs prioritizing |
| 12:49.36 | z00dax | yeh, add a Security tag to that one : ESSENTIAL |
| 13:08.22 | morsing | PalmOS just crashes again! |
| 13:08.48 | Erwin | What did you install on your Treo? Mine hasn't crashed |
| 13:09.37 | morsing | It happens when I Use the side button to launch pssh |
| 13:13.50 | morsing | moo |
| 14:31.12 | *** part/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165) |
| 14:34.47 | *** part/#gllug mouse (n=ogradka@ns2.afp.com) |
| 14:39.59 | *** join/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165) |
| 14:48.42 | morsing | stephanb2! |
| 14:48.57 | stephanb2 | morsing! |
| 14:49.44 | morsing | stephanb2: Do you miss George? |
| 14:50.44 | stephanb2 | i miss a good understanding of nat transversal of h.323 |
| 14:50.48 | stephanb2 | :-o |
| 14:51.43 | keithlard | hi stephanb2 |
| 14:51.53 | morsing | I am murble! |
| 14:54.56 | stephanb2 | hi keithlard |
| 14:56.56 | murb | morsing: no you are not |
| 14:57.45 | morsing | murb: I am. I have been IRCing from my Treo all day from the datacenter |
| 14:58.05 | morsing | Only a murble would do that! |
| 14:58.17 | murb | morsing: I don't do that kind of thing, i came to the uk without even a libretto |
| 14:58.23 | murb | and i don't have expensive toys like treos |
| 14:58.30 | murb | i only have old cast offs |
| 14:58.36 | morsing | :) |
| 14:58.44 | morsing | mmm... cast off |
| 14:58.55 | murb | btw i'm in wycombe today |
| 14:59.04 | murb | actually that is a lye |
| 14:59.10 | murb | lie, i'm in hughenden valley |
| 15:00.53 | morsing | murb: And you didn't come to the pub last night? |
| 15:03.10 | murb | morsing: I arrived in stansted at 23:30 |
| 15:03.25 | murb | and got a bus at 00:30 that got me to wycombe for 03:00 |
| 15:14.44 | morsing | moo |
| 15:40.45 | *** join/#gllug yzenezy (n=tom@217.205.177.135) |
| 15:54.54 | *** join/#gllug iTron (n=tron@unaffiliated/itron) |
| 15:56.38 | stephanb2 | im off |
| 15:56.42 | stephanb2 | bye everybody |
| 15:56.45 | *** part/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165) |
| 16:01.00 | *** part/#gllug cbz (i=chriseb@vortex.ukshells.co.uk) |
| 16:04.18 | *** join/#gllug mozrat (i=mozrat@silenceisdefeat.org) |
| 16:05.49 | mozrat | evening |
| 16:06.10 | z00dax | hi mozrat |
| 17:00.25 | morsing | mozrat! |
| 17:03.58 | morsing | someone explain to me what a "panini" is please? |
| 17:05.59 | morsing | mozrat? |
| 17:09.18 | wethrin | morsing: Have you checked wikipedia? |
| 17:09.55 | rhowe | z00dax: congrats, ye bastard :P |
| 17:11.20 | wethrin | congrats? |
| 17:11.36 | rhowe | wethrin: He got offered the job I was interviewed for last Friday :) |
| 17:11.43 | wethrin | Ahhh. |
| 17:11.43 | wethrin | Heh |
| 17:11.52 | wethrin | I had someone do that to me |
| 17:12.18 | rhowe | wethrin: But the dress just looked better on Celine Dion |
| 17:13.49 | rhowe | hm, dinner |
| 17:14.06 | wethrin | yup |
| 17:29.02 | rhowe | haha |
| 17:29.25 | rhowe | We're transferring a domain from them to mydomain.com ($35/year vs. $8/year) |
| 17:29.42 | rhowe | Took "Domain lock" off the domain and suddenly they send an email offerring renewal at $15/year |
| 17:30.03 | rhowe | er, "Domain Protect" |
| 17:57.26 | shai | hi |
| 18:16.29 | *** join/#gllug shai (n=Shai@l192-117-111-15.broadband.actcom.net.il) |
| 19:02.10 | rhowe | Does anyone know of a tool like memtest, but for block devices? |
| 19:02.33 | rhowe | (without a filesystem on it) |
| 19:04.26 | SlammerXP | any reason why you can't put a filesystem on it? |
| 19:04.49 | SlammerXP | but bonnie++ is your friend |
| 19:04.49 | rhowe | Well, filesystems have their own I/O access patterns |
| 19:05.00 | rhowe | I was thinking there must be something which could just hammer a block device, raw |
| 19:05.09 | SlammerXP | yes, but you're not going to use the array _without_ an fs on it |
| 19:05.25 | rhowe | sure |
| 19:05.28 | SlammerXP | so the numbers you get without an fs would be meaningless for approximating real world behaviour |
| 19:05.50 | rhowe | SlammerXP: This isn't for benchmarking purposes. This is to test that the horrid hacks to the SCSI layer I'm running haven't broken anything too badly |
| 19:06.15 | SlammerXP | bonnie++ simulates databases |
| 19:06.45 | rhowe | I thought it needed a filesystem? |
| 19:06.50 | SlammerXP | yes |
| 19:07.43 | SlammerXP | you could write something to wrap around dd I suppose. |
| 19:07.54 | rhowe | hm, 35Mbyte/s read, 5Mbyte/s write |
| 19:08.09 | rhowe | That was using a large block size with dd, though, so it wouldn't have been very sensible |
| 19:08.23 | rhowe | That's across a 4-disk U320 FC-attached array with two SCSI channels |
| 19:08.26 | rhowe | (2 drives on each) |
| 19:08.33 | rhowe | Not exactly blazing :) |
| 19:08.44 | rhowe | I wonder what the stripe size is.. |
| 19:08.51 | SlammerXP | 1k :) |
| 19:08.52 | rhowe | I think it's RAID5 |
| 19:08.57 | rhowe | Probably 128k |
| 19:10.00 | rhowe | Also, this is on 32bit/33MHz PCI on an old P2-233 or something |
| 19:10.08 | rhowe | (spare PC I found to act as fibrechannel test rig) |
| 19:10.26 | rhowe | Not much chance of buffer caches being an issue either - it's a little memory-constrained :) |
| 19:11.51 | Cope | ? |
| 19:11.58 | Cope | ah |
| 19:12.25 | SlammerXP | i still need more customers |
| 19:12.40 | SlammerXP | though I had a nice chat with the bloke who advertised that linux engineer role this morning |
| 19:12.58 | Cope | oh aye? |
| 19:13.03 | SlammerXP | yes, nice bloke |
| 19:13.13 | Cope | gah - dinner |
| 19:13.23 | SlammerXP | his hiring policy, and I have permission to quote him on this, is "no assholes" |
| 19:13.53 | rhowe | SlammerXP: Oh well, keep looking then :P |
| 19:14.02 | SlammerXP | i said is was no problem flying over to the UK for a face to face, and he suggested that he flies here instead. |
| 19:14.07 | SlammerXP | rhowe: quite :) |
| 19:14.22 | rhowe | SlammerXP: z00dax stole a job from under my nose :P |
| 19:14.26 | murb | SlammerXP: are you looking for a permant type gig? |
| 19:14.46 | rhowe | SlammerXP: Still, I can hardly say they made a poor choice |
| 19:14.50 | SlammerXP | murb: i'll seriously consider any interesting role. |
| 19:15.12 | SlammerXP | rhowe: he remembered to ask if they wanted fries and you didn't? :) |
| 19:15.29 | murb | SlammerXP: i'm beginning to get contract work in and arround frankfurt, just as i buy a house 300 km away. |
| 19:15.34 | rhowe | SlammerXP: Damn, I knew there was something I did wrong |
| 19:15.36 | murb | typical. |
| 19:16.00 | SlammerXP | murb: a 300km commute is doable. |
| 19:16.23 | SlammerXP | especially given a considerate employer. |
| 19:16.26 | murb | SlammerXP: well i also need a driving license. |
| 19:16.41 | murb | SlammerXP: however for contract stuff i can stay in a hotel. |
| 19:17.07 | murb | twas supposed to be this week though :(. |
| 19:19.15 | murb | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:22.00 | SlammerXP | the downside of contracting is that you have to be flexible if you want to earn the bigger stuff |
| 19:22.23 | SlammerXP | Yahoo asked me if I could help out with a DC build in the states |
| 19:22.47 | SlammerXP | "sure, when?" "when does your flight get in? we'll have a taxi waiting" |
| 19:22.54 | rhowe | murb: Oh crap. I was going to check with Natwest for you, wasn't I? |
| 19:23.11 | murb | rhowe: don't worry, it could have been cheaper |
| 19:23.15 | SlammerXP | murb: banks are the worst people to do currency transfers with |
| 19:23.29 | murb | SlammerXP: i could have saved 200 quid with the rates quoted this morning. |
| 19:23.38 | murb | however they all had lots of flail + 2 working day waits |
| 19:24.02 | murb | given they sent 177 more euros than i was expecting for my money it was only a 100 quid ripoff |
| 19:24.19 | murb | + they charged a 20 quid fee which the broker wouldn't have. |
| 19:25.10 | murb | SlammerXP: the contract foo for the house is now thursday, i don't want to sign the contract which has vicious penalties for non payment in time like 5% added on. |
| 19:25.13 | murb | and i fly back to .de tomorrow. |
| 19:25.26 | SlammerXP | whereabouts? |
| 19:25.31 | SlammerXP | i've only ever been to munich |
| 19:25.44 | murb | SlammerXP: Wiesbaden, about 60km from Frankfurt. |
| 19:25.58 | murb | but i'm moving to Helmbrechts in oberfranken |
| 19:26.48 | murb | as am buying a house (hense the transfer foo) and getting now engaged. |
| 19:27.26 | SlammerXP | my goal this year is to fly less than 50 times |
| 19:27.45 | rhowe | OK, that's bonnie++ going |
| 19:27.50 | murb | SlammerXP: i found my shoe box of boarding cards today. |
| 19:27.50 | SlammerXP | rhowe: sec. |
| 19:27.57 | rhowe | Hopefully the thing won't overheat overnight |
| 19:27.59 | murb | (used to be useful when claiming expences) |
| 19:28.03 | SlammerXP | did you tell it to use files twice as big as your physical ram? |
| 19:28.24 | rhowe | SlammerXP: It had an option for specifying the RAM of the box, which I set to the true value.. |
| 19:29.18 | murb | now i have a wireless card with a binary only linux driver wrapped up in an exe that doens't unzip. |
| 19:29.36 | SlammerXP | throw card and driver away, buy a properly supported one. |
| 19:29.37 | murb | with a module for 2.4.0test1 and 2.2.14-bah .. |
| 19:29.52 | murb | SlammerXP: i have some, i'm currently buying random cards that are cheap. |
| 19:30.04 | rhowe | murb: This evening I will be mostly trying to get SLIND to work |
| 19:30.11 | murb | and reurned the unsupported ones atleast in .de |
| 19:30.16 | rhowe | murb: Following on from that, I can start playing with Atheros drivers |
| 19:30.39 | rhowe | murb: s'only taken me a year :) |
| 19:31.24 | murb | i'm thinking of buyin gthat netgear box that has wireless with atheros, usb for masstorage and 2 ethernets one connected to a vlancapable 4 port internal switch. |
| 19:31.37 | murb | they seem to go for about 30 quid on ebay. |
| 19:31.39 | SlammerXP | i was a skype router |
| 19:31.43 | SlammerXP | want a |
| 19:31.49 | murb | SlammerXP: for asterisk? |
| 19:32.01 | murb | there is one but it isn't free. |
| 19:32.07 | murb | chan_skype or something like that. |
| 19:32.08 | SlammerXP | no. so I don't have to keep a box switched on all the time to make phone calls |
| 19:32.36 | murb | i want to get this netgear thing so i only have to leave on switch, adslmodem, this box and cisco for isdn foo |
| 19:39.56 | rhowe | hm, looks like this is what I want - http://home.comcast.net/~SCSIguy/SCSI_FAQ/RMiller_Tools/dt.html |
| 19:41.27 | Cope | indeed |
| 19:43.17 | rhowe | bonnie++ completed without incident, however |
| 19:43.30 | rhowe | This stuff might even be reliable... |
| 19:43.32 | rhowe | If it is, that rocks |
| 19:43.45 | rhowe | Finally, we can stop using 2.4.27 |
| 19:44.03 | Cope | i see |
| 19:56.37 | SlammerXP | a bonnie run should take 24-48 hours |
| 19:56.50 | SlammerXP | more if you can afford the time |
| 20:15.16 | Tarragon | Anyone seen Jason or Simon? The mailing list is barfing with a 502 error. |
| 20:17.16 | SlammerXP | Tarragon: iwfm |
| 20:23.01 | rhowe | Tarragon! |
| 20:23.14 | Tarragon | SlammerXP, Sorry, I should have said that the interface to kill the spam has the 502. The mail is still coming through |
| 20:23.24 | SlammerXP | bah :) |
| 20:24.34 | rhowe | Tarragon: So, you're saying the gllug list needs an anti-spam solution? |
| 20:24.56 | SlammerXP | beats me |
| 20:28.04 | Tarragon | I am the antispam solution! |
| 20:29.12 | rhowe | Tarragon: What are you up to these days, other than reading lots of spam? |
| 20:29.46 | murb | someone needs to moderate gllugadmin.. |
| 20:30.10 | murb | or run a better filter. |
| 20:30.36 | Tarragon | Better filter yes. I manage to kill about ten each morning on that one. |
| 20:30.57 | SlammerXP | i think abmx could be persuaded to do filtering for free for inbound gllug mail. |
| 20:31.07 | SlammerXP | the inbound volume isn't high. |
| 20:31.55 | Tarragon | I think (though could be wrong) that the filtering is done by Positive |
| 20:32.10 | SlammerXP | dunno. |
| 20:32.17 | SlammerXP | have servers, will filter. |
| 20:32.32 | SlammerXP | maybe 100 a day or a busy day? tis peanuts. |
| 20:32.35 | SlammerXP | on a |
| 20:34.03 | Tarragon | I am only the last resort to check the false positives. Very very rare that the filter gets something that I then let through. It is all the usual spam. There are about six of us that kill them. |
| 20:40.27 | murb | i've more than once killed a proper message whilst reading it as the subjet looked spammy |
| 20:41.31 | SlammerXP | well, the offer's there. feel free to ignore it :) |
| 20:44.25 | rhowe | murb: *nod*. I moderate a couple of lists too, and it's easy to do |
| 20:53.16 | Cope | sleep |
| 20:53.18 | Cope | nnall |
| 20:54.39 | *** join/#gllug AndrewBlack (n=chatzill@81.2.66.249) |
| 22:29.35 | Tarragon | SlammerXP, I will put the offer on the admin list when it is working :-) |
| 22:35.55 | Tarragon | rhowe: Working with Linux on X4100 boxes. Well that's the plan, but they have me trying to sort out management issues that are as boring as hell. I can't say I am enjoying it, but then it is a job so I have to keep doing it. |
| 23:01.44 | *** join/#gllug ldnblk (n=Just@212.183.128.185) |
| 23:22.56 | wethrin | A bit on the side? |
| 23:23.14 | z00dax | :)) |
| 23:25.32 | wethrin | I think you're sore out of luck here :) |