| 00:09.06 | Gunde | goodnight |
| 00:09.18 | *** part/#gllug Gunde (n=spamyous@82.153.170.213) |
| 00:30.22 | wethrin | roar |
| 05:03.49 | *** join/#gllug Leeds (n=richardc@210.245.153.227) |
| 05:45.40 | *** join/#gllug secretlondon (n=secretlo@5ac0b80e.bb.sky.com) |
| 05:46.42 | morsing | 'morning |
| 05:46.46 | Leeds | hi |
| 05:47.35 | secretlondon | morning |
| 05:47.48 | morsing | :) |
| 05:49.55 | morsing | Leeds: What did you have for breakfast? |
| 05:50.13 | Leeds | weetabix |
| 05:50.26 | Leeds | you? |
| 05:50.38 | morsing | Sausage roll |
| 05:50.49 | Leeds | nice |
| 05:50.51 | morsing | Mmm... |
| 05:51.09 | Leeds | http://www.crossia.com/ViewJobPost.jhtml?id=9235 |
| 05:52.13 | morsing | Nice |
| 05:52.39 | Leeds | you think it's interesting? |
| 05:53.02 | secretlondon | I had earl grey tea and some turkish bread |
| 05:53.10 | morsing | Sure |
| 05:53.13 | morsing | Yuck - tea |
| 05:53.22 | morsing | secretlondon: Are you turkish? |
| 05:53.30 | morsing | Shower... |
| 05:53.37 | Leeds | alternatively, are you an Earl? |
| 05:53.38 | secretlondon | no |
| 05:54.02 | secretlondon | i'm just going through a phase of buying fresh bread from the local turkish shop as its nice |
| 05:54.16 | secretlondon | I'm not grey either |
| 05:54.43 | Leeds | good plan... there are *loads* of little bakeries around here, so I tend to get bread from random places... when I say loads, I mean normally at least a couple per block |
| 05:54.55 | Leeds | I do like the Japanese one across the road |
| 05:55.21 | secretlondon | its much nicer than supermarket bread - we do have a west indian bread shop too but the queues are massive |
| 05:55.56 | Leeds | when you say supermarket bread do you mean in-house own-brand, or mass-baked stuff like hovis, etc.? |
| 05:56.35 | secretlondon | well both really - the local somerfield (ex safeway) does have an in store bakery but it's not that much nicer than the mass produced stuff |
| 05:57.49 | secretlondon | the non supermarker stuff does seem to be denser - i notice how much air some english bread has |
| 05:57.58 | Leeds | my cousin was very upset when he saw me buying bread in the bakery as opposed to kosher stuff from the local bakery |
| 05:58.23 | secretlondon | i suppose it might be milky |
| 05:58.29 | secretlondon | do you keep kosher? |
| 05:58.41 | Leeds | only for meat |
| 05:59.07 | Leeds | and bread is one of the things (along with wine and meat) which has to be explicitly kosher, if you care to that extent |
| 05:59.55 | Leeds | I don't care to that extent, but my cousin does - and as it happens, it was directly after yom kippur, so I think he was trying to set me on a good path for the year... bakery bread is better anyway :-) |
| 06:00.08 | secretlondon | ah - I admit I don't know much about kosher food law - i briefly lived in Barnet as a student and I remember bakeries in Hendon which had 2 separate counters for milky and non milky |
| 06:00.49 | Leeds | in general, you'll find all bakeries are milky... *delis* might have two counters |
| 06:01.10 | secretlondon | maybe that was it |
| 06:01.25 | secretlondon | it was several years ago |
| 06:02.06 | Leeds | I have a flat in hendon... |
| 06:02.24 | secretlondon | ah |
| 06:02.48 | secretlondon | I was living in nasty student accommodation in Colindale but was involved in the local elections in Hendon ward |
| 06:04.43 | Leeds | and told the party so through the feedback thing on their website |
| 06:06.07 | secretlondon | i go back and forwards - i left for a long time but rejoined at the beginning of this year. The labour parties law and order stuff is waay to authoritarian for me. i felt that by joining i would help do something about it |
| 06:06.32 | Leeds | I moved away after the boss called for an arms embargo against Israel |
| 06:07.14 | secretlondon | fair enough |
| 06:07.14 | Leeds | can't support a party which doesn't support my friends being able to defend themselves against terrorist attacks |
| 07:15.00 | *** join/#gllug trousers (n=trousers@82-43-176-23.cable.ubr06.newm.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 07:15.14 | trousers | Howdy |
| 07:15.20 | secretlondon | morning |
| 07:15.38 | trousers | secretlondon: What are you doing up at this time? |
| 07:16.00 | secretlondon | trousers: I'm not running on any sort of organised time zone |
| 07:16.14 | trousers | Ah, righto |
| 07:16.53 | Leeds | timezones are for wimps |
| 07:17.04 | trousers | Yay, halloween, another celebrationg of our pagan heritage! |
| 07:17.44 | trousers | And for people to make fools of themselves -__ |
| 07:18.20 | trousers | Leeds: No they're not Mr. it gets dark at midday :P |
| 07:19.08 | Leeds | halloween is a big deal here - everything is decorated, you see kids in the street during the day - and 'adults' at night - in costumes, and it may or may not be a big party night tonight |
| 07:20.05 | secretlondon | I think it's a lot bigger in the US too - we have bonfire night here to distract people I guess |
| 07:20.21 | trousers | Anyway, I'm off to school - bye |
| 07:28.00 | morsing | trousers_school! |
| 07:28.10 | Blapto | morsing! |
| 07:28.41 | Blapto | Working from home at 0730! |
| 07:28.50 | Blapto | and just about to go into work, bye |
| 07:33.57 | serris | morning all |
| 07:34.25 | morsing | serris! |
| 07:34.37 | serris | Morning morsing |
| 07:34.44 | serris | No work for 2 days. Woohoo |
| 07:35.56 | morsing | Nice |
| 07:35.59 | serris | Yeah |
| 07:36.17 | serris | Halloweeners are pwned at my place. I unhooked the door bell |
| 07:36.44 | Leeds | and hooked it to the mains? |
| 07:36.46 | serris | now I just have to figure out how to not have any light showing into the stairwell |
| 07:36.52 | serris | Nah |
| 07:37.05 | serris | the problem with that would be I'd end up forgetting and would zap my self |
| 07:37.21 | serris | morsing: had anything good for breakfast? |
| 07:42.56 | secretlondon | it's sad when you check your email and it's all from you |
| 07:44.19 | serris | Morning secretlondon |
| 07:44.24 | serris | How's learning the Ubuntu packaging going? |
| 07:44.27 | secretlondon | morning serris |
| 07:44.37 | secretlondon | I've now got pbuilder |
| 07:44.47 | serris | Ah |
| 07:45.20 | secretlondon | I'm just doing bug triage - and every change you make launchpad sends you an email |
| 07:45.33 | secretlondon | so you get 10 non mailing list emails but they are all you.. |
| 07:46.04 | morsing | serris: Sausage roll |
| 07:46.37 | secretlondon | serris: I had earl grey tea and turkish bread. Previous discussion has confirmed I'm not turkish, grey or an earl |
| 07:46.38 | serris | Nice |
| 07:47.37 | serris | I had a 'Fun size' Milky-Way bar for breakfast |
| 07:52.04 | sabinef72 | hello |
| 07:52.12 | serris | hi sabinef72 |
| 07:52.26 | sabinef72 | serris ! |
| 07:52.56 | serris | How's it going? |
| 07:53.26 | sabinef72 | just wake up.... |
| 07:54.42 | *** join/#gllug random1658 (n=random16@82-44-62-14.cable.ubr02.mort.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 08:00.14 | secretlondon | serris: was it "fun" or just small? |
| 08:00.22 | secretlondon | morning sabinef72 |
| 08:00.24 | serris | It was small |
| 08:00.29 | serris | but I ate a bag of 40 in 4 days |
| 08:02.13 | morsing | iTron! |
| 08:02.16 | morsing | sabinef72! |
| 08:03.31 | sabinef72 | hi secretlondon |
| 08:24.01 | *** join/#gllug SlayerXP (n=martin@gw-colt.fotango.com) |
| 08:25.06 | morsing | SlayerXP! |
| 08:25.12 | morsing | SlayerXP: Are you scary today? |
| 08:27.01 | serris | mm beer |
| 08:27.14 | secretlondon | SlayerXp should be scary |
| 08:27.17 | murb | must go shopping today. |
| 08:27.27 | SlayerXP | i'm no more scary than usual |
| 08:27.39 | SlayerXP | no less scary, either |
| 08:28.22 | murb | being scalred of SlayerXP is like being scared by a mouse, carrying blackdeath. |
| 08:28.43 | secretlondon | should I only be scared if I'm windows XP? |
| 08:29.00 | SlayerXP | more like a cute rabbit carrying a debian cd |
| 08:29.02 | murb | secretlondon: only if you are offered a vista upgrade. |
| 08:29.21 | murb | a rabbid debian zealot with aCD? |
| 08:50.24 | mozrat | Morning |
| 08:50.32 | secretlondon | morning mozrat |
| 08:50.46 | mozrat | hey secretlondon |
| 08:53.03 | serris | Hi mozrat |
| 08:53.06 | morsing | mozzie! |
| 08:54.05 | mozrat | hey guys! |
| 08:54.28 | morsing | mozrat: Are you scary? |
| 08:54.54 | mozrat | Very |
| 08:54.59 | mozrat | especially when hungry |
| 08:55.03 | morsing | Nice |
| 08:55.33 | mozrat | however, I am 8/10ths of the way through a sausage sandwich so.. not so scary now |
| 08:56.50 | murb | scary when hungarian. |
| 08:57.07 | secretlondon | are hungarians scary? |
| 08:57.52 | serris | I'm Hungarian and I'm not very scary : ( |
| 08:57.53 | murb | depends if they are rioting or not. |
| 08:58.01 | secretlondon | true |
| 08:58.02 | serris | But riots are fun! |
| 08:58.03 | murb | or inspecting tickets. |
| 08:58.11 | secretlondon | We do need more riots I think |
| 08:58.16 | serris | Indeed |
| 08:58.21 | serris | We do need more strikes at work |
| 08:58.34 | murb | more strikes less pay, makes you happy? |
| 08:58.59 | serris | More strikes more equal work make me happy |
| 08:59.23 | serris | I wouldn't be going on strike over pay rise |
| 08:59.38 | serris | We were planning a strike not long ago over lateness |
| 08:59.57 | Leeds | demanding the right to be late? |
| 09:00.01 | murb | they seemed to forget they don't get paid when on strike. |
| 09:00.13 | serris | Demand the right for everyone to be treated the same on instances of being late |
| 09:00.20 | serris | I don't mind mur |
| 09:00.21 | serris | murb |
| 09:00.22 | murb | Leeds: maybe they wanted latetness to be considered cross misconduct. |
| 09:00.24 | serris | We are short staffed all the time |
| 09:00.36 | serris | Which means I can get over time so I wouldn't really be losing money |
| 09:00.37 | murb | gross |
| 09:00.55 | murb | serris: so people who are negatively late shouldn't be penalised. |
| 09:01.07 | murb | y b doin gwork for those using unreliable forms of transport etc? |
| 09:01.31 | serris | The people in question are late every day they come to work by 15-20 minutes |
| 09:01.35 | serris | They still get payed the full 10 hours |
| 09:01.59 | serris | If I'm late by 5 minutes I have to stand through a 10 minute bollocking while nothing is done about them |
| 09:02.05 | murb | serris: if they lost an hour for every minute late they were, maybe they'd be more careful? |
| 09:02.21 | serris | Why do they get payed the same as me, actual more since they've been with the company longer than I when they do less work |
| 09:02.32 | Leeds | serris: and the difference between you and them? |
| 09:02.34 | serris | Well we're meant to be short timed for every minute we are late |
| 09:02.41 | serris | But managers don't crack down on it |
| 09:02.51 | serris | The people writting up the daily clock in details don't do anything about it |
| 09:02.54 | murb | serris: when being bollocked for being late in the morning, you should just say you'll make sure you watch the clock at the other end. |
| 09:03.08 | serris | I work the night shift |
| 09:03.17 | murb | serris: do you have a machine? |
| 09:03.19 | serris | And I'm never late ; ) |
| 09:03.21 | murb | for clocking on? |
| 09:03.24 | serris | Yep |
| 09:03.33 | murb | do you have to clock off to use irc? |
| 09:03.54 | serris | I clock in 15 minutes early every day. Not that it gives me any more money but it saves me from having to clock in late due to issues with the clocks |
| 09:04.12 | serris | I don't have to clock off until my shift ends |
| 09:04.19 | serris | bonus in being on the night shift. payed breaks |
| 09:04.34 | serris | but we do get 25 minutes less break than day shift who would be doing for example a 10 hour shift |
| 09:04.35 | murb | serris: what is your job? |
| 09:04.43 | serris | Stacking shelves at Sainsbury's |
| 09:06.04 | mozrat | This is my last day in this job.. woo! |
| 09:06.10 | serris | Nice |
| 09:06.14 | murb | mozrat: you start a new one tomorrow? |
| 09:06.25 | mozrat | But I have to now unsubscribe from many mailing lists with my work email |
| 09:06.33 | mozrat | murb: yep - just down the hall in the same building |
| 09:06.34 | murb | mozrat: no you don't! |
| 09:08.06 | mozrat | murb: a lot of them are dead. And I'm not subbing from my work address anymore anyway |
| 09:08.15 | *** join/#gllug rhowe (i=rhowe@xiao.siksai.co.uk) |
| 09:08.19 | mozrat | hey rhowe |
| 09:08.27 | serris | This job is not very fair, if you want to call it that. Their policy is that you have to do a minimum of 45 cases an hour. If you do less, you get "punished" and if you do more you get no reward but more work |
| 09:08.40 | rhowe | mornin' |
| 09:08.41 | serris | Yet everyone gets payed the same but not everyone gets pushed by the management |
| 09:08.53 | rhowe | Anyone got any reccommendations on finding a locksmith? |
| 09:08.55 | secretlondon | morning lard |
| 09:09.04 | mozrat | hey keef |
| 09:09.06 | serris | Yellow pages? |
| 09:09.10 | mozrat | serris: sounds sucky |
| 09:09.16 | serris | It is |
| 09:09.27 | rhowe | serris: Yeah, been through there - no way of knowing reputability though, really |
| 09:09.37 | sabinef72 | mozzieeeeeeeeeeeeee |
| 09:10.02 | serris | I'll do 120 cases an hour on BWS while the guy in the next aisle does 30 cases an hour. I get told to finish by x hour and he is left alone. He gets payed more than me since he's been with Sainsbury's for 5 years while I have been with them for 1 |
| 09:10.18 | rhowe | argh, goddammit Amazon |
| 09:10.19 | rhowe | We are sorry to report that the following items have been delayed. |
| 09:10.19 | rhowe | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:10.19 | rhowe | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:10.47 | antiphase | I just got a spam entitled "nigger investment" |
| 09:10.58 | Leeds | antiphase: do you regularly invest in niggers? |
| 09:11.05 | serris | lol |
| 09:11.18 | antiphase | I never have before. Maybe now's the time to start |
| 09:11.39 | serris | Indeed. You should follow up on that e-mail. It might be the investment of your life |
| 09:11.52 | murb | rhowe: what doyou need a lock smith in for? |
| 09:11.57 | rhowe | Tell all your friends & family |
| 09:12.10 | rhowe | murb: burglary yesterday. Can't find one of the keys |
| 09:12.12 | Leeds | murb: uh, that would be to replace a lock |
| 09:12.12 | antiphase | Maybe today is "Black Tuesday" |
| 09:12.32 | rhowe | antiphase: Nope, today is Lordi Tuesday! |
| 09:12.46 | antiphase | Stupid spammers |
| 09:13.04 | murb | rhowe: oh :( |
| 09:13.30 | rhowe | murb: Laptop, DS Lite, 2 digicams, all gone |
| 09:13.33 | murb | rhowe: you can't change the lock or even jus tty ecylinder yourself? |
| 09:13.44 | murb | rhowe: any sign of forced entry? |
| 09:13.52 | rhowe | murb: Hm.. probably not easily |
| 09:13.56 | rhowe | murb: or quickly |
| 09:14.02 | rhowe | murb: Nah, looks like we left a window open |
| 09:14.11 | murb | oh :( |
| 09:14.55 | murb | rhowe: do you have maniplation safe locks? |
| 09:15.18 | murb | or atleast two locks of different types on your front door? |
| 09:15.40 | rhowe | murb: Nope |
| 09:15.52 | rhowe | murb: Well, it might be manipulation safe |
| 09:16.14 | murb | rhowe: normally such locks are much more expensive, they are designed to fail when poked. |
| 09:16.24 | murb | in an evident way |
| 09:16.45 | murb | apparently locks of bugularies in .de with no sign of force entry :( |
| 09:16.48 | murb | s/locks/lots/ |
| 09:16.51 | morsing | Beer |
| 09:16.54 | murb | due to lock flaws |
| 09:17.55 | antiphase | Locks are flawsed. Next. |
| 09:18.39 | murb | the ccc used to share their congress venue with a lock picking club. |
| 09:19.25 | morsing | Moo |
| 09:19.37 | murb | boing |
| 09:54.15 | morsing | How do I set my cygwin TERM? |
| 10:00.46 | *** join/#gllug huw-l (n=scmhl2@131.251.42.89) |
| 10:18.41 | *** join/#gllug goibhniu (n=cillian@grail1.oxfam.org.uk) |
| 10:27.11 | morsing | Cawfy |
| 10:31.12 | Blapto | Hi |
| 10:38.35 | rhowe | heh, I just got done |
| 10:38.49 | rhowe | Replacing the barrel on that lock was pretty trivial :P |
| 10:39.02 | rhowe | Oh well, here's hoping the landlady takes pity on us :) |
| 10:46.34 | murb | rhowe: you paid someone to do it for you or? |
| 10:46.45 | murb | rhowe: the landlady shouldn't care as long as you provide any required keys. |
| 10:49.10 | *** join/#gllug z00dax_Delhi (n=z00dax@203.145.128.6) |
| 10:49.27 | serris | hi z00dax_Delhi |
| 10:49.27 | z00dax_Delhi | Hello! |
| 10:49.34 | z00dax_Delhi | Hey serris |
| 10:49.38 | serris | How's it going? |
| 10:50.25 | sabinef72 | z00dax_Delhi: !!!!!!! |
| 10:50.27 | rhowe | murb: Yeah, paid someone |
| 10:50.30 | rhowe | murb: £85! |
| 10:50.33 | z00dax_Delhi | Not bad, on the tube back after an excellent lunch with some old friends. |
| 10:50.46 | rhowe | murb: I'm in the wrong industry! I should be in the industry of screwing people! |
| 10:50.46 | z00dax_Delhi | Sabinef! |
| 10:50.58 | murb | rhowe: or screwing in new cylinders. |
| 10:51.10 | rhowe | murb: Yah |
| 10:51.12 | murb | or selling invalid insurance polices. |
| 10:51.14 | iTron | rhowe: You had your lock(s) replaced now? |
| 10:51.16 | rhowe | Alright, a bath and then I'm off to work |
| 10:51.20 | rhowe | iTron: Yep |
| 10:51.27 | iTron | rhowe: See you later :) |
| 10:51.47 | rhowe | iTron: Well, lock, at hourly rates of about £5000 |
| 10:52.26 | iTron | rhowe: Ouch. |
| 10:52.26 | iTron | rhowe: Next time make sure all your windows are closed - it's cheaper :) |
| 10:52.40 | rhowe | Yeah, yeah |
| 10:54.41 | z00dax_Delhi | What happened ? |
| 10:55.24 | rhowe | z00dax_Delhi: Looks like someone climbed in through the window and ran off with a bunch of stuff |
| 10:55.25 | Leeds | z00dax_Delhi: someone cunningly broke in through an open window |
| 10:55.46 | z00dax_Delhi | :( |
| 10:56.20 | z00dax_Delhi | Why break in, when the window is open ? |
| 10:56.28 | z00dax_Delhi | Oh, right ! |
| 10:56.50 | rhowe | z00dax_Delhi: We can't find a key (although it could well be under the mess) |
| 10:56.57 | rhowe | z00dax_Delhi: So I got the door lock changed |
| 10:57.01 | Leeds | rhowe: your mess or theirs? :-) |
| 10:57.03 | goibhniu | rhowe: while you were at Lordi? |
| 10:57.08 | rhowe | goibhniu: Nah, that's tonight |
| 10:57.19 | rhowe | Leeds: Mixture - they somehow managed to make our mess worse |
| 10:57.52 | Leeds | wow, that's impressive |
| 10:58.02 | Leeds | goibhniu: I have an alibaba! |
| 10:59.03 | keithlard_ | z00dax> wazzup |
| 10:59.19 | z00dax_Delhi | Keith! |
| 10:59.50 | z00dax_Delhi | Got a few hours to packup then heading out for dinner and then airport |
| 11:00.03 | Leeds | back to the Smoke? |
| 11:00.24 | z00dax_Delhi | Yup, and the cold and wet |
| 11:00.45 | Leeds | there's cold and wet? :-) |
| 11:07.37 | cope_ | moin |
| 11:10.18 | murb | a considerate burglar would cause signs of forced entry even if they came in via an opendoor / window. |
| 11:10.36 | *** join/#gllug keithlard (n=john@host217-34-140-129.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 11:11.12 | morsing | Hey |
| 11:11.32 | morsing | Ok, question is, pumpkin or turnip? |
| 11:11.35 | morsing | Vote now... |
| 11:11.58 | murb | do you look more like a cerbis or? |
| 11:13.09 | morsing | a |
| 11:13.36 | morsing | Come on people, vote! |
| 11:13.48 | sabinef72 | pumpkin !!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 11:13.51 | morsing | :) |
| 11:15.04 | mozrat | pumpkin. delicious |
| 11:15.16 | morsing | No scottish people here then? |
| 11:16.01 | murb | good. |
| 11:16.42 | sabinef72 | pumpkin soap is good |
| 11:16.59 | morsing | dre10dbp01:/> lsps -s |
| 11:16.59 | morsing | Total Paging Space Percent Used |
| 11:17.04 | morsing | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:17.06 | morsing | Weird |
| 11:17.31 | psnl | morsing: whats the vote? |
| 11:18.12 | morsing | pumpkin or turnip? |
| 11:18.31 | Leeds | okay, I'm building some C++ library... the source tree, with object files and libraries, is up to over 640MB... does this sound wrong to anyone else? |
| 11:18.56 | morsing | Leeds: Don't interrupt the vote! |
| 11:19.05 | Leeds | fuck the vote! |
| 11:19.17 | mozrat | sabinef72: you mean soup or soap? |
| 11:19.54 | morsing | Leeds: FUCK YOU! |
| 11:19.58 | sabinef72 | soup !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 11:20.29 | sabinef72 | soap <--- my god I'm so stupid |
| 11:20.38 | SlayerXP | oh dear, he's channeling george again |
| 11:20.51 | Leeds | mmm... soap |
| 11:20.55 | Cope | hello SlayerXP |
| 11:21.18 | SlayerXP | hey steve |
| 11:21.29 | sabinef72 | morsing: everybody choose pumpkin ! |
| 11:23.34 | goibhniu | they're both rather good roasted |
| 11:23.43 | morsing | sabinef72: No they don't |
| 11:24.07 | sabinef72 | morsing: who ? |
| 11:24.26 | sabinef72 | pumpkin 2 - turnip 0 |
| 11:24.32 | sabinef72 | isn't it enough ? |
| 11:24.41 | goibhniu | pumpkins are easier to carve up though ... it's a difficult one |
| 11:30.44 | iTron | It's not tasty, and it's a pulpy fibrous mess. |
| 11:31.31 | sabinef72 | mozrat !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 11:31.34 | goibhniu | the seeds are very good for the prostate |
| 11:31.59 | Leeds | oh, I prefer to eat turnip |
| 11:32.46 | mozrat | i like pumpkin pie, never tried it as a soap |
| 11:32.47 | mozrat | SOUP! |
| 11:35.29 | iTron | Sweet potatoe is another foodstuff I can't stand. |
| 11:35.51 | iTron | Give me ordinary potatoes any day. |
| 11:45.16 | mozrat | hey Cope! Where were you lurking? |
| 11:50.44 | keithlard_ | hi secretlondon |
| 11:50.51 | secretlondon | hi mr lard |
| 11:52.03 | mozrat | secretlondon: are you on the GLLUG mailing list? |
| 11:52.12 | Cope | hello keithlard_ |
| 11:52.13 | secretlondon | mozrat: 2 of the 3 |
| 11:52.18 | keithlard_ | hi |
| 11:52.23 | mozrat | I'm wondering whether to comment on your last blog post on your blog or on the list... |
| 11:52.36 | Blapto | How do you get the pumpkin seeds to your prostate? |
| 11:52.52 | iTron | Blapto: You just don't want to know. |
| 11:53.02 | secretlondon | mozrat: I'll subscribe to the list |
| 11:53.29 | mozrat | secretlondon: I should throw it up there? |
| 11:53.44 | mozrat | bad choice of words.. I should start the conversation there? |
| 11:53.50 | secretlondon | mozrat:it'll get more traffic |
| 11:54.05 | Blapto | what's this blog post? |
| 11:55.18 | secretlondon | it's about is edgy broken |
| 11:56.25 | secretlondon | the gllug mailserver seems to be half an hour slow btw |
| 11:56.45 | secretlondon | gllug-bounces has just mailed me at 11:22 |
| 11:58.09 | SlayerXP | hey Mister Morris, I keep offering to proofread stuff for you _before_ you announce it to the world |
| 11:59.01 | mozrat | where is the fun in that |
| 11:59.17 | SlayerXP | i have several other suggestions, too |
| 12:00.08 | SlayerXP | like lose the brackets from the last paragraph |
| 12:00.34 | SlayerXP | FREE ADMISSION warrant and exclamation mark |
| 12:00.45 | Leeds | and? |
| 12:00.46 | SlayerXP | lose the hypen after "1-30pm" |
| 12:01.47 | SlayerXP | the second sentence of the the answer to "What is linux?" is _really_ clumsy |
| 12:02.06 | Leeds | 8pm... I should put some clothes on and go investigate food |
| 12:04.15 | SlayerXP | "has all of the applications you need" is, at best, a lie |
| 12:04.20 | mozrat | SlayerXP: one sec.. typing |
| 12:04.48 | mozrat | SlayerXP: You are a marvellous fellow but a poor marketer |
| 12:05.02 | SlayerXP | students who need either Autocad or Visio will be asking for their money back |
| 12:05.14 | morsing | Check it! |
| 12:05.19 | mozrat | How should we convey in terms that are suitable to people that are browsing the flyer that they should be considering using GNU/Linux unless we generalise a little? |
| 12:05.21 | SlayerXP | not just students, either :) |
| 12:05.38 | SlayerXP | well, don't tell outright porkies would be a good start :) |
| 12:05.44 | mozrat | This event is mainly targetted at students to be fair |
| 12:05.54 | iTron | SlayerXP: AutoCAD 14 can run on Linux under WINE, I believe. |
| 12:06.07 | antiphase | And not insisting they call it GNU/Linux is a good start for not pedanting them to death initially |
| 12:06.29 | SlayerXP | hey, I'm just the messenger |
| 12:06.39 | Leeds | they can have their money back, surely? *gone* |
| 12:06.41 | SlayerXP | you're free to ignore my suggestions |
| 12:07.23 | mozrat | No, I value them. But I'm not sure an A4 sheet full of the definition of what Linux is as a kernel with supporting GNU tools and libraries is going to attract people to the meeting |
| 12:07.32 | mozrat | we can brainwash them once they have joined the commune |
| 12:07.54 | mozrat | Did you know that Linux was just the kernel the first time you ever heard the word? |
| 12:08.28 | iTron | mozrat: Not I. |
| 12:09.22 | antiphase | The full-on marketing crap is surely the best way of getting people to try it, rather than explaining in great an boring detail why the future of the world is not $window-shaped |
| 12:09.39 | antiphase | I hate all the nonsense like XGL that new people seem to love; let them make up their own minds though :) |
| 12:14.07 | *** join/#gllug serris (i=serris@outbound.silenceisdefeat.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:14.07 | *** join/#gllug z00dax (n=kbsingh@base.karan.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:14.36 | *** join/#gllug z00dax (n=kbsingh@base.karan.org) |
| 12:15.10 | mozrat | Nuts, it seems that I don't have the original Scribus file I used to generate that flyter |
| 12:15.15 | mozrat | s/flyter/flyer/ |
| 12:17.45 | mozrat | Bah, I'll have to fix the flyer later. |
| 12:18.15 | mozrat | SlayerXP: I appreciate the feedback, I'll fix some of the points you raised. Other points are more to do with marketing rather than bad language and syntax issues |
| 12:18.35 | SlayerXP | mozrat: 404 the link then |
| 12:20.16 | secretlondon | the Free issue is why people like Shuttleworth use "software libre" |
| 12:20.27 | secretlondon | as free defaults to !money |
| 12:22.54 | secretlondon | I reckon one of the killer apps for students is Amarok - it's much better than banshee - it does things like wikipedia lookups on band/album articles |
| 12:23.22 | secretlondon | it's hotter than itunes - you certainly can't say that for rythmbox or banshee |
| 12:24.53 | mozrat | secretlondon: shame that a lot of vendors are moving away from KDE then. I agree - amarok rocks |
| 12:26.04 | secretlondon | mozrat: I run under gnome using kde libs |
| 12:26.43 | morsing | Mmm... Smoked Ham & Mustard Sandwich |
| 12:26.53 | secretlondon | Krita is another great kde app - it's a photoshop-lite - much nicer than the gimp |
| 12:27.02 | morsing | Nice |
| 12:27.28 | mozrat | secretlondon: have you tried "listen"? |
| 12:28.06 | secretlondon | mozrat: I have it here - didn't impress me particularly |
| 12:30.31 | secretlondon | mozrat:amarok allows you to use a mysql database to store all your music. when you've got 20,000 files or so thats nice |
| 12:31.10 | antiphase | :-O |
| 12:31.40 | antiphase | There's relational data, and then there's music tags |
| 12:32.06 | secretlondon | and does the ipod thing (not that I have one) but so does rhythmbox |
| 12:35.47 | serris | anyone tried the Sainsbury's pork pies before? |
| 12:36.58 | mozrat | I have |
| 12:36.58 | boudiccas | serris; no, they're not kosher |
| 12:37.40 | serris | Which one, mozrat? did it have a blue and yellow packaging? |
| 12:37.53 | mozrat | serris: not sure, why? |
| 12:38.01 | serris | I bought one but it doesn't seem to say wether to heat it in the oven or microwave and I don't trust Sainsbury's |
| 12:38.15 | serris | So if it's raw pork I won't be hapy |
| 12:38.16 | serris | happy* |
| 12:38.22 | mozrat | You should be the authoritative source on Sainsburies products! |
| 12:39.02 | serris | I tell people about offers |
| 12:39.06 | antiphase | Pork pies are edible hot or cold |
| 12:39.12 | antiphase | Especialy with beer |
| 12:39.19 | serris | And that you should always wash produce products from Sainsbury's |
| 12:39.23 | mozrat | I love Pork and Apple pork pies |
| 12:39.34 | serris | I work on produce and you don't want to buy anything from there and not wash it |
| 12:39.56 | antiphase | Doesn't that aply to anything that isn't packaged? |
| 12:40.03 | antiphase | Just as a matter of common sense |
| 12:41.10 | secretlondon | i think pork pies are pre-cooked |
| 12:41.32 | serris | antiphase: You know what they say about common sense, it's not so common |
| 12:41.37 | serris | A lot of people don't bother |
| 12:42.11 | serris | Hmm.. I just dropped my pork pie into the sink |
| 12:42.52 | morsing | Nice |
| 12:43.32 | serris | I know |
| 12:43.42 | serris | And I was going to cook mince just now too |
| 12:43.49 | serris | I think I should staw away from the kitchen |
| 12:43.58 | *** join/#gllug deep-blue (n=db@host81-133-152-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 12:45.03 | morsing | deep-blue! |
| 12:45.33 | deep-blue | morsing, afternoon |
| 12:47.15 | secretlondon | serris: least you didn't set fire to it |
| 12:47.54 | serris | No, I set fire to the kitchen on Wednesday |
| 12:47.59 | serris | So done that already this week |
| 12:48.21 | deep-blue | mwahaha |
| 12:49.21 | deep-blue | i was there, it was so funny |
| 12:49.36 | deep-blue | just more proof that serris shouldnt drink |
| 12:50.08 | serris | :P |
| 12:50.20 | serris | You may be onto something there. I had a beer today morning |
| 12:50.30 | deep-blue | today morning |
| 12:50.33 | serris | Yeah |
| 12:50.35 | deep-blue | nice grammer >< |
| 12:50.47 | deep-blue | you have obvs had more than 3 |
| 12:50.48 | serris | what.. |
| 12:51.05 | secretlondon | grammAr |
| 12:51.07 | boudiccas | serris; his grammer makes sense when you're working night shifts :) |
| 12:51.26 | serris | What's wrong with my grammar? |
| 12:51.43 | secretlondon | we had grammEr in the description for a vocab appication - v. embarrasing |
| 12:52.00 | deep-blue | nothing, im saying you are obvs tipsy or someshit cos you never say "today morning" |
| 12:52.10 | boudiccas | ser |
| 12:52.37 | boudiccas | serris; 'I had a beer today morning' is quite fair when you're suffering disorientation from working night shifts |
| 12:52.44 | serris | Yeah |
| 12:52.54 | deep-blue | true |
| 12:52.56 | serris | I drank at 9AM before too when I didn't work nightshift |
| 12:53.23 | serris | And I was referring to the corelation between drinking and food incidents since I dropped my pork pie into the sink about 10 minutes ago |
| 12:53.52 | deep-blue | >< |
| 12:53.56 | SlayerXP | secretlondon: for most people, grammar is what they call their mother's mother |
| 12:53.57 | deep-blue | MURDURER |
| 12:54.13 | serris | I'm still eating it |
| 12:54.17 | serris | It's good |
| 12:54.17 | deep-blue | 0.o |
| 12:56.14 | deep-blue | serr, if there was ever an excuse to get a shotgun, i think tonight will be it |
| 12:56.40 | serris | Nah I unhooked the bell |
| 12:57.00 | secretlondon | I have college finishing at 9pm. I wonder if they'll have stopped by then |
| 12:58.03 | deep-blue | unlikley |
| 12:58.09 | serris | I probably won't be up before then |
| 12:58.18 | *** join/#gllug huw-l (n=scmhl2@131.251.42.89) |
| 12:58.21 | serris | Unless some people decide to bang on my bedroom window to see if I'm at home |
| 12:58.32 | deep-blue | wouldnt suprise me |
| 12:58.33 | serris | In which case I'll open the door with my kitchen knife and won't be very peachy |
| 12:58.40 | serris | Well the drunk Albanians do it |
| 12:58.48 | deep-blue | lol |
| 12:58.51 | serris | So candy starved kids will more than likely do it too |
| 12:58.56 | deep-blue | lol |
| 12:59.07 | deep-blue | i could come round n hide in the bushes |
| 12:59.17 | deep-blue | n when they come past, jump out, and mug em for their sweets >< |
| 12:59.34 | serris | What bushes would that be, deep-blue. We don't have any |
| 12:59.42 | deep-blue | the neighbours on the right do |
| 13:02.27 | deep-blue | *giggles* |
| 13:12.19 | morsing | Twatties |
| 13:17.03 | secretlondon | college is an internet island - we can only check college email at college, and they block all others. the chances of a java irc client working are slim |
| 13:17.05 | deep-blue | what you studying secretlondon? |
| 13:17.12 | secretlondon | cisco ccna |
| 13:17.22 | deep-blue | cool |
| 13:17.43 | deep-blue | i managed to miss that course, long story involving a dodgy nigerian >< |
| 13:17.44 | *** join/#gllug Jasperw (n=jasperw@62.49.196.35) |
| 13:17.54 | antiphase | sh asl |
| 13:17.57 | deep-blue | kinda wish i had done it, at the same time, im working full time and perfectly happy |
| 13:18.40 | secretlondon | i'm not working which is why I'm online at weird times and have time to mess around with stuff |
| 13:20.43 | deep-blue | lol |
| 13:21.02 | deep-blue | actually, happy was a lie, i fuckin hate a good 80% of my job |
| 13:22.29 | deep-blue | damn i need to score 2grand >< |
| 13:24.54 | murb | deep-blue: what do you do? |
| 13:25.13 | deep-blue | tech support |
| 13:25.31 | deep-blue | i run and manage a small shop where we sell, repair, consult etc |
| 13:27.40 | murb | in london? |
| 13:27.56 | goibhniu | bg |
| 13:28.01 | deep-blue | in greater longon |
| 13:28.16 | murb | bg? |
| 13:28.40 | deep-blue | bg? |
| 13:29.02 | goibhniu | sorry .. focus was in the wrong place at the wrong time |
| 13:29.08 | deep-blue | lol |
| 13:30.03 | deep-blue | murb: ? |
| 13:36.53 | mozrat | Alert: SVN gurus. How can I dump out just part of a repo using `svnadmin dump`. Is that possible? |
| 13:39.40 | boudiccas | what is the url please to bring up the interface of my BackupPC on my machine please? |
| 13:40.03 | *** join/#gllug Blapto (n=blank@213.86.240.154) |
| 13:40.11 | mozrat | boudiccas: start again.. I didn't understand (please) |
| 13:40.12 | mozrat | :-) |
| 13:41.18 | boudiccas | mozrat; i'm running backuppc every evening but i now wish to use the web interface to access the backups, except i can't remember the url for thr aforementioned web interface [doh! :( |
| 13:41.52 | mozrat | Ah, I've not heard of backuppc - where did you get that from? |
| 13:42.53 | boudiccas | can't remember ... its proper name is BackuPPC i think |
| 13:46.34 | mozrat | boudiccas: not sure, sorry |
| 13:46.43 | boudiccas | np |
| 13:46.48 | mozrat | try `netstat -nap | less` and see if you can see the process running |
| 13:47.12 | mozrat | if there is a web interface I would guess it is running all of the time and listening to some random high port number |
| 13:47.32 | boudiccas | oh, i know its running, because cron fires it off at 2000 echa evening |
| 13:47.49 | morsing | What? |
| 13:47.51 | mozrat | But the web interface.Is there a process running that all of the time |
| 13:48.43 | boudiccas | couldn't see one |
| 13:49.53 | mozrat | You're on your own lady! |
| 13:50.02 | boudiccas | mozrat; :) |
| 13:52.05 | Leeds | had dinner at an Italian/American place (nice linguini pesto, followed by tiramisu), then bought some dodgy DVDs on the way home :-) |
| 14:00.08 | goibhniu | Leeds: have you seen Little Red Flowers? ... really nice movie |
| 14:00.42 | Leeds | never heard of it... |
| 14:01.11 | goibhniu | it's not out over here yet ... one of the few chinese movies that wasn't banned on the mainland |
| 14:02.29 | rhowe | ROFL - http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/10/31/online_gaming_reverse_sting/ |
| 14:02.45 | Leeds | ah, a foreign film |
| 14:03.09 | boudiccas | mozrat; got it, from my opera cache ... its .... http://localhost/BackupPC?host=london |
| 14:08.17 | Leeds | http://www.randompubfinder.com/randomizer.php |
| 14:14.14 | wethrin | boo! |
| 14:15.58 | Blapto | eeek |
| 14:16.20 | wethrin | Don't forget the pub! |
| 14:16.24 | wethrin | Lunchtime! |
| 14:16.48 | Blapto | lunchtime? |
| 14:16.59 | Blapto | or were those entirely unrelated statements |
| 14:20.51 | morsing | Beer |
| 14:26.04 | psnl | wethrin: coffee at some point? |
| 14:33.39 | morsing | psnl: Not me? |
| 14:35.27 | psnl | morsing: you might be some way away |
| 14:35.52 | psnl | wethrin, otoh will be back here at some point |
| 14:43.13 | morsing | wethrin: When am I invited? |
| 14:44.21 | boudiccas | this looks interesting .... http://people.csail.mit.edu/rahimi/helmet/ |
| 14:52.57 | *** join/#gllug catalyst (n=catalyst@allegro/user/angelchild) |
| 14:53.52 | morsing | catalyst! |
| 14:53.58 | catalyst | morsing! |
| 14:55.36 | Leeds | what are you doing? |
| 14:56.51 | catalyst | exactly |
| 14:56.53 | morsing | catalyst: What are you doing? |
| 14:57.01 | catalyst | existing \o/ |
| 14:57.09 | catalyst | coursework doesn't seem worth doing somehow |
| 14:57.15 | catalyst | but then neither does much else XD |
| 14:57.35 | catalyst | there's not much point ranting about it either, maybe I should go for a walk... |
| 14:58.40 | Leeds | I'd say chill and put some music or a funny DVD or something on |
| 15:00.56 | Leeds | but then what do I know... |
| 15:01.10 | goibhniu | boudiccas: very! I was wondering what the helmet craze was all about |
| 15:01.40 | boudiccas | goibhniu; and this rebuts it .... http://zapatopi.net/blog/?post=200511112730.afdb_effectiveness |
| 15:03.00 | goibhniu | either way, they sure look cool |
| 15:07.05 | sabinef72 | serris : are you here ? |
| 15:07.41 | boudiccas | sabinef72; he's prolly asleep if he's doing his nightwork atm |
| 15:07.55 | sabinef72 | ok thank you boudiccas |
| 15:08.08 | sabinef72 | someone who has 10 minutes to help me around here ? |
| 15:08.15 | boudiccas | just from my own practical expereince from when i worked nights |
| 15:08.24 | boudiccas | whats the problem? |
| 15:08.44 | sabinef72 | to correct a page I translated by myself in english |
| 15:09.07 | boudiccas | k, where is it and i'll look through it for you |
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| 15:46.02 | morsing | eyore! |
| 15:46.46 | eyore | lo |
| 15:48.39 | Leeds | found it! I'd lost xmen on my hard drive... |
| 15:49.34 | wethrin | hello |
| 15:49.41 | wethrin | psnl: I'm not in durham! |
| 15:50.19 | morsing | Leeds: Too bad you found it |
| 15:50.28 | morsing | Leeds: 'rm' will help |
| 15:50.32 | Leeds | ? |
| 15:50.36 | morsing | wethrin: Where are you? |
| 15:50.42 | morsing | Leeds: Disgusting stuff |
| 15:50.46 | Leeds | hmm... |
| 15:50.51 | Leeds | and there's a typhoon in town |
| 15:51.07 | wethrin | morsing: Beaconsfield |
| 15:51.11 | wethrin | morsing: About to head into London |
| 15:51.21 | wethrin | Have a beer and a bite to eat, then go to LORDI! |
| 15:52.20 | mozrat | \m/ |
| 15:53.12 | eyore | as a service what is xinet.d called on fedora |
| 15:53.17 | wethrin | mozrat: We'll try and have fun without you |
| 15:53.19 | eyore | i mean xinet |
| 15:53.55 | rhowe | hmmm |
| 15:54.00 | rhowe | That was a funny one |
| 15:54.06 | wethrin | rhowe: See you just after 5 in the pub! |
| 15:54.20 | wethrin | bye! |
| 15:54.24 | rhowe | If you change the attributes in a table, you need to update each view |
| 15:54.26 | rhowe | wethrin: OK :) |
| 15:54.43 | rhowe | Opening the view in design mode and resaving it is sufficient, it seems |
| 15:55.09 | mozrat | eyore: xinetd? |
| 15:55.13 | mozrat | look in /etc/init.d |
| 15:55.31 | morsing | wethrin: And why wasn't I invited? |
| 15:55.36 | morsing | mozrat! |
| 15:55.42 | morsing | rhowe: Why are you ignoring me? |
| 15:57.58 | mozrat | morsing! |
| 16:00.05 | Leeds | whoa... most of the typhoon trackers are suggesting the typoon's going to miss us, but the UCL one (no, I have no idea why UCL has a typoon tracker) is predicting a direct hit on Thursday |
| 16:01.30 | Leeds | showing a 50/50 change of at least a class 1 hit |
| 16:01.55 | Leeds | and apparently there's a monsoon coming the other way... it might get a bit windy, I think |
| 16:02.37 | Leeds | thanks |
| 16:02.38 | *** join/#gllug agk (i=agk@nat/redhat/x-8de1e71b56835056) |
| 16:02.45 | Leeds | that'll help against a typhoon :-) |
| 16:02.48 | Leeds | evening agk.. |
| 16:04.12 | agk | hi |
| 16:09.49 | mozrat | hey agk |
| 16:09.58 | mozrat | not seen you on IRC for a while |
| 16:12.27 | rhowe | heh, now that's bizarre |
| 16:12.34 | rhowe | I just got a base64 encoded email |
| 16:12.48 | rhowe | as in, "Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64" |
| 16:13.29 | rhowe | Thunderbird didn't bother decoding it, and just gave me a screenful of junk. Luckily I have Mnenhy and could decode it with a couple of clicks.. it was from Lexmark acknowledging receipt of a cashback offer I applied for |
| 16:14.55 | keithlard_ | obviously they were worried it might fall into the wrong hands |
| 16:15.31 | murb | rhowe: they are not that uncommon |
| 16:16.04 | rhowe | murb: Uncommon enough that the only ones I've received to date were spam |
| 16:29.51 | *** join/#gllug huw-l (n=scmhl2@valiant.cs.cf.ac.uk) |
| 16:37.50 | murb | normally i get them with charset=UTF-8 |
| 16:59.01 | Leeds | the microwave in my place is at about the level of the top of my head, in a cupboard... which means most of the population of Hong Kong wouldn't be able to reach to put stuff in or take stuff out of it |
| 17:03.13 | psnl | wethrin: but you will return! |
| 17:12.05 | trousers | Evenin' |
| 17:12.41 | mozrat | hey! |
| 17:13.01 | keithlard_ | what up |
| 17:14.26 | trousers | Hmm, I need a fridge in my room to keep milk cold :) |
| 17:37.37 | Leeds | Why gaming sucks on Linux: http://tinyurl.com/ymzd9h |
| 17:45.07 | eyore | directX becoming the defacto platform for game development over openGL is probably a major problem |
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| 17:48.30 | deep-blue | evening gents (and ladies) |
| 17:49.23 | keithlard_ | hi :D |
| 17:50.04 | trousers | mozrat: Can Ekiga support conferences? (i.e. more than 2 people in a convo?" |
| 17:50.06 | trousers | ) |
| 17:50.53 | murb | trousers: that isn't its job. |
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| 18:09.15 | deep-blue | oh the joys of a 300w PA system, and the keys to my shop >< |
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| 19:28.58 | trousers | Argh, how do I connect to more than one server in irssi? |
| 19:29.31 | *** join/#gllug Gunde (n=spamyous@82.153.170.213) |
| 19:30.39 | *** join/#gllug trousers_s (n=trousers@82-43-176-23.cable.ubr06.newm.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 19:30.44 | Gunde | good evening |
| 19:31.16 | keithlard_ | hello :) |
| 19:40.54 | Cope | woo keithlard_ |
| 19:41.03 | keithlard_ | woooo |
| 19:41.33 | keithlard_ | i've had quite a good day |
| 19:46.36 | Gunde | tell us more, it sounds as if you want to (: |
| 19:50.37 | keithlard_ | well i've done 11 hours work |
| 19:50.56 | keithlard_ | most of it fairly productive |
| 19:56.33 | Gunde | So you have a certain feeling of contentedness? |
| 20:00.48 | keithlard_ | i do! |
| 20:01.09 | keithlard_ | time to check in and knock off, i think |
| 20:03.49 | Gunde | what does that mean? |
| 20:07.16 | *** join/#gllug deep-blue (n=Deep-Blu@82-44-63-50.stb.ubr02.mort.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:07.52 | keithlard_ | 'checking in' is sending your updated code to the CVS server |
| 20:08.00 | keithlard_ | 'knocking off' is just finishing the working day :) |
| 20:08.37 | deep-blue | debatable |
| 20:08.48 | deep-blue | oops wrong window |
| 20:11.44 | Gunde | ah, I didn't realise you are still at work. |
| 20:12.19 | deep-blue | safest place today tho i spose :p |
| 20:12.49 | Gunde | I have learned today is Halloween, but in what sense is it the safest place? |
| 20:13.13 | Gunde | I can see a bit of fireworks outside, but nobody has yet tried to throw any of them in front of me. |
| 20:13.45 | deep-blue | my area is chav central until bout 10 ish |
| 20:13.47 | keithlard_ | i wish i was going out having scary fun actually |
| 20:13.59 | keithlard_ | unfortunately i do not know anyone that is going out around here |
| 20:14.01 | deep-blue | id stay at work normally |
| 20:14.36 | deep-blue | but i have eggs at the ready, and with the brain-liquifying volume im playing music at, im sensory deprived as far as hearing the doorbell goes |
| 20:15.28 | keithlard_ | hehe |
| 20:17.40 | deep-blue | actually....this place will probs get egged JUST because i have Sinatra and Oakenfold on the same playlist |
| 20:19.05 | deep-blue | oh...and some prodigy >< |
| 20:21.50 | Gunde | what do you need eggs for? |
| 20:22.29 | deep-blue | Gunde, returning fire |
| 20:22.39 | trousers | Gunde: People throw eggs at people's houses in an attempt for amusement at the irritation of the owner of the property |
| 20:22.41 | Gunde | -v please |
| 20:22.42 | deep-blue | trousers, butterflies & hurricanes? |
| 20:22.52 | trousers | deep-blue: Sing for absolution |
| 20:22.58 | deep-blue | eggs wash off windows, egg in hair is a bitch |
| 20:23.01 | deep-blue | trousers, sounds interesting |
| 20:23.19 | trousers | Hmm, how do I start a new server "tab" in irssi? |
| 20:23.26 | Gunde | trousers: Thanks for the explanation. |
| 20:23.33 | deep-blue | FUCKING FIREWORKS |
| 20:23.39 | Gunde | So those are raw eggs then... |
| 20:23.52 | deep-blue | oh yea |
| 20:24.25 | deep-blue | trousers, london symphony? |
| 20:24.29 | trousers | Boiled eggs is just mean if you get hit in the face :P |
| 20:24.32 | trousers | *are |
| 20:24.33 | deep-blue | lol |
| 20:24.39 | trousers | deep-blue: Tallywood string quartet |
| 20:25.08 | Gunde | When I was a child there was a regional tradition to put on costumes on New Year's eve. Then groups gathered together and sang funny songs in regional dialect at peoples' front doors, with getting sweets, nuts or a coin afterwards. |
| 20:25.11 | deep-blue | interesting |
| 20:25.27 | Gunde | trousers: Seems you have had a bad experience there. |
| 20:25.50 | deep-blue | hay, anyone here dabbled with XGL? |
| 20:26.08 | trousers | deep-blue: Dabbled, yes. Not proper dabbling, really, though |
| 20:26.17 | boudiccas | Gunde; were they known as 'mummers'? |
| 20:26.33 | deep-blue | trousers, you ever had audio die with XGL enabled? |
| 20:26.50 | trousers | deep-blue: No :) |
| 20:27.05 | trousers | deep-blue: What are you running? |
| 20:27.09 | deep-blue | SLED10 |
| 20:27.12 | Gunde | Gunde: That is a word I dont know. But I am amazed to see there is an English wikipedia article about it. After all it was quite regional. |
| 20:27.52 | boudiccas | deep-blue; the full version or the time-limited version? |
| 20:28.00 | trousers | deep-blue: Hmm, no idea to be honest |
| 20:28.00 | Gunde | "is probably the origin of the American Trick-or-treating" There we go, another thing the Americans didnt invent. |
| 20:28.22 | deep-blue | boudiccas, according to the novell techies at the linux expo, its not time limited, just has no support |
| 20:28.45 | deep-blue | so far, after registering, it activated the update system, and auto-installed the nvidia drivers, and set up my Quadro 280 |
| 20:28.47 | boudiccas | mummers used to balck up and shoot guns into the branches of apple orchards to scare off evil spirits and as a fertility thing too |
| 20:28.51 | deep-blue | and asked me if i wanted XGL |
| 20:28.57 | boudiccas | *black |
| 20:28.58 | deep-blue | with it turned on, i lose audio, with it off, its fine |
| 20:29.43 | boudiccas | deep-blue; so they provide support for the first 30 dyas and after thatthey don't? is that right? how do you get any updates then? |
| 20:29.51 | boudiccas | *days |
| 20:29.56 | boudiccas | *that they |
| 20:30.04 | Gunde | boudiccas: That comment before was actually meant for you (: No idea why I wrote my own name there. |
| 20:30.07 | boudiccas | gods, my spelling is gettign worse |
| 20:30.09 | deep-blue | my understanding, is i get updates, just not the telephone support |
| 20:30.25 | boudiccas | Gunde; i guessed it was so |
| 20:30.43 | deep-blue | having said that, its been in 3 days, so we'll see |
| 20:31.03 | boudiccas | deep-blue; have you considered CentOS? |
| 20:31.14 | deep-blue | i did indeedy, im a fan of CentOS for my servers |
| 20:31.26 | deep-blue | i have 2x DNS and an ntop server running CentOS |
| 20:31.35 | boudiccas | it makes a nice workstation too :) [advert :) |
| 20:31.51 | deep-blue | i was considering it |
| 20:31.57 | deep-blue | but i DO like suse |
| 20:32.07 | deep-blue | i love the "slab" menu system |
| 20:32.22 | deep-blue | and it performs well on this box (Ath64 3000, 2gb ram, quadro 280) |
| 20:32.28 | boudiccas | i'm running it as a workstation atm :) I just like the RH/CentOS way of things |
| 20:32.41 | *** join/#gllug Jasperw (n=jasperw@82-68-161-101.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 20:32.54 | deep-blue | i used to use RH8, and liked FC1 and 2, but had issues after |
| 20:33.05 | deep-blue | i like the completeness of suse, and the fact i dont have to tinker |
| 20:33.34 | deep-blue | put it like this, this machine is designed to be my work machine, and when i pick up an AthX2, ill install VMware Workstation on it and dabble more |
| 20:33.42 | boudiccas | i didn't like the constant upgrade startegy of FC, so moved over to CentOS about a year ago, and haven't regretted it |
| 20:34.01 | boudiccas | *strategy |
| 20:34.06 | deep-blue | interesting |
| 20:34.21 | trousers | deep-blue: How many CDs is CentOS? |
| 20:34.47 | boudiccas | 4 cd's or 1 dvd |
| 20:34.48 | deep-blue | i have the DVD eds of both x86 and x86_64 |
| 20:34.53 | boudiccas | or is it 3cd's, I'm not sure |
| 20:35.15 | trousers | I might give it ago |
| 20:35.15 | trousers | I *hate* Gentoo |
| 20:35.24 | deep-blue | lol i never got past install with gentoo |
| 20:35.25 | boudiccas | never tried gentoo, i stick to rpm's :) |
| 20:35.35 | trousers | It's horrible |
| 20:35.46 | trousers | You have to compile EVERYTHING from source, except for possibly gcc :P |
| 20:36.02 | deep-blue | lol not entirely true |
| 20:36.12 | deep-blue | from what i saw of the live cd, you can install the prebuilts from that |
| 20:36.15 | trousers | I know, but it seems like it |
| 20:36.21 | deep-blue | then start custom-compiling from there if you like |
| 20:36.40 | trousers | Yeah, well, although it's stable. RPMs / APT > compiling from source |
| 20:36.43 | deep-blue | SLED10 slaughtered my T21, i have to find a distro that will run wel on a PIII, 256mb ram |
| 20:37.06 | boudiccas | CentOS for me, every time |
| 20:37.15 | trousers | Would you say that, for a server that just sits on my desk, 44 days uptime is okay? |
| 20:37.43 | boudiccas | yes, i like big uptimes |
| 20:38.07 | deep-blue | boudiccas, my old freenas box (read: before the 3x new 250gb hdds) ran for almost 2 years |
| 20:38.20 | boudiccas | sweet! :) |
| 20:38.22 | trousers | Also, for load average, what's the difference between the 3 figures? |
| 20:38.39 | deep-blue | trousers, system, user and something else |
| 20:38.42 | cpufreak | no |
| 20:38.44 | deep-blue | no? |
| 20:38.46 | boudiccas | trousers, time. now, 5 minutes, 15 minutes |
| 20:38.49 | cpufreak | its the time interval |
| 20:38.53 | deep-blue | wow that explains a lot >< |
| 20:39.00 | deep-blue | bwhahahahah |
| 20:39.01 | cpufreak | 1, 5, 15minutes |
| 20:39.29 | trousers | deep-blue: Ubuntu works well on my P3 laptop |
| 20:39.46 | deep-blue | i was tempted by going to 606, but it throws up errors, and so does 610 |
| 20:39.47 | trousers | Running either GNOME or KDE (I've switched to KDE :P) |
| 20:39.52 | deep-blue | 510 doesn tho >< |
| 20:39.59 | trousers | What is freeNAS? |
| 20:40.07 | deep-blue | fluxbuntu (plug for serris) is fast tho |
| 20:40.17 | deep-blue | trousers, a freebsd based network attached storage system |
| 20:40.30 | trousers | deep-blue: Yeah, but the only real difference is the window manager, which I can install anyway :P |
| 20:40.35 | deep-blue | aye |
| 20:41.32 | trousers | deep-blue: What's Solaris like? |
| 20:41.51 | deep-blue | im still waiting on a working dvd for 10 |
| 20:41.58 | deep-blue | 9 was nice on precise hardware |
| 20:42.25 | trousers | Hmm, I might give it a go. Is Solaris hard if I'm proficient in bash/sh? |
| 20:42.28 | deep-blue | specifically, an old AMD AthXP 2600, 512mb ram, nvidia mobo, nvifia gfx |
| 20:42.35 | deep-blue | nah you can install bash |
| 20:42.49 | hali | solaris since version 8 come with bash |
| 20:42.56 | trousers | Marvellous :) |
| 20:43.12 | trousers | Does SOlaris have package management? |
| 20:43.16 | cpufreak | of course |
| 20:43.19 | hali | trousers: yes and no :) |
| 20:43.26 | trousers | hali: ? |
| 20:43.27 | deep-blue | trousers, look into open solaris |
| 20:43.27 | hali | it has "packges" .. but they pretty much suck |
| 20:43.33 | cpufreak | trousers: if you're starting off, then blastwave.org is your friend. |
| 20:43.44 | hali | no proper dependancies |
| 20:43.45 | trousers | cpufreak: Cheers *cleecks* |
| 20:44.01 | hali | solaris express community edition is probably the most interesting version |
| 20:44.07 | trousers | I like irssi :P |
| 20:44.12 | cpufreak | hali: you're evil. |
| 20:44.23 | hali | cpufreak: why so? :) |
| 20:44.34 | hali | i know companies who use sxcr in production |
| 20:44.43 | hali | just for the iscsi target feature, but still |
| 20:44.54 | cpufreak | well unless its got considerably more stable since snv33, you are evil |
| 20:45.10 | cpufreak | having said that I'm finding about 2-3 bugs a month in solaris10 at the minute |
| 20:45.18 | cpufreak | most of which sun haven't seen before |
| 20:45.25 | cpufreak | so I'm getting incessant IDRs |
| 20:45.31 | deep-blue | hnn |
| 20:45.37 | hali | i've used sxcr since version build 27 on my laptop and it has been reasonably stable .. i've skipped a few versions though |
| 20:46.08 | cpufreak | 99% of them are in network stack. |
| 20:46.40 | hali | oh, i'm quite fond of the network stack... at least speed wise... i haven't tried much of the advanced stuff like the routing features etc |
| 20:47.10 | cpufreak | I'mnot doing anything clever |
| 20:47.14 | cpufreak | just highly loading the boxes |
| 20:48.11 | deep-blue | oh shit i just blew a cone |
| 20:48.25 | deep-blue | BWAHAHAH the matrix ost sounds like one great big fart |
| 20:51.30 | deep-blue | damn.... i killed the room >< |
| 20:51.52 | trousers | ARGH, I don't know if it's edgy or me |
| 20:51.57 | deep-blue | edgy :p |
| 20:52.07 | trousers | But apt keeps removing packages at random when I install another one :( |
| 20:52.19 | deep-blue | wait, didnt you dist-upgrade? |
| 20:52.55 | trousers | I tried doing and not doing that |
| 20:53.40 | deep-blue | hmm |
| 20:54.17 | deep-blue | lol |
| 20:54.53 | deep-blue | whats the etiquette for suggesting a social to the mailing list? |
| 21:00.29 | deep-blue | omfg im a serial-room-killer |
| 21:00.53 | trousers | Wow! Awesome! According to gkrellm, my laptop is clocked at ~9MHz when doing nothing. And clocked at 500MHz under full load \o/ |
| 21:02.18 | deep-blue | trousers, nice! i cant even get speedstep to ACKNOWLEDGE i have a throttle-supported cpu |
| 21:02.35 | trousers | I think it's throllting it :P |
| 21:02.44 | trousers | Or it's displaying how much it's using |
| 21:02.46 | deep-blue | aye! |
| 21:02.52 | trousers | But 9MHz is suprisingly low |
| 21:02.55 | deep-blue | lol aye |
| 21:03.04 | deep-blue | actually, that cant work |
| 21:03.09 | keithlard_ | deep-blue> are you on the social list? |
| 21:03.18 | keithlard_ | just send a mail |
| 21:03.23 | deep-blue | cos even if the FSB dropped to 66mhz, and killed the multipler to 1x, it would only run at 66mhz |
| 21:03.26 | deep-blue | keithlard, fair dues |
| 21:03.40 | deep-blue | trousers, probs the latter, showing usage |
| 21:03.50 | deep-blue | ive only gotten my powerbook g4 to work with thottling |
| 21:04.01 | deep-blue | if the wifi worked, id switch to ubuntu on it >< |
| 21:04.19 | trousers | more /proc/cpuinfo generally shows 500MHz, although isn't that generated on boot? |
| 21:05.08 | trousers | I think I got throttling working on my Shuttle - but I didn't want it as it killed it :P |
| 21:05.09 | deep-blue | yea |
| 21:05.24 | deep-blue | try checking /proc/cpufreq if it exists |
| 21:06.45 | trousers | deep-blue: Non existent |
| 21:07.06 | deep-blue | bah i cant remember where cpufreq shows its cpu scaling ability |
| 21:07.15 | deep-blue | you got the cpu scaling monitor on your bar at the top? |
| 21:08.33 | trousers | No? |
| 21:08.41 | deep-blue | add it |
| 21:08.44 | trousers | How? |
| 21:09.05 | deep-blue | right click on the panel, click "add to panel" |
| 21:09.20 | deep-blue | its called "CPU Frequency Scaling Monitor" |
| 21:09.25 | deep-blue | i assume you are still running Gnome |
| 21:11.04 | trousers | KDE >.< |
| 21:11.08 | deep-blue | ah |
| 21:11.10 | deep-blue | then i have NO idea |
| 21:13.37 | trousers | I don't really have much preference between GNOEM and KDE to be honest |
| 21:13.51 | trousers | I just wanted to learn Qt, so I thought KDE would be preferable |
| 21:14.04 | deep-blue | fair dues |
| 21:14.17 | trousers | The only thing I really use is the web browser + terminal :) |
| 21:14.35 | trousers | And possibly a few othe application that run on either |
| 21:15.47 | deep-blue | fair nuff |
| 21:15.49 | trousers | Yes, gkrellm is lying :( |
| 21:16.43 | deep-blue | lol |
| 21:17.28 | trousers | I do like synergy :P |
| 21:17.43 | deep-blue | that the keyboard/mouse software KVM right? |
| 21:17.50 | trousers | Er, not exactly |
| 21:18.00 | trousers | It's the shared keybhoard+mouse over network one |
| 21:18.08 | trousers | Separate monitors are used |
| 21:19.50 | deep-blue | right, no lag issues? |
| 21:20.01 | deep-blue | i think hak.5 did a segment on it last month, and it seemed interesting |
| 21:20.22 | deep-blue | trousers, you seen automatix? |
| 21:21.22 | serris | Morning all |
| 21:21.28 | deep-blue | morning serris |
| 21:25.07 | deep-blue | serris, the new automatix is a force to be reckoned with |
| 21:25.10 | deep-blue | much cleaner |
| 21:25.19 | serris | ok |
| 21:25.24 | serris | Still not going to use it |
| 21:25.41 | deep-blue | just sayin |
| 21:25.55 | serris | So am I |
| 21:32.22 | trousers | deep-blue: Yeah, they did. |
| 21:32.28 | trousers | What is automatix? |
| 21:32.47 | trousers | Also, is there any way to connect my server to a UPS without rebooting? :P |
| 21:33.07 | deep-blue | trousers, not unless you want to start skinning LIVE kettle-flex |
| 21:33.23 | trousers | deep-blue: I thought as much :( |
| 21:33.24 | deep-blue | its an auto-installer that covers a lot of what "ubuntu guide" covers |
| 21:33.37 | deep-blue | and it has extras like slab "the menu system in SLED10" |
| 21:33.39 | trousers | Oh well, I'll wait until my next power cut to buy + install one :D |
| 21:34.11 | trousers | deep-blue: Oooh! Ooh! deep-blue, I thought of *a* way. If I were running Xen I could live transfer it :P |
| 21:34.31 | deep-blue | 0.o |
| 21:34.35 | deep-blue | fuck me that sounds complicated |
| 21:36.11 | trousers | It's some weird thing you can do in Xen - where you transfer the running system to another PC on the network with <1sec downtime :D |
| 21:36.28 | deep-blue | interesting |
| 21:36.34 | deep-blue | is your server mission critical then? |
| 21:40.08 | deep-blue | serris, is it 10 or 11pm when its illegal to have volume up loud n shit? |
| 21:41.24 | serris | 10 |
| 21:41.47 | deep-blue | bah 20 min >< |
| 21:45.30 | deep-blue | well ive managed to replicate the features of suse with Edgy, very tempting to try and install that on this, see if ihave more luck with XGL |
| 21:49.33 | mozrat | Evenin' |
| 21:49.42 | mozrat | I replicate the features of suse with.. ahem.. suse |
| 21:50.22 | serris | mozrat! |
| 21:54.15 | mozrat | hey! |
| 21:55.05 | deep-blue | hay mozrat |
| 21:55.08 | serris | how's it going? |
| 21:55.14 | mozrat | hey deep-blue |
| 21:55.16 | mozrat | good thanks |
| 21:55.30 | mozrat | Just watched the footie |
| 21:55.44 | mozrat | felt rather apathetic about both teams, but was amusing enough |
| 21:56.32 | serris | Who played? |
| 21:56.43 | mozrat | Chelsea vs Barcelona (2-2) |
| 21:56.47 | serris | ah |
| 21:57.19 | mozrat | Now I'm listening to Clive Bull |
| 22:05.33 | mozrat | fscking heck. GLLUG lists are broken AGAIN! |
| 22:05.44 | cpufreak | stupid open source software |
| 22:05.50 | cpufreak | if you were using exchange, it'd all be fine |
| 22:05.51 | cpufreak | :P |
| 22:05.54 | deep-blue | ima guess thats why ive recieved sooo little mail? |
| 22:06.03 | deep-blue | cpufreak, scept for the weekly hacks |
| 22:06.04 | cpufreak | this is why I didn't subscribe. |
| 22:06.08 | cpufreak | deep-blue: er? |
| 22:06.15 | mozrat | It's the web archive foo, not the delivery |
| 22:06.25 | cpufreak | mozrat: I'm trolling. |
| 22:06.26 | deep-blue | oooo |
| 22:06.32 | mozrat | cpufreak: oooh, right! |
| 22:06.41 | cpufreak | I thought the |
| 22:06.41 | cpufreak | 22:05 < cpufreak> :P |
| 22:06.44 | cpufreak | was a give away |
| 22:07.12 | mozrat | I thought your tongue was sticking out for some other reason :-) |
| 22:07.49 | cpufreak | I've not hada stroke yet |
| 22:07.59 | deep-blue | brb, formatting this SOB |
| 22:16.01 | Gunde | personal prognosis for the 11th looks good. |
| 22:16.15 | mozrat | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:19.56 | *** join/#gllug PussInBoots (i=PussInBo@gateway/tor/x-7b76be16a2682f7e) |
| 22:20.31 | mozrat | hey PussInBoots |
| 22:20.59 | *** join/#gllug deep-blue (n=brb@82-44-63-50.stb.ubr02.mort.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 22:35.32 | *** join/#gllug random1658 (n=random16@82-44-62-14.cable.ubr02.mort.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 22:36.10 | *** join/#gllug secretlondon (n=secretlo@5ac0b80e.bb.sky.com) |
| 22:36.38 | secretlondon | evenin' |
| 22:36.45 | deep-blue | hey secretlondon |
| 22:36.47 | serris | evening |
| 22:38.22 | mozrat | hey serris |
| 22:38.29 | mozrat | s/serris/secretlondon/ |
| 22:38.58 | secretlondon | mozrat: when do you think we'll have a version of the meeting leaflet I can duplicate.. |
| 22:39.43 | mozrat | http://gllug.org.uk/uploads/Meetings/11thNov06/11_November_student_flyer.pdf is the version I was flamed for today on list :-) |
| 22:39.53 | mozrat | I'm just making some changes now, but you can distribute that one |
| 22:40.07 | mozrat | unfortunately I lost the scribus source file that generated that PDF |
| 22:40.39 | secretlondon | mozrat: i'll need to go somewhere to print out so it'll be tomorrow |
| 22:40.39 | mozrat | ok, there will be a new version there tomorrow |
| 22:42.44 | secretlondon | mozrat: cool |
| 22:43.15 | mozrat | a flameproof version |
| 22:43.55 | secretlondon | mozrat: it's better that it's aimed at the target audience - the people on the list are already converted ;) |
| 22:44.28 | deep-blue | how did you get flamed for that mozrat? |
| 22:45.21 | mozrat | deep-blue: flamed is a slight overstatement... people were questioning the technical accuracy of a leaflet aimed at people with no clue what Linux is |
| 22:45.44 | deep-blue | lol |
| 22:45.44 | mozrat | and asking is it acceptable to put slightly incorrect information in promotional materials |
| 22:46.00 | mozrat | namely "What is Linux: Linux is a computer operating system" |
| 22:46.10 | mozrat | no matter - feedback is helpful |
| 22:48.31 | mozrat | serris: you use silenceisdefeat as well? |
| 22:48.39 | serris | yeah |
| 22:48.41 | serris | do you? |
| 22:49.06 | mozrat | yeah |
| 22:49.14 | mozrat | very handy, eh? |
| 22:49.40 | serris | indeed, untill it cuts out every so often |
| 22:50.47 | Gunde | mozrat: So what would the proper and political correct anser to "What is linux" be? |
| 22:51.09 | secretlondon | a computer operating system |
| 22:51.18 | mozrat | Gunde: something that wouldn't appeal to passersby |
| 22:51.23 | mozrat | secretlondon: no, just the kernel |
| 22:51.36 | secretlondon | mozrat: i know - but what's a kernel etc |
| 22:51.54 | secretlondon | kernel = nut? ;) |
| 22:52.04 | mozrat | heh |
| 22:52.28 | secretlondon | ps i do know - but they target audience don't, and don't need to be blinded by jargon |
| 22:53.31 | Gunde | Hmm, for webdesign we learned in school a sentence that might apply to the flyer too: The fly has to be tasty for the fish, not for the fisherman. |
| 22:53.33 | Gunde | Does that make sense in English too? |
| 22:53.49 | Gunde | s/fly/bait |
| 22:54.09 | mozrat | Gunde: it does |
| 22:54.27 | Gunde | Is there something similar in English? |
| 22:55.03 | secretlondon | not that i can think of - but it makes perfect sense |
| 22:55.15 | Gunde | So go and catch your fish (: |
| 22:56.24 | Gunde | Concerning the Free and free thing - I didn't understand what it was supposed to, I just thought it is once again this silly capitalisation that you like using over here in headings etc. |
| 22:57.58 | mozrat | Well.. the English language has a problem with the word "free" |
| 22:58.03 | mozrat | it is very ambigious |
| 22:58.20 | mozrat | and has negative associations when you think of quality, especially with software |
| 22:58.43 | Gunde | oh? I didnt know that. Associations in the sense of "you get what you pay for"? |
| 22:58.49 | mozrat | yep |
| 22:59.04 | mozrat | and the word "freeware" is 4 characters away from "free software" |
| 22:59.12 | mozrat | or maybe 5 :-) |
| 22:59.25 | mozrat | and who wants to run their business on freeware? |
| 22:59.41 | deep-blue | it keeps my cost down and profits up in places :p |
| 23:00.07 | mozrat | deep-blue: if you run your business on freeware you would have a problem after 30 days :-) |
| 23:00.13 | Gunde | If they manage to do so, and can keep it running, then they are probably quite clever. |
| 23:00.19 | mozrat | or on your 11th customer.. or some stupid restriction |
| 23:00.43 | deep-blue | depends on the context |
| 23:00.47 | mozrat | Gunde: but you know freeware is not Free Software right? freeware is normally trial software, or limited.. or software people can't sell |
| 23:00.49 | deep-blue | we sell freenas powered NASes |
| 23:02.44 | Gunde | mozrat: Yes, I know that. But the trial software to me is rather shareware that you can try out, but if you want to keep it you have to pay a fee. |
| 23:03.15 | Gunde | Or maybe then I dont understand the difference in English. |
| 23:03.22 | secretlondon | free does default to money not freedom. it looks like software gratis, not software libre |
| 23:03.58 | mozrat | Gunde, Free Software could mean it is software that has $0 licencing costs |
| 23:04.06 | secretlondon | what we have is liberal, permissive software I suppose |
| 23:04.09 | secretlondon | unrestricted |
| 23:04.20 | mozrat | This is not always true of Linux.. it also gives users false expectations and in some minds suggests poor quality |
| 23:04.46 | secretlondon | red hat is actually pretty expensive ;) |
| 23:04.56 | mozrat | Free Software could also mean the software is released under a Free Software licence (GPL). This ensures that you have 4 freedoms etc |
| 23:05.15 | mozrat | Adobe Acrobat reader is free software ($0) but it isn't GPL |
| 23:05.35 | secretlondon | we can't change it |
| 23:05.36 | mozrat | Macromedia Flash player is free software ($0) but it isn't Free Software |
| 23:06.01 | Gunde | So to you Free Software (capitalised) usually is connected to GPL? |
| 23:06.02 | mozrat | RHEL is £199 per year, but is GPL and completely Free Software |
| 23:06.12 | mozrat | Gunde: yes, that is normally how I express it |
| 23:06.27 | secretlondon | I prefer open source or software libre |
| 23:06.46 | secretlondon | as free doesn't mean that to 'normal people', even capitalised |
| 23:06.54 | Gunde | I agree, somebody not familiar with the terminology won't get the hint. |
| 23:06.58 | mozrat | secretlondon: open source is a horrible term |
| 23:07.17 | Gunde | Why is it horrible? |
| 23:07.20 | mozrat | Microsoft have released lots of software they call open source. It doesn't give you the same fundamental freedoms |
| 23:07.34 | mozrat | Gunde: because I can give you code and still restrict your freedoms |
| 23:07.50 | mozrat | Open Source does not necessarily mean it is Free |
| 23:08.07 | mozrat | and here is the killer argument against the term "Open Source" |
| 23:08.41 | mozrat | you can say that Open Source software is more secure, reliable, usable than commerical closed source software |
| 23:08.58 | mozrat | and Microsoft can argue with you and give you stats from user surveys, make up shit |
| 23:09.04 | mozrat | get Gartner to run a report |
| 23:09.15 | mozrat | so you say that open source is cheaper than closed source |
| 23:09.31 | mozrat | and Microsoft run bullshit reports citing Total Cost of Ownership |
| 23:09.50 | mozrat | and provide compelling arguments about long term TCO and retraining staff |
| 23:09.58 | mozrat | or worse, drop the cost of windows to nearly free |
| 23:09.59 | mozrat | ... |
| 23:10.17 | mozrat | if you say.. We want Free Software and the basic freedoms.. Microsoft have zero argument |
| 23:10.58 | cpufreak | Free Software sucks though |
| 23:11.07 | deep-blue | 0.o |
| 23:11.08 | mozrat | Microsoft aren't in the market for issuing Freedom with their software |
| 23:11.09 | deep-blue | on what basis? |
| 23:11.13 | mozrat | cpufreak: use Exchange then :-) |
| 23:11.25 | mozrat | (I got the trollbait that time :-)) |
| 23:11.35 | secretlondon | "free software" = freeware to people who are not already committed |
| 23:11.48 | secretlondon | as a promotional phrase it sucks |
| 23:12.07 | mozrat | secretlondon: I agree. the english language sucks |
| 23:12.17 | cpufreak | seriously 99.99% of Free/free software, is not finished, or doesn't work properly. |
| 23:12.19 | mozrat | Free Software is still a better term than open source though |
| 23:12.21 | cpufreak | coz is written by 16 year olds |
| 23:12.23 | secretlondon | mozrat: well it's what we;re stuck with |
| 23:13.06 | antiphase | cpufreak++ |
| 23:13.11 | mozrat | The term "Open Source" doesn't express the most important aspect of the software. If you get MS code under a NDA are you happy? |
| 23:13.19 | secretlondon | nda isn't open |
| 23:13.44 | mozrat | secretlondon: true. there is the open source definition |
| 23:13.52 | mozrat | which is based on the Debian Social contract |
| 23:14.11 | cpufreak | antiphase++ |
| 23:14.14 | antiphase | The question I'd be asking is "Does it serve my business purposes, with the minimum TCO". Which is sadly tru for most ubiquitous non-Free software |
| 23:14.30 | secretlondon | deep-blue: note the *just* - I've admitted to being a fangirl |
| 23:14.47 | deep-blue | :p my bad |
| 23:14.56 | antiphase | It's a massive pisser for people that support Phree software. Play the long game innit |
| 23:15.00 | cpufreak | haha, pre-emptive positive karma for ant. |
| 23:15.45 | mozrat | antiphase: are you making a distinction between free software and open source with that statement though? |
| 23:16.33 | antiphase | None whatsoever. Show me some non-free open-source software that fills a hole, and I'll show you Red Hat |
| 23:16.35 | secretlondon | mozrat: the fish want !windows, we need to tell them that macos is the ssame |
| 23:16.42 | cpufreak | I thought only beardy types cared for the distinction |
| 23:16.54 | mozrat | antiphase: heh |
| 23:17.22 | cpufreak | antiphase: stil RedHat will go bust in a year |
| 23:17.28 | cpufreak | now oracle are undercutting them :) |
| 23:17.29 | deep-blue | if it had working wifi, id use it :p |
| 23:17.32 | secretlondon | cpufreak: Oracle will see to that |
| 23:17.55 | cpufreak | and all redhats partners have told redhat they prefer dealing with oracle :) |
| 23:18.09 | secretlondon | cpufreak: so I read - no loyalty lol |
| 23:18.52 | cpufreak | sure they have loyalty |
| 23:19.03 | cpufreak | oracle give bigger referral bonuses |
| 23:19.03 | secretlondon | to their shareholders etc |
| 23:20.11 | mozrat | secretlondon: I agree.. pointing people towards Mac is a bad idea. Shiny and exciting in the short term, but not good for the long term |
| 23:20.32 | cpufreak | get an Acorn |
| 23:20.34 | secretlondon | mozrat: people go to the mac as it's cooler than windows |
| 23:20.39 | deep-blue | mozrat: i dunno bout that, upgradability is getting better |
| 23:20.42 | cpufreak | http://www.acorncomputers.co.uk/ |
| 23:20.48 | antiphase | As I see it, there are 2 markets - Server, and Workstation. Server: You can never tak on Solaris for serious apps, and everyone else is $FREE_OS already. Workstation: Free software is years behind, and the zealots refuse to make it look like the market leading apps (disregarding the closed file formats) |
| 23:20.59 | secretlondon | cpufreak: aren't they unconnected to the actual acorn? |
| 23:21.17 | deep-blue | secretlondon: they are the original company |
| 23:21.20 | secretlondon | antiphase: there are some kde ones that are getting better |
| 23:21.20 | cpufreak | no |
| 23:21.21 | cpufreak | new company |
| 23:21.24 | deep-blue | but their sold off their ARM division |
| 23:21.26 | cpufreak | but they own the trade marks |
| 23:21.55 | secretlondon | cpufreak: i'd read that they don't have the right to the trademark - that olivetti own them |
| 23:22.04 | antiphase | Getting better isn't "what people learn to use at school/college/work/other employer" |
| 23:22.21 | cpufreak | you must have misread |
| 23:22.27 | cpufreak | http://www.acorncomputers.co.uk/about.htm |
| 23:22.41 | cpufreak | Acorn Computers Limited was incorporated in 2006 and is registered at Companies House to its. new owners. The Acorn registered trademark is assigned to Acorn Computers Limited under license in the relevant classes 9 and 41, the same classes as the original Acorn Computers established in Cambridge in 1978 |
| 23:22.46 | cpufreak | :p |
| 23:22.51 | secretlondon | antiphase: windows is the de facto standard |
| 23:22.59 | antiphase | r |
| 23:23.22 | antiphase | So make something that looks and beaves like Windows, but costs less over the product lifecycle |
| 23:23.37 | antiphase | Uh huh huh huh. I mean "behaves", Butthead |
| 23:24.40 | deep-blue | antiphase: like open suse |
| 23:24.46 | antiphase | The devastating problem is that Windows is _so_cheap_ now, to 90% of the consumers (i.e. businesses) |
| 23:24.56 | secretlondon | cpufreak: I was going by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acorn_Computers_Ltd - but we've updated it |
| 23:25.01 | deep-blue | as the novell techy said "they dont bite if it doesnt smell, look, and taste like windows" |
| 23:25.05 | cpufreak | :D |
| 23:25.38 | secretlondon | windows is how people are taught IT |
| 23:25.46 | deep-blue | yer |
| 23:27.12 | antiphase | Well, now I've made you all suicidal, I'm going to bed |
| 23:28.48 | antiphase | \o/ |
| 23:29.14 | mozrat | antiphase: Windows is crazy cheap for us.. much cheaper than RHEL or SLES |
| 23:29.19 | mozrat | probably half that cost now |
| 23:29.31 | mozrat | Linux makes no sense economically if you want support |
| 23:29.36 | antiphase | The ASDA philosophy of OSen |
| 23:29.46 | mozrat | which.. is kind of a problem :-) |
| 23:30.02 | deep-blue | mozrat: considering sled10 is £35 with 1year tech support...thats cheaper than xph |
| 23:30.18 | antiphase | Windows people are cheep as well, which doesn't help (even if they are a bit dim) |
| 23:30.22 | mozrat | deep-blue: yeah, the desktop is cheap |
| 23:30.28 | mozrat | but SLES isn't dirt-cheap |
| 23:30.36 | deep-blue | oo sles |
| 23:31.43 | deep-blue | actually....it doesnt seem much more expensive than win2k3 |
| 23:32.01 | mozrat | deep-blue: we have some agreement with MS |
| 23:32.13 | mozrat | and they are a client, so we get even more discounts |
| 23:32.51 | secretlondon | mozrat: the council I used to work for were quoted retail prices for licenses which were arranged by thier It support company.. |
| 23:33.23 | mozrat | secretlondon: cheeky |
| 23:33.38 | secretlondon | mozrat: ignorance in the IT dept, and crafy shite by IT Net |
| 23:33.47 | antiphase | secretlondon: ASL pix |
| 23:34.21 | secretlondon | antiphase: a/s/l? |
| 23:34.31 | deep-blue | age sex location |
| 23:34.47 | secretlondon | I know - I just didn't get why turn to msn.. |
| 23:37.06 | mozrat | by the way.. do you all know about this page.. http://gllug.org.uk/index.php?/archives/9-IRC-Faces.html |
| 23:37.06 | cpufreak | ? |
| 23:37.11 | mozrat | let me know if I can add people |
| 23:37.48 | deep-blue | remind me to get drunk first :p |
| 23:38.01 | mozrat | heh |
| 23:38.07 | secretlondon | mozrat: you really don't want a pic of me.. |
| 23:38.32 | serris | deep-blue: do you have $288 you could lend me? |
| 23:38.49 | deep-blue | which is what, £150 ish? |
| 23:38.50 | deep-blue | maybe |
| 23:38.52 | mozrat | secretlondon: up to you. A lot of people really rejected the idea when I asked them |
| 23:39.03 | mozrat | it isn't mandatory in any way |
| 23:39.09 | serris | I found a nice fisheye lens for Dawn'a's camera on ebay |
| 23:39.19 | deep-blue | mozrat: tbh i cant really get why, its not mandatory, and it'll be bloody usefull for the socials |
| 23:39.24 | deep-blue | serris: mmmm ill see |
| 23:41.16 | antiphase | I tend to look like a metal patient on camera |
| 23:41.30 | Gunde | metal patient = broken robot? |
| 23:46.14 | sabinef72 | hello |
| 23:46.24 | deep-blue | bon soir serris |
| 23:46.27 | Gunde | bon soir, mademoiselle |
| 23:46.37 | serris | What the hell's bon soir |
| 23:46.41 | deep-blue | frikkin autocompletion |
| 23:46.42 | sabinef72 | Bonsoir Gunde |
| 23:46.47 | catalyst | good evening |
| 23:46.49 | catalyst | or night |
| 23:46.51 | serris | Right |
| 23:46.52 | antiphase | Similar to Bon Fucking Jour innit |
| 23:47.35 | catalyst | (why does this never happen offline?) |
| 23:47.36 | catalyst | mm, restuarant |
| 23:47.44 | catalyst | except spelt correctly |
| 23:47.52 | antiphase | Una paloma blanca, I'm just a bird in the sky </paedo> |
| 23:47.53 | catalyst | sabinef72: did they serve food as well? or just sing? :) |
| 23:48.06 | sabinef72 | catalyst: good spanish food too |
| 23:48.13 | sabinef72 | and my god... too much wine |
| 23:49.50 | catalyst | hehe |
| 23:51.05 | deep-blue | the radiator? |
| 23:51.07 | deep-blue | :p |
| 23:51.32 | antiphase | Statler or Waldorf? |
| 23:51.35 | secretlondon | the window |
| 23:52.03 | mozrat | Gunde: lovely beard! |
| 23:52.10 | Gunde | Guess I should crop the picture for this purpose... |
| 23:52.12 | Gunde | lol |
| 23:52.34 | Gunde | mozrat: envious? |
| 23:52.36 | mozrat | Gunde: crop it and mail it to me if you want to be on the IRC faces page |
| 23:52.54 | Gunde | mozrat: I will see. |
| 23:52.58 | mozrat | Gunde: no. his hair seems to have fallen from the top of his head to his chin |
| 23:52.58 | secretlondon | there is picture of secretdon somewhere on her blog - several in fact |
| 23:52.59 | sabinef72 | mozrat ! |
| 23:53.07 | mozrat | sabinef72! |
| 23:53.10 | mozrat | drunk? |
| 23:53.18 | sabinef72 | almost |
| 23:53.46 | mozrat | good girl |
| 23:54.00 | sabinef72 | I drank a lot of wine but I'm not drunk |
| 23:54.37 | mozrat | secretlondon: URL us then |
| 23:54.51 | catalyst | http://catalyst.lazyilluminati.com/me.jpg |
| 23:54.59 | catalyst | yes |
| 23:55.02 | catalyst | you only get my head |
| 23:55.46 | Gunde | Why not the rest? |
| 23:56.07 | sabinef72 | Gunde: nice tie |
| 23:56.17 | catalyst | http://catalyst.lazyilluminati.com/meagain.jpg |
| 23:56.35 | catalyst | Advance warning: crap photo =) |
| 23:56.58 | mozrat | s/photo/football team/ |
| 23:57.08 | antiphase | It's the loans.co.uk apparition! |
| 23:57.18 | catalyst | hmm |
| 23:57.55 | mozrat | catalyst: you and I can go head to head in the "supports the worst team in English football" competition |
| 23:58.06 | catalyst | Macclesfield? |
| 23:58.24 | mozrat | no, in the premiershipp |
| 23:58.28 | rhowe | hahaha Lordi were awesome |
| 23:58.49 | catalyst | ah |
| 23:58.50 | catalyst | Charlton |
| 23:59.00 | mozrat | rhowe: yay! |
| 23:59.03 | mozrat | \m/ |
| 23:59.17 | mozrat | catalyst: give you a clue. Our star player is 40 years old |
| 23:59.20 | mozrat | we lost 8 in a row |
| 23:59.34 | catalyst | Sheffield United? |
