IRC log for #gllug on 20080620

00:00.52*** join/#gllug trousers (n=irc@92-233-113-148.cable.ubr12.nmal.blueyonder.co.uk)
00:02.48kjs_not yet tbh, all I have concluded is that vmware just seems to suck.
00:03.22AndyMillarwhat issue?
00:05.54kjs_really slow, network performance.
00:06.30*** join/#gllug catalyst (n=catalyst@allegro/user/angelchild)
00:07.19z00daxnetwork or i/o  ?
00:07.38z00daxalso, i seem to recall that vmware recommend one of the two types of scsi controllers it can emulate
00:07.42z00daxnot sure which :D
00:08.05kjs_well i did notice IO was slow copying files.
00:08.15AndyMillarkjs_: how slow?
00:08.32AndyMillaralso, did you allocate the entire disk when creating the vm?
00:09.59AndyMillarmeh
00:10.00AndyMillarbeds
00:10.55kjs_well im getting 8mb throughput
00:12.23kjs_when writing data to the tape over bacula
00:12.32kjs_from the vm to the host.
00:13.25*** join/#gllug trousers (n=irc@92-233-113-148.cable.ubr12.nmal.blueyonder.co.uk)
00:14.15kjs_which should be local loopback?
00:18.36*** join/#gllug trousers_ (n=irc@92-233-113-148.cable.ubr12.nmal.blueyonder.co.uk)
00:18.52kjs_so yeah its really slow... not sure what to do, could just move the file server to samba... on the host.
00:25.56*** join/#gllug trousers (n=irc@92-233-113-148.cable.ubr12.nmal.blueyonder.co.uk)
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02:43.06*** join/#gllug ChoHag (i=mking@lego.monnsta.net)
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05:16.56morsingcurson!
05:45.16*** join/#gllug jpds (n=jpds@ubuntu/member/jpds)
05:46.15morsingjpds!
08:09.47*** join/#gllug curson (n=curzon@60.32.176.184)
08:09.59morsingcurson!
08:45.42kjs_morning
08:46.12morsingkjs_!
08:55.05kjs_text book reaction from the delivery guy "Wow your here? Its not normal for you guys to be in at this hour..."
08:55.34wethrinheh\
08:56.22kjs_only to find they have messed up the order now I have to come in again tomorrow morning between 7:30 and 10:00
09:22.19*** join/#gllug Blapto (n=martin@62.189.100.228)
09:27.09kjs_Do you guys backup any svn servers? If so are you just copying the files to tape? or do I have to do any thing special...
09:27.52wethrinI'd be surprised if you needed to do more than back up files (plus whatever metadata) to tape
09:31.46zaarghrm, can i use multiple commands in PROMPT_COMMAND?
09:31.48zaargcan't get it to work..
09:33.07zaargnm, worked it out!
10:01.19bilarh_did i rant about the new surveillance laws in sweden yet?
10:04.51BlaptoNo, go ahead, I've got some build requests to go through
10:05.57bilarh_http://www.thelocal.se/12474/20080617/
10:05.59bilarh_http://www.thelocal.se/12534/20080618/
10:08.23antiphaseAll that rotten herring must make them stupid
10:17.13haliwe have pretty much the same laws here
10:17.34haliireland has got even worse
10:18.12haliquite a big market for traffic sniffers now :)
10:18.20haliperhaps one should build a little ntop appliance
10:32.36bilarh_england doesn't allow blanket surveillance of all phone / internet traffic crossing its border so far, afaik
10:32.45bilarh_and they dont' permit surveillance without a court order
10:32.55antiphaseRIPA innit
10:33.35bilarh_i must admit i'm not 100% up to speed with ripa, but does that grant agencies powers like these?
10:34.53antiphasehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_of_Investigatory_Powers_Act
10:34.55bilarh_hali: a private company using a network sniffer on it's own network is different to a governments blanket surveillance
10:36.34antiphaseI think basically that arbitrary snooping is still a criminal offence unless explicitly permitted, but information gathered as a result is available to maybe more people than would be strictly necessary
10:40.47bilarh_it's a piss take anyway
10:41.21bilarh_Nevertheless, FRA has tried to reassure the public that the law would not lead to a form of general or intrusive surveillance.
10:41.33bilarh_that sounds a bit like what the UK government were claiming, i bet
10:41.57bilarh_until the terrorist rubbish bins of overfullness came along, of course
10:43.39antiphaseOMG terrrrrrsts
10:43.56antiphaseMost Governments are a shower of useless fuckwits
10:44.30antiphaseBut I can wander around without getting murdered, and the value of money is relatively stable so I can't be arsed worrying about the rest
10:45.20bilarh_hmm, i know what you mean
10:45.27bilarh_i'll just keep whinging and not do anything
10:48.25bilarh_oh well, hopefully it can be squashed in the european court of law
10:51.45*** join/#gllug tink044 (i=c1cb52e2@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-244531f2fc445f74)
11:19.08kjs_what is raid5 sata going to write at roughly ?
11:19.40BlaptoHardware or softwarE?
11:19.42Blaptosoftware?
11:20.09kjs_hardware
11:20.20kjs_servers about 3 month old dell poweredge
11:20.41kjs_just a rough figure, iv not benched a sata drive in years.
11:22.29BlaptoI think it depends on what you're writing
11:22.50BlaptoLarge files, it's better, small writes, especially those smaller than the stripe size, and RAID 5 slows to a crawl
11:24.25BlaptoI suppose you could probably get (4 drives?) 200MB/s write sustained
11:24.38BlaptoMaybe 150MB/s random?
11:24.42BlaptoProbably slower than that
11:25.17morsingtink044!
11:25.22morsingBlapto!
11:25.26Blaptomorsing!
11:25.59halii'd say far from it, 100 sequential perhaps... 15-30 random at most
11:26.00BlaptoIn fact, I've just dug up some of my old benchmarks, and we got 130MB/s sustained write
11:26.18BlaptoAnd 20MB/s random :)
11:26.25morsingBeer
11:26.38BlaptoThat was on a Adaptec RAID card
11:26.55BlaptoA fairly high-end model, but Adaptec are a bit of a bargain brand sometimes.
11:27.32haliseek time and spindel speed is too low on sata
11:27.39haliseek time is too high*
11:27.42haliand spindel speed to low
11:27.50BlaptoNewer SATA stuff is much better
11:28.01BlaptoEspecially with a good RAID controller and drives that sync nicely
11:28.06haliNCQ had a good promise but I haven't seen much coop
11:28.26morsingNCQ? TCQ?
11:28.39BlaptoBut hey, for the price of 3 SCSI drives you could get 5 SATA drives :)
11:28.51halido you need the space, thats the question
11:28.53BlaptoThat said, most servers only have 4 slots anyway.
11:29.22haliwe use sata for low access datawarehouse tiers and vtl's and stuff like that
11:29.31haliworks great, high capacity but not much access
11:41.29morsinghali: What did you have for breakfast?
11:58.05morsinghttp://property.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/property/article3643024.ece
12:05.25*** join/#gllug dick_turpin (n=dick_tur@host217-34-163-30.in-addr.btopenworld.com)
12:13.26morsingdick_turpin!
12:15.45dick_turpinBanana milkshake
12:18.35kjs_I had a Jordans fruit & rason bar and a glass of water
12:19.04kjs_was late, had to get to the office for Amazon book delivery, which has not turne dup yet
13:11.06*** part/#gllug dick_turpin (n=dick_tur@host217-34-163-30.in-addr.btopenworld.com)
14:11.45*** join/#gllug DiscordianUK (n=ch@chills.demon.co.uk)
14:42.43*** join/#gllug wethrin_ (i=dankolb@hades.eco.li)
15:22.55*** join/#gllug Alex (i=hauntedu@goatse.co.uk)
15:33.58morsingAlex!
15:36.08bilarh_bored out of my arse
15:36.15wethrinGo home.
15:36.23wethrinIt's POETS day
15:36.23bilarh_i feel like it
15:36.27bilarh_yeah i know
15:36.44bilarh_argh
15:36.54bilarh_i just remembered i have to move someone's bloody pc downstairs
15:36.54wethrinI've given up on stuff that doesn't work today.
15:37.00wethrinCan't they do it themselves?
15:37.03bilarh_don't know if i can be arsed
15:37.06bilarh_no, htey are stupid users
15:37.10wethrinAnd have you been trained with appropriate lifting H&FS rubbish?
15:37.19bilarh_unfortunately, yes
15:37.22wethrinBoo
15:37.26wethrinWas it pointless?
15:37.33bilarh_i had to go on half a days training for that
15:37.36bilarh_completely
15:37.36wethrin"Look, I've been lifting computers heavier than you are! Now fuck off"
15:37.58bilarh_then tehy wont give you a certificate, and that certificate is a requirement for working here, unfortunately :(
15:38.09bilarh_it was crazy, though...
15:38.37wethrinThat's a bit rubbish
15:41.27kjs_Anyone recommend a decent webdesigner ?
15:42.17boudiccaskjs_; define 'decent'?
15:42.47boudiccasi mena that i can do plain html, but i dont use java or any other scripts
15:43.25kjs_well smooth, looks decent, we are a small IT Support company basically.  
15:43.25wethrinCSS?
15:43.42kjs_to replace the one I made, http://www.netzensolutions.com
15:44.24boudiccaswhats wrong with that?
15:44.38boudiccasflash, thats the other thing that i was meaning
15:45.07kjs_no flash on there jsut a bit of javascript on the menu
15:45.12kjs_which i have removed actually.
15:45.24wethrinThere's an annoying menu on the top left, which disappears when the mouse rolls over one of the other items
15:45.33wethrin(Safari 3)
15:45.41kjs_safari..
15:46.02kjs_dont have my mac with me will look later.
15:46.12wethrinI'm running it on Windows
15:46.20kjs_FF here...
15:46.40kjs_you find safari better?
15:46.48wethrinYes
15:47.05AlexWHY IS THE DAY NOT OVER YET OH JESUS OW.
15:47.14kjs_in what way?
15:47.53wethrinIt doesn't want to make me claw my eyes out
15:48.08wethrinTBH, I prefer its rendering engine
15:48.39boudiccaswethrin; first you have to get through the safety glasses that you're wearing before you can claw your eyes out
15:48.55wethrinAnd Firefox annoyed me with its memory leaks. Safari also takes up a huge amount of memory, but it takes longer than Firefox to eat that much memory
15:54.00morsingBeer
15:54.16BlaptoSoon, morsing, soon
15:54.26wethrinChimes!
15:54.35wethrinwants to go there again
15:54.39morsingBlapto: Belgian Chocolate Muffin Dessert? It's Tesco's finest
15:54.39xteddysmiles
15:54.45morsingGood teddy
15:54.55Blaptomorsing: Ooh, yes please.
15:55.05morsing:)
15:56.07wethrinI want to go home.
15:56.42ChoHagI did. And got in trouble for it.
15:56.43ChoHagApparently <24 hours notice is sufficient to change my hours.
15:56.46morsingwethrin: Another not very productive day for me
15:57.11wethrinYou mean, you haven't got a job yet?
15:57.19wethrinI made some devices. Which then proceeded to not work.
15:57.22wethrinWhich irritated me somewhat
15:57.53ChoHagWithout actually telling me, also. Let alone asking.
15:58.00DJ_InstincTwelcomes the beer that just arrived at his desk :)
15:58.18morsingwethrin: I mean I have so much to do at home and I once again didn't get much done
15:58.28ChoHagI will no doubt be told on Monday that I'm Not A Team Player.
15:58.38wethrinAhh.
15:58.41wethrinSpend less time on IRC!
15:58.53ChoHagI'm wondering whether to shout 'bingo' if my PHB uses that exact phrase.
15:58.54wethrinChoHag: Get a better workplace!
15:59.09ChoHagI spend none. I have been asked not to connect to anything outside the network.
15:59.46antiphaseSounds like a shit job
15:59.52ChoHagIt is.
15:59.55wethrinChoHag: I was directing that statement at morsing
16:00.12ChoHagOh.
16:00.27wethrinShit jobs are sometimes necessary, though, to keep the money in, while hunting for a better job
16:00.32ChoHagYes indeed.
16:00.40ChoHagPainful as it may be.
16:01.15ChoHagAnd actually harmful. Everybody around my is quite content to be mediocre.
16:02.01BlaptoIf he says "There's no 'I' in team" you know what to say, don't you?
16:02.14BlaptoThere's a certain word that does have a 'u' in.
16:04.19zaargheh
16:04.20zaargyawns
16:04.21xteddyhugs sleepy zaarg
16:05.35ChoHagThere is a 'me' though.
16:06.04BlaptoThere is
16:06.18BlaptoAnd team is an anagram of meat, and there's an 'I' in meat pie.
16:06.19ChoHagAnd a 'ma'.
16:06.32wethrinI LIKE PIE
16:06.34ChoHagSo you should listen to your mother.
16:06.39BlaptoI had pie for lunch :)
16:06.42BlaptoIt was most yummy
16:06.44wethrinFiend!
16:07.18ChoHagYou know what this means don't you_
16:07.31wethrinBlapto ate all the pies?
16:07.35morsingPIE!
16:07.38BlaptoI ate one of the pies.
16:07.39ChoHagIf he does actually say "There is no 'I' in team" I'm going to start sniggering.
16:07.54BlaptoIf he says that, please tell him what word has a 'u' in it?
16:07.59BlaptoPlease please please please please?
16:08.08BlaptoWe'll understand if you're not back on IRC for a few hours
16:10.20ChoHagIt'll be worse if I am.
16:12.10BlaptoI just forgot how to wash my hands
16:12.16BlaptoI ran the water
16:12.19Blaptoput soap on my hands
16:12.25Blaptoput them under the water
16:12.27Blaptoand my mind went blank
16:12.30BlaptoHow bizarre
16:12.42boudiccasmelt down
16:12.50morsingthrows an offset spanner in Blapto's work
16:13.00Blaptomorsing: stop fiddling with my works
16:13.03BlaptoWe've had that discussion
16:13.09morsing:-/
16:17.02*** join/#gllug DiscordianUK (n=ch@chills.demon.co.uk)
16:22.37ChoHagThe other day the DBA was showing me how to install the oracle client (about 400MB btw) and got scared when I started using yast to intall unzip.
16:22.40ChoHagApparently I should use the unzip binary on Novell's website rather than an rpm from our exported CDs because "I'm here to learn not fight the system".
16:23.17wethrinumm
16:23.40DiscordianUKHow does that work?
16:25.29ChoHagHe's just an idiot
16:25.46ChoHagLuckily he's resigning, though I hope he'll still last longer than me.
16:25.54DiscordianUKlol
16:26.39DiscordianUKlol Oracle 11g?
16:26.58morsingCheese
16:26.58ChoHagThey haven't got that far.
16:27.00ChoHagThey're on 9.
16:27.16boudiccasmorsing; apples
16:27.38DiscordianUKOracle DBA isn't taxing thse days
16:28.52morsinglicks boudiccas' nose
16:29.02morsingChoHag: We're all a bit crazy here
16:29.18boudiccasmorsing; don't! else i'll give you an apple
16:29.24morsing!!
16:34.35zaargjust purchased a 'flip cam'
16:35.00zaargthe quality looks impressive for the price!
16:35.51*** join/#gllug Blapto1 (n=martin@62.189.100.228)
16:36.11Blapto1ping
16:36.22boudiccasping back
16:36.33Blapto1Thanks
16:36.34DiscordianUKppng
16:36.39DiscordianUK*pong
16:37.15boudiccasDiscordianUK; you seem to be stuttering in your 'pings' :)
16:37.22Blapto1jitter?
16:37.34DiscordianUKGah google gadgets is a pain to compile
16:39.31DiscordianUKheh the labels have worn off on my keyboard
16:39.38DiscordianUKand I don't touch type
16:41.28Blapto1print off a qwerty keymap :P
16:41.39Blapto1Or, now is an excellent time to learn to touchtype.
16:41.53Blapto1How have you typed enough to wear off the labels yet not touchtype?
16:42.29DiscordianUKAfter 40 years i still carn toch type
16:42.37ChoHagI'm being forced to touchtype. My layout at work is dvorak but my keyboard in qwerty.
16:42.38DiscordianUKcan't touch
16:42.41Blapto1Ah, I still make typos :)
16:42.43ChoHagIt's hardest in the first half hour.
16:42.55Blapto1Can't touch this
16:43.01Blapto1hums doo doo doo do
16:43.26DiscordianUK## Wal;king in memphis
16:43.32DiscordianUKs/;//
16:46.16morsingFrikadeller
16:48.42morsingBlapto1: Where did Blapto go?
16:52.02Blapto1whoami
16:52.14Blaptowhoami
16:52.57DiscordianUKunknown command
16:55.27BlaptoNo, seriously, pidgin isn't a full featured IRC client
16:55.35BlaptoThen again, this is the only room I sit in
16:55.40DiscordianUKindeed
16:55.49DiscordianUKand this isn't a room
16:55.54BlaptoPerhaps #perl once in a while
16:58.03zaargzx41ps12
16:58.06zaargzx41ps12
17:00.07BlaptoThat's a nice password
17:00.19DiscordianUKwas
17:00.52DiscordianUKi suggest judo44 instead
17:01.09morsingBeer
17:01.21morsingDiscordianUK: I'm tired
17:01.39DiscordianUKSo go sleep
17:11.01DiscordianUKI must catch the BBC interview with Mistah Gates
17:16.59BlaptoUntil Monday!
17:29.53zaargthat's not my password
17:30.00zaargthankfully
17:30.15zaargit's just a work box!
17:30.50cpufreakhttp://flickr.com/photos/itwasntandy/sets/72157605722051691/
17:36.03ChoHagI think the cisco vpn has screwed up and rejected my password enough times that Windows has locked my account.
17:36.29DiscordianUKErrrk
18:25.55morsingzaarg: Why did Leeds leave?
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20:52.24morsingtrousers!
21:11.29*** join/#gllug curson (n=curzon@60.32.176.184)
21:11.36morsingcurson!
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