| 00:07.38 | herlo | shalkie: how goes class? |
| 01:03.19 | herlo | anyone else update their f16 box and lose the ability to do alt-. ? |
| 01:03.25 | herlo | it's driving me fucking insane! |
| 01:06.38 | herlo | needs to go grab food soon, then back to hacking |
| 01:46.27 | *** join/#gooseproject bochecha (~bochecha@fedora/bochecha) |
| 01:53.38 | *** join/#gooseproject flaroche (~laroche@dslb-188-104-160-095.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 02:04.21 | shalkie | herlo: Fast pace and a little behind, but otherwise not bad. |
| 02:16.37 | shalkie | Found a couple issues that may or may not be relevant any more with the class setup. |
| 02:16.50 | shalkie | I am guessing no longer relevant since I can't remember the last time I ran into it. |
| 02:18.46 | shalkie | clucks loudly |
| 02:18.48 | shalkie | http://lists.ascendos.org/pipermail/ascendos-dev/2011-December/000443.html |
| 02:18.49 | goosebot | Title: [Ascendos-dev] There are times to Step Up, and times to Step Down. Now is the time. (at lists.ascendos.org) |
| 02:32.20 | herlo | shalkie: wow! |
| 02:32.34 | herlo | still reading, but I didn't think I had any affect on what he chose to do |
| 02:33.04 | shalkie | Oh, I am sure that money is a big deal. |
| 02:34.03 | shalkie | But to think that your going to pay rent off of a new community distro when it is just starting is silly. |
| 02:34.30 | shalkie | As far as I know the cent people don't make enough cents to not work. |
| 02:34.47 | herlo | right |
| 02:34.52 | *** join/#gooseproject macropin (~Andrew@eth4845.nsw.adsl.internode.on.net) |
| 02:35.40 | herlo | I think there *can* be money in it, but I don't think it comes from the rebuild itself. I do this work because it's fun and I enjoy the community. I am sorry dmc feels this way. |
| 02:35.55 | shalkie | Aye |
| 02:37.36 | herlo | lubs Johnny Hughes' comments |
| 02:37.38 | herlo | they are the BEST! |
| 02:37.51 | shalkie | Johnny Hughes? |
| 02:38.32 | *** join/#gooseproject macropin (~Andrew@eth4845.nsw.adsl.internode.on.net) |
| 02:38.33 | herlo | one of the CentOS devs |
| 02:38.42 | shalkie | Link? |
| 02:39.31 | herlo | yeah, hang on |
| 02:39.55 | herlo | shalkie: http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-devel/2011-March/007101.html |
| 02:39.56 | goosebot | Title: [CentOS-devel] Updates from today (at lists.centos.org) |
| 02:40.13 | herlo | that's the quote I use on my slides at ttp://speakerdeck.com/u/herlo/p/rebuilding-enterprise-linux-the-community-way |
| 02:41.41 | shalkie | Ah sweet. I was hunting for that email at one point and had no luck finding. |
| 02:41.45 | herlo | shalkie: the other, to which dmc refers, is this: http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=12491&forum=38&post_id=41509#forumpost41509 |
| 02:41.46 | goosebot | Title: www.centos.org - Forums - CentOS 5 - Application & Software Support - Rebuilding grub package (at www.centos.org) |
| 02:41.55 | herlo | I love his first statement there |
| 02:42.21 | herlo | he's protecting centos by hiding code |
| 02:42.23 | herlo | First, there is no requirement to provide the build logs publicly, so we don't. It is not the hardest thing in the world to rebuild upstream sources, but we do not have any desire to help other people do it so that they can take away centos users. We did at one time help the group that built Oracle linux, and see what it got us, a competitor in our market space. Don't get me wrong, we are all for GPL software and we are happy to use it and provide all sou |
| 02:42.30 | herlo | --Johnny Hughes |
| 02:43.08 | macropin | I guess we're all in agreement then as to the problem we seek to fix.. it's pretty clear |
| 02:43.39 | herlo | macropin: I'd like to hear your opinion on what that is. I know what mine is... |
| 02:45.50 | macropin | Well, the way I see it... EL is too important to too many individuals, organisations and companies to be entrusted to a project/organisation that is not accountable to its user base. |
| 02:47.41 | macropin | I see it as more a matter of governance than anything else. |
| 02:47.43 | herlo | macropin: yes, I'd have to agree |
| 02:48.42 | herlo | I do think that's what a community can provide, at least if desired. |
| 02:57.33 | macropin | I see that as the real challenge.. setting up the governance. I think both our projects (Ascendos / GoOSe) have proven that we can rebuilt EL. Now the challenge is to make it a sustainable thing. |
| 02:58.06 | herlo | macropin: yeah, we're still getting there, but I think we'll have an alpha in a month or less. Following in your footsteps :) |
| 02:58.31 | *** topic/#gooseproject by herlo -> GoOSe Project - http://gooseproject.org |
| 03:02.20 | herlo | goozbach: you around? |
| 03:02.47 | herlo | macropin: good to talk with you, I'm excited to discuss the governance ideas and other issues further. |
| 03:06.44 | shalkie | sweet! |
| 03:06.58 | shalkie | The Tech Museum is open late this time of year. I can actually go to a museum! |
| 03:10.29 | bochecha | herlo your link above to the centos mailing-list lead me to this: http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-devel/2011-March/007114.html |
| 03:10.31 | goosebot | Title: [CentOS-devel] Updates from today (at lists.centos.org) |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | I work with SRPMS, not with an SCM system. I like SRPMS, they are a SCM |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | system of their own. |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | We do not change what upstream has in their SRPMS (except when we have |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | to) ... we don't even unpack them unless we need to change them. We |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | submit them to mock to build. Every patch we create, every change we |
| 03:10.44 | bochecha | make, it is in the SRPM. |
| 03:10.45 | herlo | looks |
| 03:10.54 | bochecha | how is that for a great quote? :) |
| 03:11.07 | herlo | it contradicts itself for one :) |
| 03:11.27 | herlo | oh, nm |
| 03:11.30 | herlo | misread |
| 03:11.36 | herlo | but yes, great quote! |
| 03:11.47 | bochecha | it seems to me like a horribly broken process to pull the srpms, rebuild and publish, without any kind of tracking of anything in between :-/ |
| 03:12.28 | herlo | bochecha: yeah, I've read this one for sure |
| 03:12.40 | herlo | bochecha: I tend to agree. |
| 03:12.53 | herlo | my big thing was that we want to be able to send patches upstream |
| 03:13.20 | herlo | fix silly things that happen and make the ecosystem better overall |
| 03:13.27 | herlo | and I think we can do it |
| 03:13.36 | bochecha | yeah, git makes that easy |
| 03:13.41 | shalkie | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.43 | shalkie | .centos files and pull them in (that and the kernel is all we change). |
| 03:13.48 | shalkie | ^ Hah! |
| 03:14.35 | bochecha | the way I do it here is that I have a 'rhel6' branch in which I import the upstream srpm, and then I have our branch in which I 1. merge the upstream updates and 2. add the patches I need |
| 03:14.56 | bochecha | makes it really easy to send patches upstream |
| 03:15.04 | herlo | bochecha: it's similar to what we're doing |
| 03:15.09 | bochecha | (and of course, to go on merging and maintaining them ^^) |
| 03:15.37 | shalkie | Right, I think It is time to go get some food. |
| 03:15.44 | bochecha | herlo, then it must not be a terrible idea ;) |
| 03:15.44 | shalkie | Tonight is Thai night. |
| 03:15.54 | shalkie | away for food. |
| 03:15.56 | herlo | our master is always the latest. Our plan is to make a mass branch when we import the next round. Incremental updates get applied to appropriate branches |
| 03:15.59 | herlo | bochecha: yep! :) |
| 03:16.22 | herlo | the current debate in my mind is *how* to get the updates from upstream |
| 03:17.06 | shalkie | herlo: I could be wrong but I think they are still publishing the updates through the ftp site. Seems like they have a modified naming convention to indicate updates. |
| 03:17.07 | bochecha | I can tell you how **not** to do it: by manually checking the upstream srpm repos and manually importing the srpms into the appropriate branch |
| 03:17.16 | bochecha | that's what I have done in the past, and it doesn't work :] |
| 03:17.35 | bochecha | shalkie, there's no real naming convention afaik |
| 03:17.54 | bochecha | they sometimes add a .x after the dist, sometimes use el6 as the dist, sometimes el6_Y,... |
| 03:18.03 | shalkie | bochecha: That could well be the case. It has been a while and the stomach does speak loudly... |
| 03:18.14 | herlo | lol, manually |
| 03:18.35 | herlo | shalkie: yes, it's called -2 after -1 :) |
| 03:18.37 | bochecha | from my outside perspective, it seems like there is a convention managers would like to push, and some maintainers follow it, others do the way they maintain packages in Fedora (i.e sensibly) |
| 03:18.50 | bochecha | herlo, I've seen weird stuff in rhel updates |
| 03:18.51 | herlo | and for el6.1 they use el6_1 :) |
| 03:18.58 | herlo | bochecha: me too |
| 03:19.13 | bochecha | like older changelog entries being modified |
| 03:19.21 | herlo | heh, yeah |
| 03:19.38 | herlo | has been to blame on that occasionally. Usually it's within the same version, however. |
| 03:19.46 | herlo | I don't do that anymore! |
| 03:19.59 | bochecha | as if they had based the update on an older version of the packages, painfully merging (hey, they still seem to use CVS ^^) back the changes that had happened in the meantime |
| 03:20.13 | bochecha | herlo, no, I mean **older** changelog entries |
| 03:20.23 | herlo | bochecha: yes |
| 03:20.41 | herlo | bochecha: it's nothing that's open |
| 03:20.43 | shalkie | wanders away for reals... |
| 03:20.47 | bochecha | as in : the initial package contains the changelog from Fedora 13 plus a "Rebuild for rhel6", the update has some changes in the changelog entries from before rhel6 |
| 03:20.47 | herlo | shalkie: go! |
| 03:20.51 | herlo | get outta here :) |
| 03:21.19 | herlo | bochecha: indeed. Odd stuff |
| 03:21.26 | bochecha | and painful to merge ;) |
| 03:21.58 | bochecha | especially when I had added my own changelog entry in between, like "Add patch from RHBZ#XYZ so the package builds in an el6 chroot" |
| 03:22.13 | herlo | hehe |
| 03:22.18 | herlo | that's what release is for :) |
| 03:22.29 | herlo | I don't understnad the reasoning for going back in that |
| 03:22.52 | bochecha | herlo, yes, but which part of Release do you bump? the part before %{?dist} ? the part after it ? |
| 03:23.05 | bochecha | rhel6 packages seem to be doing a little bit of both, depending on the maintainer |
| 03:23.33 | bochecha | (it seems the people who also maintain their packages in Fedora are doing things much more sensibly, probably because they know they have to merge these stuff back and forth) |
| 03:24.03 | bochecha | by the way, what is your take on packages that fail to build in an el6 chroot ? |
| 03:24.14 | herlo | bochecha: seems to me 'always' before |
| 03:24.19 | herlo | but I can see why they don't |
| 03:24.40 | bochecha | do you want to "be as close to upstream as possible" and rebuild them in f12 chroots like SL6 did ? |
| 03:24.46 | herlo | bochecha: name a package that doesn't build on an el6 chroot and I'll show you a patch :) |
| 03:24.53 | bochecha | or would you rather patch it so it builds in el6, submitting the patch upstream ? |
| 03:24.55 | herlo | bochecha: no |
| 03:24.57 | herlo | yes |
| 03:25.02 | herlo | the latter |
| 03:25.05 | bochecha | awesome, that's what I've been doing too |
| 03:25.18 | herlo | I see no value in going backward |
| 03:25.32 | herlo | everything should build on its intended os |
| 03:25.40 | bochecha | it is important for us to be self-hosted so we can push an update without waiting for upstream if that's ever needed (although it shouldn't but who knows) |
| 03:25.45 | herlo | I can understand getting a buildroot up first |
| 03:25.52 | bochecha | I feel the same, so I'm glad we're on the same page :) |
| 03:26.03 | bochecha | and most of the time, the needed patches have been applied in Fedora 13 a long time ago |
| 03:26.05 | herlo | but after that, it's more about rebuliding that buildroot so it works on the os it's for |
| 03:26.20 | herlo | true that, but it's not like we can't apply them for upstream |
| 03:26.31 | bochecha | so it's just a matter of opening a bz, providing a link to the fedora patch to remind the maintainer of how he had done it :P |
| 03:26.35 | herlo | and send them a patch! |
| 03:26.45 | bochecha | yup |
| 03:26.52 | herlo | a patch to the patch, if necessary :) |
| 03:26.59 | bochecha | do you have a list of packages that failed to build ? |
| 03:27.00 | herlo | but not really.... |
| 03:27.15 | herlo | bochecha: I can get it, I've only done the query in ipython so far |
| 03:27.41 | bochecha | I have a bit of time today, I'd be glad to match them with rhbz tickets I opened/added patch to/lurked in |
| 03:27.42 | herlo | it's 263 packages. Some of which I don't know if they failed because of weird deps or just because their deps weren't built yet |
| 03:27.53 | bochecha | that might help you with a few of them |
| 03:27.55 | herlo | albeit, i built 2 last night |
| 03:28.10 | herlo | bochecha: well, let me get you a list :) |
| 03:29.18 | herlo | I liked, it's 295 |
| 03:29.26 | herlo | but I know that several of those are the same package |
| 03:31.30 | herlo | bochecha: would a format similar to this work for you? |
| 03:31.32 | herlo | {'build_id': 1234, 'owner_name': 'clints', 'package_name': 'akonadi', 'task_id': 25612, 'creation_event_id': 21968, 'creation_time': '2011-11-29 01:51:23.225699', 'epoch': None, 'nvr': 'akonadi-1.2.1-2.gl6', 'name': 'akonadi', 'completion_time': '2011-11-29 01:55:48.768086', 'state': 3, 'version': '1.2.1', 'release': '2.gl6', 'creation_ts': 1322549483.2257, 'completion_ts': 1322549748.76809, 'package_id': 826, 'owner_id': 5} |
| 03:31.38 | herlo | and then a newline |
| 03:31.40 | herlo | for each build |
| 03:31.52 | bochecha | json always works for me :) |
| 03:32.06 | herlo | well, it's a dict from koji |
| 03:32.08 | herlo | in python |
| 03:32.22 | herlo | so not really json, but close |
| 03:32.24 | bochecha | dict, json... same difference (in python) |
| 03:32.26 | herlo | lol |
| 03:32.30 | herlo | okay |
| 03:32.39 | bochecha | but yeah, that works |
| 03:32.39 | herlo | let me see how it writes out if I give you the whole dump |
| 03:33.01 | herlo | bochecha: hey, do you use alt-. on your machine? |
| 03:33.08 | bochecha | alt- ? |
| 03:33.11 | bochecha | what is that ? |
| 03:33.11 | herlo | alt period |
| 03:33.26 | herlo | it brings up the last argument of the last command on the bash shell |
| 03:33.31 | herlo | but it's been failing for me for a while |
| 03:33.39 | herlo | I'm trying to figure out why. |
| 03:33.47 | bochecha | no, I didn't know about that |
| 03:34.04 | bochecha | but I'm on Fedora 14, so I'm not sure you're interested in anything from that old eol-ed thing |
| 03:34.17 | herlo | lol |
| 03:34.23 | herlo | it's not eoled yet is it? |
| 03:34.30 | herlo | I thought we had another few weeks |
| 03:34.30 | bochecha | it was supposed to happen on Friday |
| 03:34.34 | herlo | ahh |
| 03:34.37 | bochecha | might have been delayed because of the nfs outage |
| 03:34.40 | herlo | didn't see the email |
| 03:34.44 | herlo | yeah, probably |
| 03:34.57 | bochecha | but it should be Any Time Now © |
| 03:35.03 | herlo | lol, yeah |
| 03:35.07 | bochecha | just like my migration to Fedora 16 |
| 03:35.28 | bochecha | hopefully this week, if not after I come back from my ski holidays |
| 03:36.34 | bochecha | herlo, which makes me think: if you need anything from me, like notes on stuff I had to do in order to build el6 packages, or anything else, I'll be much less available starting Friday, until after Christmas |
| 03:37.32 | herlo | bochecha: who do you work for? |
| 03:37.46 | bochecha | a Hong Kong based company called Network Box |
| 03:37.46 | herlo | interesting how they give you two weeks off :) |
| 03:37.54 | herlo | bochecha: very nice! |
| 03:37.58 | herlo | fun job, I take it? |
| 03:38.27 | bochecha | I only have 12 days off per year (a big change compared to the 35 I had in France), so I save them for going back home during the winter holidays ;) |
| 03:38.32 | bochecha | yeah, a lot :) |
| 03:38.43 | herlo | ahh |
| 03:38.52 | herlo | yes, days off are definitely relative |
| 03:39.06 | herlo | in the US we usually get only 10 days. And that's if you work for a reputable company |
| 03:39.28 | bochecha | well, 35 was the minimum legal for my kind of contract, some of my colleagues had 45 paid annual leaves :D |
| 03:39.47 | herlo | it's called PTO now, so that companies don't have to maintain sick days and vacation days. Those are considered different. |
| 03:39.58 | herlo | wow, 45 days would be awesome |
| 03:39.59 | bochecha | (25 being the absolute minimum legal for any kind of full time employment) |
| 03:40.12 | herlo | plans a move ot France |
| 03:40.31 | herlo | visits rosettastone.com |
| 03:40.34 | bochecha | usually you never take them (no time, too much work), so they end up being paid extra at the end of the year :) |
| 03:41.09 | herlo | bochecha: http://sexysexypenguins.com/misc/goose_failed_builds.txt |
| 03:41.16 | bochecha | awesome, thanks |
| 03:41.19 | herlo | bochecha: that works too |
| 03:41.37 | herlo | but most people around my city will die to get 2 weeks of work off a year, paid |
| 03:42.14 | bochecha | where is that? |
| 03:42.17 | herlo | Salt Lake |
| 03:42.19 | herlo | in Utah |
| 03:42.42 | bochecha | tries goes of trying to locate that on a map |
| 03:42.59 | herlo | it's not that there aren't good companies, it's just many are very frugal and would probably prefer to bank their hours. Most companies have a use it or lose it policy now though |
| 03:43.47 | bochecha | wow, lots of parks around there, looks like a nice place to live :) |
| 03:44.20 | bochecha | "use it or lose it" is illegal in France for the 25 legal paid leaves days |
| 03:44.28 | bochecha | is giving you more motivation to move :P |
| 03:44.33 | herlo | lol |
| 03:44.45 | herlo | bochecha: I might when my 11-yo son is 18 |
| 03:45.10 | herlo | he lives with his mom in Long Beach (california). About 700 miles away from home |
| 03:45.22 | herlo | I fight hard to get to see him even 2 months a year |
| 03:45.24 | bochecha | hehe, not having any family of my own (yet) made it definitely easier for me to move to HK |
| 03:45.34 | herlo | I'm currently pushing to have him 4 months now |
| 03:46.36 | bochecha | oh, sorry about that :-/ |
| 03:47.52 | herlo | bochecha: it's okay |
| 03:47.59 | herlo | she's a good mom and he likes it there |
| 03:48.16 | herlo | so far, I can't bring myself to move there. I hate that city/area |
| 03:48.33 | herlo | too many people, too many malls, traffic, etc. |
| 03:49.08 | bochecha | I here you, I'm from a small village (700 inhabitants) in the middle of the Alps |
| 03:49.16 | herlo | I like cities, Chicago, NY, even LA to a point. It's mostly because I have everything close by and while a bit busy/crowded, I don't have to worry about traffic and such too often. |
| 03:49.32 | bochecha | I had a hard time living in Paris, but Hong Kong is proving to be even more difficult to live in |
| 03:49.49 | herlo | In SLC, it's very busy in certain places and not so bad in others. I can live in a quiet neighborhood and go to the busy parts when I want. |
| 03:49.58 | herlo | bochecha: I bet |
| 03:50.39 | bochecha | in Hong Kong it's busy in some places, and "oh my god, it took me 10 minutes to walk 100m on the side walk" crowded in others |
| 03:52.42 | herlo | yeah |
| 03:52.47 | herlo | I have heard that about that place |
| 03:53.30 | herlo | why do yum mirrors sometimes have to be such a pain in the ass! |
| 03:57.12 | herlo | YAY!! |
| 03:57.47 | herlo | I fixed the alt-. issue by downgrading gtk3 |
| 03:58.31 | bochecha | Fedora 16? |
| 03:59.28 | herlo | yup |
| 03:59.36 | herlo | bochecha: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=766918 |
| 03:59.38 | goosebot | Title: Bug 766918 Latest update of gtk3 (gtk3-3.2.2-2.fc16.x86_64) broke meta keys (at bugzilla.redhat.com) |
| 04:00.32 | herlo | gonna have to watch that bug |
| 04:06.17 | bochecha | herlo, there's a patch for fixing modifier keys in the fedora's gtk3 git, f16 branch |
| 04:06.54 | bochecha | could be related |
| 04:07.50 | herlo | yeah |
| 04:07.54 | *** join/#gooseproject makfinsky (~imak@pool-96-247-197-56.clppva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 04:08.08 | herlo | bochecha: I figure that's what caused it |
| 04:08.22 | makfinsky | Holy jebuz!! Finally! |
| 04:08.55 | makfinsky | I broked the laptop this morning just before class started and haven't been able to fix it until just now. |
| 04:09.22 | bochecha | herlo, no, the patch is in a newer release |
| 04:09.27 | bochecha | herlo, it could fix it |
| 04:09.28 | makfinsky | Nothing like performing surgery on a laptop while trying to teach... |
| 04:09.31 | herlo | bochecha: ahh |
| 04:09.35 | herlo | makfinsky: hey! |
| 04:09.42 | makfinsky | Yum n-v-r parsing? |
| 04:09.45 | herlo | you missed all of the action earlier. Good fun stuff |
| 04:09.48 | makfinsky | herlo: Hola! |
| 04:09.56 | makfinsky | Bon jour bochecha. |
| 04:09.59 | herlo | not that bochecha and I aren't having a fun time |
| 04:10.05 | herlo | :) |
| 04:10.15 | makfinsky | herlo: Oh? Do tell. Quickly as I am about to pass out. |
| 04:10.24 | bochecha | makfinsky, bonjour :) |
| 04:11.09 | herlo | makfinsky: lol |
| 04:11.16 | herlo | it's only 10:10 pm here |
| 04:11.42 | herlo | makfinsky: http://lists.ascendos.org/pipermail/ascendos-dev/2011-December/000443.html |
| 04:11.43 | goosebot | Title: [Ascendos-dev] There are times to Step Up, and times to Step Down. Now is the time. (at lists.ascendos.org) |
| 04:12.08 | makfinsky | Woa!! |
| 04:12.24 | herlo | aye |
| 04:12.33 | herlo | had a nice chat here with macropin earlier |
| 04:13.06 | herlo | there's some good discussion going on about governance and the like. I think we'll probalby want to discuss this at tomorrow's meeting |
| 04:13.21 | makfinsky | Indeed.... |
| 04:13.48 | makfinsky | I've only read the first paragraph of that post... give me a couple mins to finish and digest this... |
| 04:14.27 | herlo | yes |
| 04:14.29 | herlo | will do. |
| 04:16.42 | bochecha | is heading out for lunch, good night everyone if you're already aslept when I'm back |
| 04:16.48 | bochecha | makfinsky, bonne nuit ;) |
| 04:17.25 | makfinsky | bochecha: Merci, bonne nuit. |
| 04:17.40 | herlo | bochecha: enjoy lunch |
| 04:17.45 | herlo | thanks for the chat and help |
| 04:19.32 | makfinsky | Shoot, did we kill ascendos...?? |
| 04:20.01 | herlo | no |
| 04:20.20 | herlo | makfinsky: I think there's great promise in both of our projects |
| 04:23.24 | makfinsky | I agree... the post has a slight hint of sadness to it though. |
| 04:24.27 | herlo | yes, the money troubles seem to be the main thing. I think maybe I was just the last straw |
| 04:24.56 | makfinsky | :( |
| 04:28.13 | makfinsky | I wonder if he(Doug) is interesting in consulting and teaching work... |
| 04:29.03 | herlo | makfinsky: you should ask him |
| 04:29.11 | makfinsky | Good idea. |
| 04:29.13 | herlo | that might be a good way for him to make money and work on the project |
| 04:29.18 | makfinsky | Indeed. |
| 04:29.19 | herlo | makfinsky: it was your idea :) |
| 04:29.32 | herlo | just goosed you along :) |
| 04:29.35 | makfinsky | I didn't give you credit for it... :) |
| 04:29.41 | makfinsky | :P |
| 04:29.43 | herlo | lol |
| 04:29.44 | herlo | punk |
| 04:29.58 | makfinsky | Tee hee. |
| 04:32.15 | makfinsky | Wow... Heavy post. |
| 04:33.16 | herlo | indeed |
| 04:33.23 | herlo | so there will be replies soon |
| 04:33.35 | herlo | I'm planning one after Andrew replies |
| 04:34.14 | makfinsky | Ok, I'll keep my ears on. |
| 04:34.28 | herlo | makfinsky: btw, I'm building again :) |
| 04:34.39 | makfinsky | Ah, I was wondering about that. |
| 04:34.42 | makfinsky | How's that going? |
| 04:34.47 | makfinsky | And how can I help? |
| 04:34.57 | herlo | makfinsky: go through your failed builds? |
| 04:34.59 | makfinsky | I saw that you did some interesting tempfs work for mock. |
| 04:35.05 | herlo | find any that require the kernel and relaunch them |
| 04:35.11 | makfinsky | Oh?? |
| 04:35.12 | herlo | makfinsky: I didn't do it |
| 04:35.19 | makfinsky | Figured out a solution for the kernel issue? |
| 04:35.20 | herlo | I just showed bochecha the options |
| 04:35.28 | herlo | makfinsky: yes. It wasn't in the repo |
| 04:35.38 | makfinsky | Doh!! |
| 04:36.21 | makfinsky | When you say "your" failed builds, do you mean pkgs that I own that failed to build? Right now, only you and shalkie own packages that aren't built, it seems. |
| 04:37.11 | herlo | yes |
| 04:37.18 | herlo | makfinsky: you didn't get any emails? |
| 04:37.34 | makfinsky | I did not. |
| 04:37.38 | herlo | makfinsky: I see this: http://koji.gooselinux.org/koji/builds?userID=imak&order=-build_id&state=3 |
| 04:37.39 | goosebot | Title: Builds | Koji (at koji.gooselinux.org) |
| 04:37.54 | herlo | quite a few, I must say |
| 04:37.59 | herlo | probably before you got the emails working |
| 04:38.08 | makfinsky | Hmm... |
| 04:38.18 | herlo | :P |
| 04:38.29 | makfinsky | I'll check for failed build notices and then get started on this list. |
| 04:38.52 | makfinsky | Um... yeah, I guess I do have a few to build, huh? |
| 04:38.54 | makfinsky | :-D |
| 04:39.59 | makfinsky | Yeah, notifications were configured and working after 12/5 |
| 04:40.18 | herlo | well, there you go |
| 04:40.39 | herlo | makfinsky: thanks! |
| 04:40.53 | makfinsky | Yuppers. |
| 04:41.12 | makfinsky | Hmm... do you know of a cli way of getting that list? |
| 04:41.32 | makfinsky | Cause that's a pita to have to go through the web interface. |
| 04:41.45 | herlo | yes |
| 04:41.54 | herlo | I can give it to you now |
| 04:42.06 | herlo | wishes irssi had ctrl-r |
| 04:42.49 | herlo | makfinsky: http://sexysexypenguins.com/misc/goose_failed_builds.txt |
| 04:42.59 | herlo | it's for everyone, but your's can easily be cut from that |
| 04:43.05 | herlo | and it's pretty parseable |
| 04:43.50 | makfinsky | Rocking. |
| 04:44.04 | herlo | let me know if I can get you a better list |
| 04:44.23 | makfinsky | Um.... LOL. Sure, get me a better list! |
| 04:44.30 | herlo | no |
| 04:44.37 | herlo | see what I did there? |
| 04:44.38 | makfinsky | I think you need to let me know if you *can*. |
| 04:44.44 | herlo | I told you I can |
| 04:44.51 | herlo | but I'm not going to :) |
| 04:45.01 | herlo | lol |
| 04:45.05 | makfinsky | Nice. |
| 04:45.11 | makfinsky | Jacka$$ |
| 04:45.14 | herlo | lol |
| 04:45.16 | herlo | yer welcome |
| 04:45.22 | herlo | makfinsky: do you really want a better list? |
| 04:45.25 | makfinsky | Ok, time for bed. I have to get up in 5 hours. |
| 04:45.30 | makfinsky | That one's fine. |
| 04:45.59 | makfinsky | A bit of grep, some awk, and bam, I'll have the pkg list I need to forloop through. |
| 04:46.05 | herlo | makfinsky: k, let me know if you need a better one later |
| 04:46.10 | herlo | makfinsky: indeed |
| 04:46.46 | makfinsky | I should, at some point, start writing python or such scripts... Not tonight. |
| 04:48.17 | herlo | hehe |
| 04:48.19 | herlo | makfinsky: get some rest |
| 04:48.29 | herlo | I'm actually going to finish a few more and head on to bed myself |
| 04:48.44 | makfinsky | Thanks, good work sir. |
| 04:48.49 | makfinsky | Chat wif you manana. |
| 04:48.56 | herlo | nn |
| 05:04.58 | shalkie | herlo: It has been a while. But lets give a build a try. |
| 05:05.25 | herlo | shalkie: just so you are aware, you should be using skein |
| 05:05.25 | shalkie | Oh and there is a chance that I will be hanging out with tene tomorrow for dinner, about meeting time. |
| 05:05.34 | herlo | shalkie: fail :/ |
| 05:05.41 | shalkie | That was going to be one of the questions. what is the new workflow? |
| 05:05.54 | shalkie | herlo: Eh, I really only have the one night left. Class ends wed. |
| 05:06.01 | herlo | shalkie: orly? |
| 05:06.03 | herlo | interesting |
| 05:06.56 | shalkie | Orly? |
| 05:07.05 | shalkie | doesn't see orly. |
| 05:07.28 | herlo | o rly? |
| 05:07.47 | shalkie | To ending wed? Yeah. |
| 05:07.53 | shalkie | Like I said, custom craziness. |
| 05:08.14 | shalkie | After the lost time from today it is going to be a break neck pace. |
| 05:08.16 | herlo | ya |
| 05:08.23 | herlo | shalkie: indeed |
| 05:09.29 | herlo | hmm, I'm wondering why our mock doesn't do the right thing sometimes |
| 05:11.18 | shalkie | Um... |
| 05:11.26 | shalkie | fights the temptation... |
| 05:11.57 | shalkie | Right, so let me get skein up to date. |
| 05:12.23 | herlo | shalkie: it's now master that you want to use :) |
| 05:12.35 | herlo | I've got a 2.0 release in there now :) |
| 05:13.57 | shalkie | hangs head after updating develop |
| 05:14.07 | herlo | shalkie: well, they should be similar |
| 05:14.10 | shalkie | Right here we go. |
| 05:14.18 | herlo | I haven't added anything to develop lately |
| 05:14.42 | herlo | shalkie: they should be identical atm |
| 05:16.04 | shalkie | Right, well I think I am current. |
| 05:16.09 | shalkie | So what is the process now? |
| 05:17.06 | herlo | shalkie: what do you mean? |
| 05:17.27 | herlo | you fix the problem with the failed build and rebuild it |
| 05:23.40 | shalkie | herlo: Right, so I take the source package, run skein extract then skein build |
| 05:23.52 | shalkie | Sorry, there is an upload in there. |
| 05:24.17 | shalkie | Do I need to push? |
| 05:25.23 | shalkie | hasn't used skein for most of this. |
| 05:25.34 | herlo | shalkie: no |
| 05:25.48 | herlo | shalkie: stop right there |
| 05:26.02 | herlo | shalkie: here is the thing |
| 05:26.09 | shalkie | I am not doing anything until I am certain of the current process. |
| 05:26.15 | herlo | perfect |
| 05:26.36 | herlo | shalkie: to start with, the process is being clarified by what we do and ask |
| 05:26.45 | herlo | so ask yourself some questions |
| 05:27.07 | herlo | 1) I received some email about a failed build of package X. Why did it fail?> |
| 05:27.19 | herlo | 2) Where do I look to find out why it failed? |
| 05:27.38 | herlo | 3) After finding the link in my email to look why it failed, what caused that failure? |
| 05:29.19 | herlo | shalkie: then the process diverges a little from there I think |
| 05:29.55 | herlo | 4a) If the process is because of some bug introduced by the packager, how do I fix that? |
| 05:30.17 | herlo | 4b) If the failure is because of some bug introduced by the upstream developer, how do I fix that? |
| 05:30.45 | herlo | 4c) What do I do if I don't know what caused it. How do I trace through this shit and make any sense of it? :) |
| 05:31.06 | herlo | 4d) Whoa! something's really wrong with our koji. How do I report that? |
| 05:31.20 | herlo | 4e) you probably get the picture now, but maybe you don't? |
| 05:31.22 | herlo | could go on |
| 05:31.45 | herlo | so let's take 4a as an example |
| 05:31.58 | herlo | at this point, you don't need to extract anything |
| 05:32.21 | herlo | in fact, it's probably better to clone the git repo and have a look at the spec file and the patches that have been introduced. |
| 05:33.27 | herlo | Most of the time, when it appears to be a packager problem. I will build it in mock on an el6 vm I have to see if it works there. |
| 05:33.39 | shalkie | Has all the src been uploaded the lookaside cache? |
| 05:33.41 | herlo | If it works there, then I know it's probably not the packager problem. |
| 05:33.50 | herlo | shalkie: that's something to check |
| 05:34.18 | herlo | though I would say it's less likely the problem if you can look at the checkout log and see the downloads don't fail (or the SRPM is successfully built) |
| 05:36.12 | herlo | shalkie: it's late here. I need to crash |
| 05:36.34 | herlo | let's talk tomorrow, but you now have a framework for a process in front of you |
| 05:37.29 | shalkie | Sleep well herlo. |
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| 06:40.42 | bochecha | herlo, interesting, I had some packages fail to build while they succeeded for you |
| 06:41.24 | bochecha | e.g geronimo-specs failed to build for me because yum would pull in openjdk-devel as a build dependency, which is incompatible, but for you yum pulled gcj-devel which is ok |
| 06:41.33 | bochecha | that feels... fragile :-/ |
| 06:42.15 | bochecha | I wonder if it's because my build host was Fedora 14 at the time, and the yum depsolver algorithm had changed between EL6 and F14 |
| 06:42.33 | bochecha | (the mock chroot is populated with the host's yum) |
| 06:45.54 | bochecha | another example is linuxdoc-tools, which failed for me because the perl modules were not installed in the right place (the perlvendor macro issue that the SL6 guys had also identified) |
| 06:45.59 | bochecha | but it worked for you o_O |
| 06:46.04 | bochecha | is puzzled |
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| 12:37.52 | goozbach | did we do that!? (re DMC's email) |
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| 13:50.31 | herlo | GoOSe Morning |
| 13:50.34 | herlo | goozbach: I don't think so |
| 13:56.57 | goozbach | morn gooseing |
| 13:57.04 | goozbach | herlo: pong from last night |
| 13:57.11 | goozbach | I went to bed way early last night |
| 13:57.15 | goozbach | 9pm |
| 13:57.27 | goozbach | after falling asleep on the floor of my son's room |
| 14:00.00 | makfinsky | I think I need to go to bed early tonight... |
| 14:00.16 | makfinsky | less than 5 hours sleep a night makes teaching a real challenge. |
| 14:00.17 | makfinsky | GoOSe morning all! |
| 14:05.33 | herlo | goozbach: no prob |
| 14:05.56 | goozbach | there's some good discussion our response generated |
| 14:05.58 | herlo | I am getting ready for the day, will be at the TC soon. |
| 14:06.03 | herlo | goozbach: for sure |
| 15:08.41 | makfinsky | herlo: On the ascendos mL? |
| 15:10.34 | goozbach | oops I thought I had enabled moderated public access to the list |
| 15:10.44 | goozbach | some of the ascendos ML responses didn't make it through |
| 15:10.52 | goozbach | I'll bounce them from mutt to get them setup |
| 15:18.21 | makfinsky | Ah, ok. |
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| 15:23.57 | goozbach | theyre there now |
| 16:05.20 | herlo | goozbach: way2go. shalkie was asking about that the other day |
| 16:06.21 | makfinsky | Ok, running through a foorloop build of all the pkgs that herlo had on the failed builds report belonging to me. |
| 16:06.52 | makfinsky | goozbach: The messages are where? I haven't gotten any posts from outside our small group from the ML. |
| 16:10.07 | herlo | makfinsky: you are looping through them? |
| 16:10.17 | goozbach | http://groups.google.com/group/goose-linux/browse_thread/thread/d78e80be8494223e/154842e8adf91cb2#154842e8adf91cb2 |
| 16:10.18 | goosebot | Title: Enterprise Linux Rebuild Collaboration Manifesto - GoOSe-Linux | Google Groups (at groups.google.com) |
| 16:10.24 | goozbach | the messages from douglas |
| 16:10.26 | herlo | figured you would discover why they are failing and rebuild them by hand... |
| 16:10.28 | goozbach | goosebot: unload URL |
| 16:10.28 | goosebot | goozbach: Error: There was no plugin URL. |
| 16:10.36 | goozbach | goosebot: list plugins |
| 16:10.36 | goosebot | goozbach: Error: 'plugins' is not a valid plugin. |
| 16:10.41 | goozbach | goosebot: plugin list |
| 16:10.41 | goosebot | goozbach: Admin, Channel, Config, MeetBot, Misc, Owner, Plugin, Seen, Unix, User, Utilities, and Web |
| 16:10.49 | goozbach | goosebot: unload web |
| 16:10.50 | goosebot | goozbach: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:17.00 | goozbach | goosebot: save |
| 16:17.01 | goosebot | goozbach: Error: "save" is not a valid command. |
| 16:17.10 | goozbach | goosebot: config save |
| 16:17.10 | goosebot | goozbach: Error: 'supybot.save' is not a valid configuration variable. |
| 16:19.37 | shalkie | GoOSe morning all. |
| 16:20.20 | shalkie | makfinsky: Teaching on little sleep is the easy part. Being able to give a reasonable answer to questions, that is the tough part. :-) |
| 16:20.30 | shalkie | speaks from sad experience. |
| 16:20.52 | shalkie | Is there anything more unhealthy then Lox for breakfast? |
| 16:21.01 | shalkie | takes a bite of Lox. |
| 16:27.55 | shalkie | You know you have been doing computers for a while when the first instinct you have while reading a line with the word bite is to correct it to byte. |
| 17:23.22 | makfinsky | herlo: Yes, I am looping through them, stupidly too. I forgot to update skein on this system and this skein doesn't bg the build jobs. |
| 17:24.04 | makfinsky | shalkie: Indeed. Keeping the concepts straight is tough when brain hasn't rested enough... |
| 17:31.35 | herlo | makfinsky: is your plan to just loop through and see if some other deps have fixed the problems ?? |
| 17:38.26 | herlo | I could do that I guess.. |
| 17:58.30 | makfinsky | herlo: Yes, for this pass, that is the idea. |
| 17:59.17 | makfinsky | Working towards the point of diminishing returns - once the loops no longer build a significant number of the rpms, then the loops stop and we work by hand to resolve the issues. |
| 17:59.25 | makfinsky | At least, that's my approach. |
| 17:59.57 | shalkie | makfinsky: I thought that was the general idea. |
| 18:01.34 | makfinsky | shalkie: Yea, that's what I thought too. |
| 18:32.46 | shalkie | Alright, I am going to be gone for a bit. Have a good afternoon/evening folks. |
| 18:32.47 | shalkie | waves |
| 18:32.54 | goozbach | adios |
| 18:41.56 | herlo | makfinsky: maybe I should do that |
| 18:42.13 | herlo | makfinsky: I am also getting your emails though. Kind of weird |
| 19:02.37 | herlo | makfinsky: something like: cat /tmp/goose_failed_builds.txt | while read pkg; do p=$(echo ${pkg} | grep kojiadmin | awk -F',' '{ print $3 }' | awk -F':' '{ print $2 }' | cut -c3- | cut -d"'" -f 1) ; if [ -n "${p}" ]; then skein build -c ~/.koji/config-goose --nowait dist-gl6 ${p}; fi ; done |
| 19:02.42 | herlo | ?? |
| 19:02.43 | herlo | that is what worked for me |
| 19:22.10 | herlo | whee! |
| 19:22.55 | herlo | 5 pages of builds :) |
| 19:30.58 | herlo | almost 250 :) |
| 19:36.27 | makfinsky | The skein on this laptop wasn't updated and didn't bg the builds. |
| 19:37.04 | makfinsky | The reason you're getting emails is because you own the pkgs. |
| 19:39.19 | herlo | makfinsky: but it's coming to you as well |
| 19:39.29 | makfinsky | Both the owner and the submitter get notifications. |
| 19:41.47 | herlo | ahh |
| 19:42.00 | herlo | that seems reasonable |
| 19:42.05 | makfinsky | And you *own* just about all the pkgs. |
| 19:42.06 | makfinsky | ;) |
| 19:54.21 | herlo | oh, well I should fix that :) |
| 20:50.44 | makfinsky | Oh? Are you going to randomly assign pkgs to us? ;) |
| 20:56.28 | herlo | makfinsky: maybe. Thanks for the idea! :) |
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| 22:17.01 | makfinsky | Hehehe, I had forgotten about the --nowait option to skein build... duh! |
| 22:22.09 | makfinsky | Woot, 273 build tasks in koji now. |
| 22:24.12 | herlo | makfinsky: uh, I just did a bunch too |
| 22:24.30 | herlo | did you try to rebuild some I already launched? |
| 22:25.16 | herlo | nope, looks like they are possibly different |
| 22:26.51 | makfinsky | I grepped through the list you sent and am only launching the ones that had my name on the line. |
| 22:27.14 | makfinsky | Ok, time for me to get out. |
| 22:27.31 | makfinsky | Back latah! |
| 22:35.08 | herlo | ahh, nice |
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| 23:51.23 | herlo | wow, more builds are completing than I anticipated! |