IRC log for #gsoc on 20100403

00:00.17fatosk
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00:05.28Catfish_Mank, heading out. Bye folks
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00:27.45fatosdo you have to really know about the project you choose or can you just apply because ur interested in it... and want to start learning by doing it.
00:28.10fatoswill mentors consider that !
00:29.00shuffle2i'd say it depends on the mentor/org/etc
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00:29.48fatosthat means that u have to be careful on what projects u apply ...
00:30.58shuffle2you shouldn't apply to something you're not interested in anyways
00:32.35fatosok im interested in neural networks and their implementation to face detection but im complete beginner when it comes to doing something in that field
00:32.50fatosif im gonna do something im gonna have to start from the basics
00:35.32fatosim also interested in agent technology and parallel computing but i dont have any strong technical knowledge about these fields
00:37.36infinity0fatos: have a look at the list of mentoring organisations
00:37.37infinity0!list
00:37.38socinfo"list" is http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2010
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00:43.43r0bby|androidCrfap
00:43.53r0bby|androidLost my app :(
00:46.54fatosi know how that feels...
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00:48.13nico_le_terribleI don't really understand...
00:48.26nico_le_terribleWe must  have finish for the 16 july ?
00:49.43shuffle2lost your app?
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00:50.36magsol^ on that note, my laptop went into kernel panic 2/3 of the way through a gsoc application -_-
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00:51.11MatthewWilkesmagsol: FTR, you can edit it after submitting
00:51.18MatthewWilkessubmit early, submit often
00:51.25magsoleven when incomplete?
00:52.00MatthewWilkesSure
00:52.10MatthewWilkesas long as you've got something in every required field
00:52.24magsolgotcha
00:52.27magsolgood to know, thanks :)
00:53.13nico_le_terribleand for my question ? :$
00:53.52nico_le_terriblein the timeline, I understand that we must have something who work on the july 16, and after debugging it, doing docs, etc...
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00:59.23fatosdamn this list is too big.... they should have done some filtering options based on areas of research
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01:01.09nico_le_terribleor you should have search before :p
01:01.31fatosyeah i woke up late i guess
01:01.45fatosi heard just two days ago about GSoC
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01:01.57fatosnever heard about it before
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01:02.22fatosthis world contains so much treasure that we don't know about
01:06.50nico_le_terribleWhy we'd like you to do this project:
01:07.02nico_le_terribleonly an american can answer it properly :p
01:07.32nico_le_terriblewe never answer question like this in europe :p
01:09.01fatos???
01:10.22nico_le_terribleWe don't like say that we're good
01:10.33nico_le_terribleit's a fake modesty
01:10.36JayJaymiresYou're not expected to answer why you want to do something ?
01:11.29nico_le_terribleWhy'd you like to to do this project
01:11.35nico_le_terribleWhy we'd like you to do this project:
01:11.40nico_le_terribleit's not the same :p
01:12.34JayJaymiresOh yeah I didn't catch that but it's the same as an application just more blunt
01:13.25fatoswell you have to consider the profit gained by both sides you and the company
01:13.28nico_le_terribleIf I do the work the company gain a profit :p
01:13.55JayJaymiresUltimately they're giving you the chance to break away from the pack and tell them why it should be you that is picked
01:15.10nico_le_terribleI understand but it's difficult to a french guy
01:15.45fatosim really curious about this now... why is that the case nico !?
01:16.12nico_le_terriblebecause in our culture speak about us in a good way, it's juged a little ridiculous
01:16.26MatthewWilkesfatos: Simple cultural differences
01:16.46MatthewWilkesIf you ask "How good are you at Python" a US-born person might say "I'm great, I've done x, y, z"
01:16.48fatosi know matthew i wanted her to define the difference
01:17.01MatthewWilkesA brit might say "I've got some experience, I've done x, y, z"
01:17.30nico_le_terribleyeah MatthewWilkes ;)
01:17.59MatthewWilkesTo us the US version sounds arrogant, to a USian our version sounds like it lacks confidence
01:19.49JayJaymiresI don't think they're asking you to say you're great theyre asking what qualifies you for the position over other applicants
01:20.14jenredah a U.S. Male might say "I'm great..." ;> We women are usually not quite so in your face...sometimes to our deteriment
01:20.33jenreddetriment
01:21.02nico_le_terribleJayJaymires: there is the same problems :p
01:21.13jenrednico_le_terrible they could also be asking why you are interested in the project - have you always loved programming?
01:21.18jenredthat sort of thing
01:21.30jenredthat's why we ask that question
01:21.46nico_le_terribleok
01:23.37fatosand u also have to consider the fact that many organizations are not from US so you might feel a little safe
01:23.52nico_le_terribleyeah it's not a problem :p
01:24.07nico_le_terribleI just want discuss about it :p
01:24.32nico_le_terriblebecause I find it interessant to see difference between cultures
01:24.53nico_le_terribleYou don't see how you are about it
01:24.59nico_le_terribleand we don't see how we are about it
01:25.36nico_le_terribleI have been aware about this (arogant vs lacks confidence) when an American is come to our school and talk us about it
01:25.52JayJaymiresI think many people in each country would respond very different to that question
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01:29.04fatosi think we should invite Sigmund Freud in this conversation ...
01:29.20nico_le_terriblewhy not, it should be interesting :p
01:29.54JayJaymireshaha
01:30.17fatosbut first you have to make a program to link to the other world because that's the only way u can reach him
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01:30.48fatosand you can do that as your google project
01:31.49JayJaymiresI did that once
01:31.57JayJaymires:)
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01:33.14JayJaymiresWhat projects are you all interested in?
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01:34.12bawrPython and distributed comuting here.
01:34.15fatosive got so much in my head that i cant think of which one to choose problem choose the one which seems more sensible considering my current capacity
01:35.38fatosquantum cryptography :P
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01:37.11bawrThat's more on the hardware side of things. :)
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01:37.38fatosnot excactly...
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01:38.55JayJaymiresThat's pretty advanced right?
01:40.16fatosit exploits the principles of quantum mechanics to create quantum algorithms which are much more efficient and much more faster than 'classical algorithms'
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01:41.19JayJaymiresYou must have a solid physics background
01:42.12fatosactually it's just what i read in books about quantum mechanics because i find it very interesting
01:43.17fatosand i think that's the peak of computing
01:43.25fatosquantum computing
01:44.39fatosi dont know if there is any projects related to that
01:44.47nico_le_terriblewhat's your level fatos ?
01:45.02fatoswhat do u mean !?
01:45.28nico_le_terriblegrade ?
01:45.29fatosacademically, im 1st year undergraduate
01:45.54nico_le_terriblebecause it seems really difficult subject :p
01:46.32fatoswell if you read about it , it's not that difficult
01:46.38nico_le_terribleheu
01:46.51nico_le_terriblequantum mechanics, is not an easy subject :p
01:47.01nico_le_terribledo you study it a little in school ?
01:47.10fatosnope
01:47.22fatosi just read about it by myself
01:47.27nico_le_terrible:s
01:47.34fatosbut i wouldnt call any of my reads - studying
01:47.45fatosbut i would like to study it
01:47.49nico_le_terribleok
01:48.00nico_le_terribleand in what are you studying ?
01:48.06fatoscomputer science
01:48.10nico_le_terriblexD
01:48.50fatoswhat do u study !?
01:49.17nico_le_terriblecomputer science too :p
01:49.24fatosnice :)
01:49.58nico_le_terriblebut quantum mechanics are pure physics
01:50.02nico_le_terribleand mathematics
01:50.25nico_le_terribleour study in computer science cannot help us to understand that
01:51.06fatoswell computer hardware are made based on the principles of physics too
01:51.11fatosbut you still study computer science
01:51.18fatosbecause you deal with software
01:51.50fatosand quantum cryptography is one of the areas of quantum computing that can be considered as software
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01:52.09nico_le_terriblebut you need a solid bases in physics and mathematics
01:53.21fatoswell you need mathematics now for computer science too
01:53.27nico_le_terriblenot the same ;)
01:53.53JayJaymiresCrytopgraphy is pretty advanced in general
01:54.00nico_le_terribleyeah
01:54.15nico_le_terribleand mathematics in cryptography and mathematics for quantum mechanics are not the same too :p
01:54.35JayJaymiresIt's definately a very demanding area
01:54.38fatoswell mathematics in quantum cryptography is one mathematics
01:54.41JayJaymiresdefinitely *
01:54.43JayJaymiresblah
01:54.47fatosand if im going to study that that ill study that
01:54.48nico_le_terribleyeah JayJaymires
01:55.05JayJaymiresfatos where are you?
01:55.20fatosim in two places at the same time :P
01:55.43JayJaymireshaha
01:55.49JayJaymiresI meant country?
01:55.54fatosUK
01:57.36JayJaymiresPerhaps you should look at the ESA's projects
01:58.05JayJaymiresIf it's not on their ideas page check their website for ongoing projects and maybe apply to work with that project
01:58.22fatosEuropean Space Agency !?
01:58.26JayJaymiresYeah
01:58.37MatthewWilkesfatos: Shouldn't you be in bed?  It's 3am :P
01:58.49JayJaymireshttp://www.esa.int/gsp/ACT/about.htm
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01:59.08fatosyeah i know , when something exciting like GSoC comes i cant sleep
01:59.13nico_le_terrible4 am
01:59.15JayJaymireshaha
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01:59.44JayJaymiresI was up that late last night
01:59.59dixonmmHaha ill probably be up that late tonight!
02:00.02fatoslast night i stayd until 6 am and slept only 2 hours
02:00.08dixonmmso much research to do and so little time!
02:00.18fatosi was writing a broing essay on linguistic nativisim
02:00.19MatthewWilkesIt's funny because we're all doing it.
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02:00.46MatthewWilkesfatos: That doesn't sound boring at all!
02:00.50JayJaymiresRight I wish it was longer
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02:01.01dixonmmI wish they posted the accepted projects sooner
02:01.14fatosi dont i just couldnt get myself to enjoy it maybe my brain cells where numb
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02:01.28MatthewWilkesfatos: May I ask what uni you're at?
02:01.32dixonmmits crazy how much is out there and just trying to find something that your qualified for is like finding a needle in a hay-stack
02:01.45fatosKings College London
02:02.07JayJaymiresIt is sort of chaotic I must agree
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02:09.37nico_le_terriblebye all
02:09.47fatosbye nico
02:09.51fatosgood luck
02:10.00nico_le_terribleyou too :p
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02:21.26fatosbye all from me... and good luck with you work
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02:25.38MatthewWilkes!timeline
02:25.38socinfo"timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline
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02:37.25barbiDo i get to specify preference of organizations when applying to multiple organizations?
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02:38.11MatthewWilkesbarbi: By talking to them
02:38.38armabarbi: if you are lucky enough to be wanted by multiple orgs, there will be a conflict resolution step later, where everybody works it out such that you're happy.
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02:51.06hugo_brMatthewWilkes, you said to submit the application early and often, right?! If I click on submit, what happens? the org receives my app and then I can edit that?
02:51.16MatthewWilkeshugo_br: Yes
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02:51.22hugo_brthanks
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02:57.31iammiscI'm trying to register for GSoC as a student, but I don't have any one specific uni right now (it could be one of three). But on the registration sheet, they want to know exactly which one. what should I do?
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03:00.16purvagIs it ok to contact mentor with email directly without giving proposal ?
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04:00.38Ionic_GrooveDid the deadline for student applications change or was it always April 9th?
04:01.19jcreighIonic_Groove: AFAIK, it has always been April 9th.
04:01.26MatthewWilkesscgtrp: This might sound weird, but has anyone ever told you a recursive bedtime story?
04:01.37MatthewWilkeswas reading the qdb earlier, nick looks very familiar
04:01.42scgtrpMatthewWilkes: yes
04:01.51MatthewWilkeshehe
04:01.57MatthewWilkesbad sign that I recognised that!
04:02.12scgtrphehe
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04:05.22Ionic_GrooveOh, for some reason I thought it was the third.
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05:04.57iammisccan i make a proposal to more than one mentoring organization?
05:05.44Catfish_Manyes
05:05.47SukhEYes. You can sumbit up to 20 proposals.
05:06.04SukhE(Though don't)
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05:09.42iammiscdo i rank proposals? what if both are accepted?
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05:11.47socinfo"logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc
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05:13.54pogo11iammisc: I was asking myself the same question, I found http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-discuss/browse_thread/thread/c271e440d78c871a#
05:14.00iammisck cool
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05:14.47pogo11I'm still curious if you get any more info, because I have one prefered choice, and another one that would still be interesting, but I don't know if I should apply for my second one or not...
05:15.11JayJaymiresYou should apply for all that interest you
05:15.31JayJaymiresIf by some chance two projects do select you there will be ways to deal with it
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05:15.38pogo11And worst case scenario, you get your second choice?
05:16.18JayJaymiresExactly It's better to be wanted by 2 then not wanted because you held back
05:16.31pogo11Other question: is it seen as something bad to apply for more than one organization?  Won't they think that you're not REALLY interested?
05:16.47skbohra_pogo11: not exactly i think
05:16.58JayJaymiresNo, They realize you're a student and that's why you can apply to so many
05:17.03dixonmmIMHO it means your more ambitious
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05:17.28JayJaymiresJust put forth the effort and make sure you show them you took the time to understand the project and present your proposal in the right way
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05:18.14JayJaymiresBe sure to talk with the projects through IRC or message boards or email
05:18.35JayJaymiresThey're really helpful themselves
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05:19.18pogo11Ok sure I will.  But in my proposal, I'm describing reasons why I picked THIS particular project...  So I kinda feel that if organization A reads why I picked organization B and vice-versa, they might think I'm full of it
05:19.19iammiscyeah
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05:26.25patrick42hhello
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05:37.48patrick42hwhat is a project proposal supposed to look like?
05:38.04patrick42hi was not able to find a specific description
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05:39.09patrick42hbtw, i'm an undergrad trying to get into GSOC
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05:41.21MatthewWilkespatrick42h: Most organisations have a template they like you to fill in
05:42.30tgalalI don't understand the mentors part. Do I find and choose a mentor for my proposed project, or a mentor selects the project. And what's the role of mentor?
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05:45.45patrick42hthanks MatthewWilkes
05:46.22pogo11When you submit the proposal, you have a choice to make it public or not
05:46.27pogo11What does it do exactly?
05:46.47pogo11Do the mentoring organizations have access to your proposal if you didn't make it public?
05:47.06pogo11Do you have to check that box so that your application actually goes throught?
05:47.28Catfish_Manno it means any student or mentor can see it
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05:50.02anddamhello
05:51.25dixonmmhowdy
05:55.05tgalaldo I have to find mentors myself for my projects?
05:55.15scgtrpno, the organization selects them
05:55.42tgalalok thanks
06:06.45patrick42his it okay to apply if a project seems beyond my current skill level?
06:07.04patrick42hmany of the project ideas seem pretty advances but exciting
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06:08.21kblinls
06:08.25kblindammit
06:08.28kblintoo early
06:08.33kblinmorning btw
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06:14.23anddamwell not _too_ early
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06:18.19rman!next
06:18.19socinfo"next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC.
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06:38.22kblinhehe, using lzma to compress a couple of gigs worth of blast databases is a tad slow :)
06:39.11Dark_Shikarihah, lzma, slow?  try paq8 ;)
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06:41.04ojwbuses rot13 for fast compression - it doesn't often compress by much, but it's quick
06:41.56kblinojwb: hm, I actually rather spend the time on compressing than on waiting for that stuff to download to my home pc
06:43.50kblinah, shoot, I thought my beagleboard was fixed by adding that cap, but it doesn't seem to have helped much :/
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07:08.19DNilhi all. i have a question about application dates. suppose if i submit an application today with the abstract of the project & if i decide to add my implementational details later , then do i hav to do it within april 9? or is it allowed to do so upto april 20, including the interim period?
07:08.36dhaun!edit
07:08.36socinfo"edit" is You can submit your application in early and edit it up until the deadline. Once the deadline passes, you cannot edit it. Instead, leave comments.
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07:08.56dhaunheh, doesn't mention the date - you can edit it until April 9
07:09.15dhaunafter that, you can only leave comments
07:09.44DNilok.that helps. thanks a lot.
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07:14.20shreyasany eg propasals out there, so i get some ides
07:14.23shreyasidea*
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07:16.41dhaunsearch and ye shall find :)
07:17.04dhaunDrupal has some guidelines and a sample here: http://drupal.org/node/756878
07:17.29dhaunbut check with what your org expects from you
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08:18.51patrick42hhello people
08:19.19patrick42hi am still very unclear on how to apply
08:19.27patrick42hi would like to apply to work with git
08:19.41patrick42hbut i cannot find any explicit instructions on the SOC or git sites
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08:22.11dhaunwhat exactly is not clear?
08:22.44dhaun"Full instructions for submitting your application can be found in our http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/userguide." - that's the second sentence on the GSoC homepage, with a helpful link to the user's guide ...
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09:01.31mypcHi everyone
09:01.42Achilleshi mypc
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09:21.00iamsumeshHi Everyone.
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10:33.26Swapnilfinally.. I found the right server
10:33.28Swapnil:)
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11:15.26gnathan87hi, question to clarify something... unfortunately GSoC this year runs over the end of my term, so I'm not going to be able to submit a proposal this year. Next year I'll be taking a gap year for a couple of reasons, and hence not formally enrolled on a course, but should have a place to resume studies at a university the year after. Will I be eligible to apply next year?
11:17.14kpreidgnathan87: overlapping with classes doesn't mean you're not allowed to this year
11:17.49gnathan87kpreid: it's the other way round unfortuantely - I'll need to be here to finish writing up and submit my masters project.
11:18.05gnathan87probably won't have enough time to do anything else simultaneously.
11:18.20kpreidah, I see, you're working this summer as opposed to just having a few days
11:18.28gnathan87yeah
11:19.32kpreidanyway, the question is whether the university considers you a enrolled/accepted at that time, not whether you're *taking classes*.
11:19.50skbohrayou need to produce a proof of enrollment
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11:20.57OliJGHow do you "produce" such proof? Scan your student card?
11:21.07gnathan87ah, ok, I wasn't sure what "enrolled" formally meant, I should be able to provide proof of acceptance, though
11:21.26infinity0scanned documents are fine yes
11:21.37infinity0there's more details on the website iirc
11:21.47bawrOliJG: The FAQ covers this. Basically that, or a transcript card. Doesn't have to be *the* official paper from your university.
11:22.32OliJGOh, while I'm at it... I don't have an internationally accessible phone #
11:23.03OliJGI sent in google's example number since it was required... but will I really be rejected unless I have what amounts to a land line?
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11:23.46ojwbOliJG: I think they want a way to contact you if you disappear totally
11:23.54bawrWait, what. Cell phones are internationally accessible too, aren't they? (And as long as you're clear about it, shouldn't be a problem.)
11:24.06anirvanaI am getting this error while submitting my gsoc proposal :"malformed start tag, at line 44, column 40".Can anyone help me out?
11:24.42ojwbOliJG: so a number for your parents or some relative will probably do, but it might be best to check
11:24.55bawrAsk in #melange. Try disabling TinyMCE, that could help, and check if you're HTML is not, in fact, malformed.
11:25.05OliJGojwb: Check where? They didn't give me any place to leave nots on the application form?
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11:25.14ojwbOliJG: by email...
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11:25.29anirvananobody responded at #melange :(
11:25.40ojwbor ask carols if she's on here when you are
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11:26.08bawranirvana: Try my other suggestions. :)
11:26.40OliJGI'm picturing a disconnection between the recipient of my email and the one who looks over the applications
11:26.47anirvanabawr : How to disable TinyMCE?
11:26.55OliJGbut I guess I'll just do what I can
11:27.02bawranirvana: There's an option on your profile page.
11:27.03ojwbOliJG: the gsoc team is one full-time person
11:27.21bawranirvana: In the place where you could change your name.
11:27.22OliJGgoes to look for the email
11:27.23ojwband a few others on their 20% time
11:27.27ojwbat least AIUI
11:27.34anirvanaok
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11:28.27ojwbOliJG: carols at google dot com
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11:29.08OliJGthanks
11:30.24anirvanabawr : Are you sure there is any such option on profile page?I can't find it!
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11:31.02dhaunanirvana: User (self) > Edit Profile > Disable tinymce
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11:39.33Warenyo
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11:40.08skbohra!timeline
11:40.08socinfo"timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline
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11:40.48skbohraah its 23 days before results
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12:15.51drecutecan googleapp projects be submitted to gsoc?
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12:22.39mlankhorstdrecute: Only existing projects, not new ones
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12:23.47drecutemlankhorst: do u mean existing googleapp projects that can be extended?
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12:26.30mlankhorst!faq > drecute
12:26.30socinfoError: "faq" is not a valid command.
12:26.33mlankhorst!faq
12:26.34socinfo"faq" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs
12:28.04drecutemlankhorst: i couldn't see anything related to my question in the faq, so i decided to come here
12:29.11mlankhorstdrecute: You need to participate with an existing organization
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12:31.08drecutemlankhorst: but i aint a student. My question is related to my organization as a mentoring organization
12:31.38mlankhorstOw in that way
12:32.44mlankhorstif its useful to ha
12:32.51Upthorndrecute: mentoring organization applications are closed for this year. They were open from March 8 to March 12
12:33.18mlankhorsti think he means one of the students applied with a proposal to write a googleapp
12:33.46UpthornOh
12:33.54Upthornhuh.
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12:34.24ajuonlineany networking experts here, o.O
12:34.39ajuonlineis trying to setup his home networking with Wall mount of RJ45
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12:34.43drecuteUpthorn: i know it is closed
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12:34.58drecuteUpthorn: but wouldn't it be better if i get informed
12:35.15drecuteUpthorn: so that we can be prepared for upcoming years
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12:35.38mlankhorstI dont think that it would be explicitly excluded
12:36.01Upthornthere is a requirement that all projects be free and open source
12:36.52Upthornbut I think you have to really make a good case as to why your organization should be allowed to participate
12:37.06anirvanabawr , dhaun : even disabling tinymce doesn't help
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12:37.32drecuteUpthorn: yea, we'll think that through
12:37.52drecuteUpthorn: but i'm glad it's possible
12:38.36Upthornand if no student applies for your organization, there is a good chance that it will not be accepted a second time.
12:39.24drecuteUpthorn: since my organization has gone google, more custom app requests has been the order of the day
12:39.36drecuteUpthorn: we hope they will
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12:40.13mlankhorst<PROTECTED>
12:40.24mlankhorstwell see
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12:42.43mlankhorstdrecute: what organization though?
12:43.14drecutemlankhorst: it's a technology company
12:43.37mlankhorstI just want a name
12:43.45drecutemlankhorst: ah
12:43.51drecutemlankhorst: opevel
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12:44.31drecutemlankhorst: www.opevel.com
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12:46.57x`so what is the usual choice for the public name? are most of you going with First Last?
12:47.05x`or some pseudonym
12:49.42ajuonlinei use my irc name
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12:51.04mlankhorstdrecute: probably not a good match :)
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12:51.37drecutemlankhorst: how do u mean
12:51.55drecutemlankhorst: that we might not get through?
12:52.46mlankhorstyeah, it's for open source projects, for example www.kernel.org , not that you have some cheap labor working for you
12:53.08mlankhorstthere has to be a community
12:53.47drecutemlankhorst: u are jugding the whole thing just by a link
12:54.23drecutemlankhorst: we have a community project running under opevel
12:54.24yf_when I kick  accepting applications in website  http://socghop.appspot.com/site/home/site I receive an error as: "You cannot become a Student because you are already participating in this  program".
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12:54.44mlankhorstdrecute: link that then, here it just seems like a consulting company
12:55.02drecutemlankhorst: yea
12:55.14kblinyf_: did you already sign up as a student?
12:55.22mlankhorstand that's not what gsoc is for :)
12:55.33drecutemlankhorst: i'll do that, but not now. I'm here to get all the info i need
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12:55.51drecutemlankhorst: and i'm glad u are here to help
12:56.04bawrIt's better to read the FAQ to get all the info you need. Just saying. :)
12:56.13kblinx`: I use my real name
12:56.33bawrx`: Real name here.
12:56.50kblinyf_: please don't msg me if this is stuff that can be discussed in the channel
12:57.04x`kblin, bawr, that's what i went with, thanks
12:57.33ajuonlineargh. this jack doesnt have colour combinations. cant figure out which one is pin #1
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12:59.49kblinyf_: you're still using msg
13:00.27kblinyf_: anyway, if you already signed up as a student, you should be able to apply for projects
13:01.14codestasherkai == kblin , right ?
13:01.34ajuonlineright
13:01.34mlankhorsthe is
13:01.38kblincodestasher: yeah, just that kai is my irc client at work that I forgot to shut down :)
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13:02.36codestasheryeah, you already told me that
13:02.45codestasheri was cross checking )
13:02.47codestasher:)
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13:03.36mlankhorstdrecute: also, 'open 2 more business' the 2 was the first thing I looked at when I saw that site ;)
13:04.09drecutemlankhorst: meaning...
13:04.48drecutemlankhorst: what does it depict to u
13:04.54ajuonlinethe wall mount side of the jack is called the female side right/
13:04.59ajuonline?
13:05.19mlankhorstthe hole is female, pin is male, easy to remember
13:05.21Wolf_OSGeoajuonline: yes
13:05.31Wolf_OSGeomlankhorst: indeed
13:05.47Wolf_OSGeothat goes for all connectors
13:06.17Wolf_OSGeousb, rs-232, Rj-45 etc
13:06.18ajuonlineso I need to swap the wiring? i guess. one end is 568B with RJ45 Jack. the other end comes to my wall mount, which is female
13:06.50ajuonlinehttp://www.greatsys.com/images/cables/cat5_cross_100_both.gif
13:06.52mlankhorstajuonline: I think you should really try www.google.com
13:07.14ajuonlineyea, this wall mount doesnt have labels
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13:08.20ajuonlinejust has L1, L2, L3, L4 cant figure out which is pin #1 - 8,
13:08.21ajuonlinenvm.
13:09.06Wolf_OSGeoleftmost when you look at the jack as it goes into the plug is 1
13:09.29Wolf_OSGeoajuonline: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TIA/EIA-568-B
13:10.15Wolf_OSGeojust realized it can be the other way araiund, depending on where the clip is
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13:11.22x`I'm a Slovenian, who is currently in London (month long vacation). Will Google send me anything vital to my mail address in the mean time and should I supply the London mail address?
13:11.28ajuonlineWolf_OSGeo: erm i know. http://twitpic.com/1cufxv this is what i see
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13:11.47ajuonlinethe female/wall mount
13:12.03mlankhorstx`: Well not in the past few years, though you will miss out on the surprise of the yearly starting present :)
13:13.06Wolf_OSGeoajuonline: see http://www.ablecables.com.au/568avb.htm
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13:13.38x`mlankhorst: hhehe, i will use my brother's (he lives with me in Slovenia) genuine excitement as a measure of surprise, for the time being :)
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13:14.40Wolf_OSGeoajuonline: looks like you have a lot of choises :S
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13:15.33ajuonlineWolf_OSGeo: honestly, all that i have seen, and know. its just that the wall mount itself, its hard to identify which side is first and which is 1->8
13:15.37ajuonlinei tried all combinations :P
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13:15.57x`second q, i am one year away from graduation, and our school system is a bit different than in the US .. should I select undergrad, even though our terminology differs?
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13:17.05Wolf_OSGeoajuonline: I feel your pain...
13:17.45muzPayneGSoChi guys
13:17.52muzPayneGSoCis anybody online?
13:18.28dhaunx`: I *think* those are only for statistics anyway - pick the closest match?
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13:19.03Wolf_OSGeomuzPayneGSoC: nop, just us bots here :P
13:19.16muzPayneGSoCok
13:19.25muzPayneGSoCi have one question
13:19.25Wolf_OSGeomuzPayneGSoC: kidding ;)
13:19.33muzPayneGSoCi know...
13:19.45x`thanks dhaun, that's what I thought
13:19.53Wolf_OSGeo!ask
13:19.53socinfo"ask" is Don't ask to ask, just ask. Meta-questions lead to meta-answers and wasted time.
13:19.55muzPayneGSoCdo you post anything other than to GSoC page?
13:20.11muzPayneGSoCbecause i want to join some project
13:20.18muzPayneGSoCand they dont have forum
13:20.23muzPayneGSoCor irc
13:20.29Wolf_OSGeodo they have a mailing list?
13:20.32muzPayneGSoCso i send mail only to mentor
13:20.34muzPayneGSoCnope
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13:20.50Wolf_OSGeoand you got no reply?
13:21.25Wolf_OSGeohow long ago did you send email? Remember that they are probably doing this in their spare time, and it is Easter now
13:21.29x`dhaun: eh, sorry, I found it in the user's guide for melange now, sorry about that :)
13:21.38Wolf_OSGeoso they might not be in a possition to reply
13:22.03muzPayneGSoCyes i know
13:22.13muzPayneGSoCbut student should write an proposal
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13:22.23Wolf_OSGeomuzPayneGSoC: nothing technical is going to stop you from submitting a proposal
13:22.49muzPayneGSoCyes, I know, but further talk will be good
13:22.50Wolf_OSGeoso write te proposal, submit it to Melange and send an email to the mentors asking for feedback
13:22.57Wolf_OSGeothat's what I'd do
13:22.59muzPayneGSoCok and you are students, or mentors, or?
13:23.07Wolf_OSGeois a mentor/admin
13:23.20muzPayneGSoCok
13:23.34muzPayneGSoCand Melange is???
13:23.46Wolf_OSGeo!melange
13:23.46socinfo"melange" is http://code.google.com/p/soc/
13:24.11Wolf_OSGeoit is the system which runs the soc site
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13:24.53muzPayneGSoCsure
13:24.55muzPayneGSoCok thanks
13:25.06muzPayneGSoCsorry for stupid questions
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13:25.25muzPayneGSoCbut I was last 2 weeks abroad so I hane no much time left
13:25.48Wolf_OSGeomuzPayneGSoC: you'd better hurry then!
13:29.27JayJaymires•Wolf_OSGeo• Which ideas will you be mentoring if you don't mind me asking?
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13:32.51Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: it depends. I'm not targetting any specific idea, but my interests in GRASS grass are generalization, cartography and related subjects
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13:34.21Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: Also I'm planning on mainly admining, but will mentor if there is something very interesting and/or need
13:34.23JayJaymires•Wolf_OSGeo• have you mentored previous summers as well?
13:34.31JayJaymiresAh I see
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13:34.47Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: yes, I have mentored from 2007 to 2009
13:35.13JayJaymiresAll your mentees work out well?
13:35.20Wolf_OSGeoI had two students the first year and one student in 2008 and 2009
13:35.23hugo_brdoes everybody here who sent student applications have detailed the timeline work on project? for example: from day X to day Y I will do Z
13:35.26Wolf_OSGeoyes they all passed
13:36.07JayJaymiresHugo I'm planning on creating rough timelines for my proposals
13:36.17Wolf_OSGeohugo_br: as a mentor I'm quite ok with on week X i plan to ...
13:36.21Wolf_OSGeotimelines are good
13:36.29Wolf_OSGeobut they are only plans
13:37.08JayJaymiresWolf were the students you mentored pretty knowledgable before the summer?
13:37.36hugo_brthat's because the project I want to participate doesn't have well defined gsoc goals, the mentors said something like: "the student will work with us", like fixing issues, improving win support and etc.. not exactly pre-defined tasks
13:37.44Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: knowledgeable about what? GIS? No, but they were pretty good at programming
13:39.05JayJaymiresOk good the reason I asked is because I'm pretty knowledgable about programing but not so much GIS
13:39.53Wolf_OSGeohugo_br: you need to define your goals if you are going to be successful. Doing a bit of this and a bit of that doesn't sound very good :S unless it's like our Zap-a-bug idea
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13:40.45hugo_brWolf_OSGeo: thanks.
13:41.12Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: Then you need to pick up on what GIS is. At least the basics.
13:41.47Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: which idea interests you?
13:42.27Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: it also depends a bit on the project/idea. Like our live disk, you don't really need to know what gis is
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13:44.13zubin71hey, quite a lot of friends have been asking me, and im not sure either. would it be right to call gsoc a summer intern?
13:45.05JayJaymiresI'm actually interested in several and am pooring over tons of information I only found out about this yesterday unfortunately
13:45.38Wolf_OSGeozubin71: Well in a way it is.
13:45.50zubin71Wolf_OSGeo: hmm... ok
13:46.15Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: ohh well. Let's start at the top. What programming language do you prefer?
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13:46.59JayJaymiresI like Java and C/C++
13:47.26JayJaymiresbut have experience with python and some others including assembly
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13:47.36pygiJayJaymires, there is no language like C/C++
13:47.40pygiplease don't call it like that
13:47.41pygithank you
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13:48.19JayJaymiresok
13:48.48Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: well. which is your favorite
13:49.00Wolf_OSGeowhen you dream, in what language is that?
13:49.03zubin71pygi: there`s this interview with Bjarne Stroustup in which he says the exact same thing; duno if you have read it. :)
13:49.14pygizubin71, link me up, I didn't
13:49.16JayJaymiresC++
13:49.25zubin71pygi: just a sec
13:50.26Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: well then GDAL and Quantum GIS is what you probably should focus on
13:50.45Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: do you like to program midleware or guis more?
13:51.01kblinahrg
13:51.18pygikblin, woke up one the wrong leg? :D
13:51.28Wolf_OSGeokblin: stepped on a lego?
13:51.31JayJaymiresmiddleware
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13:52.07Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: well then GDAL is your friend ;) And possibly GRASS too. Depending on what you want to do
13:52.10kblinno, trying to get navit to use my marco polo rout planning maps
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13:52.19Wolf_OSGeoGRASS is C but some modules are C++
13:52.31kblinand it's not even pointing north at the moment
13:52.38Wolf_OSGeoouch!
13:52.54JayJaymiresI think I must have looked over GDAL
13:53.07kblinah, there we go
13:53.29Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: well enjoy :D
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13:53.59JayJaymiresThanks for the direction
13:54.13kblinmeh
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13:55.09zubin71pygi: http://www2.research.att.com/~bs/bs_faq.html
13:55.22pygithanks zubin71
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13:55.45zubin71pygi: no probs; enjoy the read!
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13:56.20Wolf_OSGeoJayJaymires: any time. Looking forward to seeing what you pick :)
13:56.55kblinnot good, it crashes when entering an address :/
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14:07.28kblinmeh
14:08.46pygiWolf_OSGeo, trying to lure people to your org? :D
14:09.33Wolf_OSGeopygi: of course! :D
14:09.48pygiWolf_OSGeo, ay ay :D
14:09.53pygiwhat fun things do yoou have? :P
14:10.22Wolf_OSGeopygi: anything from live disks to web programming to low level algorithm programming
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14:10.27Wolf_OSGeowe have it all!
14:10.44pygiWolf_OSGeo, share the links so that I don't have to look it up?
14:10.46pygiI'm being lazy
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14:11.03Wolf_OSGeopygi: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010_IdeasQ
14:11.10Wolf_OSGeohttp://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010_Ideas
14:11.35Wolf_OSGeosilly computer added a Q...
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14:13.41Wolf_OSGeopygi: when you find something interesting let me know ;)
14:13.56pygiWolf_OSGeo, lemme bug you on PM
14:13.59Wolf_OSGeosee I'm already assuming he will find interesting stuff :P
14:14.17pygiWolf_OSGeo, do you need cd burning support anywhere? :D
14:14.39Wolf_OSGeopygi: possibly
14:14.39siri1Hi all..I have one question, Does any org or mentor knows how many proposals the student had made?
14:14.51Wolf_OSGeoif you have a cool idea we'd like to hear about it
14:16.29dhaunsiri1: no, they don't
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14:16.40dhaunwell, unless you send more than one to the same org :)
14:17.09dhaunwonders what the sinister plan behind that question is
14:17.28siri1dhaun: thank you..
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14:17.48siri1asks as it was new to her
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14:24.37kblinsiri1: you're aware though that it's better to send in two-three good ones than a dozen so-so ones, right?
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14:30.43siri1kblin: I heard that it is for introducing new ones to open source, my question can i allot some time for getting acquiantence to community in my timeline?
14:31.07yf_hi, when I kick  accepting applications in website  http://socghop.appspot.com/site/home/site I receive an error as: "You cannot become a Student because you are already participating in this  program".
14:31.21siri1kblin: will it effect my chance of getting selected??
14:31.31yf_i seem not participating in this program
14:31.32kblinsiri1: that's what the community bonding period is for
14:31.57yf_i sign in with my account and password
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14:35.47kblinyf_: have you filled out the student web form?
14:36.50yf_yes, I filled the form
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14:39.29kblinyf_: then you already are a student
14:39.50kblinjust sign in and you should see a link called "#  Submit your Student Proposal
14:39.52kblin"
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14:39.57kblinin the left hand menu
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14:42.02yf_kblin: yes, I think I am already a student
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14:43.22yf_sd: hi
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14:45.35yf_sundan: hi
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14:48.55yf_kblin: I still get that error message, It says I am participating this program. I have read the faqs, I don't find any message can help.
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14:51.17muzPayneGSoCany admin online???
14:51.49muzPayneGSoCi want to ask where aditional informations should be sent?
14:52.05muzPayneGSoClike personal details, etc.
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14:52.13dhaunnullpuppy: additional information about what?
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14:52.42dhaunyf_: so do you get that message when you try to submit a proposal? if so, try asking in #melange
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14:53.07dhaunbah, muzPayneGSoC: additional information about what?
14:53.14dhaunneeds more coffee
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14:54.21dhaunmuzPayneGSoC: are you talking about sending a proposal? if so, check the orgs application template - they usually state what they want to hear from you
14:54.31muzPayneGSoCyes
14:54.38muzPayneGSoCbut i want to send two proposals
14:54.49muzPayneGSoCone project has its own pages, forums
14:54.50yf_dhaun: no, when  I click the link "accepting applications" in website  http://socghop.appspot.com/site/home/site I receive an error as: "You cannot become a Student because you are already participating in this  program".
14:55.03muzPayneGSoCand they want some aditional informations
14:55.10muzPayneGSoCsecond dont have link to any website
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14:55.22muzPayneGSoCso only the proposal is enough?
14:56.26dhaunmuzPayneGSoC: a short introduction of yourself can't hurt
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14:57.25muzPayneGSoCyes, this i exactly what i want to add
14:57.28muzPayneGSoCok thanks
14:57.53muzPayneGSoCand is there any lat year successful participant???
14:58.18muzPayneGSoCi just want to ask how much time should I spend in reality with project
14:58.29muzPayneGSoCI have no other big plans for summer
14:58.46muzPayneGSoCi just want to ask, because one my friend told me he was working 4 hours per day
14:58.51muzPayneGSoCsome that 8
14:59.20muzPayneGSoCso I think it depends on difficulty of project?
14:59.49dhaunit's supposed to be your main focus during the summer (the FAQ has words to that effect), so more or less full-time
14:59.59dhaunbut yes, it also depends on the project
15:00.06dhaunif in doubt, ask the org :)
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15:01.30skbohrai think best way to know about someone is a simple google search of his/her name
15:02.05skbohramost org must be doing that
15:02.12yf_dhaun: no, when  I click the link "accepting applications" in website  http://socghop.appspot.com/site/home/site I receive an error as: "You cannot become a Student because you are already participating in this  program".
15:02.46dhaunskbohra: unless their name is "Carol Smith" ;-)
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15:03.22skbohradhaun: hehe
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15:04.18dhaunyf_: sorry, I've never seen Melange from a student's side so I don't even know about that link
15:04.33skbohrayf_: did you participate last year ?
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15:05.03yf_skbohra: no, I did not participate last year
15:05.49skbohrayf_: make sure you are trying to be student there and not mentor etc
15:06.34kblinyf_: can you go to http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student_proposal/list_orgs/google/gsoc2010/your_linkid_here ?
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15:07.04kblinskbohra: fails for a lot of people I know
15:07.39thebolthi all
15:07.45skbohrathebolt: hey
15:08.08yf_skbohra: In my loggin page, I have "resign as a student" link in the lefthand, so I think I log as a student account
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15:13.37bawrWell, I have to admit I still fail the google test. All my name turns up is a short paper I wrote in a philosophy contest a few years ago.
15:14.06bawrAnd that's not even on the first page. :)
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15:14.31Ian_Cornemine returns my esug gsoc page :p
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15:15.42theboltgets page after page with himself.. mailinglists, webpages, other stuff.. :(
15:18.18bawrOne of these days I'll start a blog for my code and rants, and that's as far as I can get into this social networking quagmire.
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15:21.29kblinmeh
15:21.43kblinI don't know what problems people have with the gsoc web-app
15:21.50kblinthe student interface is pretty obvious
15:22.02darkipit adds to the spacing EVERY time I edit my proposal
15:22.04darkipvery irritating
15:22.12kdaksdarkip
15:22.20kdaksyes that is a problem even i face
15:22.32darkipIt's bearable, but still wastes time
15:22.32pygikblin, its surely better then what we had before, so I won't complain, but its hardly perfect :)
15:22.34kblinok, that's know
15:22.44kdaksi edited the html but still the same  result
15:22.46pygis/then/than
15:23.00kblinpygi: yeah, but how hard can it be to find that silly submit your student proposal link?
15:23.07pygikblin, its not hard
15:23.09darkipAlso, the lack of being able to insert tables
15:23.21darkipit's obviously easy to do them using HTML, but it should need to come to that
15:23.39darkip*shouldn't
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15:24.55kblindarkip: patches welcome
15:25.18darkipkblin: hehe, if I had time I would
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15:25.31darkipfinding the time to get a proposal together has been hard enough
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15:26.22dhaundarkip: combine the two and apply for Melange :P
15:26.37darkiphah
15:26.46darkipI've already applied for StatusNet
15:26.47kblinyou can switch off tinymce in your profile settings and just write plain html in there
15:27.05kblinI don't see why you'd need a fancy wysiwyg editor anyway
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15:28.24thebolti don't really see that html adds anything needed really.. when i reviewed gsoc submissions it was content, not form, that mattered ;)
15:28.37kblinright
15:28.47skbohramakes sense
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15:29.00kblinbut you need <br> or <p>...</p> to make html readable
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15:29.09theboltheaders is easy to make by just having an empty line and then a word or tow by itself to show it was a header
15:29.52kblinor just <pre> plain text proposal here </pre>
15:30.29thebolt:-)
15:30.57kblinbut I agree, if you have the nicest looking proposal ever, but don't know anything about the proposal you're submitting and have no clue about the timeline, you're not going to make it
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15:31.46darkipthe only thing I used html for was a table for my schedule
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15:33.21safal_soniwhen will we know that the organisations have accepted our proposal?
15:33.23skbohrai gave a link to pdf version of my app with all fancy colorful stuff :D
15:33.39skbohrasafal_soni: timeline?
15:33.45skbohra!timline^
15:33.45socinfoError: "timline^" is not a valid command.
15:33.49skbohraheh
15:34.04safal_soni9 april
15:34.11skbohrasocinfo: 26th april
15:34.11socinfoError: "26th" is not a valid command.
15:34.20kdaks!timeline
15:34.21socinfo"timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline
15:34.26skbohraneed to have some rest
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15:36.05safal_soniskbohra what`s ur plans this summer?
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15:37.11safal_soniUnhammer:plans?
15:37.47Unhammermy plans for the summer?
15:38.39safal_sonihttp://www.socg.appshot.com
15:40.15Unhammeridunno, maybe take a trip to delhi, visit some domain name squatters
15:41.41siri1kblin: where to start the timeline in the proposal we(students) submit ?April 26 or from May 22, which one is better?
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15:52.45bawrChoose the one you plan to plan from. ;)
15:52.52bawrApril 26 here, if that helps.
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16:03.17skbohrasafal_soni: planning to go to himalyas ;)
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16:18.00safal_soniwell all the best
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16:19.20skbohrasafal_soni: so what you planning :)
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16:22.00safal_soni<skbohra>:giving university exams when all my neighborhood kids play
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16:22.58safal_soniskbohra: what for gsoc-10
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16:28.16g0If I fill out the proposal form and don't check Make public that is effectively like saving a draft right?
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16:30.15g0right? anyone?
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16:30.24dhaung0: "Make public" makes it public, i.e. visible to anyone who knows the URL
16:30.28pogo11no its not
16:30.35g0Thanks
16:30.47pogo11mentors will still be able to see it
16:31.02g0but I do think that there should be a way to save drafts :)
16:31.18dhaunit's a draft until April 9 ...
16:31.21dhaun!edit
16:31.22socinfo"edit" is You can submit your application early and edit it up until the deadline (April 9). Once the deadline passes, you cannot edit it. Instead, leave comments.
16:31.25pogo11I used a .txt file :)
16:31.50smtmspogo11, not .html? :-)
16:32.13g0pasting it to abiword looks all weird
16:32.39pogo11You're right, it would have been better.  Or in fact, to stay in the spirit of the event, I could have used a Google Doc
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16:33.00xnoxI used a wiki
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16:33.07xnoxas my Orgs wants to
16:33.18xnoxand then copied web-page and pasted into the application
16:33.32xnoxlooks nice cause Gsoc form supports pasting rich-text
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16:34.45iamsumeshHi everyone.
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16:51.56kimeltomorning!
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17:11.08siri1Abhinav1: hi
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17:11.24Abhinav1siri1: hello
17:12.29*** join/#gsoc Abhinav1 (~Abhinav@unaffiliated/abhinav1)
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17:13.12siri1Abhinav1: Is this from bikaner???
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17:14.07rajatdefine this
17:15.23Abhinav1siri1: what?
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17:15.35rajat!this
17:15.36socinfoError: "this" is not a valid command.
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17:17.20siri1Abhinav1: nthing, Are you from bikaner?
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17:18.11skbohrasiri1: yeah
17:18.58skbohrasiri1: so as me :)
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17:19.48siri1skbohra: yeah..i still remember you...
17:20.02siri1friend of abhinav,right?
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17:20.33Abhinav1siri1: right
17:21.33siri1skbohra,Abhinav1 : where to start the timeline in the proposal we(students) submit ?April 26 or from May 22, which one is better?
17:22.16skbohrasiri1: which suits you best
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17:26.37siri1skbohra: I want to know whether the things like getting the trunk and using svn which are new for a newbie can be written in proposal?
17:27.28Abhinav1siri1: It should not in proposal
17:27.55smtmssiri1, you can learn a lot during the community-bonding period
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17:29.54siri1smtms: community bonding period is after getting selectd n before coding starts, you mean in this time??
17:30.03smtmssiri1, yes
17:30.10siri1Abhinav1: ok
17:30.13skbohrasiri1: just put that in timeline
17:30.26siri1smtms: ok...thank you
17:30.29skbohrathat you will use that time for learning these
17:31.22siri1skbohra: k..then i will put it from april26 to may22
17:31.40skbohrasounds good enough
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17:32.32siri1skbohra: Thank you very much
17:32.40skbohranp
17:33.23siri1:)
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17:37.15Fatoswhere do you submit your proposals again anyone .... do you do that through mailing lists... !???//////
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17:38.04Catfish_ManFatos: ...the gsoc webapp
17:38.20dhaunFatos: in the end, you submit it through the website - check with your org if they want to see drafts first
17:38.22Catfish_Manalso please, if you abuse punctuation like that, people will think you're stupid. So don't do that around mentors
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17:41.36FatosCatfish_Man, where excactly in the gsoc webapp?
17:42.00Catfish_ManFatos: if you can't find it, you can't apply for gsoc
17:43.08Catfish_ManI suggest reading the manual, for example
17:43.09Fatosand if you can't help me you shouldn't be respoding to me, should you ?
17:43.27mlankhorstFatos: There is a minimum age of 18 to apply :)
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17:43.51Fatosthat's so funny. :P
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17:45.08bawrSee, this is why I like this channel.
17:45.15bawrIt makes even me feel smart. ;)
17:45.59rajatpoints Fatos to the FAQ
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17:47.01Fatosbawr, why? how do you usually feel ?
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17:47.22rajat!troll
17:47.22socinfoError: "troll" is not a valid command.
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17:47.34mlankhorstoooo thats painful :}
17:47.45bawr:x
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17:48.04Fatos:P
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17:50.15bawrBut to address your question, Fatos... I *usually* think that I'm not special in that I tend to read my manuals and FAQs. ;P
17:50.44mlankhorstthis is enough for now
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17:51.19bawrRight'o.
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18:03.43FatosDo orgs consider ideas from students more then the ideas presented in their lists?
18:04.10Catfish_Manin my experience, no, less
18:04.15Catfish_Manunless they're really good ideas
18:04.36thiagoin mine, it depends on how well you write the proposal
18:04.41thiagonot from whom the idea came
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18:05.08Catfish_Manthiago: I've found that a large % of student-proposed ideas are either overambitious or bad ideas, but there are some real gems
18:05.22thiagothat's a good point
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18:08.54Fatosi think that if choosing from an idea from a list would be less promising due to the fact that many students could choose that same idea an the competition would become more obvious
18:09.06Catfish_Mansure
18:09.16rajati would agree with Catfish_man. i'm a student and if i were to propose an idea of my own i would have trouble deciding how much should i put in in order to dazzle
18:09.23bawrBasically, you want to talk about your idea first, and see what response you get, either way.
18:09.23Catfish_Manit's a tradeoff: less competition, but you have to be very sure your idea is both good and feasible
18:09.46thiagorajat: it's not about dazzling
18:09.57thiagomake a proposal for 3 months of work that _you_ can accomplish
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18:10.07rajatbut for that reason most mentors suggest posting your idea in the forum and wait for review
18:10.08thiagothen explain why it's good to do and why you should be the one doing it.
18:10.14mlankhorstpersonally I think the best proposals have been written by students that came up with their own ideas
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18:11.14dhaunitems on the ideas list are usually things that the orgs want to see implemented
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18:11.37dhaunstudent ideas can be good but often suggest things that the org may not really be interested in
18:11.44thiagoor random ideas to fill the gap
18:11.46dhaun(in my experience, FWIW)
18:11.50thiagonote also that most ideas lists are wikis
18:11.52thiagoso anyone can edit them
18:12.23Wolf_OSGeoit depends on the org. Some project with innovative software will probably be more open to student ideas
18:12.41Catfish_ManWolf_OSGeo: uh, quite the opposite. Orgs with innovative software *have* good ideas :P
18:12.45Catfish_Manby definition
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18:13.24Wolf_OSGeowell sure, but they also attact those students who like to come up with out of the box ideas
18:13.44Catfish_Manperhaps
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18:13.50Wolf_OSGeowhile more conservative projects might prefer ideas from their ideas list
18:14.06Catfish_Manmost of the student proposed ideas adium got were just "voice and video chat!", which we removed from our list due to it being too hard
18:14.15Catfish_Manbut there was one guy who proposed *six* ideas not from the list
18:14.16Catfish_Manall awesome
18:14.22Wolf_OSGeocool!
18:14.28mlankhorstexactly ;P
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18:17.14Fatosthen it comes down to time, if i have an idea i shoud do something ( programming, or report) that i'm already doing something right ?
18:17.20Wolf_OSGeoCatfish_Man: unit tests?!? are you serious :P ;)
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18:18.04mlankhorstCatfish_Man: depends though, for a single protocol doing voice + video chat might not be so hard
18:18.15Catfish_Manmlankhorst: this isn't theoretical
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18:18.21Catfish_ManVV is the rock that students run aground on
18:18.25Catfish_Manyear after year after year
18:18.31mlankhorstah oke
18:19.27Wolf_OSGeoused to work with IMPS XMPP and SIP protocols. Man it was hard at times. There are a lot of pitfalls
18:20.14mlankhorstthought for jabber - as long as you dont handle nat - it would be pretty straightforward with a few api calls to libjingle
18:20.26Catfish_Manyou have to handle nat :P
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18:20.32Catfish_Manalso libjingle is pretty junky last I checked
18:20.44Catfish_ManWolf_OSGeo: it's trickier for us because you have to take linux-ish libraries, and then get them hooked up to osx-ish UI layer
18:20.56Catfish_Manwhich is doable, but requires broad knowledge
18:21.29Wolf_OSGeoCatfish_Man: ouch.. We only had the snags of windows and symbian, thus we did almost everything ourselves
18:21.49Wolf_OSGeofrom scratch
18:21.53Catfish_ManWolf_OSGeo: well, parts of it are good. Once you have your frames as a texture on a CoreAnimation layer, a lot of stuff happens for free
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18:22.04Catfish_Manhardware acceleration, transforms, easy nonblocking display, etc...
18:22.18Wolf_OSGeocool
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19:03.16x`so what's all this "make public" juju?
19:03.36Catfish_Manit makes it public
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19:06.13dhaunI think students in past years asked for this, so they could show their proposal to others (who are not mentors)
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19:10.15x`oh, thanks for the explanation. I thought it had a function similar to "publish", so that when you're finished fiddling around, you just check make it public and your mentors see it.
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19:11.12x`it's not mentioned in the user's guide, i wouldn't ask otherwise :)
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19:12.20Catfish_Manah, it should be :/
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19:12.26Catfish_Mansomeone should fix that
19:12.55x`so that leaves one more thing, any tips for where I can upload the source code to? is pastebin the de facto standard?
19:13.12Catfish_ManI believe google code is the required location
19:13.18x`source code = previous work
19:13.23Catfish_Manoh, previous work
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19:13.41x`yeah, sorry for not making that clear
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19:13.43Catfish_Manum... dunno. set up a bitbucket account perhaps?
19:13.47Catfish_Manit's free
19:13.58x`i'm going to check it out, thanks
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19:19.46rohit123_I get an error on form submission for gsoc: Invalid XSRF token
19:20.03shuffle2why would you use bitbucket over googlecode? even for previous work, you can just setup a new repo...
19:20.51aramisquit
19:21.04thiagogives aramis a slash
19:21.21ajuonlinesteals the slash and runs
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19:21.50rohit123_I get an error on form submission for gsoc: Invalid XSRF token? has anyone got this error?
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19:26.00neXyonsomeone from google here?
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19:28.03neXyonis it possible to get a notification, when someone writes a comment to my proposal?
19:28.39Bzarrandom question, any freshmen hanging out here?
19:28.41dhaunneXyon: there should be a "subscribe to updates" button
19:30.09ubuntuselurBzar: i'm a freshman
19:30.50Bzarubuntuselur: neat, I was just wondering
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19:34.03neXyondhaun: does that work for comments?
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19:34.30neXyondhaun: and how am I notified then? mail?
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19:46.22rohit123_As part of Gsoc submission should any code submissions be made in the proposal itself or on trac?
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19:48.35armarohit123_: whatever fits most naturally for the project. as long as your submission points to the code somehow, it should be fine.
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19:55.16schumamlcould someone please update the timeline asap to reflect the important changes to the application ranking schedule?
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19:55.32x`what changed?
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19:57.28schumamlslots are allocated on April 13 based on the number of applications
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19:58.08schumaml(either that or the mails from google are very ambiguous ;))
19:58.53armaschumaml: yeah, it sure does look like somebody is neglecting the fact that most proposals arrive on the last day (apr 9)
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20:01.39bawrWhat? Each org gets a number of slots based on the number of applications they had? So... whoever's into botnets and/or language processing gets 90% of the slots? ;)
20:01.49schumamlyep
20:02.04neXyonawesome :)
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20:02.54thiagoit's not the only criterion
20:03.06x`that wouldn't make sense
20:03.11bawrI disbelieve. If the DnD lingo isn't enough, let me try internet memes. Citation needed. :P
20:03.13thiagothe number of applications is an analog for the org's popularity
20:03.19x`all this talk about quality over quantity and then it would revert to quantity?
20:03.27thiagoGoogle usually uses the track record, the number of mentors and the number of slots requested
20:03.58bawrThe way someone explained the process two days ago - Klingon blood rituals - did not even mention the number of applications.
20:04.10x`hehe
20:04.16thiagopainsticks
20:04.50bawrWell, to be precise - "Klingon blood rituals" was just a short name, followed with an explanation. :)
20:13.55schumamlhm, we could even send a former bdsm slave to these rituals. not joking.
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20:28.19gigasoft1when i translate proposal on my language it means something like suggestion
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20:28.55gigasoft1socinfo, is proposal == application
20:28.55socinfoError: "is" is not a valid command.
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20:29.33gigasoft1socinfo, ?(proposal == application)
20:29.34socinfoError: "?(proposal" is not a valid command.
20:29.50gigasoft1hm
20:30.15dhaungigasoft1: you do realize you're talking to a bot, right?
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20:30.27gigasoft1hm, no
20:30.53smtmsgigasoft1, does anything about the meaning or translation bother you?
20:31.10gigasoft1i thought it was some coool programer?
20:31.13gigasoft1hm
20:31.15gigasoft1yes
20:31.23gigasoft1?(proposal == application)
20:31.43dhaunin the GSoC context - yes
20:31.48gigasoft1ok
20:31.53gigasoft1thanks, man
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20:38.50skelethello. what is about that "Major subject" field in the student registration form? I can't seem to figure out what to put there :-s
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20:40.16xiainxwhat are you majoring in?
20:40.19xiainxin school
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20:43.09skeletcomputer engineer, I believe
20:43.47xiainxyou believe?
20:44.00skeletactually subengineer
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20:44.22skeletthat's what I heard it will write on the diploma :)
20:44.28xiainxthen put that
20:44.37skeletokay, thank you
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21:14.17xiainxany suggestions as to how to get in contact with orgs that seem to be ignoring me???
21:15.04loupgaroublondxiainx, do you mean kernel.org?
21:15.04xiainxnope
21:15.04loupgaroublondok :)
21:15.04xiainx*other* organizations
21:15.04loupgaroublondok
21:15.43brikmail, visit their irc channel, forum?
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21:15.50xiainxdone done done
21:15.56xiainx:(
21:16.02brikbe patient?
21:16.24loupgaroublondxiainx, how long have you been waiting?
21:16.37xiainx~2 or 3 days for a few
21:16.42xiainxover a week for one or two
21:16.57brikit's easter, so people might be off work until tuesday
21:17.19xiainxyes, that's a good point
21:17.34bawrWhat org, out of curiosity?
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21:19.50xiainxwell, I'd rather not say
21:20.00xiainxthey might be listening!
21:20.36xiainxI'm not applying for them anymore, but Ubuntu has been kind of aloof
21:21.05loupgaroublondi'm debating with myself whether we should be transparent about which orgs are slow to respond
21:21.08loupgaroublondit really goes both ways
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21:36.51schumamlplease note that some orgs will start to look at proposals only after the application deadline
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21:43.27xiainxwell, if those same orgs are saying that they look for students to submit early and get feedback, then they're lying to themselves and the students...
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21:46.36mlankhorstmost of my projects proposals are first announced on mailng list so everyone can give feedback
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21:47.18bawrMy org of choice is pretty nice on this account... I just grabbed a mentor or two on their IRC and extracted some feedback. ;)
21:47.39bawrmlankhorst: Most? How many did you have this year?
21:48.12infinity0xiainx: are you implying there are such orgs?
21:48.33mlankhorstbawr: see mailing list? ;p
21:49.47bawrmlankhorst: But I don't remember who you're with. ;P
21:50.29Wolf_OSGeobawr: that's the way to go :)
21:50.36Wolf_OSGeoif they have people on IRC
21:50.40Wolf_OSGeonot all do
21:51.10mlankhorstbut not everyone is in the same timezone..
21:51.11xiainxinfinity0: I've seen a few organizations that say they want discussion, but are tough to reach
21:51.39freedrullim trying to discuss as much as possible now without getting flame
21:51.40freedrulld
21:51.47freedrullwith the organization im interested in
21:52.19bawrmlankhorst: I'm in GMT+1, they're in GMT+USA, but it can bbe done. :)
21:54.07Wolf_OSGeobawr: you mean GMT-USA :P
21:54.15bawrWolf_OSGeo: Same difference.
21:54.19Wolf_OSGeo;)
21:54.30Wolf_OSGeojust toying with ya. I'm tired.
21:54.52bawrHey, I got to make a slight pun, so I'm okay with this.
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22:09.22ruturaj!timeline
22:09.22socinfo"timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline
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22:17.51kblinmlankhorst: hey there
22:21.57mlankhorstnoon
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22:27.54kblinmlankhorst: I can't find the wine org homepage on melange, did that get lost?
22:29.42mlankhorstodd
22:30.19mlankhorstcan find it here though
22:31.05mlankhorsthttp://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/org/show/google/gsoc2010/wine
22:31.08mlankhorstWorksForMe(TM)
22:31.49kblinthat's the autogenerated one
22:32.21mlankhorstow
22:32.26kblinI'm talking about the one that leslie asked us to create, the one that shows the news feed and will show the accepted student's projects
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22:33.56mlankhorstill peek at it later
22:35.45mlankhorstbedtime here, nn
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22:40.52kblinyeah, here as well
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23:18.46killerchicken!timeline
23:18.47socinfo"timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline
23:21.23kimelto!next
23:21.24socinfo"next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC.
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23:23.43gigasoft1i need student proposal example, please.
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23:27.01gigasoft1i found it.
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23:31.36bawrgigasoft1: Want another one? :)
23:31.50gigasoft1of course
23:31.56gigasoft1is it a free?
23:32.09bawrOnly ~80% done, though.
23:32.11bawrhttp://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student_proposal/show/google/gsoc2010/bawr/t127006308673
23:32.31gigasoft1bawr, thanks
23:33.06bawrNo problem. If you have a great idea about making yours better because of this, do share the idea. ;)
23:35.38gigasoft1:)
23:36.46scgtrp"Did I mention the t-shirt? That alone can keep me motivated for months. :-)"
23:36.56scgtrpthat's great :D
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23:38.17bawrscgtrp: Your remarks about being a slacker in your proposal inspired me. :)
23:39.02bawrAnd if anyone wonders what's up with the RFC link, the Pydra guys linked that when they said that no matter what protocol we use, we should keep in touch. :)
23:39.04scgtrpsomeone actually did write up an application for that to the nmap mailing list on the 1st :D
23:39.22bawrHahaha.
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23:39.47hugo_bris there a public student proposal list?
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23:40.38bawrI don't think there is.
23:40.42scgtrpnot that i know of, but if you find one please give me the link
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23:42.47bawrAs nice as that is, I think it wouldn't be a good idea. We could see the advent of copy-paste proposals.
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23:45.43egns_afk!kde
23:45.43socinfoError: "kde" is not a valid command.
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23:45.49egns_afkit of course is.
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23:48.54Wolf_OSGeobawr: I like the style in your app :D relaxed, yet informative :)
23:49.16bawrWolf_OSGeo: Thank you. That's what I was going for.
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23:51.59Wolf_OSGeobawr: I even got what you want to do, even if you are missing the details, and I know next to nothing about pydra. :D Good job!
23:53.03bawrWell, this is the only app I'm placing, so I wanted to make it count. :)
23:54.45Wolf_OSGeo:)
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