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| 00:16.31 | LeoBH | !next |
| 00:16.31 | socinfo | LeoBH: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
| 00:17.24 | bahaa | most of the projects require much more than "basic programming skills" -.- |
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| 00:26.26 | asagarwal | hey |
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| 01:59.15 | zwj | hello,everyone |
| 01:59.19 | zwj | good morning |
| 01:59.20 | woozie | hi! |
| 01:59.32 | woozie | 03:00 in sweden, hehe :P |
| 01:59.56 | zwj | i have a problem when i look the link of list all accepted org |
| 02:00.19 | zwj | haha |
| 02:00.47 | zwj | there was some red content "To see the contents of this list you should enable Javascript." |
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| 02:01.04 | zwj | but i have already enable javescript |
| 02:01.22 | zwj | is there other link to see the accepted orgs |
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| 02:01.33 | Inc | ya it's the usuals who are in every year |
| 02:02.04 | woozie | this page you got problem with? http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2011 |
| 02:02.13 | zwj | yes |
| 02:02.29 | woozie | which brower are you using? |
| 02:02.33 | woozie | *browser |
| 02:02.57 | zwj | chrome , firefox all i have tried. it failed |
| 02:03.15 | asmeurer | !numapps |
| 02:03.15 | socinfo | asmeurer: "numapps" is 417 mentoring orgs applied and 175 were accepted this year. In 2010, 367 mentoring orgs applied and 151 were accepted; 5539 proposals were submitted by 3464 students, and 1026 were accepted |
| 02:03.29 | woozie | ouch. |
| 02:03.42 | woozie | restart and see if it works? :P |
| 02:03.54 | zwj | is there other link can see the accepted orgs? |
| 02:04.04 | zwj | i have restart many times |
| 02:04.24 | woozie | ok. dunno about some other list. I don't think there's one. |
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| 02:05.51 | zwj | ok, can you help me copy the name of organizations to some place i can access? |
| 02:05.51 | ojwb | Inc: there's about 50 new orgs this year actually |
| 02:07.35 | zwj | i was so Helpless about having no idea about what orgs accept the gsoc |
| 02:08.39 | woozie | zwj, can you test it this one works? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/455671/List%20all%20accepted%20organizations.htm |
| 02:10.25 | zwj | ok, it works . thank you very very very much .hehe |
| 02:10.38 | woozie | you're welcome^^ |
| 02:11.42 | zwj | hehe, now i can find the goodness, you are so kind. |
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| 02:45.22 | asagarwal | hi all |
| 02:45.36 | asagarwal | is there an irc channel for projects as well ? |
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| 02:47.06 | atagar | many projects have their own irc channels, if that's what you mean |
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| 02:50.03 | siddharth | should we directly talk to the mentoring organization for projects? |
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| 02:51.04 | daniloaf | siddharth sure |
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| 02:53.07 | xiluo | HOWTO IRC chat records? |
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| 02:55.19 | praveenkumar | xiluo: if you are using xchat then their is option for saving logs. |
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| 03:14.41 | xiluo | praveenkumar:thx |
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| 03:15.18 | xiluo | am using pidgin |
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| 03:18.15 | atagar | it has an option too |
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| 04:20.41 | namra | +read |
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| 04:34.55 | Vikash_ | Hello Everyone... I was interested in a debian project... |
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| 04:37.54 | Vikash_ | ??? |
| 04:38.56 | KylePan | hello~~it seems that many are just idle on..haha |
| 04:40.25 | Vikash_ | ha ha |
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| 04:43.29 | ojwb | !anyone |
| 04:43.30 | socinfo | ojwb: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here> |
| 04:43.34 | ojwb | Vikash_: ^^^ |
| 04:44.12 | Vikash_ | ojwb: ya... m istening |
| 04:44.23 | lbieber | I'm trying to add mentors but it keeps telling me that the id I am using is invalid. I thought this was their google email address or user name. How do I find the right id for the person I want to invite?? |
| 04:44.55 | ojwb | lbieber: ask them what their "linkid" is |
| 04:45.04 | ojwb | it's shown top right when they're logged in to melange |
| 04:45.12 | lbieber | ojwb: thanks! |
| 04:45.19 | ojwb | or if their name starts with "a" the autocomplete might help... |
| 04:46.01 | Vikash_ | ojwb: I am interested in few projects... so how should I get started in asking those ideas |
| 04:46.02 | ojwb | potential mentors can also send a request which you then OK |
| 04:46.33 | ojwb | Vikash_: look at the contact info for those orgs, and go and talk to them |
| 04:47.05 | ojwb | there's a random smattering of mentors and org admins here, but your chances of finding one awake are better in the orgs own channel |
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| 04:48.26 | ojwb | debian's channel is #debian-soc on oftc (i happen to know as i was involved with them last year) |
| 04:48.42 | Vikash_ | ojwb: are you a mentor??? |
| 04:49.36 | ojwb | yes, but not for debian this year |
| 04:49.55 | Vikash_ | there are few others too that I am interested in |
| 04:50.01 | Vikash_ | be right back in 5 min |
| 04:50.02 | Vikash_ | ... |
| 04:50.04 | Vikash_ | :) |
| 04:50.31 | littledo | ojwb, which org project will you be mentoring this year? |
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| 04:51.47 | sheen_drifter | i can't find this years org list ? |
| 04:52.02 | littledo | shadeslayer, http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2011 |
| 04:52.39 | ojwb | littledo: Xapian |
| 04:52.49 | littledo | i see |
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| 04:59.06 | sheen_drifter | anyone regarding freenet project ? |
| 04:59.26 | scorche | !anyone |
| 04:59.26 | socinfo | scorche: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here> |
| 04:59.32 | scorche | sheen_drifter: ^^ |
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| 05:01.13 | sheen_drifter | ##scorche okay i'll go specific now on ... thank u |
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| 05:16.31 | namra_ | can nyone plz tell me how to create a google melange link id |
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| 05:42.20 | anu_ | any admin over here? |
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| 05:48.44 | anu_ | hey lh... |
| 05:48.54 | anu_ | r u the admin or something? |
| 05:48.55 | lh | anu_: hello |
| 05:49.11 | lh | anu_: no. but if you have questions, i might be able to help. |
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| 05:49.23 | anu_ | ok... |
| 05:49.25 | anu_ | great |
| 05:49.47 | anu_ | tell me can a student participate on his own in GSoC |
| 05:49.57 | anu_ | i mean i do have an idea |
| 05:50.10 | anu_ | and i want somebody to mentor it.. |
| 05:50.21 | anu_ | so is it possible? |
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| 05:52.29 | anu_ | hey akashm |
| 05:52.48 | akashm1990 | yea? |
| 05:53.46 | anu_ | tell me, u know na i got an idea related to the plugin thing |
| 05:54.14 | akashm1990 | yes, but if you are talking about the subtitle thing, its already in VLC AFAIK |
| 05:54.31 | anu_ | yeah...i know |
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| 05:55.02 | anu_ | anyway, tell me is it possible to do a project in GSoC on an idividual basis? |
| 05:55.10 | anu_ | *individual |
| 05:55.17 | akashm1990 | as in, without a mentoring organisation? |
| 05:55.25 | atagar | anu_: You need to apply to a mentoring organization. |
| 05:55.40 | anu_ | akashm: yeah |
| 05:55.43 | akashm1990 | then, no you cant. You need a mentoring org |
| 05:55.53 | anu_ | hmmm.... |
| 05:56.02 | akashm1990 | there is an exception, but it doesnt really apply here |
| 05:56.03 | anu_ | big problem.. |
| 05:56.13 | scorche | anu_: the Google OSPO provides this, however you need to provide your own mentor and it has to be *really* good ;) |
| 05:56.17 | anu_ | what exception? |
| 05:56.25 | akashm1990 | what sorche said |
| 05:56.48 | anu_ | scorche : what is OSPO? |
| 05:56.56 | akashm1990 | but it needs to be academic/research oriented |
| 05:57.01 | scorche | open source programs office |
| 05:57.27 | anu_ | sorche : ohhh... |
| 05:57.40 | anu_ | anywaym, thanks guys :) |
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| 05:57.52 | anu_ | *anyway |
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| 05:58.50 | anu_ | hey anybody knows about lua? |
| 05:59.01 | scorche | plenty do, im sure... |
| 06:00.09 | anu_ | scorche: sorry? |
| 06:00.18 | akashm1990 | anu_, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lua_%28programming_language%29 and http://www.lua.org/ |
| 06:00.45 | scorche | anu_: i was giving a very generic answer to your very generic question... |
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| 06:01.10 | anu_ | akashm : i googled it, then even downloaded some books..but m not sure whether lua is used for plugin devlopment |
| 06:01.45 | akashm1990 | anu_, I think #videolan would be a better place to ask |
| 06:01.58 | scorche | this channel is not a general tech channel - it serves as a communication medium for the GSoC program |
| 06:02.24 | anu_ | akashm : everybody suggested lua only.. |
| 06:02.44 | anu_ | scorche : ok.. |
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| 06:10.07 | zamN | can someone explain how the projects work? |
| 06:10.29 | zamN | I realize that you essentially submit an application to each organization to do a certain thing on the project list |
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| 06:10.41 | zamN | But is it on an individual basis or with a group of people all working on a project together? |
| 06:10.41 | NayanShah | zamN, yes |
| 06:11.29 | zamN | Also it seems like being someone who knows primarily Java I'm SOL when it comes to projects |
| 06:11.33 | NayanShah | depends on the size of project. |
| 06:11.55 | zamN | i havent found any java projects yet :p |
| 06:12.19 | NayanShah | usually many people apply for a project. and the required number are selected by the orgs |
| 06:12.30 | zamN | ah, ok |
| 06:12.38 | NayanShah | there are quite a few in java also |
| 06:13.02 | zamN | i'll check tomorrow again |
| 06:13.07 | NayanShah | searched using the tag java ? |
| 06:13.10 | zamN | yes |
| 06:13.15 | zamN | i get javascript |
| 06:13.36 | zamN | i havent searched since yesterday though so i'll check again tomorrow |
| 06:13.37 | ojwb | zamN: projects are individual |
| 06:13.43 | ojwb | (as the faq clearly says) |
| 06:13.58 | zamN | was asking a question based off of what someone said in here |
| 06:14.06 | zamN | sorry almighty |
| 06:14.51 | akashm1990 | !numapps |
| 06:14.52 | socinfo | akashm1990: "numapps" is 417 mentoring orgs applied and 175 were accepted this year. In 2010, 367 mentoring orgs applied and 151 were accepted; 5539 proposals were submitted by 3464 students, and 1026 were accepted |
| 06:15.08 | ojwb | there are some java projects |
| 06:15.32 | ojwb | but proportionally it seems more students know java and more projects want other languages |
| 06:15.43 | ojwb | unis seem to teach java pretty commonly these days |
| 06:15.47 | zamN | because thats what students are taught in college :p |
| 06:15.53 | ojwb | sadly |
| 06:15.54 | zamN | ^^ |
| 06:16.03 | zamN | going to learn C this summer if I dont get in GSoC |
| 06:16.50 | ojwb | I know we (xapian) have one java-related project idea |
| 06:17.00 | ojwb | I'd imagine apache have quite a few |
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| 06:17.52 | zamN | alright i'll check you guys out |
| 06:17.53 | zamN | thanks! |
| 06:19.37 | atagar | We (Tor) have an android project which is, of course, java. (https://guardianproject.info/apps/orbot/) |
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| 06:27.37 | ojwb | hmm, if you type java in the tag search, the first two org listed have a java tag |
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| 06:28.11 | ojwb | and "java," avoids the javascript issue, though may miss those with java as the last tag |
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| 06:57.58 | Vikash_ | Hi I dont knw is this off the topic or not... But i want to make face recognition application and is also willing to make a speech to text Ide... or add this feature to an exsisting IDE... so how should i get started if i plan to do this in gsoc |
| 06:59.05 | woozie | so this would be your own project, if I'm correct? |
| 06:59.47 | Vikash_ | might be... as of now yes... |
| 06:59.57 | Vikash_ | thanks woozie for replying |
| 07:00.27 | woozie | well, the organization deadline has passed already. Try next year. prepare by read that is required for the org to apply. |
| 07:00.52 | woozie | OR you find an org that has applied and is doing somethign similar to what you want |
| 07:01.03 | Vikash_ | ok |
| 07:01.09 | woozie | but I don't know anyone that has an open source face recog going on .. |
| 07:01.52 | woozie | gl |
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| 07:03.18 | Vikash_ | any IDE... |
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| 07:03.38 | thiago_home | eclipse has joineddddddddddd |
| 07:03.40 | thiago_home | oops |
| 07:04.11 | Vikash_ | thiago_home: thanks ... and any other |
| 07:04.32 | thiago_home | kdevelop is available, since KDE has joined |
| 07:05.21 | Vikash_ | thiago_home: thanks a tonne |
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| 07:43.35 | akash | is this the place to discuss ideas for google chrome? |
| 07:44.25 | Myth17 | akash, go to the chrome IRC channel |
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| 07:52.26 | akashm1990 | Myth17, can you tell me the channel? the GSoC page lists this channel for chrome |
| 07:53.13 | Myth17 | akashm1990, i have no idea, check the chrome website or their mailing list |
| 07:53.37 | akashm1990 | actually I was coming from here : http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/org/show/google/gsoc2011/ospo |
| 07:53.49 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: are you from manipal |
| 07:53.54 | akashm1990 | yes |
| 07:54.08 | Vikash_ | kon sa lamba wala... |
| 07:54.20 | Vikash_ | vajapure ke saath waala |
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| 07:54.38 | akashm1990 | Vikash_, ??? I dont think I know you |
| 07:54.57 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: which branch... |
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| 07:55.12 | akashm1990 | Vikash_, CSE 3rd yr |
| 07:55.31 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: oh I am sorry then... |
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| 07:55.43 | akashm1990 | np |
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| 07:56.04 | Myth17 | akashm1990, which college? |
| 07:56.10 | Vikash_ | i m in IT 2nd yr |
| 07:56.27 | akashm1990 | Myth17, Manipal |
| 07:56.36 | Myth17 | ahh cool |
| 07:56.37 | akashm1990 | Vikash_, U in LUG? |
| 07:57.42 | Vikash_ | ya |
| 07:57.42 | Vikash_ | y??? |
| 07:57.53 | akashm1990 | just curious |
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| 07:59.14 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: np... applying for which org |
| 07:59.40 | akashm1990 | maybe mozilla or chrome, not sure if I'm applying or not |
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| 08:00.16 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: ok... u took that socket workshop...I am the one completed it first... |
| 08:00.42 | akashm1990 | You were the one sitting at the back? |
| 08:00.47 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: :) ok.... all the best |
| 08:01.35 | Vikash_ | akashm1990: ya... |
| 08:01.56 | akashm1990 | kk. good lucks. Where are you applying? |
| 08:02.37 | Vikash_ | I am going through all and then will decide.. |
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| 08:41.46 | barf00 | hi. is there a overall limit of students google will accept for this gsoc? |
| 08:43.18 | dhaun | barf00: there is, but we don't know the number :) |
| 08:44.31 | dhaun | "we will extend the scope of the program this year by targeting a 25% increase in accepted student applications" |
| 08:45.04 | dhaun | and last year, 1026 students were accepted, so I guess we're looking at ~1250 this year |
| 08:45.18 | dhaun | (note: this is only me guessing - I don't work or speak for Google) |
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| 08:46.43 | barf00 | ok, thanks |
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| 08:50.06 | zeta_chang | dhaun: so how many applicant are there annually? |
| 08:50.13 | dhaun | !numapps |
| 08:50.14 | socinfo | dhaun: "numapps" is 417 mentoring orgs applied and 175 were accepted this year. In 2010, 367 mentoring orgs applied and 151 were accepted; 5539 proposals were submitted by 3464 students, and 1026 were accepted |
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| 08:51.17 | zeta_chang | dhaun: thanks |
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| 10:32.44 | saiteja | can someone tell me how to join? |
| 10:33.13 | in3xes | saiteja, Join what? |
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| 10:34.31 | sega | join GSoC or what? |
| 10:34.39 | op_amp_afk | wishes Happy Holi :) |
| 10:34.53 | saiteja | sry i wanted to ask how to contact a particular company |
| 10:35.15 | saiteja | participating and disucss about the project |
| 10:35.41 | dhaun | follow the link from the list of accepted orgs to their ideas page - they should have contact information there |
| 10:35.53 | dhaun | (and most orgs aren't companies) |
| 10:36.20 | saiteja | yeah please replace companies with orgs and answer him |
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| 10:36.41 | saiteja | answer me |
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| 10:36.52 | dhaun | I thought I just did? |
| 10:36.52 | ojwb | saiteja: he already did |
| 10:37.12 | tamerlan | 10:35 < dhaun> follow the link from the list of accepted orgs to their ideas page - they should have contact information there |
| 10:37.31 | saiteja | ok should I directly send an application to them? |
| 10:37.54 | ojwb | you can also click on the org name in the list (assuming they filled it in, which the majority now have) |
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| 10:38.21 | saiteja | click on org name and then?? |
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| 10:39.07 | ojwb | read the words that appear on your screen |
| 10:39.15 | ojwb | have you used the web before? |
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| 10:40.26 | saiteja | no u asshole :P |
| 10:40.37 | saiteja | suck my dick bitch |
| 10:40.52 | rishi | saiteja: Now you are in deep shit. |
| 10:41.02 | saiteja | y? |
| 10:41.11 | rishi | op_amp_afk: Are you the same Neeraj Gupta from NIT Hamirpur? |
| 10:41.13 | ojwb | there's no need for that language |
| 10:41.26 | saiteja | ok dude |
| 10:41.41 | saiteja | suck my bro's cock |
| 10:41.51 | saiteja | or my friend's chaitu's cock |
| 10:41.58 | rishi | saiteja: You are going to repent this. |
| 10:42.02 | TrumpCard | saiteja: seriously, you're asking for trouble |
| 10:42.04 | saiteja | how? |
| 10:42.22 | Ayberk | don't feed the troll. |
| 10:42.22 | rishi | saiteja: Keep it up and you will see how. |
| 10:42.35 | saiteja | ohhh |
| 10:42.42 | deekay | Don't bother with 5yo and keep chill guys. |
| 10:42.55 | saiteja | deekay: sure y not |
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| 10:43.39 | op_amp | rishi, No :) |
| 10:43.47 | rishi | op_amp: Ah, ok. :-) |
| 10:44.55 | The_Sorce | Isn't this a good first step automatic application filtering? If you don't know how to contact an organization, maybe the coding won't be top notch, either. |
| 10:45.21 | shadeslayer | yep |
| 10:45.23 | The_Sorce | So if you don't know how to make first contact, maybe you shouldn't apply at all... Just an idea. ;D |
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| 10:47.37 | Ayberk | Above all, you should solve attitude problems. |
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| 10:48.55 | mayanks43 | people should take lessons in irc manners before joining |
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| 10:58.35 | TrumpCard | mayanks43: maybe every irc channel should include http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc1855.txt in their description |
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| 10:59.16 | TrumpCard | mayanks43: like please read the FAQ and how you should behave |
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| 11:00.04 | mayanks43 | yup |
| 11:00.06 | mayanks43 | ;) |
| 11:00.18 | dhaun | maybe I'm pessimistic, but do you really think people would read that? |
| 11:00.36 | dhaun | especially people who can't even follow a "click here" link? |
| 11:00.48 | mayanks43 | true |
| 11:01.00 | TrumpCard | dhaun: we can all hope for better times :p |
| 11:01.01 | mayanks43 | also considering the size of that document |
| 11:01.38 | Pranav_rcmas | I think it's more extrapolate than just IRC. As in basic manners and maturity :) |
| 11:03.06 | rrix | Wow |
| 11:03.23 | rrix | that was the most pathetic backscroll I've read in a long time. :( |
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| 11:04.49 | The_Sorce | people who can't click links always make me sad... :S |
| 11:06.14 | The_Sorce | of course, i've done my share of helpdesk work... so i've seen my share of ms office illiterates too, and those are the worst kind. |
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| 11:07.31 | The_Sorce | -"I tried to save Word, and now says 'Do you want to save the document?'. What do I do?" -"Well, do you?" -"Do I what?" -"Do you want to save the document?" -"No" -"Then click 'No'..." -"Okay... Hey, where is my document?!?" |
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| 11:07.45 | The_Sorce | *close Word |
| 11:08.08 | |Kev| | When students who're at that level turn up, I find it hard to know what the best thing to do is. |
| 11:08.32 | |Kev| | On the one hand, clearly it's unfair to lead them on into wasting time on an application that I know is going to be unsuccessful. |
| 11:08.54 | |Kev| | On the other hand, is it fairest to at least give them as much support as possible before the application so they'll have learned something? |
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| 11:09.36 | The_Sorce | Tough call. :S |
| 11:09.42 | |Kev| | (This was a mostly rhetorical question, I'm not expecting an answer) |
| 11:09.42 | rishi | |Kev|: Send a bunch of ninjas down their chimney to beat them with clue bats? |
| 11:09.57 | The_Sorce | Yeah, that would clearly make the most sense. :D |
| 11:10.01 | |Kev| | rishi: They're a student. The point of being a student is to learn. |
| 11:10.28 | The_Sorce | well, says 'LEARN!' like a clue bat to the face... |
| 11:10.30 | |Kev| | Which is what makes it tough. |
| 11:10.31 | The_Sorce | *nothing |
| 11:10.43 | The_Sorce | i'm losing words... must be my connection... or head. |
| 11:10.59 | |Kev| | If it was someone applying for a standard job, clue bats ahoy!, but given that it's supposed to be a mentorin gexperience... |
| 11:11.02 | rishi | |Kev|: Right. Like suddenly jumping up and down like a jack-in-the-box in your mathematics class increases ones right to learn. :-P |
| 11:11.57 | |Kev| | I dropped maths when I wasn't enjoying it :) |
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| 11:13.24 | |Kev| | Or, wasn't enjoying the experience of taking only a small amount of maths, and being unaware of what was going on wrt: workshops and the like, to be fair. I still like maths :) |
| 11:13.39 | rishi | |Kev|: :-) |
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| 11:15.20 | pygi | o hi |
| 11:15.24 | The_Sorce | Nothing wrong with math, as long as it can actually be applied for something. |
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| 11:16.03 | The_Sorce | I mean, being thought algorithms for converting 20x20 matrices into rubber chickens, for no apparent reason, is not very rewarding. |
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| 11:18.07 | The_Sorce | *taught |
| 11:18.33 | The_Sorce | (why am I using the wrong words, and skipping words here and there? i must be REALLY tired, but i just got up a few hours ago... makes no sense.) |
| 11:18.57 | woozie | The_Sorce: they taught you to arrange the elemnts intio something resembling chickens .. or what do you mean? |
| 11:19.12 | pr0ton | just a question about eligibility |
| 11:19.26 | pr0ton | my exams will get over in may, and i'll be graduating after a few months when my results are out |
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| 11:19.29 | pr0ton | i'm eligible ? |
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| 11:19.43 | |Kev| | pr0ton: This is covered by the FAQ |
| 11:19.44 | pr0ton | bachelors, not masters |
| 11:19.54 | The_Sorce | woozie: nah, not really. point being that some math teachers just teach math without giving ANY real-life examples of when the methods would actually be useful. |
| 11:20.48 | pr0ton | |Kev|, ok thx |
| 11:20.51 | woozie | ok. in which class were you taught that? |
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| 11:21.23 | woozie | also, I could see it fit in a recreational math class, but not anywhere else :P |
| 11:21.32 | pr0ton | ok, q answered |
| 11:21.34 | pr0ton | I graduate in the middle of the program. Can I still participate? |
| 11:21.34 | pr0ton | As long as you are enrolled in a college or university program as of April 26, 2010, you are eligible to participate in the program. |
| 11:21.52 | pr0ton | err, should be 2011 i think |
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| 11:22.18 | The_Sorce | nobody taught me to arrange matrices into chickens... but for example, i went through graph theory 101 without a clue of real-world applications for graphs. the lecturer never mentioned as much as ONE real-life application. |
| 11:22.33 | pr0ton | The_Sorce, there are so many! |
| 11:22.50 | woozie | he's right though ... his teachers should atleast meantion a few |
| 11:22.53 | pr0ton | your lecturer, is bad i guess... but my lecturer didnt even know much of graph theory to teach any applications :D |
| 11:23.06 | pr0ton | i'm mostly self-taught, i come from a very bad univ :( |
| 11:23.38 | pr0ton | lol, facebook is very much based on the idea of a social graph... but i'm not sure if they borrowed much from graph theory ;) |
| 11:23.44 | The_Sorce | I think the problem with math teachers is that they are too interested in the math itself. For them, math is just fun because it is math. Not necessarily as true for CS students. :D |
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| 11:23.55 | pr0ton | The_Sorce, thats kinda true |
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| 11:24.13 | pr0ton | The_Sorce, i know of my friend who was a grad student at columbia, knowing a professor who taught algos |
| 11:24.20 | pr0ton | and who was kind of averse reading his email ;) |
| 11:24.47 | pr0ton | i think, it's important to distinguish between theoretical and applied aspects of CS |
| 11:25.11 | The_Sorce | for CS students, the graphs get way interesting during 'data structures' or some equivalent CS course. and yeah, graphs are VERY useful. :) |
| 11:25.12 | pr0ton | you cant take a course with Theoretical CS, and expect to learn applied, if you do it's a windfall, but not something that you're assured of |
| 11:25.16 | pr0ton | maths is pretty cool though ;) |
| 11:25.32 | The_Sorce | math is cool, with the right teacher. :) |
| 11:25.39 | pr0ton | The_Sorce, yeah. i think graph theory should be taken, after algorithms / ds |
| 11:25.58 | pr0ton | well i cant comment, here i cant even choose my courses :D |
| 11:26.07 | pr0ton | just take what i get, and be content with it |
| 11:26.11 | pr0ton | very rigid system |
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| 11:26.26 | The_Sorce | well that sucks. i can choose courses, and i think i chose them in the wrong order. |
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| 11:26.44 | pr0ton | haha, The_Sorce you should've done a topological sort on your courses ;) |
| 11:27.24 | The_Sorce | yeah. i've seen circular references in the course requirements, though... not for these particular courses, but for some other ones. :D |
| 11:27.33 | pr0ton | The_Sorce, lol |
| 11:27.57 | pr0ton | whoever set these courses, should be assualted with a DAGger |
| 11:28.21 | pr0ton | for those who dont get the refer - DAG = directed acyclic graph... i am not propagating violence :D |
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| 11:29.00 | The_Sorce | got it. i know my graphs, those courses were yeeeeears ago. :) |
| 11:29.09 | pr0ton | nope, i meant for others :D |
| 11:29.14 | pr0ton | who'd think i'm a lunatic psychopath |
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| 11:29.49 | The_Sorce | hmm.. I'm sure you can defend the DAG, but what about the 'ger'? :D |
| 11:29.58 | The_Sorce | are those German DAGs? :D |
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| 11:31.25 | pr0ton | no // |
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| 11:35.28 | The_Sorce | We can't stop here. This is bat country. |
| 11:35.34 | The_Sorce | (I'm just making conversation...) |
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| 11:46.54 | Ivanovic | does someone have a link to this years gsoc logo at hand? |
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| 11:47.10 | Ivanovic | want to write a news entry on the wesnoth homepage about wesnoth being accepted in this years gsoc |
| 11:47.11 | dhaun | Ivanovic: http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/GsocLogos |
| 11:47.24 | Ivanovic | thanks dhaun |
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| 12:04.57 | Ivanovic | uhm, the logo GSOC_2011_300x200px_URL.png is not exactly what is advertised |
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| 12:05.18 | dhaun | yeah, it's much bigger |
| 12:05.18 | Ivanovic | the downloaded image has lovely 1126x750 as dimensions, not 300x200 |
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| 12:36.32 | marti1125 | Hi :D |
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| 12:37.14 | marti1125 | Hi |
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| 12:40.51 | shadeslayer | marti1125: hi |
| 12:41.55 | marti1125 | someone applied to abiword |
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| 12:45.32 | kblin | !anyone |
| 12:45.32 | socinfo | kblin: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here> |
| 12:45.51 | kblin | oh, that's just for mentors |
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| 13:45.30 | piyush | hey |
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| 13:47.55 | shadeslayer | piyush: hi |
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| 13:51.46 | shadeslayer | piyush: please ask all your questions here instead of PM'ing me |
| 13:52.28 | piyush | since i am very new to GSoC, so can u tell me that what are we supposed to do once the participating organisations are declared |
| 13:52.48 | piyush | i have gone thru their ideas list |
| 13:53.26 | shadeslayer | piyush: so which organization do you want to work with? |
| 13:53.29 | dhaun | pick a few projects you're interested in, talk to the orgs, see if you like it, prepare for application |
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| 13:54.03 | piyush | but dude i'm not sure how to contact them...... |
| 13:54.09 | piyush | through mail........?? |
| 13:54.17 | Xeli | !next |
| 13:54.17 | socinfo | Xeli: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
| 13:54.25 | ojwb | there are contact details for each org |
| 13:54.27 | dhaun | contact info is usually given on the ideas list |
| 13:54.30 | ojwb | just click on the name in the list |
| 13:55.08 | shadeslayer | yep |
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| 13:56.29 | piyush | oh....now i got that |
| 13:56.33 | piyush | thanx man |
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| 14:01.25 | hilnius | hi all |
| 14:01.42 | kps_foo | hilnius: hi |
| 14:02.01 | hilnius | i've got a little question about gsoc applying |
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| 14:04.09 | hilnius | actually, the only thing we can do is to talk with organizations, in order to apply after march 28 ? |
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| 14:05.14 | rishi | hilnius: You can carpet bomb them with patches in order to bully them into accepting you. :-) |
| 14:05.36 | NayanShah | rishi, nice one. |
| 14:05.39 | hilnius | :D lol |
| 14:05.45 | |Kev| | hilnius: Talk to the orgs. Some will be happy to suggest little tasks you can do, to persuade them you're competent. |
| 14:06.06 | hilnius | thanks kev |
| 14:06.19 | |Kev| | I'm suggesting tasks to a student at the moment. |
| 14:06.29 | kps_foo | hilnius: by fixing patches they will know that you really want to do some work, and are not just saying stuff |
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| 14:06.42 | |Kev| | They don't have to do it, but if they do, it'll prove they're able to work with us. That's a hell of a plus next to their name come application time. |
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| 14:07.21 | hilnius | kev, which organization are you working for ? |
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| 14:07.59 | |Kev| | I help admin for the XMPP umbrella, and my particular project is swift.im |
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| 14:11.03 | rishi | |Kev|: Swift does not happen to use Telepathy, does it? |
| 14:11.10 | |Kev| | It doesn't. |
| 14:11.19 | |Kev| | It uses its own XMPP library. |
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| 14:13.52 | |Kev| | rishi: Why'd you ask? |
| 14:14.20 | rishi | |Kev|: I am hacking Telepathy a bit. |
| 14:14.40 | rishi | |Kev|: Why use a separate XMPP library? Just curious. |
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| 14:14.55 | rishi | (I don't hack Telepathy's Jabber connection manager.) |
| 14:16.11 | |Kev| | A bundle of reasons, including but not limited to license control, wanting control of the codebase, being quite experienced with XMPP so Remko has come up with a stonkingly good library, being able to support any C++-supporting platforms, etc. etc. etc. |
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| 14:17.10 | rishi | |Kev|: Control? :-) |
| 14:17.38 | |Kev| | Which bit? |
| 14:18.41 | |Kev| | We like having a library that we control, that we can add features to whenever we want, refactor at will, etc. etc. |
| 14:19.08 | mmadia | regarding the 2011 Logo, is it OK to store it in greyscale? for example for creating a flyer that is more appropriate for photocopying? |
| 14:19.13 | mmadia | http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/GsocLogos |
| 14:20.13 | kblin | mmadia: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/ says no |
| 14:20.19 | koda|gsoc | where should students send their application? |
| 14:20.26 | kblin | !faq |
| 14:20.26 | socinfo | kblin: "faq" is http://goo.gl/Up2Qf |
| 14:20.27 | |Kev| | No-where yet. |
| 14:20.32 | koda|gsoc | not to the public mailing list right? |
| 14:20.34 | kblin | !timeline |
| 14:20.34 | socinfo | kblin: "timeline" is http://goo.gl/0lYPz |
| 14:20.42 | kblin | koda|gsoc: ^^^ |
| 14:20.49 | rishi | |Kev|: So is this library meant to be used by programs other than Swift? |
| 14:21.01 | koda|gsoc | i know but i've been asked and they're not accepting "notyet" as anwer |
| 14:21.06 | koda|gsoc | answer* |
| 14:21.13 | |Kev| | rishi: It is used by other XMPP projects, yes. |
| 14:21.25 | |Kev| | (Components as well as clients) |
| 14:21.32 | dhaun | koda|gsoc: applications aren't open yet - what more is there to say? |
| 14:21.35 | ojwb | koda|gsoc: well, they can send them to your org's mailing list for review |
| 14:21.52 | kblin | right, what ojwb said |
| 14:22.06 | ojwb | but they need to wait to submit them in a way which can actually get them accepted |
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| 14:22.26 | rishi | |Kev|: Which library is this? It is not obvious to me from the web page. |
| 14:22.29 | kblin | once the application period opens, it will be on google-melange.com |
| 14:22.47 | |Kev| | rishi: It's not really a website yet, is it? (I'm working on that as we speak) |
| 14:22.49 | koda|gsoc | eaccepted by us or by gsoc? :p |
| 14:22.55 | |Kev| | http://swift.im/swiften exists though, iirc. |
| 14:23.29 | ojwb | koda|gsoc: in order for them to actually get accepted (and funded etc) they need to be submitted in melange |
| 14:23.29 | gevaerts | koda|gsoc: you can't accept a project that's not on melange, so "yes" :) |
| 14:23.43 | ojwb | at which point your org reviews and ranks them, etc |
| 14:24.01 | ojwb | but there's no reason why you can't comment on them before that, outside of melange |
| 14:24.24 | kblin | koda|gsoc: provided the applicants are eligible, google won't impose any other restrictions on you as an org |
| 14:24.35 | koda|gsoc | ok i see, thank you : |
| 14:24.36 | koda|gsoc | :) |
| 14:24.45 | kblin | !eligible |
| 14:24.45 | socinfo | kblin: "eligible" is Follow this handy flowchart to see if you are eligible http://goo.gl/kvCSv (text version at http://goo.gl/ImfNT) |
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| 14:25.18 | rishi | |Kev|: This fragmentation of "standards compliant, robust, cross-platform" libraries breaks my heart. |
| 14:25.36 | |Kev| | Oh? |
| 14:26.04 | rishi | |Kev|: I am not really criticizing you. In fact, I am not qualified to do so. |
| 14:26.25 | ojwb | multiple implementation of a standard is a healthy thing |
| 14:26.29 | |Kev| | You're welcome to your opinion though, and I'm interested in it. |
| 14:26.55 | ojwb | though I do sometimes despair at our love of reimplementing things which already exist over reusing them |
| 14:27.05 | gevaerts | A "standard" with only one implementation isn't really a standard |
| 14:27.05 | ojwb | when I'm not busy doing it myself that is |
| 14:27.21 | |Kev| | ojwb: To be fair, Remko and me doing that is *slightly* different to someone new to the protocol ;) |
| 14:27.29 | rishi | |Kev|: Just curious why using Telepathy Glib or libpurple would not have worked ? |
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| 14:27.57 | |Kev| | (Remko and I have been involved in assorted XMPP projects since before the RFCs were published (2004)) |
| 14:28.19 | |Kev| | rishi: Those aren't XMPP libraries, though, those are multi-protocol libraries. |
| 14:28.33 | ojwb | |Kev|: i meant in general - i've no idea about this case |
| 14:28.35 | |Kev| | libpurple has scary dependencies. |
| 14:28.51 | |Kev| | ojwb: I agree in general. I just feel we're excused in this one instance :) |
| 14:29.19 | |Kev| | (i.e. the XMPP lib is the only lib we re-implement, we don't re-do DNS, SSL, file handling, anything in Boost etc.) |
| 14:30.02 | gevaerts | |Kev|: but how many SSL libraries do you support? |
| 14:30.09 | rishi | nods |
| 14:30.34 | |Kev| | gevaerts: two, loosely. OpenSSL mainly, there is also an schannel implementation (that we don't control). |
| 14:30.41 | rishi | |Kev|: I will remember Swiften when I need a C++ XMPP library the next time. |
| 14:31.10 | |Kev| | rishi: Interestingly, I *am* considering using Farsight for VOIP stuff :) |
| 14:31.13 | rishi | |Kev|: Happy hacking. |
| 14:31.18 | |Kev| | Thanks :) |
| 14:31.18 | rishi | |Kev|: :-) |
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| 14:31.48 | gevaerts | |Kev|: no license issues then? |
| 14:31.53 | gevaerts | Lucky you! |
| 14:31.58 | rishi | |Kev|: As long as we write free software and can learn from other's code everything should be fine. :-) |
| 14:32.02 | |Kev| | gevaerts: What do you mean? |
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| 14:32.42 | gevaerts | |Kev|: well, openssl is "notorious" for not being GPL compatible |
| 14:32.49 | |Kev| | We do GPL outgoing, BSD incoming. That way we have the option to relicense. |
| 14:33.11 | |Kev| | gevaerts: Ah, well, it's GPL with an exception (or GPL3 with a section 7(?) allowance). |
| 14:33.22 | |Kev| | But right, we don't use GPL code inbound, for reasons like this. |
| 14:33.38 | |Kev| | (Add "compatible" to the last but one line) |
| 14:33.57 | gevaerts | |Kev|: have a look at http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2011/02/05/libcurl-seven-ssl-libs-and-one-ssh-lib/ :) |
| 14:34.13 | gevaerts | And http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2011/02/08/fosdem-2011-my-libcurl-talk-on-video/ for the recording |
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| 14:36.50 | dhaun | hey, I attended that session :) |
| 14:37.25 | |Kev| | I was ill at home in bed instead of at FOSDEM this year, which was especially annoying as I was supposed to be presenting. |
| 14:37.27 | gevaerts | I met one of our users at that session! |
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| 14:38.23 | gevaerts | It's nice to get confirmation that some people out there actually use your stuff :) |
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| 14:44.48 | SRabbelier | FYI: we've disabled invite/request creation until we launch the new UI later this week |
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| 14:45.15 | SRabbelier | feel free to redirect questions about this to me, either here on in #melange |
| 14:45.42 | gevaerts | So no more new mentors for a few days? |
| 14:46.03 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: correct |
| 14:46.07 | gevaerts | ok |
| 14:46.17 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: but it'll be back before student application starts |
| 14:46.25 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: so hopefully this won't be too much of a problem |
| 14:46.37 | dhaun | SRabbelier: you may want to post that on the mentors list |
| 14:46.39 | gevaerts | Yes. I was just confirming that I understood it correctly |
| 14:46.51 | SRabbelier | dhaun: *nod* |
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| 14:47.46 | gevaerts | I think you should deploy the new UI one day before the student application deadline though ;) |
| 14:48.02 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: before it opens you mean? |
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| 14:48.24 | gevaerts | SRabbelier: no. I'm aiming for maximum panic :) |
| 14:48.29 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: lol |
| 14:48.33 | shadeslayer | lol |
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| 14:49.46 | SRabbelier | dhaun: done |
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| 15:33.29 | mmadia | kblin may i drop you a PM? |
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| 15:47.59 | chunmun | hi guys, any irc where I can find openwall mentors? |
| 15:48.18 | SRabbelier | chunmun: have you checked their website? |
| 15:48.39 | chunmun | SRabbelier: yes, nothing much there other than just the ideas twiki and an email. |
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| 15:49.04 | chunmun | http://openwall.info/wiki/ideas |
| 15:49.07 | |Kev| | !anyone |
| 15:49.07 | socinfo | |Kev|: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here> |
| 15:49.46 | SRabbelier | chunmun: then probably not |
| 15:49.58 | in3xes | !help |
| 15:49.58 | socinfo | in3xes: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. |
| 15:50.45 | chunmun | socinfo: logs |
| 15:50.46 | socinfo | chunmun: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
| 15:51.28 | chunmun | SRabbelier: k, guess I ll start with that email id first. |
| 15:51.41 | SRabbelier | chunmun: sSGTM |
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| 17:23.10 | MarcosNobrega | Hey, on gsoc, each idea only can have one person working? |
| 17:23.37 | ahel | yes |
| 17:23.40 | dhaun | MarcosNobrega: you can not work as a team, if that's what you're asking |
| 17:23.41 | gevaerts | That depends on what exactly you mean by that :) |
| 17:23.41 | ahel | rtfm |
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| 17:24.34 | MarcosNobrega | ok, so, each idean just accepts one student |
| 17:24.38 | |Kev| | No. |
| 17:24.40 | gevaerts | You *can* have multiple students working on the same (or a similar) idea, in some sort of competition. I wouldn't recommend that though |
| 17:25.05 | dhaun | has any org ever done that? |
| 17:25.19 | gevaerts | Basically you can *not* do something where one student depends on another student |
| 17:25.33 | MarcosNobrega | hum, ok, |
| 17:26.10 | gevaerts | The problem is that students can (and have done so in the past) diseappear without warning and without trace |
| 17:26.22 | |Kev| | Or just underperform |
| 17:26.25 | gevaerts | If another student fails because of that, you have a serious problem |
| 17:27.16 | MarcosNobrega | hum, it make sense |
| 17:27.41 | MarcosNobrega | it's my first time in gsoc |
| 17:27.47 | |Kev| | You *can* get around this, depending on the project, with enough forethought. |
| 17:28.30 | gevaerts | Most things in gsoc make sense once you figure out the rasoning behind them :) |
| 17:28.37 | |Kev| | E.g. if you had a project with 3 must-have stages, and a few optional stages, you could ask student one to do phases 1 2 3 4 5, and student two to do phases 2 3 1 6 7. |
| 17:29.01 | |Kev| | If either one or two drops out or underperforms, the other one is still able to do the 123 must-have stages. |
| 17:29.03 | dhaun | guys, I don't think MarcosNobrega had something like that in mind when he asked ... |
| 17:29.27 | |Kev| | If both students perform, they'll be able to get onto the optional bits. |
| 17:30.06 | gevaerts | |Kev|: good point. That requires some modularity though |
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| 17:30.14 | |Kev| | Sure, depends on the project in question. |
| 17:30.32 | |Kev| | We've got one idea this year that we could do that for, though (and I'd love to have two good students on that project) |
| 17:32.31 | MarcosNobrega | ok, thanks, see you later |
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| 17:39.35 | siddharth_ | zzz |
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| 17:49.04 | sheen_drifter | i have some question regarding experience to work on projects |
| 17:49.14 | |Kev| | !goodenough |
| 17:49.14 | socinfo | |Kev|: "goodenough" is Am I good enough to be a student for GSoC? http://www.booki.cc/gsocstudentguide/_v/1.0/am-i-good-enough/ |
| 17:49.27 | |Kev| | sheen_drifter: Without knowing your question, that might answer it. |
| 17:50.10 | sheen_drifter | kev: it specific to some project |
| 17:50.30 | |Kev| | Then you'll probably want to go grab that mentoring org to ask :) |
| 17:50.38 | sheen_drifter | kev: i hv read that manual |
| 17:50.44 | |Kev| | Goodo :) |
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| 17:51.25 | sheen_drifter | kev: actually am way to new in this, so a little hessitant |
| 17:51.56 | sheen_drifter | kev: thank u, i'll look at mentoring org |
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| 17:54.31 | darkjames | hi |
| 17:54.38 | dukeleto | nice to see there is an irc bot that refers to the guides that I helped write :) |
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| 17:54.41 | ann0nn | Hi, can we submit to more than one application but setting priority ? |
| 17:54.46 | |Kev| | dukeleto: Hi. |
| 17:55.03 | dukeleto | ann0nn: you can submit multiple, but there are no priorities (unless stuff has changed) |
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| 17:55.15 | dukeleto | |Kev|: howdy |
| 17:55.18 | |Kev| | ann0nn: There's no 'priority' field, but typically if you're accepted into multiple projects, the orgs will ask which you prefer. |
| 17:55.34 | gevaerts | You can of course add your priority to the text |
| 17:55.36 | faif | is it necessary to be a student for applying? what about being a recent graduate? |
| 17:55.37 | |Kev| | dukeleto: Sorry, I meant to say hi to darkjames and autocomplete failed me. But hi too :) |
| 17:55.38 | ann0nn | what if they are from diferent orgs ? |
| 17:55.59 | gevaerts | ann0nn: in that case they will probably ask you in case of conflict |
| 17:56.00 | |Kev| | ann0nn: Typically they'll ask which you'd rather do. Not always, but typically. |
| 17:56.10 | ann0nn | ok, thanks |
| 17:56.19 | |Kev| | Assuming you've not applied to any projects you don't want to do, it's almost certain to work out alright. |
| 17:57.10 | gevaerts | faif: from the FAQ, "As long as you are accepted into or enrolled in a college or university program as of April 25, 2011, you are eligible to participate in the program" |
| 17:57.25 | sheen_drifter | while selecting to apply, do I need to concider my past project experiences regarding platform or language |
| 17:57.29 | faif | I see, thanks |
| 17:57.43 | |Kev| | sheen_drifter: You need to not apply for a project you're not capable of completing. |
| 17:57.59 | gevaerts | suspects that 'bcb[^+#]' is the correct way to indentify organisations using c |
| 17:58.01 | |Kev| | I would not recommend a project in a language you've never touched before, although it's possible. |
| 17:58.32 | |Kev| | But e.g. the project using Git for version control and you've never used it before isn't a problem. |
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| 18:00.16 | sheen_drifter | kev: for example I hv low experice in python but I fine with c but hv experice more on .net |
| 18:00.44 | sheen_drifter | kev: so in that context i limit myself to mono only |
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| 18:01.15 | |Kev| | If you have *any* Python experience, you could probably do *some* projects in Python. |
| 18:01.34 | |Kev| | You'd just have to have a look at the projects, discuss with the orgs, and decide. |
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| 18:01.49 | |Kev| | I wouldn't e.g. apply for a Lisp project though (assuming you have no Lisp experience). |
| 18:01.59 | |Kev| | [Although I wonder if such a project even exists :)] |
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| 18:04.35 | cronco | hmm |
| 18:04.56 | cronco | how about, if I have plenty of experience with PHP, and go for something like web-oriented Python |
| 18:05.22 | sheen_drifter | as its period of proposal n idea discussion time, can i bug ppl reagading applications too |
| 18:05.22 | |Kev| | I think you'd be making life unnecessarily hard upon yourself. |
| 18:05.57 | |Kev| | You could probably get up to speed on Python before the project starts if you wanted to, but I'd be inclined not to make life hard upon yourself. |
| 18:06.16 | cronco | yeah, that's most of the advice I've received until now |
| 18:06.43 | cronco | I guess experimenting is better left for some other time :) |
| 18:06.54 | |Kev| | It depends on your experience too. |
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| 18:07.11 | |Kev| | If you have experience in many languages, picking up Python will be easier than if you have experience in just one. |
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| 18:07.56 | cronco | I know Python is one of the most straight-forward languages out there |
| 18:07.59 | cronco | syntax wise |
| 18:08.23 | |Kev| | I think Lua probably beats it, but sure. |
| 18:08.30 | |Kev| | It's not a complicated language, syntax-wise. |
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| 18:08.41 | |Kev| | That doesn't mean it's trivial to write *good* code in it :) |
| 18:08.48 | cronco | I also knows it has it's own, Pythonic, way of doing things |
| 18:09.18 | cronco | It's never trivial to write good code |
| 18:09.46 | |Kev| | Kinda the point :) |
| 18:10.12 | cronco | always wanted to get more into Python, but never really got the chance |
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| 18:10.30 | |Kev| | You can contribute to OSS projects at any time you want to. You've always got the chance :) |
| 18:10.37 | cronco | I know |
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| 18:12.14 | cronco | I'm not in it (only) for the money :P |
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| 18:12.36 | sexwithyourex | http://tinyurl.com/y9z3fe4 |
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| 18:12.52 | cronco | I really hope to gather some xp and guts and also give back |
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| 18:14.24 | sexwithyourex | New GSoC logo: http://tinyurl.com/y9z3fe4 |
| 18:14.51 | gevaerts | suspects that sexwithyourex wants to be banned |
| 18:14.53 | dhaun | where's an op when you need one ... |
| 18:14.54 | |Kev| | mlankhorst / kblin / SRabbelier: (Can't remember who I've seen active recently) - could you do something about sexwithyourex please? |
| 18:15.20 | *** mode/#gsoc [+b sexwithyourex!*@*] by SRabbelier |
| 18:15.22 | Digital_Pioneer | That dereferences to goatse. |
| 18:15.22 | *** kick/#gsoc [sexwithyourex!debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/srabbelier] by SRabbelier (sexwithyourex) |
| 18:15.23 | |Kev| | Thank goodness for http://tinyurl.com/preview.php |
| 18:15.30 | |Kev| | SRabbelier: Many thanks. |
| 18:15.36 | Digital_Pioneer | |Kev|: Yep. :) |
| 18:15.40 | SRabbelier | shakes head |
| 18:15.50 | SRabbelier | sad |
| 18:15.54 | |Kev| | Could be worse, could have been a rickroll. |
| 18:15.56 | gevaerts | |Kev|: I use curl -I for that |
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| 18:16.11 | cronco | |Kev| : lol |
| 18:16.15 | gevaerts | dislikes URL shortening services in general |
| 18:16.18 | SRabbelier | |Kev|: ping me if they come back |
| 18:16.24 | |Kev| | Thanks. |
| 18:16.31 | ishwadeep | pukes |
| 18:16.50 | Digital_Pioneer | ishwadeep: Did you follow it? |
| 18:16.57 | ishwadeep | :( yes |
| 18:17.00 | |Kev| | Well, GSoC is a learning experience after all :) |
| 18:17.06 | mayanks43 | :-D |
| 18:17.13 | SRabbelier | |Kev|: lol |
| 18:17.19 | ishwadeep | sure is |
| 18:17.22 | Digital_Pioneer | ishwadeep: Sorry to hear that. I followed one several years back, never trusted links quite the same since. |
| 18:17.49 | ishwadeep | will keep it in mind :) |
| 18:18.10 | cronco | thank god for a slow pc which showed me the real url long before the contents |
| 18:18.11 | Digital_Pioneer | In the mean time, turn on tinyurl previews. :P |
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| 18:18.56 | ishwadeep | done :) |
| 18:19.08 | ishwadeep | but then there are others... bit.ly goo.gl et al |
| 18:19.10 | Digital_Pioneer | I got lucky. Apparently I hadn't turned on turl previews yet on this browser, but I was tipped off by the nick. :P |
| 18:19.22 | shadeslayer | same here ^^ |
| 18:19.32 | |Kev| | I was tipped off by "Link on IRC from someone I don't know". |
| 18:19.37 | Digital_Pioneer | I'm pretty sure goo.gl won't let you create a URL for goatse... |
| 18:19.49 | SRabbelier | |Kev|: their nickname would be pretty obvious |
| 18:19.57 | SRabbelier | |Kev|: although it was a targetted troll :P |
| 18:20.12 | gevaerts | ishwadeep: I *always* run curl -I on any of those. |
| 18:20.19 | SRabbelier | Digital_Pioneer: that would be awesome |
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| 18:21.17 | ishwadeep | thanks gevaerts and Digital_Pioneer :) |
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| 18:21.25 | gevaerts | points to http://tinyurl.com/kkeenx for some slightly more harmless fun |
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| 18:22.12 | Digital_Pioneer | Lol |
| 18:22.38 | mayanks43 | is that recursion? |
| 18:22.44 | Digital_Pioneer | gevaerts: GAaaahhhh! Infinite loop! |
| 18:22.48 | Digital_Pioneer | :D |
| 18:23.02 | gevaerts | Digital_Pioneer: not really |
| 18:23.09 | Digital_Pioneer | Hmm... Is it recursion? |
| 18:23.25 | gevaerts | After a few minutes google will start suspecting that you may be a bot, and ask you to say you're not |
| 18:23.35 | Digital_Pioneer | Ahhh, lol |
| 18:23.39 | Digital_Pioneer | Very nice. |
| 18:23.40 | cronco | :)) |
| 18:24.16 | Digital_Pioneer | For all intents and purposes, I am a bot right now. It's automated web browsing. |
| 18:24.25 | Digital_Pioneer | Not browsing very far... :P |
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| 18:25.18 | Digital_Pioneer | gevaerts: Google seems to be fairly certain I am not a bot. :P |
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| 18:40.08 | akashm1990 | !logs |
| 18:40.08 | socinfo | akashm1990: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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| 18:42.56 | MJ | Hi guys. |
| 18:43.23 | Guest21212 | How to apply through the web interface, or where can I read about it. |
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| 18:45.07 | dhaun | Guest21212: not yet |
| 18:45.09 | xJapx | Guest21212, if I remember correctly, you can start applying from 28th of March |
| 18:45.10 | dhaun | !timeline |
| 18:45.10 | socinfo | dhaun: "timeline" is http://goo.gl/0lYPz |
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| 18:49.00 | Guest21212 | You got me wrong. :) |
| 18:49.11 | Guest21212 | I am interested in the process. |
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| 18:50.10 | dhaun | which part of the process exactly? |
| 18:50.32 | dhaun | you read this, I assume? http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/faqs#student |
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| 18:51.35 | Michitux | Guest21212: and you've read http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/userguide#depth_studentapply , too? |
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| 18:52.05 | Guest21212 | Submitting an application for participation in the project through a web interface |
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| 18:53.38 | dhaun | Guest21212: http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/userguide#depth_studentapply |
| 18:53.44 | gangil | can I ask a offtopic question? |
| 18:54.10 | dhaun | "User's Guide" is actually the very first link in the FAQ ... |
| 18:56.04 | gevaerts | gangil: I'd point out that whether or not one can ask off-topic questions might be off-topic :) |
| 18:56.12 | gevaerts | will not do that however |
| 18:56.32 | Guest21212 | All figured out, all thanks!!!!!!!!!! |
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| 18:58.42 | gevaerts | gangil: in general when it's not too busy this is a fairly relaxed place without too much strictness about topics |
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| 19:03.06 | rrix | gevaerts: does that include goatse? *duck* |
| 19:03.26 | gevaerts | It's also meant to be a family friendly place at all times |
| 19:03.31 | rrix | ahh, right |
| 19:08.56 | tensa_zangetsu | i'm planning to participate in gsoc and i want to work on improving support for radeon graphics cards |
| 19:09.15 | pygi | I dont think there is such a project |
| 19:09.20 | tensa_zangetsu | i'm aware that this spans multiple pieces of software like the kernel, xorg, mesa etc. |
| 19:09.42 | gevaerts | I'd say you have to talk to those |
| 19:10.31 | tensa_zangetsu | yeah. i'm just wondering if anyone here knows which one i would start with since i haven't done related development before |
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| 19:12.57 | cronco | probably you should take that up with kernel.org |
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| 19:15.41 | dbs | tensa_zangetsu: you might want to touch base with a Linux distro like "The Fedora Project" as a possible sponsoring org too |
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| 19:16.19 | rrix | yawns |
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| 19:16.44 | tensa_zangetsu | cronco,dbs: thanks. will try those. |
| 19:16.45 | rrix | Yeah, we have a similar idea listed for the nouveau drivers, I don't see why our mesa/x devs wouldn't be open to a radeon related project |
| 19:16.52 | rrix | (we = fedora) |
| 19:17.10 | dbs | fedora++ |
| 19:17.44 | cronco | does anyone know how come ubuntu didn't make the cut this year? |
| 19:17.51 | cronco | (just asking) |
| 19:17.52 | gevaerts | yes |
| 19:18.10 | gevaerts | I suspect either ubuntu or google know (or maybe even both) |
| 19:18.24 | cronco | gevaerts: lol thanks :) |
| 19:18.47 | gevaerts | You're welcome! |
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| 19:21.37 | pygi | cronco: its simple |
| 19:21.39 | rrix | tensa_zangetsu: the Fedora xorg developers hang out on the Fedora development list, linked to in our org profile, as well as #fedora-devel. Come up with some sort of plan, and mail the list to see if you can attract any xorg developers to support your application and mentor it |
| 19:21.42 | pygi | I dont think they even applied |
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| 19:22.23 | cronco | pygi: never thought about that |
| 19:22.36 | cronco | even though I heard they had some problems a few years ago |
| 19:22.57 | pygi | they have problems every year |
| 19:22.57 | cronco | (i.e. dropped out) |
| 19:23.09 | pygi | they dont really care about gsoc, instead they hire people on contracts |
| 19:23.11 | gevaerts | They *are* problems :) |
| 19:23.13 | gevaerts | hides |
| 19:23.16 | pygi | often under same terms on gsoc |
| 19:23.43 | pygi | cronco: take it from someone who himself reviewed over 200 applications for ubuntu in 2006 |
| 19:23.48 | pygi | *shrug* |
| 19:23.59 | rrix | (Fwiw, I think kubuntu did try to apply this year, they had an ideas page up on the ubuntu wiki) |
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| 19:26.02 | cronco | pygi: thanks, i'll do a bit of research on my own |
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| 19:27.56 | tensa_zangetsu | rrix: ok. thank you. |
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| 19:59.26 | dukeleto | does anybody know if it is possible to add multiple people to melange with 'admin' rights, in addition to the main admin and backup admin? |
| 19:59.45 | Nightrose | dukeleto: yes |
| 19:59.47 | gevaerts | "yes" :) |
| 19:59.52 | Nightrose | via "invite as admin" |
| 19:59.54 | Nightrose | but... |
| 19:59.59 | Nightrose | not sure if you should do that atm |
| 20:00.07 | Nightrose | or wait until new UI is deployed |
| 20:00.28 | dukeleto | Nightrose: i have many battle wounds from Melange. The spice is strong in me. I can survive. |
| 20:00.42 | Nightrose | dukeleto: lol - good! - welcome to the club |
| 20:00.55 | Nightrose | dukeleto: btw what's the status of trolluniversity? |
| 20:01.25 | Nightrose | needsmoreaction(TM) |
| 20:01.26 | Nightrose | :P |
| 20:01.45 | dukeleto | Nightrose: we are building our campus in an undisclosed Z-Day Certified (TM) location |
| 20:01.59 | Nightrose | -.- |
| 20:02.01 | Nightrose | good to hear |
| 20:02.17 | gevaerts | bets it's under a bridge |
| 20:02.21 | Nightrose | lol |
| 20:03.01 | dukeleto | the sneakiest trolls bring their bridges with them, where ever they go... |
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| 20:03.39 | gevaerts | That's why I always burn all bridges whenever I travel |
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| 20:11.27 | dberkholz | Nightrose: yeah, we'll get that thing done eventually. =) |
| 20:11.39 | Pharaoh2 | Hi, I am unable to connect to irc.ofct.net which is the IRC Host for qemu-gsoc, if any mentor from qemu can help me out? |
| 20:11.54 | dberkholz | Nightrose: you're not the only one who got busy ... i got caught up in gsoc prep stuff |
| 20:12.13 | dberkholz | Pharaoh2: is a typo your problem? oftc, not ofct |
| 20:12.46 | Pharaoh2 | oh, :(, thanks a lot |
| 20:13.05 | dberkholz | Pharaoh2: if the typo was theirs and not yours, i'm sure they would appreciate being told about it |
| 20:13.17 | Nightrose | dberkholz: yeah :D - any grand masterplan how to get this finished anytime soon? |
| 20:13.36 | Pharaoh2 | no, it was my fault |
| 20:13.37 | dberkholz | Nightrose: set a deadline, perhaps some date by which it wouldn't be useful for this year anymore |
| 20:13.51 | Nightrose | dberkholz: lol - yeah... |
| 20:14.18 | Nightrose | basically to be useful for this year we'd need to get it out in the next week or so |
| 20:14.32 | |Kev| | What needs to be done to it? |
| 20:14.45 | |Kev| | Before it become suseful. |
| 20:14.46 | dberkholz | well, there's not much of it so far that's about the application. a lot would apply more during coding itself |
| 20:14.47 | |Kev| | -typo |
| 20:15.09 | |Kev| | (I'm guessing you're talking about antipatterns without bothering to scrollback) |
| 20:15.15 | dberkholz | checks timeline again |
| 20:15.46 | Nightrose | hmm ok - you know what? i will sit down now and finish that blog post about my visit to india and then try to write some stuff for this |
| 20:15.49 | dberkholz | Nightrose: |Kev|: how about march 28, when student apps open? we're all going to get pretty busy then |
| 20:15.59 | Nightrose | yeah sounds good |
| 20:16.06 | Nightrose | let's get this finished by then |
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| 20:16.25 | |Kev| | Sounds reasonable. |
| 20:16.41 | dberkholz | |Kev|: basically enough info to make it a standalone document without readers requiring explanation from one of us directly =) |
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| 20:17.04 | |Kev| | Roger that. |
| 20:17.09 | Nightrose | is there a good place we can publish it? |
| 20:17.16 | Nightrose | that kinda influences how we write it |
| 20:17.19 | dberkholz | probably a little intro, then more words for each bullet to explain it. maybe some kind of wrap-up |
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| 20:17.27 | dberkholz | Nightrose: google open source blog, probably |
| 20:17.31 | |Kev| | Nightrose: If it's written, it'll get linked to, I'd have thought. |
| 20:17.36 | Nightrose | dberkholz: aha! not bad |
| 20:17.48 | dberkholz | maybe we can stick it onto the gsoc site afterwards |
| 20:18.15 | Nightrose | dberkholz: to get it published on the gsoc blog it takes some time though is my experience |
| 20:18.24 | Nightrose | so we should invite carol now and let her know it is coming |
| 20:18.33 | dberkholz | good plan |
| 20:18.35 | Nightrose | do you mind if i do that? |
| 20:18.47 | |Kev| | Please do. |
| 20:18.52 | Nightrose | ok |
| 20:18.53 | dberkholz | nope |
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| 20:26.02 | *** join/#gsoc Talad (~myself@planeshift/director/Talad) |
| 20:26.04 | Talad | Hi |
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| 20:26.20 | Talad | I've been contacted by some student who is asking if those 40 hours / week are really required |
| 20:26.25 | Talad | he can commit 20 hours / week |
| 20:26.42 | Talad | what's the standard way to handle such a situation? |
| 20:26.54 | |Kev| | "Sorry, GSoC requires the dedication of a full-time job. |
| 20:26.55 | |Kev| | " |
| 20:27.05 | gevaerts | Talad: did he give a reason? |
| 20:27.11 | |Kev| | If it's because they've got another job, it's just tough. |
| 20:27.27 | |Kev| | If it conflicts with exams, or something, or they have some reasonable-sounding excuse, you could try to work something out. |
| 20:27.35 | |Kev| | Like they'd start coding earlier to make up or something. |
| 20:27.41 | summatusmentis | it's sorta dependent on whether your org thinks the project they want to work on can be done in 20hr/week |
| 20:27.48 | Talad | reason was: "half of the working time is in the middle of my term" |
| 20:27.56 | |Kev| | summatusmentis: If the org thinks that, they should have set a harder project, IMO. |
| 20:28.00 | cronco | the same applies for me |
| 20:28.10 | cronco | I've got school until mid-late june |
| 20:28.11 | gevaerts | In my opinion if that reason is "I have another job", it's clearly no. If it's "I live in Brazil/Australia/other southen hemisphere place where he doesn't have much holidays in the period", try to help |
| 20:28.29 | alinrus | cronco: july :) |
| 20:28.34 | |Kev| | Talad: Right, if it's clashing with exams, I'd suggest they start earlier, and intend to go into overdrive once the exams are over (usually halfway through) |
| 20:28.45 | cronco | alinrus: july, right |
| 20:28.55 | summatusmentis | |Kev|: that's probably true, ultimately it's up to the org whether or not that's ok though |
| 20:29.00 | Talad | |Kev|: ok, makes sense. But I guess this will rank him lower on the selection |
| 20:29.01 | gevaerts | I'd suggest *never* to reject someone due to school clashes |
| 20:29.08 | |Kev| | Talad: That is up to you. |
| 20:29.44 | |Kev| | Talad: If your aim is to get a long-term contributor (And that's very often the main org aim), it makes no difference. |
| 20:30.01 | Talad | well, I also want to honor the google program |
| 20:30.07 | Talad | so doing it right |
| 20:30.14 | |Kev| | Your aim could be just free labour for the summer, in which case you want to rank them lower, but I doubt that's anyone's aim. |
| 20:30.34 | Talad | and all the students get the same amount of money, so I want to be fair with others working full time |
| 20:30.37 | |Kev| | Talad: I am not Google, but ISTM to be entirely within the GSoC mantra to support students taking exams. |
| 20:30.52 | |Kev| | Talad: Right, you should work something out, rather than just saying "Oh, do half the work". |
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| 20:31.00 | Talad | agreed |
| 20:31.08 | Talad | why you answer and you are not an op anyway ? |
| 20:31.32 | |Kev| | I would work on the theory that the student can give half hours for the first half, so they can give half hours for a few weeks before as well. |
| 20:31.32 | gevaerts | Being an op doesn't have much to do with knowing answers :) |
| 20:31.58 | Talad | gevaerts: but considering an answer official is part of it I guess |
| 20:31.58 | |Kev| | gevaerts: And knowing answers has little to do with willingness to assert opinions :D |
| 20:32.36 | gevaerts | Talad: most ops here are ops because they've shown to be good ops, not because what they say is official |
| 20:32.56 | Talad | mmm... so ops are not google employee? |
| 20:33.02 | gevaerts | The only way to know if something is official is to check if whoever who said it was using the nick "carols" :) |
| 20:33.06 | gevaerts | no |
| 20:33.20 | |Kev| | Talad: Ultimately, you can ignore everything I've said if you so wish. It is advice offered in good faith, but it is only my advice, for the little that's worth. |
| 20:33.33 | Talad | I think it's good advise |
| 20:33.39 | Talad | but I want to know if it was also official |
| 20:33.49 | |Kev| | 20:30 < |Kev|> Talad: I am not Google |
| 20:33.49 | Talad | and I understand it's not |
| 20:33.53 | Talad | but still good advise |
| 20:34.08 | Talad | thanks |
| 20:34.09 | user | hi all |
| 20:34.11 | gevaerts | Well, you can only get an official answer on weekdays during California working time :) |
| 20:34.12 | Talad | bye |
| 20:34.12 | |Kev| | If you want official, it's best to wait until carols is here, probably around mid-afternoon UTC tomorrow. |
| 20:34.23 | gevaerts | I'm pretty sure the official answer will be "It's up to you" though |
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| 20:35.23 | user | where i can registery in gcos ? |
| 20:35.57 | |Kev| | !next |
| 20:35.57 | socinfo | |Kev|: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
| 20:36.00 | |Kev| | user: ^ |
| 20:36.21 | Talad | ah, I have another question |
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| 20:36.30 | |Kev| | I have another answer. |
| 20:36.35 | |Kev| | Let's see if they match :) |
| 20:36.39 | gevaerts | I have *two* answers! |
| 20:36.44 | |Kev| | Show-off. |
| 20:36.48 | Talad | how much of the ideas should be developed by the students? |
| 20:36.56 | |Kev| | Talad: Entirely up to you. |
| 20:36.58 | Talad | like we have an idea half specified |
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| 20:37.08 | Talad | but I'm willing to work now to make it more clear |
| 20:37.11 | |Kev| | Ah, right. |
| 20:37.19 | |Kev| | I think it should be clear from the idea what the general aim is. |
| 20:37.23 | Talad | and I can use some of the students right now to specify it |
| 20:37.29 | |Kev| | This is now strictly my opinion, not advice. |
| 20:37.33 | gevaerts | I'd say "enough to make sure that the student fully understands the idea and its implications" |
| 20:37.38 | Talad | or I can tell them to propose their project idea later on the application |
| 20:37.59 | Talad | I think the more it's specified the better |
| 20:37.59 | |Kev| | I think the student should give an outline in their application of what they think the steps would be to complete it (And they should be discussing this with you during this period). |
| 20:38.09 | |Kev| | And you and the student would, post-acceptance, work out appropriate project plans. |
| 20:38.23 | |Kev| | The aim isn't to play 'guess-the-aims' IMO. |
| 20:38.25 | Talad | a technical explanation? like a design document? |
| 20:38.28 | |Kev| | So specify as fully as you like. |
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| 20:39.14 | cronco | from your experience, has any organization ever requested things like formal UML on a student application? |
| 20:39.19 | Talad | but yes... probably it's a good idea to have the students not only understand the idea, but really proposing a way forwar |
| 20:39.20 | Talad | d |
| 20:39.31 | Talad | so it makes easier for me to judge if they can really do it |
| 20:39.34 | gevaerts | If your requirements are very specific, specify a lot. If it's a much vaguer thing, you can let the student specify more |
| 20:39.37 | gevaerts | yes |
| 20:39.57 | Talad | I will not specify and implementation detail |
| 20:39.58 | |Kev| | I like there to be enough scope that the student has to show that they have more of an understanding than the ability to copy/paste. |
| 20:40.01 | Talad | so they have to think about it |
| 20:40.08 | gevaerts | You don't want the students to spend three weeks trying to understand what you mean, but you don't want them to just point at your text either |
| 20:40.09 | user | this project start every year??\\ |
| 20:40.19 | |Kev| | Once they're accepted, you should do everything necessary to get them on the right track. |
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| 20:40.27 | Talad | yes user |
| 20:40.29 | |Kev| | Whatever is appropriate for that student. |
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| 20:40.46 | |Kev| | user: It has run each year since 2005 (Was '05 or '04? '05 I think). |
| 20:40.53 | |Kev| | Hopefully it will continue to run in the future, but there is no guarantee. |
| 20:41.01 | meenuh | i also have a question! |
| 20:41.19 | gevaerts | I used up one answer, but I still have one left! |
| 20:41.38 | user | thank)0 |
| 20:41.55 | Talad | ok, I have another one :) |
| 20:41.58 | alinrus | Talad: as a former student I can say that the initial specifications change a lot until the end. the aim of the project should be clear, and some tight constraints if there are some, otherwise let the students experiment |
| 20:42.13 | Talad | I received a proposal to be a mentor from a person I don't know |
| 20:42.30 | Talad | I just saw his notification now on google |
| 20:42.30 | Talad | but how can I contact him? |
| 20:42.30 | Talad | there is just the ID and no email |
| 20:42.47 | |Kev| | If you don't know them, you don't want them as a mentor. |
| 20:42.59 | meenuh | so how much should the student know about the project when writing their proposals? |
| 20:43.05 | |Kev| | There are many people who try to game the system by applying to be mentors with orgs with whom they have no cannection. |
| 20:43.06 | Talad | maybe it's someone I know, but I don't know they are that ID |
| 20:43.19 | |Kev| | Talad: Then they will let you know that they appled. |
| 20:43.47 | Talad | eh, message is not very good :) |
| 20:43.49 | Talad | "I'ld like to work with you. |
| 20:43.49 | Talad | How I can do it ?" |
| 20:43.53 | meenuh | should it be really specific? |
| 20:43.57 | gevaerts | meenuh: "as much as possible", but I guess you might want more detailed answers :) |
| 20:44.08 | Talad | I agree mentors should be within the organization |
| 20:44.14 | |Kev| | meenuh: Students shouldn't have to guess what the projects are. |
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| 20:44.16 | alinrus | the proposal is refined until the deadline |
| 20:44.30 | |Kev| | Or were you asking from the student PoV? |
| 20:44.35 | alinrus | keep in touch with the would be mentors and you should have a great proposal until then |
| 20:44.54 | meenuh | |Kev|: student pov :3 |
| 20:45.08 | gevaerts | Talad: at first that sounds like some unknown external mentor... |
| 20:45.24 | Talad | yes, I think he is |
| 20:45.32 | Talad | probably trying to get 500$ |
| 20:45.36 | Talad | I will not answer |
| 20:45.44 | gevaerts | Talad: I understand that somewhere next week there will be an update to the melange software that will include more detail in the mentor request |
| 20:45.56 | |Kev| | Or they just want a T-Shirt. But in any case, if you don't know that you know them, you don't want them. |
| 20:46.09 | |Kev| | meenuh: You should ask the orgs how much detail they want, if you're in doubt. |
| 20:46.54 | meenuh | okay, thank you. |
| 20:46.54 | SRabbelier | Talad: mentors don't get the $500 in all organizations btw |
| 20:47.07 | SRabbelier | Talad: for example, with git all the money goes to funding Git meetings and whatnot |
| 20:47.13 | Dark_Shikari | Yeah, mentors don't get any money |
| 20:47.15 | Dark_Shikari | the organization gets money |
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| 20:47.26 | Dark_Shikari | if you choose to give the mentors the money that's your business. we don't. |
| 20:47.29 | SRabbelier | Talad: there's really no motivation for someone to fake to be a mentor |
| 20:47.46 | gevaerts | SRabbelier: but do those fake mentors know that? |
| 20:47.49 | Dark_Shikari | unless they also accept a scam student and take part of the money. |
| 20:47.55 | Dark_Shikari | .... but that's going into conspiracy-land. |
| 20:47.56 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: maybe we should tell them :P |
| 20:48.07 | SRabbelier | Dark_Shikari: indeed |
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| 20:48.33 | gevaerts | I know I'll get part of the rockbox money, but only after it's converted to beer :) |
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| 20:48.44 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: lol :) |
| 20:49.07 | Talad | SRabbelier: considering the message seems really someone outside our team |
| 20:49.07 | Dark_Shikari | well, as we know from the ballmer peak, beer can be converted into code |
| 20:49.15 | gevaerts | SRabbelier: seriously :). Part of our fund is used to help pay for developer conferences, and that includes beer! |
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| 20:49.34 | SRabbelier | gevaerts: + to that |
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| 20:50.23 | meenuh | ' |
| 20:50.35 | schumaml | SRabbelier: they could still vote, so if anyone wanted to attack the goc program itself, this could be their way in |
| 20:50.41 | schumaml | *gsoc |
| 20:50.48 | meenuh | ack, sorry, cat stepped on the keyboard D: |
| 20:50.53 | SRabbelier | schumaml: I suppose |
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| 20:51.08 | gevaerts | schumaml: I'd guess that as soon as you (the admin) spots this, you'll have an ex-mentor |
| 20:52.03 | schumaml | if the admin spots this |
| 20:52.47 | dberkholz | Dark_Shikari: that's pretty difficult since orgs get paid directly now, not mentors |
| 20:53.00 | Dark_Shikari | that's what I just said |
| 20:53.25 | gevaerts | I find it hard to imagine that someone who understands gsoc would try this |
| 20:53.37 | gevaerts | Someone who only saw "$500 per mentor" might have a go though |
| 20:53.51 | dberkholz | oh, so you were saying that this would only happen at one of the orgs that later passes out the money |
| 20:54.08 | Dark_Shikari | I was saying it wouldn't happen period |
| 20:54.20 | gevaerts | Well, it wouldn't *work* |
| 20:54.26 | dberkholz | seems like a fair amount of work for not that much money |
| 20:54.37 | scorche | schumaml: but the admins can disable voting |
| 20:54.37 | gevaerts | dberkholz: only if you understand gsoc |
| 20:54.42 | schumaml | gevaerts: think less of "crazy individual" (ka troll), more like "group with an agenda" |
| 20:54.45 | Dark_Shikari | don't underestimate third world countries |
| 20:55.06 | schumaml | e.g. anonymous |
| 20:55.14 | scorche | schumaml: many orgs do not use the voting/scoring mechanisms in the app |
| 20:55.14 | Dark_Shikari | no, anonymous does not care about gsoc |
| 20:55.17 | dberkholz | to make it work properly, you should be a mentor known in the project under an alias, actually be a student, and apply as both student and mentor for the same project |
| 20:55.30 | dberkholz | but you still need to supply the code in the end, so it's kind of a waste |
| 20:55.54 | schumaml | Dark_Shikari: let's hope they don't, but you get the idea |
| 20:56.05 | *** join/#gsoc cancelme (~cancelme@79.112.125.237) |
| 20:56.05 | |Kev| | It's not a waste, you end up with $5000 for the priviledge of writing code. |
| 20:56.06 | scorche | schumaml: it really isnt that easy... |
| 20:56.08 | Dark_Shikari | also anonymous isn't a group |
| 20:56.16 | Dark_Shikari | |Kev|: you can do that without scamming though |
| 20:56.19 | |Kev| | I just can't imagine anyone managing to pull it off. |
| 20:56.22 | Dark_Shikari | I've known orgs that had developers intentionally sign up as students |
| 20:56.29 | Dark_Shikari | do lots of real, good work |
| 20:56.31 | Dark_Shikari | and get paid for it. |
| 20:56.43 | |Kev| | Dark_Shikari: Right, if you're a known mentor. |
| 20:56.47 | gevaerts | schumaml: I'd agree that with enough work, you can get $5500 ($500 for the mentor, $5000 for the student). As scams go, is that worth it? |
| 20:56.52 | dberkholz | the only scam part might be if you were good enough to hold a full-time job simultaneously and not tell anyone about it |
| 20:56.56 | |Kev| | (I've done GSoC when I was already a dev) |
| 20:57.00 | Dark_Shikari | that's not a scam either, dberkholz |
| 20:57.10 | Dark_Shikari | it doesn't matter how much time you dedicate to gsoc as long as you do the job |
| 20:57.12 | dberkholz | it is if the org explicitly prohibits it and you lie... |
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| 20:57.49 | dberkholz | anyway, enough time spent on miniscule corner cases |
| 20:58.02 | gevaerts | dberkholz: it would be bad faith, sure, but I'm not sure if I'd call that a scam |
| 20:58.25 | gevaerts | I mean, burglary is bad faith as well, but not usually called a scam either :) |
| 20:58.45 | dberkholz | a more interesting possibility would be having pre-written code that's just pushed publicly over the course of the summer |
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| 20:59.16 | gevaerts | hm |
| 20:59.21 | cronco | that would mean knowing what the project will be from the get-go |
| 20:59.26 | gevaerts | It's only $5000 per student! |
| 20:59.28 | wtachi | you'd have to successfully oppose changes to the code |
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| 21:00.04 | cancelme | !next |
| 21:00.04 | socinfo | cancelme: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
| 21:00.08 | dberkholz | or hiring someone else to ghostwrite the proposal and code for cheaper |
| 21:00.16 | gevaerts | If I want money and I don't care about ethics, I'll send emails to everyone telling about the $50000000 I want them to share, and I'll get much more than $5000 |
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| 21:00.47 | cronco | dberkholtz: that wouldn't work either |
| 21:00.49 | Dark_Shikari | I don't think that works that well these days |
| 21:00.53 | gevaerts | So yes, dishonesty will happen, but I don't believe in large scale organised scamming of gsoc |
| 21:01.03 | dberkholz | cronco: how come? |
| 21:01.09 | cronco | what would stop the one hired to do the proposal to do the proposal under his own name? |
| 21:01.18 | dberkholz | not everybody is a student |
| 21:01.21 | gevaerts | You don't tell him about gsoc |
| 21:01.49 | cronco | well, yes, not everyone's a student |
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| 21:02.14 | cronco | but that would infer that he is a graduate/drop-out, with the chops to make such a proposal |
| 21:02.21 | cronco | and to write the code |
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| 21:02.44 | cronco | unless he's unemployed, it would be hard to make it worth his while |
| 21:02.55 | cronco | being that he's a skilled coder |
| 21:02.58 | dberkholz | yep. you contract someone in a country with a low cost of living for a month's work, for perhaps $1000. |
| 21:03.03 | wolfb | !next |
| 21:03.03 | socinfo | wolfb: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
| 21:03.39 | dberkholz | i need to do some other stuff now. i'll worry about this when i think it's happening =) |
| 21:03.45 | wolfb | when is the rejection meeting again, was it on the 21st at 16:00 UTC? |
| 21:03.56 | dhaun | !meeting |
| 21:03.56 | cronco | I'm not sure what the lowest average salary would be for a decent coder anywhere in the world |
| 21:03.56 | socinfo | dhaun: "meeting" is The IRC meeting for rejected orgs is 16:00 UTC on 22 March in this channel. |
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| 21:04.05 | |Kev| | !meeting |
| 21:04.05 | socinfo | |Kev|: "meeting" is The IRC meeting for rejected orgs is 16:00 UTC on 22 March in this channel. |
| 21:04.10 | wolfb | thanks dhaun :) |
| 21:04.10 | |Kev| | Oh, sorry, much too slow |
| 21:04.11 | cronco | wolfb: wow, rejection meeting. that sounds like the story of my life |
| 21:04.18 | wolfb | XD |
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| 21:07.41 | dberkholz | cronco: you got me all curious. payscale.com says software developers in india average ~$6500 USD per year, so 3 months for gsoc would be ~$1500 |
| 21:07.58 | dberkholz | now i really gotta run. |
| 21:08.19 | |Kev| | Antipattern: Spending all day debating consipracies on IRC instead of coding :) |
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| 21:08.22 | |Kev| | Bye dberkholz |
| 21:08.35 | gevaerts | |Kev|: it's our day off! |
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| 21:09.00 | cronco | |Kev|: it _could_ be feasable |
| 21:09.01 | dberkholz | |Kev|: http://twitter.com/#!/nearyd/status/47315179356160000 |
| 21:09.08 | |Kev| | Actually, I'm in an off period of coding, we're in code freeze ready for a 1.0 release at the moment, so I'm working on the website. This does not amuse me. |
| 21:09.11 | cronco | I don't think anyone's doing it, though |
| 21:09.26 | |Kev| | dberkholz: Hehe. |
| 21:09.47 | |Kev| | Hrmm, that was supposed to be a manly 'heh', instead of a schoolgirl giggle, but oh well. |
| 21:10.03 | GeorgeZZ | Dropped and come back. |
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| 21:41.25 | |Kev| | Evening lh. |
| 21:41.55 | lh | |Kev|: greetings |
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| 22:15.33 | Upthorn | !next |
| 22:15.34 | socinfo | Upthorn: "next" is March 18-27: Would-be student participants discuss application ideas with mentoring organizations. |
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| 22:37.51 | *** join/#gsoc bahaa (~bahaa@188.161.143.51) |
| 22:38.12 | bahaa | hi people |
| 22:38.16 | bahaa | just a question |
| 22:38.28 | bahaa | how would google know if i'm really a student ? |
| 22:38.33 | bahaa | by the application ? |
| 22:38.55 | *** join/#gsoc mog_ (8d72d669@gateway/web/freenode/ip.141.114.214.105) |
| 22:39.23 | SITZ | can a student apply for more than one idea given by a org ? |
| 22:39.32 | gevaerts | bahaa: they'll ask for some paperwork |
| 22:39.42 | bahaa | gevaerts, I see |
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| 22:39.57 | bahaa | SITZ, i think it's up to 20 application |
| 22:40.06 | gevaerts | SITZ: yes, but it's considered good form to talk to them first |
| 22:40.06 | ojwb | SITZ: yes, but you should probably talk to the org first |
| 22:40.27 | SITZ | okay, i see |
| 22:40.33 | ojwb | and 20 is just an insanity check |
| 22:40.46 | SITZ | ojwb: yeah! kind of :| |
| 22:41.07 | ojwb | the average is < 2 |
| 22:41.25 | SITZ | actually I want to work with an org and I can't decide which one one is the best for me |
| 22:41.49 | ojwb | a backup application can be wise, but I'd say stick to 2 |
| 22:41.56 | SITZ | I tried to narrow the possobilities but, all I can do is to reduce them to 3 ! |
| 22:42.02 | gevaerts | Talk to all of the ones you can't decide between |
| 22:42.02 | ojwb | well, talk to them |
| 22:42.12 | ojwb | they may be able to say which seem best suited to your skills |
| 22:42.13 | gevaerts | Hopefully some of them will turn out to be horrible :) |
| 22:42.23 | ojwb | or which they've had a thousand student interested in already |
| 22:42.35 | SITZ | gevaerts: I guesss they don't ! |
| 22:43.02 | gevaerts | SITZ: oh, well. In that case one of them may turn out to be more awesome than the others |
| 22:44.00 | SITZ | ok, one more thing how will they choose me if they judge me good for both og the ideas I've applies ? |
| 22:44.17 | gevaerts | That's why you've been talking to them first! |
| 22:44.24 | SITZ | i mean for which idea will pre preferred for me ? |
| 22:44.32 | brlcad | SITZ: the orgs will work it out with you if you get accepted to more than one |
| 22:44.34 | SITZ | ok.. got that :) |
| 22:45.01 | ojwb | SITZ: you're talking about two ideas *with the same org* aren't you? |
| 22:45.04 | brlcad | the orgs get notified if that happens |
| 22:45.10 | SITZ | ojwb: yes |
| 22:45.20 | protoss_Z | is it tough for an inexperienced freshman to get accepted? |
| 22:45.28 | ojwb | ok, that's not quite the same |
| 22:45.40 | SITZ | ojwb: then ? |
| 22:45.42 | ojwb | it's entirely up to the org how they choose then |
| 22:45.55 | gevaerts | If you're good enough for more than one project within one org, you should have talked to them about this, and there should be some understanding on both sides about which one is preferred. If not, you haven't talked enough |
| 22:46.00 | ojwb | but I'd consider factors like which mentors are available and interested |
| 22:46.05 | gevaerts | !goodenough |
| 22:46.05 | socinfo | gevaerts: "goodenough" is Am I good enough to be a student for GSoC? http://www.booki.cc/gsocstudentguide/_v/1.0/am-i-good-enough/ |
| 22:46.09 | gevaerts | protoss_Z: ^^ |
| 22:46.14 | ojwb | which application seems more likely to succeed |
| 22:46.26 | ojwb | which project is more useful |
| 22:46.50 | ojwb | and which has other good applications |
| 22:47.11 | SITZ | ojwb: hmm .. i better get it cleared with the mentors, right ? |
| 22:47.35 | ojwb | it's always good to talk to the org |
| 22:47.41 | *** join/#gsoc clsk (clsk@unaffiliated/clsk) |
| 22:47.43 | scorche | communication is key ;) |
| 22:47.45 | gevaerts | SITZ: the *very* *first* rule of gsoc is *communicate* |
| 22:47.53 | gevaerts | The second rule is "talk" |
| 22:48.00 | ojwb | if we've heard from you before the application, that gives us more information to work with, so you're at an advantage over students who don't get in touch |
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| 22:48.04 | scorche | the third rule is "discuss" |
| 22:48.23 | gevaerts | The theme changes after the fifteenth rule or so |
| 22:48.50 | klickverbot | I know that various sources, e.g. !goodenough, mention that GSoC is a full-time job. However, I was just asked if there was an official source for this â is there? |
| 22:49.14 | ojwb | i believe the faq mentions it |
| 22:49.37 | ojwb | but the student manual was cowritten by carols, so is pretty close toofficial |
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| 22:51.17 | gevaerts | She also stated it on http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/20110317.html.gz |
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| 22:52.16 | klickverbot | Okay, thanks a lot you both |
| 22:53.26 | gevaerts | http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/faqs#time_student |
| 22:53.52 | gevaerts | Of course "your primary focus this summer" doesn't literally say "full-time job", but I'd say it's close enough |
| 22:55.10 | gevaerts | Also take into account that an organisation is basically free to reject any application it doesn't like |
| 22:55.39 | gevaerts | So arguing that this rule isn't clear if the organisation has clearly said that they read it as "40 hours a week" isn't going to get you very far |
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| 22:56.19 | gevaerts | All that said however, most organisations are prepared to be flexible with this if there's a good reason, such as "Student is not in the USA, so the schedule doesn't fit well" |
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| 22:56.45 | klickverbot | I know, yes (the question really wasn't for myself, by the way, I have a wonderful lot of spare time to spend during the summer^^) |
| 22:56.51 | klickverbot | Anyway, thanks a lot again |
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| 23:10.57 | ojwb | klickverbot: did you do the SWIG D stuff? |
| 23:11.11 | klickverbot | ojwb: Yes |
| 23:11.19 | ojwb | ah, so that's why the nick is familiar |
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| 23:13.05 | klickverbot | ojwb: Oh, so I guess your name is Olly? |
| 23:13.11 | ojwb | indeed |
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