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| 00:20.41 | SeriousWorm | I wonder if we get to keep last year's cards or will we get new ones |
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| 00:20.56 | SeriousWorm | keeping with uniformity, I'm guessing everyone will get a new one, regardless whether they have one already |
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| 00:22.27 | SeriousWorm | last year's cards were the coolest cards ever, semi-transparent |
| 00:22.33 | SeriousWorm | everyone was wowed when I showed them :) |
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| 00:23.06 | MatthewWilkes | just having a Google card in your wallet is almost enough reason to take part ;) |
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| 00:24.23 | dsathe | any open source enthusiasts will absolutely love this on http://videos-cdn.mozilla.net/brand/Mozilla_Firefox_Manifesto_v0.2_640.webm check it out ! |
| 00:24.48 | SeriousWorm | wow i love the 0.1 sec load time of native webm in opera |
| 00:25.00 | SeriousWorm | basically instant (as opposed to youtube for example) |
| 00:29.10 | X-tonic | How open is opera? |
| 00:29.16 | X-tonic | is it gpl? |
| 00:29.18 | dsathe | immaterial |
| 00:29.25 | dsathe | amazing add looooved it |
| 00:29.26 | X-tonic | no, but curious |
| 00:29.31 | ojwb | it's proprietary isn't it? |
| 00:29.36 | dsathe | it is open afail |
| 00:29.53 | X-tonic | oh... yea, even i thought it was proprietory |
| 00:30.22 | SeriousWorm | opera isn't open source in any way |
| 00:30.31 | dsathe | not my bad |
| 00:31.17 | SeriousWorm | however, it definitely feels like it's user-driven. I'm a opera user for years and years and while it is indeed closed source, it's so good (perfect) that I forgive them that |
| 00:32.00 | SeriousWorm | I have no idea who opera devs are, but the browser is so good, I'd make a barbecue for them if they came around to my town or something :) |
| 00:32.08 | dsathe | :D |
| 00:32.09 | X-tonic | It still should try a linux port |
| 00:32.20 | SeriousWorm | ? opera has versions on every imaginable platform |
| 00:32.31 | dsathe | cannot adjust to anything but firefox |
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| 00:32.56 | simonl | I think opera is the most cross platform browser available, even more than firefox |
| 00:32.59 | X-tonic | oh right.. didnt know abt opera linu |
| 00:33.14 | dsathe | the closest that i have come to using any other browser is epiphany 3.4 |
| 00:33.27 | X-tonic | mainly because it isnt on the default repositories |
| 00:33.44 | SeriousWorm | here are the versions for popular OSs http://www.opera.com/browser/download/?custom=yes |
| 00:34.02 | dsathe | opera is good indeed , just cannot adjust to its interface |
| 00:34.27 | SeriousWorm | you don't have to, everything is customizable :) anyway this isn't an opera channel so I'll stop discussion about it. |
| 00:34.29 | sharvey | cheese is so delicious |
| 00:34.35 | sharvey | on the topic of opera |
| 00:34.52 | sharvey | oh, that opera |
| 00:34.59 | sharvey | i.e. the browser, not the performance kind |
| 00:35.06 | zomux | opera is fast , on slow computer ... |
| 00:35.16 | simonl | I pretty sure preformance is involved actually ;-) |
| 00:35.52 | sharvey | wrong use of words |
| 00:36.25 | X-tonic | I have 180 tabs on firefox, i dont see any performance issue yet. |
| 00:36.28 | simonl | notices how bad he's writing; decides to go to bed |
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| 00:42.17 | tian2992 | opera is good! |
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| 00:57.35 | asdou | Carol said in the email, that some students may not want ACM membership this year, why is that ? |
| 00:58.11 | sharvey | asdou: some may already have acm membership paid for? |
| 00:58.56 | asdou | sharvey, so it is only about already having ACM membership already |
| 00:59.13 | sharvey | others may not want to be part of acm |
| 00:59.14 | ojwb | i think you could extend an existing membership by a year |
| 00:59.40 | sharvey | maybe they're not in computing, so really have no need to be part of a computing org? |
| 00:59.41 | ojwb | though if you had life membership, a one year extension isn't so useful |
| 01:00.12 | sharvey | ojwb: yeah, I'm seeing if I can get my membership extended |
| 01:00.24 | sharvey | I've been a paying student member for 2 years |
| 01:00.28 | asdou | Ok, will check to see what the ACM membership is useful for |
| 01:01.06 | sharvey | the benefits are pretty cool; I like having an @acm.org e-mail :) |
| 01:01.12 | ojwb | sharvey: i don't know the details, but i'm fairly sure i've heard it is possible |
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| 04:43.13 | unimauro | alguien de Perú en gsoc ? :s Somebody from Perú in Gsoc ? |
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| 06:54.58 | zfe | Morning |
| 06:55.33 | Arjun05 | ahoy |
| 06:56.48 | zfe | how's it going |
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| 07:18.12 | kai | hi folks |
| 07:18.28 | kai | shouldn't I be able to assign additional mentors to accepted proposals now? |
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| 08:34.45 | ojwb | kai: if it's possible, it's not obvious to me how to do it either |
| 08:37.46 | kai | ok, so it's not just me being blind |
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| 08:37.46 | ojwb | unless you assign a mentor and that doesn't just replace the current one |
| 08:37.46 | ojwb | comentors were possible last year I think |
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| 08:37.56 | kai | yeah, that was the plan |
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| 08:46.56 | |Kev| | kai: I *thought* that assigning additional mentors was conceptual, rather than through Melange. |
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| 08:56.32 | ojwb | |Kev|: pretty sure the concept was made more material last year |
| 08:56.45 | |Kev| | That's what I remembered, yeah. |
| 08:56.58 | |Kev| | But I thought someone vaguely official had said you didn't do it this year. |
| 08:57.04 | |Kev| | I may have misremembered. |
| 08:57.17 | kai | |Kev|: but last year having two mentors assigned meant either of them could fill out the evals |
| 08:57.38 | ojwb | or that both assume the other will |
| 08:57.56 | kai | I need to micro-manage these cases if I can only assign one mentor |
| 08:58.46 | |Kev| | kai: Understood :) |
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| 09:00.41 | kai | of course if the official stance is to not have official co-mentors, that's what I'll have to do |
| 09:01.02 | kai | I don't have any students to mentor myself this year, so I'll have more admining time ;) |
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| 09:04.17 | mark_h | on the non us "tax" form the place for the address is just one line, is it ok if it overlaps into the date part? |
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| 09:24.07 | kai | oh, it's that "I'm getting so much spam from the mentors list"-time of the year again |
| 09:25.22 | fubhy | kai: I feel very tempted to shoot a message to the mailing list yelling at everyone to stop spamming me with random questions for Carol. But that seems rather counter-productive :P |
| 09:25.33 | |Kev| | Also known as the "I don't understand the Internet" time of year. |
| 09:25.54 | fubhy | today I woke up to 32 e-mails from the mailing list |
| 09:26.15 | fubhy | 10 of which were from Carol saying "please dont ask me stuff on the mailing list, it spams everyone else" |
| 09:26.28 | mark_h | yeah its not that bad |
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| 09:29.55 | ojwb | "your message will cost open source hundreds if not thousands of man hours"... |
| 09:30.22 | gevaerts | recommends reading the mythical man-hour |
| 09:31.09 | fubhy | ojwb it costs me frustration ;) |
| 09:31.11 | ojwb | is that a precis version of the mythical man month? |
| 09:31.27 | |Kev| | I really should read that, it's sitting on my shelf. |
| 09:31.47 | gevaerts | It is :) |
| 09:32.06 | gevaerts | should probably re-read it one of these days. Last time was at least fifteen years ago |
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| 10:46.21 | guifre | !logs |
| 10:46.21 | gsocbot | guifre: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
| 10:47.54 | blacktooth | !stats |
| 10:47.55 | gsocbot | blacktooth: I have 2 registered users with 2 registered hostmasks; 1 owner and 0 admins. |
| 10:48.14 | zomux | !stats |
| 10:48.14 | gsocbot | zomux: I have 2 registered users with 2 registered hostmasks; 1 owner and 0 admins. |
| 10:48.18 | zomux | !next |
| 10:48.19 | gsocbot | zomux: "next" is Community Bonding Period (until May 21): Students get to know mentors, read documentation, get up to speed to begin working on their projects. |
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| 10:51.10 | ojwb | !numapps | blacktooth |
| 10:51.11 | gsocbot | blacktooth: "numapps" is In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
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| 10:59.15 | blacktooth | ojwb: thanks. I was looking for it :D |
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| 10:59.35 | ojwb | guessed |
| 10:59.46 | ojwb | it's quite common for people to try !stats |
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| 11:41.23 | vipulnsward | !logs |
| 11:41.23 | gsocbot | vipulnsward: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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| 12:25.08 | dark-al | hi. In my dashboard todo list I see: "School name selected from autocomplete - no" and "Set 'additional info' for... - no". What does it mean? Thanks. |
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| 12:28.31 | jsalatas | dark-al: don't bother with that (according to carol) |
| 12:29.10 | dark-al | jsalatas, ok :) |
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| 12:31.43 | ojwb | the autocomplete one doesn't matter if you filled in the school name by hand |
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| 12:31.56 | ojwb | it's good to add additional info to your project |
| 12:32.20 | ojwb | the synopsis is usually a bit minimal |
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| 12:32.29 | ojwb | dark-al: ^ |
| 12:32.48 | AndChat|198900 | Hi all |
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| 12:35.25 | AndChat|198900 | anybody from ascend |
| 12:35.30 | dark-al | ojwb, yes, I manually enter university name. |
| 12:35.52 | kai | !anyone | AndChat|198900 |
| 12:35.53 | gsocbot | AndChat|198900: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here> |
| 12:36.56 | AndChat|198900 | Ok |
| 12:37.32 | AndChat|198900 | :) |
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| 13:01.36 | sontek | Can a project only have 1 accepted mentor? We had 2 students and each only have a single mentor assigned but we would like 2 mentors per student if possible |
| 13:02.53 | |Kev| | sontek: I *think* that as things stand you only have one mentor marked in Melange. |
| 13:03.09 | |Kev| | But you should have both mentors act like mentors in practice. |
| 13:03.22 | David_Honeynet | sontek: you can only have one official mentor via melange, but you can still assign multiple mentors internally |
| 13:03.30 | David_Honeynet | or what |Kev| said ;-) |
| 13:03.47 | David_Honeynet | we call ours primary and supporting mentors |
| 13:04.12 | David_Honeynet | with the primary responsible for completing mid-term/final assessments, etc but otherwise they work as a team |
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| 13:05.50 | sontek | That sounds perfect |
| 13:05.59 | kai | shrugs |
| 13:06.06 | kai | I've already asked on melange-soc |
| 13:06.50 | kai | according to the list, once the next push hits the production systems, we'll be able to assign co-mentors again |
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| 13:08.22 | Ident | google mailing list ftw |
| 13:08.40 | Ident | the things i never wanted to know, directly in my serious mail account, every day! |
| 13:08.56 | Ident | "I want to notice you that I will move in another flat next week so I need to update my shipment address." <--- should i send him flowers? |
| 13:08.59 | David_Honeynet | kai: even better then :) |
| 13:09.34 | MatthewWilkes | I blame the GSoC mailing lists for confusing my spam filter |
| 13:10.02 | MatthewWilkes | it correctly recognises that kind of nonsense email as spam, but misses "Subject: Western union payment" |
| 13:10.30 | |Kev| | I can't use the mailing lists. There's too much mail, I can't cope. |
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| 13:10.40 | |Kev| | I've had at least three mails today. |
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| 13:14.02 | Lennie | |Kev|, which lists :P? |
| 13:14.09 | Lennie | I just put them on daily summary ^^ |
| 13:14.18 | malex_ | Setting gsoc-mentors to web delivery is a no-op it seems. I'm still getting emails. |
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| 13:14.57 | kai | malex_: are you subscribed with multiple accounts? |
| 13:15.32 | |Kev| | Lennie: It was a flippancy - someone was complaining that they couldn't unsubscribe from the mentors' list. |
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| 13:15.59 | Lennie | |Kev|, they'll get re-added anyway :P |
| 13:16.17 | |Kev| | That's what they were complaining about :) |
| 13:16.19 | Lennie | If you are a mentor you will be subscribed by Carol since important announcements are mdde :D |
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| 13:16.28 | Lennie | made* |
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| 13:17.53 | kai | I suggested to just ditch all mails not from @google.com |
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| 13:18.03 | kai | if getting emails really distresses them |
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| 13:18.53 | malex | kai: nope |
| 13:19.11 | kai | shrugs |
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| 13:19.59 | Lennie | kai, :P |
| 13:20.07 | Lennie | kai, that skips mails from madhu though which are important too |
| 13:20.08 | |Kev| | I can understand with the students list, that used to be quite noisy (although I seem to not be on it any more, I thought alumni stayed subscribed), but the mentors list is really very low volume. Even during the P* thread. |
| 13:20.15 | malex | kai: actually, that now looks like a distinct possibility. I think I got autosubscribed with another email. |
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| 13:21.44 | malex | kai: I just like reading the mentors list outside of my email client, that's all. |
| 13:21.52 | malex | I mean |Kev| |
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| 13:22.15 | Lennie | Also I can't believe that person hijacked the thread like that :P |
| 13:22.17 | Lennie | At least make a new one |
| 13:22.22 | kai | hehe |
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| 13:22.34 | kai | Lennie: you'd think mentors get how the internet works |
| 13:22.49 | kai | but the mentor list proves otherwise, every year |
| 13:22.51 | Lennie | kai, I've learned a long time ago that they are just like normal users :) |
| 13:23.12 | Lennie | kai, I think that's because they have to use Melange ;P |
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| 13:24.06 | Lennie | anyhow, you should be able to assign co mentors again in the near future :D and still looking into why the GCI blobs haven't migrated properly |
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| 13:25.31 | MatthewWilkes | Lennie: Maybe they tired of being locked up in GAE and left to see the world? |
| 13:26.11 | Lennie | MatthewWilkes, who knows :P |
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| 13:26.29 | Lennie | kai, is there any particular file you are in need of/ |
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| 13:33.41 | malex | I wonder who I could ping to remove one of my addresses from the mentor and anounce lists. |
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| 13:42.15 | kai | Lennie: hmm |
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| 13:44.53 | ojwb | thinks it would be better to have an announce list people are autosubscribed to and a discuss one they can choose to join (or to leave) |
| 13:45.08 | ojwb | as it is, people have to filter the discuss to produce an announce list |
| 13:45.34 | kai | Lennie: the last download of http://www.google-melange.com/gci/task/view/google/gci2010/7074228 would be nice |
| 13:45.49 | kai | I've already located all of the other files I was interested in |
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| 13:48.16 | Lennie | kai, that's the one you linked me to before right? |
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| 13:49.48 | kai | Lennie: possibly, let me check :) |
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| 13:50.16 | kai | Lennie: correct |
| 13:50.57 | Lennie | kai, looks like powerpoint templates |
| 13:51.01 | Lennie | does that make sense? |
| 13:51.28 | JordiGH | itym libreoffice |
| 13:51.32 | JordiGH | haha |
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| 13:52.24 | kai | Lennie: hm, no, I'd expect a blender model.. or maybe an ogre3d binary file |
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| 13:53.41 | Lennie | kai ah :) |
| 13:53.42 | Lennie | yeah |
| 13:54.16 | Lennie | let me wrap it up for you and send it |
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| 13:55.44 | kai | great customer service :) |
| 13:55.53 | bobbyaldol | hey I am new to this channel but cannot understand something. Is this channel for people selected for GSoC or people who want to... |
| 13:57.03 | kai | this is a channel for all things GSoC |
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| 13:57.15 | Lennie | And GCI :) |
| 13:57.22 | Lennie | kai, mail sent |
| 13:57.55 | kai | right, GCI too :) |
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| 13:58.26 | kai | Lennie: got it, thanks :) |
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| 14:24.17 | prateekp | what are tax forms |
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| 14:24.41 | Azzurrio | Can I know please any statistics about students countries who are accepted this year? |
| 14:25.14 | Azzurrio | Where can I find statisticslike this |
| 14:25.32 | prateekp | does i need to upload the foreign certification form in case of tax forms |
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| 14:35.56 | trasz | according to socghop app, i'm mentoring two projects, but i dind't get any mail about it. is that normal? |
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| 14:43.51 | masquerade | trasz: you don't get e-mails about it, presumably you know you're mentoring as you volunteered to mentor and would be in contact with your org admin |
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| 15:00.01 | scher | address in foreign certification form must be local address (address where I assume to work on the project)? |
| 15:00.21 | scher | my* |
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| 15:00.46 | akdroid | what is the enrollment form that needs to be attached |
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| 15:03.55 | scher | just go to your school and ask for enrollment certificate. They will give a certificate^ that establishs that you are currently a student |
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| 15:04.33 | akdroid | bafna_p1 u mean like a bonafide certificate |
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| 16:24.50 | nischayn22 | my friend asks if there is a wild card entry in Gsoc? lol |
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| 16:47.37 | sharvey | nischayn22: I don't think wild cards are allowed in gsoc... we prefer tame cards |
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| 17:40.15 | carols | serves some tea and coffee |
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| 17:49.41 | Ksenija | Hi all! Are there any students from Russia? |
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| 17:51.28 | JordiGH | Yes. |
| 17:51.54 | JordiGH | То ест, «да». |
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| 17:52.39 | Ksenija | Привет) |
| 17:52.44 | JordiGH | Hi. |
| 17:52.49 | bretonium | well, not from Russia, but russian-speaking. |
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| 17:54.18 | JordiGH | А, Женя. |
| 17:54.29 | JordiGH | I was wondering why was it written like that. |
| 17:54.46 | carols | hi everyone |
| 17:54.50 | carols | english only in this channel |
| 17:55.04 | Ksenija | sorry :) |
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| 17:56.14 | atermenji | I'm from Urkaine |
| 17:56.21 | atermenji | also Russian speaking |
| 17:56.31 | carols | it's fine. |
| 17:56.41 | carols | unfortunately i only speak english, so that's how i moderate the channel |
| 17:56.57 | atermenji | yes yes, no Russian here :) |
| 17:57.18 | Ksenija | Did you manage to get a certificate in english from your universities? |
| 17:57.20 | gevaerts | Well, except for Russian words that were borrowed by English of course :) |
| 17:57.26 | JordiGH | Bistro? |
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| 17:58.03 | JordiGH | can't think of other Russian loanwords in English. |
| 17:58.13 | JordiGH | Except food, I guess. |
| 17:58.26 | gevaerts | JordiGH: wiktionary says that's pure French |
| 17:58.27 | atermenji | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:58.43 | JordiGH | gevaerts: Really? The Russian etymology is folk etymology? |
| 17:58.50 | Ksenija | In my university they refused to give a proof of enrollment in english |
| 17:59.03 | gevaerts | No idea. I wasn't aware there is a Russian etymology |
| 17:59.16 | chetan_ | gevaerts: You can't define that. English has too many local variations. I might not have used any Russian english word |
| 17:59.31 | JordiGH | gevaerts: Wiktionary says the Russian etymology is folk etymology, what a shame. |
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| 18:00.53 | gevaerts | JordiGH: of course the trouble with etymology is that you can't ever be absolutely sure :) |
| 18:01.18 | gevaerts | chetan_: the rules say "English only". They don't say *which* English :) |
| 18:01.29 | JordiGH | gevaerts: So here was I with my droogs, getting ready real horrorshow to tolchock some veck... |
| 18:02.27 | atermenji | droogs? sounds like drugs, not friends |
| 18:02.47 | gevaerts | JordiGH: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Russian_origin can help |
| 18:02.48 | JordiGH | My droogies. |
| 18:03.17 | chetan_ | gevaerts: Well the point being that English borrows words only so that it can adapt to the various regions of the world. So as long as others here get what you are saying, its perfectly alright :) |
| 18:03.32 | JordiGH | gevaerts: GPU! |
| 18:03.44 | gevaerts | chetan_: I disagree. English borrows words because it likes doing that, not to adapt to the various regions of the world |
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| 18:05.26 | JordiGH | gevaerts: Almost all of those are technical or specialised words. What a shame that English has very few common Russian loanwords. |
| 18:06.00 | chetan_ | gevaerts: Again you can't define like. English isn't alive. If a group of people use English and add their own words to it, and this becomes accepted then English has borrowed something. This only means it has adapted itself to a particular group of people |
| 18:06.16 | gevaerts | chetan_: English is very much alive |
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| 18:06.46 | gevaerts | Also, words aren't only borrowed by people who learn it as a second language |
| 18:06.50 | JordiGH | It's not animate, I guess is what chetan_ means. |
| 18:07.01 | xhoch3 | hello everyone! =) |
| 18:07.08 | carols | hello xhoch3 |
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| 18:07.18 | JordiGH | xhoch3 is my mentee. :D |
| 18:07.25 | xhoch3 | yes =) |
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| 18:08.25 | JordiGH | Y'all be nice to him. He's got great things in store for us. ;-) |
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| 18:08.32 | chetan_ | gevaerts: I am sorry let's discontinue this :) |
| 18:08.58 | xhoch3 | I requested a proof for immatriculation written in english today |
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| 18:09.31 | gevaerts | chetan_: yes, sorry. I misunderstood, we're supposed to be speaking English, not *about* English :) |
| 18:10.28 | atermenji | your discussion was quite interesting |
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| 18:12.28 | chetan_ | atermenji: The one about English? |
| 18:14.34 | atermenji | exactly |
| 18:15.09 | atermenji | as for me, I can not remember any English Russian words |
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| 18:16.56 | JordiGH | xhoch3: Do you have any trouble with that? |
| 18:17.21 | JordiGH | atermenji: It doesn't look like there are many interesting ones. |
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| 18:17.58 | atermenji | JordiGH: there should be some |
| 18:18.05 | chetan_ | atermenji: Well over here there are over 20 languages and 100s of dialects. So its commonplace, exchange of words. |
| 18:18.10 | xhoch3 | JordiGH, no, it will be ready next week |
| 18:18.41 | prazuber | russian party going on here? :) |
| 18:18.48 | JordiGH | chetan_: What's the difference between a language and a dialect? |
| 18:18.52 | JordiGH | <-- trololol |
| 18:18.54 | atermenji | prazuber: night of Russians :) |
| 18:19.05 | xhoch3 | a dialect is a variation of a language |
| 18:19.14 | prazuber | btw I'm from Ukraine too |
| 18:19.19 | JordiGH | For example, Scheme is a variation of lisp. |
| 18:19.22 | scorche|sh | JordiGH: not much, really |
| 18:19.23 | |Kev| | Usually regional. |
| 18:19.24 | atermenji | languages probably have differences between them |
| 18:19.35 | atermenji | prazuber: what city? |
| 18:19.40 | JordiGH | Python 3.0 is a dialect of Python. |
| 18:19.42 | chetan_ | JordiGH: A language has its own written script and a common history. A dialect can be a small difference, that exists between locls groups of people |
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| 18:20.07 | gevaerts | chetan_: so before the invention of writing there were no languages? |
| 18:20.13 | xhoch3 | anyone from Germany here? |
| 18:20.18 | |Kev| | Before the invention of IRC there were no languages. |
| 18:20.25 | scorche|sh | there are dozens (and then some) of "dialects" of "Chinese" - most are very, very different to one another, though they use the same written system |
| 18:20.36 | JordiGH | |Kev|: Before the invention of IRC, there was no English standard. |
| 18:20.37 | prazuber | atermenji: Kiev ofc |
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| 18:20.46 | gevaerts | thinks the difference between dialect and language is mostly political |
| 18:20.47 | xhoch3 | before RMS wrote emacs with emacs, there was no IRC |
| 18:20.57 | scorche|sh | gevaerts: yeah |
| 18:21.05 | JordiGH | xhoch3: fact |
| 18:21.14 | atermenji | prazuber: I like Kiev, been there in March |
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| 18:21.47 | chetan_ | gevaerts: I am not saying language is defined only by a written script. I am explaining the present understanding of the two words. I can myself speak 3-4 dialects of my tongue |
| 18:22.06 | scorche|sh | most people claim the "small difference - often regional" definition of dialect, but that is far from the case many times |
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| 18:22.27 | |Kev| | I can only speak two languages - English and American, and I don't speak the latter very well :) |
| 18:22.35 | JordiGH | How many regional variations does C++ have? |
| 18:22.56 | gevaerts | chetan_: but why are they dialects? I bet they're farther apart than some pairs of languages |
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| 18:23.22 | bretonium | JordiGH: well, we have to look where does MSVS prevails and where does g++ |
| 18:23.37 | bretonium | *does prevail |
| 18:24.01 | xhoch3 | MSVS has a Microsoft compiler, not a C++ compiler |
| 18:24.17 | |Kev| | I've seen several regional variations of C++ dialect within the same patch, sometimes :) |
| 18:24.29 | scorche|sh | the term "dialect" is almost always just a subjective measure |
| 18:24.47 | bretonium | lingvosrach itr |
| 18:25.22 | atermenji | bretonium: lol |
| 18:25.31 | JordiGH | bretonium: Let's not forget the clang and comeau dialects. |
| 18:25.44 | chetan_ | gevaerts: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect#.22Dialect.22_or_.22language.22 |
| 18:26.20 | JordiGH | I dislike people who use "dialect" to refer to "socially inferior language". |
| 18:26.39 | scorche|sh | chetan_: right - so what i have been saying all along |
| 18:26.46 | scorche|sh | hah - i like this quote: "A language is a dialect with an army and navy" |
| 18:27.04 | JordiGH | scorche|sh: Yeah, common adage. I think it's attributed to Sassure, the father of modern linguistics. |
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| 18:27.17 | JordiGH | I thought it was flag and army. |
| 18:27.46 | scorche|sh | JordiGH: wikipedia says a bit differently: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_language_is_a_dialect_with_an_army_and_navy |
| 18:28.07 | JordiGH | Ah, I guess it wasn't Sassure. |
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| 18:29.28 | scorche|sh | JordiGH: wikipedia isnt always right either ;) |
| 18:30.53 | JordiGH | I'm probably wrong here. |
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| 18:31.01 | JordiGH | defers to the wisdom of the wikimasses. |
| 18:31.08 | Ksenija | How do you think, should some horrendous abbreviations in the certificate of enrollment be translated? For example Basic State Registration Number and some others |
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| 18:32.31 | JordiGH | Can you do your own translation? |
| 18:33.12 | atermenji | I've written only the basic meaning of enrollment certificate in English. I mean university name, my name, and study period. Hope it is ok |
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| 18:33.48 | Ksenija | I have just tried to do my translation. |
| 18:33.49 | gevaerts | There's always the general rule that they'll tell you if it's not OK |
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| 18:34.47 | Ksenija | Thanks |
| 18:34.55 | JordiGH | Hm, I don't see anything about translation in the FAQ. |
| 18:35.09 | JordiGH | Does the email that get sent to students say anything about translating documents? |
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| 18:35.59 | atermenji | JordiGH: yes it is. It is a basic recommendation to do translations since it would be difficult to read Russian documents for Carol or somebody other |
| 18:36.16 | Ksenija | I think we both have read the same letter. I didn't find such detailed information there |
| 18:36.26 | xhoch3 | well, I asked for an "official" translation |
| 18:36.54 | xhoch3 | ie. the secretary at university told me she could do it for me |
| 18:36.55 | JordiGH | atermenji: But does it say if you can do your own translation? |
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| 18:37.20 | atermenji | JordiGH: yes. one moment, I'll find it for you |
| 18:37.55 | atermenji | " If you cannot submit documents in English, please provide a translation along with the document." |
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| 18:38.15 | prazuber | should our translation be notarized? |
| 18:38.18 | atermenji | it is mentioned in Accepted Student Information |
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| 18:38.54 | gevaerts | prazuber: I don't think so, but only carols can give an official answer here. Insist on having a notarized answer though ;) |
| 18:39.06 | Ksenija | It is clear that a translation is needed. |
| 18:39.13 | atermenji | prazuber: I think that no. I've noticed that the original document should be official, but they need a translation to catch the meaning of a document |
| 18:39.34 | JordiGH | atermenji: I guess the wording is vague enough (if indeed, that is all the wording) so you can do your own translation. |
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| 18:40.46 | atermenji | JordiGH: yes, I've looked through the info several times and did not find anything else regarding translation |
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| 19:01.18 | ashwini | !logs |
| 19:01.18 | gsocbot | ashwini: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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| 19:05.26 | isaacbw | the mailing list flood is getting a bit exhausting |
| 19:05.40 | agliodbs | only if you read it |
| 19:05.55 | isaacbw | I don't want to miss something important :( |
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| 19:06.26 | JordiGH | isaacbw: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKAn1HvmRXM |
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| 19:07.18 | isaacbw | heh |
| 19:07.45 | agliodbs | isaacbw: all the importnat stuff comes from Carol and has ANNOUNCE in the subject line |
| 19:08.04 | isaacbw | oh, that's helpful. Thank you |
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| 19:11.14 | openbees | can i change my shipping address for future shipment ? |
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| 19:16.23 | schumaml | isaacbw: does your mail program allow to sort stuff into a folder and does it show threads? |
| 19:16.29 | schumaml | or is it google mail ;) |
| 19:16.38 | isaacbw | of *course* it's gmail :0 |
| 19:16.40 | isaacbw | :) |
| 19:17.11 | gevaerts | wonders about that "of course" :) |
| 19:17.48 | isaacbw | even my school uses gmail at this point |
| 19:18.55 | isaacbw | I wonder how long Google's ubiquity will last. We have no historical references for this sort of thing |
| 19:18.58 | isaacbw | it's all brand new |
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| 19:21.36 | schumaml | well, unless I'm missing something, google mail is useless for mailing lists |
| 19:21.55 | schumaml | probably on purpose, because everyone should be using google groups :) |
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| 19:22.43 | |Kev| | Works fine for em. |
| 19:22.46 | |Kev| | Me, too. |
| 19:22.55 | vikash | hi Everyone, I am just querying on the !emails bug. Al of my friends (including me) had their dashboard changed, made it through in GSoC in the same projects that appeared in projects, so I think that wasn't really a bug. I also *presume* it didn't worked only with students for dedup? |
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| 19:23.48 | vikash | That means, it was that we had made it through. Or it was really a bug? |
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| 19:25.16 | gevaerts | vikash: decisions hadn't been reached on the 19th yet, not all students got such changes, some students got more emails than proposals. If that's not a bug, I'm not sure what would be |
| 19:26.29 | bretonium | !emails |
| 19:26.30 | gsocbot | bretonium: "emails" is (#1) The emails were sent out by a bug. They don't mean anything. Please ignore them., or (#2) Who is accepted and rejected is not decided yet. It's impossible to determine if you're accepted or not from your emails because it's not decided yet., or (#3) This is also why your dashboard will have changed in Melange., or (#4) Everything is back to normal now. |
| 19:26.35 | bretonium | :3 |
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| 19:26.42 | vikash | gevaerts, may be for some students? |
| 19:26.45 | budili | hi |
| 19:26.53 | isaacbw | it was probably linked to some reality |
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| 19:27.04 | vikash | ok, I just wanted to confirm :) |
| 19:27.30 | isaacbw | did gsoc use melange last year? |
| 19:27.35 | vikash | Yup |
| 19:27.43 | gevaerts | vikash: there are only two possible outcomes for a proposal, it's either accepted or rejected. You can easily work out the odds of random emails matching the eventual outcome :) |
| 19:27.47 | carols | isaacbw: yes, and the year before that and the year before that |
| 19:27.56 | isaacbw | oh |
| 19:28.04 | vikash | gevaerts, :-) |
| 19:28.40 | budili | i have a question to the proof of enrollment: a certificate of enrollment is enough or a transcript with the whole courses are need too ?? |
| 19:28.47 | vikash | gevaerts, My query *was* because of the outcome, that I received the emails in the same particular order |
| 19:28.48 | gevaerts | isaacbw: it wasn't the exact same melange of course |
| 19:29.16 | vikash | Thank You, Congratulation, etc etc |
| 19:29.16 | isaacbw | it's nice to be able to develop it with some real deployed applications in mind |
| 19:29.48 | vikash | Also, if I any query on OSPO, is there a right channel to ask queries? |
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| 19:30.55 | carols | vikash: you should just email me, please |
| 19:31.21 | witness123 | !next |
| 19:31.22 | gsocbot | witness123: "next" is Community Bonding Period (until May 21): Students get to know mentors, read documentation, get up to speed to begin working on their projects. |
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| 19:31.39 | vikash | carols, Can I pm you for 5 min :-) with some cookies and tea |
| 19:31.45 | carols | vikash: sure |
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| 19:36.17 | budili | hey, in my todos i have a point with "school name is selected from autocomplete --> no", but i have fillled the text field ... ?? |
| 19:36.28 | budili | what i have to do ?? |
| 19:37.48 | vikash | budili, Did you fill it using auto-complete? |
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| 19:38.43 | vikash | gevaerts, Also, when my dashboard changed then, I updated my schoolname with auto complete and after the results it was at the same state |
| 19:39.13 | budili | vikash: no manually |
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| 19:39.59 | vikash | budili, Please try to do it with autocomplete, as the list is huge, you might get some delay but it would come :) |
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| 19:42.30 | qballer | !next |
| 19:42.31 | gsocbot | qballer: "next" is Community Bonding Period (until May 21): Students get to know mentors, read documentation, get up to speed to begin working on their projects. |
| 19:42.45 | budili | i haven't a drop down menu there ... ?? only a text field |
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| 19:43.50 | budili | oh yes .. |
| 19:43.51 | budili | thx |
| 19:44.01 | vikash | I told you :-) |
| 19:44.11 | budili | thanks !! |
| 19:44.19 | vikash | My pleasure |
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| 19:50.14 | xhoch3 | does anyone know if the ACM membership ends automatically? |
| 19:50.33 | vikash | xhoch3, Its almost for an year :-) |
| 19:50.59 | carols | xhoch3: yes, it's good for one year. |
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| 19:51.52 | vikash | carols, I have the membership, so my membership will be renewed? |
| 19:52.00 | carols | vikash: yes |
| 19:52.20 | xhoch3 | and after that year my membership ends automatically? or will it be prolonged automatically, so that I have to pay some fees after gsoc? |
| 19:52.45 | carols | xhoch3: it will end. if you want to renew it you will have to contact them and pay the fees for that then |
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| 19:54.09 | xhoch3 | carols: thank you. Sorry for my inexperience with ACM. |
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| 19:55.18 | Arjun05 | vikash: by the way I didn't get any email, and I got accepted later |
| 19:56.03 | vikash | Arjun05, ok, Thanks for notifying :-) |
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| 19:57.02 | gevaerts | thinks of an argument that may convince vikash |
| 19:57.15 | carols | xhoch3: no problem |
| 19:57.33 | gevaerts | vikash: usually software developers don't like admitting bugs, so when they do, it's likely to be true :) |
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| 19:57.58 | vikash | gevaerts, LOL |
| 19:58.15 | vikash | gevaerts, that may offending to many devs out here :-) |
| 19:58.52 | jps | when org admin wants to revise project proposals after they are accepted, but isn't saying how, and the mentor is reluctant to agree to that, what to do? |
| 19:58.54 | gevaerts | vikash: I added a smiley, so I'm safe |
| 19:58.55 | Chris_Oelmueller | it would be if it weren't true :) |
| 19:59.28 | vikash | <PROTECTED> |
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| 20:01.57 | vikash | gn everyone, I am off to bed |
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| 20:02.55 | xhoch3 | vikash, gn |
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| 20:19.40 | KL-7 | admires carols for patiently answering all the questions that keep coming into the public mailing list |
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| 20:20.00 | carols | thanks KL-7 |
| 20:20.04 | carols | :-) |
| 20:21.20 | KL-7 | carols, I almost ready to bite anyone who sends a question without reading the FAQ and all the docs =) |
| 20:21.30 | carols | KL-7: please don't :-) |
| 20:22.22 | ojwb | then you end up with a list full of naive questions and flame wars |
| 20:22.36 | carols | no, then i moderate the list entirely. |
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| 20:22.53 | ojwb | or that |
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| 20:34.31 | isaacbw | woo, just pushed my first commit to my org's git repos |
| 20:34.38 | carols | nice |
| 20:34.41 | carols | congrats :-) |
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| 20:37.51 | JordiGH | isaacbw: Which org? |
| 20:37.55 | isaacbw | GIMP |
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| 20:38.10 | JordiGH | Nice, they gave you push access to their repo? |
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| 20:38.24 | JordiGH | I wonder how many people follow a strict pull-only workflow. |
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| 20:38.59 | isaacbw | yup. They use GNOME's git servers |
| 20:40.34 | isaacbw | I don't know how limited my push priviledges are |
| 20:40.35 | atermenji | isaacbw: what is your project? I am using gimp rather often :) |
| 20:40.44 | isaacbw | *ges |
| 20:41.04 | JordiGH | I don't think you can typically be very selective about which branches you can push to on git, unless you do it with server hooks. |
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| 20:41.55 | isaacbw | atermenji, GIMP is redesigning its infrastructure to use a non-descructive graph and I will be working on tools to help with the development of that new infrastructure |
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| 20:42.57 | atermenji | isaacbw: sound interesting |
| 20:43.03 | atermenji | sounds* |
| 20:43.21 | isaacbw | it really is. GIMP is changing a lot right now |
| 20:43.48 | isaacbw | and I'm pretty sure the new version does away with floating windows |
| 20:45.42 | perepujal | Floating windows are nice :( |
| 20:46.08 | isaacbw | it will be optional I believe |
| 20:46.21 | atermenji | they are trying to adapt their UI to sensor screens? |
| 20:46.28 | JordiGH | Yeah, floating windows are awesome. |
| 20:46.39 | JordiGH | People with inferior non-Unix window managers are the ones who don't like it. :-( |
| 20:46.47 | isaacbw | I hear floating windows as one of the biggest gripes about usability |
| 20:46.51 | JordiGH | Window management is a lost art. |
| 20:46.52 | isaacbw | but yea, I like them too :( |
| 20:47.30 | schumaml | atermenji: no |
| 20:48.01 | JordiGH | People gripe Gimp's windows probably as frequently as people gripe about Octave not having a GUI. |
| 20:48.16 | JordiGH | Well, same relative frequency; we have far less users than gimp. |
| 20:48.19 | isaacbw | hah |
| 20:48.52 | JordiGH | But my boy xhoch3 here is gonna change all that. |
| 20:49.03 | schumaml | there's a 50:50 split of people who like multiple windows and people who like a signle window |
| 20:49.32 | JordiGH | schumaml: That much? I thought the camp that knew how to manage X windows was a minority. |
| 20:49.35 | schumaml | that's why this is configurable - in general, we try to avoid such options |
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| 20:50.05 | Michitux | I like them when I have a lot of screen space (i.e. two monitors) and mostly dislike them when screen space is rather limited |
| 20:50.22 | schumaml | for most people who like them, they just work without any additional effort |
| 20:50.53 | Chris_Oelmueller | single window gimp++ |
| 20:50.56 | JordiGH | schumaml: Are you a gimp dev? |
| 20:51.00 | JordiGH | Chris_Oelmueller-- |
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| 20:51.26 | schumaml | for suitable values of dev, yes |
| 20:51.32 | schumaml | I don't code that much |
| 20:51.35 | JordiGH | schumaml: Get a hostmask! |
| 20:51.40 | JordiGH | :D |
| 20:52.35 | perepujal | Michitux: in Gimp, hitting [TAB] swaps between windows so you can have them hiden in small screens and get at one key far when you need them |
| 20:53.22 | schumaml | the inaccurate news coverage of the single window mode ("gimp is moving to one window") caused quite a lot of hate |
| 20:53.50 | Triskelios | Chris_Oelmueller---- |
| 20:54.08 | isaacbw | perepujal, I never knew that... |
| 20:54.18 | isaacbw | that... changes everything |
| 20:54.43 | Chris_Oelmueller | of course i also use tab a lot |
| 20:55.01 | Chris_Oelmueller | but i really mostly work with hotkeys, and those tools i want to have around better stick to their place |
| 20:55.20 | schumaml | sadly, I found that you can run circles around many people asking question about gimp on irc by just quoting the user manual, verbatim |
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| 20:55.50 | JordiGH | schumaml: What exactly happened with that single window thing? |
| 20:55.55 | Michitux | perepujal: hm, nice feature, didn't know that, though it seems it only works when the focus is currently not on a specific element in the tools, but could still be really handy |
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| 20:56.46 | schumaml | JordiGH: nothing happend to it, it is a mode (i.e. you can switch between muti window and single window), just as planned |
| 20:57.03 | JordiGH | schumaml: So what's the press hate? |
| 20:57.23 | schumaml | it's just that some news sites seem to write up their articles from one single screenshot |
| 20:57.40 | schumaml | no, user hate, when reacting to badly written articles |
| 20:58.01 | schumaml | on the assumption that gimp 2.8 will take their multiple windows away for good |
| 20:59.07 | JordiGH | ah. |
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| 21:03.21 | antweb_ | oh wow. TAB changes the handling of GIMP quite a lot. how come it's the first time I hear about it? |
| 21:04.21 | antweb_ | multiple windows are a nice feature with multiple screens but rather annoying without them |
| 21:04.39 | JordiGH | Eh, use multiple desktops. |
| 21:04.48 | JordiGH | A feature from 1995. |
| 21:05.00 | JordiGH | fvwm can do multiple desktops. Probably twm too. |
| 21:05.11 | perepujal | yea, fvwm rules :) |
| 21:05.35 | antweb_ | JordiGH: one desktop just for the tool and layer window? |
| 21:05.40 | ChrisOelmueller | schumaml: sounds like you need to do more PR for the tab key ;o |
| 21:06.58 | JordiGH | antweb_: I usually dedicate one desktop for gimp. You can always just create another desktop. |
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| 21:08.19 | antweb_ | JordiGH: I'll be using the tab key from now on ;) |
| 21:09.34 | JordiGH | We're so offtopic sometimes. Is the topic police off duty? |
| 21:10.34 | jsalatas | lol! Some guys in gsoc's mailing list are unbelievable :) |
| 21:10.36 | JordiGH | lol |
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| 21:16.25 | ojwb | JordiGH: they're busy checking there really is a hazelnut in every bite |
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| 21:25.18 | alex|D-Guy2 | better ask questions over here than flooding everybody's inbox :D |
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| 21:27.49 | mesutcang | carols: what about turning gsoc mail list into moderated one? |
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| 21:29.38 | dsathe | that would be suicide for carols , imagine reading and moderating each of those crazy messages mesutcang |
| 21:30.31 | Catfish_Man | auto-approve any message that passes a spellchecker ;) |
| 21:30.54 | carols | mesutcang: every year this comes up and every year we determine not to. also happens every year with the mentors list. |
| 21:31.03 | carols | you're welcome to get no email or just digest emails of course |
| 21:31.07 | carols | that's your prerogative |
| 21:31.17 | meflin | or set up email filters :) |
| 21:31.28 | carols | indeed |
| 21:31.33 | carols | all these options are available to you |
| 21:31.54 | mesutcang | carols: thanks I will try daily digests |
| 21:32.20 | carols | great |
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| 21:34.48 | qballer | creating a filler and moving it to a label will also work. |
| 21:35.17 | ChrisOelmueller | perhaps the default setting can be adjusted somehow? i feel that at least my mentors prefer digests by far and judging from the feedback, a lot more people do |
| 21:35.37 | gevaerts | seriously dislikes digests |
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| 21:39.59 | JordiGH | How does this look, as far as posters go? http://jordi.platinum.linux.pl/octave/octconf-2012.pdf |
| 21:42.10 | isaacbw | I think it might look better without the shadow |
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| 21:46.07 | carols | serves some tea, coffee, and cookies |
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| 21:55.51 | carols | has some tea on the open source couch |
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| 21:56.19 | gevaerts | decides to have some cookies |
| 21:56.24 | carols | hey gevaerts :-) |
| 21:56.28 | carols | it's been a long day. |
| 21:56.42 | meflin | has a beer and hope the sick kittie is home soon |
| 21:56.49 | gevaerts | Still thousands of emails per hour? |
| 21:56.50 | ojwb | wonders if the open source couch needs patching |
| 21:56.56 | carols | poor sick kitty :-( |
| 21:57.02 | carols | gevaerts: only around 300 emails sent today. |
| 21:57.06 | carols | so it's quieted down. |
| 21:58.02 | gevaerts | wouldn't want to do that job |
| 21:58.33 | Catfish_Man | … I was about to reply to JordiGH, dangit |
| 21:58.52 | meflin | takes me most of an hour to put together the welcome students email ... imagine if that is how gsoc went? ;) |
| 21:59.00 | dberkholz | Catfish_Man: there's a little-known and -used feature of freenode called memoserv |
| 21:59.10 | Catfish_Man | dberkholz: yeah I don't like it :P |
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| 22:06.10 | qballer | Are there any statistics on how many accepted students from each list country?? |
| 22:06.23 | carols | qballer: we'll publish it on our blog soon. |
| 22:06.26 | carols | as we do every year. |
| 22:06.55 | qballer | ok |
| 22:08.08 | qballer | thanks carols, just need to get my proof of enrollment and I'm done with forms.Will we receive feedback if the forms are good?. |
| 22:08.28 | carols | qballer: no, you'll only receive feedback if the forms are bad. |
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| 22:09.26 | qballer | I see, since I'm guessing you guys are reviewing all forms it would be nice to have a checkbox that one of the admins mark and let the student know. But it's not that important. |
| 22:09.36 | carols | qballer: agreed. |
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| 22:26.21 | uman | in case anyone is interested: http://www.reddit.com/r/gsoc2012 |
| 22:26.44 | isaacbw | ooh |
| 22:26.54 | isaacbw | did you make it? |
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| 22:29.04 | uman | isaacbw: yes I made it (I already sent this once but I'm not sure if it went through, internet disconnected) |
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| 22:30.34 | Zer000 | uman maybe you should tell everyone one the gsoc mailing list? I'm sure some will find it useful |
| 22:30.47 | uman | Zer000: already done, check your email lol |
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| 22:34.57 | alex|D-Guy2 | carols, Hi Carol, just one brief question concerning the proof of enrollment: Is a commented pdf okay? Anyway, I'll hand it in now :) |
| 22:35.05 | carols | alex|D-Guy2: please do. |
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| 23:01.36 | Steel_S | Any french here (please don't blame me I'm not using the mailing list) |
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| 23:03.05 | gevaerts | Why would the French blame you for that? |
| 23:03.47 | Mareo | Steel_S, yes ? |
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| 23:04.20 | zoumpis | hello everybody |
| 23:04.28 | zomux | hi |
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| 23:05.21 | zoumpis | any spanish guy here? ( i ask at the ml about tax form , but untill now i did'nt find the solution on my problem) |
| 23:05.23 | zoumpis | thnx |
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| 23:11.29 | uman | Steel_S: tu peux toujours créer une liste spécialement pour les Français ... |
| 23:12.06 | Steel_S | Ouais mais bon c'était juste pour les taxes |
| 23:12.23 | Mareo | hmm, please keep this channel english-only |
| 23:13.11 | uman | Mareo: sorry :) |
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| 23:21.35 | v1z | !stats |
| 23:21.35 | gsocbot | v1z: I have 2 registered users with 2 registered hostmasks; 1 owner and 0 admins. |
| 23:21.43 | mmadia | !numapps |
| 23:21.44 | gsocbot | mmadia: "numapps" is In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
| 23:21.54 | v1z | tks |
| 23:21.55 | mmadia | i guess that's what you were looking for, v1z? |
| 23:21.59 | v1z | y |
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| 23:23.23 | v1z | mmadia: do you know from the top of the head if there are stats per country or anything like that? |
| 23:23.24 | v1z | looking into writing a news article about gsoc |
| 23:24.26 | mmadia | no, sorry. |
| 23:24.54 | Mareo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:24.56 | Mareo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:24.58 | Mareo | <PROTECTED> |
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| 23:25.46 | v1z | sweet |
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| 23:35.12 | ojwb | !learn countries as Stats on students per country will be published on the OSPO blog "soon" |
| 23:35.12 | gsocbot | ojwb: "countries" is Stats on students per country will be published on the OSPO blog soon |
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| 23:37.33 | MatthewWilkes | !soon | ojwb |
| 23:37.38 | MatthewWilkes | hmm |
| 23:37.39 | MatthewWilkes | !later |
| 23:37.39 | gsocbot | MatthewWilkes: "later" is when |
| 23:37.41 | MatthewWilkes | there we go |
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| 23:52.20 | AlexanderS | !next |
| 23:52.21 | gsocbot | AlexanderS: "next" is Community Bonding Period (until May 21): Students get to know mentors, read documentation, get up to speed to begin working on their projects. |
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