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| 00:00.13 | olly | \win 8 |
| 00:00.16 | olly | gah |
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| 00:04.24 | ravenlock | lh, hi how are you? |
| 00:04.32 | ravenlock | do you have a moment? |
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| 00:07.13 | Frenchie | Hey |
| 00:09.06 | donpinto | Hi Carol, we are planning on putting out the list of projects soon - questions (1) If we get selected, will we be assigned slots or will the selected projects be picked? |
| 00:10.13 | mmadia | donpinto -- carols signed off a few minutes ago. mentoring orgs are assigned slots and they choose which students/projects to accept. |
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| 00:16.00 | donpinto | Thanks mmadia. |
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| 00:26.36 | halfdan- | mmadia: what factors do they take into account when assigning slots? |
| 00:27.26 | mmadia | iirc, first time orgs will usually get at most two slots. |
| 00:28.00 | mmadia | http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/studentallocations |
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| 00:47.31 | saste | hi gsoc people |
| 00:47.51 | saste | do candidate mentors need to register before the application is done? |
| 00:48.06 | anth_r | no. |
| 00:48.15 | anth_r | i'm not even sure they can. |
| 00:48.25 | meflin | they do need trust of the org's |
| 00:48.40 | anth_r | well, they can register, but i don't think there's a way to say "we're attached to org X" |
| 00:49.20 | meflin | there is no way at this time to register as a mentor only as an org |
| 00:49.23 | saste | anth_r, indeed, that's what i thought as well, but better safe than sorry |
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| 00:51.40 | saste | thanks |
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| 02:22.51 | ravenlock | How important is it that our ideas page be "one page". We essentially have a smaller index page with all the categories and ideas, then each idea has its own page of detail. And these individual pages are a bit long. |
| 02:23.01 | ravenlock | seems unweildy to put all on one page. |
| 02:23.31 | ravenlock | does Google Reviewers, look to the secondary pages? or is it some snapshot process and then they look at the one page? |
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| 02:34.33 | hiker | ravenlock: I asked the same question before, and was told "AFAIK 1" (i.e. only one URL), and "so you want g to click back and forth because you are to lazy?" |
| 02:34.55 | hiker | That wasn't from an official op (afaik) - hope that helps a bit |
| 02:35.32 | ravenlock | ok. noted. technically is only one URL to be provided. but would require clicking to see details. |
| 02:35.39 | ravenlock | I can put all on one page. |
| 02:35.45 | ravenlock | one very very long page. |
| 02:35.47 | ravenlock | but is fine |
| 02:36.26 | hiker | I can't imagine either that this would be an issue (in our case we have a GSoC overview pages, and an idea page) |
| 02:36.29 | Arthur_D | tidiness doesn't equal laziness - quite the opposite |
| 02:37.13 | hiker | We decided to just submit our list of ideas URL. |
| 02:37.36 | hiker | It would (imho) be great if the form had an 'comment' section, where you could provide additional details |
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| 02:40.06 | hiker | ravenlock: also we have one page with the list of ideas, but link to sub-pages for some ideas with additional details, but those details would be more interesting if you want to implement it, not to understand the idea |
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| 03:11.13 | olly | ravenlock: you could steal^H^H^H^H^Hbe inspired by plone: https://plone.org/events/summer-of-code/2013/ideas-list |
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| 03:13.08 | ravenlock | olly, is nice. unfortunately our "new wiki" is "phabtastic" and does not seem to support such coolness. |
| 03:13.59 | olly | more generally, have a look at what other orgs do and see what works well as someone coming to the page not knowing much about the org |
| 03:14.41 | olly | a google search for something like "gsoc project ideas" will find you loads |
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| 09:43.01 | Hamish_B | Hi, we notice that the student-application template is not part of the org-application this year. it's on our ideas page anyway, but just to confirm we didn't miss it? tx |
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| 09:50.24 | stefanha | Hamish_B: I haven't seen it either. Perhaps orgs can configure templates once they have been accepted. |
| 09:50.35 | stefanha | I wouldn't worry about it for now. |
| 09:51.24 | olly | perhaps they decided they didn't find it a useful thing to see |
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| 10:05.04 | Hamish_B | best I can randomly guess is that the template wants a project page, and those will only be created after accepted orgs were known. ok, glad it's not just me not seeing it. |
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| 10:13.21 | olly | i feel it would be better if prospective orgs filled in the page which will appear if they get accepted |
| 10:14.16 | olly | rather than having that embarassing few hours between accepted orgs being announced and the admin filling in their page |
| 10:14.22 | olly | or few days for some orgs |
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| 10:15.53 | Hamish_B | note I was just making a wild guess, I've no actual knowledge about it. |
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| 10:19.17 | olly | well, it's been like that for the past couple of years at least |
| 10:19.44 | stefanha | olly: Good idea |
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| 10:20.58 | olly | i should check if it's been suggested via the melange tracker |
| 10:21.13 | olly | i know people have pointed it out on the list |
| 10:21.31 | olly | though we're a bit late for this year |
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| 10:55.58 | arvind_khadri | Hi, I am representing an organization applying for GSoC 2013. In the application for an org, can ex-employees of google be listed for vouching? |
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| 11:07.32 | ockham | hi, the FAQ say, " A link to a bug tracker for your open source organization is NOT an ideas list." |
| 11:08.07 | ockham | what about a link to a bug tracker filtering for a specific "gsoc-idea" tag? |
| 11:08.53 | ockham | like so: https://github.com/thinkle/gourmet/issues?labels=gsoc-idea&page=1&state=open |
| 11:11.10 | olly | arvind_khadri: you'd have to check with carols, but 4am california time is not a good time to find her here |
| 11:11.16 | olly | would guess not |
| 11:11.27 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: Should be fine. The point is that it should be gardened |
| 11:11.42 | ockham | MatthewWilkes: okay, thx. |
| 11:11.49 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: Looking at those ideas though, they're very short, have no common structure, and some have lots of obtuse comments |
| 11:12.05 | arvind_khadri | olly, I see, thanks, will hang around here. :) |
| 11:12.34 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: Here's our draft, for example: https://plone.org/events/summer-of-code/2013/ideas-list |
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| 11:12.49 | MatthewWilkes | Still got a bunch to add, language to tighten up, etc |
| 11:12.58 | ockham | looks good, though |
| 11:14.54 | olly | even ignoring its importance for selection, it's worth spending time making sure the ideas are well presented |
| 11:15.17 | olly | otherwise if you get selected you'll end up answering the same student qeustions over and over |
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| 11:16.50 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: For one, you'd be surprised at how often students think they need to find a mentor |
| 11:17.00 | MatthewWilkes | So you should be clear about who is appropriate |
| 11:17.43 | ockham | MatthewWilkes: ok, thx for the hint |
| 11:18.36 | ockham | MatthewWilkes: thing is, we're pretty small - only two active devs, so we can't take more than one student anyway, and it'd be always the same two people acting as main and backup mentor |
| 11:18.55 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: Okay |
| 11:19.03 | ockham | i was going to add that to https://github.com/thinkle/gourmet/wiki/Google-Summer-of-Code -- but that's not really an ideas list, only linking to it |
| 11:19.14 | ockham | (our wiki is read-only for non-members) |
| 11:20.10 | MatthewWilkes | ockham: I'd say to just modify the descriptions of the issues a bit so they're easier to read and all follow the same pattern of headings, etc |
| 11:20.35 | MatthewWilkes | Standard disclaimer: I don't speak for google, I represent an organisation. Which you probably already guessed. |
| 11:20.55 | ockham | MatthewWilkes: ok, will do. yeah: plone. 'm i right? ;-) |
| 11:21.08 | MatthewWilkes | Yep |
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| 13:10.43 | ishitva | Hello Everyone ! |
| 13:10.51 | ishitva | I am intersted in working with WikiMedia for GSOC 2013 |
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| 13:11.20 | ishitva | Can anyone guide me on what all can I do with Wikimedia ? |
| 13:12.59 | stefanha | ishitva: Google has not yet announced the participating organizations for this year. There is no guarantee that Wikimedia will be in GSoC. |
| 13:13.13 | stefanha | ishitva: So it is still early to get involved as a student. |
| 13:13.19 | ishitva | stefanha: okay |
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| 13:13.47 | stefanha | ishitva: But you could look for Wikimedia's project ideas page (probably somewhere on their website) |
| 13:13.59 | ansgar | Well, getting involved doesn't hurt either ;) But asking in a wikimedia-related channel should help more. |
| 13:14.06 | ishitva | I would like to work with an organization which has work related to PHP , C , C++ |
| 13:14.16 | ishitva | ansgar: okay |
| 13:14.22 | stefanha | ishitva: There are usually plenty PHP, C, or C++ orgs :) |
| 13:14.39 | ishitva | okay |
| 13:14.49 | ishitva | How can I increase my chance of getting selected ? |
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| 13:16.40 | ishitva | stefanha: Is submitting a patch before applying to an organization mandatory ? |
| 13:16.48 | |Kev| | depends on the org. |
| 13:17.05 | ishitva | |Kev|: okay |
| 13:17.15 | |Kev| | It's universally a good idea, though. |
| 13:17.23 | sunu_monsta | ishitva: connect with the org early, solve a few bugs. This helps in gaining their trust that you can actually do stuff. |
| 13:17.37 | stefanha | ishitva: You can read advice on GSoC all over the place. Here's my advice: |
| 13:17.38 | stefanha | http://blog.vmsplice.net/2011/03/advice-for-students-applying-to-google.html |
| 13:18.07 | ishitva | stefanha: Thanks |
| 13:18.26 | ishitva | sunu_monsta: Thanks |
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| 13:19.01 | MatthewWilkes | ishitva: Do you mean wikimedia or mediawiki? |
| 13:19.18 | ishitva | MatthewWilkes: Mediawiki |
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| 13:19.31 | ishitva | I have downloaded their core project code |
| 13:20.09 | ishitva | and right now I am reading their beginners tutorials |
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| 13:23.46 | ishitva | Please also suggest some resources where I can Learn how to create a patch ? |
| 13:24.06 | |Kev| | http://google.com ? |
| 13:24.11 | ishitva | I have just gone through the basic mission on the OpenHatch .com webiste |
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| 13:24.36 | ishitva | |Kev|: Okay , I will search for it :) |
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| 13:25.10 | |Kev| | It'll vary depending on the VCS that your project uses. |
| 13:25.19 | |Kev| | Trying to find a basic introduction to Git would probably be sensible. |
| 13:25.37 | |Kev| | (Then you should be able to apply the concepts to other VCS) |
| 13:26.55 | ishitva | okay |
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| 13:41.50 | gevaerts | |Kev|: unless you end up with cvs :) |
| 13:42.15 | |Kev| | In which case you can use the concepts you've learned from Git to know that this isn't a project you want to play with :D |
| 13:44.10 | gevaerts | Good point! |
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| 14:02.06 | ishitva | okay |
| 14:02.17 | ishitva | I know the basics of GitHub |
| 14:02.54 | gevaerts | But do you know the basics of Git? :) |
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| 14:11.30 | JordiGH | Git is unknowable... Those who think they know it are deluded or just haven't seen enough git to exhibit their ignorance. ;-) |
| 14:16.07 | |Kev| | Which is orthogonal to the question of knowing the basics. |
| 14:16.57 | JordiGH | There is no clear separation between basics and advanced usage in git. There are only problems you have faced and problems you haven't faced yet with git. |
| 14:17.25 | halfdan- | there are no problems with git, only with you :) |
| 14:17.54 | halfdan- | typical PEBKAC |
| 14:18.07 | JordiGH | Ah, I dislike git. I must be stupid. |
| 14:18.10 | JordiGH | Blame the user, eh? http://blog.schwern.net/2013/02/28/git-text-adventure/ |
| 14:20.24 | derdon | JordiGH: looks like it stooped in the middle of |
| 14:20.28 | derdon | *stopped |
| 14:20.47 | JordiGH | derdon: What stopped? |
| 14:20.54 | JordiGH | The text adventure? |
| 14:22.24 | derdon | JordiGH: yes |
| 14:22.45 | derdon | JordiGH: like he the author wanted to end the article but |
| 14:22.53 | derdon | can't type |
| 14:23.27 | JordiGH | derdon: I didn't get that impression. |
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| 14:27.11 | Arkanath | Anyone here from pidgin community? |
| 14:27.34 | JordiGH | Arkanath: Have you already asked #pidgin? |
| 14:28.04 | Arkanath | yeah no one responded there yesterday |
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| 14:35.54 | JordiGH | Arkanath: If you've already tried the IRC channel and nobody responded, try the mailing list. |
| 14:36.24 | Arkanath | JordiGH: I've tried even that, and am still waiting for a reply :) |
| 14:36.52 | JordiGH | Arkanath: Have you been waiting longer than 24 hours? |
| 14:37.05 | JordiGH | Longer than 48? |
| 14:37.05 | Arkanath | Yeah |
| 14:37.10 | carols | Arkanath: then go do some coding and wait longer. or approach another org entirely. :-) |
| 14:37.32 | Arkanath | not longer than 48 |
| 14:37.48 | Arkanath | carols: Hehe |
| 14:38.03 | anth_x | and hang out in their channel. many channels have long periods of inactivity. |
| 14:39.31 | yogev_ezra | I wonder whether anybody here can actually give any advice related to GSoC? :-) |
| 14:40.13 | carols | yogev_ezra: sure |
| 14:40.18 | carols | how can i help? |
| 14:41.59 | carols | serves some tea and coffee |
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| 14:42.38 | yogev_ezra | carols: I represent KolibriOS project, we would like to apply to GSoC as mentoring organization for the first time. I heard that organizations were rejected from participating in past GSoCs on terms of unsatisfactory GSoC wiki page. I wanted to know whether anybody here can check the page I created and tell whether it appears unsatisfactory: http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code_2013 |
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| 14:42.53 | carols | i can't tell you that up front. |
| 14:43.05 | carols | we don't decide whether it's a quality page until the review period next week. |
| 14:43.26 | carols | however, i can tell you that there are lots of examples on the web of quality ideas pages, so you should match your formatting and structure to theirs. |
| 14:43.58 | yogev_ezra | That's what I tried to do. Looked at other pages and tried to make ours similar |
| 14:43.59 | |Kev| | And people other than Carol, who aren't bound to Do The Right Thing may have (largely irrelevant) opinions :) |
| 14:44.03 | carols | or "those," i guess i should say |
| 14:44.17 | carols | like: http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCMentoring/making-your-ideas-page/ and http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page#3._What_is_an_Ideas_list |
| 14:44.25 | |Kev| | I'd have thought that was quite light on details for the ideas. |
| 14:44.35 | |Kev| | (And my opinion is, as I note, irrelevant) |
| 14:45.00 | carols | there's a link to an actual ideas list on that second one... |
| 14:45.12 | carols | i think that's about as close as you get without telling people how to do it :-) |
| 14:45.26 | MatthewWilkes | yogev_ezra: Speaking entirely unofficially as a fellow potential admin: I'd probably flesh out the summary a little bit, maybe make goals its own section. I like that you've listed a mentor |
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| 14:46.12 | yogev_ezra | carols: it's good, thank you. I will review those 2 pages |
| 14:46.16 | MatthewWilkes | yogev_ezra: The (very unfinished – we have a load of notes to format and add in) draft of the Plone ideas list is at https://plone.org/events/summer-of-code/2013/ideas-list |
| 14:46.17 | carols | great :-) |
| 14:46.38 | MatthewWilkes | yogev_ezra: We spent ages working out a good format and useful information, it's very similar to the KDE one and has a lot in common with yours |
| 14:46.52 | MatthewWilkes | yogev_ezra: You might want to copy the 'your own idea' section, too, I dunno |
| 14:47.29 | yogev_ezra | MatthewWilkes: thanks for the advice |
| 14:47.30 | MatthewWilkes | We put that there to give people with their own ideas a hint as to what kind of scope we'd like |
| 14:48.21 | yogev_ezra | carols: But another question that I hope you would be able to answer: Does this page have to be complete before I am submitting my application, or is it enough for it to be complete before you start the reviewing? |
| 14:48.37 | carols | yogev_ezra: yes, it must be complete. |
| 14:48.50 | carols | a big mistake would be having it in a "to be added to" state on monday next week. |
| 14:49.01 | |Kev| | It wasn't a yes/no question :D |
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| 14:49.29 | carols | make it complete now. we start reviewing applications at 19:01 UTC on friday. |
| 14:49.50 | carols | it takes so long to review each application individually that we have to start immediately after the window closes. |
| 14:49.54 | gary_b | MatthewWilkes: like the accordion format |
| 14:49.57 | carols | which is another reason we don't take late apps. |
| 14:50.12 | gevaerts | MatthewWilkes: the draft Plone ideas page is public these days? ;) |
| 14:50.22 | |Kev| | Will the final one be? :D |
| 14:50.25 | MatthewWilkes | gary_b: Thanks, we added that the year before last as it was getting a bit intimidating as a wall of text |
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| 14:50.28 | MatthewWilkes | I hate you guys :( |
| 14:50.39 | yogev_ezra | carols: oh, that was the answer to my question. the timeline on Melange page might me have thought that Saturday and Sunday are free days. |
| 14:50.40 | |Kev| | No, no you don't! |
| 14:50.58 | carols | yogev_ezra: free for you :-) not for us administrators. |
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| 14:51.17 | MatthewWilkes | I promise the plone ideas page will be public this year |
| 14:51.53 | carols | gives MatthewWilkes a skeptical look |
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| 14:52.31 | MatthewWilkes | carols: Come on, it can't be the stupidest mistake someone's made when applying… right? |
| 14:52.45 | carols | you have no idea, MatthewWilkes. the stuff i've seen. |
| 14:52.46 | |Kev| | I'd love to hear it if there's a better one :) |
| 14:53.27 | MatthewWilkes | It's fine, we don't mind being a cautionary tale for young orgs |
| 14:53.40 | MatthewWilkes | Eat your greens or you'll grow up to be like Plone! |
| 14:54.00 | |Kev| | Eat your greens or you'll grow up to [article is private]. |
| 14:55.14 | MatthewWilkes | (with its 260 core contributors, 6 continents hosting events, mean time between physical events of 374 hours, 850 contrib modules, etc, etc, etc) |
| 14:55.16 | MatthewWilkes | pouts some more |
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| 14:56.38 | MatthewWilkes | lh! |
| 14:58.02 | yogev_ezra | Ok thanks everyone (carols, MatthewWilkes) for their help, I am off to improve the page |
| 14:58.07 | carols | yw yogev_ezra |
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| 15:04.44 | luki | hello, i have come across gsoc and i'm considering it. but i would like some advice, as -even though I like learning new skills- my background lies in architecture, which means i will be mostly good for graphics. can anyone suggest if i should give this a shot? |
| 15:06.12 | luki | i have had a consuming interest in linux and open source for a few years, but i have not learned how to code |
| 15:06.18 | stefanha | luki: You have nothing to lose by trying. GSoC is about programming though, so you'll need to be able to write code. |
| 15:06.19 | carols | luki: have you read the student manual? |
| 15:06.30 | carols | there's a good section in there called, "am i good enough?" |
| 15:06.36 | luki | i have read the about page |
| 15:06.56 | carols | from the faqs? |
| 15:06.58 | carols | that's a good start |
| 15:07.08 | carols | but you should read the student manual too :-) |
| 15:07.28 | luki | i'll try to find it now |
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| 15:07.56 | carols | cool :-) |
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| 15:13.28 | luki | stafanha: hmmm, i've just read it. i was just starting to learn python, but i wouldn't be anywhere near programming something anytime soon. |
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| 15:14.10 | |Kev| | You'd have to have been able to complete a programming project by the end of the summer. |
| 15:14.24 | luki | i was hoping i could offer something in the graphics department/user interfase? |
| 15:14.55 | |Kev| | ISTM there should be enough time to learn something like Python to a basic level. |
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| 15:17.14 | |Kev| | The FAQ /implies/ that projects must involve code, in the Documentation answer. |
| 15:17.28 | |Kev| | Which would mean graphics-only projects wouldn't be permissible. |
| 15:17.29 | |Kev| | carols: ? |
| 15:17.37 | carols | hm? |
| 15:17.41 | carols | can i help? |
| 15:18.10 | |Kev| | A question about whether projects not involving code, but doing graphics work were similarly not allowed under the same rules as docs aren't. |
| 15:18.21 | |Kev| | (From luki) |
| 15:18.47 | carols | well, it has to produce code to be a gsoc project, by definition... |
| 15:18.56 | carols | there has to be a code sample uploaded at the end of the program. |
| 15:19.03 | |Kev| | Ta. |
| 15:19.07 | |Kev| | luki: Does that help you? |
| 15:19.09 | carols | so that others can come along, download it, and use it too :-) |
| 15:20.01 | luki | i think it does. from what i'm reading, i can look at the list of available projects and see if i can contribute to any of them |
| 15:20.22 | carols | cool |
| 15:20.23 | luki | to one of them, i mean |
| 15:20.39 | luki | the list gets posted early next month |
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| 15:21.15 | luki | so i have some time to learn more code and see |
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| 15:24.11 | luki | i think i will be more legible for the outreach program for women, rather than gsoc (that's how i found out about it in the firstplace) |
| 15:24.46 | luki | i will keep an eye out in april for the list |
| 15:25.02 | luki | thank you for your help and clarifications |
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| 15:29.20 | Albert_C | Hi |
| 15:29.27 | Albert_C | I have a question regarding the organization eligibility |
| 15:29.32 | Albert_C | from the FAQ: |
| 15:29.38 | carols | sure |
| 15:29.54 | Albert_C | 5. What are the eligibility requirements for mentoring organizations? Mentor organizations must be organizations or individuals running an active and viable open source or free software project whose proposals are approved by Google's Open Source Programs Office. Organizations based in Iran, Syria, Cuba, Sudan, North Korea and Myanmar (Burma), with whom we are prohibited by U.S. law from engaging in commerce, are ineligible to parti |
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| 15:30.13 | Albert_C | does this mean that my organization must be pre-approved by the Google Open Source Program Office? |
| 15:30.23 | carols | nope, no need for pre-approval. |
| 15:30.38 | Albert_C | so I can just apply |
| 15:30.40 | Albert_C | ? |
| 15:30.40 | carols | did you read the question above it, "what is a mentoring organization?" |
| 15:30.47 | Albert_C | yes :) |
| 15:30.52 | carols | yep, go for it, so long as you meet the other criteria |
| 15:30.53 | Albert_C | but this other question confused me... |
| 15:31.05 | carols | ok, why? |
| 15:31.31 | Albert_C | "proposals approved by Google Office" |
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| 15:31.40 | Albert_C | I was unsure if that meant pre-approved or not |
| 15:31.48 | carols | no, you don't need to be pre-approved. |
| 15:31.58 | carols | have you already released code under an OSI-approved license? |
| 15:31.58 | Albert_C | thank you very much for the clarification |
| 15:32.05 | Albert_C | yes |
| 15:32.07 | carols | and you're not based in an embargoed country? |
| 15:32.11 | Albert_C | no :) |
| 15:32.17 | carols | and you have at least two org admins? |
| 15:32.20 | Albert_C | yes |
| 15:32.26 | carols | great, go ahead |
| 15:32.31 | Albert_C | thank carols ! |
| 15:32.34 | carols | yw |
| 15:32.38 | Albert_C | thanks for your time |
| 15:33.12 | carols | of course. |
| 15:33.20 | OsakaFoo | Urgh that moment when you realize that you did not have "-pedantic -Wall" set T_T |
| 15:33.53 | lh | MatthewWilkes, greetings! |
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| 15:37.50 | thiago | lh: leslie! |
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| 15:55.47 | MatthewWilkes | lh: How's tricks? |
| 15:56.11 | Arkanath | Statistically, what are the chances of a new idea (other than the ones that the companies have released) to get selected as a project? |
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| 15:57.24 | ansgar | Arkanath: Depends on the idea and the organization (I guess most aren't companies). |
| 15:57.41 | lh | MatthewWilkes, very well. how are you? |
| 15:59.36 | ansgar | Arkanath: I wouldn't expect them to have lower chances if one talks to the project in question before and they agree that it's a good idea. |
| 16:00.04 | Arkanath | ansgar: |
| 16:00.21 | derdon | Arkanath: a statistical number like 46% wouldn't give you anything. talk with some project members / leaders about it |
| 16:00.32 | Arkanath | ansgar: so there will be enough time to convince them? |
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| 16:01.31 | Arkanath | ansgar: what i mean is there is no separate deadline for projects? |
| 16:02.13 | ansgar | Arkanath: Well, you can start talking to people already. Not even the organizations taking part in GSoC are chosen so far. |
| 16:02.48 | Arkanath | ansgar: right! thats what i wanted to confirm |
| 16:03.16 | ansgar | Arkanath: And students can apply with ideas until May. |
| 16:03.28 | Triskelios | there's nothing preventing you from talking to organisations months or even years in advance, except until the list of accepted orgs is published you can't be sure they can participate in GSoC |
| 16:04.29 | MatthewWilkes | lh: Good, ta! |
| 16:04.42 | Arkanath | hmm.. |
| 16:04.44 | lh | MatthewWilkes, wonderful. :) |
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| 16:06.17 | Triskelios | Arkanath: most orgs will be happy if you show some initiative |
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| 16:08.27 | Arkanath | that will be good |
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| 16:33.35 | ravenlock | carols, might you have a moment to discuss something on the mentoring org application? |
| 16:33.39 | carols | sure |
| 16:36.05 | ravenlock | in the past one of the comments mentioned to us in feedback on not being accepted had to do with "needing a better answer wrt 'what to do with dissapearing student' " |
| 16:36.45 | ravenlock | the comment was along the lines of "make sure it is thoughtful and that you have considered all possibilities of what to do when the dissapear". |
| 16:37.27 | ravenlock | so… we have crafted a master plan in which we essentially stop short of planting an RFID chip in them do avoid dissapearing. |
| 16:37.47 | ravenlock | but this seems quite contrary to advice for mentors posted here: http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforMentors |
| 16:38.04 | ravenlock | and in fact… the feedback even seems… confusing in light of the advice on that page. |
| 16:38.12 | ravenlock | so… I'm wondering... |
| 16:38.41 | ravenlock | if you can provide insight into what you desire with respect to this question on application |
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| 16:39.10 | ravenlock | (we've participated a couple years in a row, then sat out a few years… sitting on the feedback I mention just now) |
| 16:39.19 | ravenlock | so… a little confused. |
| 16:39.26 | MatthewWilkes | ravenlock: IANAGoogler, but: I have done this before. I've spent time phoning up students, contacting their employers to say we're worried about them, finding them on social networks to express concern they're not returning calls, etc. Every single one that's disappeared significantly has come back a week before the midterm and worked hard to try and get the money |
| 16:40.12 | MatthewWilkes | ravenlock: My personal opinion is that you should do more than a couple of emails, in case they have a genuine communications problem, but that significant effort chasing them is likely to be wasted |
| 16:40.52 | ravenlock | that has always been our beleif from the get go. But then we were told… that beleif was insufficient. |
| 16:40.57 | ravenlock | specifically |
| 16:41.23 | ravenlock | or… that was my understanding of what was said to me. And it was said rather clear I thought |
| 16:42.04 | ravenlock | thinks he has lost carols |
| 16:42.11 | carols | you have, actually. |
| 16:42.14 | MatthewWilkes | ravenlock: Well, again, I'm not speaking about your past experiences, but there's a lot more you can say in those answers. For example, you can reference timelines you'll have your student set and how you'll get them back on track if they re-appear |
| 16:42.31 | MatthewWilkes | carols: Sorry for butting in! I'm waiting for things to build and am bored… |
| 16:42.36 | carols | no worries |
| 16:42.39 | carols | i'm confused :-) |
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| 16:43.10 | carols | you're basically saying you don't know what to write in the "disappearing student" question? |
| 16:43.21 | ravenlock | no. |
| 16:43.24 | carols | ok. |
| 16:43.27 | ravenlock | I'm saying..... |
| 16:43.28 | carols | then i'm definitely confused :-) |
| 16:43.33 | ravenlock | hehe. |
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| 16:43.38 | ravenlock | ok. let me try again. sorry. |
| 16:43.46 | carols | it's ok. |
| 16:44.00 | carols | i haven't had much coffee this morning. |
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| 16:44.08 | JordiGH | I myself would like to outright ask that question. |
| 16:44.14 | ravenlock | hands carols a cup-o-joe |
| 16:44.19 | carols | thanks :-) |
| 16:44.21 | JordiGH | What sort of plans should there be for disappearing students? |
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| 16:44.56 | ravenlock | carols, so the "philosophy" mentioned on the advice page I posted url of above is rather clear I think |
| 16:45.05 | ravenlock | agreed? |
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| 16:46.07 | carols | yes. please do keep in mind though that it was written by my predecesssor and hasn't been updated for 3 years. so things may have changed a bit. but yes, in general, i'm with you. |
| 16:46.20 | ravenlock | ok… next.... |
| 16:46.51 | carols | ok. |
| 16:46.55 | carols | sips coffee |
| 16:47.24 | ravenlock | so, we generally agree with that philosphy. But provided an attempt to "provide an answer that showed some attempts to keep up with them and reengage them should they return". and if they did not return…. what's a guy to do. |
| 16:47.24 | derdon | spits coffee |
| 16:47.28 | ravenlock | but…. |
| 16:47.37 | ravenlock | upon providing such an answer.... |
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| 16:48.04 | ravenlock | and then coincidentally not getting accepted.... |
| 16:48.15 | ravenlock | we of course asked for feedback…. |
| 16:48.41 | ravenlock | the feedback was essentially: "you need to put more thought into answering the 'dissapearing students' question." |
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| 16:49.11 | carols | ok, what's the name of the org? i'm going to have to look at my spreadsheet because this is still just not quite working for me right now. |
| 16:49.16 | ravenlock | which was a bit confusing… given ours and "Googles (predecessors)" philosophy |
| 16:49.30 | ravenlock | hehe. ok. Enlightenment |
| 16:49.44 | carols | let me take a look at our notes from last year. |
| 16:49.58 | ravenlock | 2008/2009 we were in. 2010-2012 we did not get accepted. |
| 16:50.17 | ravenlock | 2011 these comments were made. Last years irc log seems to be lost for me. :( |
| 16:50.30 | ravenlock | but I remember something similar I beleive |
| 16:50.38 | ravenlock | any insight is apprecieated :) |
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| 16:52.28 | carols | so looking at your application from last year and from our notes from the meeting, i don't get the impression that that particular question was the "make or break" part of the application. in fact, i get the sense we made some tough decisions and your org fell on the wrong side of the chopping block. |
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| 16:53.03 | JordiGH | I got the same answer last year, that our application looked good, but we just got unlucky. |
| 16:53.04 | carols | so, that may have been the feedback in previous years, but i don't think that was the problem last year. |
| 16:53.17 | carols | JordiGH: we make a lot of hard decisions. |
| 16:53.39 | carols | ravenlock: there are some orgs that clearly have not thought out what happens when a student drops off the face of the planet. |
| 16:53.57 | carols | but i don't get the impression that's the discussion we were having last year in reviewing your app. |
| 16:54.22 | carols | so, i guess, long story short, don't worry too much about modifying your answer to that question for this year's app. |
| 16:55.00 | ravenlock | hm. ok. as I mention, last years log of our convo was lost to me. prev years I had. |
| 16:55.01 | carols | and thank you for being proactive for this year. |
| 16:55.38 | carols | also, please keep in mind that that's a 4 hour non-stop meeting for me each year |
| 16:55.44 | JordiGH | carols: I'm trying to write an application for Mercurial this year. They were accepted in 2011 but rejected in 2012. My impression is probably that the ideas page looked weak. Is this what happened? I wasn't involved with Mercurial in past GSoCs. |
| 16:55.49 | carols | and sometimes the wires get crossed even though i don't intend them to. |
| 16:55.54 | ravenlock | ha…well….this will sound bad… but somehow 2012 has dissapeared for me all together. (even the app). I will rummage. meybe it still in melange and accessible to me? |
| 16:56.02 | Catfish_Man | JordiGH: oh nice, you're working with hg? I didn't realize that |
| 16:56.04 | ravenlock | carols, yes. I know is taxing on you. |
| 16:56.21 | carols | JordiGH: let me look at the spreadsheet. |
| 16:56.34 | ravenlock | carols, thanks for your help. :) |
| 16:56.47 | carols | ravenlock: yw. sorry i can't offer you any sage insight. |
| 16:56.52 | JordiGH | Catfish_Man: Yes... I am trying to polish up the ideas page. It doesn't look great right now. |
| 16:56.53 | scorche|sh | carols: only 4 hours? ;) |
| 16:57.02 | carols | scorche|sh: usually :-P |
| 16:57.06 | ravenlock | carols, no no… you've been a big help. thank you. |
| 16:57.31 | JordiGH | ravenlock: Oh, you're with Sage? |
| 16:57.44 | ravenlock | ;) |
| 16:57.46 | Catfish_Man | JordiGH: cool, good luck :) mercurial was a big help to us (sigh... Adium. Not us anymore) |
| 16:57.57 | carols | JordiGH: mercurial? did they apply as "mercurial" last year? |
| 16:58.22 | JordiGH | carols: The id might be "hg"? Or did they totally flake out and not even apply? They told me they were rejected |
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| 16:58.54 | carols | i'll look again. |
| 16:59.06 | JordiGH | ravenlock: Sage gets some sort of prize for the perseverance in applying to GSoC. |
| 16:59.17 | JordiGH | for their perseverance |
| 16:59.21 | carols | JordiGH: i have nothing under "mercurial" or "hg" as the name of the org. |
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| 16:59.32 | JordiGH | carols: Odd. I guess they flaked out. Let me ask them. |
| 16:59.38 | carols | ok. |
| 16:59.44 | carols | it could be listed as another name? |
| 16:59.48 | carols | if so, i can look that up. |
| 16:59.56 | ravenlock | JordiGH, you were referring to our inability to get accepted, then? |
| 17:00.08 | carols | Sage participated last year! |
| 17:00.18 | JordiGH | carols: Oh, looks liek I was misinformed. They didn't apply last year. |
| 17:00.20 | Catfish_Man | carols: can you search by people involved? Augie Fackler/durin42 has historically been around for that org |
| 17:00.22 | Catfish_Man | ah ok |
| 17:00.30 | carols | well there ya go. |
| 17:01.22 | ravenlock | carols, I don't suppose previous years apps are available on melange? |
| 17:01.35 | JordiGH | ravenlock: Yes. Also, I still have hopes for Sage to stay on hg... |
| 17:01.35 | MatthewWilkes | Excuse the OTness, but how awesome is this: http://dist.plone.org/media/contributormaps/latest.png - each pin is a city we've had contributions to Plone from in the last 5 days |
| 17:01.52 | ravenlock | JordiGH, we made it 2 years… will again … eventually. maybe this year? |
| 17:02.02 | ravenlock | we have very good participation within our community |
| 17:02.06 | ravenlock | I am very hopeful |
| 17:02.38 | carols | trundles off |
| 17:02.40 | JordiGH | MatthewWilkes: I see my hometown there! |
| 17:02.43 | JordiGH | reps his hood. |
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| 17:02.56 | ravenlock | carols…. ah yes. found them |
| 17:03.07 | JordiGH | ravenlock: I wish Sage used hg DVCSly instead of jumping right away to git... |
| 17:03.22 | ravenlock | ??? |
| 17:03.38 | ravenlock | wonders how we got to Sage vcs from gsoc? |
| 17:03.56 | Catfish_Man | ravenlock: JordiGH is the admin for hg |
| 17:04.07 | JordiGH | Well, I will be, if hg gets accepted. |
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| 17:11.08 | manugupt1__ | Hi is it possible to add 2 back-up admins for a project |
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| 17:13.41 | scorche|sh | manugupt1__: just specify one now - you are able to manage this sort of thing in melange after the application process |
| 17:14.21 | manugupt1__ | scorche|sh: Thanks just wanted to make sure we did not miss on anything :) |
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| 17:57.50 | chokito76 | hi, I got a question about a submisson of an org... can someone help? |
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| 17:59.29 | carols | chokito76: sure |
| 17:59.31 | carols | go ahead |
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| 18:00.36 | carols | sips some more coffee |
| 18:00.52 | chokito76 | thanks carols, we are a small group developing a multimedia software (lgpl). the program is interesting to us, but I was wondering about the menthors/admin requirements. can admins and methors be the same people? |
| 18:01.04 | carols | chokito76: yes. |
| 18:01.10 | carols | however, please do keep in mind the time requirement. |
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| 18:01.29 | carols | that's a huge undertaking for one person, and folks often under-anticipate the workload |
| 18:01.41 | chokito76 | by time requirement you mean application deadline? |
| 18:01.47 | carols | however, you *must* have at least two org admins. |
| 18:01.59 | carols | no, i mean the time required to both be an org admin and to mentor student(s) |
| 18:02.19 | chokito76 | oh, that's for sure! |
| 18:02.25 | carols | indeed :-) |
| 18:02.36 | chokito76 | thank you a lot! |
| 18:02.38 | carols | yw |
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| 18:11.55 | Kaus | Hi, I am a working professional with an admit from US university for Fall 2013. Can I participate in GSOC? My course commences in August |
| 18:12.15 | carols | Kaus: does that university consider you an accepted student on may 27, 2013? |
| 18:12.42 | Kaus | I have received acceptance and i20. |
| 18:12.47 | carols | then yes. |
| 18:12.54 | carols | assuming you meet the other eligibility requirements. |
| 18:13.06 | Kaus | what if my VISA is rejected? |
| 18:14.05 | carols | if you are still considered an accepted student by that university on may 27, 2013 you can participate regardless of what happens after that. |
| 18:14.07 | carols | HOWEVER |
| 18:14.23 | carols | if the university revokes that acceptance before may 27 then you are no longer eligible to participate |
| 18:15.13 | Kaus | great thanks a million |
| 18:15.31 | carols | yw |
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| 18:38.43 | |Kev| | carols: Is it OK for an old org recommending a new org to not be applying this year? |
| 18:39.15 | JordiGH | Whoa, I thought we were all friends here. |
| 18:39.21 | |Kev| | A new org that's previously been under our umbrella is putting me down as a ref for recommendation, but we're not applying ourselves this year. |
| 18:39.46 | |Kev| | JordiGH: Wuh? |
| 18:40.00 | JordiGH | Oh, I thought you were recommending that someone should not apply. |
| 18:40.07 | |Kev| | I did not. |
| 18:40.15 | JordiGH | I parsed your sentence wrong. |
| 18:40.21 | |Kev| | Jolly good :) |
| 18:40.41 | JordiGH | Wait, which umbrella is that? |
| 18:40.46 | |Kev| | XSF (XMPP) |
| 18:40.50 | JordiGH | Ah. |
| 18:41.51 | |Kev| | Yes, no-one important :p |
| 18:42.02 | carols | |Kev|: yes, that's fine. |
| 18:42.07 | |Kev| | carols: Thanks. |
| 18:42.09 | carols | yw |
| 18:42.59 | MatthewWilkes | Can we vouch for ourselves? :) |
| 18:43.06 | |Kev| | MatthewWilkes: Only on a public page. |
| 18:43.07 | carols | nope :-) |
| 18:43.17 | MatthewWilkes | throws things at |Kev| |
| 18:43.30 | |Kev| | :D |
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| 18:48.24 | ter3l | Hi |
| 18:48.38 | OsakaFoo | waves at ter3l |
| 18:49.12 | ter3l | I am not a student but I want to code |
| 18:49.34 | ter3l | For gsoc |
| 18:49.47 | OsakaFoo | ter3l: https://code.google.com/codejam/ |
| 18:49.54 | OsakaFoo | but that is not gsoc |
| 18:50.00 | carols | well, you're not eligible for gsoc if you're not a student. |
| 18:50.19 | carols | but there's lots of other code options like the one OsakaFoo mentioned and just volunteering for an open source org |
| 18:50.54 | ter3l | Ok ill look at codejam |
| 18:50.54 | goggles | carols: If I'm taking a year out of my studies (as in, doing a temporary withdrawl from my course), am I eligable for gsoc? |
| 18:51.16 | carols | goggles: does you university still consider you an enrolled student? |
| 18:51.18 | carols | *your |
| 18:51.27 | goggles | carols: not sure, but I think so. |
| 18:51.38 | OsakaFoo | goggles: Do you mean IY? |
| 18:51.56 | carols | goggles: well, if the answer is "yes," then yes. if the answer is "no," then no. |
| 18:52.02 | goggles | OsakaFoo: no, I mean a temporary withdrawl |
| 18:52.09 | dark-al | !next |
| 18:52.11 | goggles | carols: thanks :] |
| 18:52.16 | carols | yw |
| 18:52.33 | carols | the gsoc bot seems to be a little tired... |
| 18:53.10 | dark-al | carols, oh :) will look at schedule on google-melange |
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| 19:21.18 | JordiGH | I'm tyring to be a new org admin for Mercurial, which was accepted in 2008 and 2011 and I think all years in between. The question about being veterans asks for pass/fail rate, but I don't have that information easily available. Is there an easy way to get it out of Melange? |
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| 19:28.44 | carols | JordiGH: if you're the org admin for mercurial from those years, you can see all the student projects i believe... |
| 19:29.00 | JordiGH | Yes, but I'm not. |
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| 19:38.11 | carols | JordiGH: ok, then the answer to your question is no. |
| 19:38.32 | JordiGH | Hmmm... Can I allow someone else to edit the Mercurial application? |
| 19:38.50 | JordiGH | I'm gonna be AFK six days starting tomorrow... |
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| 19:44.16 | JordiGH | Would it be ok if I just said, "I don't have the hard numbers, but I know these rough estimates"? |
| 19:44.51 | JordiGH | I know we've had about 8 students before, only one of them fled, most had successful projects, one of them is still now a contributor... |
| 19:45.08 | JordiGH | I don't know the pass/fail rates. We've certainly kept all of their code. |
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| 19:52.41 | halfdan- | JordiGH: afaik you can enter a backup admin |
| 19:52.49 | halfdan- | and he/she can edit the application until deadline |
| 19:53.27 | JordiGH | Ah, backup admin can edit? |
| 19:53.29 | JordiGH | Alright, that works. |
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| 20:39.43 | kowey | hi all; we're a bit confused by "IF YOU DO NOT HAVE THE LEGAL AUTHORITY TO BIND MENTOR ORGANIZATION, PLEASE DO NOT CLICK THE "I ACCEPT" BUTTON BELOW." |
| 20:40.33 | kowey | are there any implications for who in the project can make the application for us to participate in GSoC? |
| 20:41.25 | paultag | depends on the org, I s'pose |
| 20:41.34 | kowey | our official proj lead (well, me) is busy and would like to delegate |
| 20:41.43 | paultag | shrugs |
| 20:41.45 | paultag | we did that with Debian |
| 20:41.52 | paultag | the org admins are "delegates" |
| 20:41.56 | paultag | so, no problem |
| 20:42.23 | kowey | I'm happy to go with that if nobody else has a counter opinion |
| 20:42.25 | kowey | (thanks) |
| 20:42.45 | paultag | basically, this is to prevent some random from submiting an application they don't have a connection with |
| 20:42.48 | paultag | AFAIK |
| 20:43.05 | kowey | that's what I'd assume |
| 20:43.17 | kowey | I think we sometimes get a bit nervous about these sorts of things |
| 20:43.35 | paultag | kowey: who is "we" (if you don't mind, I'm generally interested) |
| 20:43.49 | kowey | hi :-), darcs |
| 20:43.54 | paultag | hi! :) |
| 20:43.58 | paultag | ah, ok :) |
| 20:44.11 | kowey | we used to do all our GSoC work under the Haskell.org umbrella |
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| 20:44.24 | kowey | but it might be time for us to try and stand on our own feet |
| 20:46.47 | paultag | totally :) |
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| 21:02.09 | JordiGH | Two org applications submitted. o.O |
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| 22:12.41 | Kyzz[Mobile] | Does anyone have suggestions on how to pick a project to work on over ths summer? |
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| 22:18.05 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: import random; print random.choice(projects) |
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| 22:21.59 | halfdan- | Kyzz[Mobile]: personal preferences? |
| 22:22.27 | Kyzz[Mobile] | halfdan-: I'm not partial to anything really. I'm new to most of this. |
| 22:23.08 | |Kev| | Pick a project for some software that you use, or think you could usefully use? |
| 22:24.41 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: you are probably not a professional at 10 programming languages, so that reduces your choice already |
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| 22:26.30 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: also ask yourself what topics you like. do you like analysing data? web development? games? something totally different? |
| 22:27.49 | Kyzz[Mobile] | derdon: I like web development from what I've been exposed to. |
| 22:29.47 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: then you'll find something you like |
| 22:30.10 | Kyzz[Mobile] | derdon: Why do you say that? |
| 22:30.34 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: the thing about web development is you often have to master a lot of technologies and "juggle" with them so they fit nicely together |
| 22:30.55 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: you asked for suggestions on how to pick a project |
| 22:31.16 | derdon | Kyzz[Mobile]: and I told you some criteria like your own skills and preferences |
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| 23:02.10 | kos_tom | hello |
| 23:02.15 | kos_tom | I am part of the Buildroot project |
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| 23:02.24 | kos_tom | we have submitted our proposal for the first year for the GSoC |
| 23:02.36 | kos_tom | but it's not clear to me if our submission has been received and will be taken into account |
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| 23:03.19 | meflin | how is it not clear? |
| 23:03.37 | meflin | you loged into melange and see your an "org" right? |
| 23:04.00 | kos_tom | meflin: yes. |
| 23:04.15 | kos_tom | meflin: but since you can edit, and re-edit the form, and save by clicking "submit" |
| 23:04.31 | kos_tom | it's not clear how to say "I'm done with all my changes, now I want my submission to be finalized" |
| 23:05.00 | meflin | you can edit untill the last second |
| 23:05.14 | meflin | when app's close what you have it what they read |
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| 23:08.59 | kos_tom | meflin: ok, great, thanks! |
| 23:09.23 | meflin | student apps will work the same way |
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