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| 00:03.04 | freax | Hi all. I'm a GSoC 2013 aspirant. I saw that the list of selected mentoring organizations will be updated tomorrow at 1900 UTC. Can anyone tell me whether we could see the list of organizations that has send a proposal to Google to be as a mentoring organization? |
| 00:03.25 | thiago | no |
| 00:03.26 | anth_r | no, google does not share that information. |
| 00:04.01 | anth_r | you can get a decent idea by (a) googleing "applied to gsoc 2013" or similar, or (b) looking at previous years' lists of participants. |
| 00:04.06 | gevaerts | The best you can do is hang out here shortly after the announcement and pay attention to who's unhappy |
| 00:04.09 | anth_r | neither method is exhaustive, of course. |
| 00:04.49 | ChrisOelmueller | putting that right on my todo list for monday, "be unhappy on irc" |
| 00:05.03 | gevaerts | :) |
| 00:05.58 | gevaerts | You might want to try and find out exactly what they're unhappy about :) |
| 00:06.38 | freax | thanks guys! I am interested to apply for organizations working in the area of operating systems, real-time systems which involves system level hacking. Can I know which organizations are working in this area? LAst time I saw that Debian-Hurd was selected, so wanted to know in advance about such organizations |
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| 00:07.18 | thiago | btw, the publication will happen in 43 hours |
| 00:07.19 | anth_r | is it kosher to advertise for ones own org here? ;-) |
| 00:07.21 | thiago | that's closer to two days |
| 00:07.23 | gevaerts | It's less than two more days right now... |
| 00:07.49 | anth_r | plan9's applying. we're an os. if you like hurd, it's likely you'll like us (hopefully even more). |
| 00:08.13 | gevaerts | anth_r: there's advertising, and there's answering questions :) |
| 00:09.28 | thiago | anth_r: and how about the majority of people, who don't care about hurd? :-) |
| 00:11.10 | freax | anth_r, are you from plan9 dev team, wow! I obviously like plan9 :) |
| 00:11.13 | anth_r | well, i just mentioned hurd because it was mentioned above. i think anyone who wants to work on OS-level stuff should check plan9 out. |
| 00:11.35 | anth_r | thiago: since you asked. ;-) |
| 00:12.29 | freax | thiago, I have seen you in the Qt IRC I guess. You into Qt related dev this time? |
| 00:14.53 | anth_r | freax: i'm org admin for plan9. i do only minor dev work on it myself. |
| 00:15.28 | thiago | freax: I have been into Qt dev for 13 years. |
| 00:15.34 | thiago | freax: so not just this time |
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| 00:16.55 | freax | anth_r, thiago : great to know about you guys! Will get in touch with you after going through plan9's ideas. |
| 00:19.21 | anth_r | awesome to hear. now let's just hope we (both) made the cut! |
| 00:19.38 | anth_r | okay, off to dinner and a movie. later, folks. |
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| 00:26.10 | thiago | freax: Qt did not enter GSoC this year |
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| 02:55.23 | freax | thiago, you must have worked with Trolltech too :) Feels great to know you. May I know why Qt is not into GSoC this time? |
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| 03:22.19 | thiago | freax: I worked at Trolltech |
| 03:22.32 | thiago | freax: we didn't enter GSoC because no one volunteered to be admin |
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| 03:36.06 | freax | thiago, got it. |
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| 03:50.37 | phillipuniverse | do most orgs that submit applications get accepted? |
| 03:51.15 | phillipuniverse | curious what the acceptance percentage is for orgs; is there some sort of organization limit? |
| 04:15.15 | freax | phillipuniverse, afaik the number of organizations which apply and which get accepted varies each year. So I don't think there is any sort of limit on that part. You can analyse the stats to see a trend though :) |
| 04:16.24 | freax | phillipuniverse: or to say, whether there is any pattern of acceptance |
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| 04:54.33 | ojwb | !numapps | phillipuniverse |
| 04:54.33 | gsocbot | phillipuniverse: "numapps" is In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
| 04:55.05 | ojwb | i think they're expecting about the same number of orgs this year as last |
| 04:55.11 | phillipuniverse | well that's an awful handy feature |
| 04:55.13 | ojwb | to accept about the same |
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| 04:56.05 | phillipuniverse | hm about 44% org acceptance rate |
| 04:56.09 | phillipuniverse | pretty competitive |
| 04:56.45 | phillipuniverse | even less so for student proposals |
| 05:01.58 | ojwb | phillipuniverse: there's a significant proportion of total junk in the student applications |
| 05:02.04 | ojwb | not sure if the org apps are as bad |
| 05:02.14 | phillipuniverse | ah I see |
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| 05:02.28 | phillipuniverse | I guess that makes sense |
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| 05:02.53 | ojwb | things that are just a paste from the ideas list |
| 05:03.21 | ojwb | or some random idea unrelated to the org |
| 05:03.35 | ojwb | or a CV/resume with nothing else |
| 05:04.22 | ojwb | i'd guess they get a few org applications which are someone trying to invent an org so they can also apply as a student and accept themselves |
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| 15:52.49 | spectre | !timeline |
| 15:52.50 | gsocbot | spectre: "timeline" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2013 |
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| 16:12.38 | juju_ | Hello!! |
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| 16:13.55 | juju_ | If a student is chosen by 2 orgs, during conflict resolution does the student get to choose one org ? |
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| 16:14.17 | gevaerts | Maybe |
| 16:14.42 | gevaerts | The organisations talk to each other to work this out, and they *may* ask the student for a preference |
| 16:15.57 | gevaerts | However, there are cases where for one organisation this student is the only real option for a slot, while for the other organisation there are several possible other students. In such cases, they may decide without asking the student |
| 16:16.58 | sunu | Ah ok. Thanks gevaerts :) |
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| 16:17.40 | sunu | I was wondering about that too. |
| 16:17.40 | gevaerts | If you have a real preference, saying this in your application to the preferred organisation is an option |
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| 16:34.03 | juju_ | Thanks gevaerts |
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| 16:37.34 | j2shar | juju_:You can read de-duplication meeting of last year to have clear idea [ http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/20120420.html.gz ] |
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| 16:39.18 | gevaerts | j2shar: most duplicates are resolved long before the de-duplication meeting |
| 16:39.18 | juju_ | j2shar: ok, i'll have a look at that. thanks :) |
| 16:39.55 | derdon | !next |
| 16:40.06 | gsocbot | derdon: "next" is April 8: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 16:40.38 | derdon | does that mean at 0:00 UTC? |
| 16:41.02 | ChrisOelmueller | no. |
| 16:41.29 | gevaerts | See http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2013 for exact times |
| 16:42.30 | yogev_ezra | derdon: Shortly speaking, it's 26.5 hours from now. |
| 16:43.00 | derdon | ah, thanks |
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| 17:13.48 | yogisuper | hii..m new to gsoc. can anyone give me idea how to proceed for it? |
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| 17:14.56 | derdon | I wonder how people try to get information |
| 17:15.04 | gevaerts | !studentguide | yogisuper |
| 17:15.04 | gsocbot | yogisuper: "studentguide" is http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ |
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| 17:24.20 | mrcoffeina | hi |
| 17:24.25 | frenchie4111 | Hi |
| 17:24.30 | mrcoffeina | I habe one question |
| 17:24.34 | frenchie4111 | shoot |
| 17:25.20 | mrcoffeina | can I still join the program |
| 17:25.28 | frenchie4111 | As a student? |
| 17:26.06 | mrcoffeina | yes |
| 17:26.07 | mrcoffeina | I do not have the team, I'm alone, I would like to program |
| 17:26.18 | frenchie4111 | It's a program for individuals |
| 17:26.25 | frenchie4111 | It's not time for student's to sign up yet |
| 17:26.38 | frenchie4111 | !next |
| 17:26.41 | gsocbot | frenchie4111: "next" is April 8: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 17:26.55 | *** join/#gsoc gs2013 (53aa44af@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.170.68.175) |
| 17:27.01 | mrcoffeina | ok |
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| 17:27.34 | mrcoffeina | that is, I still have a chance? |
| 17:28.01 | frenchie4111 | http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2013 is the timeline |
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| 17:28.39 | frenchie4111 | I believe you do still have a chance. I am also a student applying this year, I have been talking to my organization for about a week, but I am sure you could get started now as a majority of student's haven't started yet |
| 17:28.50 | gs2013 | Apparently the accepted organizations will be announced tomorrow. |
| 17:29.19 | gevaerts | gs2013: no "apparently" about it |
| 17:29.36 | |Kev| | Yes, apparently works fine there. |
| 17:29.47 | |Kev| | In it's real sense, rather than the way it's frequently used :) |
| 17:29.53 | gs2013 | Looks like students can't submit any application until April 22. |
| 17:30.06 | frenchie4111 | Yep. You start talking to Orgs next week |
| 17:30.14 | frenchie4111 | (Tomorrow) |
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| 17:30.58 | gs2013 | Can applications still be submitted to the organizations before April 22? |
| 17:31.01 | sunu | The game begins tomorrow :P |
| 17:31.10 | mrcoffeina | where I can finde list of organizations ? |
| 17:31.31 | sunu | gsocbot: you can discuss unofficially ofcourse |
| 17:31.38 | frenchie4111 | Wint-I mean-Students are coming |
| 17:31.39 | gs2013 | mrcoffeina: list of organizations will be at http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013 tomorrow. |
| 17:31.56 | mrcoffeina | ok |
| 17:32.16 | gs2013 | Winter already came |
| 17:32.38 | mrcoffeina | so I must have some idea yes ? |
| 17:32.48 | gevaerts | |Kev|: how is the sense in which a word is frequently used not a real sense? ;) |
| 17:32.48 | frenchie4111 | Most organizations have an ideas page |
| 17:33.01 | gevaerts | *all* organisations have an ideas page |
| 17:33.02 | |Kev| | gevaerts: Hrmph. |
| 17:33.11 | frenchie4111 | !studentguide | mrcoffeina |
| 17:33.11 | gsocbot | mrcoffeina: "studentguide" is http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ |
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| 17:33.25 | mrcoffeina | ;) |
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| 17:34.13 | Nick23 | I've already looked into some organizations, hopefully they're accepted! |
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| 17:34.37 | Frenchie4111 | I have been talking to an org already, I am really hoping they are accepted |
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| 17:34.48 | gevaerts | |Kev|: it looks like you are also one of those people who could care less about language |
| 17:34.51 | Nick23 | Good luck! |
| 17:35.07 | |Kev| | #()@*^&$)&@^#*)&@^#(*&@^#(*&@#^(&@*^$(*&@^($&*^@$(&*@^(# |
| 17:35.11 | |Kev| | *Explode* |
| 17:35.15 | Nick23 | Since this chatroom is loggged, is there a way to browse the archive? |
| 17:35.25 | Frenchie4111 | !archive |
| 17:35.31 | dhaun | nice troll there gevaerts :P |
| 17:35.32 | |Kev| | !logs |
| 17:35.33 | gsocbot | |Kev|: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
| 17:35.34 | Frenchie4111 | Nope. I thought it was something |
| 17:35.42 | Frenchie4111 | Oh, logs. My bad |
| 17:36.10 | gevaerts | dhaun: I know *I* could care less. I just choose not to :) |
| 17:36.16 | Nick23 | thanks gsocbot |
| 17:36.22 | Nick23 | is gsocbot really a bot, or a real person? |
| 17:36.38 | Frenchie4111 | *noone will ever know* |
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| 17:52.25 | Nick23 | before I entered this room, I accidentally typed #gspot |
| 17:52.48 | gevaerts | looks around, but he doesn't see a room |
| 17:53.54 | mrcoffeina | I have one question that if you work in a company and I am a student also attend? |
| 17:54.20 | Frenchie4111 | Can you rephrase that? |
| 17:54.26 | ChrisOelmueller | /nick room |
| 17:54.41 | Frenchie4111 | ./nick a room |
| 17:54.46 | |Kev| | If the question is "Can you do GSoC at the same as a full time job" the answer is, generally, no. |
| 17:55.02 | Frenchie4111 | GSoC is intended to be a full time job workload |
| 17:55.13 | |Kev| | If the answer is "Does being an employee (of someone unrelated to Google) necessarily preclude you entering" then the answer is no, but the devil's in the details. |
| 17:55.31 | *** join/#gsoc edsiper (~edsiper@186.177.47.60) |
| 17:55.44 | mrcoffeina | :/ |
| 17:55.55 | |Kev| | You can't work two full time jobs at the same time. |
| 17:56.01 | |Kev| | The hours don't work. |
| 17:57.24 | mrcoffeina | that's too bad, now I working as a tester, and would love to work as a programmer |
| 17:58.01 | Nick23 | will the mentors guide me, step-by-step on how to do everything? ;) |
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| 17:58.42 | gevaerts | Nick23: they will expect you to know how to search, read documentation, and work out simple things |
| 17:59.29 | Nick23 | gevaerts: ok, great. :D |
| 18:00.20 | gevaerts | They'll also expect you to know the programming languages you claim to know :) |
| 18:01.00 | Nick23 | oh shit, I only know BBCode. ;) |
| 18:03.53 | gary_b | mrcoffeina: do you find testing to be quite repetitive? |
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| 18:04.19 | edsiper | any melange dev around ? |
| 18:04.23 | gary_b | asks out of interest just |
| 18:04.45 | gevaerts | edsiper: #melange might be a better place to find those |
| 18:04.50 | mrcoffeina | is boring |
| 18:04.55 | edsiper | thanks gevaerts |
| 18:05.11 | gevaerts | No guarantees that any of them are active there right now :) |
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| 18:06.27 | *** join/#gsoc Nick23 (53aa44af@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.170.68.175) |
| 18:06.32 | Nick23 | !next |
| 18:06.37 | *** join/#gsoc shalkia (shalki@123.237.52.165) |
| 18:06.43 | gsocbot | Nick23: "next" is April 8: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 18:06.49 | *** join/#gsoc Skriptkid (~Skriptkid@117.208.161.127) |
| 18:06.55 | Frenchie4111 | Is "April 8th" midnight tonight, or sometime during the day tomorrow? |
| 18:07.17 | Nick23 | Frenchie4111: 19:00 UTC tomorrow |
| 18:07.26 | gary_b | mrcoffeina: do you get to do any scripting at least? |
| 18:07.51 | edsiper | Frenchie4111, April 08 at 19:00 UTC |
| 18:08.09 | gevaerts | Frenchie4111: check the official timeline. !next is really only an indication learned by the bot for convenience |
| 18:08.22 | Frenchie4111 | Thanks Nick23 and edsiper and gevaerts |
| 18:08.32 | *** join/#gsoc PioneerAxon (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/pioneeraxon) |
| 18:08.43 | gevaerts | !learn next as April 8 19:00 UTC: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 18:08.44 | gsocbot | gevaerts: "next" is (#1) April 8: Accepted mentor organizations announced, or (#2) April 8 19:00 UTC: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 18:08.48 | gevaerts | !forget next 1 |
| 18:08.49 | gsocbot | gevaerts: "next" is April 8 19:00 UTC: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
| 18:08.56 | gevaerts | There :) |
| 18:09.07 | Nick23 | Frenchie4111: WolframAlpha has a countdown timer http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=8%2F4+19%3A00+UTC |
| 18:09.50 | Frenchie4111 | You put the wrong month in there |
| 18:10.05 | Frenchie4111 | http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=4%2F8+19%3A00+UTC There is the real one ;D |
| 18:10.11 | mrcoffeina | <gary_b>no |
| 18:10.42 | Frenchie4111 | mrcoffeina: what kind of software do you test? |
| 18:11.05 | Nick23 | Frenchie4111: I guess you have different settings because your link shows up as August 4 for me. |
| 18:11.14 | gary_b | that sounds annoying, but at least you've got on the ladder a little closer to where you / i want to be :) |
| 18:11.26 | Frenchie4111 | Nick23: That is very weird |
| 18:11.28 | gary_b | mrcoffeina^ |
| 18:11.30 | PioneerAxon | Anyone noticed, the PROGRAM TIMELINE on homepage shows "Off season".. :-/ |
| 18:11.38 | mrcoffeina | <Frenchie4111>web apps |
| 18:11.56 | Frenchie4111 | Isn't it "Off season" until student's start coding |
| 18:12.13 | Nick23 | Frenchie4111: I know. I actually tried your input first but it shows up as August 4 so I had to to 8/4 and that showed up as April 8. |
| 18:12.20 | Frenchie4111 | mrcoffeina: sounds fun-ish |
| 18:13.08 | dhaun | Frenchie4111, Nick23: 8/4 vs. 4/8 -which side of the Atlantic are you on? Or try http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=April+8+19%3A00+UTC |
| 18:13.10 | Frenchie4111 | http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=April+8th+2013+19%3A00+UTC Nick23 there is the best one |
| 18:13.23 | mrcoffeina | <Frenchie4111> yes I konow is very stupid but I have a job |
| 18:13.29 | Frenchie4111 | Mine is the same as dhaun |
| 18:13.46 | Nick23 | Frenchie4111: Yes, that's the right one. |
| 18:13.52 | Nick23 | *best |
| 18:13.54 | ChrisOelmueller | melange has a countdown right on its homepage |
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| 18:14.05 | ChrisOelmueller | i'm not really getting this discussion currently, sorry |
| 18:14.05 | Frenchie4111 | mrcoffeina: No judgement here, you probably get paid much more than me. I get paid -40k$ a year (negative) |
| 18:14.26 | gevaerts | thinks the *real* question is why people need a countdown time for this one |
| 18:14.31 | Nick23 | ChrisOelmueller: WolframAlpha is better because it shows minutes and seconds. |
| 18:14.56 | Frenchie4111 | Nick23: It doesn't live update though |
| 18:14.59 | gary_b | mrcoffeina: selenium seems useful, i once considered learning it |
| 18:15.00 | ChrisOelmueller | gevaerts: in seconds no less |
| 18:15.28 | gevaerts | ChrisOelmueller: I'd say the wolframalpha timer is useless. It doesn't show nanoseconds! |
| 18:15.50 | Frenchie4111 | gary_b: Ooh. Selenium looks awesome. |
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| 18:16.52 | Frenchie4111 | gevaerts: http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=Difference+from+now+April+8th+2013+19%3A00+UTC+nanoseconds |
| 18:17.06 | yogev_ezra | |Kev|: I have actually done twice the required number of hours at 1 work place for about 2-3 months (worked around 80 hours a week rather than 45 we are required in Israel). It's possible but only if you have no family to support (no husband/wife, no kids), and I got very tired at the end of each day. Just trying to say that it's not impossible. |
| 18:17.20 | gevaerts | yogev_ezra: it |
| 18:17.22 | idkwhatever | Wow. That's intimidating. You're counting out the nanoseconds? |
| 18:17.57 | gevaerts | yogev_ezra: were you actually as productive per hour as if you hadn't done that? |
| 18:18.03 | gevaerts | has doubts |
| 18:18.08 | yogev_ezra | And BTW I receive monthly payment so didn't get anything for those overtime hours. It was just a matter of finishing the project in time. |
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| 18:18.43 | mrcoffeina | <yogev_ezra>nice |
| 18:19.01 | Frenchie4111 | yogev_ezra: was that 16 hours a day for 5 days, or 11 hours a day for 7 |
| 18:19.34 | gevaerts | The thing is, yes, you can sit at a desk for more than 40 hours, but no, you can't do twice the work you'd do in 40 hours |
| 18:20.08 | gary_b | Frenchie4111: seem to be able to control it from your preferred programming language which is pretty cool |
| 18:20.25 | Nick23 | no way I'm gonna sit at the desk for 40 hours! that's insane. |
| 18:20.43 | gevaerts | If you're working on a single project, doing these extra hours (for a restricted time) can indeed help, but if you're doing two unrelated things, you're being worse at both of them |
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| 18:22.03 | yogev_ezra_ | Ugh I hate when it happens :-( The webchat IRC client works fine without a problem for 16-18 hours, and then starts to disconnect every 5 minutes... :-( |
| 18:22.16 | gary_b | as with anything productivity levels > 40 hours depends on the person |
| 18:22.48 | Frenchie4111 | Download xchat |
| 18:23.44 | idkwhatever_ | does xchat work with web proxy? |
| 18:23.57 | edsiper | idkwhatever_, yep |
| 18:24.06 | Nick23 | The best IRC client I've ever tried is on a Mac, and it's called Colloquy. Although I'm on a Windows right now. |
| 18:24.25 | yogev_ezra | Frenchie4111: It was 80 hours a week on the average, since it's a hitech company, you can come and go basically when you want. So it was 17 hours one day, 6 hours the other day, etc. There were even a few times when I drove the attendance reporting system crazy, when I came at 10:00 on one day, and left at 18:00 the day after :-) |
| 18:24.51 | gevaerts | Nick23: is it better than irssi? |
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| 18:25.22 | Frenchie4111 | Nick23: I have also used Colloquy, I agree it was nice |
| 18:25.26 | Nick23 | gevaerts: Haven't tried irssi but I'll definitely try that as well. |
| 18:25.54 | idkwhatever_ | What's wrong with IRC directly through the browser? New to it, sorry. |
| 18:26.00 | Frenchie4111 | irssi is the command line one, correctly? |
| 18:26.12 | gevaerts | Frenchie4111: it's text mode, but not command line :) |
| 18:26.15 | thiago | full-screen text interface |
| 18:26.29 | gary_b | yogev_ezra: what did you do during that 32 hour marathon? |
| 18:26.43 | Frenchie4111 | idkwhatever_: I just don't like leaving my browser open all of the time, it's easier to have a dedicated application |
| 18:26.46 | Frenchie4111 | And it has more power |
| 18:26.52 | gevaerts | gary_b: my bet is: not being very productive at the end :) |
| 18:27.24 | gary_b | gevaerts: im not betting against you there :p |
| 18:27.52 | gevaerts | Frenchie4111: if you want a command line irc client, try ii (http://tools.suckless.org/ii/) |
| 18:28.01 | gary_b | but ive heard of other guys on irc talking about such feats, it astonishines me |
| 18:28.19 | gary_b | *astonishes |
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| 18:28.37 | gevaerts | gary_b: sitting at a desk staring at a screen for 32 hours is easy |
| 18:29.01 | gevaerts | The trouble starts the next day, when you have to debug the code that made sense near the end of such sessions |
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| 18:31.11 | Nick23_ | t |
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| 19:07.37 | baba | in the 20 days between student applications starts do we have to code something and show the org ? |
| 19:07.48 | baba | bcoz my exams would be there during this time |
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| 19:09.20 | anth_r | it depends on the org you're applying to. |
| 19:09.42 | anth_r | (can we teach the bot to reply "it depends" to anything ending in a question mark?) |
| 19:10.02 | anth_r | baba: most orgs will want some form of proof of competency, but what that is varies tremendously from org to org. |
| 19:13.31 | sunu | less than 24 hours to go \m/ |
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| 19:20.52 | baba | anth_r: :) |
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| 19:30.52 | Mrk_ | What happens if we get accepted for multiple projects at different organizations? |
| 19:31.11 | waldi | you will only get accepted for at most one project |
| 19:32.03 | Mrk_ | waldi: I'm talking about different organizations. |
| 19:32.50 | ChrisOelmueller | we are too |
| 19:33.02 | anth_r | you will (still) get accepted for at most one project |
| 19:33.11 | ChrisOelmueller | if you apply to more than one organization and both consider accepting you, they are notified and try to resolve this |
| 19:33.22 | Mrk_ | Ok, thanks for explaining this ChrisOelmueller. |
| 19:33.24 | ChrisOelmueller | this may include asking you for your preference, but doesn't need to |
| 19:36.14 | Mrk_ | Wow, GSOC 2012 has 6685 applications http://google-opensource.blogspot.com/2012/05/google-summer-of-code-2012-by-numbers.html. |
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| 19:36.21 | Mrk_ | *had |
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| 19:54.18 | baba | how many positions are there ?? |
| 19:54.25 | baba | for the projects. |
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| 19:58.29 | Mrk_ | baba well last year 1212 students were accepted according to http://google-opensource.blogspot.com/2012/05/google-summer-of-code-2012-by-numbers.html. |
| 19:58.42 | gevaerts | !numapps |
| 19:58.42 | gsocbot | gevaerts: "numapps" is In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
| 19:59.27 | Mrk_ | nice, thanks gevaerts. |
| 19:59.28 | baba | Mrk_ and gevaerts :) |
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| 20:01.07 | Mrk_ | so looks like Google paid out $6,666,000 to students last year |
| 20:01.08 | androidify | hello :) |
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| 20:02.44 | dhaun | Mrk_: assuming they all successfully completed their projects |
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| 20:05.42 | thiago | more like 5.5 M |
| 20:05.50 | thiago | students get $4500 if they completed the project |
| 20:06.16 | dhaun | thiago: wasn't it $5500? |
| 20:06.18 | Mrk_ | dhaun: Good point, I'd imagine there are some students who wouldn't be able to complete their projects, their loss. |
| 20:06.38 | Mrk_ | I thought it was $5,500, unless they reduced it this year. |
| 20:07.25 | thiago | it's always been $4500 |
| 20:07.39 | Mrk_ | Oops, nevermind. Just re-read the FAQ; "Google will provide a total stipend of 5500 USD per accepted student developer, of which 5000 USD goes to the student and 500 USD goes to the mentoring organization." |
| 20:08.00 | thiago | ah, so it is up |
| 20:08.05 | thiago | it used to be 4500 + 500 |
| 20:08.38 | dhaun | can't find the student success rate for 2012, but it's usually around 90% |
| 20:11.26 | Mrk_ | does GPA matter? |
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| 20:13.05 | gevaerts | Mrk_: many mentors won't have a clue how to value such locale-specific numbers |
| 20:13.24 | gevaerts | So most likely not |
| 20:14.06 | gevaerts | I know that historically when reviewing student applications, I've always just skipped the bit about academic achievement |
| 20:14.18 | Mrk_ | gevaerts: Looks like only Google is going to be getting my transcript anyway, so it doesn't matter. |
| 20:14.26 | gevaerts | nods |
| 20:14.47 | gevaerts | Also, google doesn't need a transcript as such, just proof of enrollment IIUC |
| 20:15.10 | gevaerts | A transcript just happens to be the most common way to do that |
| 20:15.26 | Mrk_ | You're right, just noticed it says proof of enrollment as well. |
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| 20:17.53 | gevaerts | Of course, it's entirely possible that some organisations will ask for numbers and will take them into account. I suspect that's going to be rare though |
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| 20:23.09 | Mrk_ | Is it okay to apply to a lot of different organizations to improve our chances of getting accepted? |
| 20:23.35 | gevaerts | Well.... |
| 20:23.53 | gevaerts | The rules say you can make five proposals I believe |
| 20:24.20 | gevaerts | "apply to a lot of different organizations to improve our chances" isn't actually true though. Experience suggests that after two or three, quality goes down a lot |
| 20:24.53 | Mrk_ | the rules says five proposals, but it doesn't say if it's per organization or not |
| 20:25.03 | gevaerts | No, it's five in total |
| 20:25.12 | Mrk_ | ok, thanks |
| 20:25.17 | gevaerts | That can be five to one organisation, or one to five organisations each |
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| 20:27.45 | gevaerts | Until a few years ago, the limit was 20, but while a reasonably significant number of students did indeed submit more than five proposals, I don't think more than one or two of those ever got accepted |
| 20:28.05 | gevaerts | Good proposals take time and effort :) |
| 20:28.21 | Mrk_ | You're right, it's better to focus on quality instead of quantity. |
| 20:28.32 | gevaerts | Very much so |
| 20:29.06 | gevaerts | !odds |
| 20:29.08 | gsocbot | gevaerts: "odds" is Odds, chances or probability really do not come into play for GSoC. Rambling off numbers or asking What are the odds of getting accepted... is really quite useless as one's acceptance is not dictated by luck or numbers, but by the quality of your proposal and your skills instead. |
| 20:30.13 | freax | anth_r: I don't know whether you are reading my messages but the gsoc channel tab is becoming red-highlighted when I switch to other programs giving me a feel that you are replying me :-) So weird. |
| 20:31.50 | anth_r | i was indeed replying. back in PM. |
| 20:32.09 | gevaerts | One thing that can be seen as "luck" though is the fact that some organisations get a lot more proposals than others in general. If that also means more *good* proposals (which isn't always going to be the case), picking such an organisation will decrease your chances. |
| 20:33.11 | gevaerts | I don't think there are actual public numbers about this though |
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| 20:33.31 | ojwb | Mrk_: rather than sending multiple proposals to one org, talk to the org |
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| 20:39.14 | Mrk_ | ok, that's what I'll do ojwb |
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| 20:44.28 | idkwhatever | How many students does one mentor have under him/her? |
| 20:45.03 | |Kev| | Typically one. |
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| 20:47.07 | idkwhatever | One? :O |
| 20:47.25 | idkwhatever | That's kind of a waste of resources, dontchya think? |
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| 20:49.27 | |Kev| | No. |
| 20:50.22 | idkwhatever | Does a single student require so much baby-sitting? |
| 20:50.29 | |Kev| | Yes. |
| 20:51.14 | |Kev| | Although calling it baby-sitting isn't really representative. |
| 20:51.47 | anth_r | mentors also typically do things other than just mentor (like having a job) |
| 20:52.00 | idkwhatever | Well so do students, surely. |
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| 20:52.06 | |Kev| | No. |
| 20:52.09 | anth_r | no, typically not. |
| 20:52.17 | idkwhatever | Not necessarily a job, but |
| 20:52.18 | |Kev| | GSoC is a full time job for the students. |
| 20:52.21 | anth_r | GSoC is expected to be full-time for students. |
| 20:52.23 | |Kev| | Very much not for the mentors. |
| 20:52.27 | |Kev| | (Generally) |
| 20:54.55 | ChrisOelmueller | usually mentoring a student takes more time for one mentor than just coding their project instead of the student |
| 20:55.43 | idkwhatever | What do organisations get out of this then? Publicity? Promotion of FOSS? |
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| 20:56.37 | anth_r | new contributors, mostly. |
| 20:56.46 | anth_r | and then some code. |
| 20:57.16 | anth_r | a little cash, i guess, although i'd be surprised if that was a primary motivator for any org. |
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| 20:58.02 | ChrisOelmueller | well the mentor summit definitely is :) |
| 20:58.15 | anth_r | true! |
| 20:58.56 | idkwhatever | You guys have all been mentors? |
| 20:59.34 | ojwb | a lot of people here have |
| 20:59.59 | ojwb | i predict the proportion of students will suddenly increase in just under a day |
| 21:01.18 | ojwb | not sure I'd agree that the mentor could usually just write the code in less time than they spent mentoring |
| 21:01.39 | ojwb | it's certainly sometimes true, and of course some projects fail |
| 21:01.40 | idkwhatever | Exceptional students? |
| 21:02.10 | |Kev| | I assume mentors spend around 1/4 of the time mentoring that students spend coding. Somewhere between 1/8 and 1/4. |
| 21:02.14 | ojwb | well, there are certainly a few where the mentor couldn't write the code even in the time the student took |
| 21:02.44 | |Kev| | It seems quite believable that a mentor would be 4* faster coding on their own project than a new student. |
| 21:02.59 | |Kev| | But 'quite believable' doesn't make it the universal truth, natch. |
| 21:03.07 | ojwb | it the "usually" I'm dubious of |
| 21:04.56 | idkwhatever | Did you spend upwards of two hours a day mentoring? |
| 21:05.49 | ojwb | in a few cases, probably |
| 21:06.15 | gary_b | ojwb: interesting, what did you spend that 2 hours a day doing exactly? |
| 21:06.45 | idkwhatever | I'm a student, but tbh mentoring sounds like more fun. Have to learn something first I guess :P |
| 21:07.10 | ojwb | answering questions, reviewing code, explaining how things work, that sort of thing |
| 21:08.00 | ojwb | our org encourages the students to seek help on irc from whoever's around at the time, which makes it a bit hard to assess the time per student |
| 21:08.14 | gary_b | ojwb: could the student have researched the questions / found out how things worked themselves? |
| 21:08.38 | ojwb | sometimes |
| 21:08.48 | gary_b | fair enough |
| 21:08.58 | ojwb | sadly a lot of the nitty gritty explanations in many open source projects aren't written down |
| 21:09.24 | ojwb | but helping them learn how to help themselves is certainly part of it |
| 21:09.48 | idkwhatever | Do differing time zones create much of a problem? |
| 21:09.58 | ojwb | e.g. pasting error messages into a search engine can help |
| 21:10.13 | ojwb | or can just find you other people who have no idea what it means either |
| 21:10.41 | ojwb | they can be an issue - that's partly why we encourage just asking on IRC |
| 21:11.17 | gary_b | ojwb: cool. Which os project is this? |
| 21:11.25 | ojwb | xapian |
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| 21:14.45 | ojwb | we have a plan this year to create a "development manual" to rehouse all our various development-related docs, and provide an obvious place to add explanations for things where they can be easily found again |
| 21:14.52 | ojwb | so that will probably help |
| 21:15.49 | idkwhatever | sounds tedious |
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| 21:17.41 | ojwb | so's explaining the same things over and over |
| 21:17.58 | ojwb | though the common ones have mostly got written down |
| 21:18.30 | baba | if for example there are 15 proposed projects by a specific firm, tommorow when the list will be released regarding the accepted organization. Will the total slots of the project will also be anounced ? |
| 21:18.45 | ojwb | the organisations aren't firms |
| 21:19.01 | ojwb | the slots are only allocated after the student proposals are in |
| 21:19.29 | ojwb | and they aren't published, they just show up in the org admin's dashboard |
| 21:19.55 | ojwb | the number of ideas in the list isn't really much of an indication of how many slots the org will get |
| 21:20.16 | ojwb | though a large org which expects a lot of slots will presumably try to have more ideas |
| 21:22.30 | gwty | Hello |
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| 21:25.34 | gwty | This is my first time applying for GSoC, and I want to write a proposal not based on the Org's Ideas page. Is it advisable to do so? |
| 21:26.12 | ojwb | gwty: discuss it with the org in question |
| 21:26.25 | ojwb | many orgs are happy with it or even actively encourage it |
| 21:26.26 | dhaun | gwty: most orgs will accept such ideas, but you should talk to them first to see if they are interested at all |
| 21:26.31 | ojwb | but you should at least sanity check the idea |
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| 21:27.06 | ojwb | it's all to easy to have an idea which isn't feasible in the GSoC timescale |
| 21:27.25 | idkwhatever | Technical know-how vs smart ideas vs dedication - what does a mentor look for? |
| 21:27.58 | |Kev| | Varies by mentor, I'd imagine. |
| 21:28.08 | bahaa | money? |
| 21:28.23 | ojwb | i doubt many mentors are in it for the money |
| 21:28.28 | idkwhatever | And you, personally? |
| 21:28.40 | bahaa | :p |
| 21:29.01 | gwty | dhaun: I have talked to the project maintainer, and he liked it.It built upon a bug. I was wondering how it works, since the Ideas page already has the mentors mentioned on it. |
| 21:29.35 | ojwb | gwty: you may need to find someone willing to mentor, or the org may be happy to find someone |
| 21:29.48 | ojwb | you really need to ask these questions of them |
| 21:30.11 | ojwb | find someone in the org that is |
| 21:30.37 | baba | ojwb: my bad in calling the organization "firms" |
| 21:30.50 | ojwb | baba: it's a common misconception |
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| 21:31.39 | ojwb | idkwhatever: i guess i'm involved to promote open source and in particular my org |
| 21:32.04 | baba | ojwb: ok |
| 21:32.15 | baba | do mentors also get paid ? |
| 21:32.17 | ojwb | there's also an aspect which I've not seen mentioned much, which is that you can learn a lot about things by having to explain them to people |
| 21:32.31 | ojwb | the org get US$500 per student mentored |
| 21:32.39 | ojwb | some orgs pass that on, some don't |
| 21:32.57 | baba | cool |
| 21:32.58 | idkwhatever | No I meant, what you look for in a student |
| 21:32.59 | ojwb | they also may get to go to the mentor summit at google hq |
| 21:34.22 | ojwb | idkwhatever: student + proposal combinations which look likely to succeed, fundamentally |
| 21:34.31 | ojwb | people who look like they won't be too painful to mentor |
| 21:34.57 | ojwb | people who never ask questions are actually probably the worst |
| 21:35.41 | ojwb | they just plough off into the distance with little chance to steer them away from problems or bad design decisions |
| 21:35.47 | gwty | ojwb: Ok. Thank you |
| 21:36.43 | ojwb | gwty: if the project maintainer liked the idea, he or she is probably a good person to ask about mentoring it |
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| 21:43.02 | idkwhatever | ojwb: Do you see it as more of a teaching experience or just publicity/contibution for your org? |
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| 21:49.38 | idkwhatever | How seriously do orgs take the "Two Patches Rule"? |
| 21:50.58 | ojwb | idkwhatever: i think it's hard to distinguish - if it wasn't for the teaching aspect, it wouldn't really work |
| 21:51.17 | gary_b | whats the "Two Patches Rule"? |
| 21:51.23 | ojwb | depends on the org |
| 21:51.29 | ojwb | not all require patches |
| 21:52.15 | ojwb | but sending in a few good patches will make you look a good choice for any org |
| 21:52.32 | idkwhatever | Is it too late to start now? :-/ |
| 21:52.34 | ojwb | it shows you've got to grips with the code enough |
| 21:52.35 | ojwb | no |
| 21:52.54 | ojwb | there will be a big surge of interest soon though I bet |
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| 21:53.09 | ojwb | and another when student apps open |
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| 22:55.17 | nashi | participating organisations list for gsoc 2013? |
| 22:55.47 | ojwb | nashi: is yet to be announced |
| 22:56.49 | thiago | nashi: still 21 hours to go |
| 22:57.23 | ojwb | 20 |
| 22:57.30 | nashi | any organisations mentors we can talk to as of now, regarding project ideas? |
| 22:57.31 | ojwb | well, and a few minutes |
| 22:57.54 | ojwb | i'm sure most would be happy to talk to you |
| 22:58.06 | thiago | you usually find them in their channels, though |
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| 23:02.25 | nashi | I am told a github page is a necessity. What kind of code should one upload there, for example? |
| 23:04.25 | stefano-k | nashi: necessity for? |
| 23:05.06 | nashi | necessity for a gsoc applicant student. |
| 23:05.19 | gevaerts | huh? |
| 23:05.24 | gevaerts | Why would that be? |
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| 23:07.24 | gevaerts | Sure, showing code is good, but (a) there's no particular reason for it to be on github, any other place would be just as good, and (b) if the code is in an open source project, just link to that |
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| 23:09.25 | ojwb | nashi: it may be that a particular org requires you to have a github page |
| 23:09.50 | ojwb | though it would seem an odd requirement to me |
| 23:10.23 | ChrisOelmueller | well a github account i could see |
| 23:10.28 | ChrisOelmueller | we'll require that too |
| 23:11.23 | ChrisOelmueller | but i'd be more confused by an applicant hammering out github pages right before applications open than if they didn't have one at all |
| 23:11.37 | nashi | organisations find it easier to select students once they have evidence of their coding ability about the desired/required language for the project, right? |
| 23:12.13 | ChrisOelmueller | i'd prefer them actually having worked with the project in question |
| 23:12.23 | ojwb | i'm probably more interested in seeing how they get to grips with the code they'll be working with |
| 23:12.46 | ojwb | just seeing some code you already wrote isn't as useful |
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| 23:17.40 | nashi | I am learning python as of now. choosing a project where I'd be required to prove proficiency in python would obviously be to my disadvantage then I suppose. |
| 23:18.40 | Mrk_ | !cookie |
| 23:18.40 | gsocbot | Mrk_: "cookie" is omnomnom |
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| 23:20.17 | Mrk_ | gsocbot: countdown |
| 23:20.18 | gsocbot | Mrk_: "countdown" is (#1) http://goo.gl/tlSVK, or (#2) http://href.hu/x/hn5a |
| 23:22.07 | Mrk_ | gsocbot: next |
| 23:22.08 | gsocbot | Mrk_: "next" is April 8 19:00 UTC: Accepted mentor organizations announced |
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| 23:25.15 | afahim | 19 hours left! |
| 23:25.16 | ojwb | gsocbot: forget countdown |
| 23:25.16 | gsocbot | ojwb: Error: 2 factoids have that key. Please specify which one to remove, or use * to designate all of them. |
| 23:25.20 | ojwb | gsocbot: forget countdown * |
| 23:25.20 | gsocbot | ojwb: The operation succeeded. |
| 23:27.22 | Mrk_ | !learn countdown as http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/to?msg=Accepted+students+announcement&day=27&month=05&year=2013&hour=19&min=00&sec=00&p0=0 |
| 23:27.22 | gsocbot | Mrk_: "countdown" is http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/to?msg=Accepted+students+announcement&day=27&month=05&year=2013&hour=19&min=00&sec=00&p0=0 |
| 23:27.41 | ojwb | a shortened version would be better |
| 23:28.12 | Mrk_ | gsocbot: forget countdown |
| 23:28.12 | gsocbot | Mrk_: The operation succeeded. |
| 23:28.17 | Mrk_ | !learn countdown as http://goo.gl/ocEn4 |
| 23:28.22 | gsocbot | Mrk_: "countdown" is http://goo.gl/ocEn4 |
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