| 00:01.07 | d3kod | hello, can I ask a question - is it possible to apply to GSoC as a team (me and my friend for a single proposal) |
| 00:01.28 | sukhe | d3kod: no. |
| 00:01.43 | xanat0s | ^^^^ |
| 00:02.03 | sukhe | d3kod: http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page#10._Can_a_group_apply_for_and_work_on_a |
| 00:02.23 | d3kod | sukhe, xanat0s: thanks =) |
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| 00:03.37 | _Nico | are the numbers of applicants to gsoc published anywhere? |
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| 00:05.26 | xanat0s | _Nico: nowhere that i know of. but don't quote me on that |
| 00:05.43 | sukhe | !numapps | _Nico |
| 00:05.43 | gsocbot | _Nico: "numapps" is In 2013, 177 of 417 mentoring orgs were accepted. In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
| 00:06.45 | xanat0s | what's numapps? |
| 00:07.36 | _Nico | xanat0s: I'm guessing number of applicants :) |
| 00:08.03 | xanat0s | _Nico: lol i'm wondering where that info actually is |
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| 00:22.04 | jayprich | looks like data is distributed via email and some orgs have published pages with it on .. e.g. http://www.honeynet.org/node/840 ... 2010-2012 data and 2013 data on official blog ( http://google-opensource.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/mentoring-organizations-for-google.html ) |
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| 01:15.40 | LuisFlores | HELP |
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| 01:17.09 | tomprince | ? |
| 01:18.49 | mmadia | ", I need somebody. HELP, not just anybody, ..." -- the Beatles. :) |
| 01:19.22 | LuisFlores | Sorry, I tried to do the command help xd |
| 01:19.39 | srinup | !help |
| 01:19.39 | gsocbot | srinup: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. |
| 01:19.59 | srinup | like that |
| 01:20.22 | LuisFlores | Thanks srinup =)! |
| 01:20.36 | ojwb | that's a command to the bot - /help is an IRC command |
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| 05:24.28 | pratnala | ChatZilla |
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| 05:55.48 | roonyH | i like to see some !logs |
| 05:55.55 | roonyH | !logs |
| 05:55.56 | gsocbot | roonyH: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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| 06:05.56 | f2prateek | Would love some feedback on my propsal draft http://bit.ly/10QySrd . |
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| 06:06.23 | f2prateek | I'm not sure if this too long, or if I should elaborate my proposal more. |
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| 06:13.34 | f2prateek | Updated the link the doc to leave comments, feel free to do so :) |
| 06:13.45 | f2prateek | *linked |
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| 07:26.59 | ojwb | f2prateek: looks plausible, though orgs may look for different things, so asking for feedback from the org you're subitting to is best |
| 07:27.32 | ojwb | looks like you're already expanding on the timeline, which i was going to suggest |
| 07:27.55 | f2prateek | ojwb: I already posted in #XBMC, but I'm thinking I'll try again tomorrow at a time people are more likely to be up. |
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| 07:30.01 | ojwb | f2prateek: just to warn you, I'm not sure how well the 2 column formatting will survive being pasted into melange |
| 07:30.40 | f2prateek | Yeah I'l just put in a single column with headers on the site |
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| 07:35.48 | f2prateek | I'm looking at https://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/org/google/gsoc2013/xbmc and http://wiki.xbmc.org/index.php?title=Google_Summer_of_Code_2013 , and no names of mentors are mentioned. Does GSoC keep a list, or do I just ask XBMC themselves. |
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| 07:36.31 | xanat0s | f2prateek: https://google-melange.appspot.com/gsoc/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2013 |
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| 07:37.07 | f2prateek | I can find the organizations listed, not the specifc mentors in that organisation. |
| 07:37.14 | f2prateek | *from that |
| 07:38.07 | xanat0s | oops sorry misread that. some orgs don't do a good job of specifying mentor info |
| 07:38.17 | pratnala | u go to an org's idea page and see if u can find |
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| 07:46.26 | banas | I've made updates to my proposal. Could anyone help review it so I could improve it further? |
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| 08:18.14 | sese | hello , i cannot insert image on Melange, do someone encounter this problem? |
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| 08:20.27 | waldi | you are at least the third. just don't do it |
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| 08:25.27 | kblin | I can link to images hosted elsewhere just fine :) |
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| 08:26.48 | sese | 3q, i just find this, it cannot insert image directly |
| 08:27.52 | sese | but i cannot understand this |
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| 10:01.40 | denisboyun | hi. How to know my proposal was accepting to gsoc? |
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| 10:02.36 | waldi | denisboyun: you will get an e-mail |
| 10:06.23 | denisboyun | waldi: When will that be? |
| 10:06.58 | ansgar | denisboyun: On 27th May. |
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| 10:13.00 | denisboyun | ansgar: No, I said not about a final result. I say how to know that my proposal was receiving to Google? |
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| 10:35.29 | olly | denisboyun: look in your dashboard and you should see it listed |
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| 10:47.01 | k-joseph | :) |
| 10:47.03 | k-joseph | <PROTECTED> |
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| 11:13.08 | saviour | can anybody help? Basically the rule to participate in the gsoc is to submit a project proposal for a particular open source organization then if accepted you will be told to write the code. mentor will guide and at the end you will submit the project |
| 11:13.29 | saviour | but how they are going to evaluate quality |
| 11:13.48 | |Kev| | However they like. |
| 11:13.49 | saviour | i mean which project is better which code is better |
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| 11:14.29 | saviour | hmm. it means they have the completele freedom to choose anyone |
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| 11:14.39 | |Kev| | But often used things are "Did the student communicate well during the application period?" "Is the application written well" "Is the timeline reasonable" "Has the student obviously thought through the problem" "Is the student sufficiently qualified" |
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| 11:15.10 | |Kev| | Yes, the orgs have completely freedom to choose whoever they want for the limited slots they get. |
| 11:15.24 | |Kev| | -ly |
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| 11:16.40 | saviour | in the site it is told a participant can propose upto five projects can they be for different orgs or same? |
| 11:16.57 | |Kev| | Wherever they like. |
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| 11:17.09 | |Kev| | But conventional wisdom is that submitting five would be a bad idea. |
| 11:17.20 | saviour | ofcourse |
| 11:17.41 | saviour | but whati want to know is can i propose for multiple orgs |
| 11:17.55 | |Kev| | Yes, the five can be wherever the applicant wants. |
| 11:18.22 | saviour | you have been a great help thank you very much |
| 11:19.11 | |Kev| | yw |
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| 11:24.25 | olly | saviour: and generally it's a good idea to talk to an org before submitting multiple proposals to the same org |
| 11:25.07 | olly | sometimes doing that makes sense, sometimes you'd do better to focus on just one |
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| 11:28.33 | saviour | i understand but there are multiple organizations doing the same kind of work that i find interest. dont you think that applying for multiple orgs will increase my chance as it is not sure whether i will be acceplted or not. @ olly |
| 11:29.07 | gevaerts | Maybe, but maybe not |
| 11:29.13 | olly | saviour: I'm talking about multiple proposals to the *same* org |
| 11:29.26 | gevaerts | High quality proposals take time, and time is a finite resource |
| 11:32.02 | saviour | I am quite late. So what i can do is write a average grade proposal for one org or write three low level proposal. and then for both depend on the luck. |
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| 11:32.29 | olly | 3 poor quality propsals gives you 3 times no chance of acceptance... |
| 11:32.46 | saviour | correct |
| 11:33.03 | saviour | but idea might be issue |
| 11:33.12 | saviour | dont you think |
| 11:33.30 | olly | my experience (as a mentor) has been that the majority of students we accept haven't applied elsewhere |
| 11:33.43 | olly | but the average number of proposals is just under 1.5 |
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| 11:34.35 | olly | (when I say majority, it's something like 90% for the last 2 years) |
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| 11:35.54 | olly | so it seems fewer proposals is the better approach |
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| 11:41.10 | saviour | That is right. cause even if i am not accepted i can still work on it. I will take your advice. t |
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| 11:44.48 | sachin_h | But applying to more than one wouldn't have a negative effect of any kind right? |
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| 11:46.43 | gevaerts | sachin_h: assuming infinite time, no |
| 11:47.03 | sachin_h | I mean if I have put a good amount of effort on both, they wouldn't get inclined to feel I split my focus, would they? |
| 11:47.43 | gevaerts | Well, that doesn't (or shouldn't) matter |
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| 11:48.01 | gevaerts | What *does* matter is what your competitors are doing |
| 11:48.46 | gevaerts | If someone else is equally suited for a project, but you're dividing your attention and they're not, your applications individually will be worse |
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| 11:50.22 | sachin_h | I'm a little confused. If the applications *are* equally good, they would feel inclined to take the guy who applied to only one. Is that what you mean? |
| 11:50.39 | gevaerts | No |
| 11:51.13 | gevaerts | I'm saying that if both *applicants* are equally good, the proposal by the applicant who only concentrates on one proposal will be better |
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| 11:54.53 | sachin_h | ah, okay. So, if 2 applicants *finally* submit proposals that are equally good, there would be no bias towards anyone, right? |
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| 11:55.15 | kai | no, not really |
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| 11:55.50 | kai | but in practice you rarely see this :) |
| 11:57.35 | sachin_h | rarely see equally good proposals one by someone who didn't submit anything else and another by someone who did? |
| 12:00.26 | kai | yeah |
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| 12:03.01 | sachin_h | thank you |
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| 12:07.47 | azi` | is there any estimate how much google invests in this GSOC thing? |
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| 12:07.54 | azi` | just courious how much does it cost |
| 12:08.16 | saviour | sorry to bug again. Can there be a affinity towards local paricipants than foreign participants in any organization. (specially the one which have a lot of indian people) |
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| 12:10.52 | dfighter | azi` at least 5500*students $ |
| 12:11.34 | MatthewWilkes | saviour: What are you asking? |
| 12:12.04 | dfighter | MatthewWilkes he is asking if orgs are more likely to pick students with specifiec nationalities |
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| 12:12.33 | MatthewWilkes | Ah, maybe. |
| 12:12.50 | MatthewWilkes | Preferably not, though |
| 12:13.20 | sunu | azi`: last year it was 7.3 million USD |
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| 12:23.47 | kai | saviour: We've got contributors from australia, europe, the USA, what would be a "local participant"? |
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| 12:26.37 | olly | kai: one from earth |
| 12:27.19 | olly | there are a few orgs which look to be more clearly associated with a particular region though |
| 12:28.17 | olly | i'd hope they either don't favour "local" applicants, or make it clear that they do |
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| 12:31.35 | kai | olly: ok, fair enough. A lot of the interaction we do is based on TCP/IP, and latency from Mars or the Jupiter moons make participating in GSoC a bit impractical |
| 12:32.07 | grumpy_cat | feh. Mars is close enough for REPL use |
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| 12:34.43 | olly | kai: you should try TMA/IP |
| 12:35.00 | olly | works great from Jupiter to Earth |
| 12:35.38 | grumpy_cat | not sure what was used for Deep Space One (iirc), might have been plain old serial terminal, but it worked enough to write code on DS1 :P |
| 12:36.30 | kai | sure, but I don't want to wait for those people on mumble conf calls |
| 12:36.53 | grumpy_cat | hehe |
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| 12:40.48 | djmitche | does the mentor application take a few days to show up? I've had two people apply to be mentors, but I haven't gotten an email, and as far as I can see there's nowhere in melange that lists pending connections |
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| 12:46.20 | MatthewWilkes | djmitche: https://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/dashboard/google/gsoc2013#org_connections shows pending connections |
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| 13:00.45 | ensonic | hi, anyone know where I can find the channel logs? |
| 13:01.11 | waldi | !logs |
| 13:01.12 | gsocbot | waldi: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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| 13:01.44 | ensonic | thanks |
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| 13:27.15 | Crystallis | !next |
| 13:27.16 | gsocbot | Crystallis: "next" is May 3 19:00 UTC: Student application deadline. ( Countdown at http://tinyurl.com/cg526v7 ) |
| 13:27.37 | Crystallis | 4 days left... :( |
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| 13:29.46 | chrismed | hello, I've written a proposal and published it as a gist. Can I point to my gist in submit proposal form or should I copy and reformat the proposal (which might be boring)? |
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| 13:31.41 | ansgar | chrismed: Depends on the org. Ask them how they prefer proposals. |
| 13:32.08 | chrismed | ansgar: thank you |
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| 13:46.48 | ChadWindnagle | Hey all |
| 13:47.51 | ChadWindnagle | brain teaser for you: I have a potential student who's submitted a proposal. But I was alerted by a mentor that they have posted software and keys on a warez site. I'm thinkg we'll probably ignore the proposal out of principal, thoughts? |
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| 13:49.24 | summatusmentis | I mean, as the org, you get to decide how you pick students |
| 13:50.12 | summatusmentis | personally, it seems like a) doing that sort of thing doesn't necessarily speak anything about their capacity, and b) maybe ought not be relevant within GSoC |
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| 13:50.47 | ChadWindnagle | my only thought is the ethics of the student are now in question. Who knows where is code will come from now. |
| 13:51.01 | summatusmentis | maybe there's an argument that ignoring copyright, etc. etc. |
| 13:51.02 | summatusmentis | yeah |
| 13:51.31 | summatusmentis | I'm a former student of 2 years, never done the org side, so take this all with a grain of salt |
| 13:51.40 | summatusmentis | but maybe it'd be useful to talk to the student? |
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| 13:52.37 | ChadWindnagle | I'm sure if we said something the warez would be taken down. but that's not necessarily my issue. More of a question of their ethics and character. Perhaps I'm over thinking it? |
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| 13:52.50 | summatusmentis | and, to be clear, I'm certain there are very good open source devs that pirate music and things |
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| 13:53.17 | summatusmentis | or, certain is strong, but I'd be surprised if there weren't |
| 13:54.24 | summatusmentis | I guess what I'm getting at is that it's not at all clear to me that participating in warez is an indicator of their quality as a student |
| 13:54.39 | summatusmentis | certainly could be, but it also may not be |
| 13:55.41 | ChadWindnagle | True true. But our community in general is pretty tough on warez activity |
| 13:55.56 | gevaerts | It's entirely up to you |
| 13:56.08 | summatusmentis | which is fine, as I said, you as the org get to decide |
| 13:56.21 | summatusmentis | it may be that because of community norms, this student is the wrong fit |
| 13:56.24 | summatusmentis | and that's ok |
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| 13:58.02 | ChadWindnagle | Valid points. Okay that helps |
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| 13:59.21 | summatusmentis | people make mistakes, I think it's fair to take that into account when making a decision, predicated on changed behavior |
| 13:59.29 | summatusmentis | which is why I suggested talking to them |
| 13:59.50 | summatusmentis | a conversation (or continued conversation) can go a long way |
| 14:00.18 | djmitche | when a mentor applies, where should I see that in my dashboard |
| 14:01.28 | ChadWindnagle | Agreed. I"ll at least send him a note right now and ask him to think about how that might impact his proposal in our eyes |
| 14:02.33 | summatusmentis | I don't know what role you're taking on, but you might consider talking to the community too |
| 14:02.45 | summatusmentis | or at least the other mentors/org people |
| 14:02.47 | ChadWindnagle | I'm an org admin. I'm asking my fellow admins and mentors |
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| 14:03.05 | summatusmentis | yeah, all I'm suggesting is talking about "policy" might be useful |
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| 14:03.58 | ChadWindnagle | Agreed, this is my second year adminning for our org (we've had other admins), so I'm kind of rewriting the book on how we do things. This is new for us. Every year we learn more :) |
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| 16:15.38 | Guest51036 | hello |
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| 16:25.02 | pratnala | hi |
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| 16:34.26 | sunu | git diff |
| 16:34.40 | sunu | oops. sorry |
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| 16:35.47 | pratnala | hehe |
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| 16:50.06 | Guest51036 | is there someone i can talk to? |
| 16:51.51 | pratnala | regarding? i'm also a student but i can help if i know the answers :) |
| 16:53.21 | Guest51036 | http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page#16._What_if_there_is_no_organization |
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| 16:53.57 | Guest51036 | is there more info? |
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| 16:55.19 | pratnala | u dont like any of the orgs? |
| 16:55.52 | Guest51036 | i have a big project i'm working on and i would be more than happy to keep working on that |
| 16:55.56 | Guest51036 | it's open source anyway |
| 16:56.38 | pratnala | so then u apply to google open source programs office and hope to get selected if google is impressed |
| 16:56.41 | pratnala | u need a mentor |
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| 16:58.00 | neverpanic | this would have been easier if the project applied as org, though |
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| 17:01.27 | Guest51036 | it's not an official project |
| 17:01.32 | Guest51036 | it's me working with a professor |
| 17:02.14 | Guest51036 | what do i have to ask to my professor? |
| 17:02.25 | pratnala | you should put this on the gsoc mailing list |
| 17:02.34 | pratnala | carol or somebody can reply better |
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| 17:04.50 | Guest51036 | Students List ? |
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| 17:05.34 | pratnala | yes |
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| 17:09.40 | Guest51036 | i cannot read it :( |
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| 17:11.06 | pratnala | join it |
| 17:11.32 | pratnala | this one: https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/google-summer-of-code-discuss |
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| 17:13.17 | Guest51036 | thank you |
| 17:13.27 | pratnala | anytime! |
| 17:13.40 | pratnala | btw the students list is for students who get selected :P |
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| 17:18.03 | Gridriver | I'm new here, can someone tell me, exactly how do I have to propose my Open Source project, |
| 17:18.20 | Gridriver | Do I even have to do it or the mentor organization would do it for me? |
| 17:18.38 | Gridriver | Is anyone there? |
| 17:18.39 | scorche|sh | Gridriver: have you read through our fine FAQ? |
| 17:18.50 | perepujal1 | Gridriver: It's YOUR project |
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| 17:19.32 | Gridriver | I tried but it repeatedly mentions the timeline and timeline didn't say much except that 3rd is the last date for submission |
| 17:20.10 | scorche|sh | Gridriver: what do you mean? - what is not on the timeline that should be? |
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| 17:21.15 | Gridriver | scorche|sh: What I mean to ask is, 3rd is the last date of submission, fine! But where do I have to submit my project? |
| 17:21.23 | Gridriver | WHERE is what I want to ask. |
| 17:21.42 | perepujal1 | You will have to explain in it what want to do, how want to do it, in what time do you think it will be done, why are you the best person to develop it..... |
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| 17:22.24 | pratnala | you have to submit on melange |
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| 17:22.51 | pratnala | since i get it u r doing an independent project, u apply thru google open source programs office |
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| 17:24.19 | pratnala | Gridriver: sorry i confused you with guest51036 |
| 17:24.37 | Guest51036 | ! |
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| 17:24.49 | pratnala | my bad im sorry |
| 17:26.10 | scorche|sh | !faq |
| 17:26.11 | gsocbot | scorche|sh: "faq" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page |
| 17:26.14 | scorche|sh | !studentguide |
| 17:26.15 | gsocbot | scorche|sh: "studentguide" is http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ |
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| 17:26.18 | scorche|sh | Gridriver: ^^ |
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| 17:52.03 | Guilherme_ | hello |
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| 17:53.46 | ace_striker | hi there.. |
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| 17:55.50 | ace_striker | i have spotted LINK_ID term in R project for statistical computing project template...what will be here or how should i proceed.. |
| 17:56.25 | tomprince | That is your melange user name (it should show up when you are logged in) |
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| 17:58.12 | ace_striker | tomprince: thanks for reply btw link_id is outdated as per this link http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2012/userguide#linkid |
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| 17:59.43 | tomprince | I thought I saw it this year, but maybe I'm mistaken. |
| 18:00.11 | tomprince | In any case, that template may not have been updated to reflect the change. (The R people may not have been aware of the change) |
| 18:00.47 | ace_striker | but there is your google-melange username .right?? |
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| 18:01.05 | tomprince | Yes. link_id was the old name for that. |
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| 18:21.33 | swook | hmmm... is it wrong for me to feel like wanting to tell my org they're the only one I'm applying to? |
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| 18:23.27 | scorche|sh | not really, but dont assume that gives you any special priority over other students |
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| 18:57.43 | swook | scorche|sh: no of course not |
| 18:57.47 | swook | thanks |
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| 19:10.28 | d33tah | hi guys! |
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| 19:10.51 | d33tah | a friend of mine would want to apply to gsoc, but he's a bit unconfident about whether he'll succeed |
| 19:11.07 | summatusmentis | I was that way too |
| 19:11.11 | d33tah | and here's the question - what if he fails? |
| 19:11.11 | summatusmentis | and I passed |
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| 19:11.21 | summatusmentis | depends on when he fails |
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| 19:11.59 | summatusmentis | at least in past years (I'm not certain about this year), payment was broken into separate sections, upon passing a mid-term review, and upon passing final review. |
| 19:12.04 | d33tah | what if somehow he gets overwhelmed by time requirements? |
| 19:12.16 | summatusmentis | he'd need to be keeping his org up to date |
| 19:12.20 | d33tah | simply gives up during the process? |
| 19:12.30 | summatusmentis | simply giving up is not a good idea |
| 19:12.34 | summatusmentis | and will guarantee a fail |
| 19:12.55 | d33tah | yeah, i know, but he wanted me to find out if there are any penalties for that |
| 19:13.03 | summatusmentis | define penalties |
| 19:13.15 | d33tah | like financial ones? legal? |
| 19:13.20 | summatusmentis | he wouldn't get paid, he wouldn't get a certificate or a t-shirt |
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| 19:13.33 | summatusmentis | students aren't legally obligated to complete |
| 19:13.48 | d33tah | so it's not about what he'd lose, but what he wouldn't get? |
| 19:14.08 | summatusmentis | right, I don't know if the site still lists people who didn't complete their projects |
| 19:14.18 | summatusmentis | but it's conceivable that someone could find out if they were looking |
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| 19:14.53 | gevaerts | Any reason why *you* are asking? |
| 19:14.55 | d33tah | okay, thanks summatusmentis, you were very helpful :) |
| 19:15.01 | d33tah | because he's afk, basically. |
| 19:15.07 | gevaerts | ok :) |
| 19:15.42 | gevaerts | was going to attempt a little speech about communication being a key factor, but if there's a good excuse... :) |
| 19:16.26 | summatusmentis | d33tah: any particular reason he might not complete (assuming he were accepted)? |
| 19:17.09 | d33tah | it's basically about time |
| 19:17.38 | d33tah | he's not exactly sure he might spend 40hrs a week coding |
| 19:17.40 | summatusmentis | yes, but are there particular time commitments he's made already? |
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| 19:17.50 | d33tah | what kind of? |
| 19:18.02 | summatusmentis | he's not intending to hold a second job or anything like that? |
| 19:18.22 | summatusmentis | because that's generally forwned upon |
| 19:18.37 | d33tah | he's on an internship, but it'll probably finish before the coding starts |
| 19:18.48 | swook | probably? |
| 19:19.13 | d33tah | hadn't really asked him about specific time bounds |
| 19:19.20 | swook | I'm sure it wouldn't matter if he loses the first few weeks as long as he makes this known |
| 19:19.48 | d33tah | it was like i showed him ideas list of a specific project and he said "awesome, im applying! but... what if i don't make it?" |
| 19:19.59 | gevaerts | The *most* important thing about these things is to be honest and open about them to the organisations when you apply |
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| 19:21.27 | summatusmentis | I'm assuming (although I don't know for sure) that not completing one year sort of poisons the well for you in the future |
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| 19:22.57 | jojva | it's just a matter of being honest, can you do it or not. Is the organisation ok with a part time gsoc student... |
| 19:23.20 | summatusmentis | yes |
| 19:23.34 | jojva | You won't "fail" if you work, you will just progress more slowly |
| 19:23.55 | jojva | failing is when you go on holidays while people wait for you |
| 19:24.17 | summatusmentis | to some extent it depends on the org |
| 19:24.21 | summatusmentis | but yes |
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| 19:51.08 | d33tah | i have another question, this time about me |
| 19:51.23 | d33tah | im in the final year of IT studies |
| 19:52.15 | d33tah | i might graduate before the GSOC pencils down, do I have to postpone the graduation to be eglible for gsoc? |
| 19:52.24 | DeNiS_M | no |
| 19:52.26 | summatusmentis | !faq |
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| 19:52.27 | gsocbot | summatusmentis: "faq" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page |
| 19:52.30 | summatusmentis | check that out |
| 19:52.36 | summatusmentis | it answers your question |
| 19:52.37 | DeNiS_M | you have to be a student as of 27 of may |
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| 19:52.48 | d33tah | won't be a problem then. |
| 19:54.00 | d33tah | btw, i've read the faq and couldn't find it there |
| 19:54.04 | d33tah | gotta ctr+f for 27 now |
| 19:54.39 | d33tah | oh, yeah, it's there. thanks. |
| 19:56.56 | ocf | \join #iprj |
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| 20:02.28 | nurupo | what is the deadline for proposal: May 3rd 23:59 or May 2nd 23:59? |
| 20:02.55 | gevaerts | !next | nurupo |
| 20:02.56 | gsocbot | nurupo: "next" is May 3 19:00 UTC: Student application deadline. ( Countdown at http://tinyurl.com/cg526v7 ) |
| 20:03.37 | nurupo | gevaerts: thanks |
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| 20:13.28 | roonyH | !chance |
| 20:13.28 | gsocbot | roonyH: "chance" is p, where p + q = 1 and 0 <= q <= 1 |
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| 20:14.02 | derdon | and what is q? |
| 20:14.17 | roonyH | given |
| 20:14.30 | roonyH | 0<=q<=1 |
| 20:15.10 | derdon | I meant: what is the meaning of q? |
| 20:15.31 | roonyH | q is greater than 0 and less than 1 |
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| 20:16.01 | derdon | that's not what I asked for |
| 20:16.15 | derdon | I can read but not interpret |
| 20:17.22 | summatusmentis | in stats, q is defined as 1-p, where p is the probability of an event |
| 20:17.24 | swook | q is not p |
| 20:17.37 | derdon | summatusmentis: that's better |
| 20:17.54 | roonyH | so, 0 < = chance < = 1 |
| 20:18.26 | derdon | roonyH: no! |
| 20:18.44 | derdon | roonyH: gsocbot says that the chance is p, not q |
| 20:18.45 | roonyH | why not ? |
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| 20:19.38 | roonyH | if 0 < = q < = 1 and p+q=1 shouldn't 0 < = p < = 1 |
| 20:20.01 | gevaerts | hopes so! |
| 20:20.04 | swook | 1-p has the same distribution as p |
| 20:21.12 | derdon | roonyH: you're right] |
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| 20:21.27 | derdon | though I still can't say what q represents |
| 20:21.33 | roonyH | :) |
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| 20:24.06 | summatusmentis | in stats, q usually represents the probability of not the event |
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| 20:25.09 | derdon | summatusmentis: heh, should have come to the conclusion myself. was too obvious :P |
| 20:25.44 | summatusmentis | yes :) |
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| 20:25.53 | summatusmentis | that's why I didn't mention it up front |
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| 20:29.13 | roonyH | bye all. need some sleep. :) |
| 20:29.35 | d33tah | guys, i was just thinking |
| 20:30.12 | d33tah | don't you have the same impression that it's very rarely that gsoc gets summarized well in a single sentence? |
| 20:30.32 | d33tah | i mean, years before i was putting off the applying because i was too lazy to do the research and all i knew about gsoc wax |
| 20:30.35 | d33tah | was* |
| 20:30.52 | d33tah | "well, it's some google's scholarship project where you code for open source apps" |
| 20:31.26 | d33tah | not even once did i read in a single sentence that it's REMOTE, takes three monts and pays 5k usd. |
| 20:31.32 | derdon | d33tah: I think it cannot be summarized in one short sentence |
| 20:31.54 | d33tah | yeah, i know, but i mean, the most interesting stuff |
| 20:32.18 | d33tah | for the ones that have no clue about what gsoc is |
| 20:32.26 | derdon | d33tah: how did you find out about gsoc? |
| 20:32.44 | d33tah | well, all the blogs, news sites and so on kept writing about it |
| 20:32.45 | derdon | I first heard about it via an IT news portal |
| 20:32.51 | d33tah | slashdot, osnews, h-online... |
| 20:33.22 | swook | "Google Summer of Code is a global program that offers students stipends to write code for open source projects." (source: GSoC website) |
| 20:33.27 | swook | that says it all |
| 20:33.39 | d33tah | it skips three important factors |
| 20:33.40 | swook | global: open to everyone (almost) |
| 20:33.44 | swook | students: the target audience |
| 20:33.49 | swook | stipends: paid |
| 20:33.51 | d33tah | where does it take place, how much does it pay and how much work is needed? |
| 20:33.53 | swook | write code: the action |
| 20:34.05 | swook | for open source projects: implies remote work |
| 20:34.08 | derdon | global: in the internet |
| 20:34.24 | swook | including the documentation, community and all |
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| 20:34.49 | d33tah | wasn't that obvious to me |
| 20:34.56 | derdon | d33tah: "how much work" is a detail everyone wil lfind out who is interested in the program |
| 20:35.12 | swook | d33tah: the amount of money is not important |
| 20:35.22 | d33tah | i guess its a motivator for quite a few people out there |
| 20:35.53 | derdon | I would do it for less |
| 20:35.54 | swook | yes, but that is not what GSoC is about or aims to be about |
| 20:36.22 | d33tah | a few months ago i wasn't even sure if its remote or do i have to move to some place for the time being |
| 20:36.48 | swook | !faq | d33tah |
| 20:36.48 | gsocbot | d33tah: "faq" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page |
| 20:36.54 | d33tah | yeah, now i do know |
| 20:37.00 | swook | it has every single thing one would want to know |
| 20:37.03 | swook | provided interest |
| 20:37.05 | d33tah | but it took me quite a bit of reading :P |
| 20:37.28 | d33tah | it just felt kinda flawed in terms of marketing |
| 20:37.31 | swook | it's definitely more work than an average internship application |
| 20:38.34 | swook | d33tah: how would you want to be informed about it? |
| 20:40.07 | d33tah | now that a friend asks me what it is, I say it's a Google's project that funds 5K USD for three months of remote work on an open source project you choose. |
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| 20:44.10 | censorydep | "it's definitely more work than an average internship application" I suspect this may be true of the internship as well. But then, GSOC isn't for everyone… :-) |
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| 20:44.35 | gevaerts | It's only for about one thousand people :) |
| 20:45.05 | censorydep | well played sir, well played. |
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| 20:45.47 | swook | hmm was it |
| 20:45.48 | swook | !numbers |
| 20:45.51 | swook | !stats |
| 20:45.52 | gsocbot | swook: I have 2 registered users with 2 registered hostmasks; 1 owner and 0 admins. |
| 20:46.00 | swook | err okay |
| 20:46.07 | gevaerts | !numapps | swook |
| 20:46.07 | gsocbot | swook: "numapps" is In 2013, 177 of 417 mentoring orgs were accepted. In 2012, 180 of 406 mentoring orgs were accepted; 4258 students submitted 6685 proposals, of which 1212 were accepted. In 2011, 175 of 417 orgs were accepted; 3731 students submitted 5474 proposals, and 1116 were accepted. In 2010, 151 of 367 orgs were accepted; 3464 students submitted 5539 proposals, and 1026 were accepted. |
| 20:46.13 | swook | cheers :) |
| 20:46.45 | swook | 3.5 : 1 is not bad at all |
| 20:46.57 | swook | I wonder what the ratio is once rubbish apps are discounted |
| 20:47.06 | swook | there must be a few of those |
| 20:47.39 | d33tah | depends on how strict your definition of rubbish is |
| 20:47.57 | swook | I've just heard about one-line apps |
| 20:48.13 | censorydep | "give me money, I make software!" |
| 20:48.18 | swook | that's my standard I suppose, something that doesn't go beyond one line |
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| 20:48.35 | d33tah | if a student is quite good on some particular technology, but knows hardly anything about the project or organization and applies, putting away the research phase, is it still rubbish? |
| 20:48.56 | swook | I think intelligent people learn skills quickly |
| 20:49.01 | d33tah | so do I. |
| 20:49.01 | swook | especially with good guidance |
| 20:49.03 | swook | so no |
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| 20:49.39 | d33tah | well, i meant he has the skills, but not much knowledge about what he is applying for, apart from the technologies used that he knows he's good at |
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| 20:50.07 | censorydep | you can also chat with the orbs you're interested in advance and see what they do and what technologies they are interested in… most have IRC channels on freenode. (or maybe many, rather than most) |
| 20:50.22 | d33tah | im actually browsing organizations |
| 20:50.31 | censorydep | that's orgs not orbs… stupid autocorrect. |
| 20:50.32 | swook | I think some orgs apply for an expansion of the community, some orgs do so for labour, some for fun, some for combinations... |
| 20:50.35 | d33tah | kind of started the research yesterday |
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| 20:50.46 | swook | I tend to talk to my orbs too censorydep |
| 20:50.58 | censorydep | lol |
| 20:51.11 | swook | d33tah: I think the answer to your question depends on what an org is looking for |
| 20:51.29 | McEnroe | Once I submit a proposal, is it possible to change it? I want to write up a preliminary one, give to the org for review, and make changes as necessary .... |
| 20:51.31 | swook | if it's basically a contract job, then yes that should be perfectly fine |
| 20:51.42 | swook | McEnroe: you can submit and edit your proposal until |
| 20:51.47 | swook | !next | McEnroe |
| 20:51.48 | gsocbot | McEnroe: "next" is May 3 19:00 UTC: Student application deadline. ( Countdown at http://tinyurl.com/cg526v7 ) |
| 20:52.59 | swook | censorydep: swapping orbs with girls makes it a good life tip ;) |
| 20:53.10 | swook | (not sure about IRC channels) |
| 20:53.39 | censorydep | that's true swook, but I've learned the hard way that you have to make sure they *want* to swap first… :-p |
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| 20:54.44 | swook | oh god this is quickly getting off the hooks |
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| 21:07.06 | d33tah | where is the ideas list for Google Open Source Programs Office? |
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| 21:07.38 | swook | there are none |
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| 21:07.43 | gevaerts | d33tah: there isn't one |
| 21:07.46 | gevaerts | See the FAQ |
| 21:07.54 | d33tah | okay |
| 21:08.00 | swook | you apply to it if you have a proposal and an agreed mentor but not as part of an accepted organisation |
| 21:08.08 | swook | but this is very rarely accepted |
| 21:08.45 | d33tah | not my case then. thanks ^^ |
| 21:09.03 | gevaerts | I suspect that one attracts a lot of scammy proposals |
| 21:09.07 | swook | np |
| 21:09.15 | swook | I'd like to read some! |
| 21:09.26 | gevaerts | Of course, they're also least likely to fall for them |
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| 21:13.02 | swook | sorry, it's how members of our tribe greet one another |
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| 23:14.22 | d33tah | hm |
| 23:14.36 | d33tah | who will review my application - google or the organisation i'm applying to? |
| 23:15.49 | gevaerts | The organisation |
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| 23:17.23 | d33tah | thanks, gevaerts. and it's totally up to them on whether i'll get accepted or not? |
| 23:18.09 | gevaerts | Yes |
| 23:18.20 | gevaerts | Well, google will check the paperwork |
| 23:18.37 | gevaerts | Things like enrollment, age, ... |
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| 23:19.43 | sumanah | hi d33tah |
| 23:19.55 | d33tah | yeah, hi sumanah |
| 23:19.57 | sumanah | d33tah: if you would like for more people to look at your application and give you feedback, you can ask |
| 23:20.29 | d33tah | nah, not yet. im still in the research phase. |
| 23:20.52 | sumanah | d33tah: The sooner you start showing drafts around the sooner people can help you improve :) |
| 23:20.56 | sumanah | good luck! |
| 23:21.09 | d33tah | trying to balance between application quality and count. i really want to get into the program and i don't want to bet on a single project. |
| 23:21.16 | sumanah | !odds |
| 23:21.16 | gsocbot | sumanah: "odds" is Odds, chances or probability really do not come into play for GSoC. Rambling off numbers or asking What are the odds of getting accepted... is really quite useless as one's acceptance is not dictated by luck or numbers, but by the quality of your proposal and your skills instead. |
| 23:21.20 | d33tah | sumanah: thank you, i guess i'll need it |
| 23:21.28 | sumanah | hmm, that's a bit harsh in the wording, bot |
| 23:21.37 | sumanah | d33tah: How many proposals are you attempting to write? |
| 23:21.45 | d33tah | 20 at most :D |
| 23:21.47 | sumanah | I personally would recommend: 2 at most |
| 23:21.55 | d33tah | probably not more than five |
| 23:22.03 | scorche|sh | d33tah: i believe there is a maximum of 5 now |
| 23:22.22 | sumanah | you will get more water if you dig 1 100-foot well than if you dig 5 20-foot wells. |
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| 23:22.51 | sumanah | An organization is more likely to accept you if you demonstrate a genuine interest in that project, write a few patches, and show it wasn't a rush job |
| 23:23.00 | scorche|sh | sumanah: that depends entirely on where you dig ;) |
| 23:23.08 | d33tah | 6. Can a student submit more than one application? |
| 23:23.10 | d33tah | Yes, each student may submit up to twenty applications. However, only one application will be accepted. We've heard from our mentoring organizations that quality is better than quantity. |
| 23:23.22 | sumanah | scorche|sh: are you willing to agree with me in general, though? |
| 23:23.25 | d33tah | its from the current faq. where can i see it's 5 max, scorche|sh? |
| 23:23.39 | sumanah | scorche|sh: and analogically? |
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| 23:24.42 | d33tah | sumanah: the well analogy kind of depends on how uneven the ground is |
| 23:24.57 | sumanah | ok, yes, yes, y'all can nitpick that bit if you want |
| 23:24.58 | scorche|sh | d33tah: oh, that - nevermind =) |
| 23:25.26 | sumanah | do you hear what I'm saying about the quality of your engagement, d33tah? |
| 23:25.47 | d33tah | yeah, i do |
| 23:26.29 | d33tah | its just that i pretty much started doing my work yesterday and i only have like two-three days to prepare something to show off with |
| 23:27.20 | d33tah | and there's my thinking that if someone else applies for the same task i might not get it while applying for some rarer project would make my odds bigger |
| 23:28.10 | gevaerts | d33tah: http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2013/help_page#6._Can_a_student_submit_more_than_one |
| 23:28.14 | josko | I feel the same way. |
| 23:28.22 | josko | :) |
| 23:28.25 | gevaerts | I don't know what current faq you're looking at :) |
| 23:28.30 | sumanah | d33tah: have you tried asking the mentors whether there are any projects for which there haven't been any applicants yet? |
| 23:28.48 | d33tah | not yet, but point taken. |
| 23:29.05 | sumanah | d33tah: you may as well go on actual data |
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| 23:31.15 | tomprince | Also, most orgs are going to have more projects than mentors available, or slots. So picking a project nobody has applied for won't necesarily help you. |
| 23:32.29 | gevaerts | Very trye |
| 23:32.31 | gevaerts | *true |
| 23:32.48 | sumanah | yep |
| 23:33.16 | sumanah | josko: d33tah - I have been an org admin and a mentor. I'm happy to look over a proposal and give feedback |
| 23:34.12 | josko | Why thank you, but I've only begun to write it. Hopefully done by tomorrow tho :) |
| 23:34.28 | sumanah | ok |
| 23:34.32 | sumanah | !studentguide |
| 23:34.33 | gsocbot | sumanah: "studentguide" is http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ |
| 23:34.36 | sumanah | ^ that is pretty helpful |
| 23:34.41 | josko | I wish d33tah luck if that will cheer him up. |
| 23:34.55 | tomprince | And, personally, I'd be less inclined to pick somebody who applied to a particular project because they thought nobody else would have applied. |
| 23:35.25 | sumanah | tomprince: yeah, on balance, yes. Although if this person was picking between 2 things they were genuinely interested in, I wouldn't feel as adverse |
| 23:35.59 | tomprince | Sure. |
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