00:03.27 | stqism | This place gets really off topic sometimes |
00:03.34 | rlyshw | lol sry bout that |
00:04.56 | downey | brews some tea |
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00:06.18 | downey | stqism: tea is always on topic, right? |
00:06.42 | stqism | always |
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00:07.37 | umccullough | is always off topic |
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00:14.26 | madrazr | !anyone | olly |
00:14.27 | gsocbot | olly: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization directly. You can find an org's contact information via the org list at http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/org/list/public/google/gsoc2014 |
00:14.37 | madrazr | olly: sorry, I wanted to experiment that :) |
00:15.08 | olly | s'ok, i'm an idiot |
00:15.24 | madrazr | olly: no no, I really got curious about what it did |
00:15.31 | madrazr | olly: but did not know whom to redirect to |
00:15.46 | madrazr | olly: who else to redirect to |
00:15.58 | olly | sure, np |
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05:31.34 | ravi | Hey there !! I am Ravi, A GSoc 2014 student aspirant |
05:32.31 | stqism | I see, anything we can help you with? |
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05:34.40 | ravi | Actually I am in a process of finding Ovirt IRC |
05:34.48 | ravi | can u hel me? |
05:34.51 | ravi | help* |
05:35.56 | Niharika | ravi: http://www.ovirt.org/Communication |
05:36.27 | ravi | Thank you Niharika |
05:37.01 | Niharika | It was a five-second google search. |
05:37.03 | umccullough | looks like they're not on freenode |
05:37.41 | olly | not all orgs use IRC |
05:38.02 | olly | but if you look at their homepage in melange, you'll see they're on oftc: http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/org2/google/gsoc2014/ovirt |
05:38.03 | umccullough | they use irc.oftc.net |
05:38.06 | thiago | and even those that do, some use different networks |
05:38.32 | olly | we might all have to the way freenode seems to be holding up |
05:38.38 | olly | +given |
05:38.40 | umccullough | ;) |
05:38.44 | umccullough | silly freenode |
05:39.03 | olly | i was in an exclusive version for an hour or so earlier |
05:39.04 | ravi | true : umccullough |
05:39.16 | olly | less than 100 people in here on that one |
05:39.46 | umccullough | is it wrong to have 8 wifi routers currently in use at my house? |
05:40.04 | umccullough | just installed dd-wrt on another wrt54g |
05:40.51 | olly | just a few more and you can have one on every channel |
05:41.03 | olly | how big is your house though? |
05:41.06 | umccullough | well, channels have overlapping frequencies |
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05:41.16 | umccullough | my house is about 4000 sq ft actually, two stories |
05:41.26 | umccullough | but i'm repeating the signal down to my other house now |
05:41.26 | olly | umccullough: yeah, i know |
05:41.44 | umccullough | i also avoid channel 6 since several neighbors use it :/ |
05:42.08 | umccullough | 6 acres to cover :) |
05:42.27 | olly | now you're just showing off |
05:42.31 | umccullough | heh |
05:42.38 | umccullough | i just put this router out in the bathroom next to the pond |
05:43.04 | umccullough | then i'm gonna put one in the pump house down the hill |
05:43.11 | umccullough | and hopefully that's enough to get me to the other house |
05:43.46 | umccullough | i really don't feel likey paying for a 3rd DSL line |
05:44.40 | umccullough | i think i'm gonna put all my build servers and stuff down there |
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05:46.18 | umccullough | and my wife wants me to setup some nightvision security cameras at the barn on the other corner of the property |
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05:46.40 | umccullough | might be time to build some wok antennas |
05:49.38 | prasoon2211_ | <PROTECTED> |
05:51.20 | stqism | umccullough: You use powerline adapters, right? |
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06:16.44 | umccullough | stqism, nope |
06:17.26 | umccullough | both houses are on different meters |
06:17.56 | umccullough | so, i couldn't really utilize powerline adapters to transmit the signal down there anyway |
06:18.44 | stqism | umccullough: Damn, in my home powerline is beautiful |
06:18.48 | umccullough | if i was feeling up to it, i guess i could bury some cat5 |
06:19.29 | umccullough | once i get the house wired up, i can eliminate most of my wifi routers in the house |
06:19.39 | umccullough | i have a 1000' box of cat6 ready to use |
06:19.44 | umccullough | just too lazy to pull the wire :/ |
06:19.44 | stqism | It wouldn't be a bad idea |
06:20.14 | umccullough | my previous house was completely wired, i ran conduit in all the walls and pulls cat5e into the attic and a central wire closet |
06:21.01 | umccullough | of course, that's easy to do when you're ripping walls apart and doing new sheetrock :) |
06:21.56 | stqism | I rent, so that's out of the question for me :P being in my early 20's, powerline adapters + wifi routers with ddwrt formed in to an oslr mesh is a lot nicer than finding a bank who'll give me a mortgage :) |
06:22.07 | umccullough | yeah |
06:22.35 | umccullough | what powerline adapters do you use? |
06:22.40 | umccullough | i've been meaning to try some |
06:23.28 | stqism | I'd have to check the brand, but I got them off ebay for real cheap. Rated to 500 mbps |
06:24.04 | umccullough | it would be good temporary solution and elminate some of the wifi routers in client mode |
06:24.54 | stqism | I recommend using them as much as possible, the drop in bandwidth with a mess of routers sucks |
06:25.08 | umccullough | indeed |
06:25.19 | umccullough | i have a closet picked out on the lower floor already |
06:25.33 | umccullough | but getting motivated to pull wire is hard |
06:25.43 | stqism | Floors? closets? Where do YOU live? Gosh |
06:26.05 | umccullough | as i mentioned before, it's a 2 story ~4000 sq ft house |
06:26.12 | stqism | I have the luxury of closets and 1400 square feet, for too much. |
06:26.35 | umccullough | it's on a slope |
06:26.47 | umccullough | lower floor goes under the garage, and that's where the kids bedrooms are ;) |
06:26.54 | stqism | Makes more sense |
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06:28.54 | umccullough | i live in a rural area of northern california... |
06:29.36 | stqism | Makes even more sense. I live in an overpriced area of socal |
06:29.42 | umccullough | right |
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06:30.31 | umccullough | morning PulkoMandy |
06:30.41 | PulkoMandy | hello world! |
06:30.53 | stqism | PulkoMandy: But...you didn't even compile. |
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06:36.52 | PulkoMandy | stqism: ... I'm interpreted? |
06:37.01 | stqism | Huh |
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11:15.06 | vishu | hello sir! |
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11:24.13 | tachyons | vishu, hello |
11:24.52 | vishu | Sir is mailing list closed by now ? |
11:24.55 | vishu | because |
11:25.06 | vishu | i am not able to recieve any reply |
11:25.36 | vishu | I wanted to propose a new idea |
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11:26.26 | vishu | Which may not be related to any of your projects but last year it was accepted but I was new so was not able to finish it . |
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11:27.58 | tachyons | vishu , which org? |
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11:29.03 | vishu | Sir it was Sugar labs |
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11:29.53 | vishu | but this time I have something new and as I am 4th year student so now i have sufficient time to give to my project and would defiantly complete it .. |
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11:34.04 | tachyons | https://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel |
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11:39.12 | vishu | No sir i dont need the link I wanted to propose a new idea |
11:39.20 | vishu | I wanted to work with you |
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11:40.10 | tachyons | vishu, this is general gsoc channel |
11:40.23 | tachyons | not specific to sugarlabs |
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11:40.38 | tachyons | so it is difficult to find your mentor here |
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11:40.57 | tachyons | So always use mailing list for proposing new idea |
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11:43.16 | vishu | I know Sir but actually i was not being replied over their so opted for IRC instead |
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11:47.28 | olly | vishu: there probably aren't any mentors from sugarlabs here |
11:47.44 | olly | if they don't have their own irc channel, you'll have to email them |
11:47.59 | vishu | No Sir i dont wanted to work with suger labs now |
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11:48.11 | vishu | i thought you might listen to my idea once |
11:48.51 | olly | generally having an idea and trying to find an org to mentor it doesn't work |
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11:49.39 | olly | student supplied ideas can make good projects, but they're almost always ideas the students have *when they look at a particular org's existing code* |
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11:50.43 | tachyons | http://chat.sugarlabs.org:9090/ |
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11:51.01 | tachyons | #sugar |
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12:08.27 | Dragooon | Hello, I'm a first year university student interested in participating in GSoC, I had a question |
12:08.32 | sumanah | Hi Dragooon |
12:08.34 | sumanah | go ahead and ask! |
12:08.35 | sumanah | welcome |
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12:08.43 | Dragooon | Since Student registration starts from March 10th, I take that means this is the period we submit our proposals? |
12:09.08 | LordAro | indeed |
12:09.17 | sumanah | Dragooon: officially to Melange, yes |
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12:09.35 | sumanah | Dragooon: getting feedback from the mentors and other developers in the project early will help you a lot |
12:09.50 | Dragooon | I totally forgot March 10th and had April 10th in my mind, it suddenly hit me it's March |
12:10.01 | sumanah | that sort of thing happens to me too sometimes :) |
12:10.16 | rigelk | what's the purpose of #melange ? |
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12:10.28 | sumanah | rigelk: for people to get help with Melange specifically |
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12:10.53 | Dragooon | As in melange the OS software Google wrote for their own stuff |
12:11.01 | sumanah | Dragooon: you put your proposal up on a wiki page or send it to the mailing list for your project and get feedback |
12:11.02 | Dragooon | It's available for free for anyone else to use if someone wants to conduct something similar |
12:11.04 | sumanah | make it better |
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12:11.46 | Dragooon | Joomla! is something I'd be probably the strongest at |
12:12.03 | Dragooon | Oh yeah, another question, how does the 5 proposal limit work? |
12:12.22 | sumanah | Dragooon: btw have you already read the manual/guide? |
12:12.36 | Dragooon | Can it be any combination of total 5 proposals? Or do they have to be limited to one org |
12:12.43 | Dragooon | I read the GSoC FAQ |
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12:13.05 | sumanah | Dragooon: http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ is super helpful |
12:13.17 | sumanah | http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ch008_writing-a-proposal/ for instance |
12:13.27 | sumanah | Dragooon: you do NOT have to limit yourself to one org |
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12:16.16 | rigelk | btw, the aim of GSoC is to discover opensource communities as well. Dragooon, you should check others orgs, just to have a better understanding of it all. like #mdo :] |
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12:17.04 | Dragooon | rigelk: Joomla! is something I have never actually worked with, I've used it but on the surface. But it's something I'd like to get into since it has a wide application |
12:17.24 | Dragooon | So I thought it'd be a good opportunity to start with, I'll have three more proposals so I'll check out MDO as well. Thanks! |
12:18.19 | rigelk | Dragooon: #mdo is just for fun, be warned. troll ahead :p |
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12:18.47 | sumanah | Dragooon: I really want to remind you that fewer high-quality applications are better than more low-quality ones |
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12:19.16 | sumanah | and that mentors and org admins also make decisions partially based on whether they have seen that student show any lasting interest in the org |
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12:19.35 | rigelk | sumanah, he might do more high-quality applications as well ! |
12:19.45 | Dragooon | sumanah: Yeah I understand that, I don't have any prior coding experience with Joomla! though. So I'm not sure how that'll factor in |
12:19.55 | sumanah | btw Dragooon what pronoun do you prefer? |
12:20.08 | Dragooon | sumanah: he works well |
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12:20.11 | sumanah | thx |
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12:20.54 | sumanah | Dragooon: at least with Wikimedia, where I work, we really like it if the applicant tries to fix some small bugs during the application process |
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12:21.09 | Dragooon | Wait, Wikimedia is also participating? |
12:21.12 | Dragooon | Oh yay |
12:21.23 | rigelk | sumanah: are there lots of first year of universiy, inexperimented coder like Dragooon and me, to participate to GSoC ? |
12:21.28 | Dragooon | Are you a mentor? |
12:21.51 | Dragooon | I am not an unexperienced coder btw, I am just a first year |
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12:22.05 | sumanah | yeah, I'm a mentor & org admin |
12:22.19 | Palash | Guys tell me if it's difficult to get selected in an org which has been selected for first time. |
12:22.33 | bePolite | Dragooon: that doesn't mean you're not unexperienced |
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12:22.55 | Dragooon | bePolite: No, but I'm not unexperienced. |
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12:23.12 | rigelk | Dragooon: sry, i didn't mean to say that :/ |
12:23.13 | bePolite | I didn't mean you are |
12:23.25 | gevaerts | Palash: there are too many factors involved to answer that :) |
12:23.42 | Dragooon | As in I do have a lot of coding experience, so I want to jump in GSoC since I finally have the chance |
12:24.06 | sumanah | rigelk: yes, there are lots of first-year university students who participate in GSoC |
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12:24.24 | sumanah | https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Summer_of_Code_2014 is Wikimedia's page |
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12:24.55 | Dragooon | sumanah: What are the chances for someone not experienced in MediaWiki itself to be considered for a slot? |
12:25.02 | LordAro | Dragooon: "a lot" |
12:25.07 | gevaerts | Palash: if it's a popular organisation, and your proposal is fairly good but not exceptional, you're probably not going to get selected. If your proposal is very good, and the organisation is not extremely popular, you'll get selected |
12:25.10 | PulkoMandy | that's the goal of GSoC |
12:25.11 | sumanah | Dragooon: I can't give you an exact number. Your chances improve as you show up |
12:25.18 | PulkoMandy | get more people working on open source project |
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12:25.33 | sumanah | Dragooon: Read the page https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Summer_of_Code_2014 , read the manual - those will give you a lot of info |
12:25.35 | Dragooon | Okay, cool. Thanks |
12:25.51 | PulkoMandy | at least here at Haiku we will try to pick students that are new to the project |
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12:25.55 | Dragooon | Yeah I'm reading, a lot of reading |
12:26.05 | PulkoMandy | for example, we won't pick the same student two years in a row |
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12:27.25 | sumanah | Dragooon: I wrote something about 'the rhythm of help' http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana/2014/02/26/0 that you might find helpful as well |
12:27.46 | Dragooon | Currently I'm browsing all the ideas pages |
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12:27.54 | sumanah | cool |
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12:28.12 | bePolite | cool man |
12:28.31 | Dragooon | And looking into stuff that I find interested (as in cool ideas which I'd use) |
12:28.39 | bePolite | Just that most cool projects have some competition |
12:28.43 | Dragooon | So I'll start bugging the mentors in a day or so about them before applying |
12:29.00 | sumanah | Dragooon: :) showing up and being in contact on the mailing list, etc is good |
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12:29.07 | sumanah | (the project's mailing list) |
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12:29.47 | Dragooon | So how do I show up? Hi, I'm a GSoC student and x, y, z ideas interest me? |
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12:30.03 | novochen | yes, Dragooon |
12:30.39 | novochen | i did that, though no reply till now |
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12:31.45 | sumanah | I think asking specific questions in your introduction is good |
12:32.12 | sumanah | not just "how do I get started" but "I thought about doing it this way; would that have too many performance liabilities?" etc |
12:32.14 | Dragooon | What happens if I apply to multiple orgs and get multiple acceptance? (Not to sound too arrogant or something) |
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12:32.42 | novochen | the orgs will figure it out, I assume |
12:32.53 | sumanah | Dragooon: the organizations have a deduplication meeting |
12:32.57 | PulkoMandy | Dragooon: the orgs decide who keeps you |
12:33.09 | PulkoMandy | they will probably ask you for your choice, but they aren't forced to do so |
12:33.19 | sumanah | "First round of de-duplication checks happens; organizations work together to try to resolve as many duplicates as possible." 15 April |
12:33.27 | PulkoMandy | (let's say if one of the orgs has many good students, and the other doesn't) |
12:33.27 | gevaerts | Well |
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12:33.39 | sumanah | Dragooon: the polite thing to do is to mention to the mentors that you have submitted multiple proposals |
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12:33.57 | gevaerts | They *may* ask for your preference. I'm not convinced that happens often enough to make it probable |
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12:34.58 | Dragooon | So...mentors sit in a round table and auction away the students? :P |
12:35.04 | novochen | sh!t, melange seems to be blocked by GFW |
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12:35.37 | gevaerts | Dragooon: for the last few unresolved cases, more or less :) |
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12:35.57 | sumanah | Dragooon: it's an IRC room and "auction" implies that someone gets a reward for saying "you take this one" |
12:35.59 | gevaerts | Most duplicates are resolved in private conversation between orgs (and maybe students) though |
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12:54.40 | Dragooon | Oh god #mdo is a total troll thing |
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12:55.33 | PulkoMandy | we are most desirable! |
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12:56.28 | Dragooon | Certainly |
12:56.39 | Dragooon | Proposal #1: Make a new site |
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12:56.43 | Dragooon | Proposal #2: Burn the previous site |
12:57.13 | astrofrog | I wonder if anyone will submit a proposal next year for GSoC for the "Most Desirable Organization" |
12:57.22 | astrofrog | as an org application |
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12:57.50 | Dragooon | You mean no one has so far? Most shameful |
12:57.59 | astrofrog | good question actually |
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12:59.43 | bePolite | I plan to submit |
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13:00.22 | PulkoMandy | astrofrog: http://mostdesirable.org - we are working on it! |
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13:01.14 | astrofrog | fantastic! |
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13:01.32 | astrofrog | I'm a little worried other orgs will see a drop in student applications though |
13:01.37 | astrofrog | if MDO gets accepted |
13:02.46 | astrofrog | I guess competition is good |
13:04.10 | gevaerts | thinks that the acceptance of MDO is not really something other organisations need to worry about |
13:04.20 | astrofrog | ;) |
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13:05.16 | rigelk | Dragooon: mdo was created 2 days ago, so having no student so far is quite normal ; however, we got proposals already ^^' |
13:05.19 | bePolite | lol I think time has passed for the acceptance |
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13:06.19 | gevaerts | bePolite: it hasn't. MDO was granted a highly exceptional extension |
13:06.45 | PulkoMandy | because it is most desirable |
13:07.28 | sumanah | For all the newbies in the channel who don't understand: a student contacted MANY orgs this year and told each of them that they were the "Most Desirable Organisation". We are now making fun of this circumstance by pretending that there really is one. |
13:09.19 | rigelk | seriously, MDO could become a good information center for newbies, beside its natural world-class troll status. |
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13:20.29 | downey | rigelk: most desirable help? |
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13:25.20 | rigelk | exactly. downey , mdo is an umbrella for everything. mdo has 42 projects. mdo has tea. end of story :] |
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13:26.55 | novochen | 42 mentors, 42 ideas, 42 students |
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13:38.08 | chocko | sometimes projects have a futile origin, but they eventually can be transformed to be the greater good by the amout of people it attracts |
13:38.22 | chocko | like the web framework flask |
13:39.18 | kblin | ? |
13:39.26 | kblin | futile origin? |
13:39.36 | chocko | so it would not be a so bad idea to make MDO something really useful, like a set of advices for applying to gsoc |
13:40.38 | chocko | futile like useless or also like it is a joke |
13:41.57 | chocko | i agree with the statement of rigelk : "seriously, MDO could become a good information center for newbies, beside its natural world-class troll status." |
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13:42.42 | kblin | the reference to flask threw me off, as that's actually a decent web framework.. or rather a nice finish over werkzeug |
13:43.53 | chocko | yes it really good |
13:44.17 | sumanah | I've used Flask and it seemed fine :) |
13:44.17 | chocko | at the begiining it was just a joke |
13:44.45 | chocko | and finally the dev started reaaly to build it |
13:45.16 | kblin | but the main part of the business logic still is in werkzeug, which already existed at the time |
13:45.27 | chocko | mayle i did not used good words to explain my thouhts, my bad, sorry |
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13:45.55 | kblin | anyway, I understood what you meant, now :) |
13:47.13 | PulkoMandy | you guys can join the MDO and make it even more most desirable :) |
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13:47.37 | kblin | I'm happy to help with admining MDO for gsoc 2015, as I'm sure the mentors are all great as well |
13:49.12 | chocko | btw, why the bitcoin adress ? |
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13:51.02 | PulkoMandy | I guess we have at least the domain name to pay for? |
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13:51.07 | PulkoMandy | I don't know who gets the money |
13:51.34 | kblin | it's a wiki, right? you should be able to see who added it :) |
13:52.11 | PulkoMandy | not the home page, I think |
13:53.06 | kblin | ah, right |
13:53.24 | kblin | I haven't used google code since forever :) |
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13:54.42 | PulkoMandy | well, yes... most of their updates *remove* features... :( |
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14:01.22 | downey | The BTC donations allow most desirable resources |
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14:02.23 | downey | Need to ask carols for advice on most desirable t-shirts |
14:03.11 | kblin | MDO will stock women's cuts, though, and as opposed to other t-shirt providers, MDO's will be the correct size |
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14:04.01 | jbisch | Is the BTC address the official most desirable address? |
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14:05.13 | downey | Isn't dogecoin more desirable these days? |
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14:18.18 | jbisch | Yes, dogecoin cannot go anywhere but the moon. We will all be rich. |
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14:21.02 | sumanah | Dr3amc0d3r|away: hi! |
14:21.16 | sumanah | oh sorry, I thought you were someone else I knew. |
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14:21.47 | shivammax | hello! |
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14:24.09 | sumanah | hi shivammax |
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14:54.48 | lordkryss | !logs |
14:54.48 | gsocbot | lordkryss: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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15:22.31 | rihbyne | PulkoMandy: what is MDO ? |
15:22.51 | downey | rihbyne: Visit #mdo for details |
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15:29.16 | JordiGH | How many Indians did we get last year? |
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15:32.04 | shivammax | I suppose there were a lot. |
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15:32.29 | shivammax | At least around 20+ were from IIIT-Hyderabad! |
15:33.32 | rihbyne | lots of IITians and they are experienced and eating newbie slots :P |
15:34.04 | rihbyne | JordiGH: ^ |
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15:34.34 | JordiGH | So, what's a reasonable yearly salary for a programmer in India? |
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15:34.43 | darnir | You get lots of IITians, IIITians and BITSians |
15:34.43 | JordiGH | Two GSoCs? Three? |
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15:34.57 | JordiGH | Eight GSoCs? |
15:35.15 | darnir | JordiGH: Eight is about right |
15:35.40 | JordiGH | I've heard stories of so many people making so much less money than that. |
15:36.07 | darnir | Well, you have lower paying jobs too. |
15:36.13 | PulkoMandy | I do :/ |
15:36.26 | PulkoMandy | but, I work for an open source project - so it's ok |
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15:36.46 | JordiGH | Hm, two GSoC is what this says: http://www.staff.com/blog/web-developer-salaries-infographic/ |
15:36.47 | darnir | Eight is around what one of the students from those institutes might bag. |
15:37.12 | JordiGH | So one GSoC is already 6 months pay. |
15:37.57 | rihbyne | seriously IITians grap slots quickly |
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15:38.17 | darnir | Last year I made more through one GSoC than most of my friends made through 6 month internships. |
15:38.36 | darnir | And more than a couple made lesser through their jobs for the whole year |
15:39.24 | JordiGH | Right, so GSoC is a lot of money in India. I wonder if this alone explains why we get so many Indians. |
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15:40.00 | stqism | JordiGH: You might be on to something obvious |
15:40.35 | JordiGH | stqism: Yeah, I know it's kind of obvious, was just wondering exactly how alluring the money is. |
15:40.44 | JordiGH | 6 months salary? Wow. |
15:40.44 | rihbyne | JordiGH: what have you decided then. |
15:40.51 | rihbyne | :D |
15:40.59 | JordiGH | rihbyne: Decided? Nothing. |
15:41.00 | stqism | JordiGH: 6 months worth would be a damn lot |
15:41.07 | downey | JordiGH: GSoC is a lot of money most places. |
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15:41.31 | darnir | Well, the difference is in the fact that the dollar is overpriced in a lot of places. |
15:41.39 | JordiGH | downey: Yeah, but it's about the same as a summer undergraduate research grant in the US or Canada. |
15:41.51 | JordiGH | downey: As an undergrad, I made about the same amount for a summer of marking papers. |
15:41.55 | downey | JordiGH: Most of the world doesn't live in the US or Canada. :) |
15:42.21 | darnir | JordiGH: Cost of living matters. |
15:42.36 | Palash | Actually GSoC for me isn't about the money, but the experience of coding and learning ! |
15:42.50 | TCD | money's nice though |
15:42.58 | JordiGH | Money's a good antidepressant. |
15:42.59 | stqism | Palash: That's what they all say ;) |
15:43.00 | shivammax | Yeah, specially because we're on the Open Source ride, why even talk money |
15:43.01 | Palash | Most Indians don't consider getting any money for internships at all. |
15:43.04 | darnir | I know first hand as an Indian who is currently staying in EU. We pay less than half the price for most of the commodities. |
15:43.18 | JordiGH | shivammax: "Open source" doesn't mean "gratis". |
15:43.42 | JordiGH | shivammax: There are many examples of successful commercial free software. |
15:43.51 | PulkoMandy | darnir: beware about EU, I think you can double the prices of everything by moving from Slovakia to Norway :) |
15:43.53 | Palash | stqism : No, it;s actually true. Since india itself doesnt have a great big coder base |
15:43.59 | rihbyne | java is hybrid one |
15:44.00 | shivammax | JordiGH: I meant the comparison. Yeah I would definitely need some money to keep my life going |
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15:44.19 | darnir | stqism: If it was about the money, I'd have come back as a student, not forgone $5500 to be a mentor |
15:44.34 | stqism | darnir: :P |
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15:45.19 | stqism | shivammax: That's always a funny thought, off what I have saved up I could live in Vietnam comfortably for a while, due to the tiny cost of living |
15:45.24 | darnir | And as just mentioned, that is *a lot* of money when looking at the living expenses in India |
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15:46.12 | darnir | PulkoMandy: True. But I'm already halfway there in Germany. It can't get too much worse now. |
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15:55.44 | carols | serves some coffee and tea |
15:55.57 | downey | TeaGIF |
15:56.18 | carols | hi downey |
15:56.30 | downey | carols: Hi, Carol! Happy Friday. |
15:56.45 | carols | happy friday to you as well :-) |
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16:07.41 | narendraj9__ | Since the whole idea behind gsoc is to help people get started in open source, I think it would be better if people aren't allowed to participate in consecutive years. This would ensure that new people enter the open source community. |
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16:08.38 | gevaerts | narendraj9__: is that the whole idea behind it though? |
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16:09.19 | narendraj9__ | gevaerts, that's what I think it is. Correct me if I am wrong. :-) |
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16:10.15 | gevaerts | narendraj9__: I'd say http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2014/help_page#3._What_are_the_goals_of_this_program is the best answer |
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16:12.11 | gevaerts | Organisations can (and several do) decide that *their* primary goal is to get new people, but gsoc as a whole doesn't really have a single specific goal like that |
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16:13.48 | carols | narendraj9__: it's certainly one of the ideas behind gsoc. |
16:13.57 | carols | but i would certainly not call it the "whole" idea |
16:14.10 | Ivanovic | narendraj9__: for us at wesnoth there are basically 2 ideas: |
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16:14.14 | Ivanovic | 1) get new people in |
16:14.21 | Ivanovic | 2) kickstart some areas which really need love |
16:14.40 | Ivanovic | and yeah, not always both are fullfilled |
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16:15.44 | narendraj9__ | okay. Sometimes to get things done, better and experienced people are needed. I got the idea. |
16:15.51 | Ivanovic | and if the folks have any expience in open source: we don't care! |
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16:16.11 | Ivanovic | so if folks have experience with other projects: fine by us |
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16:16.39 | Ivanovic | if they don't: does not matter |
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16:16.57 | Ivanovic | what matters is that they are able to work together with us, so fit into our community |
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16:19.16 | stqism | Ivanovic: Fitting in is very big with us |
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16:23.29 | chick | ping #ublab |
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16:24.14 | Ivanovic | stqism: i hope that is the case for every org |
16:24.16 | Ivanovic | ;) |
16:24.38 | stqism | :P |
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17:05.49 | 1JTAALGBF | !numapps |
17:05.50 | gsocbot | 1JTAALGBF: "numapps" is In 2014, 190 of 371 mentoring orgs were accepted. 2013: 117/417 orgs; 4144 students submitted 5999 proposals, of which 1192 were accepted. 2012: 180/406 orgs; 1212/6685 proposals (by 4258 students). 2011: 175/417 orgs; 1116/5474 proposals (by 3731 students). 2010: 151/367 orgs; 1026/5539 proposals (by 3464 students) |
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17:10.20 | cardinot | #iprj |
17:11.28 | umccullough | 117 of 417 in 2013? |
17:11.30 | umccullough | that sounds wrong... |
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17:12.20 | umccullough | should be 177 |
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17:14.05 | Mathnerd314 | is the list of people who have signed up as mentors available somewhere? I'm trying to narrow down my list of projects and some of them basically require a specific person to be the mentor |
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17:27.55 | umccullough | Mathnerd314, not sure i follow |
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17:36.23 | Mathnerd314 | well, I want to know if e.g. "Has Simon Peyton Jones signed up as a mentor for Haskell yet?" |
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17:36.50 | ishan1604 | IRC channel of Haskell awaits you |
17:37.07 | Mathnerd314 | he's not on there... :-) |
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17:38.02 | umccullough | you'll have to ask each org |
17:38.34 | umccullough | once a mentor creates a profile and requests connection to an org, the admin is responsible for assigning them. I'm not aware of any way to search this on melange, but you can certainly ask in #melange |
17:39.02 | Mathnerd314 | hmm, ok then. |
17:39.12 | umccullough | also, i would assume each org has indicated somewhere on their ideas pages which mentors *intend* to participate this year |
17:39.21 | ishan1604 | Yes right |
17:39.28 | Mathnerd314 | not Haskell... :p |
17:39.35 | umccullough | shame on them ;) |
17:40.04 | Mathnerd314 | well, I did ask them, they said they basically pick which proposals they like and then coerce various people into being mentors |
17:40.18 | umccullough | ugh |
17:40.44 | umccullough | seems like a poor practice IMO |
17:41.55 | Mathnerd314 | how would you recommend doing it? |
17:41.57 | umccullough | in any case, it's entirely possible that melange has a way to discover the mentors, but i don't know how |
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17:42.15 | umccullough | most orgs are encouraged to provide a list of mentors that have committed for the year |
17:42.26 | umccullough | it's recommended anyway |
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17:42.53 | edsiper | umccullough, your goal at this point is not your mentor, is your organization, if you ask something about X project, you will get a reply |
17:43.15 | umccullough | huh? |
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17:50.01 | terri | Mathnerd314: Why not ask Simon Peyton Jones directly, if he's the one mentor you care about right now? |
17:50.31 | Mathnerd314 | he's not, actually, I have like 20 mentors for 20 different project ideas |
17:50.52 | Mathnerd314 | I could theoretically ask them all, but it feels like spamming |
17:51.47 | terri | In that case, I'd suggest you should probably use the public mailing lists to discuss your ideas, and see which mentors get interested. :) |
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17:52.06 | umccullough | indeed, list them all off and see who bites |
17:52.13 | umccullough | you can only submit 5 proposals |
17:53.35 | Mathnerd314 | hmm, ok then. mailing list it is. |
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17:55.59 | Mathnerd314 | I think SPJ does read the mailing lists occasionally, actually... |
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18:06.26 | rigelk | Mathnerd314: the only spam is when you apply for Most Desirable Org ^^ |
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18:16.47 | Mathnerd314 | rigelk: you mean someone writing "Most Desirable Org" into the application? |
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18:19.37 | rigelk | yes ^^ some student has sent such a mail to many mentors recently ;) |
18:19.53 | umccullough | http://pastebin.com/fi4eNBf3 |
18:20.20 | terri | it's resulted in this: mostdesirable.org |
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18:23.04 | Mathnerd314 | hmm, were they accepted this year? |
18:23.17 | umccullough | mostdesirable.org? we're working on it |
18:23.46 | blast007 | Mathnerd314: it's an inside joke :P |
18:24.13 | umccullough | next year for sure! |
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18:24.41 | Mathnerd314 | I dunno, just thinking about that logo to svg converter |
18:24.57 | umccullough | heh |
18:24.58 | terri | Mathnerd314: the entire org is a joke. :) |
18:25.04 | umccullough | i actually found two projects that sorta already do it |
18:25.07 | rigelk | oh, interested Mathnerd314 ? :) |
18:25.20 | umccullough | TurtleArt has a save to SVG feature |
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18:26.07 | umccullough | anyone is free to work on MDO tasks even outside of GSoC |
18:26.15 | umccullough | we'll give you commit access to the git repo |
18:26.46 | Mathnerd314 | hmm, not much point if it's already implemented |
18:27.07 | umccullough | yeah, i searched around after the idea was added to the list :/ |
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18:28.01 | Mathnerd314 | and all the others are super hard |
18:28.14 | umccullough | we're open to proposals |
18:28.35 | Mathnerd314 | eh, I think I'll stick to Haskell |
18:28.48 | umccullough | :) |
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18:30.18 | terri | that reminds me, I need to add my other project idea to mostdesirable.org |
18:30.37 | terri | I suppose my android build is going to tak ea while anyhow... |
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18:34.28 | warthog9 | offers carols some tea |
18:34.34 | carols | thank warthog9 |
18:34.36 | carols | :-) |
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18:37.13 | CFS-MP3 | carols will you be around for some time? I had to ask you something and I don't remember what it was, but it will come to me :-) |
18:37.31 | carols | CFS-MP3: i'm here now. i make no guarantees as to later. |
18:37.33 | carols | but anyway |
18:37.37 | carols | why not just email? |
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18:38.56 | CFS-MP3 | I save email for the most formal stuff :-) |
18:39.00 | chro | am I allowed to apply for 2 projects? |
18:39.11 | chro | so that I can have a fallback plan |
18:39.17 | chro | in case I am not accepted in 1 of them |
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18:39.50 | CFS-MP3 | chro, up to 5 I think |
18:40.20 | chro | and I need to state that in my proposals? that I am applying for several ones |
18:40.38 | umccullough | up to 5 proposals, for one or more projects |
18:40.45 | CFS-MP3 | don't know about other projects but so far I haven't received any proposal formally but I can already tell many things about the students who have contacted me |
18:40.53 | darnir | chro: Always a good idea not to give your mentors a surprise |
18:41.00 | rigelk | chro: no need to mention ; b imho |
18:41.19 | CFS-MP3 | so I'm saying that if you've already discussed things with orgs most likely you can figure out the chances of being accepted or not |
18:41.26 | rigelk | but yeah, surprises don't mix well with orgs |
18:41.43 | chro | yhe thing is that not all projects for a given org are accepted |
18:42.02 | chro | last year I applied for one and discussed things with my mentor, but the project was left out of GSoC |
18:42.18 | chro | cause apache have a fixed amount of slots |
18:42.25 | darnir | The point will most probably come up in deduplication talks. If the org already knows about your other applications, they can ask you for your choice. Else, it'll all be to your disadvantage |
18:43.13 | terri | You don't *need* to tell the orgs, but yeah, you'll need to be prepared to choose very quickly if you come up in deduplication |
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18:43.41 | chro | someone will ask me to choose? |
18:43.58 | rigelk | someone may. or not. |
18:44.12 | rigelk | may not* |
18:44.14 | terri | chro: Depends. sometimes one org needs you way more than the other and they'll get you regardless. But sometimes both have equal needs and they'll ask you your preference. |
18:44.21 | terri | Be prepared to answer |
18:44.39 | terri | the last thing we want to hear at that point is "can you give me a few days?" because we generally have only hours to work it out. |
18:44.42 | chro | ok, that's no problem at all |
18:45.48 | CFS-MP3 | do students know if they're been accepted to more than one and that there's a deduplication process affecting them, or they just get a notification of the final outcome? |
18:46.49 | darnir | CFS-MP3: It depends. Sometimes you get a choice, other times you done |
18:46.51 | chro | I think you cannot be accepted for more than one |
18:46.53 | darnir | dont* |
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18:49.14 | CFS-MP3 | darnir but even when you don't get a choice you at least get some notification that more than one project had accepted you? (even if then you don't get to choose unless the projects are nice enough to ask) |
18:49.19 | gevaerts | No |
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18:50.09 | gevaerts | The bit where orgs can ask you is actually bending the rules already |
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18:51.54 | warthog9 | gevaerts: orgs should ask that up front, if a student has applied elsewhere, and where on their preference list their org is |
18:52.07 | gevaerts | nods |
18:52.24 | gevaerts | When I was involved with selecting students, we did exactly that |
18:52.26 | warthog9 | we usually ask it during the interview |
18:53.00 | terri | We don't always ask, but many students tell us up-front |
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18:55.20 | rigelk | warthog9: there is an interview ? |
18:55.40 | warthog9 | rigelk: some orgs may request/require an interview |
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18:56.14 | gevaerts | Using various media, from irc to phone |
18:56.15 | warthog9 | rigelk: we do a 1hr irc chat, go over the app, ask a bunch of questions and throw a coding exercise at the students |
18:56.45 | warthog9 | we've always found it to be exceedingly useful |
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19:01.24 | rigelk | it sure is. what org do you represent, warthog9 ? |
19:01.35 | warthog9 | I'm with SyncDiff(erent) this year |
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19:02.15 | warthog9 | I've been part of git, ran kernel.org for a number of years, etherboot, python and probably a couple more I've forgotten in the 7years I've been doing GSoC |
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19:03.45 | chro | warthog9, have you ever did internship at google? |
19:03.56 | yuriy-k | Hello! Is Carol Smith online? |
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19:04.41 | gevaerts | carols: visitors for you :) |
19:04.45 | carols | hi |
19:04.51 | carols | how can i help? |
19:04.53 | warthog9 | chro: no, I'm a little old to do an internship |
19:05.10 | chro | how old are you? |
19:05.19 | yuriy-k | Hi! Yes please - I would like to clarify - |
19:05.19 | carols | chro: want to take this to a PM, please? |
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19:05.23 | yuriy-k | I am a student of Cousera - may I participate GSoC? |
19:05.36 | carols | yuriy-k: i don't know. is that an accredited university? |
19:05.57 | chro | it's not a university |
19:06.04 | chro | it's an online learning platform |
19:06.22 | yuriy-k | carols: seems like - no. (Cousrera - https://www.coursera.org/ ) |
19:06.29 | carols | yuriy-k: then no, that doesn't count |
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19:08.46 | yuriy-k | Ok. Thanks. At least I tried (( |
19:08.54 | carols | ok |
19:08.55 | carols | cheers |
19:09.30 | yuriy-k | One more question : |
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19:09.53 | carols | yes?? |
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19:10.38 | yuriy-k | Is there any MOOS that allows students to participate GSoC? |
19:11.10 | carols | it's not a question of MOOCS allowing students to participate. it's a question of students meeting GSoC's eligibility criteria. |
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19:11.18 | warthog9 | chro: I'm in my mid 30s |
19:11.35 | carols | warthog9: want to take this to a PM, please? |
19:12.23 | chro | carols, btw, can you confirm that I can make up to 5 proposals, and that in case I get accepted for more than one, someone will ask me to choose one? |
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19:12.36 | carols | chro: no, they don't have to ask you. |
19:12.42 | carols | so don't apply for an org you don't want to work for |
19:13.40 | umccullough | put another way: the orgs may discuss the overlapping proposals amongst themselves without your input |
19:13.42 | yuriy-k | Ok, so - Is there any MOOS that satisfy GSoC's eligibility criteria? |
19:13.56 | carols | yuriy-k: are there any MOOCS that are accredited universities? |
19:14.19 | chro | I was thinking of applying for more than 1 project in the same org. Because I know that not all projects are selected for GSoC due to available slots each org has |
19:15.20 | umccullough | chro, go for it? :) |
19:15.28 | yuriy-k | carols, Yes - May be you have such information (from already appoved students)? |
19:15.37 | carols | yuriy-k: i don't, sorry |
19:15.58 | chro | umccullough, but maybe if I specify my preferences in each proposal it would be easier for an org to decide |
19:16.07 | umccullough | sure |
19:16.11 | chro | ok |
19:16.12 | chro | thanks |
19:16.14 | scorche|sh | chro: communication with the org is a good thing ;) |
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19:16.37 | chro | right |
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19:17.15 | CFS-MP3 | carols are there stats about the ratio failed/total students for past years? (or failed/total projects) |
19:17.24 | carols | CFS-MP3: sure, on our wiki |
19:17.34 | yuriy-k | caols: ok, thanks. |
19:17.40 | carols | yw |
19:17.51 | downey | *sigh* everyone in my office went out for tea and left me here to work :( |
19:18.03 | carols | downey: your life: so hard. |
19:18.14 | downey | carols: my day was most desirable up until then |
19:18.17 | gevaerts | downey: have some tea here! |
19:18.25 | downey | gevaerts: thanks! i think i will |
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19:18.36 | brlcad | I wish my coworkers would leave me alone more ;) |
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19:19.01 | chro | carols, is it true that you have a playground at Google Mountain View? |
19:19.12 | carols | chro: i don't know, i don't work in mountain view. |
19:19.23 | chro | oh ok |
19:19.36 | downey | chro: closest thing i've seen there is a sand volleyball court. you can see it on google maps. |
19:19.50 | umccullough | "playground" can mean a lot of things :D |
19:19.50 | chro | ok |
19:20.23 | chro | actually they have one at google zurich with a slide |
19:20.32 | downey | carols: Do you know if any OSPO'ers are going to LibrePlanet this year? |
19:20.39 | brlcad | chro: http://searchengineland.com/figz/wp-content/seloads/2013/03/google-playground-SXSW-1362946830.jpg |
19:20.41 | carols | downey: not that i'm aware of.. |
19:21.22 | downey | carols: Ah ok. Still nice of y'all to sponsor it. :) |
19:21.30 | carols | downey: happy to :-) |
19:21.55 | Ivanovic | brlcad: but this playground is not in mountainview... |
19:22.02 | CFS-MP3 | carols will you be at I/O? |
19:22.18 | carols | CFS-MP3: i don't think so. could change, but i don't currently have tickets |
19:22.43 | CFS-MP3 | really? I guess that puts my chances of getting one into perspective |
19:22.45 | gevaerts | carols: will you be somewhere? :) |
19:22.55 | carols | gevaerts: i am currently right here :-) |
19:23.15 | gevaerts | Oh, good! :) |
19:23.20 | carols | CFS-MP3: they don't want too many googlers at i/o. it is, after all, for the developers, not the employees. |
19:23.44 | chro | carols, could you tell me in which office you are located? |
19:23.55 | scorche|sh | carols: you are definitely not "right here" |
19:24.01 | carols | chro: sure, san francisco. |
19:24.05 | chro | thanks |
19:24.09 | brlcad | Ivanovic: i know :) |
19:24.37 | carols | yw |
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19:25.08 | brlcad | the flemings across the street is a nice touch :) |
19:25.12 | CFS-MP3 | carols OK... hopefully there's some kind of process that gives a tad of priority to non-employees part of GSOC or something :-) |
19:25.24 | carols | CFS-MP3: i honestly know nothing about it whatsoever :-) |
19:25.27 | downey | I heard a rumor there will be tours of carols desk during the student/mentor summit in October |
19:25.28 | carols | it's quite nice actually |
19:25.32 | carols | one less thing to worry about |
19:25.49 | downey | chro: ^ |
19:25.49 | carols | downey: you're funny. |
19:25.57 | downey | really hoping to get a picture of the stapler. |
19:25.59 | CFS-MP3 | :-D |
19:26.01 | stqism | downey: I'm assuming empty tea mugs, all over the place. |
19:26.03 | downey | and the tea cozy |
19:26.19 | chro | downey, no, actually I just want to send a letter to carols' boss |
19:26.22 | downey | stqism: i'd assumed they'd be full |
19:26.37 | CFS-MP3 | should we bring a proper European cup for carols? |
19:26.39 | stqism | downey: Depends if carols has a tea kettle on her desk as well |
19:27.20 | carols | you all assume i am so much messier and have so much more on my desk than i actually do... |
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19:28.24 | chro | actually a recommendation letter, about the very good job she has been carrying out with GSoC |
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19:28.50 | carols | chro: sure, you're welcome to email her. |
19:28.54 | chro | and maybe I will also send her some typical cakes from my town |
19:29.02 | chro | I mean, for you :) |
19:29.04 | carols | please don't send us perishables. |
19:29.17 | brlcad | itsatrap! |
19:29.19 | carols | we don't want them nor will we eat them nor will they most likely make it through customes |
19:29.21 | carols | *customs |
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19:30.10 | chro | oh ok |
19:30.30 | carols | but thank you for thinking of us |
19:31.07 | chro | yw :) |
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19:31.42 | CFS-MP3 | carols most European geeks are experts of getting things through customs |
19:31.47 | CFS-MP3 | both in and out the US |
19:31.59 | carols | CFS-MP3: i'm glad to hear it. still, please don't send us perishables. |
19:32.02 | downey | the cake is a lie |
19:32.58 | chro | is it? |
19:33.10 | chro | I was just thinking of doing something nice |
19:33.33 | chro | ok, let's end this conversation here. |
19:34.04 | gjca | Hello. Anyone from Freifunk around? |
19:34.18 | carols | gjca: the best place to ask that would be to the freifunk community |
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19:44.23 | eLobato | hey could anyone give feedback on why our organization was not selected? |
19:46.11 | downey | eLobato: Did someone from your org attend the IRC meeting for orgs that weren't selected? Perhaps that person would have some details. |
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19:46.31 | eLobato | downey: I tried but got in too late.. |
19:46.47 | carols | eLobato: i'd recommend you just email me |
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19:55.53 | JordiGH | Oh, that meeting already happened? |
19:55.54 | JordiGH | Crap. |
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19:58.51 | umccullough | a week ago? |
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20:00.52 | CFS-MP3 | JordiGH what meeting? |
20:01.03 | JordiGH | The rejected org meeting. |
20:01.06 | CFS-MP3 | Ah yes |
20:01.07 | CFS-MP3 | it did |
20:01.11 | JordiGH | Never mind, I just found out why we got rejected. |
20:01.23 | CFS-MP3 | what was your project? |
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20:03.01 | JordiGH | Mercurial. |
20:04.37 | terri | JordiGH: Mercurial is going to work under the Python umbrella this year, no? |
20:04.44 | JordiGH | terri: Yeah. |
20:04.57 | JordiGH | But I'm not very hopeful, so far only one student has expressed interest. |
20:05.17 | terri | JordiGH: still time to advertise! |
20:06.05 | JordiGH | I think the hg devs are kinda sleepy about advertising this year. |
20:07.45 | TCD | i was maybe interested but i just havent expressed it :p |
20:08.00 | TCD | finds it hard to type and eat pizza |
20:08.07 | JordiGH | TCD: Do you like hg? |
20:08.22 | TCD | JordiGH: It was a project that struck me as interesting |
20:08.31 | JordiGH | Ah, why? |
20:08.43 | JordiGH | It's a very hackable and lively DVCS. |
20:08.47 | JordiGH | We're the Canada of git. |
20:09.00 | TCD | I'm trying to think of a good answer to that, heh. |
20:09.34 | JordiGH | You know about Canada theory, right? http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/005497.html |
20:09.57 | TCD | that's neat. |
20:10.25 | terri | JordiGH: you should at least put a post up on the soc2014-general list talking about the Mercurial projects. Python tends to attract a lot of students who are interested in python but not sure which project, and I think many of them subscribe to the list hoping osmething will jump out at them. :) |
20:10.38 | TCD | I can't really think of a reason why; I'm just someone who has gut feelings but can't really justify or explain them :p |
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20:10.45 | TCD | past 'it sounds interesting' |
20:11.08 | JordiGH | TCD: Here's me doing some huckstering: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cov1FsopLSU |
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20:13.03 | joshuatj | Hi, I would like to clarify what I've read on Student Allocations http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2014/studentallocations |
20:13.15 | carols | joshuatj: sure, how can i help? |
20:13.20 | joshuatj | The second paragraph reads "Please note that if your organization has never participated in GSoC before it is unlikely you will receive more than 1-2 slots this year" |
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20:13.25 | carols | indeed |
20:13.29 | carols | that is in fact the case |
20:13.34 | joshuatj | does that mean 1-2 slots per project or 1-2slots per mentoring org? |
20:13.40 | carols | 1-2 slots per org |
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20:13.50 | carols | 1-2 total students |
20:14.06 | joshuatj | hmmm... that means a new GSoC can only take 1-2 total students. Wow... that's quite competitive. |
20:14.13 | carols | i agree |
20:14.16 | carols | and it's for your own safety |
20:14.21 | carols | like a seatbelt, really |
20:14.57 | joshuatj | carols: I guess right now I just have to trust those that went before me that it is necessary :) Thanks carols for the clarification |
20:15.10 | carols | yw |
20:15.17 | carols | i'll tell you a quick story |
20:15.26 | carols | two years ago we had a new org ask for 7 slots |
20:15.30 | carols | we gave them 2 |
20:15.38 | carols | at the mentor summit that year the org admin came up to me and said: |
20:15.50 | carols | "i just want to shake your hand and thank you for not giving me all the slots i asked for." |
20:16.04 | carols | so there you go. |
20:16.25 | rigelk | carols: did he explain why ? |
20:16.37 | blast007 | it's more work that people think |
20:16.39 | blast007 | than* |
20:16.41 | carols | rigelk: yeah, because he didn't actually understand what he was asking for |
20:17.16 | joshuatj | carols: I see.. haha ok. |
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20:17.38 | carols | most orgs don't actually understand how much work gsoc is |
20:18.18 | TCD | JordiGH: Thanks! |
20:18.18 | carols | it's not just "oh, free developers for three months" |
20:18.55 | JordiGH | Yeah, it's a lot of work to attract the students. |
20:19.16 | carols | and a lot of work to mentor them and evaluate them and keep them on track and help them |
20:19.19 | carols | and and and |
20:19.23 | TCD | I've seen some orgs flooded with students, or so it seems |
20:19.42 | rigelk | ok :) TCD : like MDO ? ^^' |
20:20.06 | TCD | Oh yeah, MDO is going to be impossible to get into..it's so fierce competition over there |
20:20.44 | downey | is there an LDO? |
20:20.53 | one_more_minute | rigelk: MDO? |
20:21.12 | TCD | #mdo |
20:21.15 | downey | joshuatj: It's definitely about quality over quantity. |
20:22.30 | JordiGH | The actual code that students have written for us has never been all that interesting. It's been more interesting to work with them after GSoC. How common is this experience? |
20:22.31 | joshuatj | downey: ya, it does make sense to me now. Looks like it's time to up the game :p |
20:22.59 | downey | joshuatj: I encouraged some of our mentors to sit out this year who felt more obligated to be a mentor and were not doing it because they loved doing so |
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20:30.51 | joshuatj | downey: wow ok. Thanks for the glimpse of how it's like to be a mentor. |
20:35.16 | umccullough | JordiGH, the ones that stick around can be very interesting, indeed |
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20:35.55 | downey | JordiGH: Fairly common over here |
20:36.26 | downey | JordiGH: but then again, my first attempts at things are usually not very good compared with as i get more experience. so, i guess it's not too surprising. |
20:36.55 | umccullough | we had a student port nfs4 to Haiku, and then after gsoc, he built in ASLR and wrote a new process scheduler |
20:39.04 | TCD | why must all these projects seem so neat.. |
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20:41.52 | downey | TCD: Which are you finding most desirable? |
20:42.13 | umccullough | one that isn't in the org list, i suspect |
20:43.22 | TCD | downey: I figured I should apply to 2 orgs in the case that one gets a huge amount of (good) proposals or something similar |
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20:44.03 | JordiGH | So you think you have two mediocre proposals? |
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20:44.12 | JordiGH | You only need one good one. |
20:44.42 | JordiGH | But more than a brilliant idea in a proposal, what most orgs want to see is early involvement and an indication that you'll work hard and stick around and enjoy working with them. |
20:45.11 | TCD | Nono; I'm just planning that what if my proposal is for the same/similar thing as someone else with a better proposal. |
20:46.11 | JordiGH | Theoretically it doesn't matter if you propose the same idea as someone else, and if both are good, there may be a chance that both can work on the same thing. |
20:46.23 | TCD | hm. |
20:46.25 | JordiGH | Individual orgs may decide that they don't want duplicate projects, though. |
20:46.26 | terri | TCD: the other way to mitigate risk of similar proposals is to submit your proposal early and talk to the mentors. |
20:46.49 | terri | sometimes it's possible to split up a project if there are multiple good students, and sometimes mentors are able to help redirect students to spread out projects. |
20:46.59 | TCD | true. |
20:47.09 | terri | but it's much easier to do that if you submit early and talk to them lots. |
20:47.38 | brlcad | indeed |
20:48.24 | olly | if there are two proposals for the same idea and one's been talking to us for weeks and the other appears much later, the former almost inevitably looks more appealing |
20:49.03 | downey | http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2014/help_page#11._What_happens_if_two_students_are |
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20:56.12 | olly | downey: I know we're allowed to accept two student working independently on the same thing, but it's always seemed a bad idea to me |
20:56.24 | carols | olly: some orgs really want to |
20:56.30 | carols | "may the best coder win" sort of thing |
20:56.33 | downey | olly: to me too :) |
20:56.33 | carols | some orgs don't |
20:56.36 | carols | either's fine |
20:56.44 | olly | carols: i don't have a problem with that, but I'd rather not try it myself |
20:56.56 | carols | olly: fair enough :-) |
20:56.57 | downey | olly: i suppose there is some scenario where some A/B testing could be useful |
20:56.58 | TCD | doesn't sound like the best use of resources :P |
20:57.34 | olly | like nasa getting 3 versions of some control software written by students for gsoc? |
20:57.49 | gevaerts | will work hard to be gnome (or similar) org admin, and then he'll have dozens of students doing the same thing! |
20:57.50 | carols | TCD: i've certainly heard from orgs where a really needed feature had two great proposals and they said, "great, you can both try and we'll implement the best one" |
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20:58.46 | olly | gevaerts: RAGS - Redundant Array of GSoC Students |
20:58.53 | gevaerts | :) |
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20:59.25 | olly | step 1: RAGS, 2: riches! |
20:59.27 | gevaerts | Nothing like making people redundant in the proper sense of the word :) |
20:59.56 | terri | olly: sounds like something for MDO |
21:00.06 | TCD | carols: I'd hate to be the one who gets told 'sorry we won't use your work' :p |
21:00.11 | olly | would be interested to here how it's worked out for orgs which have tried it |
21:00.16 | olly | *hear |
21:00.18 | carols | TCD: you'd still get paid, why do you care? :-) |
21:00.23 | TCD | true. |
21:00.32 | olly | likes to think students do care |
21:00.38 | olly | and it isn't just for the money |
21:00.50 | carols | olly: well, i think most students do come to gsoc just for the money. |
21:00.51 | carols | granted |
21:00.56 | gevaerts | carols: maybe TCD is one of those students who isn't in it *just* for the money :) |
21:00.58 | carols | lots *stay* because they realize it's great |
21:01.07 | TCD | If I'm honest does it affect my chances? :P |
21:01.16 | gevaerts | TCD: no |
21:01.29 | gevaerts | tries to trick TCD into being honest :) |
21:01.39 | TCD | I wouldn't have come if it wasn't for the money, but I would consider myself to be in it for more than the money :P |
21:01.53 | paultag | Students do care. |
21:01.58 | paultag | well, the ones that do well. |
21:02.01 | paultag | cough cough. |
21:03.54 | rigelk | paultag: are we all that bad ? :p |
21:06.12 | paultag | rigelk: I love all the GSoC students |
21:06.18 | paultag | so much amazing work and so many great ideas |
21:06.40 | paultag | it's just the small amount that don't do things until just before it's due :) |
21:07.54 | rigelk | oh. just those ones :) |
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21:09.18 | paultag | Lucky for my sanity, this has been a very small amount of students selected to participate :) |
21:09.35 | paultag | most are wonderful hackers |
21:09.46 | stqism | I like my students, it's just those special few who fail to read anything and try to email a proposal that unnerve me :) |
21:10.06 | paultag | no one reads anything anymore :) |
21:10.12 | paultag | canned responses are the best |
21:10.13 | paultag | cough |
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21:10.43 | terri | What responses have people been sending to http://pastebin.com/fi4eNBf3 |
21:11.04 | brlcad | finds "tell me what to do" students frustrating to interact with, educate |
21:11.22 | terri | brlcad: I made a flowchart for those. it's helped quite a bit. |
21:11.38 | gevaerts | brlcad: so tell me what to do about those :) |
21:11.40 | stqism | brlcad: I had one who attempted to tell me something about my own project that was incorrect |
21:12.12 | stqism | terri: That's the real good one :P |
21:12.28 | brlcad | gevaerts: it involves a blender and a cooler |
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21:13.00 | brlcad | margaritas! <ba-dum*tish*> |
21:13.19 | gevaerts | :) |
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21:17.25 | CFS-MP3 | terri we got the exact same text (in a connection request no less) |
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21:19.03 | olly | terri: link them to http://mostdesirable.org/ |
21:19.11 | olly | CFS-MP3: all orgs have, it appears |
21:19.17 | terri | CFS-MP3: yeah, there's a huge number of orgs that have gotten that. So many that they formed http://mostdesirable.org/ ;) |
21:19.27 | stqism | We ALL did :) |
21:19.53 | terri | if someone actually writes the "choose a project spinner" for MDO, we'll all have the easiest way ever to deal with "tell me what to do" queries. ;) |
21:21.24 | carols | serves some more tea and coffee |
21:21.42 | gevaerts | gets a cup of most desirable tea |
21:21.59 | terri | Actually, if someone writes that, I will find some really random swag to send them as a prize. |
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21:22.40 | stqism | terri: I'll throw in an oh so rare Tox sticker |
21:23.39 | terri | they can have my unopened dow chemical lip balm, a bunch of stickers, and a random selection of t-shirts to be determined based on their t-shirt size. |
21:23.51 | CFS-MP3 | out of curiosity, do you guys have preferred countries to pick your students? |
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21:24.01 | TCD | aw, does it have to be JS? |
21:24.20 | meflin | I only takes students who live in a country on this planet |
21:24.28 | terri | I probably have some weirder swag around. would have to look. |
21:24.31 | stqism | CFS-MP3: With us, we would generally like you to not be in some strange timezone where we'd never be able to communicate. |
21:24.31 | gevaerts | CFS-MP3: I suspect most people don't, and those that do won't admit it :) |
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21:25.03 | CFS-MP3 | gevaerts I can relate to that :-) |
21:25.10 | stqism | CFS-MP3: As a general rule of thumb, our students must be alive to be considered :) |
21:25.29 | TCD | You guys are disgusting with the level of discrimination I'm seeing. |
21:25.39 | olly | gevaerts: we'll take students for *ALL* parts of India |
21:25.41 | gevaerts | There are barriers that are correlated with countries though. You have to be able to find a language you can use to talk to the student, and sometimes that's not easy |
21:26.01 | TCD | I think you should open your student applications to dead aliens. |
21:26.16 | terri | put it on the MDO list. clearly the MDO would take dead aliens. |
21:26.17 | stqism | gevaerts: And in all honesty, not being able to communicate with students isn't a good thing. |
21:26.18 | olly | google isn't allowed to do business with dead aliens |
21:26.22 | olly | our hands are tied |
21:26.31 | gevaerts | TCD: we do, but unfortunately nearly no dead aliens attend accredited universitues |
21:26.42 | CFS-MP3 | olly not even if they are enrolled in an acceptable university? |
21:26.44 | stqism | Are you sure? |
21:27.03 | stqism | I'm sure I could enroll an alien in a community college |
21:27.09 | terri | clearly the outreach initiatives to dead aliens need to be stepped up. |
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21:27.49 | stqism | I don't think Google prohibits students from other planets in the FAQ |
21:28.19 | CFS-MP3 | doesn't say anything about dogs in obedience schools either |
21:28.20 | scorche|sh | stqism: as long as the colleges are accredited! |
21:28.53 | stqism | scorche|sh: As CFS-MP3 mentioned, what if my dog attended an accredited obedience school? |
21:28.57 | terri | CFS-MP3: but yeah, we care about communicating. So timezone doens't matter as long as you're willing to be awake when your mentor is awake, or communicate asynchronously by email. |
21:29.16 | gevaerts | stqism: does it follow post-secondary courses? |
21:29.18 | TCD | stqism: Does your dog have experience in programming languages? |
21:29.23 | gevaerts | Hmmm |
21:29.45 | terri | is your dog trying to further its skill in Computer Science? |
21:29.50 | stqism | Maybe, and only if licking a keyboard counts. |
21:29.51 | gevaerts | "Post-secondary courses" means the courses that come after the starters and the main courses, so they're desserts, I think |
21:30.11 | scorche|sh | stqism: i dont think those get any of these: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_education_accreditation |
21:30.16 | stqism | Yeah, I think my dog likes deserts. Shame he can't eat em |
21:30.29 | gevaerts | stqism: he can't handle sand? |
21:30.50 | stqism | gevaerts: Something about chocolate and throwing up |
21:31.04 | gevaerts | stqism: not much chocolate in most deserts! |
21:31.15 | stqism | scorche|sh: Can I enroll him in a local community college? |
21:31.37 | scorche|sh | i am the wrong person to ask! |
21:31.39 | stqism | gevaerts: We eat very different kinds of deserts |
21:32.01 | stqism | scorche|sh: Lets assume he got in. Can he apply? |
21:32.16 | scorche|sh | stqism: i am not one to eat many types of desert |
21:32.21 | scorche|sh | though, i live in one |
21:32.23 | stqism | Lets also assume he's the greatest K9 coder of his generation |
21:34.02 | gevaerts | stqism: I never ate any desert! |
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21:34.43 | stqism | You folks should eat more deserts, it's like dessert without the calories |
21:34.57 | gevaerts | Ah, finally :) |
21:34.59 | scorche|sh | actually, there are times when haboobs come in and you cant really avoid eating desert - but then again, i tend not to enjoy it |
21:35.14 | stqism | :P I was dumb of a momend |
21:35.18 | gevaerts | scorche|sh: surely never a whole one? :) |
21:35.19 | stqism | moment, rather |
21:35.27 | terri | yeah, windy season in albuquerque and we all eat desert like it or not. |
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22:03.47 | funcode | what if our college schedule does not meet up with the GSOC schedule? Is their any flexibility? |
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22:04.16 | umccullough | how far off? |
22:04.19 | brlcad | funcode: only what you discuss with the mentoring org .. the dates of the program are fixed |
22:04.45 | umccullough | sometimes a student will be doing finals for a week or two after gsoc starts, and it's usually not a big deal as long as they let the org know |
22:05.05 | shinji_ | do mentors need to be associated with organisation for which one is applying for?? |
22:05.25 | umccullough | shinji_, are you a mentor? |
22:05.35 | shinji_ | no i'm a student |
22:05.42 | olly | the org will have mentors |
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22:06.09 | olly | you don't bring your own mentor, unless you're applying to the "ospo org", which is a special case |
22:06.21 | umccullough | right, the org supplies the mentors |
22:06.29 | DaSpirit | What's the ospo org? |
22:06.37 | umccullough | google's internal org |
22:06.44 | umccullough | open source programs office |
22:06.54 | umccullough | or whatever |
22:06.58 | olly | it's in the FAQ |
22:06.59 | DaSpirit | I never knew that existed. |
22:07.02 | DaSpirit | I'm going to look it up. |
22:07.12 | olly | they only take a few students each year |
22:07.27 | olly | it's generally research projects, with the uni supervisor as mentor |
22:07.33 | olly | at least AIUI |
22:07.35 | DaSpirit | Oh. |
22:07.52 | olly | so it's a harder route, not an easy one as some students seem to think |
22:08.08 | olly | i bet they get some "interesting" proposals |
22:08.40 | scorche|sh | there is an entry in the FAQ about it ;) |
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22:59.43 | wiruzx | Hi everyone |
22:59.54 | mataLebam | hello wiruzx |
23:00.38 | Guest86911 | Hello |
23:01.39 | wiruzx | I would like to ask: what if I would be accepted in some project, and I'll do all tasks before the summer? |
23:02.22 | wiruzx | or maybe not all, but some of them |
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23:06.27 | terri | wiruzx: if you finish early, you generally work with your mentor to find new stuff to do. |
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