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| 00:20.19 | *** topic/#gsoc is Google Summer of Code 2018 | Start of coding May 14th | https://g.co/gsoc |
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| 03:06.10 | r0bby | rolls an eye to gevaerts |
| 03:06.11 | r0bby | :D |
| 03:27.19 | r0bby | Wait, people sleep? |
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| 05:37.31 | *** mode/#gsoc [-r] by meflin |
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| 06:54.32 | furiousDingo7 | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 06:54.32 | furiousDingo7 | This blog is essentially an ad for the Handshake ICO scam with a one-line "denial" of involvement mixed in there. It's obviously very unethical of Christel to not mention her own involvement in the scam which the blog post promotes. |
| 06:54.49 | *** mode/#gsoc [+r] by meflin |
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| 13:31.22 | Freso | Fellow ops, should we set `/mode #gsoc -r+zq $~a` (and `/op Sigyn`)? This would allow spammers to still join and post, but only ops (ie., us) would see it, and Sigyn could still k-line them. Any legitimate users could also still post their questions and we'd be able to see it. |
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| 14:03.07 | achillion | oh cool |
| 14:06.31 | jn__ | Freso: sounds pretty good to me (speaking as a non-op, notably) |
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| 15:18.05 | Freso | jn__: Well, me too obviously, but not doing anything without a ð from other mods here. :) |
| 15:18.22 | Freso | But I feel `+r` is too restrictive for the target group. |
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| 15:53.32 | kappa1 | Anyone can point me to a good report from last years? |
| 15:53.50 | *** join/#gsoc gruetzkopf (gruetzkopf@bnc.dont-follow.us) |
| 15:53.51 | kappa1 | final report with the description of the word done, etc |
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| 16:07.02 | m16 | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 16:07.02 | m16 | This blog is essentially an ad for the Handshake ICO scam with a one-line "denial" of involvement mixed in there. It's obviously very unethical of Christel to not mention her own involvement in the scam which the blog post promotes. |
| 16:07.02 | m16 | Consider Andrew Lee's involvement, Andrew Lee is Christel's boss at London Trust Media and he also controls the majority of freenode voting rights. Andrew Lee also heads the handshake ICO scam. Coincidence? |
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| 16:59.18 | enchi | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
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| 17:23.40 | prklm10 | can anyone help me prepare for gsoc 2019 any help would be great |
| 17:24.11 | jn__ | prklm10: first step: the student guide |
| 17:24.14 | jn__ | !studentguide |
| 17:24.24 | jn__ | oh, no, the bot is asleep |
| 17:24.32 | blast007 | http://google.github.io/gsocguides/student/ |
| 17:24.52 | achillion | jn__: well, I would say the first step is sticking around for the answer :P |
| 17:25.05 | jn__ | oh |
| 17:25.06 | jn__ | good point |
| 17:25.07 | blast007 | oh, yeah, missed that :) |
| 17:25.17 | jn__ | maybe that's the zeroth step, though |
| 17:25.24 | achillion | heh |
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| 18:58.54 | czart_ | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
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| 19:29.55 | nandub | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 19:29.55 | nandub | This blog is essentially an ad for the Handshake ICO scam with a one-line "denial" of involvement mixed in there. It's obviously very unethical of Christel to not mention her own involvement in the scam which the blog post promotes. |
| 19:29.55 | nandub | Consider Andrew Lee's involvement, Andrew Lee is Christel's boss at London Trust Media and he also controls the majority of freenode voting rights. Andrew Lee also heads the handshake ICO scam. Coincidence? |
| 19:29.55 | nandub | Oh, and about those donations she speaks of: https://twitter.com/ISCdotORG/status/1025461692132519936 |
| 19:30.21 | meflin | 1 hour 27 min |
| 19:42.08 | *** join/#gsoc rwg27 (~rwg@81-210-85-118.static.ip.netia.com.pl) |
| 19:42.12 | rwg27 | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 19:42.35 | meflin | 11 min |
| 19:47.07 | *** join/#gsoc noonehere4u (~noonehere@124-9-163-116.dynamic.tfn.net.tw) |
| 19:47.07 | noonehere4u | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 19:47.29 | achillion | meflin: spam intervals? |
| 19:47.42 | meflin | 5 min |
| 19:47.44 | meflin | yes |
| 19:48.12 | *** mode/#gsoc [+zq $~a] by meflin |
| 19:48.24 | meflin | achillion: can you still see me |
| 19:48.28 | achillion | yup |
| 19:48.59 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o downey] by meflin |
| 19:49.04 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o edunham] by meflin |
| 19:49.16 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o gevaerts] by meflin |
| 19:49.34 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o matthewwilkes] by meflin |
| 19:49.49 | achillion | and you get an op, and you get an op... |
| 19:49.58 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o PulkoMandy] by meflin |
| 19:50.13 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o terri] by meflin |
| 19:50.28 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o warthog9] by meflin |
| 19:51.16 | meflin | take no offence these choices are based on long memorys |
| 19:52.15 | achillion | me? nah |
| 19:52.55 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o Sigyn] by meflin |
| 19:53.04 | achillion | So, "+zq $~a". This makes non-registered users' messages visible only to ops? |
| 19:53.09 | meflin | yes |
| 19:53.11 | achillion | neat |
| 19:53.40 | meflin | I might burn in hell ... but the other 2 options have been proven to ... be horiable |
| 19:54.19 | achillion | This does seem like a great option for this channel (assuming you have at least one active operator at any given time) |
| 19:54.31 | meflin | that is an issue yes |
| 19:55.02 | achillion | for many channels, plain old +r works, but certainly not here |
| 19:55.56 | meflin | that issue is also why I made some more ops ;) |
| 19:56.04 | achillion | yeah, I figured |
| 19:58.07 | achillion | meflin: thanks, btw :) |
| 19:58.12 | achillion | for the spam reduction efforts! |
| 19:59.17 | meflin | 3rd fail is the charm ;P |
| 20:02.00 | achillion | well, after that, we just shut it all down and go home |
| 20:02.36 | meflin | I'm to stubborn to go home ;) |
| 20:03.24 | achillion | well then |
| 20:03.27 | achillion | in that case |
| 20:03.29 | achillion | sticks around for the show |
| 20:03.42 | achillion | lemme know if you need me |
| 20:05.53 | achillion | or if there's tea |
| 20:06.04 | achillion | I would also like to be notified of tea |
| 20:06.07 | meflin | there is always tea |
| 20:06.26 | meflin | herbal, chai, black , green |
| 20:06.46 | meflin | passes achillion some whild grown asamm |
| 20:06.54 | achillion | I mean, why else stick around? |
| 20:07.16 | achillion | gonna have to grab something herbal though; too late for black |
| 20:07.39 | meflin | robidos with orange honey and hibiscous ? |
| 20:07.55 | achillion | sure |
| 20:08.00 | meflin | pours |
| 20:08.27 | achillion | ty ^_^ |
| 20:08.51 | downey | !tea |
| 20:08.55 | downey | oh yeah, no bot :) |
| 20:09.28 | meflin | as that this is _your_ fault I server you a cup of teppid water :P |
| 20:10.44 | achillion | sips on his proper tea and glares at downey |
| 20:11.09 | gevaerts | Any guidelines on what we do? +v and tell them to ask again? |
| 20:11.25 | meflin | gevaerts: I hadn't thought that far |
| 20:11.32 | gevaerts | Or try to help, which would make the channel look a bit one-sided |
| 20:11.35 | downey | gevaerts: i believe that's correct |
| 20:11.46 | downey | let me test. stand by :) |
| 20:12.10 | *** join/#gsoc newb1e (c0843d23@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.132.61.35) |
| 20:12.13 | meflin | +v would worrk for humans |
| 20:12.29 | meflin | and bots may *censored 75 lines* |
| 20:12.32 | *** mode/#gsoc [+v newb1e] by gevaerts |
| 20:12.40 | newb1e | hello world :) |
| 20:12.45 | meflin | newb1e: you can stop being identifed to acutaly test |
| 20:12.52 | newb1e | i'm not identified |
| 20:12.54 | meflin | or it worked |
| 20:13.04 | gevaerts | Yet we know who you are! |
| 20:13.07 | meflin | heh my bad I mixed up idents |
| 20:13.10 | downey | achillion: did you see newb1e say "hello im a newbie how do i gsoc?"? |
| 20:13.16 | meflin | death to newb1e |
| 20:13.37 | gevaerts | is happy that no actual newbie joined right then :) |
| 20:13.39 | downey | or any other non-op ^^ |
| 20:13.52 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o downey] by meflin |
| 20:13.58 | downey | hey now |
| 20:13.59 | meflin | simple enough to test |
| 20:14.01 | downey | :-P |
| 20:14.06 | newb1e | but i am voiced |
| 20:14.24 | *** mode/#gsoc [-v newb1e] by meflin |
| 20:14.29 | meflin | says who? |
| 20:14.37 | meflin | I see you do you see you |
| 20:14.52 | *** kick/#gsoc [newb1e!~meflin@c-24-8-154-206.hsd1.co.comcast.net] by meflin (Do not disturb the Tea!) |
| 20:15.01 | meflin | dam trolls ;) |
| 20:15.01 | downey | ok, seems to work |
| 20:15.07 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o downey] by meflin |
| 20:15.26 | meflin | so +v is required for actual ppl |
| 20:15.28 | downey | i'm not sure how we know someone is new and can't be seen by others, though. |
| 20:15.38 | meflin | but ops have no way to tell |
| 20:15.41 | downey | do we need to +v everyone, to tell the difference? |
| 20:15.44 | olly | the unvoiced user doesn't seem to stand out to me |
| 20:15.48 | downey | olly: right. |
| 20:15.55 | achillion | downey: nope |
| 20:16.06 | achillion | downey: first thing was "hello world" |
| 20:16.07 | downey | achillion: cool, thanks for verifying :) |
| 20:16.20 | meflin | this solution sucks |
| 20:16.22 | olly | i think this approach is going to see a lot more students unreplied to |
| 20:16.35 | olly | I can see it might work for other channels |
| 20:16.46 | downey | it is not most desirable |
| 20:16.56 | downey | but then again, nothing about the situation is desirable |
| 20:17.01 | meflin | downey: remember our founder :P |
| 20:17.18 | olly | maybe if a bot auto-voiced people from the freenode web ui |
| 20:17.23 | olly | at least until that's abused |
| 20:17.26 | achillion | I would have suggested adding info in the topic for users to ask for +v, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't help |
| 20:18.08 | achillion | Have a bot PM unregistered users who join with instructions? |
| 20:18.09 | downey | all of the spammers are coming from unpatched zombie routers, from what i've heard |
| 20:18.11 | *** mode/#gsoc [-zq $~a] by meflin |
| 20:18.18 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o downey] by meflin |
| 20:18.30 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o edunham] by meflin |
| 20:18.42 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o matthewwilkes] by meflin |
| 20:18.43 | achillion | meflin is taking over! |
| 20:18.51 | achillion | do something! |
| 20:18.52 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o PulkoMandy] by meflin |
| 20:19.03 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o Sigyn] by meflin |
| 20:19.11 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o terri] by meflin |
| 20:19.19 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o warthog9] by meflin |
| 20:19.22 | downey | mutiny :) |
| 20:19.30 | olly | um, i think some of those are usually ops |
| 20:19.36 | gevaerts | Should I act while I still can? :) |
| 20:19.47 | meflin | olly: I dont think so |
| 20:19.58 | downey | ChanServ should own all of that IMHO |
| 20:19.59 | achillion | gevaerts: the revolution is counting on you |
| 20:20.22 | meflin | gevaerts: since I fogot you you should kickabn :P |
| 20:20.33 | olly | i guess if you got it wrong they can moan |
| 20:20.36 | gevaerts | I should have kept quiet :) |
| 20:20.46 | *** mode/#gsoc [-o gevaerts] by meflin |
| 20:21.02 | meflin | gevaerts: you should be deeply offended ;) |
| 20:21.12 | gevaerts | I usually am |
| 20:21.20 | meflin | downey: chanserv is in command |
| 20:21.43 | meflin | the only reason I consider handing ops out like candy :P |
| 20:22.08 | downey | as long as valorie is +o life is good |
| 20:22.10 | achillion | My Chromecast is acting up. Since this is a Google channel, pls help |
| 20:22.19 | meflin | so nothing works .... |
| 20:22.34 | *** kick/#gsoc [achillion!~meflin@c-24-8-154-206.hsd1.co.comcast.net] by meflin (you asked :P) |
| 20:22.45 | *** join/#gsoc achillion (~ach@unaffiliated/achillion) |
| 20:22.47 | downey | achillion: did you try buying a new one? |
| 20:22.51 | olly | achillion: have you tried turning it off and on again? |
| 20:23.02 | achillion | downey: no. olly: of course |
| 20:23.06 | downey | meflin: i have seen good results from a moderated +v channel with a bot that auto +v's after a little time |
| 20:23.29 | achillion | downey: it's a very first gen... maybe I should get one of them ultras |
| 20:23.42 | gevaerts | That might work, now we only need such a bot |
| 20:23.48 | downey | right. a bot |
| 20:24.02 | achillion | but then there's also the issue that a lot of users barely stick around a minute after they pop in and ask a question |
| 20:24.23 | meflin | do we care about ppl who dont even stay for 5 min? |
| 20:24.57 | downey | achillion: FWIW i think it's something like 15 seconds ... long enough to deter the spammers |
| 20:25.07 | achillion | fair enough |
| 20:25.29 | downey | 200 people in here ... surely someone wants to hack on gsocbot v2 |
| 20:25.33 | gevaerts | The bot should then probably also tell the user |
| 20:25.45 | achillion | meflin: fair point, I just meant there's a lot of people coming in who do stick around but wouldn't realise they're unable to speak for half a minute |
| 20:25.47 | downey | fame & unfortune awaits the brave volunteer |
| 20:26.06 | olly | if Sigyn has +o it'll see what they say and if it hasn't kicked them after they say something, it's fairly safe to +v |
| 20:26.21 | downey | olly: right |
| 20:26.21 | gevaerts | yes |
| 20:26.31 | olly | though then you lose what they first say |
| 20:26.48 | downey | olly: the bot could send a privmsg |
| 20:26.50 | olly | and having the bot repeat it doesn't seem ideal |
| 20:26.52 | gevaerts | You do, but that's inevitable |
| 20:27.03 | olly | well, voice after N seconds may not |
| 20:27.25 | meflin | olly: that is a very very good point on the bot thing |
| 20:27.51 | downey | "GSOCbot here. Sorry, but we didn't catch anything you said before just now. If you asked a question or made a comment, please repeat it. Thanks." |
| 20:28.05 | olly | i'm potentially up for some bot hacking, but I think it probably makes sense to see how the situation develops before putting a lot of effort into a solution |
| 20:28.31 | *** join/#gsoc DJWillis (~djwillis@cpc123798-trow7-2-0-cust28.18-1.cable.virginm.net) |
| 20:28.35 | meflin | I agree |
| 20:28.45 | meflin | expecialy since it would most likly be me :P |
| 20:28.46 | olly | i'd assume freenode will be looking at a central way to address this |
| 20:28.51 | downey | olly: they are |
| 20:29.12 | olly | i'll be at the mentor summit - perhaps that's a suitable time to get together and review? |
| 20:29.26 | downey | as long as nobody suggests slack as a replacement :) |
| 20:29.30 | olly | (though if someone's keen to work on something sooner, don't let me stop you) |
| 20:29.32 | meflin | olly: you will? must find |
| 20:29.42 | achillion | downey: ++ |
| 20:29.46 | olly | booked my flights and everything |
| 20:30.07 | olly | just need an ESTA, but that should be a formality |
| 20:31.39 | meflin | so we have tried all the things now they all suck |
| 20:31.48 | meflin | so what should we do |
| 20:32.20 | gevaerts | The least sucky solution I think would be the bot one |
| 20:32.36 | olly | +r seems tolerable for this phase of gsoc |
| 20:32.44 | gevaerts | Well, it would be forcing the spammers to read bad poetry, but... |
| 20:33.06 | olly | i don't see it as suitable in the application phase |
| 20:33.13 | meflin | bot is doable and we havent tried that suck yet |
| 20:33.19 | achillion | you could +r with redirect into a -unregistered channel where a couple of ops hang out and eat the spam and explain... |
| 20:33.29 | olly | that's not a bad idea |
| 20:33.49 | meflin | achillion: hmm define redirect |
| 20:34.05 | olly | they can add ignore rules to filter out the spam too |
| 20:34.14 | olly | meflin: it's an IRC channel mode |
| 20:34.16 | meflin | olly: by app phase hopefully this problem will be solved |
| 20:34.23 | achillion | meflin: it's one of the chanmodes that redirects /join to a channel for unregistered users |
| 20:34.41 | olly | unreg user tries to join #gsoc and end up in (say) #gsoc-unreg |
| 20:34.48 | achillion | +f |
| 20:35.02 | meflin | olly: and then unreg gets spamed |
| 20:35.09 | achillion | yes |
| 20:35.10 | gevaerts | Hmmm, maybe |
| 20:35.23 | meflin | it would work for a while |
| 20:35.28 | olly | yes, but basically just a few ops are there, and they can set ignore rules in their clients |
| 20:35.46 | gevaerts | True |
| 20:35.47 | achillion | could also get sigyn in there |
| 20:35.52 | olly | so the only traffic they'd see is unregistered users |
| 20:36.07 | olly | achillion: maybe not - it'll only join channels with >= 100 users now it seems |
| 20:36.27 | meflin | very likely if set up right the spam will never find it |
| 20:36.28 | achillion | ah yeah, it's a stated rule |
| 20:36.40 | olly | it's still not a good experience for newbies though |
| 20:36.47 | gevaerts | meflin: depends on whether the spam bots get redirected |
| 20:37.02 | meflin | point |
| 20:37.44 | olly | we probably should see what OSPO people think too |
| 20:37.59 | downey | #freenode-sigyn topic says min 30 users. but still |
| 20:38.18 | achillion | joins #python-unregistered to see what it's like in there |
| 20:38.53 | meflin | holy bovine feecies |
| 20:39.43 | olly | downey: interesting, i guess it was temporarily higher: "I just tried to invite it to a channel and got a reply: Invitation denied, there are only 77 users in #linux-libre (100 minimum for Sigyn)" |
| 20:39.44 | meflin | over 1K nicks |
| 20:40.00 | meflin | olly: sigyn is in hight demand |
| 20:40.08 | downey | could be demand based ya |
| 20:40.47 | olly | the danger is that the #gsoc-unregistered channel ends up becoming a place where new students just fail to get answers from other new students |
| 20:41.01 | achillion | meflin: yeah, not sure why. It looks like some people just hang out there... maybe to help unregs? |
| 20:45.40 | meflin | we have 3 bad solutions and new projects |
| 20:48.11 | achillion | It's a true open source project! |
| 20:48.46 | meflin | so what should we do right now |
| 20:50.55 | achillion | keep our client filters updated and eat the spam for a while longer? |
| 20:51.09 | meflin | that is an option |
| 20:51.36 | Robert_S | not really, most people dont' have client filters |
| 20:51.55 | meflin | Robert_S: living wit the spam so newbs can talk is an option tho |
| 20:51.56 | achillion | well, it's yet another *bad* option perhaps |
| 20:52.12 | Robert_S | We need better efficacy metrics. |
| 20:52.31 | meflin | Robert_S: we are dealing with current realities at this point |
| 20:52.41 | achillion | I'm just enumerating the options, tbh |
| 20:53.20 | achillion | muting unregs + bot with instructions; forwarding to unreg chan; other botty solutions... |
| 20:53.32 | meflin | that is a project |
| 20:54.19 | meflin | I'm asking for feedback on our 3 failed do it right now solutions |
| 20:54.55 | meflin | let the spam happen, +r no un identifed clients , or only opts can see un identifed while that cant see who is who |
| 20:56.27 | meflin | those options hope that freenode gets this under controll , the others are projects that take a bit of time/skill/and thinks |
| 20:56.46 | *** join/#gsoc Yoda (~Yoda@58.65.159.251) |
| 20:56.46 | Yoda | Christel just posted this "denial" on the freenode blog https://freenode.net/news/spam-shake Why does this blog post mention "10.2 million" THREE times? |
| 20:57.40 | *** mode/#gsoc [+r] by olly |
| 20:59.44 | olly | i think +r is least terrible right now - at least an unregistered user gets an error saying what the issue is |
| 20:59.55 | olly | it could be clearer "#gsoc Cannot join channel (+r) - you need to be identified with services" |
| 21:00.19 | meflin | the msg is not i our controll |
| 21:00.21 | olly | but it's better than being quietly ignored but it appearing you can talk |
| 21:00.24 | olly | yes, i know |
| 21:00.42 | meflin | we could use the redirect option tho |
| 21:00.57 | olly | and Robert_S could add a note to the page linking to the channel to say you need to be registered currently |
| 21:01.01 | meflin | I've hit that before and its ... not optimal in the least |
| 21:01.41 | olly | we could, but it seems confusing to the new user and requires manual op intervention for each new user |
| 21:01.47 | olly | or writing bots, etc |
| 21:01.54 | meflin | projects |
| 21:02.01 | olly | which sure we can do, but for a solution right now it's manual |
| 21:02.12 | meflin | exactly |
| 21:03.28 | meflin | unless someone has a better idea of right now ... +r it is unless a chan op is monitoring |
| 21:03.40 | *** mode/#gsoc [-r] by meflin |
| 21:03.54 | olly | i'd hoped that each bot just did /list to find targets and +s would work to stop them finding the channel, but it seems there's more of a control structure in place |
| 21:04.30 | meflin | olly: that got more advanced 20 years ago +s does help alot tho i've tested it in other places |
| 21:05.14 | achillion | meflin: did you accidentally -r instead of +r? |
| 21:05.34 | meflin | achillion: no I did not since I am monitoring r is off |
| 21:05.49 | achillion | ah, right right |
| 21:06.00 | achillion | Oh it was already on |
| 21:06.05 | achillion | never mind! |
| 21:06.07 | meflin | if the spam is distruptive and I will set + when I go get lunch ( to late ) I will set + |
| 21:06.21 | achillion | roger roger |
| 21:06.32 | olly | i'd turned it on to test the message an unregistered user got |
| 21:06.32 | downey | +? |
| 21:06.44 | meflin | +r |
| 21:08.39 | *** mode/#gsoc [+r] by meflin |
| 21:08.47 | meflin | this also isn't the only chan I monitor ;) |
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