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| 00:27.28 | psokolovsky | mzb: Hi, online? As was expected, people can't get past "2.3. How does Ramdisk Rescue work?" on http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/RamdiskRescue |
| 00:27.52 | psokolovsky | mzb: it's long and boring, so people just stop reading the manual at all. |
| 00:28.08 | psokolovsky | and then ask utterly stupid questions |
| 00:28.17 | psokolovsky | so, I'm going to fix that |
| 00:28.23 | psokolovsky | (manual, not people) |
| 00:32.36 | mzb | psokolovsky ? |
| 00:35.13 | mzb | psokolovsky: ok, fair enough |
| 00:39.28 | mzb | psokolovsky: the whole point of having that section at the beginning was to explain the "two-kernel" issue, in particular for the hx4700. So putting it at the end, AND in the developer section is not as appropriate as you might think. |
| 00:39.51 | mzb | I think a different solution needs to be found. |
| 00:41.27 | mzb | TBH, if a potential user can't be bothered to read/understand that (or just skip it) then they're going to be an absolute joy to deal with from a support point of view. |
| 00:43.24 | mzb | the more I look at it the less I like your change |
| 00:48.42 | mzb | psokolovsky: which "stupid questions" are you referring to? |
| 00:49.40 | mzb | I'd prefer a "skip this section if you've got a short attention span" rather than moving it. |
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| 08:49.22 | cm34 | how can I set/clear GPIO in haret ? |
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| 10:42.04 | memmo | hi I was wondering if the anyone could tell me if the hx4700 has wifi fuly working... |
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| 11:59.57 | psokolovsky | memmo: yes, it has, didn't you see wiki? |
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| 12:36.06 | memmo | psokolovsky: I did that's why I asked. I tried linux on my ipaq before and it didn't work then. I just recently installed wm5 and I wish not to go to the trouble of instsalling linux only to find wifi in linux still fails |
| 12:37.10 | psokolovsky | memmo: Installing Linux is great joy, not trouble. |
| 12:37.13 | psokolovsky | ;-) |
| 12:37.32 | psokolovsky | memmo: I hope you don't even think about obscure things like flashing? |
| 12:38.18 | memmo | so it is but to be able to use it would be the ultimate joy and without wifi there is little possibillity of using internet and thus no packages and no software so basicly nothing |
| 12:38.54 | memmo | I did see some changes in the wiki |
| 12:40.04 | memmo | before I had to look real hard to see some posts on some site about the three .BIN files |
| 12:41.12 | memmo | If this does the trick than I'm in for another try |
| 12:41.16 | psokolovsky | memmo: bottom line: to try linux, you don't need to get rid of wm5. boot if from card and see if it works for you. |
| 12:41.29 | memmo | I see... that's new two |
| 12:42.15 | memmo | how does that work I can't seem to find that on the wiki |
| 12:43.55 | psokolovsky | memmo: http://handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/RamdiskRescue |
| 12:48.23 | memmo | hmmm interesting but the fact that there is no audio makes it unuseable for me |
| 12:49.24 | memmo | I'll keep this in mind though once this is fixed my ipaq will deffently undergo the linux improvement |
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| 12:58.06 | cm34 | how does USB detection in pxa_udc works ? I've provided .udc_is_connected, but seems like it is not called at all |
| 12:58.52 | psokolovsky | cm34: yeah, for pxa27x_udc it's not used at all ;-D. UDC apparently senses it itself. |
| 12:58.59 | psokolovsky | cm34: but pullups are required |
| 12:59.21 | cm34 | :-) |
| 13:06.20 | cm34 | and .udc_command should be called when USB connected/disconnected ? |
| 13:09.17 | psokolovsky | yep, that controls pull up |
| 13:12.41 | mzb | psokolovsky: hi |
| 13:13.04 | psokolovsky | mzb: hi |
| 13:13.19 | mzb | you seem to have forgotten the purpose of the paragraph you moved in the RR wiki. I'm not comfortable with the change. |
| 13:14.12 | psokolovsky | mzb: feel free to revert |
| 13:14.20 | mzb | ie. the long story being an introduction to the idea of needing two different kernels, one for RR and one for the distro. |
| 13:15.50 | mzb | if you remember, the reason that section was inserted in the first place was because of the number of users being confused by this issue. |
| 13:16.25 | cm34 | hm than seems like pxa udc detection is not properly working since my .udc_command isn't called when I connect/disconnect USB cabel |
| 13:17.08 | mzb | psokolovsky: I'd like to ask where is the huge list of ppl being bored by that section? |
| 13:17.09 | psokolovsky | mzb: what can I say? it's sad that after so much effort and time we failed to deliver a user friendly installer ;-I. But nevermind. |
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| 13:17.50 | mzb | no need to dodge the issue Paul, feel welcom to vent without bitching :) |
| 13:18.18 | psokolovsky | cm34: nope, it doesn't work like that. when pxa27x_udc feels that it's right to connect, it calls that function with *CMD*_CONNECT, which means "c'mon hardware, you're allowed to connect now" |
| 13:18.48 | mzb | psokolovsky: keeping to the issue at hanf: how is your change related to user friendliness? |
| 13:18.56 | mzb | s/hanf/hand/ |
| 13:19.04 | psokolovsky | cm34: what machine code is just sets GPIO for pull up, and after that, UDC continues |
| 13:20.03 | cm34 | yes, it is called with CMD_CONNECT once during boot |
| 13:20.11 | cm34 | is it normal ? |
| 13:20.28 | mzb | and as I recall, we discussed previously the manner in which all this would be addressed ... by integrating kernel + initrd with haret ... I just haven't been able to get to that stage yet. |
| 13:21.57 | psokolovsky | mzb: As I said, nevermind. I just saw another good customer of RR - he really wanted to install linux, and lacked a cardreader. RR failed to deliver nice user experience to him. And not because RR is bad, but because it has too verbose instructions, which that novice as any novice out there just fail to read in entirety. Because it's *too big*! |
| 13:22.39 | psokolovsky | mzb: nice to know you're still on it. again, just tried to maintain the stuff based on real-world experience. please revert. |
| 13:22.56 | mzb | fine. But cutting out an explanation for ONE user spoils it for the others. |
| 13:23.05 | psokolovsky | cm34: yes, if you have pxa27x_udc statically compiled, that's how it should be. |
| 13:23.22 | mzb | I will endeavour to ensure that the next version avoids this issue completely :) |
| 13:24.26 | mzb | I'd appreciate it you would revert the change YOU made, considering the circumstances. |
| 13:24.45 | mzb | (and past experience) |
| 13:25.01 | psokolovsky | mzb: so we host RR downloads on sf.net, right? |
| 13:25.25 | mzb | nothing has changed |
| 13:25.32 | mzb | why do you ask? |
| 13:25.38 | psokolovsky | mzb: no, as a person who recommends RR to other, and supports it to some extent, I believe that the change is right |
| 13:25.56 | psokolovsky | mzb: I just don't remember exactly |
| 13:26.27 | mzb | need I point out the multitude of emails to various lists regarding the confusion re: 2x kernels? |
| 13:26.38 | mzb | vs the SINGLE user you speak of? |
| 13:27.02 | psokolovsky | mzb: hosting on sf.net? |
| 13:27.39 | mzb | what about hosting? |
| 13:28.10 | psokolovsky | mzb: I'm looking for d/l stats |
| 13:29.22 | psokolovsky | mzb: ok, assuming sf.net. then RR has ~300 d/l month, or ~100 for ext.gz which is 1 instance of it. |
| 13:29.43 | psokolovsky | mzb: and do you have success rates for those 100 dls/month? |
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| 13:30.46 | mzb | Paul, I don't think either of us have the time&effort to argue stats+logic, Your point? |
| 13:30.46 | psokolovsky | mzb: my idea is that it is very low, or we'd hear more feedback. So, that user is just common case of issues folks face. |
| 13:32.06 | mzb | my point remains: we had MANY users confused re the need for 2x kernels, versus ONE user that thinks the page is long and boring. |
| 13:32.16 | psokolovsky | mzb: point is to remind that RR was done towards some aim, and it needs to be maintained towards it. If people don't read docs, you should check what's wrong with them. YMMV |
| 13:32.50 | mzb | fine, as I've ALSO already said, this issue will be null and void in future releases |
| 13:33.19 | psokolovsky | so far, there're no releases in 8 months. |
| 13:33.38 | mzb | yeah righto, wanna swap lives? |
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| 13:34.21 | mzb | I understand your point, and I empathise, however cut+shut on wiki + nitpicking now is not the best way to get my attention |
| 13:34.47 | mzb | please revert your change. I've got better things to do. |
| 13:35.33 | mzb | btw + fyi: I have managed to write a menu in C which might suit |
| 13:36.11 | Sauron | hi, how reseting keys on joypad in opie? it not worked |
| 13:37.35 | S-a-u-r-o-n | if press up opie say "2" |
| 13:38.19 | S-a-u-r-o-n | if press down say "6" |
| 13:41.13 | mzb | non-computer-related duties pending ... good night all |
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| 13:43.36 | psokolovsky | S-a-u-r-o-n: you have been answered yesterday, but here it again. You misrepresent facts. It cannot be that OPIE has it. it's *your* version of OPIE (with your version of kernel) does that. What are those version? If you yourself don't know, you should just make sure you use something current, and then fix it. |
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| 13:52.26 | bd2_ | dwmw2_gone, hi! As previously discussed, I've forked battery2-2.6.git into battery2-2.6-dev.git, and cleaned battery2-2.6.git from intermediate commits (+ rebased against 2.6.22). If you want/need to, you can "convert" your local copy to -dev by modifying .git/config, replacing url= with battery2-2.6-dev.git, and rm .git/FETCH_HEAD. |
| 14:05.52 | psokolovsky | bd2_: Hi! |
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| 14:10.46 | bd2_ | psokolovsky, hey! how are you? |
| 14:16.59 | cm34 | is there git mirror for handhelds.org kernel sources ? |
| 14:19.16 | psokolovsky | thanks, ok ;-) |
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| 16:44.47 | cm34 | why doesn't pxa27x_udc use .gpio_pullup like pxa2xx_udc ? |
| 16:58.18 | psokolovsky | cm34: unconverted yet. feel free to add |
| 16:59.29 | cm34 | ok |
| 17:00.29 | cm34 | I've just get udc working on looxc550. should I submit patches without .gpio_pullup ? |
| 17:03.23 | psokolovsky | cm34: If you're going to add it, can wait for final version ;-). but otherwise, early patch submission is appreciated - as you saw yourself, it can save you doing unneeded work/doing something twice |
| 17:03.57 | psokolovsky | cm34: and congrats, that's great step, you'll now be able to do testing much more comfortably! |
| 17:04.19 | cm34 | yes, I've already felt it :-) |
| 17:05.01 | cm34 | btw, is there git mirror for handhelds.org cvs ? |
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| 17:43.59 | cm34 | psokolovsky, patches are in mailing list |
| 17:44.45 | psokolovsky | thanks! |
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| 23:52.48 | *** join/#handhelds Ironnads (n=Ironnads@host86-135-217-108.range86-135.btcentralplus.com) |