| 02:06.30 | *** join/#harmattan infobot (~infobot@rikers.org) |
| 02:06.30 | *** topic/#harmattan is a cozy little place for pure harmattan device discussions | MeeGo N9(|50) CE on its way, MOSLO still missing discuss in #meego-arm please |
| 02:07.04 | *** mode/#harmattan [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
| 02:08.02 | *** mode/#harmattan [+o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ |
| 02:08.32 | *** topic/#harmattan by DocScrutinizer -> a cozy little place for pure harmattan device discussions | MeeGo N9(|50) CE on its way, MOSLO still missing discuss in #meego-arm please | this channel is logged by infobot, see ~logs |
| 02:08.50 | DocScrutinizer | ~logs |
| 02:08.50 | infobot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/%23harmattan/ Lines starting with spaces are not logged. Logs are updated daily. |
| 02:09.41 | *** mode/#harmattan [-o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ |
| 02:17.05 | DocScrutinizer | Jul 12 23:13:59 (none) mce[530]: mce-io.c:mce_close_file(): Failed to close `/sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-2/2-004b/wait_for_gesture'; Device or resource busy |
| 02:17.10 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 04:06.25 | dm8tbr | good moaning |
| 04:34.12 | *** join/#harmattan DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 05:00.57 | dm8tbr | 13.07.2011, 06:23 Out for delivery 33800 ITELLA LOGISTIIKKA KULJETUS \o/ |
| 05:01.15 | dm8tbr | declares 'home office until delivered' ;) |
| 05:19.53 | *** join/#harmattan hiemanshu_ (~hiemanshu@fedora/hiemanshu) |
| 06:52.40 | hiemanshu | dm8tbr: damn you |
| 07:33.54 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 07:34.37 | alterego | o/ |
| 07:34.57 | alterego | Looks like javispedro removed branding |
| 07:35.09 | Jaffa | Yup |
| 07:35.11 | Jaffa | Works well |
| 07:35.30 | alterego | Nice, can you change it to, say, "AWESOME EDITION? |
| 07:35.36 | Jaffa | Don't see why not |
| 07:35.43 | Jaffa | It's just changing/removing references to image files |
| 07:35.50 | Jaffa | What does the 'N' in 'N950' stand for? |
| 07:35.53 | alterego | Oh, neat |
| 07:35.56 | alterego | :) |
| 07:36.02 | alterego | It stands for garlic |
| 07:36.03 | ieatlint | N series |
| 07:36.39 | ieatlint | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_Nseries |
| 07:36.42 | macmaN | what does the E in E7 stand for? |
| 07:37.03 | ieatlint | euclidean |
| 07:37.45 | alterego | The E stands for kirk edition |
| 07:39.07 | Jaffa | Isn't that the T series? |
| 07:41.36 | alterego | E stands for Elop |
| 07:44.16 | hiemanshu | E = Business, N = General smartphone |
| 07:45.04 | *** join/#harmattan veli (veli@feenix.piipiip.net) |
| 07:46.13 | dm8tbr | and C is just Cheap-Ass-Smartphone |
| 07:46.20 | Jaffa | :) |
| 07:46.35 | ieatlint | and X? |
| 07:46.49 | hiemanshu | X = XpressMusic |
| 07:46.58 | Jaffa | Xtremely Expensive |
| 07:48.20 | hiemanshu | C = Core |
| 07:48.44 | Jaffa | thinks hiemanshu and ieatlint have missed the fact Jaffa was being facetious |
| 07:49.18 | ieatlint | i realized about 2s after posting that link :P |
| 07:49.50 | hiemanshu | hah |
| 07:53.38 | alterego | Anyone watched the N9 adverts? :D |
| 07:54.02 | alterego | I like the pink one |
| 07:55.25 | *** join/#harmattan TheBootroo_ (53914532@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.145.69.50) |
| 07:55.46 | TheBootroo_ | hi |
| 07:55.50 | TheBootroo_ | i jsut got my N950 |
| 07:56.07 | TheBootroo_ | but i cant use usb rndis on win7 cause there is no driver |
| 07:56.22 | TheBootroo_ | and i cant use WLAN because i have no wifi in range |
| 07:56.30 | TheBootroo_ | what could i do ? |
| 07:56.33 | flux | well, sucks to be you then?-) |
| 07:57.40 | flux | I guess your best option is to find a driver. or buy a wifi station. or install linux into virtualbox and use the usb-bridging. |
| 08:06.29 | *** join/#harmattan Khertan_w (c16a270a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.193.106.39.10) |
| 08:06.32 | *** join/#harmattan TheBootroo (53914532@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.145.69.50) |
| 08:06.37 | Khertan_w | morning |
| 08:07.09 | Khertan_w | Does voice call is working on your n950 |
| 08:07.20 | TheBootroo | hello |
| 08:07.23 | ieatlint | yes |
| 08:07.40 | TheBootroo | can someone tell me where i can download RNDIS driver for N950 to win7 |
| 08:08.59 | Khertan_w | ieatlint: always call error |
| 08:09.14 | ieatlint | i've made and received calls on my n950 |
| 08:09.16 | ieatlint | no issues |
| 08:10.03 | Khertan_w | ok ... maybe network coverage ... |
| 08:10.19 | ieatlint | try sms perhaps? |
| 08:10.35 | Khertan_w | sms is working at least receiving |
| 08:11.00 | ieatlint | i dunno... i didn't do anything special to get it working though |
| 08:11.22 | dm8tbr | I HAZ A TOY! :D |
| 08:11.53 | TheBootroo | dm8tbr: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-9cvoYjUO-F0/ThyNUAGZGJI/AAAAAAAAAGw/TTSVvH2__ns/s1600/lolcat8804a57f1ba2e6c369732769833bf6b3746cfa00.jpg |
| 08:11.57 | Khertan_w | hum ... call Seems to work now after receiving a first call |
| 08:12.07 | Khertan_w | ieatlint: thx |
| 08:13.48 | kimju | dm8tbr :) |
| 08:15.45 | ieatlint | Khertan_w: i will note that i received a call before making one as well |
| 08:15.48 | ieatlint | coincidence, perhaps |
| 08:16.34 | Khertan_w | ieatlint: maybe |
| 08:24.08 | dm8tbr | I could try that |
| 08:24.19 | dm8tbr | which order didn't work? outgoing first? |
| 08:26.04 | ieatlint | try outgoing |
| 08:26.12 | dm8tbr | trying |
| 08:26.15 | *** join/#harmattan cpscotti (~cpscotti@124.16.112.87.dyn.plus.net) |
| 08:26.44 | dm8tbr | heh, call worked but dropped after 6s |
| 08:26.53 | dm8tbr | 'can't get onto the mobile network' |
| 08:27.16 | ieatlint | i don't even know what that means |
| 08:27.38 | dm8tbr | second call worked |
| 08:27.47 | dm8tbr | dial out worked OOTB for me |
| 08:27.58 | dm8tbr | could be an operator specific thing then |
| 08:28.04 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, device in hands... :D |
| 08:28.06 | ieatlint | ok, or random chance |
| 08:28.20 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: @cpscotti FU dude, FU! |
| 08:28.21 | hiemanshu | :P |
| 08:28.35 | *** join/#harmattan deimos (~deimos@host67-65-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 08:29.12 | dm8tbr | waves around his n950 in front of hiemanshu :p |
| 08:29.20 | cpscotti | exhibits a huge smile in his face, laughs at the whole thing and goes back to the thing's terminal admiring how cool is the default green/black color scheme. |
| 08:29.26 | hiemanshu | dm8tbr: die you bastard, die! |
| 08:29.38 | cpscotti | dm8tbr, lol! |
| 08:29.58 | cpscotti | hey, question one.. do we have a ctrl+backspace? |
| 08:30.06 | dm8tbr | goes to find his torx screwdriver to finish unboxing achipa style |
| 08:30.29 | hiemanshu | I am going to go have lunch now |
| 08:30.34 | hiemanshu | will be back in an hour |
| 08:31.13 | cpscotti | starts cutting his nails to help further typing on small keyboards.. patience.. |
| 08:37.48 | alterego | Hah |
| 08:44.15 | *** join/#harmattan CaCO3 (~CaCO3@19-233.195-178.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 08:44.43 | cpscotti | ooook... the gps is FAAST! |
| 08:50.08 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@host-94-248-207-98.kabelnet.hu) |
| 08:50.08 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 08:57.04 | Jaffa | cpscotti: Yes, the up-right arrow/backspace |
| 08:58.25 | cpscotti | Jaffa, HA! Thanks! lovely! |
| 09:00.19 | Jaffa | cpscotti: Added to http://wiki.meego.com/Migrating_from_N900_to_N950 |
| 09:02.36 | cpscotti | Jaffa, that guide is getting good :D |
| 09:03.30 | *** join/#harmattan CaCO3 (~CaCO3@19-233.195-178.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 09:11.24 | DocScrutinizer | dm8tbr: congrats for new TOY |
| 09:11.55 | Venemo | hm, DHL works fast. they gotten the N950 at yesterday 16:20, and at today 08:13 it already left their Budapest facility |
| 09:14.17 | DocScrutinizer | DHL express delivers overnight in whole Europe afaik |
| 09:15.15 | ieatlint | very quick... shipped 4pm CET Friday and was out for delivery 9am PDT Monday |
| 09:15.59 | ieatlint | from finland to california.. |
| 09:18.07 | Venemo | that is nice |
| 09:18.51 | alterego | Yeah, most couriers I've had business work like that :P |
| 09:19.49 | ieatlint | err, screwed up the timezone there, not CET, but GMT+3, forget the name of the timezone for finland :P |
| 09:19.52 | hiemanshu | Venemo: you got yours too? |
| 09:20.02 | Venemo | hiemanshu, not yet |
| 09:20.08 | hiemanshu | Venemo: you'll get it today? |
| 09:20.18 | Venemo | hiemanshu, as I said, it left Budapest in 08:13, that's what's on their site |
| 09:20.31 | hiemanshu | Venemo: how far are you from budapest? |
| 09:20.43 | Venemo | hiemanshu, 200 km |
| 09:20.47 | Venemo | or a bit more |
| 09:20.58 | hiemanshu | ah, so you should probably get it today |
| 09:21.04 | hiemanshu | is hoping his ships today |
| 09:21.21 | Venemo | Jaffa, how can I either make that ugly white bar disappear from the bottom of the app, or at least put my toolbar icons on it? |
| 09:21.42 | hiemanshu | Venemo: use .showFullScreen()? |
| 09:21.46 | Jaffa | Venemo: You can put icons on it by using Qt Components (ask andy80) |
| 09:22.07 | Venemo | Jaffa, unfortunately it is a QWidgets app |
| 09:22.10 | lardman | hmm, still no DHL email |
| 09:22.10 | Jaffa | Venemo: You can make it go away by using .showFullScreen() and if you use PageStackWindow *and* showFullScreen() you can control showStatusBar and showToolBar |
| 09:22.17 | Venemo | I recall you saying some NoMStyle thing. |
| 09:22.18 | Jaffa | Venemo: showFullScreen should do it then |
| 09:22.34 | Jaffa | Venemo: I've no idea what that does, but Ronan put it in the original Harmattan port of Attitude |
| 09:22.40 | Venemo | umm, I don't wish the fullscreen to be default. |
| 09:22.59 | lardman | Venemo: how much delay between the Nokia email saying it was shipped and the DHL email for you? |
| 09:23.17 | hiemanshu | lardman: you should have got it by around 7-ish .fi |
| 09:23.30 | lardman | hmm, I didn't |
| 09:23.30 | Venemo | lardman, 2 hours, but the DHL email also came from @nokia.com |
| 09:24.05 | Venemo | lardman, in fact, according to DHL, it was picked up 2 more hours later. |
| 09:24.23 | hiemanshu | MEH, I dont care anymore |
| 09:24.32 | lardman | I'll email them and see if my dhl tracking number has got lost somewhere |
| 09:25.18 | Jaffa | Venemo: The Harmattan style is full screen more than on N900 |
| 09:25.37 | Venemo | Jaffa, I know, but there is the top bar which I don't want to disappear |
| 09:25.52 | hiemanshu | Venemo: then draw it yourself |
| 09:26.10 | Venemo | how? |
| 09:26.26 | Jaffa | Venemo: If you wrap it in a PageStackWindow, you showFullScreen() and then showStatusBar: true |
| 09:26.32 | Jaffa | Venemo: That's what Attitude does |
| 09:26.39 | Venemo | Jaffa, showStatusBar: true how? |
| 09:26.52 | hiemanshu | Jaffa: he is using QWidgets, not QML :P |
| 09:27.03 | hiemanshu | Venemo: why do you want to use QWidgets? Its not themed |
| 09:27.11 | Venemo | not themet? |
| 09:27.18 | Jaffa | hiemanshu: You can put QWidgets *inside* QML :-p |
| 09:27.19 | Khertan_w | does harmattan component will be availabe in fremantle ? |
| 09:27.27 | Venemo | there is QMStyle or whatever. it should be themed. |
| 09:27.30 | Jaffa | Khertan_w: According to Kat Alhola. |
| 09:27.39 | Khertan_w | Venemo: but completly bugged |
| 09:27.53 | hiemanshu | Jaffa: thats just stupid :P |
| 09:27.58 | Khertan_w | Jaffa: she talk about ubuntu, meego ce, not fremantle, or i miss something |
| 09:28.40 | Jaffa | Khertan_w: http://www.mwkn.net/2011/26/devel.html#devel-1 |
| 09:28.42 | hiemanshu | well the issues is QML in 4.7.0 is really buggy |
| 09:28.46 | Khertan_w | hiemanshu: no it s not ... text management in qml do not let do rich text managment so using a qwidget here in qml is the way to go :) |
| 09:28.57 | hiemanshu | Khertan_w: ah |
| 09:29.03 | Khertan_w | hiemanshu: and keep the rest in qml :) |
| 09:29.06 | Jaffa | Khertan_w: "Nokia Developer former Forum Nokia will provides a community port of components to Ubuntu Natty, Maemo5, and MeeGo 1.2. New components could be easily adapted for example to MeeGo 1.2 style with just small hack in application." |
| 09:29.14 | hiemanshu | ah |
| 09:29.22 | Khertan_w | Jaffa: oh ... thx |
| 09:29.30 | Venemo | well honestly, the app is based on QGV. I have no idea how to make it QML |
| 09:29.39 | Khertan_w | Jaffa: so i ll try to use the harmattan component so :) |
| 09:29.45 | Venemo | and I have no desire to make it consume 3Ã the memory it does now. |
| 09:29.56 | Venemo | any suggestions? |
| 09:30.16 | Khertan_w | Venemo: qml didn't eat 3 more time memory, and from my test is faster ...:) |
| 09:30.25 | hiemanshu | Venemo: theme it yourself |
| 09:30.27 | hiemanshu | then |
| 09:30.33 | Venemo | Khertan_w, according to MohammadAG's tests, it was slower |
| 09:30.42 | Jaffa | Venemo: Your requirements aren't supposed to be supported by the Harmattan UX. |
| 09:30.51 | Venemo | Jaffa, which parts? |
| 09:30.58 | Khertan_w | QGraphicView ? |
| 09:31.28 | Jaffa | Venemo: Showing the status bar is rare (though I do it in Harmattan), doing that without the grey bar, doing that in plain QWidgets |
| 09:31.37 | Khertan_w | just put so the qgraphicview in a qgraphicproxy to use it a qdeclarativeitem |
| 09:31.56 | hiemanshu | I emailed DDP explaining my problem and they come back to me saying 'Thank you, we will ship the devices soon.' :( |
| 09:31.58 | Venemo | how can I translate the QGraphicsView to QML and still have its features? |
| 09:32.09 | Venemo | hiemanshu, patience is a virtue |
| 09:32.21 | hiemanshu | Venemo: but I move soon, so here it doesn't help |
| 09:32.23 | Khertan_w | Venemo: QGraphicView is a QWidget right ? |
| 09:32.34 | Venemo | Khertan_w, right. |
| 09:32.39 | Khertan_w | take a look at the source code of branch qml of KhtEditor |
| 09:32.46 | Khertan_w | it s python code |
| 09:32.48 | Venemo | hiemanshu, so tell them to either ship now or delay it for some time... |
| 09:32.51 | Khertan_w | but the concept is here |
| 09:32.51 | hiemanshu | Venemo: by end of the week my current house will have 40-ish people, and by mid of next week I empty the place |
| 09:33.02 | hiemanshu | Venemo: delaying it for more time makes no sense :( |
| 09:33.03 | Khertan_w | i use a QTextEdit in a qdeclarativeview |
| 09:33.08 | hiemanshu | Venemo: I'll run around and get it |
| 09:33.19 | Venemo | hiemanshu, then delay your moving |
| 09:33.35 | Venemo | Khertan_w, I can't understand python |
| 09:34.23 | hiemanshu | Venemo: naah, I'll pick it up from DHL myself some time later |
| 09:34.43 | Venemo | or simply tell them your new address |
| 09:35.01 | hiemanshu | Venemo: atleast they replied, so I expect them to notice me, and hopefully send it today or tomorrow, which is fine |
| 09:35.19 | Venemo | nice :) |
| 09:35.46 | DocScrutinizer | lardman: see my post to FMC develdevice thread. There will be NO DHL mail, it's from Nokia |
| 09:36.04 | Khertan_w | Venemo: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/declarative-cppextensions-qwidgets.html |
| 09:37.42 | DocScrutinizer | lardman: mail whom to see if your tracking number "got lost"? DHL? They will have NFC how to help you |
| 09:38.19 | Venemo | Khertan_w, is it possible to do this without QML? |
| 09:38.31 | Venemo | I kinda like QML, but it's unsuitable for this kind of app. |
| 09:38.41 | Khertan_w | Venemo: what are you trying to do ? |
| 09:38.57 | Khertan_w | blam qtcreator which didn't launch anymore qemu ... grrr |
| 09:39.01 | Venemo | well anyway, I'll think it through |
| 09:39.03 | hiemanshu | Venemo: like I said, if you draw everything yourself you can use QWidgets |
| 09:39.36 | lardman | DocScrutinizer: I understand, my fault for sloppy wording - basically I've recieved no email giving me a tracking number from anyone |
| 09:40.30 | Khertan_w | Venemo: there is two way, port your app to qml, debug and maitain meegotouchstyle which is currently abandonned, unmaintained, and buggy |
| 09:40.35 | DocScrutinizer | lardman: but you got mail from Joan? |
| 09:41.06 | lardman | from no-one, other than the do not reply email that told me the device had shipped |
| 09:42.42 | MohammadAG | <Venemo> Khertan_w, according to MohammadAG's tests, it was slower |
| 09:42.53 | MohammadAG | Remember, this is #harmattan |
| 09:43.20 | Khertan_w | ? |
| 09:43.52 | Khertan_w | MohammadAG: from my test qml is slower on maemo5 but faster on harmattan |
| 09:43.56 | MohammadAG | It's slower on fremantle |
| 09:44.07 | MohammadAG | exactly my point |
| 09:44.17 | MohammadAG | Harmattan has boosters and stuff |
| 09:44.32 | Khertan_w | and qwidget is faster on fremantle than harmattan :) |
| 09:44.36 | Khertan_w | this is the funny part |
| 09:46.49 | hiemanshu | well everything in Harmattan is QML, so loading it shouldn't really be an issue |
| 09:47.02 | hiemanshu | and yeah there are boosters already |
| 09:47.11 | DocScrutinizer | lardman: you should probably get a mail from Nokia: >>Ticket for order OID-052736 [ ref:00D2Kmvd.5002G<< |
| 09:47.49 | Venemo | maybe I could use QML Harmattan stuff, and use one of this proxy thing to proxy a QGV |
| 09:48.32 | *** join/#harmattan deimos (~deimos@host67-65-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 09:48.39 | MohammadAG | hiemanshu, everything is QML? |
| 09:48.49 | MohammadAG | Afaik the whole UI is MTF + QGV |
| 09:49.08 | hiemanshu | MohammadAG: so far yeah, teh homescreens and everything seems to be QML |
| 09:50.09 | MohammadAG | you sure? |
| 09:50.12 | DocScrutinizer | lardman: I got >>Your order has been sent<< from:"no.reply-developer@nokia.com" <no.reply-developer@nokia.com> at 2011-07-06 12:43 --- and >>Ticket for order OID-052736<< from "joan.bon d ad@nokia.com" at 2011-07-06 12:44 |
| 09:50.33 | hiemanshu | I remember someone telling me that yes |
| 09:50.42 | hiemanshu | DocScrutinizer: you lucky arse |
| 09:50.44 | MohammadAG | Jaffa, can you confirm otherwise? |
| 09:50.48 | hiemanshu | is still waiting |
| 09:51.12 | MohammadAG | I'm pretty sure the UI is not QML |
| 09:51.17 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 09:51.21 | DocScrutinizer | so you still don't know your OID-8478??? |
| 09:51.40 | hiemanshu | MohammadAG: did yours get sent yet? |
| 09:51.52 | MohammadAG | don't think so |
| 09:52.59 | Jaffa | has not investigated - but I don't think the home screens are QML. They're built on top (closed source plugins) of the open source meegotouchhome |
| 09:53.08 | lardman | DocScrutinizer: ok, so I'm missing an email |
| 09:53.30 | *** join/#harmattan achipa (~attila@nat/nokia/x-jvrrlvdvnnwuiwsx) |
| 09:53.31 | *** join/#harmattan achipa (~attila@Maemo/community/council/achipa) |
| 09:53.50 | DocScrutinizer | If you got a >>Your order has been sent<< moe than 12h ago but no other mail yet, I'd probably send an *urgent* mail to DDP@nokia, as your parcel might be on the way and you can't track it |
| 09:54.12 | lardman | yep, just done that, thanks |
| 09:55.11 | MohammadAG | mine's still a new order |
| 09:55.16 | MohammadAG | lardman, yours shipped? |
| 09:55.25 | Venemo | meh, sorry, it crashed. |
| 09:56.09 | hiemanshu | MohammadAG: same here, new order |
| 09:56.28 | MohammadAG | I think they ran out of devices or something |
| 09:56.44 | hiemanshu | nope, just not many people |
| 09:57.38 | MohammadAG | 4 people can get 250 packages sent out in one day |
| 09:58.17 | hiemanshu | like achipa said, there is a lot of overhead, qt ambassadors, launchpad, and other dev devices to ship too |
| 09:58.19 | lardman | MohammadAG: I think so, but no way of tracking it |
| 09:58.47 | Venemo | MohammadAG, not if they need to personally flash each device and package it |
| 09:58.47 | hiemanshu | lardman: a few people didn't get a number but they got their devices |
| 09:58.48 | achipa | MohammadAG: if it was only 250... |
| 09:59.06 | hiemanshu | hey achipa |
| 09:59.09 | lardman | It seems we were fairly far back in the queue of people to receive them, that is those who applied via the Meego DDP |
| 09:59.43 | lardman | but who cares, as long as the thing arrives so I can start doing some dev work for it |
| 10:00.13 | achipa | and it's not just "slap a sticker on a DHL box", there is considerably more work with them |
| 10:00.53 | achipa | (remember, the DDP process is originally set up to deal with companies) |
| 10:01.23 | Venemo | achipa, could you please help me for a moment? |
| 10:01.39 | achipa | so, while a sympathize with all the people wearing their F5 button out, patience :) |
| 10:01.42 | achipa | Venemo: sure |
| 10:02.02 | lardman | achipa: my issue is that I've received a shipped email, but no tracking information |
| 10:02.08 | Venemo | achipa, what is QGV's alternative in QML? |
| 10:02.36 | achipa | Venemo: not sure I follow, QML *is* QGV in way ? |
| 10:02.43 | achipa | s/in/in a/ |
| 10:02.53 | cpscotti | is baffled at Qt Mobility; New OS; new phone; build -> runs. All in less than 10 minutes. |
| 10:03.07 | Venemo | achipa, I have a QWidgets app. In that app, I have a window. on that window, there are some buttons and a QGV |
| 10:03.15 | achipa | lardman: tracking depends on the country and who we are using for delivery, etc |
| 10:03.23 | Venemo | achipa, now suppose for a moment that I want to rewrite this app's GUI to QML. |
| 10:03.41 | lardman | achipa: ok |
| 10:03.43 | achipa | Venemo: let's suppose that :) |
| 10:03.45 | Venemo | achipa, I'm aware that buttons and other UI elements are implemented as Qt Components, so I can just use them |
| 10:03.52 | lardman | Anyone else in the UK received one, and if so did it have tracking? |
| 10:03.55 | Venemo | achipa, but what do I replace the QGV with? |
| 10:04.20 | achipa | essentiall, that's just a root Item {} for you |
| 10:04.49 | Venemo | achipa, wut? |
| 10:04.54 | achipa | whatever you would put in, do with within the QGV, you do within that Item |
| 10:05.01 | Venemo | achipa, I have various QGraphicsItem subclasses that I put int here |
| 10:05.12 | achipa | yes, perfect, then put them in the Item :) |
| 10:05.36 | Venemo | achipa, I also use QGV's features extensively... like effects and zooming. |
| 10:05.42 | Venemo | achipa, can I do that in QML? |
| 10:05.47 | achipa | absolutely |
| 10:05.55 | Venemo | hmm |
| 10:06.09 | achipa | better even, I'd daresay, depending on what version of Qt/QtQuick you are using |
| 10:06.28 | achipa | don't forget that Item *IS* a QGraphicsItem |
| 10:06.37 | Venemo | sounds like an awful lot of work... it it? |
| 10:06.37 | achipa | (somewhere deep down below) |
| 10:06.51 | Venemo | sounds like an awful lot of work... is it? |
| 10:06.55 | achipa | less actually, QML is a lot terser than C++ code |
| 10:07.06 | Venemo | so I heard (from your blog) |
| 10:07.13 | Venemo | but I have no idea how I can do this right now |
| 10:08.01 | achipa | not sure about what the confusion stems from... ? Think about your main.qml as you graphicsscene |
| 10:08.12 | Venemo | sure, but then where do I put the button? |
| 10:08.13 | Venemo | s |
| 10:08.19 | achipa | on it |
| 10:08.27 | Venemo | but I don't want the button to be on the QGV |
| 10:08.31 | Venemo | I mean... |
| 10:08.46 | hiemanshu | Venemo: the button is a mouse area on the QGV |
| 10:09.01 | Venemo | sure, but I don't want my graphics items to be covered by the buttons |
| 10:09.04 | hiemanshu | Venemo: everything is just a QGV, but instead they are already drawn out for you |
| 10:09.35 | achipa | Venemo: no, it doesn't work that way, with QML you layout things you want |
| 10:09.39 | Venemo | achipa, do you have an N900 at hand? install Puzzle Master from extras-devel |
| 10:09.50 | achipa | you're not limited by 'can/have to put them beside/above' |
| 10:09.53 | Venemo | apt-get install puzzle-master |
| 10:10.04 | Venemo | and then tell me how I can implement the game board itself in QML |
| 10:10.08 | achipa | duh... battery dead |
| 10:10.46 | Venemo | you can run it on your desktop as well |
| 10:10.55 | Venemo | just a lot better experience on touchscreen |
| 10:10.55 | hiemanshu | Venemo: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/qml-integration.html read it |
| 10:11.01 | achipa | but anyway, normally, that's just another 'layer'. Item { buttons... stuff... and then ItemWhichUsedToBeMyGraphicsView {} } |
| 10:11.27 | Venemo | hiemanshu, I don't want to mix QML and QWidgets really |
| 10:11.35 | Venemo | it's either this or that. |
| 10:11.46 | achipa | ... use components ? |
| 10:11.51 | Venemo | achipa, btw, should a regular QWidgets app run/look well on Harmattan at all? |
| 10:12.01 | achipa | run, yes, look well, no |
| 10:12.24 | Venemo | meh, I thought there is QMeegoTouchStyle to take care of that |
| 10:15.31 | Venemo | achipa, also, I do create my QGraphicsItem subclass objects in C++ code. how can I add those to QML? |
| 10:15.41 | Venemo | I really have absolutely no idea about this |
| 10:15.50 | achipa | Venemo: if you extended QGI, yes, otherwise that's Item {} |
| 10:16.19 | *** join/#harmattan SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 10:16.32 | Venemo | achipa, I did extend QGI, yes. for example, the puzzle pieces contain their logic in that class |
| 10:16.58 | achipa | Venemo: same thing then, just inherit from QDeclarativeItem |
| 10:17.34 | Venemo | achipa, if I do this, will the app still be able to run on Maemo 5 and the desktop? |
| 10:17.56 | achipa | yes (depending on what UI components you use) |
| 10:18.29 | alterego | I just got "Device sent to customer" |
| 10:18.30 | alterego | :) |
| 10:18.33 | alterego | WOO! |
| 10:18.35 | Venemo | alterego, congrats :) |
| 10:18.38 | alterego | Should be here tomorrow then :D |
| 10:18.43 | alterego | hiemanshu: gutted :P |
| 10:18.45 | Venemo | achipa, hm, I'm a bit clueless about all this... :( |
| 10:18.55 | hiemanshu | alterego: damn you |
| 10:19.09 | hiemanshu | am I the only one not getting it? achipa did you do something to my order? :( |
| 10:19.10 | achipa | Venemo: just do it |
| 10:19.45 | achipa | hiemanshu: I put your name at the bottom of the pile every time you complain :P (KIDDING !) |
| 10:20.02 | achipa | Venemo: go through the QML tutorials and it will be a lot clearer |
| 10:20.03 | alterego | Hahah |
| 10:20.03 | Venemo | achipa, something tells me that it will cost me several days and at the end my app will perform worse. |
| 10:20.05 | hiemanshu | achipa: well I like to complain :P its fun :P |
| 10:20.34 | achipa | Venemo: that is certainly the case. Not because of QML, but because of lack of experience (which you do have with widgets) |
| 10:20.58 | Venemo | I see. |
| 10:21.17 | alterego | hiemanshu: was your order # higher or lower than mine? |
| 10:21.23 | hiemanshu | alterego: 887 |
| 10:21.25 | Venemo | achipa, well, the app performs worse with QGV than it did when I just used QWidgets instead of QGI as well. |
| 10:21.31 | achipa | an any technology it requires a bit of mastering. I have yet to meet people who didn't pull hair when dealing with spacers and the QWidget layouting |
| 10:21.36 | alterego | hiemanshu: you're lower than me .. |
| 10:21.38 | Venemo | achipa, I have since determined that it's because QGV's extensive use of floats for everything. |
| 10:21.41 | alterego | I'm 934 |
| 10:22.04 | hiemanshu | alterego: I know, this is so unfair :( |
| 10:22.08 | Venemo | achipa, spacers and QWidget layouting are very easy concepts understandable in 5 minutes |
| 10:22.10 | alterego | Awww, :( |
| 10:22.19 | alterego | hiemanshu: I wonder if they do bulk by country or something. |
| 10:22.31 | alterego | It kinda half makes sense for grouping, but who knows .. |
| 10:22.43 | hiemanshu | alterego: I dont think so really |
| 10:23.04 | achipa | Venemo: I just met the wrong people then :P They sound easy in theory, but then suddenly widgets/spacers don't expand in the right ways... |
| 10:23.04 | alterego | Well, I hope your status changes very soon :) |
| 10:23.18 | hiemanshu | alterego: until then, /me goes back to corner to cry |
| 10:23.51 | achipa | not to mention if you use QtDesigner, moving something from one deeply buried layout to another is a ... mess |
| 10:24.31 | alterego | Aww :( |
| 10:24.42 | alterego | I feel guilty now, I should have not said anything :( |
| 10:25.02 | achipa | Venemo: and I would seriously argue the notion that QWidget's layouting is simpler than the QML one :) |
| 10:25.25 | Venemo | achipa, since I have no idea about the QML one, I can not express any opinion about it. :) |
| 10:25.29 | alterego | achipa: maybe for simple things, but QML is more powerful and adaptable. |
| 10:25.52 | alterego | Venemo: QML layouts are basically anchor points and explicit positions. |
| 10:26.01 | DocScrutinizer | achipa: afaik Nokia uses DHL for all but inland. The first mail with DHL tracking number and shipment info comes from _Nokia_ as the carrier doesn't know about the adressee's email |
| 10:26.06 | alterego | Though you have repeaters, rows, columns, tablets etc. |
| 10:26.11 | alterego | s/tablets/grids/ |
| 10:26.13 | hiemanshu | alterego: this isn't the worse news, I am wondering if I'll have place to sleep at home today, loads of people coming home for the house warming, and then move my house starting next week |
| 10:26.29 | achipa | DocScrutinizer: for all except where it doesn't... :) |
| 10:26.37 | alterego | hiemanshu: :/ |
| 10:28.23 | DocScrutinizer | achipa: I consider it careless behaviour of customer to receive a "got shipped" notification from Nokia but no actual tracking details, and not to inform Nokia about the fact the parcel isn't under control anymore |
| 10:28.52 | DocScrutinizer | achipa: <DocScrutinizer> lardman: I got >>Your order has been sent<< from:"no.reply-developer@nokia.com" <no.reply-developer@nokia.com> at 2011-07-06 12:43 --- and >>Ticket for order OID-052736<< from "joan.bon d ad@nokia.com" at 2011-07-06 12:44 |
| 10:28.58 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I had a link in that e-mail which contained tracking details. |
| 10:29.31 | cpscotti | Hey DocScrutinizer, one question.. is #harmattan being logged somewhere? |
| 10:29.44 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: the first mail in ^^^ had NO tracking details, they came with 2nd mail from joan |
| 10:29.46 | achipa | cpscotti: everything is logged |
| 10:30.03 | DocScrutinizer | cpscotti: see /topic |
| 10:30.14 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, yes. |
| 10:30.38 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, but it is still sent from someone@nokia.com |
| 10:30.44 | cpscotti | ~logs |
| 10:30.44 | infobot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/%23harmattan/ Lines starting with spaces are not logged. Logs are updated daily. |
| 10:30.46 | Venemo | I could click on the link |
| 10:30.57 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: ergo if somebody got first mail, but is waiting for second mail longer than 1 day, odds are DHL already delivered to the naighbour |
| 10:30.57 | cpscotti | achipa, DocScrutinizer thanks |
| 10:30.59 | Venemo | and then I could see what DHL did |
| 10:31.09 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, now that sounds like a mistake |
| 10:35.08 | cpscotti | fails miserably at finding the log.. 404 on the link |
| 10:35.32 | cpscotti | not 24 hours yet? |
| 10:38.18 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: http://ibot.rikers.org/#harmattan/ |
| 10:38.43 | hiemanshu | %23 doesn't work for some reason |
| 10:39.28 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, I tried with # too.. it's empty. if you go to http://ibot.rikers.org/ there's no harmattan |
| 10:39.42 | hiemanshu | hmm yhea |
| 10:39.43 | hiemanshu | checking |
| 10:39.46 | cpscotti | maybe it's because infobot's been here for less than 24hrs? |
| 10:39.54 | hiemanshu | probably |
| 10:40.04 | hiemanshu | there was none when I checked yesterday |
| 10:40.50 | DocScrutinizer | hiemanshu: I got transcoding issues on KDE with %23<->#, usually I ned to swap all %23 to # and vice versa, in browser URL, after clicking such an URL in IRC |
| 10:40.57 | lardman | Venemo: yeah I only received one email though |
| 10:41.42 | DocScrutinizer | cpscotti: indeed there's probably no log yet as infobot just joined recently |
| 10:41.43 | cpscotti | ok, so.. no logs I'm going to ask a the same question someone probably asked before. Anyone knows how to lock a QWidget (!QML) app in portrait/landscape in harmattan? |
| 10:41.46 | hiemanshu | DocScrutinizer: ja, but no such thing exists, maybe wait longer |
| 10:42.08 | DocScrutinizer | ~logs |
| 10:42.08 | infobot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/%23harmattan/ Lines starting with spaces are not logged. Logs are updated daily. |
| 10:42.18 | DocScrutinizer | >> Logs are updated daily.<< |
| 10:42.20 | cpscotti | yep.. |
| 10:42.21 | cpscotti | hehe |
| 10:42.26 | cpscotti | I was about to paste that |
| 10:42.50 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: hold on, giving you link to code |
| 10:43.03 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, thx! |
| 10:43.22 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: https://github.com/hiemanshu/komedia/blob/master/main.cpp |
| 10:43.27 | hiemanshu | that seemed to work for harmattan too |
| 10:43.47 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: and https://github.com/hiemanshu/komedia/blob/master/mainwindow.cpp |
| 10:43.55 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: thats the function code |
| 10:44.29 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, tried that one alread.. but it doesn't |
| 10:44.39 | cpscotti | and there's even a comment there saying: // Note that this will only have an effect on Symbian and Fremantle. |
| 10:44.40 | cpscotti | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:45.22 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: when people tested this on the N9 protos, it seemed to work fine |
| 10:45.48 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, weird.. maybe I'm missing something here.. let me look |
| 10:46.10 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: its the default code from the Maemo 5 QtSDK setting lock to landscape |
| 10:49.37 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, did u see this? http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=24627&postcount=6 |
| 10:50.26 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: I wonder how they worked on the N9 protos then :/ |
| 10:52.17 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, same here but you know, I'd say "there is a way". I just wanted to use my old qwidget ui that compiles/runs fine on it.. I guess I'll have to go qml sooner than expected |
| 10:53.03 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: qwidget runs fine? I mean it looks fine? |
| 10:54.34 | cpscotti | hiemanshu, well, the only actual QWidget is a QGraphicsScene and then all else is painted inside/on top of it.. |
| 10:54.41 | cpscotti | so it looks exactly the same |
| 10:55.52 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: ah |
| 10:55.55 | cpscotti | you can rotate a whole scene cant you.. :D "graphicsView->rotate(-90);" |
| 10:56.43 | cpscotti | voila! |
| 10:58.37 | hiemanshu | cpscotti: hah |
| 10:59.39 | alterego | Urgh, zehjotkah is flooding twitter with random crap |
| 11:01.57 | lcuk | alterego, gestures o nthe keyboard! |
| 11:02.28 | alterego | So the Nokia N8 has been given Dolby Digital Plus as well |
| 11:02.33 | alterego | So much for the N9 being the first? |
| 11:02.40 | alterego | bbiab |
| 11:23.02 | MohammadAG | alterego, one of the main selling points afaik |
| 11:25.44 | DocScrutinizer | should finally test hs-audio of 950 |
| 11:26.21 | MohammadAG | should get his N950 |
| 11:26.55 | DocScrutinizer | I probably had to shoot me if N9 had a similar monster bug in wired headset circuitry like FR had, and I was just in time noticing it to tell "hah you sold half a mio crap already" |
| 11:34.34 | DocScrutinizer | stereo recording is nice, even with video |
| 11:34.58 | DocScrutinizer | hard though to tell what dolby does for it, as you can't switch "live" |
| 11:35.33 | DocScrutinizer | going to settings where "dolby" switch sits will pause video playback |
| 11:37.30 | alterego | wonders what n9seconds.com is about .. |
| 11:44.19 | *** join/#harmattan TheBootroo (53914532@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.145.69.50) |
| 11:44.27 | cpscotti | alterego, http://www.youtube.com/nokia ? |
| 11:44.32 | TheBootroo | the N950 doesnt support .avi |
| 11:44.40 | cpscotti | alterego, I clicked "Need help" and it took me there |
| 11:44.46 | alterego | Yeah |
| 11:44.54 | TheBootroo | is there a missing gstreamer plugin i could load to read them ? |
| 11:49.38 | TheBootroo | can i add debian repos to harmattan (which serie ? lenny squeeze ... ) to install missing packages |
| 11:50.07 | cpscotti | withdrawals comment on n950 gps. That was just the "smart" Location thing. Truth lies behind QGeoPositionInfoSource::SatellitePositioningMethods ... :/ |
| 11:50.36 | kimju | TheBootroo, no you can not |
| 11:51.15 | kimju | it is not a debian, and it also requires an aegis manifest within the .debs |
| 11:52.54 | frals | alterego: win a nokia smartphone! ;-) |
| 11:53.53 | TheBootroo | kimju: shit |
| 11:54.09 | TheBootroo | so i can do nothin until nokia decide to open the store |
| 11:54.30 | MohammadAG | err, you're a dev, this isn't a consumer device |
| 11:54.38 | MohammadAG | compile gstreamer, build packages and install them |
| 11:54.41 | kimju | you can recompile things with the sdk. |
| 11:54.56 | kimju | copy them over to the device and install |
| 11:55.33 | TheBootroo | compile gstreamer.... you foolish mad insane guys |
| 11:55.40 | TheBootroo | i compile pure qt apps |
| 11:55.46 | kimju | be sure to enable "allow installing packages from other sources" or something like that in the settings |
| 11:55.46 | TheBootroo | gstreamer is huge |
| 11:55.50 | frals | dpkg-buildpackage |
| 11:55.55 | frals | -> coffe -> profit |
| 11:56.36 | kimju | but so far I haven't been able to replace an existing package on device |
| 11:56.54 | kimju | been trying to make couple of changes to meego-terminal |
| 11:57.13 | TheBootroo | kimju: i already hacked the device |
| 11:57.18 | TheBootroo | connected in root ssh with winscp |
| 11:57.55 | TheBootroo | modified the theme to remove 'developer device' stamp, re-add close button (i missed it), and enable landscape more |
| 11:58.42 | TheBootroo | but i can't find the image file for the status bar si the is yet developer device there which avoid me to read the network status |
| 11:58.49 | TheBootroo | need to find the file and fix it |
| 11:59.05 | kimju | did you document what you did? |
| 11:59.07 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 11:59.17 | kimju | I'd like to make those changes too :) |
| 11:59.24 | Venemo | hahah |
| 11:59.27 | Venemo | hiemanshu, you're gonna hate me |
| 12:04.53 | cpscotti | Venemo, got yours? |
| 12:04.58 | TheBootroo | kimju: not documented yet, but i will if one say me its safe to publish this kind of hacks |
| 12:05.02 | Venemo | yep |
| 12:05.19 | Venemo | sooner than I expected, I might add |
| 12:05.37 | cpscotti | o/ |
| 12:06.55 | Venemo | very nice indeed, but portrait-only is a bit, well, a lot more than a bit, annoying |
| 12:07.28 | MohammadAG | <TheBootroo> compile gstreamer.... you foolish mad insane guys |
| 12:07.33 | TheBootroo | Venemo: i agree |
| 12:07.37 | MohammadAG | you asked for the device so you could develop for it :p |
| 12:07.47 | MohammadAG | Venemo, just change the style |
| 12:08.02 | TheBootroo | Venemo: overall for music reader : i can no more put my phone on a stand and use it plugged in my HIFI |
| 12:08.26 | TheBootroo | MohammadAG: develop with gstreamer is not in my plans |
| 12:08.36 | Venemo | MohammadAG, that I will |
| 12:08.48 | Venemo | nah, the screen quality is _VERY_ good |
| 12:08.51 | MohammadAG | you're not developing with gstreamer, you're just compiling it |
| 12:08.54 | MohammadAG | Venemo, you got it? |
| 12:09.03 | kimju | MohammadAG, mostly it seemed to be "develop apps", not lower level stuff.. |
| 12:09.14 | Venemo | MohammadAG, yes, it has arrived 5 minutes ago |
| 12:09.24 | MohammadAG | kimju, technically, it's just a ./configure && make away |
| 12:09.31 | MohammadAG | he's not delving into gstreamer's headers |
| 12:09.48 | Venemo | touchscreen is very responsive |
| 12:09.51 | MohammadAG | Venemo, didn't your DDP page say new order yesterday? |
| 12:09.59 | TheBootroo | MohammadAG: and must install all millions of dependancies by compiling them too... |
| 12:10.27 | Venemo | MohammadAG, yesterday morning yes. |
| 12:10.34 | TheBootroo | hum |
| 12:10.34 | Venemo | MohammadAG, then yesterday afternoon they sent it |
| 12:11.29 | TheBootroo | i'm quite sure i could tweaks Swipe this way : left swip shows switcher, right show events, bottom show launcher, and top show status menu |
| 12:12.08 | flux | thebootroo, you may find that less than trivial, given that the swipe plugin of mcompositor is closed.. |
| 12:12.14 | flux | but maybe you can reimplement it. |
| 12:12.52 | TheBootroo | flux: nope |
| 12:13.11 | TheBootroo | flux: all swipe behavior is stored in CSS files so opened BTW |
| 12:13.13 | Venemo | no X button to quickly close apps is also a bit weird |
| 12:13.21 | TheBootroo | just a matter of trials and reboot |
| 12:13.28 | flux | thebootroo, oh, nice. I guess the plugin is sufficiently versatile then already :) |
| 12:13.41 | TheBootroo | Venemo: just edit one css file to get the X back, i did it |
| 12:13.48 | cpscotti | Venemo, I missed the X too.. but you get used quickly |
| 12:14.02 | Venemo | TheBootroo, ok, please educate me |
| 12:14.23 | Venemo | good thing is that long-press close in task manager is not as annyoing as I imagined it to be |
| 12:14.29 | TheBootroo | Venemo: wait i search the file |
| 12:14.43 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I can unlock this one while it sits on the table. |
| 12:14.55 | Venemo | oh, and the hingle looks better than on Doc's pics |
| 12:15.27 | Venemo | I wonder what the QML code on the box does |
| 12:15.32 | TheBootroo | Venemo: edit /usr/share/themes/blanco/meegotouch/libmeegotouchviews/style/mnavigationbarstyle.css |
| 12:15.56 | TheBootroo | and seek line 'has-close-button' |
| 12:16.02 | TheBootroo | and set it to true |
| 12:16.09 | TheBootroo | save and reboot |
| 12:16.24 | TheBootroo | you will have close button in all non fullscreen apps |
| 12:16.30 | Venemo | TheBootroo, okay, sounds good |
| 12:16.37 | Venemo | what do I do to get landscape mode? |
| 12:16.49 | TheBootroo | Venemo: wait |
| 12:17.04 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: I also can unlock it when on table, I can't though when plugged in to USB |
| 12:17.10 | Venemo | aah. |
| 12:17.11 | DocScrutinizer | well, "can't" |
| 12:17.21 | Venemo | TheBootroo, I think X-Fade published some CSS tweaks for that |
| 12:17.28 | DocScrutinizer | AND it's sitting on table |
| 12:17.44 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: and I wonder how your hinge can look better than mine |
| 12:18.04 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, maybe it's just the picture quality |
| 12:18.08 | TheBootroo | Venemo: create a /usr/share/themes/blanco/meegotouch/meegotouchhome/style/meegotouchhome.css containing "MainWindowStyle { locked-orientation: ""; } |
| 12:18.20 | DocScrutinizer | mediaplayer is all Hana Montana pink, has obviously no playlist to edit |
| 12:18.24 | TheBootroo | Venemo: don't works for all apps though |
| 12:18.35 | DocScrutinizer | and stops music when unplugging headset - hahaha |
| 12:18.40 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: you can change that color |
| 12:18.49 | Venemo | TheBootroo, http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3756&page=2 |
| 12:19.38 | Venemo | hm, what's the root pw? |
| 12:19.46 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, that is nice |
| 12:20.05 | DocScrutinizer | I'm btw undecided about dolby for headphones really is a cool thing |
| 12:20.10 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I hate when I unplug it accidentally and then everyone on the train/bus/university class will hear my music |
| 12:20.17 | TheBootroo | lets hope some1 will publish a complete theme for harmaatn supporting both modes and ux more like maemo5 one (with titlebar and home and close buttons) |
| 12:20.29 | *** join/#harmattan nyr_ (anyrhine@rat.hole.fi) |
| 12:20.51 | DocScrutinizer | TheBootroo: ++ |
| 12:21.02 | Venemo | so, wut's the root pw? |
| 12:21.09 | TheBootroo | Venemo: rootme |
| 12:21.13 | DocScrutinizer | triple+ for closebutton |
| 12:21.15 | TheBootroo | like old 770 |
| 12:21.19 | DocScrutinizer | rootme |
| 12:21.47 | DocScrutinizer | the command is devel-su |
| 12:22.02 | Venemo | mhm |
| 12:22.07 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: i'm looking forward on how i could have the titlebar back on all apps, and the close button on top right instead of bottom left |
| 12:22.15 | Venemo | I just used the ssh root@localhost as recommended by the others |
| 12:22.30 | DocScrutinizer | recommended? |
| 12:22.44 | Venemo | by Jaffa and X-Fade |
| 12:22.48 | DocScrutinizer | I guess that's been the last resort rather than a "recommendation" |
| 12:24.10 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: for the pinky music player, just edit /usr/share/themes/blanco/meegotouch/constants.ini, on line "COLOR_ACCENT12 = #CC09BA ; Music" |
| 12:24.41 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: i'm trying to build a complete harmattan theme map |
| 12:24.52 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: to help on tweaking deep the UX |
| 12:28.34 | Venemo | hm, why doesn't nano quit on Ctrl+Shift+X |
| 12:30.01 | DocScrutinizer | aah, while you mention it... |
| 12:30.11 | DocScrutinizer | does a apt-cache search mc |
| 12:30.43 | DocScrutinizer | MEH |
| 12:31.05 | DocScrutinizer | I feel with TheBootroo regarding poorly populated repos |
| 12:32.23 | TheBootroo | true, the repos even lacks usual dev tool (OSS) like leafpad, aptitude,etc |
| 12:32.51 | Venemo | hm |
| 12:32.58 | DocScrutinizer | I don't ask for polished click-the-icon GUI apps, but you'd think a devel-machine comes with (at least access to) a wealth of cmdline tools popular at developers |
| 12:33.08 | Venemo | I did both that you recommended, and yet I still get neither an X nor landscape support... |
| 12:33.13 | Venemo | I also rebooted |
| 12:35.35 | TheBootroo | landscape support is only for menu and events |
| 12:35.36 | DocScrutinizer | actually the "here's your gcc, for the rest you know where to get source of bash etc" stanza isn't really popular - except maybe for gentoo - even in developer community |
| 12:36.05 | TheBootroo | x button is only in apps having already a bottom bar (as flux reader, calendar, mails...) |
| 12:36.08 | Jaffa | hasn't "recommended" ssh root@localhost. |
| 12:36.21 | Jaffa | It was the first one we used before 'devel-su' was found to actually work. |
| 12:36.28 | DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: I'd be surprised if you had |
| 12:36.29 | Jaffa | uses 'devel-su' all the time now |
| 12:36.54 | DocScrutinizer | :-) |
| 12:38.15 | DocScrutinizer | jr@halley:~> cat `which whichgrep` |
| 12:38.16 | DocScrutinizer | #!/bin/sh |
| 12:38.18 | DocScrutinizer | find `echo $PATH|tr ":" " "` -name "$1" |
| 12:38.45 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, okay, connected to usb, sitting on table, locked with the power key. double tap on touchscreen does wake it up and I can unlock. |
| 12:39.17 | DocScrutinizer | whichgrep '*su*' |
| 12:40.28 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: sorry when I'm not feeling like talking you thru reproducing the interference issue me and a few others have seen |
| 12:40.57 | Venemo | no problem... |
| 12:41.04 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: it obviously depends on your table, on WHICH usb device you connected to, and a lot of other things |
| 12:41.48 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: plus I never stated it was impossible to unlock with the particular setup, it's just unreliable |
| 12:42.25 | Venemo | ah |
| 12:42.26 | Venemo | weird |
| 12:42.35 | Venemo | anyway I'm glad I haven't seen the issue |
| 12:42.39 | DocScrutinizer | as is selecting entries of long menus or generally clicking on buttons |
| 12:42.49 | Venemo | mhm |
| 12:43.53 | DocScrutinizer | and I have a lot of EMI-generating devices in a maybe 50cm radius from 950 |
| 12:44.01 | Venemo | haha! apps grid is buggy in landscape |
| 12:44.50 | dm8tbr | hmm is the RSS feed reader known to be b0rken? |
| 12:45.13 | dm8tbr | my feeds are not loading |
| 12:46.03 | DocScrutinizer | haha, I accidentally joined #! |
| 12:46.22 | DocScrutinizer | all hail to shebang |
| 12:47.11 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: apps grid? |
| 12:47.56 | Venemo | the homescreen on which there are icons |
| 12:48.13 | TheBootroo | which #ifdef can i use to identity harmattan N |
| 12:51.29 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: what's buggy with it? it just stays in portrait |
| 12:51.45 | DocScrutinizer | like almost everything else |
| 12:53.04 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, if I set it to also rotate to landscape, it becomes buggy and doesn't repaint icons correctly when I rotateit |
| 12:53.15 | TheBootroo | Venemo: i have same problem |
| 12:54.00 | Venemo | nah. it seems that making the css invalid also prevents meegotouchhome from working.... |
| 12:54.02 | Venemo | hehe |
| 12:54.07 | Venemo | how do I reflash? |
| 12:55.03 | DocScrutinizer | HAHAHAHAHA |
| 12:55.11 | Venemo | or maybe I could edit the file once more through SSH? :D |
| 12:55.12 | Venemo | lol |
| 12:55.14 | DocScrutinizer | that's unfair - you topped my record |
| 12:55.31 | Venemo | record of what? |
| 12:55.40 | DocScrutinizer | of time-to-brick |
| 12:56.03 | Venemo | it is not bricked yet, just the home process can't launch |
| 12:56.10 | Venemo | but I can connect to usb, select SDK mode |
| 12:56.24 | DocScrutinizer | cool sh*t |
| 12:56.34 | Venemo | so it's only semi-bricked |
| 12:56.50 | DocScrutinizer | wonders wtf is sdk-mode |
| 12:57.01 | Venemo | usb networking |
| 12:57.20 | DocScrutinizer | uhuhm so why it's called sdk-mode? |
| 12:57.37 | Venemo | dunno... |
| 12:58.14 | DocScrutinizer | I wonder if the SDK actually directly links to the device via networking, in a more than stupid way |
| 12:58.39 | DocScrutinizer | like - duh- remote-gdb? |
| 12:59.26 | DocScrutinizer | I wish I had another 30GB of free space on my rootfs, to test all that intriguing stuff |
| 12:59.33 | Venemo | hehe |
| 13:00.19 | DocScrutinizer | probably I shuld get a dedicated machine and install (YUCK!) buntkuh on it, just for Nokia |
| 13:00.35 | Venemo | what's that? |
| 13:01.36 | TheBootroo | yeah what the f* is buntkuh |
| 13:02.29 | DocScrutinizer | kubuntu-uh |
| 13:03.20 | DocScrutinizer | (also a less usual word for a checkered cow) |
| 13:05.03 | DocScrutinizer | NB flasher-3.5.11 has *no* .tgz "for non-debian-based systems" |
| 13:05.52 | DocScrutinizer | the support for anything other than buntkuh seems marginal - obviously inside Nokia linux==ubuntu |
| 13:06.30 | Venemo | well |
| 13:06.37 | Venemo | the SDK worked for me on Fedora |
| 13:06.53 | Venemo | I think you can just extract the .deb on non-debian |
| 13:07.04 | DocScrutinizer | I think I can, yes |
| 13:07.20 | MohammadAG | MeeGo isn't exactly better |
| 13:07.29 | Venemo | ? |
| 13:07.34 | MohammadAG | all sources are rpm based, so inside Intel linux==fedora |
| 13:07.50 | Venemo | opensuse is also rpm based, and so are others |
| 13:08.06 | DocScrutinizer | similarly evil approach |
| 13:08.19 | MohammadAG | Debian is deb based, we're not discussing which distros use what |
| 13:08.31 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, I think inside meego linux==suse |
| 13:08.46 | DocScrutinizer | which actually has a certain appeal for me |
| 13:08.50 | DocScrutinizer | ;-P |
| 13:09.20 | MohammadAG | so suffer the Harmattan pains |
| 13:09.56 | DocScrutinizer | meh, for now it seems there's plain nuttin, at least in repos |
| 13:10.25 | MohammadAG | I thought there were no repos |
| 13:10.32 | MohammadAG | we need a -devel repo |
| 13:10.46 | DocScrutinizer | so I couldn't care less about whether to download a .deb and do dpkg -i, or to dl a .rpm and do whatever they use on meego |
| 13:10.57 | MohammadAG | rpm -i |
| 13:11.12 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, or zypper, or yum or whatever |
| 13:11.13 | MohammadAG | point is |
| 13:11.23 | MohammadAG | zypper is like apt, rpm is like dpkg |
| 13:11.28 | DocScrutinizer | point is, there are no repos for now ;-P |
| 13:12.03 | MohammadAG | anyway, point is, you need Fedora/OpenSUSE for MeeGo, Ubuntu for Harmattan |
| 13:12.11 | DocScrutinizer | we need a tools repo, the -devel repo seems on its way |
| 13:12.15 | MohammadAG | except the Harmattan SDK works well on Fedora |
| 13:12.42 | Jaffa | Joy. Mail's now aborting when I click "Refresh" |
| 13:12.52 | DocScrutinizer | haha |
| 13:13.03 | flux | you can just run whatever distribution you need in a virtual machine anyway |
| 13:13.20 | flux | well, unless you want to use the more flashy QT tools, then perhaps the native experience is better |
| 13:13.52 | flux | so it's not like you need to change your desktop distribution :) |
| 13:14.53 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: I wonder how hard it can be to e.g set up a "public" buildhost for harmattan and let it run 3 days to build the ~4000 standard linux packages you expect to install on any machine without too much fuss |
| 13:15.33 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, Jebba did that once |
| 13:15.52 | DocScrutinizer | I think Nokia could've done this for the 2000 some devels that try to create a nicely filled ovi appstore for N9 rollout |
| 13:16.11 | *** join/#harmattan Termana_ (~Termana@122.151.73.136) |
| 13:16.42 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: yeah, I know. And it was awesome - and a black day for me when he tore down the whole repo |
| 13:18.03 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: but honestly, shipping me a devel device where I see a big void on apt-cache search bash, that's ridiculous |
| 13:18.25 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, feel free to hand it over :P |
| 13:18.31 | DocScrutinizer | :-P |
| 13:19.24 | DocScrutinizer | don't tease me, I might feel free to rip it insread so I get *some* good info out of it |
| 13:19.44 | DocScrutinizer | s/insread/instead/. |
| 13:20.55 | DocScrutinizer | btw there's also a LP5523 with 9 LED channels on 950 |
| 13:21.22 | DocScrutinizer | just there's no R G B channel anymore but rather they are numbered 0..8 |
| 13:21.53 | TheBootroo | will we be able to switch on / off the flash leds from a torch app, like on N900 ? |
| 13:21.53 | DocScrutinizer | I'll build a 950-KIT later on ;-) |
| 13:22.07 | DocScrutinizer | TheBootroo: that's on my apps list |
| 13:22.14 | DocScrutinizer | I'm sure it is |
| 13:22.17 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: ok cool |
| 13:22.34 | DocScrutinizer | but needs some proper investigations on how much the LEDs can do |
| 13:22.42 | DocScrutinizer | not to fry them |
| 13:22.54 | TheBootroo | teasers says its 20% over the olders |
| 13:22.59 | TheBootroo | more powerfull |
| 13:23.15 | DocScrutinizer | yup, heard sth like that |
| 13:23.16 | TheBootroo | normally a led cant actually fry since it must not heat up |
| 13:23.29 | DocScrutinizer | and they look like a friggin tank |
| 13:23.33 | DocScrutinizer | a monster |
| 13:23.53 | DocScrutinizer | TheBootroo: (not heat up) eh? |
| 13:24.21 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: a led does not emit much heat |
| 13:24.27 | DocScrutinizer | haha |
| 13:24.36 | TheBootroo | kind of +2 ou 3 degree |
| 13:24.47 | DocScrutinizer | still it's the head that limits flash duration on N900 to 0.5s |
| 13:24.56 | DocScrutinizer | heat* |
| 13:25.14 | DocScrutinizer | otherwise those flash LEDs *will* fry |
| 13:26.19 | DocScrutinizer | and that's the reason we had to sensibly take care about reducing current for N900 flashlight app |
| 13:26.21 | TheBootroo | weird |
| 13:26.30 | DocScrutinizer | not at all |
| 13:27.30 | DocScrutinizer | check those 5W LED incandescent bulb replacements when you visit your supermarket next time. They even have a heatsink |
| 13:28.28 | DocScrutinizer | indeed it's basically just the heat that limits how much current you can send to a LED |
| 13:29.18 | DocScrutinizer | well, plus EM and related deterioration, which will reduce the time-to-50% |
| 13:29.52 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: yes but they are 5W led, those of phone arent, obviously |
| 13:30.11 | DocScrutinizer | no, those of phome are probably 1W |
| 13:30.51 | *** join/#harmattan trx (~ns-team@212.200.198.201) |
| 13:32.07 | DocScrutinizer | the flash LED, not those uder kbd for backlight ;-D |
| 13:34.40 | dm8tbr | would be fun if the kbd leds would be like 1W each ;D |
| 13:35.58 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, 1W LAZORZ |
| 13:36.17 | DocScrutinizer | 8 of them |
| 13:36.55 | *** join/#harmattan Termana (Termana@70.32.34.100) |
| 13:38.02 | TheBootroo | u mad |
| 13:38.06 | TheBootroo | :D |
| 13:38.32 | TheBootroo | though, laser pointer integrated would be nice |
| 13:38.47 | dm8tbr | that's so 90s |
| 13:38.56 | TheBootroo | and ? |
| 13:39.05 | TheBootroo | i like 60s to 90s |
| 13:39.08 | dm8tbr | we're in the 10's now |
| 13:39.28 | TheBootroo | yeah i've gone back |
| 13:39.45 | dm8tbr | 'comez with integrated lazzzzor' is not a sales agrument anymore |
| 13:39.49 | TheBootroo | does some1 here plan to port blueMaemo |
| 13:40.16 | TheBootroo | (remote + mouse + keyboard for computer hover bluetooth) |
| 13:41.43 | TheBootroo | and was wondering... has the N950 gstreamer tools usable to test the quality of the front camera ? |
| 13:42.38 | Venemo | MohammadAG, Harmattan worksforme on Fedora |
| 13:42.48 | Venemo | MohammadAG, why would I need bugbuntu? |
| 13:43.25 | Termana | bugbuntu? *rage* :p |
| 13:43.48 | *** join/#harmattan webporttest (57b46821@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.180.104.33) |
| 13:44.20 | webporttest | ~botsnack |
| 13:44.20 | infobot | webporttest: :) |
| 13:44.40 | Venemo | oh, no |
| 13:44.51 | Venemo | swipe is enabled in the browser, making scrolling difficult |
| 13:46.36 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: ?? |
| 13:46.52 | Venemo | when I try to scroll down in the browser |
| 13:46.54 | TheBootroo | Venemo: just dont go near the border |
| 13:46.59 | Venemo | I accidentally activate swipe |
| 13:47.04 | TheBootroo | but i find swipe quite annoying too |
| 13:47.04 | Venemo | heh |
| 13:47.13 | Venemo | it is very good otherwise |
| 13:47.59 | Venemo | the browser is definitely faster |
| 13:48.09 | TheBootroo | but sometimes buggy |
| 13:48.32 | TheBootroo | on google reader mobile, it sometimes crashes when loading a random new |
| 13:48.41 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: a swipe starts "outside" the screen, while a flick/scroll starts *inside* |
| 13:48.56 | DocScrutinizer | there's no way to accidentally mix up the two |
| 13:48.58 | Venemo | mhm |
| 13:49.12 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: actually, there is |
| 13:49.13 | Venemo | in N900, is used to start flick outside the screen to. |
| 13:49.14 | Venemo | too* |
| 13:49.23 | TheBootroo | Venemo: me too |
| 13:50.38 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: yeah, and it also doesn't know the gesture to enable cursor-mode to highlight text etc |
| 13:50.55 | Venemo | a pity, I hope they'll add it later |
| 13:51.04 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: no way |
| 13:51.13 | TheBootroo | Venemo: +100 |
| 13:51.23 | DocScrutinizer | TheBootroo: ?? |
| 13:51.29 | TheBootroo | really missed this feature that morning |
| 13:51.41 | macmaN | DocScrutinizer: got into nokia accounts yet? |
| 13:51.45 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: there is no way to do it AT |
| 13:51.48 | TheBootroo | *ATM |
| 13:51.57 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: yup, since monday |
| 13:52.02 | macmaN | WHAT |
| 13:52.05 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: they fixed sth on their server |
| 13:52.06 | macmaN | how? |
| 13:52.25 | macmaN | i just tried, still the same BS for me |
| 13:52.29 | Venemo | scrolling is a _lot_ more smooth, no nearing, etc. |
| 13:52.35 | macmaN | wtf what do i do to get in goddamn |
| 13:53.31 | Venemo | will it add RSS to the events view? |
| 13:53.40 | TheBootroo | Venemo: already done |
| 13:53.47 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: I tried with my existing account (like I did last week) and on monday that worked. Haven't bothered to check if "create new account" also works now |
| 13:53.59 | TheBootroo | Venemo: just edit each feed and activate 'show in home page' option |
| 13:54.04 | Venemo | TheBootroo, aaah, nice |
| 13:54.12 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: OR... it was related to my reflash ;-) |
| 13:54.20 | TheBootroo | Venemo: but i hope they will add Google reader support very soon |
| 13:54.27 | macmaN | DocScrutinizer: right, im starting to wonder about that too |
| 13:54.27 | Venemo | haha, "Oops! The browser experienced a problem while showing this page." |
| 13:54.48 | macmaN | i wonder if i should take the plunge and reflash this biatchz |
| 13:55.05 | DocScrutinizer | go for it, it's fun |
| 13:55.40 | Venemo | oh noo! |
| 13:55.46 | DocScrutinizer | also test Nokia account signin and creation immediately before and after |
| 13:55.49 | Venemo | it opens m.facebook.com instead of regular facebook |
| 13:55.52 | TheBootroo | Venemo: wazup ? |
| 13:56.13 | Venemo | TheBootroo, I entered facebook.com and it redirected to m.facebook.com |
| 13:56.16 | TheBootroo | Venemo: you have on a real facebook app so what the website matters ? |
| 13:56.19 | DocScrutinizer | UAAARG |
| 13:56.30 | TheBootroo | Venemo: type touch.facebook.com |
| 13:56.58 | DocScrutinizer | unlocked and what do I see? Hannah Montana pink all over the musicplayer screen that's open there |
| 13:57.08 | DocScrutinizer | *shocking* |
| 13:57.19 | TheBootroo | DocScrutinizer: damn |
| 13:57.45 | DocScrutinizer | TheBootroo: I didn't yet follow your advice |
| 13:58.40 | *** join/#harmattan Stskeeps (~cvm@Maemo/community/distmaster/Stskeeps) |
| 13:59.11 | TheBootroo | does the n950 add the contacts birthday into a special agenda ? |
| 13:59.19 | TheBootroo | (like N900 used to) |
| 14:02.19 | macmaN | DocScrutinizer: mind updating http://www.developer.nokia.com/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=234 with your information? |
| 14:02.28 | lcuk | in Harmattan, if I have an app which is made up of multiple panels, is the swipe gesture available for use to slide through them? |
| 14:02.40 | lcuk | (I already tested in liqbase but wondering about proper way) |
| 14:02.45 | alterego | lcuk: yes, like columbus, I use swiping. |
| 14:02.55 | alterego | lcuk: it's just apps are desensitive at the edges. |
| 14:02.56 | macmaN | lcuk: i think you need to swipe in-screen, not edges |
| 14:02.58 | DocScrutinizer | sure thing |
| 14:03.03 | *** join/#harmattan harbaum (~quassel@et-1-20.gw-nat.bs.kae.de.oneandone.net) |
| 14:03.11 | alterego | Literally 8 pixels or something. |
| 14:03.13 | lcuk | shame |
| 14:03.14 | harbaum | Does anyone know how to disable the n950 lock code? I have set one (as the exchange setup asked me to do so), but i would like to disable it again |
| 14:03.17 | Venemo | I could get used to portrait-only for a device without a keyboard... but for the N950 it just disturbes my concentration. |
| 14:03.29 | lcuk | it would be nice to have all the apps in the global swipe list |
| 14:04.24 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: overriding systemwide basic gestures probably isn't really a good idea |
| 14:04.38 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, that was not what I said! |
| 14:04.55 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I mean, there's just no other way to jump to another app than swipe |
| 14:04.56 | Venemo | for apps that use swiping, it is recommended to do so. |
| 14:05.26 | lcuk | but if I have calendar open, it should be available in the Events|Launch|AppsGrid list -> Calendar|Events|Launch|AppsGrid |
| 14:05.33 | lcuk | etc for other apps too |
| 14:05.34 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: so if your app is hijacking swipe, it basically has hijacked the device |
| 14:06.34 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, I have tested this on my n900 and ideapad so far, no n950 here yet |
| 14:06.40 | lcuk | just talking |
| 14:06.52 | macmaN | did anyone attempt connecting n950 with ovi suite yet |
| 14:07.05 | macmaN | i wonder if the backup system works in any way at all |
| 14:07.10 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: on N9 the screen with swipes is all we got |
| 14:07.12 | macmaN | it created 13 MB file of something.. |
| 14:07.20 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, for now. |
| 14:07.31 | DocScrutinizer | how would you quit your swipe-hijacker app whenever it goes mad |
| 14:07.39 | macmaN | btw. did any attempt installing ranger for file-management |
| 14:07.51 | macmaN | (its on github) |
| 14:07.55 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, read the nokia documentation |
| 14:07.56 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, SSH, and kill command |
| 14:08.00 | lcuk | swipe can be disabled |
| 14:08.03 | macmaN | i didnt get gentoo prefix + py 2.6 on n900 so i didnt get to try it out |
| 14:08.06 | lcuk | there are documents relating to it |
| 14:08.08 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: haha |
| 14:08.19 | lcuk | since swiping is not always desired in games etc |
| 14:08.44 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I believe you there's a way to do it - I question though if it's a good or sane thing to do it |
| 14:08.54 | lcuk | https://www.developer.nokia.com/swipe/ux/pages/Full_Screen.html |
| 14:09.00 | lcuk | it is needed for some things |
| 14:09.06 | lcuk | and documented |
| 14:09.15 | lcuk | ie, whilst playing a game like angry birds |
| 14:09.22 | lcuk | you misswipe accidentally and cuss at the device |
| 14:09.34 | lcuk | so proper thing is to hijack (in your words) and disable swiping |
| 14:09.38 | lcuk | until the game is paused |
| 14:09.47 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I agree on this |
| 14:10.01 | DocScrutinizer | just saying it's generally not a really good idea |
| 14:10.09 | Venemo | lcuk, Doc's question was, how do you quit angry birds when it crashes while it had disabled swipe |
| 14:10.10 | DocScrutinizer | except for such special cases |
| 14:10.41 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: yes |
| 14:10.54 | macmaN | ok i guess not. |
| 14:11.11 | macmaN | so what are you guys currently doing for replacing down-swipe=close-app |
| 14:11.35 | Venemo | well, I'm liking my N950 very much :) |
| 14:11.53 | Venemo | "Not for sale, Developer device" just makes it sexy |
| 14:12.54 | *** join/#harmattan arcean (~Arcean@aafv133.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 14:13.16 | macmaN | so apt-get install just says unable to get lock resource temporarily unavailable |
| 14:13.33 | Venemo | Jaffa, if I sync my contacts between N900 and N950 with your method, will it also sync the IM contacts? |
| 14:14.33 | Venemo | LoL @ Settings / About product / Warranty |
| 14:15.10 | *** join/#harmattan cpscotti (~cpscotti@212.36.161.100) |
| 14:15.42 | Jaffa | Venemo: Not sure. |
| 14:17.25 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: heh |
| 14:18.21 | DocScrutinizer | ^Q closes app |
| 14:18.25 | DocScrutinizer | FWIW |
| 14:19.00 | DocScrutinizer | tested with web and music |
| 14:19.06 | DocScrutinizer | and settings |
| 14:19.14 | macmaN | ok you mean "clunkily open keyboard hit awkward keycombo ^Q smooth close keyboard" instead of just swipe down |
| 14:19.18 | macmaN | :) |
| 14:19.26 | macmaN | thanks for the tip, didnt know about it |
| 14:19.32 | macmaN | (seriously) |
| 14:19.38 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: I mean nuttin |
| 14:19.56 | DocScrutinizer | I say I just accidentally found out ^Q is closing apps |
| 14:20.06 | macmaN | oh :) |
| 14:21.03 | DocScrutinizer | while "blue"-bs seems to jump to appstarter |
| 14:22.00 | DocScrutinizer | and typing in taskswitcher starts search |
| 14:22.29 | DocScrutinizer | actually typing in any of the 3 basic screens starts search |
| 14:22.57 | Venemo | mhm |
| 14:23.19 | DocScrutinizer | and blue-BS kicks you back to last screen, not always = appstarted |
| 14:26.40 | macmaN | apt-get install came to life again after reboot |
| 14:26.47 | *** part/#harmattan arcean (~Arcean@aafv133.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 14:26.48 | DocScrutinizer | hah |
| 14:40.52 | macmaN | hmmm i click mail icon in ovi.com, that takes me to yahoo with login myname@ovi.com, no password works, remind password says no such account |
| 14:44.41 | *** join/#harmattan cpscotti (~cpscotti@212.36.161.100) |
| 14:45.15 | Venemo | heh |
| 14:45.18 | Venemo | N950 is not stereo |
| 14:46.45 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: nobody ever said it was |
| 14:46.51 | Venemo | true |
| 14:47.02 | Venemo | :D |
| 14:47.04 | DocScrutinizer | it has steeo recording though |
| 14:47.17 | Venemo | mhm |
| 14:47.41 | DocScrutinizer | which come in quite nice for video |
| 14:47.48 | Venemo | and no landscape mode in 90% of apps, this is still annoying to me |
| 14:48.14 | DocScrutinizer | meh, this is a N9 OS, not optimized for N950 |
| 14:48.36 | DocScrutinizer | you're supposed to ignore the fact this is a N950 ;-) |
| 14:48.43 | Venemo | :P |
| 14:49.02 | Venemo | music playback through headphones is very good, that I must admit |
| 14:49.19 | DocScrutinizer | it's ok |
| 14:49.40 | DocScrutinizer | no EQ though, other than that weird dolby thing |
| 14:50.07 | Khertan_w | someone know if there is a list somewhere of harmattan plateform icon ? |
| 14:50.10 | Venemo | I've never ever used eq |
| 14:51.53 | Venemo | Jaffa, I'll be an eager tester of Hermes :) |
| 14:52.10 | DocScrutinizer | ok, musicplayer uses press of wired hs button for pause/play, and long press for skip+1 |
| 14:53.01 | Venemo | what is wired hs button |
| 14:53.21 | DocScrutinizer | funny how Nokia integrated quite a number of community borne concepts there |
| 14:53.30 | macmaN | my god that yahoo mail account integration is a fuckin mess |
| 14:53.43 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, what is "wired hs button"? |
| 14:53.58 | DocScrutinizer | the button on your wired headset |
| 14:54.18 | Venemo | I have a vired headset? |
| 14:54.24 | Venemo | they only gave a USB with it |
| 14:54.49 | DocScrutinizer | have to find a multibutton wired headset to test multimedia buttons |
| 14:55.10 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: no, I have ~30 wired headsets of all kinds here |
| 14:55.22 | Venemo | ahh, that. |
| 14:55.36 | DocScrutinizer | 50% of them with Nokia-AV compatible jack and pinout |
| 14:55.41 | Venemo | well, I only had the N900's but that has been faulty for some time. |
| 15:11.29 | *** join/#harmattan achipa (~attila@a91-155-185-5.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 15:11.30 | *** join/#harmattan achipa (~attila@Maemo/community/council/achipa) |
| 15:11.53 | Khertan_w | so noone have idea where i can found a list of available icon ? |
| 15:13.25 | Stskeeps | prolly in the theme |
| 15:14.01 | Khertan_w | yeah but the name use in qml differ from the one in the theme |
| 15:14.07 | Khertan_w | but thx for the idea |
| 15:15.03 | Venemo | Khertan_w, /usr/share/icons or /usr/share/pixmaps are good places to start |
| 15:22.00 | cpscotti | Venemo, haha. that's generally what I do too. If you check my app's icons, they are all bad remakes from icons found there.. lol |
| 15:22.21 | Khertan_w | :) |
| 15:22.56 | Venemo | there is also a guy in MeeGo forums who says he's willing to help devs to make icons |
| 15:23.26 | Khertan_w | here the problem is most finding what bloodyhell name have standart theme icon |
| 15:23.51 | Khertan_w | i ll like to use the same icons as the theme for common features |
| 15:34.23 | *** join/#harmattan gri (~gri@p4FCEBB07.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:38.50 | Venemo | great |
| 15:38.58 | Venemo | now we have 3 channels for N950 and harmattan... |
| 15:39.17 | Venemo | those who are not aware of #harmattan use #maemo and #meego ... |
| 15:40.29 | frals | dont get why you created this instead of just sticking with #maemo ;P |
| 15:40.52 | Venemo | frals, I don't get it either, but now that we have it, we should use it |
| 15:55.29 | kimju | hah, weird bugs.. after unlocking the orientation and rebooting. after rotating the device, only about one third of icons are displayed until I swipe to another screen and back :D |
| 16:07.47 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: so make them aware of #harmattan |
| 16:07.54 | DocScrutinizer | :-D |
| 16:08.28 | DocScrutinizer | on #meego you're rather lost with specific harmattan topics |
| 16:09.10 | DocScrutinizer | on #maemo the harmattan stuff thens to spoil S/N ratio for the M5/N900 (as well as N8x0) users |
| 16:09.23 | DocScrutinizer | s/thens/tends/ |
| 16:10.16 | CaCO3 | fACK, I think its good to have a separate channel |
| 16:10.42 | CaCO3 | elsn newbies in #maemo only get unneccessarly confused |
| 16:10.43 | DocScrutinizer | it's so bad that I've frequently seen M5 related requests getting ignored completely on #maemo among all the harmattan chat and "DHL doesn't ship" whining |
| 16:12.10 | DocScrutinizer | while when posting here you don't even make clear you're talking about harmattan and not m5 or meegoCE |
| 16:13.35 | DocScrutinizer | so, for common stuff like QML at large etc, generally for all where meegoCE and harmattan actually don't differ, I'd suggest #meego or #meego-arm, while here is for strictly harmattan-only topics |
| 16:15.00 | CaCO3 | it would be good to cocument that somehow, i.e. in the chanel topics |
| 16:15.11 | CaCO3 | s/cocument/document |
| 16:18.07 | macmaN | basically DocScrutinizer is my hero |
| 16:18.15 | macmaN | he's the reason why i have a chance at nice things |
| 16:20.08 | DocScrutinizer | CaCO3: >>a cozy little place for pure harmattan device discussions << |
| 16:21.07 | achipa | QML at large would be #qt-qml actually |
| 16:21.16 | DocScrutinizer | ok :-) |
| 16:21.40 | DocScrutinizer | I hope you all got my idea nevertheless |
| 16:23.05 | DocScrutinizer | another aspect would be: harmattan is supposed to move towards meegoCE, so eventually this chan will become obsolete and all users will live on #meego(-arm) happily. I wouldn't want to see this happen for #maemo channel |
| 16:25.59 | *** join/#harmattan piggz_ (~piggz@78.25.237.221) |
| 16:38.05 | dm8tbr | DocScrutinizer: sadly IMHO that's wishful thinking. it would be nice to replace the harmattan core with meego but I doubt Nokia is interested in paying developers to do that. and at least some level of cooperation would be necessary |
| 16:39.15 | *** join/#harmattan rcg (~rc@g226029037.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:45.36 | *** join/#harmattan spenap (~spena@cs27063224.pp.htv.fi) |
| 16:46.28 | achipa | and it's actually meego core that is behind at the moment |
| 16:46.28 | spenap | Don't know if this is the best channel to ask, but... is anyone else experiencing a crash when trying to use a QML with a WebView under HARMATTAN targets, in scratchbox? |
| 16:46.55 | spenap | it works fine on device, though |
| 16:47.05 | achipa | Harmattan is lib-wise a Meego 1.2-and-a-half |
| 16:47.23 | achipa | spenap: X86 or ARM ? |
| 16:47.39 | spenap | X86, I didn't try on ARM |
| 16:47.43 | spenap | achipa, ^ |
| 16:48.15 | achipa | yeah, X86 should be the more stable one... no idea then |
| 16:48.29 | achipa | (unless the crash trace reveals something) |
| 16:49.33 | spenap | I tried to debug the crash, and I lead to something in D-Bus, but it wasn't too clear. I can post more details on the issue, but I was kind of expecting some other people experiencing it :) |
| 16:49.43 | spenap | s/I lead/it lead/ |
| 16:52.25 | DocScrutinizer51 | maybe non-user user? |
| 16:52.41 | DocScrutinizer51 | dbus session bus is user specific |
| 16:52.57 | spenap | I'm running it under meego-run |
| 16:53.00 | spenap | should work fine |
| 16:53.51 | spenap | I'll post some test code on a pastebin |
| 16:53.54 | spenap | one sec |
| 16:58.49 | spenap | http://pastebin.com/x20g7u3z, DocScrutinizer51 |
| 16:58.55 | spenap | (and others) |
| 16:59.51 | DocScrutinizer51 | spenap: i'm mobile atm, so hard to do a decent check |
| 17:00.27 | Stskeeps | dm8tbr: i really wonder how much would just work if you dropped in binaries.. |
| 17:00.42 | spenap | oh, nevermind, then: the trace is quite large. However, it ends up with Failed to get sensor manager interface: "The name com.nokia.icd2 was not provided by any .service files" |
| 17:00.43 | DocScrutinizer51 | (there are tasks I'm reluctant to do on my N900) |
| 17:00.45 | spenap | and then segfaults |
| 17:01.28 | Stskeeps | dm8tbr: like, to meego.com on n9/n950 |
| 17:12.05 | dm8tbr | Stskeeps: well if everything is api/abi/whatever compatible you could basically swap out things, yes :) |
| 17:12.20 | Stskeeps | should be |
| 17:12.22 | dm8tbr | only the closed bits would remain |
| 17:12.24 | Stskeeps | not even thumb2, like some claim |
| 17:12.46 | dm8tbr | heh, then it would even run on the n900 ;) |
| 17:17.21 | *** join/#harmattan Atarii (~Atarii@77.107.156.213) |
| 17:57.13 | *** join/#harmattan mzanetti (~micha@2001:4dd0:fddf:0:21c:b3ff:fec3:e17a) |
| 18:18.26 | *** join/#harmattan vilva (~vilva@89.204.153.106) |
| 18:26.11 | ieatlint | some people may find this useful/interesting http://projects.developer.nokia.com/qtinfo |
| 18:29.04 | *** part/#harmattan vilva (~vilva@89.204.153.106) |
| 18:29.56 | DocScrutinizer | yahooo, GPS got a fix after ~15min |
| 18:30.10 | DocScrutinizer | last fix was from 24h ago |
| 18:30.20 | DocScrutinizer | location changed 400m |
| 18:30.41 | DocScrutinizer | this thing clearly needs some love still |
| 18:30.59 | ieatlint | also, if you try that application, you'll be introduced to the genius of Qt gestures. specifically, how to scroll a QScrollArea |
| 18:31.24 | ieatlint | the answer is to put two fingers on the screen and move your fingers on the axis you want to scroll |
| 18:31.28 | DocScrutinizer | it's almost instant (like 5s) with SIM, and seems also with just WLAN - but with neither it's as bad as N900 was in the beginning |
| 18:32.52 | kimju | does it save previously received data somewhere? or does it do cold start always unless you're online? |
| 18:33.10 | DocScrutinizer | I'm not sugesting to debug/evaluate the harmattan-OS (as it's an obsolete version we got anyway), but GPS seems not exactly OS anymore |
| 18:33.29 | DocScrutinizer | kimju: it's *supposed* to store |
| 18:33.38 | DocScrutinizer | kimju:bviously it doesn'ton |
| 18:33.51 | DocScrutinizer | eh? |
| 18:33.59 | DocScrutinizer | obviously it doesn't |
| 18:34.19 | DocScrutinizer | curses touchpad |
| 18:36.43 | kimju | I wonder if there is going to be updated images for n950 when n9 gets released.. |
| 18:45.03 | gri | I wonder if there will ever be docs how to use signon-qt and libaccounts-ui ... *going crazy* |
| 18:48.14 | *** join/#harmattan piggz_ (~piggz@78.25.237.208) |
| 18:54.55 | hiemanshu | piggz_: so I am really really sad :( :( |
| 18:55.15 | piggz_ | hiemanshu: hehe, never mind, maybe tomrrow ) |
| 18:55.18 | piggz_ | :) |
| 18:55.24 | hiemanshu | piggz_: lets hope :P |
| 18:56.13 | frals | gri: https://gitorious.org/accounts-sso/libaccounts-ui/trees/pr1.0 not good enough? |
| 18:58.08 | gri | frals: I managed to get up a ui using libaccounts-ui but I have no idea how the data is stored - I actually get an error message and also have no idea how to debug in scratchbox since QtCreator attach returns "ptrace: Operation not permitted" |
| 18:58.49 | Venemo | any news when we might get an updated image? |
| 18:59.49 | gri | frals: Also libaccounts-ui seems to handle much for the user using config files - but that is neither documented nor do I have a clue what all this code is for |
| 19:00.23 | gri | and I thought the accounts-ui part would be the easiest one to start :P |
| 19:04.58 | Venemo | eh! |
| 19:05.16 | *** join/#harmattan cpscotti (~cpscotti@124.16.112.87.dyn.plus.net) |
| 19:05.37 | Venemo | SHAME ON HARMATTAN DEVS FOR THIS: when I compile my app for Harmattan in Qt Creator, I get a bunch of warings for code in the included header files! |
| 19:05.47 | Venemo | and: |
| 19:05.49 | Venemo | :-1: error: Packaging failed: Foreign debian directory detected. |
| 19:06.06 | DocScrutinizer | kimju: btw there's some aegis storage for location data |
| 19:06.16 | Venemo | achipa, what the f... is this? :-1: error: Packaging failed: Foreign debian directory detected. |
| 19:06.44 | Venemo | achipa, also, the "Skip packaging step" option is once again missing from Qt Creator. |
| 19:07.02 | achipa | ididntdoit |
| 19:07.08 | Venemo | I believe you |
| 19:07.16 | frals | Venemo: dont blame harmattan devs for something the guys doing qtcreator did, please... |
| 19:07.34 | Venemo | frals, QtCreator devs didn't make the header files for Harmattan |
| 19:07.50 | Venemo | anyway, what is, Foreign debian directory detected? |
| 19:07.52 | achipa | also, harmattan IS beta, thats why you have the devkit |
| 19:08.01 | Venemo | indeed, this is why I'm reporting this bug |
| 19:08.03 | Venemo | :P |
| 19:08.15 | achipa | which QtC are you using |
| 19:08.30 | Venemo | 2.2.1 |
| 19:08.37 | Venemo | (newest in Qt SDK) |
| 19:08.39 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: sounds like aegis related ;-P |
| 19:08.55 | Venemo | maybe the problem is that I already have a directory called 'debian' in my project folder? |
| 19:09.00 | achipa | maybe :) |
| 19:09.19 | Venemo | but still, this is a bug |
| 19:09.24 | macmaN | driving a udlfb usb monitor off n950 that would be da bomb |
| 19:10.15 | Venemo | meh, my app looks like hell |
| 19:10.28 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: javispedro (iirc) did that on N900, worked for QVGA or sth |
| 19:10.33 | achipa | I would have to see the thing, but not necessarily - if there is both a 'native' debian dir and the qtcreator one, then the behavior is undefined, so qtc is at least somewhat right about complaining |
| 19:10.37 | DocScrutinizer | with 3 fps |
| 19:10.47 | DocScrutinizer | sth like that |
| 19:11.36 | Venemo | and I get a lot of debug messages from somewhere |
| 19:11.39 | Venemo | like this: |
| 19:11.40 | Venemo | QGLWindowSurface: Flushing to native child widget, may lead to significant performance loss |
| 19:11.50 | Venemo | and indeed, the performance is below any expectations |
| 19:12.08 | achipa | remember, we don't know what you are doing :) |
| 19:12.31 | Venemo | achipa, seriously, could you please take a look? |
| 19:12.40 | Venemo | all I did was compiling and running this: https://gitorious.org/colorful-apps/puzzle-master |
| 19:12.48 | achipa | is it some proxwidget stuff ? |
| 19:12.59 | DocScrutinizer | I never could have guessed ;-P |
| 19:13.07 | Venemo | it's the same app that I've talked about this morning |
| 19:13.19 | Venemo | it has some QWidgets and a QGV |
| 19:13.45 | DocScrutinizer | and iirc we discussed gfx accel issues quite some months ago |
| 19:14.08 | Venemo | yes, we did, for N900 |
| 19:14.14 | Venemo | most of the perf issues were gone on N900 |
| 19:14.18 | Venemo | and also on Symbian |
| 19:14.27 | DocScrutinizer | the situation for N9(50) isn't basically different |
| 19:15.18 | DocScrutinizer | if you use hw accelerated objects, then you have to stay in that domain, not do anything from outside to it |
| 19:15.33 | Venemo | and the N9(50) has twice the clock the N900 on its graphics chip |
| 19:15.41 | Venemo | and still, puzzle-master performs worse on it |
| 19:15.51 | DocScrutinizer | otherwise context switches between gfxaccel and CPU will kill you |
| 19:16.39 | Venemo | I have no idea what that means |
| 19:16.48 | Venemo | but even software rendering is slower |
| 19:17.08 | DocScrutinizer | it's like uploading a whole video buffer to the graca to draw a line there then download to CPU ram again |
| 19:17.18 | Venemo | I understand, but Qt should handle this |
| 19:17.34 | Venemo | something about QWidgets is seriously broken on Harmattan, and that is the problem. |
| 19:17.34 | DocScrutinizer | we found out it's poor on handling this |
| 19:17.50 | Venemo | it may perform better when I rewrite the GUI to QML, according to Khertan_w and achipa |
| 19:17.52 | DocScrutinizer | we also found out Qt is using *floats* for a ll gfx |
| 19:18.03 | Venemo | indeed. |
| 19:18.52 | Venemo | achipa, please try that app on N900 and on N950, and compare the experience |
| 19:18.57 | achipa | Venemo: qwidgets don't really have a budget harmattan-wise - if it works, yay, but don't expect serious work on that front |
| 19:19.44 | DocScrutinizer | so you bet a memcpy is propably faster for elementary gfx functions like move a tile than these highly sophisticated float based Qt gfx widgets |
| 19:20.21 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, well, all I do with gfx is a single line of code. |
| 19:20.59 | Venemo | anyway, I'll rewrite this in QML... but I have no idea where to start :( |
| 19:21.14 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: it's not like I'm dealing with this issue first time - on FreeRunner we had exactly this problem with glamo gfx chip with its crappy GL implementation and memory bus bottleneck |
| 19:21.41 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, this time, every other app is working, so obviously mine is the issue :) |
| 19:21.49 | achipa | Venemo: at the beginning. QML is a giant qgraphicsview |
| 19:22.06 | achipa | Venemo: also, have you tried without opengl ? |
| 19:22.31 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: I suspect you are doing object copying or sth |
| 19:22.46 | Venemo | achipa, [21:16] <Venemo> but even software rendering is slower |
| 19:22.56 | DocScrutinizer | something that makes Qt gfx widgets "dump content to CPU domain" |
| 19:23.16 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I'm doing copying only when the puzzle pieces are merged together. |
| 19:23.23 | Venemo | but that interestingly not slow |
| 19:23.33 | Venemo | however, simply moving the pieces around is very choppy |
| 19:24.17 | achipa | also I see you play around with various QGV flags |
| 19:24.23 | DocScrutinizer | so you'll need to use a tool to find what'S eating most time |
| 19:24.29 | achipa | might not have any effect but... |
| 19:24.40 | Venemo | yes, various flags for optimizing. as I said, working on Maemo 5 and Symbian |
| 19:24.48 | lcuk | Venemo, does your package still support n8x0? |
| 19:24.49 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: some profiler |
| 19:24.50 | Venemo | that code is ifdeffed out for Harmattan |
| 19:24.52 | Venemo | lcuk, yes. |
| 19:25.03 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: dunno if such thing exists for Qt |
| 19:25.12 | lcuk | do you still have n8x0 for comparison with your description of "choppy" |
| 19:25.51 | Venemo | lcuk has a point. with SW rendering, it is even slower than N8x0... I have never tried on a real N8x0 but noone complained about choppiness and it worked in Scratchbox nicely |
| 19:26.36 | Venemo | the problem is this debug output: |
| 19:26.40 | Venemo | QGLWindowSurface: Using plain widget as window surface QGLWindowSurface(0x36b0e0) |
| 19:26.40 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: isn't there a whole bunch of profilers for C(++) programs? |
| 19:26.41 | Venemo | QGLWindowSurface: Flushing to native child widget, may lead to significant performance loss |
| 19:26.59 | achipa | Venemo: so MOBILE is off for harmattan ? |
| 19:27.01 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, the only reasonable visual profiler I have found in linux has been for qml! |
| 19:27.07 | Venemo | for some reason, Qt flushes stuff to somewhere and admits that it will rape my perf |
| 19:27.12 | DocScrutinizer | HAH |
| 19:27.17 | lcuk | and that just shows you what you already know: initialisation of a whole object tree takes time ;) |
| 19:27.33 | DocScrutinizer | HAH again |
| 19:27.45 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@host-94-248-207-98.kabelnet.hu) |
| 19:27.45 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 19:27.50 | DocScrutinizer | maybe we don't need a visual profiler though |
| 19:28.01 | Venemo | meh, this shit disconnected me... :( |
| 19:28.07 | lcuk | gets by with printfs |
| 19:28.16 | DocScrutinizer | yuck |
| 19:28.19 | lcuk | i know my code enough to know and understand where it is slow |
| 19:28.32 | DocScrutinizer | nice for debugging - but profiling? :-o |
| 19:28.40 | DocScrutinizer | hehe |
| 19:29.08 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, i can enable a whole suite of logs around the tile rendering engine |
| 19:29.23 | lcuk | every step of the way about 200 lines per rectangle |
| 19:29.25 | lcuk | ;) |
| 19:29.30 | Venemo | okay, so achipa, if I rewrite this to QML, do you promise me that it will work? :) |
| 19:29.42 | DocScrutinizer | LOL |
| 19:29.43 | lcuk | slowing the code down that much lets you walk it through and see slowness |
| 19:29.45 | achipa | :) |
| 19:30.42 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: no, but I can promise you a few lines you have to insert that definitely make your whole device *fail* ;-P |
| 19:31.24 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, :D :D |
| 19:31.51 | lcuk | Venemo, your app should be ideal for qmlisation |
| 19:32.00 | lcuk | small, a few rectangles |
| 19:32.08 | lcuk | can put some wiggles on the merges etc |
| 19:32.09 | Venemo | lcuk, I have no idea how to start anyway. |
| 19:32.15 | achipa | at the beginning |
| 19:32.20 | frals | Rectangle {} |
| 19:32.23 | frals | is usually a good start for qml |
| 19:32.24 | achipa | http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/qml-tutorial.html |
| 19:32.26 | Venemo | well |
| 19:32.26 | frals | ;D |
| 19:32.33 | Venemo | the pixmaps won't be rectangles forever |
| 19:32.42 | lcuk | Venemo, you have started already :) |
| 19:32.44 | Venemo | btw, has anyone tried what the QML code on the devkit's box does? |
| 19:32.51 | achipa | Venemo: rule number one - everything is a rectangle |
| 19:33.08 | lcuk | anything that is not a rectangle needs to be made into one |
| 19:33.12 | Venemo | achipa, so, there will be transparent pngs in those rectangles then |
| 19:33.18 | lcuk | achipa, Venemo has jigsaw pieces |
| 19:33.20 | lcuk | ;) |
| 19:33.20 | macmaN | DocScrutinizer: is your nokia accounts login something@ovi.com? |
| 19:33.25 | achipa | perfect ! |
| 19:33.26 | lcuk | i have sketches made out of drawn lines |
| 19:33.37 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: yup |
| 19:33.40 | achipa | harmattan even has MaskedItem component |
| 19:33.47 | achipa | it was *made* for this |
| 19:33.48 | Venemo | QGV could handle this nicely, and also could add a drop shadow effect to them without compromising transparency |
| 19:34.05 | DocScrutinizer | caramelisation |
| 19:34.32 | Venemo | sighs |
| 19:35.19 | *** join/#harmattan harbaum (~quassel@krlh-4d034958.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 19:35.49 | achipa | don't sigh, jigsaws are ridiculously easy with QML. now, this doesn't help the fact that you still need to learn QML, but hey... |
| 19:36.31 | harbaum | Even i have started to like qml ... |
| 19:36.43 | lcuk | :O |
| 19:36.59 | lcuk | harbaum, OSM map tiles are texturemaps aren't they?> |
| 19:37.05 | harbaum | yepp |
| 19:37.07 | lcuk | or can you get vector based ones? |
| 19:37.09 | *** join/#harmattan piggz (~piggz@78.25.237.197) |
| 19:37.23 | harbaum | you can download vector data as well if you want |
| 19:37.30 | harbaum | that's what osm2go worked upon |
| 19:37.36 | lcuk | yes I remember |
| 19:37.45 | lcuk | I gather that is harder in qml though? |
| 19:38.02 | harbaum | what's harder in qml? rendering vector graphics? |
| 19:38.11 | lcuk | yea |
| 19:38.12 | achipa | Venemo: take a peek at http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/demos-declarative-minehunt.html |
| 19:38.20 | achipa | that's not that far from your usecase |
| 19:39.10 | harbaum | drawing vector graphics is something qml isn't meant to do |
| 19:39.33 | harbaum | one would need some vector canvas like the goocanvas i used for osm2go |
| 19:39.38 | Venemo | achipa, okay |
| 19:40.07 | lcuk | harbaum, or many thousands of them as I use in liqbase |
| 19:40.25 | mzanetti | Venemo: I reccomend you to create a small application with QML first. If you have never used something like QML before you will need a little a practice until you get the declarative nature of the language |
| 19:40.29 | harbaum | many thousands of what? |
| 19:40.43 | lcuk | individual vector rectangles |
| 19:40.50 | lcuk | one per sketch |
| 19:40.59 | achipa | harbaum: sllllight disagreement. It provides you with no hardcore vector rendering element, but one *could* make a snazzy VectorItem {} |
| 19:41.24 | lcuk | otherwise it is improssible to use qml to full extent |
| 19:42.44 | harbaum | qml just has a speed penalty as its interpreted and will eat more cpu processing thousands of polygons on every single redraw |
| 19:43.16 | Venemo | harbaum, it is JIT-compiled |
| 19:43.29 | harbaum | oh, really? cool ... |
| 19:43.58 | Venemo | achipa, as you are closer to the fire than the rest of us, so to speak, do you know if any support for landscape mode is coming for N950? |
| 19:44.11 | harbaum | still i'd expect a fast c++ written 2d canvas with proper qml bindings to be the best solution |
| 19:44.28 | lcuk | harbaum, based on number of pixels drawn vs scale of the operation, using simple code I had originally, it was faster to live render sketches than to try and maintain a set of cache components and blitting! |
| 19:45.03 | harbaum | with antialiasing? That's the heaviest thing in osm2go |
| 19:45.19 | lcuk | I never implemented antialiasing :) |
| 19:45.22 | harbaum | without the graphics were ugly but way faster |
| 19:45.34 | lcuk | my writing looks fuzzy when it is 2 pixels wide |
| 19:46.21 | Venemo | hah! I managed to get the taskmanager to a bugged state |
| 19:46.33 | harbaum | are there any cool things to run/try on the n950 yet? |
| 19:46.41 | Venemo | I started puzzle master, then closed, then launched the camera UI, then closed that too |
| 19:46.50 | macmaN | harbaum: aegis-exec |
| 19:46.55 | Venemo | now my "Do you want to exit the game?" dialog is in the taskmanager, unclosable |
| 19:47.38 | harbaum | what's aegis-exec? |
| 19:47.43 | Venemo | seems to be more of a graphical glitch than the dialog actually there |
| 19:47.55 | mzanetti | harbaum: https://gitorious.org/xbmcremote/xbmcremote ;) |
| 19:49.06 | Venemo | mzanetti, I actually have used XAML as a declarative language |
| 19:49.18 | Venemo | mzanetti, never tried QML yet |
| 19:50.00 | Venemo | other question: |
| 19:50.27 | mzanetti | Venemo: QML is really straight forward to start with. But very soon you will find better ways to do things. thats why I reccomend to play around with some simple app before trying to port something you want to release |
| 19:50.29 | Venemo | am I encouraged to use my devkit device as my phone / personal device and bring it with me all the time, or I should rather keep it at home where it's safe? |
| 19:50.43 | Venemo | mzanetti, okay, I'll take the advice :) |
| 19:50.55 | harbaum | any ready-to-run debs yet? |
| 19:51.10 | Venemo | first I will implement my memory game with QML, that will be very straightforward after I read all these docs |
| 19:52.17 | harbaum | Like http://www.harbaum.org/till/cacheme/cacheme_0.8.1_harmattan.deb |
| 19:52.50 | mzanetti | I could upload a deb somewhere if you are interested. but you need to install a nightly build of xbmc to use to... here is some more info: http://competition.meetmeego.org/submissions/50 |
| 19:53.40 | ieatlint | haha, i just noticed that the failure message of the OCF is "Unsuccess" |
| 19:54.06 | mzanetti | harbaum: yay! geocaching already here :) nice! |
| 19:55.09 | harbaum | mzanetti: I am rewriting the ux in qml |
| 19:55.26 | harbaum | the main map imho already works pretty neat |
| 19:55.49 | harbaum | The nice part on that qt version there is that the magnetic compass is working |
| 20:00.19 | mzanetti | anyone knows hot to take screenshots of my app on the device? |
| 20:01.43 | harbaum | can't the widget gallery do that? |
| 20:02.19 | harbaum | the boosted wg has something under Debug tools |
| 20:02.44 | Venemo | achipa, are the bugs I talked about known, or shall I report them? if yes, where? |
| 20:04.10 | mzanetti | harbaum: indeed... completely missed that debug tools section |
| 20:04.26 | harbaum | mzanetti: and it actually works |
| 20:05.14 | Venemo | nah, I'll grab some food |
| 20:13.37 | harbaum | is anyone else missing a way to easily dismiss a program instantly? |
| 20:14.36 | mzanetti | harbaum: you can swipe it from top to bottom |
| 20:14.57 | macmaN | except that doesnt work on n95 |
| 20:14.59 | macmaN | n950 |
| 20:15.09 | macmaN | on n9 that will actually close the program |
| 20:15.10 | ieatlint | heh, just noticed the apt-get sources list are all password protected repos that are static |
| 20:15.26 | mzanetti | macmaN: uh... why that? |
| 20:15.45 | macmaN | mzanetti: incomplete firmware |
| 20:15.53 | ieatlint | yeah, the swipe from top to bottom is an option in newer firmware that isn't on our n950s |
| 20:16.16 | ieatlint | the setting would be in Settings -> Device -> Display |
| 20:16.26 | ieatlint | "Swipe down to close app" |
| 20:16.29 | macmaN | im going to reflash the n950 now and seeing if that enable nokia accounts for me |
| 20:18.54 | DocScrutinizer | harbaum: projects.developer.nokia.com/compass |
| 20:19.07 | DocScrutinizer | harbaum: semi-cool |
| 20:19.43 | DocScrutinizer | mzanetti: doesn't work here |
| 20:20.24 | mzanetti | DocScrutinizer: Yeah... macmaN just told me that its not enabled on the N950 yet |
| 20:20.56 | harbaum | But that would be quite useful ... and very WebOS'ish |
| 20:26.21 | ieatlint | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILEjbh6EMtM#t=51s has an interesting build of the UI. jumps to portrait mode for the home screen when he opens the keyboard |
| 20:28.55 | DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: isn't it supposed to be the other way round? ;-P |
| 20:29.05 | ieatlint | erg, jumps to landscape, yes :) |
| 20:29.51 | DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: I guess that's a newer version of OS |
| 20:30.10 | harbaum | mine does the same :-) |
| 20:30.30 | harbaum | there's some wiki page explaining how to enable that |
| 20:30.44 | ieatlint | ah, cool, will look for that then |
| 20:32.13 | rcg | which is the best way to have something like Q_WS_MAEMO_5? |
| 20:33.01 | ieatlint | might be Q_WS_MAEMO_6 i think |
| 20:33.23 | piggz | yeah, i think maemo_6 exists |
| 20:33.28 | piggz | ive seen it in auto generated code |
| 20:33.35 | rcg | aint that supposed to be dropped? |
| 20:33.40 | piggz | what i miss is a q_ws_meego for -ce |
| 20:34.16 | harbaum | i've been told that it's my purpose that you cannot detect meego in qmake |
| 20:34.40 | harbaum | that's my my cacheme has some runtime-detection for meego :-) |
| 20:35.03 | mzanetti | I do this: exists($$QMAKE_INCDIR_QT"/../qmsystem2/qmkeys.h"): DEFINES += Q_WS_MAEMO_6 |
| 20:35.40 | piggz | harbaum: do show me...ive been trying to resort to defining -DMEEGO in the .spec file, but i havnt managed yet |
| 20:39.57 | harbaum | piggz: run-time, not compile time |
| 20:40.19 | piggz | harbaum: yes, i read that, using what method? |
| 20:40.44 | piggz | harbaum: any ideas on portrait/rotation? |
| 20:40.46 | harbaum | i just look for /usr/bin/uxlaunch |
| 20:40.56 | piggz | simple :) |
| 20:41.12 | harbaum | i thought qml does rotation automatically? |
| 20:41.21 | piggz | its not a qml app |
| 20:41.21 | mzanetti | for runtime checks you can/should use QSystemInfo |
| 20:41.46 | harbaum | mzanetti: thanks |
| 20:41.50 | piggz | hance, im just building now with a requirement for meegotouch-qt-style |
| 20:42.32 | piggz | it looks pretty good with that style actually |
| 20:42.58 | harbaum | piggz: meegotouch-qt-style works? |
| 20:43.23 | mzanetti | and qml does rotation not automatically. however, if you use a PageStackWindow it'll handle the rotation for you |
| 20:43.26 | rcg | mzanetti: thanks will try |
| 20:43.34 | piggz | harbaum: seeems to...i havnt done extensive testing, and only use simple widgets |
| 20:45.05 | harbaum | piggz: on the real thing? I have tried it on meego-ce and it was pretty unusable |
| 20:45.46 | piggz | harbaum: i am talking about meego-ce (i havnt got the phone yet)....isnt the qtstyle on the real thing called 'blanco' or something like that? |
| 20:46.01 | harbaum | mzanetti: really? No rotation for plain qml? That's bad ... |
| 20:46.12 | harbaum | piggz: There's no qt theme on the real thing |
| 20:46.34 | harbaum | plain qt apps are unusable on harmattan |
| 20:46.44 | mzanetti | well, I do this on the N900: property string orientation: width > height ? "landscape" : "portrait" |
| 20:47.18 | harbaum | mzanetti: but for that to work there must already be some rotation be working |
| 20:47.28 | piggz | harbaum: i got am email after enguiring about it... |
| 20:47.31 | piggz | There is style but we strongly discourage using it. It is not as complete as Maemo5, |
| 20:47.33 | piggz | it misses advanced widgets and it does not support portrait orientation. |
| 20:48.06 | mzanetti | you start the QDeclarativeView most of the times with showFullScreen() or showExpanded() |
| 20:48.20 | rcg | mzanetti: thanks again :) |
| 20:48.24 | mzanetti | this automatically adapts your main.qml's width and height |
| 20:48.44 | mzanetti | and so you can just use the above to set your orientation property on your own |
| 20:48.50 | harbaum | mzanetti: yes, but if width and height are swapping, then there already is auto rotation |
| 20:49.30 | mzanetti | ok... yes... but you still have to re-align your items (unless you just anchor them all to the borders) |
| 20:49.50 | mzanetti | I mostly use a Grid {} and change the column count depending on the orientation |
| 20:51.00 | harbaum | yes, that's of course true. but that's simple once rotation itself works |
| 20:51.17 | piggz | y....atm, i dont see any rotation in meegoce |
| 20:53.38 | piggz | harbaum: try out my app if you like...its a mapping/trip searching app https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=pgz-everytrail&project=home%3Apiggz |
| 20:53.59 | piggz | i need to get some maemo packages done |
| 20:54.17 | piggz | and test the trail recording a bit more |
| 20:54.33 | piggz | and use the map widget in the recording view, istead of the lon/lat list |
| 20:56.37 | harbaum | What plattform are you adressing? I have finally given up upon my plain qt version of cacheme and am redoing the UX in qml |
| 20:56.53 | harbaum | The theming really doesn't work ... |
| 20:56.59 | piggz | mzanetti: was excited when i looked at the qsysteminfo docs that it may help sove a problem i have...but it doesnt...there is no QSystemInfo::HWKeyboard |
| 20:57.46 | piggz | harbaum: when i started it, it was addressing maemo/symbian....and the meegotouch is just a helper for meego, until yes, i write it in qml |
| 20:58.54 | harbaum | i have released cacheme for maemo5 and symbian as well. But the symbian version already has a rather simple theming |
| 20:59.44 | harbaum | Also android etc will likely never get theming and these will be you only targets once maemo5, neego and symbian are discontinued |
| 21:00.22 | mzanetti | piggz: iirc you can do that with QmSystem2 |
| 21:00.32 | rcg | harbaum: is there a good guide on howto migrate from plain qt to qml? |
| 21:00.52 | piggz | i dont think you 'migrate' as such ;) |
| 21:01.58 | rcg | ;) well.. i used the term "migrate" as in switch my ui part to qml while keeping the rest of my project as much as it is |
| 21:02.03 | Venemo | am I encouraged to use my devkit device as my phone / personal device and bring it with me all the time, or I should rather keep it at home where it's safe? |
| 21:02.40 | piggz | Venemo: its too cool not to use |
| 21:03.17 | harbaum | you are not supposed to hide it |
| 21:03.30 | Venemo | piggz, its not turning to landscape when the keyboard is opened is quite a stopping factor against showing it off |
| 21:03.36 | piggz | rcg: in the case of my above app...most of the code just sends requests and parses replies from a website...so, i just need to expose the object that does that via qml, and call slots as usual |
| 21:03.46 | Venemo | but well, it's slim enough so noone will notice the hw keyboard anyway :P |
| 21:03.51 | harbaum | rcg: the qmltube/cutetube-qml source has helped me a ot |
| 21:03.56 | Venemo | piggz, do you use it? |
| 21:04.09 | piggz | Venemo: havnt got it yet....tracking with dhl now :) |
| 21:04.40 | rcg | piggz: harbaum: ic thanks :) |
| 21:05.00 | Venemo | piggz, then it will arrive tomorrow |
| 21:05.16 | piggz | Venemo: that will be quick from finland to gb ;) |
| 21:05.26 | mzanetti | piggz: http://library.developer.nokia.com/topic/MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_API/html/qmsystem2/classMeeGo_1_1QmKeys.html It may help you... but still not exactly what you're looking for |
| 21:07.00 | piggz | mzanetti: in my spaceinvaders game in the meego coding comp (download it and vote for it ;) ... there is the option to set keys for movement...but, it obviously only makes sense if there is a keyboard available...as it is, the option is there on a touchscreen only device, and pressing a totally stupid key is the only way out of it :) |
| 21:07.31 | Venemo | it would make sense to be able to select the people whose facebook stuff I want to see in the events view and whose not |
| 21:07.52 | Venemo | but, I'm liking the Favorites feature of the contacts app |
| 21:09.04 | piggz | Venemo: will it sync contacts with google/activesync? |
| 21:09.11 | Jaffa | Venemo: Indeed, I've unliked some things so I don't see them in the News feed |
| 21:09.20 | mzanetti | rcg: here are two QML "themes". One that does work everywhere and one specially for MeeGo: https://gitorious.org/xbmcremote/xbmcremote/trees/master/qml/xbmcremote |
| 21:09.21 | Jaffa | Venemo: Hopefully the production image has some tuning options |
| 21:09.36 | mzanetti | piggz: download and vote for id :P ^^ |
| 21:09.49 | Venemo | piggz, nope, at least not yet |
| 21:10.00 | Venemo | piggz, but please don't tell anyone, I'm under and NDA not to disclose this |
| 21:10.20 | rcg | mzanetti: ah thanks... will have a look at it :) |
| 21:11.24 | piggz | mzanetti: i got rid of my xbmc when i got a pch ;) |
| 21:12.41 | Venemo | nah, you guys convinced me |
| 21:12.51 | piggz | hiemanshu: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Nokia-E50-1-Metal-black-Unlocked-Smartphone-Used-/160616159625?pt=UK_Mobile_Phones&hash=item2565781989 :P |
| 21:12.51 | Venemo | I put my main SIM card into N950 |
| 21:12.59 | Venemo | poor N900 now feels soo empty |
| 21:13.37 | hiemanshu | piggz: hah |
| 21:13.43 | hiemanshu | Venemo: send it to me :P |
| 21:13.47 | hiemanshu | Venemo: I'll make good use of it |
| 21:14.17 | Venemo | hiemanshu, no way - I still need something after the N950 loan ends. |
| 21:14.25 | Venemo | hiemanshu, plus, now I have hw to test MeeGo CE on |
| 21:14.30 | hiemanshu | my brother in law wants mine, so I am wondering about giving it to him |
| 21:15.16 | Venemo | and what'll you do when you need to send N950 back? |
| 21:15.28 | Venemo | or are you confident that it may remain with us forever? |
| 21:19.59 | mzanetti | Venemo: Do you really think of returning to the N900 after a few months with the N950? |
| 21:21.43 | Venemo | mzanetti, what else? |
| 21:22.07 | Venemo | I won't be able to afford the N9 |
| 21:24.33 | mzanetti | ok... that could be a valid reason... |
| 21:25.05 | Venemo | my only hope is that the N950 can remain with me. the guys who participated in N900 programme told that they were never required to send it back |
| 21:25.34 | mzanetti | I got an N810 in 2008. I still use it every day... |
| 21:25.56 | Venemo | :) |
| 21:30.49 | lcuk | mzanetti, which apps? |
| 21:31.37 | mzanetti | FlipClock, xterm/ssh and media players |
| 21:31.48 | mzanetti | flipclock really rocks |
| 21:32.17 | mzanetti | and also the speakers of the N810 perform way better than any other mobile device's speakers |
| 21:32.28 | *** join/#harmattan Atarii` (~Atarii@77.107.156.213) |
| 21:32.31 | Venemo | Jaffa, is Hermes any usable on N950? I could really use it right now :) |
| 21:33.04 | Venemo | mzanetti, agreed. N950 speaker is underwhelming. |
| 21:35.19 | mzanetti | lcuk: it really rocks to have a touch screen alarm clock with ssh and upnp client on your bedstand... |
| 21:36.05 | mzanetti | especially with the green theme in insomniac mode :) |
| 21:36.36 | Venemo | hm, will we have Skype on da N950? |
| 21:37.06 | ieatlint | yes |
| 21:37.19 | ieatlint | the official press stuff has shown skype on the n9 |
| 21:37.41 | piggz | probably got it ported from msft ;) |
| 21:38.39 | ieatlint | well, harmattan uses telepathy like maemo5, so they probably just ported the maemo5 plugin |
| 21:38.53 | Venemo | ieatlint, that is good enough |
| 21:39.16 | piggz | yeah...no other platform out there even touches the maemo plugin system |
| 21:39.22 | Venemo | okay, I want to show facebook events from either only the people already in my contacts or allow me to hand-pick for whom I don't care. |
| 21:39.29 | lcuk | mzanetti, this is what I have on my devices http://liqbase.net/liq.20110623_015300.liqbase-playground.scr.png |
| 21:39.38 | piggz | Venemo: you need googel circles ;) |
| 21:39.44 | Venemo | piggz, what is that? |
| 21:39.49 | ieatlint | yeah, the system for IM on maemo5 is the best i've ever seen for a mobile platform |
| 21:39.52 | piggz | s/google |
| 21:40.02 | piggz | Venemo: you know what circles is surely? |
| 21:40.04 | ieatlint | and it's just an updated version in harmattan :) |
| 21:40.19 | Venemo | piggz, I was referring to the fact that the N950's events view shows every event from every last contact |
| 21:40.27 | Venemo | piggz, "google circles"-> never heard of it |
| 21:40.35 | piggz | ah. |
| 21:40.55 | ieatlint | i want a google latitude app too |
| 21:41.11 | piggz | well, circles/plus is like fb, but you can put people in 'circles' i was thinking it would be cool to have an event plugin, that allowed you to show events from certain circles |
| 21:41.16 | ieatlint | it's pretty funny right now, if you go to m.google.com on the n950, google's site gets confused |
| 21:41.23 | piggz | ieatlint: i can do that, i have one for maemo :) |
| 21:41.29 | ieatlint | starts showing "install now" buttons for apps, and then 404 when you click |
| 21:41.32 | Venemo | piggz, I can put people to groups in facebook too... |
| 21:41.41 | Venemo | ieatlint, lol |
| 21:41.49 | ieatlint | piggz: cool :) |
| 21:41.51 | piggz | ieatlint: i already planned to port it to harmatten |
| 21:42.09 | ieatlint | i wish i had more spare time to make apps for the phone :( |
| 21:42.10 | mzanetti | this explains google circles quite well: http://failbook.failblog.org/2011/07/13/funny-facebook-fails-the-current-social-landscape/ |
| 21:42.20 | ieatlint | going to be struggling to get the app i promised done |
| 21:42.24 | piggz | i just need to read up on the settings system, as there is no desktop widgets |
| 21:43.04 | ieatlint | yeah, the top drop down menu can have things added to it though |
| 21:43.10 | ieatlint | i came across the api a couple days ago |
| 21:43.32 | piggz | ieatlint: i was thinking of having it as an invisibl daemon, updating your location, and displaying it in the event view |
| 21:44.00 | ieatlint | not sure if the event view allows persistent events |
| 21:44.23 | piggz | no, but it could update it whenever it does a timed update |
| 21:44.33 | piggz | say, every 20 minutes |
| 21:46.12 | ieatlint | cool |
| 21:46.42 | ieatlint | i bet one could do a pretty decent qml app with the Map element too |
| 21:47.08 | piggz | ieatlint: yeah..ive used that element already (in above geomapping app) |
| 21:47.25 | ieatlint | it kinda words :P |
| 21:48.07 | piggz | atleast porting to qml will give me extended time with the n950 ;) |
| 21:49.00 | *** join/#harmattan CaCO3 (~CaCO3@19-233.195-178.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 21:55.55 | Venemo | ok, I would seriously need Hermes... :P |
| 21:57.47 | hiemanshu | Hey Venemo piggz |
| 21:59.23 | hiemanshu | scrolling 60-ish channels with quassel2go isnt fun :( |
| 22:06.09 | *** join/#harmattan piggz (~piggz@78.25.237.197) |
| 22:11.01 | Venemo | hiemanshu, wut's quassel2go? |
| 22:11.45 | hiemanshu | Venemo: quassel client for N900 |
| 22:11.57 | Venemo | wut is quassel? |
| 22:12.43 | Venemo | btw, porting an IRC client to Harmattan is gonna be among my first priorities |
| 22:12.45 | hiemanshu | Irc client, has a core and client |
| 22:12.59 | Venemo | is it Qt? |
| 22:13.02 | hiemanshu | so one core multiple clients can acess it |
| 22:13.04 | hiemanshu | Ja |
| 22:13.10 | hiemanshu | There is a qml ver |
| 22:13.18 | hiemanshu | There is a qml verSion in the works |
| 22:13.26 | Venemo | does it look good on da N950? |
| 22:13.31 | Venemo | if yes, I won't bother... :P |
| 22:13.49 | hiemanshu | well help the guy doing it :) |
| 22:14.13 | Venemo | how do I tell da N950 not to connect to the net every chance it gets? there was an "always ask" option in da N900 |
| 22:14.25 | Venemo | hiemanshu, maybe I'll help the guy doing it. |
| 22:14.26 | hiemanshu | Anyways off to sleep, its 4am :P |
| 22:14.36 | hiemanshu | Venemo: awesome :) |
| 22:14.37 | Venemo | yep, I'm going to sleep too... |
| 22:14.51 | hiemanshu | night. |
| 22:15.40 | Venemo | night :) |
| 22:20.22 | ieatlint | i wish the terminal app would allow me to hide the on-screen keyboard |
| 22:20.36 | Venemo | ieatlint, it hides it when you slide out the keyboard |
| 22:21.38 | ieatlint | yes, but for something like irssi, i want to be able to read what's there without opening up the keyboard |
| 22:21.53 | Venemo | mhm |
| 22:22.06 | ieatlint | also would like ability to lock portrait/landscape for it |
| 22:22.13 | ieatlint | and open more than one... |
| 22:22.20 | Venemo | I wonder how durable the keyboard remains if I keep opening/closing it the same amount as I did with da N90 |
| 22:22.22 | ieatlint | but pre-release software, etc |
| 22:22.22 | Venemo | 0 |
| 22:22.47 | ieatlint | it looks a lot like the e7 keyboard mechanism |
| 22:23.05 | ieatlint | i used an e7 for 3 months... seemed very reliable, didn't get loose or anything |
| 22:23.13 | kimju | ieatlint, I tried to add to landscape locking to terminal (actually, prevent it from rotating when minimizing), but couldn't replace the package on device. aegis fighting back.. |
| 22:23.44 | Venemo | hmm |
| 22:23.47 | Venemo | no file manager? |
| 22:24.07 | kimju | seems that I need to rename the modified terminal to get it installed |
| 22:25.12 | kimju | but I don't have time to retry that until next week. |
| 22:25.20 | Venemo | hm, any reason why it might not recognize some of my songs? it did recognize half of an album, but not the other half |
| 22:25.42 | ieatlint | file formats? |
| 22:26.05 | Venemo | the entire album is of the same format. and it did recognize the other half |
| 22:26.53 | ieatlint | just blame aegis, it seems to be the popular thing to do |
| 22:27.09 | Venemo | hehehe |
| 22:27.23 | Venemo | aegis hasn't done anything to me (yet?) |
| 22:27.26 | ieatlint | aegis has deemed your taste in music insufficient, but is not wholly cruel, and will allow some of it |
| 22:27.44 | Venemo | still, I did beat DocScrutinizer's record of rendering the device unusable in the shortest time :P |
| 22:27.54 | Venemo | ieatlint :D :D :D |
| 22:31.13 | Venemo | hmm |
| 22:31.21 | Venemo | the speaker wouldn't be actually bad if it were stereo |
| 22:44.35 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: if it were stereo, the device was 25% larger |
| 22:45.18 | DocScrutinizer | for the 50% missing music - watch the names of the songs you are missing. Any special chars? |
| 22:45.35 | Venemo | nope. |
| 22:46.34 | DocScrutinizer | re filemanager: no, it seems M6 concept is again close to the worst of iPhone. Nokia wants to *conpletely* hide the fact you are dealing with chunks of data caled files |
| 22:47.12 | Venemo | nah anyway, the mono is good enough for playing ringtones, and I don't really listen to music from my phone's speakers anyway |
| 22:47.24 | DocScrutinizer | there's not even a fileselector dialog aiui |
| 22:47.37 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, yeah, it seems that this is a good thing for average users |
| 22:47.51 | DocScrutinizer | BLAERGH!! |
| 22:47.53 | Venemo | meaning, good for idiot stupid people who only use their computer for facebooking |
| 22:48.04 | DocScrutinizer | indeed |
| 22:48.23 | Venemo | and I recall seeing among the selected devs one or two with a file manager app :) |
| 22:48.26 | DocScrutinizer | alas you're right this obviously *is* THE average user |
| 22:48.55 | Venemo | so... Nokia knew they can't write a proper file manager (as they couldn't for any other), so they decided to entrust the cummunity with this. |
| 22:49.09 | DocScrutinizer | hehe |
| 22:50.13 | *** join/#harmattan mzanetti (~micha@2001:4dd0:fddf:0:21c:b3ff:fec3:e17a) |
| 22:50.18 | DocScrutinizer | maybe THAT is the true reason for N9(50) not having any MMC card slot - you'd need to deal with fileselectors once more |
| 22:50.29 | Venemo | okay, deleted the songs, plugged out USB... "updating library", then copied them again, unplugged, "Updating library" again, and now they're there |
| 22:50.37 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, indeed. |
| 22:51.11 | Venemo | I'm also liking the ability to fastscroll in Contacts and Music |
| 22:51.20 | Venemo | I mean, the scrolling by starting letters |
| 22:51.27 | Venemo | did you notice that? |
| 22:51.34 | Venemo | I accidentally sumbled upon it |
| 22:51.50 | DocScrutinizer | still you're busted with camera when you want to take a 4h video and your internal meager 8GB are filled with mp3, but you got a 64GB stick on USB hostmode |
| 22:52.14 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I don't wanna take a 4h vid. |
| 22:52.27 | DocScrutinizer | camera won't allow you to store to anything else than internal MMC, this exact directory called MyDocs/DCIM |
| 22:53.10 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: with your waggonload of terrible music there won't be enough space left over for a 4min video ;-P |
| 22:53.20 | Venemo | xD |
| 22:53.25 | cpscotti | DocScrutinizer, btw, I hate the name "DCIM".. couldn't they come up with anything better? |
| 22:53.38 | Venemo | I also like the tumbnails the Contacts and Music apps autogenerate, and the Music app's ability to list recently listened albums on its start screen |
| 22:53.47 | DocScrutinizer | I friggin wonder what it means at all |
| 22:53.47 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, naah, it's just a couple of gigabytes of music |
| 22:54.05 | cpscotti | Venemo, me too! that's cool |
| 22:54.18 | Venemo | cpscotti, I think the reason is because every digital camera does it the same way |
| 22:54.40 | DocScrutinizer | Degenerated Camera-dir Invented by Mircosoft |
| 22:54.43 | cpscotti | I know.. but whyyyy!?? i wan't to ask that first guy that decided about DCIM... back in 2001.. |
| 22:55.19 | cpscotti | lol |
| 22:55.26 | Venemo | you want to ask... I want to travel back in time and persuade him to use "Images" instead |
| 22:55.49 | Venemo | hm. |
| 22:56.04 | Venemo | a lot of tweaks that we were complaining about on N900 are implemented on N950 |
| 22:56.09 | cpscotti | Venemo, lol |
| 22:56.24 | Venemo | which is a good thing |
| 22:57.20 | Venemo | music app is also a lot less annoying to handle |
| 22:57.37 | Venemo | but I wonder what good this dolby thingy is |
| 22:57.41 | DocScrutinizer | tolfya it's kinda funny how Nokia adopted a lot of comunity-driven concepts, like headset pull and pause, like headset button control for musicplayer... |
| 22:57.55 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, yeah |
| 22:58.07 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, have you tested a headphone adapter with media buttons |
| 22:58.10 | DocScrutinizer | actually I think music app is even worse than N900 |
| 22:58.17 | Venemo | oh, why is that? |
| 22:58.49 | DocScrutinizer | no, my friend with that N95 headset with multibutton doesn't answer my calls, hope he's all well |
| 22:59.11 | DocScrutinizer | (music) no playlist - or I'm too stupid to find it |
| 22:59.18 | Venemo | I'd try, but both my N95 headsets stopped working a long time ago, even with the N95 |
| 22:59.27 | Venemo | hm? |
| 22:59.37 | Venemo | no playlists? wut? |
| 22:59.48 | DocScrutinizer | no recent playlist |
| 23:00.03 | DocScrutinizer | where's the list that shows me what's next song? |
| 23:00.09 | Venemo | ah, the current playlist |
| 23:00.20 | Venemo | I find it less annoying that it doesn't show that. |
| 23:00.35 | DocScrutinizer | I don't care a rat's ass about stored playlists |
| 23:00.40 | piggz | whats the equivalend of extras/extras-devel for harmatten? |
| 23:00.46 | Venemo | because on N900 it took me one click more to return to artist |
| 23:00.54 | Venemo | piggz, personal repos of people... |
| 23:01.07 | piggz | Venemo: stored where? |
| 23:01.23 | Venemo | piggz, no idea, ask Jaffa or X-Fade |
| 23:01.23 | DocScrutinizer | damn, you can't even navigate to song #3 of an album |
| 23:01.34 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, I can |
| 23:01.39 | Venemo | either with next button |
| 23:01.40 | DocScrutinizer | that thing is so utterly useless |
| 23:01.53 | DocScrutinizer | PFFFF |
| 23:01.56 | DocScrutinizer | realy? |
| 23:01.57 | piggz | Venemo: thinking of, eg, when developing something that depends on someone elses library |
| 23:02.00 | Venemo | or I just press the back button (bottom left) and select the song I wanna hear |
| 23:02.16 | Venemo | piggz, yeah, that is why people don't like this decision |
| 23:02.30 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, anyway, I understand your concern. |
| 23:02.48 | Venemo | but again, don't worry. 1/3 of all community applications for the device programme were media players :) |
| 23:03.23 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: you'll understand even more after you learned there's an option "add to current playlist" when you clickNhold a song in the songs view |
| 23:03.39 | Venemo | aaaahhh |
| 23:03.42 | Venemo | haven't noticed that one |
| 23:03.58 | DocScrutinizer | so there IS a current playlist, just you have no idea what it looks like or how to navigate or even edit it |
| 23:04.10 | Venemo | ok, I get it |
| 23:05.09 | Venemo | what I don't exactly get is the purpose of this dolby thingy |
| 23:05.24 | DocScrutinizer | don't get me wrong, I don't really like the idea of a current playlist, but WHEN ther is any, then damn I need to have a way to look at it and edit it |
| 23:05.36 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, ok, I understand |
| 23:05.56 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: switch it while listening music, you *should* notice some subtle diferences |
| 23:06.02 | Venemo | yep, I do |
| 23:06.17 | Venemo | without it, it feels like as if the music came from the middle of my head (as always) |
| 23:06.28 | Venemo | with it, it feels like the music comes from a distance |
| 23:06.42 | DocScrutinizer | that's what it's meant to do, yeah |
| 23:06.42 | Venemo | but it makes the music a bit less immense |
| 23:06.59 | piggz | ooo, dhl is doing a marvelous job...departed germany now |
| 23:07.14 | DocScrutinizer | I think it makes music less crisp and less clear |
| 23:07.25 | Venemo | a little bit that too |
| 23:07.42 | DocScrutinizer | piggz: yeahm that's the tie when all the planes start at Leipzig |
| 23:07.44 | Venemo | oh, but a very strong point |
| 23:08.13 | Venemo | I was 100% sure I will carry this as my main personal device, when I saw how better the mail client is from Modest |
| 23:08.59 | DocScrutinizer | meh, I tried it for one afternon - got allergic spots all over my skin ;-P |
| 23:09.13 | Venemo | both apps lack the features of identities, so that's a negligible feature lack. |
| 23:09.19 | Venemo | but this one has "mark all as read" |
| 23:09.39 | DocScrutinizer | incredible¡ |
| 23:10.09 | Venemo | :P |
| 23:10.31 | DocScrutinizer | I know a better way for that, it starts with apt-get and continues with... guess what |
| 23:11.02 | Venemo | dunno |
| 23:11.12 | Venemo | is there already a better email app in da repo? |
| 23:11.40 | DocScrutinizer | honestly I couldn't think of a more cruel punishment than being forced to deal with those 300 mails / day on a smartphone |
| 23:12.28 | DocScrutinizer | for an alternative to that obsolete MMS sending, modest is just fine |
| 23:12.35 | Venemo | agreed |
| 23:12.37 | piggz | that is what n900ce is missing...a mail client, if it had that, i'd be tempted to run it all day |
| 23:12.43 | Venemo | hehe |
| 23:13.25 | Venemo | ok, one hw defect carried over from N900: inconvenient to type on hw kbd when jack is plugged in |
| 23:13.52 | DocScrutinizer | indeed |
| 23:14.32 | DocScrutinizer | also they again didn't think about antenna placement wrt holding the device for typing |
| 23:14.48 | Venemo | but at least microusb and jack are on da same side |
| 23:15.49 | Venemo | hm |
| 23:16.00 | Venemo | anyone tried how reliable the Track&Protect app is? |
| 23:16.08 | DocScrutinizer | LOL |
| 23:16.15 | Venemo | I have a bad feeling that a reflash will eradicate its usefullness |
| 23:16.18 | DocScrutinizer | you bet nobody has tried it yet |
| 23:16.42 | piggz | Venemo: oh....speaking of which....is the microusb on hte bottom, when in portrait mode? that would be much much better for in-car |
| 23:17.02 | DocScrutinizer | it's meant to protect your data and - as far as feasible - track your phone. Of course you can kill it by a reflash |
| 23:17.37 | DocScrutinizer | piggz: nope, on top |
| 23:17.45 | piggz | DocScrutinizer: noooooooooo |
| 23:17.50 | piggz | thats terrible |
| 23:18.02 | piggz | again, i wont be able to charge while in car |
| 23:18.17 | piggz | it calls for some kind of microusb, right -angle adapter |
| 23:18.31 | DocScrutinizer | piggz: you can't place it on bottom, as GSM antenna has to go there, not to interfere with hearing aid devices when it was placed the classical way |
| 23:19.58 | DocScrutinizer | indeed a micro-usb stub (reduced length) plug with a really stron flat cable was an awesome product |
| 23:20.33 | DocScrutinizer | plug in til level, bend flat cable along the body to backside |
| 23:20.56 | DocScrutinizer | if you got my weird idea... |
| 23:21.09 | SpeedEvil | needs to try making that. |
| 23:21.43 | DocScrutinizer | remove stub by pulling the cable |
| 23:22.00 | DocScrutinizer | "plop" |
| 23:22.22 | DocScrutinizer | no more lever to break the USB receptacle |
| 23:23.21 | DocScrutinizer | no more *annoying* cable on top of phone, just a flat ribbon cable close to case running around the corner to backside |
| 23:25.02 | piggz | yeah, something like that would be ideal in the car...or....reverse portrait mode, which is the mode im missing in n900ce, for this reason |
| 23:25.15 | Venemo | hm |
| 23:25.22 | Venemo | are the two QML example "apps" open source? |
| 23:25.32 | Venemo | if yes, then I just got myself a head start in QML |
| 23:25.39 | DocScrutinizer | alas a stripped calsiical micro USB plug still is ~5mm longer than the mere insert to the recepacle |
| 23:25.55 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, is there any way to persuade my N950 not to connect to the net every X minutes? |
| 23:26.07 | Venemo | or at least disconnect when it got what it wanted? |
| 23:26.10 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: eh? |
| 23:26.27 | DocScrutinizer | there are apps for that |
| 23:26.36 | Venemo | even if I disconnect from wifi, it reconnects in a few minutes |
| 23:26.39 | Venemo | what apps? |
| 23:26.50 | DocScrutinizer | auto-disconnect or whatever |
| 23:27.08 | Venemo | that is for N900 |
| 23:27.10 | Venemo | not N950.. |
| 23:27.15 | SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: It's a bit less than that if you look at the actual raw plugs |
| 23:27.26 | SpeedEvil | I've got some here. |
| 23:27.33 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: haha |
| 23:27.36 | DocScrutinizer | dunno |
| 23:27.40 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer :P |
| 23:27.45 | DocScrutinizer | port it |
| 23:28.01 | Venemo | I don't feel like it |
| 23:28.05 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: indeed, a lot less |
| 23:28.15 | Venemo | I think this is what the "allow connecting in the background" option is for |
| 23:28.20 | DocScrutinizer | but still too much for my perfectionism |
| 23:28.25 | Venemo | if it eats the battery too much, I'll just turn that off. |
| 23:29.21 | Venemo | for now, I'm curious about just how good this battery is |
| 23:29.24 | DocScrutinizer | anybody noticed and shouted at all those useless quetionmark icons all over the place? ;-P |
| 23:29.49 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, yes, but I think they will get some purpose in the final version |
| 23:29.59 | DocScrutinizer | prolly |
| 23:31.36 | DocScrutinizer | pff about "how good battery is" - it's a errr 1400mAh or sth, it's clearly written on the battery pack |
| 23:32.02 | Venemo | okay, lemme rephrase: how long it lasts |
| 23:32.24 | DocScrutinizer | the question is how good is the device, and esp how good is the software managing the device |
| 23:32.28 | Venemo | yea |
| 23:32.41 | Venemo | printed on the back? on the back of the device? |
| 23:33.18 | *** join/#harmattan cpscotti (~cpscotti@91.125.248.94) |
| 23:33.33 | DocScrutinizer | and as we all are aware this is a beta version,meh a pre-alpha version, of an OS targeted at a different hw platform. So don't expect much, and don't expect any meaningful results |
| 23:33.48 | DocScrutinizer | on tha battery package |
| 23:34.13 | Venemo | well, N9 is the same hw platform, with a few small differences in details |
| 23:34.42 | DocScrutinizer | yoh, tiny diffs like amoled vs LCD with backlight |
| 23:35.22 | Venemo | well, N950's LCD is one of the best I've seen |
| 23:35.24 | DocScrutinizer | like possibly 64 vs 16 GB RAM |
| 23:35.38 | Venemo | 16 GB RAM? |
| 23:35.41 | Venemo | you jokin' |
| 23:35.53 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: I'm talking about power consumption, not about optics |
| 23:36.02 | DocScrutinizer | MMC meh |
| 23:36.16 | DocScrutinizer | storage |
| 23:36.47 | DocScrutinizer | see what Nokia did to me, with their constant mixing of storage and memory? :-( |
| 23:36.56 | Venemo | :P |
| 23:36.59 | Venemo | no excuse |
| 23:37.44 | DocScrutinizer | anyway expect more flash to use more power |
| 23:38.09 | Venemo | mhm |
| 23:38.12 | DocScrutinizer | expect AMOLED to use enormous amounts of power, for bright screens |
| 23:38.38 | Venemo | well, I'm specifically interested in N950's properties and almost not at all in N9 |
| 23:38.43 | DocScrutinizer | that's the reason why this thing has only all-black themes |
| 23:38.48 | Venemo | well |
| 23:38.52 | Venemo | many apps are white |
| 23:38.54 | Venemo | eg.contacts |
| 23:39.50 | Venemo | and mail |
| 23:39.53 | Venemo | and etc |
| 23:40.01 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, also many graphical elements are one pixel wide white lines, though the developer howto clearly says you MUST avoid that as it looks terrible on amoled |
| 23:40.26 | Venemo | :D |
| 23:40.34 | Venemo | when do I find one? |
| 23:40.37 | cpscotti | Woa... the facebook app's "Pull down to update" trick is cool! |
| 23:40.45 | Venemo | where* |
| 23:40.49 | Venemo | cpscotti, hm? |
| 23:41.01 | DocScrutinizer | faceWhat? |
| 23:41.27 | Venemo | I'm annoyed by the fact that the facebook app does support landscape, but I can't scroll it down in landscape mode |
| 23:41.31 | SpeedEvil | It's like google + for old people. |
| 23:41.44 | cpscotti | if you are in your news feed on the f***book app and you try to scroll up further then the most recent element it starts to update |
| 23:41.56 | Venemo | google+ is overrated shit |
| 23:42.11 | SpeedEvil | hasn't played with either. |
| 23:42.13 | Venemo | why would I want to join the N+1th social network? |
| 23:42.32 | DocScrutinizer | facebook is the underrated evil |
| 23:42.44 | cpscotti | Venemo, agree.. both are the same shit. And I feel better splitting my online "info" between to competing companies.. competition is always good |
| 23:42.59 | cpscotti | I already use google for all the rest.. :/ |
| 23:43.05 | DocScrutinizer | why would I wnat to join *any* social network? |
| 23:43.06 | Venemo | google already knows all there is to know about me... :P |
| 23:43.14 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer ++ |
| 23:43.32 | Venemo | I only did because that is the only way to contact many people I occasionally want to contact |
| 23:43.46 | SpeedEvil | I am unsure that if you turn off 'collect my searches' -if it actually does so. |
| 23:44.02 | Venemo | SpeedEvil, rest assured, it will not |
| 23:44.10 | DocScrutinizer | ouch, for that I have a phone in my phone |
| 23:44.40 | Venemo | their worst shit is the one called "Google Toolbar"... its first version sent your MSN messages to Google. |
| 23:44.43 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, hm? |
| 23:44.51 | Venemo | ah. |
| 23:45.33 | ieatlint | wow, i managed to get the music player into a bizarre loop |
| 23:45.57 | ieatlint | it's cycling through all the music i put on the phone, playing only 1s of each song before skipping to the next |
| 23:46.05 | DocScrutinizer | it's no bizarre loop, it's the newest feature of the invisible playllist |
| 23:46.26 | DocScrutinizer | it's called intro-search |
| 23:46.39 | Venemo | oh, and speaking of the facebook app, its like button doesn't always work. |
| 23:46.40 | DocScrutinizer | my fist 3 CD players had that as well |
| 23:46.45 | ieatlint | it's called unintuitive and annoying :P |
| 23:46.46 | DocScrutinizer | first* |
| 23:48.59 | Venemo | hm.. I'm getting tired of having to long press each time I wanna close an app |
| 23:49.05 | Venemo | maybe I'll just leave them all runnin |
| 23:49.24 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, have you noticed that the browser is unable to open https://meego.com ? |
| 23:49.51 | DocScrutinizer | heard about it |
| 23:50.25 | ieatlint | haha |
| 23:50.36 | *** join/#harmattan mzanetti (~micha@2001:4dd0:fddf:0:21c:b3ff:fec3:e17a) |
| 23:51.57 | ieatlint | i'm still wondering wtf google thinks this phone is |
| 23:52.02 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: duh, why? you can close all on one click of a button ;-P |
| 23:52.04 | ieatlint | because it knows it's a mobile platform... |
| 23:52.15 | ieatlint | but it clearly thinks it's something it's not |
| 23:52.43 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, sure, but there are some that I wish to keep open. eg. music app |
| 23:52.54 | Venemo | ieatlint, hehe |
| 23:53.26 | DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: don't you know a proper hacker test site, where *all* those browser info bits like identifier, referer, IP, whatnotelse are just displayed on the webpage? |
| 23:53.53 | ieatlint | i know of them |
| 23:54.00 | ieatlint | can't say i typically use them |
| 23:54.15 | ieatlint | i've already looked at the user-agent |
| 23:54.24 | DocScrutinizer | I neither could tell an URL without lots of googling right now |
| 23:54.34 | ieatlint | and wouldn't tell me what google thinks the phone is anyway |
| 23:55.14 | DocScrutinizer | I bet google has a page that tells you about that detail |
| 23:55.40 | Venemo | I bet google just discriminates the competitor devices |
| 23:55.58 | ieatlint | they don't really |
| 23:56.15 | ieatlint | the symbian google maps app isn't terrible for instance |
| 23:56.17 | DocScrutinizer | so maybe Nokia made sure harmattan looks like android to google? |
| 23:56.24 | ieatlint | and they provide the only maps support for iphone |
| 23:56.48 | Venemo | sure, and apple paid for them to do that |
| 23:56.56 | DocScrutinizer | I think google knew about the N900 |
| 23:57.40 | Venemo | what did they know about it? |
| 23:57.57 | ieatlint | i really just want the new software update |
| 23:58.02 | DocScrutinizer | aah, no. microB google bookmark told google about "N900" in a parameter |
| 23:58.07 | Venemo | ieatlint, yeah, me too |
| 23:58.22 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer, yep |
| 23:58.43 | DocScrutinizer | I drpped by youtube a few hors ago - was nice |
| 23:58.44 | Venemo | I'm hoping they fixed the bug which is there when I enable rotation in the tasklauncher |
| 23:59.15 | Venemo | oh btw - swipe is a lot more convenient from either top or bottom than left or right |
| 23:59.30 | Venemo | because of that plastic edge around the screen |
| 23:59.32 | ieatlint | youtube support is awesome |
