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| 00:00.57 | thp | npm: i think the one i have (randomly searched on amazon.at) is from mumbi |
| 00:02.29 | thp | npm: if you search for B004E29SMG on http://www.amazon.at/ you'll find it. but the cr-115 suggested by Jare also looks good |
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| 02:18.31 | Markion | Hello |
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| 02:40.33 | itsnotabigtruck | jare thp: any opinions on cases? |
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| 05:29.59 | DocScrutinizer | ~moo |
| 05:29.59 | infobot | ACTION mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass |
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| 05:48.45 | ieatlint | hahaha, a wanted rapist tried to pick up a female police officer in uniform in my hometown |
| 05:48.55 | ieatlint | apparently it didn't work as hoped.. |
| 05:49.10 | kralor | fail |
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| 06:17.55 | ZogG_laptop | kralor: it's not actually fail |
| 06:18.04 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: better die trying =) |
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| 06:24.05 | Jare | itsnotabigtruck: well i've been using this one from Nokia for a couple of months now http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/accessories/carrying-cases-and-style/carrying-cases/nokia-carrying-case-cp-571-for-nokia-n9. I like the ergonomics of it, but quality wise it's rubbish. The "leather" feels more like vinyl and it's already breaking from one corner |
| 06:24.34 | Jare | itsnotabigtruck: i've been thinking of buying this one soon: http://www.noreve.com/langue/en/product/Nokia_N9-00_Tradition_leather_case.html |
| 06:24.37 | itsnotabigtruck | jare: hmm...i was thinking about that one, better avoid it then |
| 06:24.42 | itsnotabigtruck | doesn't help that it seems impossible to find |
| 06:25.01 | itsnotabigtruck | i think they might have discontinued the 571 (the 572 for the lumia is more available, same but without the hole for the flash) |
| 06:25.17 | itsnotabigtruck | the noreve looks good, but i'm worried about the whole folding part |
| 06:26.11 | Jare | folding part in that design or noreve? |
| 06:28.53 | Jare | there are some really nice leather pouches in the market too, but I don't like the idea of always using two hands to get access to my phone |
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| 07:22.22 | ieatlint | ZogG_laptop: there's trying, and there's walking up to a uniformed cop while being a wanted rapist and trying to hit on her, including offering your name which she then looked up on a computer and discovered his status |
| 07:22.39 | ieatlint | that's pretty big fail |
| 07:24.53 | ieatlint | also, tizen made a release of some sort? that's actually being taken seriously? |
| 07:26.21 | dm8tbr | ieatlint: seems after people had cloned everything anyway out of their git, there was no turning back, but I wonder who really cares... |
| 07:26.56 | ieatlint | yeah... |
| 07:27.15 | ieatlint | so unfortunate, but both nokia and intel killed any prospect of such a thing |
| 07:27.48 | ieatlint | (and yes, intel didn't have clean hands.. both companies threw millions at it, but if you ever saw the meego tablet ux, you'd see it too was doomed) |
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| 09:04.38 | auenf | rofl, just watching a youtube video |
| 09:04.49 | auenf | and ad for N9 came up at the start |
| 09:08.50 | RST38h | Ok, so Microsoft did not have any presence at CES, they used Nokia's keynote and booth instead |
| 09:09.30 | RST38h | Saved themselves some money from that $1B bribe... |
| 09:14.21 | ieatlint | you're in vegas? |
| 09:14.52 | ieatlint | because you should be drunk right now in a bar/strip club |
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| 09:17.43 | lucido | vxzOtÿ" Entered: "±³w:Àí |
| 09:18.43 | lucido | only difference in debug output is the missing double quotes at the end of the hash value of the entered password |
| 09:28.40 | jonni | lucido: works better if you base64 encode & decode it to gconf |
| 09:31.02 | jonni | (as without your hash string can have null characters in it, which will lead to failure on compare) |
| 09:32.48 | jonni | so its better to compare base64 encoded hashes |
| 09:35.59 | RST38h | ieatlint: I am in Moscow right now, and sober like a doorknob. |
| 09:37.03 | alterego | My freakin' simulator doesn't have an up-to-date version of qt components, lame. |
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| 09:37.11 | RST38h | Still amused by Engadget's report of the Nokia's keynote - it basically looks like Microsoft's keynote, with all the right decorations, Ballmer included |
| 09:39.28 | frals | wait that was a nokia keynote? ;( |
| 09:39.46 | RST38h | apparently |
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| 09:59.40 | djszapi | ieatlint: yeah, the pre-alpha tizen release is serious :) |
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| 10:11.34 | djszapi | interesting, they still have debian format, but will change to rpm.. |
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| 10:22.11 | lucido | jonni, thanks |
| 10:26.10 | lucido | in wml, how I have several text input items and I'd like to change the enter key on the virtual keyboard to next so the input jumps to the next text input |
| 10:26.21 | lucido | qml* |
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| 10:51.54 | jonni | lucido: use Keys.onReturnPressed and FocusScope, like http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/qdeclarativefocus.html , or make custom keyevent handler in c++ |
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| 11:38.13 | Avengence | so, nobody knows anything about messageserver? |
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| 11:40.01 | Avengence | this is getting frustrating... I had working email yesterday but the logging was exhausting /tmp so I killed messageserver and restarted it in order to delete the log (it leaves the file handle open) but since that restart it claims it can't find the files under .qmf under homedir. so I have a feeling I'm really not running it the right way (wrong user id, missing params, etc) |
| 11:40.46 | jonni | reboot :) |
| 11:41.31 | Avengence | jonni: problem is that messageserver doesn't start at boot |
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| 11:41.49 | Avengence | figuring that out is why I turned on logging. |
| 11:41.53 | djszapi | Avengence: write an upstart job for that :P |
| 11:42.04 | lucido | start it manually with /sbin/start |
| 11:42.16 | jonni | atleast dont start it by hand :) |
| 11:42.36 | lucido | to debug I mean |
| 11:42.39 | Avengence | djszapi: yesterday I came here asking how startup system works because I want to figure out where it should be starting and why it doesn't |
| 11:43.30 | thp | itsnotabigtruck: i never use any cases, so no suggestions there :/ |
| 11:43.30 | djszapi | Avengence: it is simple ;-) |
| 11:43.39 | Avengence | fenix log tells me that it can't find running messageserver when it starts and there was no log file for messageserver until i ran the thing from terminal so as far as I can tell it's not running at boot |
| 11:44.47 | Avengence | it worked once to run from terminal, and later i hit ctrl-c and ran it again with & so it backgrounded, which worked until i had to kill its pid to delete the log file |
| 11:45.17 | Avengence | lucido: /sbin/start will run it with proper environment or do i need to pass any flags? |
| 11:46.09 | Avengence | djszapi: do you happen to have a link to any reference on upstart, or better, a copy of the config file for whatever should be starting it at boot so I can see what is different on mine? |
| 11:46.27 | lucido | Avengence, it should run it jsut as upstart runs it at boot so you can debug it |
| 11:47.19 | Avengence | the big mystery to me is just what I could have done to not have it running on it's own at boot. it worked after PR1.1, but then after a reboot due to battery exhaustion it stopped working. i didn't have developer mode on then, but flipped it on to debug |
| 11:47.26 | lucido | jsut grep the files in /etc for the name of the msgsrvr binary |
| 11:47.52 | djszapi | please not under /etc |
| 11:47.59 | djszapi | upstart jobs are under /etc/init/ |
| 11:48.07 | Avengence | lucido: ok, will do. stuck working ion terminal since I can't seem to login with ssh |
| 11:48.13 | djszapi | also, it is not "msgsrvr". |
| 11:48.23 | Avengence | its /usr/bin/messageserver |
| 11:48.27 | Avengence | iirc |
| 11:48.28 | djszapi | Avengence: /etc/init//xsession/messageserver.conf |
| 11:48.42 | djszapi | Avengence: that is not the main point :) |
| 11:48.59 | djszapi | exec /usr/bin/aegis-exec -s -u user -l "MAIL_BOOT_NO_WAIT=$PAR1 exec /usr/bin/messageserver" -> so there is a line like that |
| 11:49.07 | lucido | Avengence, is this N9? there is no reason why shouldn't you be able to log in via ssh |
| 11:49.16 | djszapi | either use it in a custom stuff, or start to run it manually for debugging. |
| 11:49.57 | lucido | Avengence, dev mode installed and passwd as user in ion |
| 11:50.06 | Avengence | lucido: yes, N9. from what I read, no root login, but login as user with password set either via passwd or setting lock password. it rejected my lock password and I didn't want to use passwd yet for fear I might not be able to get back in either way |
| 11:50.09 | jonni | lucido: as long as he isnt trying to log in as root :) |
| 11:50.47 | lucido | jonni, yes but you can devel-su once you logged in |
| 11:51.05 | djszapi | in certain cases, I would say, not all the time ;-) |
| 11:51.08 | RST38h | http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/10/tizen-os-exposed-apparently-running-on-an-unknown-samsung-i950/ |
| 11:51.24 | jonni | lucido: yes you can, avengence's problem is that he tried user and not developer :) |
| 11:52.47 | jonni | setting lock password has no affect on user-password, so if some forum states it, then its just wrong info. |
| 11:53.30 | Avengence | jonni: ok, so I should set passwd or user account to use ssh. i guess it defaults to blank so ssh doesn't allow access |
| 11:53.43 | djszapi | mmm, the office-suite has a lacking feature that is wont fix. It does not recall the page you were previously after opening it again. |
| 11:53.51 | Avengence | maybe better to just drop my ssh pubkey on here after I get the other bit sorted |
| 11:53.55 | djszapi | (I hope a simple plugin can fix this, and not platform limitation) |
| 11:54.22 | jonni | Avengence: user ssh developer@192.168.2.15 and read passwd from sdk connectivity tool, or set passwd to user account and use ssh user@.... |
| 11:55.30 | Avengence | i was going based on instructions from PR1.0 that said to edit the sshd_config to turn off root login and set password for user with passwd. someone wrote an update to that saying PR1.1 fixes the root login hole and setting lockscreen password will set user password, but obvious only the first half of that claim is true. |
| 11:55.33 | jonni | by default you should only ssh to developer@192.168.2.15, all other usernames are not meant to be used |
| 11:56.21 | Avengence | I'm glad I asked again today since yesterday it seemed nobody here was alive when I first asked about messageserver |
| 11:57.02 | Avengence | jonni: is developer password static (which I should change) or something different per device that I need to get through SDK tools (not installed) |
| 11:57.43 | jonni | Avengence: it changes everytime you start sdk connectivity tool, but you can set it manually or upload ssh key to developer |
| 11:58.19 | jonni | ie its random |
| 11:58.49 | Avengence | ok, i'll drop in ssh keys for both user and developer at somepoint (so i can be either as needed) |
| 11:59.21 | Avengence | I'd probably have an easier time if I started from normal, but since somethinh borked email I' |
| 11:59.26 | Avengence | m chasing that first |
| 12:01.01 | Avengence | I assume upstart runs as root so going to try the stuff from messageserver.conf as root |
| 12:01.52 | jonni | but aegis-exec starts messageserver as user, so most likely it reads the conf as user .) |
| 12:02.25 | Avengence | aegis-exec gets -u user as a parameter |
| 12:02.35 | djszapi | plus -s |
| 12:02.41 | Avengence | so i asssume it runs as root as switches to user to run the rest |
| 12:02.59 | djszapi | yeah, as jonni said :) |
| 12:07.42 | jonni | one things that you might want to check is to check if /home/user/.qmf is user owned and all the recursive files inside it too. Just in case someone/you have started messageserver as root accidentally at somepoint |
| 12:08.17 | jonni | and ownerships could have messed up |
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| 12:08.31 | Avengence | AHA! the check just before running message server, where it calls qmftool to see that there are any accounts, throughs a message in syslog saying that the account is using wrong XML from groups |
| 12:09.03 | Avengence | please change to <group name="settings"> for the gmail.service |
| 12:09.25 | djszapi | jonni: that would be nasty without the proper credential which is not available without developer mode ;-) |
| 12:10.20 | Avengence | i only ran messageserver as user and I see the upstart script will fix permissions on the /usr/home/.qmf stuff |
| 12:12.25 | Avengence | great, there's 4 sections of group name=somestring, so which of the 4 are making the 2 messages in syslog saying to use group name="settings" |
| 12:12.28 | djszapi | yep, you are right about that: chown user:users $QDIR |
| 12:13.00 | Avengence | though, that's not a recursive chown |
| 12:13.06 | djszapi | that does not matter. |
| 12:13.17 | djszapi | since it is created at that point |
| 12:13.41 | djszapi | so "subfolders" will inherit this setting since qmftool is also run as user |
| 12:14.25 | Avengence | reading again, it only sets that if it has to make the dir so it doesn't fix perms |
| 12:14.58 | Avengence | but, that means people with hte 100% cpu use issue can just kill .qmf dir and it's all remade for them correctly |
| 12:15.26 | djszapi | but you need to create that once, right ? |
| 12:15.43 | djszapi | and when it is created, it is created properly. |
| 12:16.02 | Avengence | no, the script will create it completely. it kills and remakes the temp dir, but if the whole .qmf dir is missing it will make it from scratch |
| 12:16.14 | djszapi | that is what I am saying |
| 12:16.19 | djszapi | the script will create it for you ... |
| 12:16.24 | djszapi | too much worry for nothing ;-) |
| 12:16.25 | Avengence | I can't help but notice the comment about the result of qmftool does not match the usage that qmftool prints |
| 12:16.26 | jonni | but if files get wrong ownership by accidentally running messageserver as root, you can try fixing by recursive chown |
| 12:17.18 | djszapi | that is why I said, that would be nasty from platform developers |
| 12:17.47 | jonni | Avengence: so either figure out why gmail xml settings are messed up, or delete and recreate the account :) |
| 12:17.48 | djszapi | but I do not think they set user folders to root anyway |
| 12:18.08 | jonni | not the folder, but I was thinking about individual emails that it fetches |
| 12:18.23 | djszapi | and an average user cannot change the chown things |
| 12:18.48 | djszapi | same category, mails (which are also files then) should not be changed to root under ~user |
| 12:19.01 | Avengence | the gmail file it complains about is in /usr/share/accounts/services and is owned by root. so, i think that's essentially a definition of basic gmail settings used like template when adding the account |
| 12:19.06 | djszapi | I do hope platform devs do not do that :) |
| 12:19.45 | jonni | ah yes, and that mail dir doesnt have +w to root, so no way it gets corrupted. |
| 12:20.12 | jonni | so mostly Avengence currently has some email setting/xml bug |
| 12:20.28 | djszapi | jonni: but platform devs are not "root" :) |
| 12:20.39 | Avengence | all perms on the qmf dir are proper |
| 12:20.41 | djszapi | so they could actually change it still, but I hope they do not do that. |
| 12:21.29 | Avengence | i am starting to think something in the PR1.1 OTA update went wrong and some files maybe got reverted to what they were in 1.0 after second reboot |
| 12:22.04 | jonni | in that case removing and recreating the account should do the trick |
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| 12:26.00 | Avengence | yeah, i will delete the gmail account, reboot and see if rest work normally |
| 12:26.54 | Avengence | though I'm not sure that will help as I just checked to see qmftool is spraying a warning into syslog, but it still returns 0 as it should so the script should go on to start messageserver |
| 12:29.54 | jonni | ah that xml warning comes for me too, so its just a feature :) |
| 12:31.40 | Avengence | ok, so the devs need to fix up the gmail.services file |
| 12:32.14 | jonni | gmail mails get updated just fine even with that warning |
| 12:33.23 | jonni | Avengence: maybe you havent enabled the scheduler for each of the email account, or how ofter your settings fetch the mail? |
| 12:34.14 | Avengence | well, it looks like that worked. after reboot, it was really slow, took a few seconds to open mail, and hitting refresh causes a notifications that "Error occurred". I went to terminal and can see messageserver is running, but was probably busy sorting itself out. a moment later I got a notification that I got new mail on one of the other acccounts |
| 12:34.28 | Avengence | jonni: I set all my account to Always Up-to Date |
| 12:34.42 | Avengence | which I asssume means use IMAP IDLE |
| 12:35.19 | Avengence | i had 10min for on and off peak before, but changed it when I first stopped getting mail |
| 12:35.29 | djszapi | one a side note: fetching emails is really slow for some reasons. 100 emails / 10 minutes or so with proper 3.5G connection |
| 12:35.30 | jonni | Avengence: and you've setup it on each account seperately? I've made a mistake in beginnign thinking that it was global value, untill i noticed that each one needs seperate config |
| 12:35.35 | djszapi | on* |
| 12:35.39 | Avengence | it was some time later that I flipped on developer mode to find that messageserver was simply NOT running at all |
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| 12:36.23 | jonni | but good that its working now, hopefully it still works when you readd the gmail |
| 12:37.16 | Avengence | if you read the log from messageserver, you can see it frequently updates it's indexes and checks flags for all messages, so it could be a bit slow especially if you have high latency. I'm doing this over wifi to dsl since I'm out of my home country and rather not pay data roaming |
| 12:37.39 | djszapi | yes, but it is really slow |
| 12:37.41 | Avengence | yep, that is next step, add gmail account, let it fetch, then reboot again and see if it all still works |
| 12:37.50 | djszapi | ten minutes to start doing anything at then, like 10 seconds per mail |
| 12:38.08 | djszapi | I become grey by the time it fetches the qt5-development@ mailing list :) |
| 12:38.44 | djszapi | it is like that on Android or other phones I tried. |
| 12:38.49 | djszapi | not* |
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| 12:39.25 | jonni | I have 8700 mails in my inbox, and 1st run was pretty fast |
| 12:39.42 | jonni | only took few minutes' |
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| 12:39.59 | Avengence | i have over 11000 in my main inbox but it only fetched some small subset and I haven't found a way to make it fetch them ALL |
| 12:40.14 | djszapi | I have also tried the same sim card with the same 3.5G connection in Lumia, and it was way faster. |
| 12:42.24 | djszapi | after 2-3 weeks winter vacation, it had worked for 20-30 minutes, I think to fetch the mails only into one inbox. |
| 12:43.02 | djszapi | so even if there is this NOA account enabler plugin getting this very traffic at certain hours, it is not because of that. |
| 12:43.29 | *** part/#harmattan sebas (~skue@opensuse/member/vizzzion) |
| 12:58.03 | amppa | doh, my application failed store QA |
| 12:58.18 | amppa | seems like they're testing with PR 1.0 |
| 12:58.30 | Avengence | hmm, i just noticed that IMAP accounts have setting for number of messages stored on device with All as an option, but gmail account does not. I wonder if I'd be better off setting up gmail as regular imap instead of google account type |
| 12:58.51 | amppa | splash screen is shown but the application itself shows only black screen |
| 12:59.01 | jonni | amppa: yes every application needs to work with PR1.0 always |
| 12:59.27 | amppa | would anyone have ideas what could cause this in 1.0? |
| 12:59.34 | amppa | looks pretty clear that it's something QML related |
| 12:59.49 | amppa | and works fine in 1.1 devices |
| 12:59.55 | jonni | amppa: cause what? |
| 13:00.08 | amppa | application shows just a black screen |
| 13:00.18 | jonni | amppa: maybe your using some PR1.1 only api, like swipelocking? |
| 13:00.26 | amppa | for me that sounds like QML doesn't load properly since the application obviously starts |
| 13:00.45 | Avengence | can you set min version when submitting your app to the store? |
| 13:00.45 | djszapi | amppa: do you include a qt quick version which is only available in PR1.1 ? |
| 13:00.48 | amppa | jonni: don't think so, it's quite basic QML application |
| 13:00.59 | djszapi | like 1.1 |
| 13:01.00 | amppa | did 1.0 still have Quick 1.0? |
| 13:01.19 | jonni | Avengence: no you cannot, avery N9 application needs to work with PR1.0 |
| 13:01.36 | djszapi | I still use this: "import com.nokia.meego 1.0". |
| 13:01.40 | Avengence | ugh, that makes it more difficult to use new APIs |
| 13:01.53 | amppa | since yeah, i'm importing QtQuick 1.1 |
| 13:01.55 | djszapi | not sure that is any culsprit though, just saying. :) |
| 13:02.09 | djszapi | Yeah, I import 1.1, too |
| 13:02.42 | amppa | and that's in the store? shouldn't be it then |
| 13:02.55 | Avengence | well, seems mail is still woring after adding the gmail account and rebooting |
| 13:03.30 | djszapi | amppa: check out the API documentation what is available in PR1.0 |
| 13:03.32 | Avengence | so now I can shut off the logs and reboot again. default location of messageserver log will fill /tmp in less than a day |
| 13:03.56 | *** join/#harmattan tbf_ (~mathias@p57BD752F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:03.56 | amppa | djszapi: yeah, i guess i'll have to do that |
| 13:04.13 | amppa | just.. it's a basic QML application, no platform apis used |
| 13:04.20 | djszapi | but QtQuick is coming with 4.7.4 afaik |
| 13:04.24 | djszapi | along* |
| 13:04.40 | djszapi | check the qt version in PR1.0 |
| 13:04.49 | djszapi | QtQuick1.1, that is |
| 13:04.57 | amppa | any idea if the forum nokia remote device access has N9? |
| 13:05.06 | djszapi | it has |
| 13:05.33 | jonni | amppa: have you checked your debian package that does it have the qml in it, or embedded .qrc |
| 13:05.47 | *** join/#harmattan ab (~ab@pdpc/supporter/professional/ab) |
| 13:05.50 | amppa | jonni: i've given the .deb for a friend to test |
| 13:05.53 | amppa | worked like a charm |
| 13:06.01 | jonni | ah |
| 13:06.03 | amppa | though that was a developer-enabled PR1.1 device as well |
| 13:06.34 | amppa | but yeah, i guess i can debug with RDA then |
| 13:06.49 | djszapi | amppa: why do you use plain qml by the way ? |
| 13:07.06 | amppa | it's qml components |
| 13:07.31 | amppa | with plain qml i meant i don't use meego specific C++ apis |
| 13:07.53 | djszapi | right, so you use at least "com.nokia.meego" ? |
| 13:08.04 | jonni | I can downgrade one of my N9's back to PR1.0 if RDA doesnt solve it... |
| 13:08.19 | amppa | djszapi: sure, import com.nokia.meego 1.0 |
| 13:08.38 | djszapi | amppa: that sounds ok to me. |
| 13:09.07 | amppa | jonni: thanks for offering, let's hope i can solve this some easier way though :) |
| 13:09.22 | deram | jonni: isn't downgrading impossible on N9? |
| 13:09.40 | djszapi | well, we internals can do that :) |
| 13:09.52 | deram | oh, didn't think about that |
| 13:10.09 | djszapi | actually my N950 still has PR1.0 |
| 13:10.44 | *** join/#harmattan lamikr (lamikr@nat/nokia/x-ismlrlhorbcaasrl) |
| 13:14.53 | jonni | that reminds be that my ovi store app has been in QA process for the last 6 days... |
| 13:16.14 | jonni | already added global orientationlock to it, but 1st I need to wait for previous version even be released, before I submit update. |
| 13:18.02 | *** join/#harmattan briglia (~briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:25.10 | *** join/#harmattan JackaLX (~steve@sxemacs/project-lead/JackaLX) |
| 13:28.39 | Sazpaimon | so like |
| 13:28.47 | Sazpaimon | does nokia now have 3 phones that are nearly identical looking? |
| 13:30.11 | djszapi | which 3 ? |
| 13:30.42 | Sazpaimon | N9 Lumia 800 and 900 |
| 13:30.51 | Sazpaimon | http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2012/01/nokia900gallery06.jpg |
| 13:31.08 | mgedmin | is it the big ugly one on the left? |
| 13:31.08 | Sazpaimon | http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2012/01/nokia900gallery10.jpg |
| 13:31.20 | Sazpaimon | 900 is the one on the left yeah |
| 13:31.37 | kevin_b | the black N9 is really stylish |
| 13:31.48 | kevin_b | best design ever |
| 13:31.57 | X-Fade | Nah, white one :) |
| 13:32.00 | kevin_b | ok |
| 13:32.16 | djszapi | Sazpaimon: interesting, thanks. I did not know there are two types of Lumia. |
| 13:32.30 | Sazpaimon | 900 is coming to AT&T as well |
| 13:32.39 | kevin_b | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:33.13 | Sazpaimon | the 900 looks just like the 800/N9 but with a larger body to make it the same screen size as the N9 |
| 13:33.22 | Sazpaimon | to make room for the windows keys |
| 13:33.33 | kevin_b | God, both harmattan OS and the talent of Nokia could screw the market |
| 13:33.35 | gabriel9 | i need n950 >_< |
| 13:33.48 | Sazpaimon | gabriel9, you can get one |
| 13:34.03 | Sazpaimon | just be willing to deal pay about $1600 for one |
| 13:34.03 | Avengence | ok, next fun quetsion: How do I view a stored password for an email account already configured on the N9? my laptop crapped out a few days ago and I may well ahve lost all the data on it, including stored passwords. |
| 13:34.13 | gabriel9 | oh well if i ever find time to finsih my apps for n9 |
| 13:34.27 | gabriel9 | ouch |
| 13:34.30 | gabriel9 | 1600 |
| 13:34.36 | gabriel9 | i can buy slave for that |
| 13:34.38 | Sazpaimon | thats what Ive seen a few go for |
| 13:34.41 | mgedmin | Avengence, hm, sniff network traffic on your router? |
| 13:35.13 | Sazpaimon | and even then there's a chance that the imei will get blacklisted on you |
| 13:35.25 | Avengence | mgedmin: would need SSL proxy for that... |
| 13:35.43 | Avengence | MITM myself |
| 13:36.08 | mgedmin | you can turn off SSL on the N9 without knowing the password :) |
| 13:36.12 | Avengence | Sazpaimon: where do you buy a N950. I'd have paid that if I had not already paid 600EUR for N9... |
| 13:37.46 | Avengence | I called Nokia and asked where to buy N950 when it first was released to developers. They called me back a few days later to say I can't buy it, I could only apply for one as a developer but all where already given out at that point so no chance unless they decided to make more. I literally asdked on the phone "How much do i have to pay to get a N950? I don't care, just name a price!" and they said NO |
| 13:37.49 | jonni | Avengence: Charles proxy is great for SSL debugging, but its commercial, but there is free trial though |
| 13:38.12 | Avengence | mgedmin: doesn't work if the server doesn't allow plaintext IMAP |
| 13:38.39 | mgedmin | hm, so the N9 won't even send the password then? |
| 13:38.44 | gabriel9 | what do you think is there any way for new phone like n9? |
| 13:38.50 | mgedmin | set up a fake netcat server |
| 13:39.01 | mgedmin | more seriously, though, I don't know where the N9 stores its passwords |
| 13:39.14 | mgedmin | I wouldn't be surprised to learn they're in encrypted aegisfs storage or something |
| 13:39.17 | nid0 | obvious question though, can't you just change the account's password? |
| 13:39.28 | Avengence | jonni: I have used some SSL proxies that are free for sniffing web traffic and assume same works for other SSL/TLS connections |
| 13:40.37 | Avengence | mgedmin: if it doesn't get a connetion, then it won't just blindly send login data. it won't even try to send password until after getting a response to sending user name (in accordance with IMAP protocol) |
| 13:40.47 | jonni | Avengence: yeah there are free solutions available also, I've just used charlie abit and find it handy, you can always use tcpdump inside N9 too :) |
| 13:41.20 | Avengence | nid0: nope, don't have any access to most stuff since I have no access to my ssh keys until I get home and pull out a backup disk (which has the stored passwords anyway) |
| 13:42.02 | Avengence | I found info on getting passwords from N900 but that does not apply to N9/N950 |
| 13:42.11 | Sazpaimon | Avengence, ask around |
| 13:42.18 | Sazpaimon | put up a WTB ad somewhere |
| 13:43.01 | Avengence | i did at least find how to extact the wifi password, but it requires some work since gconf spits it out in decimal instead of hex |
| 13:43.07 | Sazpaimon | you will be getting it second hand, which is illegal |
| 13:43.14 | Sazpaimon | and you'll essentially be recieving stolen property |
| 13:43.53 | Avengence | Sazpaimon: i'll wait until nokia figures out there's market demand for a real keyboard. now that I have the N9, I can't justify spending that much just to get a keyboard |
| 13:44.13 | Avengence | i was hoping they got a clue and were taking orders for the 950 |
| 13:44.14 | jonni | use bt keyboard :) |
| 13:44.32 | Sazpaimon | you can spend less money and build your own case with a builtin usb keyboard |
| 13:44.37 | Sazpaimon | or bluetooth |
| 13:44.55 | deram | jonni: does that work already? tried with one before, and it got paired, but nothing happened |
| 13:45.05 | Avengence | yeah, I was about to say, I want it attached so I can hold it as one unit to use while moving |
| 13:45.07 | Sazpaimon | learn how to mold plastic and have a blst |
| 13:45.15 | mgedmin | oh I hate being unable to ping my n9 despite it showing up as online & connected |
| 13:45.58 | jonni | deram: worked for me atleast, and I posted the patch for enabling fullscreen terminal on forums when using bt hidd connection |
| 13:46.30 | deram | jonni: ok, I'll check that post and try again then.. |
| 13:46.36 | djszapi | Avengence: you always have the open mode for that btw :) |
| 13:46.42 | Avengence | this probably sounds dumb, but how do I ask the N9 what it's current IP is? I had to use nmap to find it, and it took a couple runs of that to realize that ping is not honoured so had to toss another flag to nmap to just look for ssh without icmp response |
| 13:47.24 | Avengence | ifconfig doen't seem to exist.. feels like solaris |
| 13:47.37 | Aard | ip addr sh |
| 13:47.39 | jonni | Avengence: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=5310&highlight=widget there is widget for that |
| 13:47.53 | jonni | Avengence: if you dont want to use console :) |
| 13:48.22 | Aard | though I do have ifconfig on my n9, probably comes with some update |
| 13:48.33 | djszapi | Avengence: /sbin/ifconfig ? |
| 13:48.49 | jonni | and yes there is ifconfig under sbin too |
| 13:49.41 | Avengence | ahh, yes, it's in /sbin. thanks djszapi |
| 13:50.01 | Avengence | i was expecting /sbin, /usr/sbin etc to be in path at least as root if not always |
| 13:50.02 | Piru | I wrote an app that updates my .mobi domain at ifup by using gandi.net website ;-) |
| 13:50.04 | mgedmin | Avengence, 'ip a' just works |
| 13:50.08 | Avengence | guess i'll have to fix the paths up |
| 13:50.20 | mgedmin | /sbin is in $PATH when you do devel-su - |
| 13:50.21 | djszapi | Avengence: on the device, it is not |
| 13:50.23 | mgedmin | with the - |
| 13:50.26 | Piru | so I can always ssh into my n9 easily |
| 13:50.28 | mgedmin | hates su, misses sudo |
| 13:50.30 | djszapi | Avengence: with that shell by default. |
| 13:50.36 | mgedmin | the N9 responds to pings, but only after a while |
| 13:50.41 | mgedmin | sometimes it's a long while |
| 13:50.48 | djszapi | Avengence: it should work properly over ssh though. |
| 13:50.55 | Avengence | I'm more a BSD guy than linux user, so I have to learn all the quirks |
| 13:51.15 | Avengence | i tried devel-su though not with the - |
| 13:51.21 | Piru | you don't been to su for ifconfig |
| 13:51.27 | Piru | just give the full path |
| 13:51.29 | mgedmin | I never do the - either... |
| 13:51.40 | mgedmin | 'ip a' is shorter to type anyway |
| 13:51.46 | Avengence | I guess its really su and not sudo. Maybe need to port that |
| 13:51.55 | mgedmin | would aegis let you? |
| 13:52.07 | djszapi | you cannot port the traditional "sudo" :) |
| 13:52.20 | mgedmin | so, I ssh into my n9 (eventually, grr those ARP troubles) so I can look for wifi passwords for Avengence |
| 13:52.21 | djszapi | unless either with custom kernel, or opensh |
| 13:52.24 | mgedmin | and realize I've no idea where to look |
| 13:52.50 | Avengence | mgedmin: i know where to get wifi password. its email password I'm looking for |
| 13:53.17 | Piru | I just ssh in as root... screw devel-su ;) |
| 13:53.27 | djszapi | the problem is that the db in the aegisfs is tied to the application id of the creator. |
| 13:53.27 | Avengence | easiest might be to just spoof dns to point to a imapd on the laptop, turn off ssl/tls on the n9 and log the attempt |
| 13:53.36 | mgedmin | Avengence, idea: MyDocs/.backups/Backup0/settings.zip |
| 13:53.44 | mgedmin | I see an accounts.db.bak there |
| 13:54.26 | mgedmin | it's an sqlite DB... no sign of passwords, though |
| 13:54.50 | Avengence | I found the accounts.db file and took a peek but didn't see the passwords, so they are obfuscated if present. I didn't use sqlite to view it, just vi and a quick scan through (as I do know at least the gmail password) |
| 13:55.06 | *** join/#harmattan hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net) |
| 13:55.47 | djszapi | Avengence: that is why I said you cannot encrypt it since you did not create that |
| 13:55.52 | djszapi | ;) |
| 13:56.05 | mgedmin | Avengence, /home/user/.signon/backup/signon.db |
| 13:56.27 | mgedmin | dpm |
| 13:56.29 | mgedmin | err |
| 13:56.33 | mgedmin | don't see passwords yet... |
| 13:56.45 | djszapi | ofc |
| 13:56.58 | mgedmin | but the word 'password' does appear in there |
| 13:57.00 | Avengence | I wish I was learning about N9 in a more structured way, rather than crashcourse because the laptop died while I'm in a foreign country for at least a few more weeks |
| 13:58.03 | mgedmin | there's a 'signonfs' in my backup zip, that looks like a LUKS-encrypted filesystem image? |
| 13:58.22 | mgedmin | my gut feeling is that the passwords are there |
| 13:59.03 | mgedmin | I think it's mounted on /home/user/.signon/private |
| 13:59.10 | djszapi | LUKS is a history |
| 13:59.16 | djszapi | that was the idea, we do not use it anymore. |
| 13:59.42 | mgedmin | fuse.aegisfs doesn't sound very LUKS-like |
| 13:59.47 | djszapi | assume y ou are using PR1.1 or higher |
| 13:59.49 | djszapi | /home/user/.signon/signon.db but that does not contain secret data |
| 14:00.03 | djszapi | the db is under it's under /home/user/.signon/private |
| 14:00.12 | mgedmin | but in the backup zip files you can't make use of fancy OS-provided services, it's just bits |
| 14:00.12 | djszapi | aegisfs is the new way, not LUKS |
| 14:00.22 | djszapi | and aegisfs is based on the upstream fusefs user space file system |
| 14:00.35 | Avengence | so under private, but aegis will not let me read from there |
| 14:00.39 | djszapi | ofc not |
| 14:01.06 | djszapi | unless you hack the right application creating it with the same application id requested in the manifest file =) |
| 14:01.48 | mgedmin | I don't suppose you can strace the email checking app and get it that way? |
| 14:01.53 | Avengence | short of replacing aegis with something more permissive, easier to just use ssl proxy or trap it via dns spoofing |
| 14:02.34 | mgedmin | goes into Accounts and sees that his Facebook account is just! gone! poof! like it was never there! what the fuck, harmattan? |
| 14:02.34 | djszapi | I believe the only way would be to make an app with the same aegis configuration as the email client and do a trace in it, do a signon session with method "password" and you should get it out, I believe email signon identities are stored to use the "password" method |
| 14:03.07 | Avengence | important thing is I can get mail on my N9 again so I have access to all my email albeit in limited fashion |
| 14:03.13 | djszapi | by default reading stored passwords should be impossible, in case of email, using dbus monitor might reveal it (unless email has encryption token defined) |
| 14:04.09 | Avengence | so now I can put some time into getting stuff installed on this alternate laptop and then see about rescuing the disk from the other laptop. it make some bad clicking sounds and then everything just froze, so I don't want to spin up that disk until I'm ready to go at it with ddrescue |
| 14:05.13 | X-Fade | Avengence: Can't you just reset the password? Most of the time that is a lot easier? |
| 14:05.52 | Avengence | X-Fade: if I had access to my ssh keys to get to the server I could do that, but those are trapped same as the storred password on the laptop that went dead a couple days ago |
| 14:06.17 | X-Fade | Avengence: And nobody else has access? |
| 14:06.39 | Avengence | nope, I'm the only admin of my personal mail server |
| 14:07.05 | X-Fade | Avengence: So, you locked the door and threw away the keys? :) |
| 14:07.28 | mgedmin | could be worse: imagine if it was the hard drive on the _server_ that broke down |
| 14:07.35 | mgedmin | how many kilometers away are you? |
| 14:08.11 | Avengence | of course, I have a backup disk that i was using, but the laptop ceased to be able to 'see' it when I last tried so I didn't bring it on this trip |
| 14:08.53 | mgedmin | "oh, the backups broke down; no rush, I'll just fix them whenever -- surely nothing bad is going to happen to my primary disk during _this_ trip" |
| 14:08.59 | Avengence | the server is in france, home (with backup disks) is in czech republic, currently sitting in croatia |
| 14:10.18 | Avengence | oh, the backups aren't working, I have only a day before I have to leave the country to wait out a visa process that takes a few months... and there's still unfilled paperwork but I can't legally stay in EU so someone has to file the last bits for me, and I still need to get the airline to confirm transport of my cat... |
| 14:11.00 | Avengence | so, I may have lost all the pictures I took here but most of the rest should be ok when I get back |
| 14:11.04 | mgedmin | Murphy is strong |
| 14:11.18 | djszapi | Avengence: btw, SSL proxy will not help anyway. best option to get passwds is to take backup, restore it to pr1.0 device, preferably with rd certificates, so that root can read mounted loopback files, and then you can copy signon database and check stored password |
| 14:11.22 | mgedmin | looks at his recently dead laptop PSU sadly |
| 14:11.39 | djszapi | Avengence: I could probably help with the R&D certificate part. |
| 14:11.46 | djszapi | but then I will know your stuff :D |
| 14:12.32 | Avengence | why wouldn't ssl proxy work? If it just pretends to be the server and undoes/redoes the ssl wrapping it should be able to sniff the password |
| 14:13.08 | Avengence | the R&D certs trick doesn't work in 1.1? |
| 14:14.31 | mgedmin | still, how about the backup zip as an attack vector? |
| 14:14.45 | mgedmin | it has the passwords in it (encrypted), hasn't it? |
| 14:15.03 | mgedmin | do you need a secret key embedded in the N9 hardware to decrypt it or what? |
| 14:20.45 | Avengence | if the backup file is encrypted with a key that is copied out, then its possible to use worm to read the whole backup from infected pc |
| 14:21.13 | Avengence | on the other hand, it's impossible to restore to new hardware unless any decryption keys are in the backup |
| 14:21.16 | thp | is there any prebuilt component for doing the "overscroll to show search bar" thingie in a QML ListView (e.g. like in the messages or music apps)? |
| 14:21.54 | djszapi | "there is no decryption key on the device" |
| 14:22.51 | djszapi | thp: I do not think so, but it is not hard to make it work ;-) |
| 14:23.11 | frals | thp: pretty sure there isnt |
| 14:23.15 | thp | djszapi: is there example code somewhere, so I don't have to experiment with the flickable properties myself? |
| 14:24.12 | djszapi | thp: imho, you can hide it in the beginning, and then reveal for flickering, that is all |
| 14:25.13 | Avengence | so then the backup could be attacked, but still sounds easier to use proxy. not sure why that wouldn't work. the server cert already does not match hostname and N9 is ok with that |
| 14:25.35 | *** join/#harmattan rm_work (~rm_you@2605:2700:0:3::4713:9326) |
| 14:25.35 | *** join/#harmattan rm_work (~rm_you@Maemo/community/cssu/rm-you) |
| 14:25.38 | djszapi | how could it be attacked ? |
| 14:25.49 | djszapi | for an external ? |
| 14:27.19 | Avengence | if theres no encryption key stored solely on the device, meaning the backup can be restored onto another device (sensible use case), then copy backup off and go at it on laptop |
| 14:27.40 | djszapi | but you cannot encrypt that |
| 14:27.44 | djszapi | just the process which created it. |
| 14:27.50 | djszapi | That is the whole point as far as I understand. |
| 14:28.03 | djszapi | that is what the application ID is used for over there. |
| 14:28.12 | Avengence | key recovery using patrial known plaintext |
| 14:28.14 | flux | btw, is there a tool that would a) automatically activate the backup mechanism and b) copy the backups off the device? |
| 14:29.31 | Avengence | when the backup is copied off, there is nothing to stop me from looking at all the bits. would help to know algorithm used and whatnot |
| 14:32.24 | *** join/#harmattan JackaLX (~steve@bastard.steveyoungs.com) |
| 14:32.29 | *** join/#harmattan JackaLX (~steve@sxemacs/project-lead/JackaLX) |
| 14:33.04 | Avengence | argh, I hate freenode. "WHOIS This command could not be completed because it has been used recently, and is rate-limited." funny, first time i ussues that since connecting. i guess the rate limit is 0 |
| 14:33.37 | *** join/#harmattan JackaLX (~steve@sxemacs/project-lead/JackaLX) |
| 14:33.54 | flux | avengence, your irc client could be issuing WHOIS behind your back :) |
| 14:34.57 | Avengence | maybe... i did just install it yesterday and did almost no configuration, but if it was i should see a mess of those rate limit messages from the server for all the times it issues a whois on its own |
| 14:35.23 | flux | for example irssi knows some rate limit parameters of the servers and knows to avoid them |
| 14:35.42 | flux | althoguh it sounds a bit stupid if an irc client would do all that, but then not limit user-requested WHOIS |
| 14:36.41 | Avengence | i'm using Konversation, which I hadn't tried before but figured I'd give it a go on this system since xchat bugs were really bothering me on the other laptop |
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| 15:20.46 | kulve | what's the correct location for control panel desktop-files? /usr/lib/duicontrolpanel or /usr/share/duicontrolpanel/desktops? |
| 15:28.12 | kulve | I guess the /usr/lib/duicontrolpanel even though the docs seem to say the latter |
| 15:28.47 | kulve | I'm trying to get a settings applet visible using the libdeclarative.so but my desktop entry isn't shown there |
| 15:32.13 | kulve | argh, nm. I missed one crucial line from the desktop file.. |
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| 15:35.43 | kevin_b | 'lo guys |
| 15:35.49 | kulve | this indicates the wrong directory still: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/guide/html/Developer_Library_Best_practices_for_application_development_Storing_and_managing_application_settings_Example_of_managing_settings_with_Control_Panel_Applets.html |
| 15:35.55 | kevin_b | I'd like to unlock device with a custom gesture |
| 15:36.12 | kevin_b | Any app doing that? |
| 15:36.49 | X-Fade | Pick a word and use swype? |
| 15:37.26 | X-Fade | That'll make for a complicated gesture :) |
| 15:37.27 | kevin_b | so you mean this is natively supported? I can unlock with a swype? |
| 15:37.42 | X-Fade | notice y not i. |
| 15:38.00 | X-Fade | Swype is the input method. |
| 15:39.44 | X-Fade | But that is just to enter a password. If you mean something like the android unlock, then I haven't seen it yet. |
| 15:39.45 | kevin_b | Almost what I need |
| 15:40.08 | kevin_b | yea I didnt notive I can swype keyboard on unllocking screen |
| 15:40.13 | kevin_b | thanks for that |
| 15:40.22 | kevin_b | would make it complicated though lol |
| 15:40.40 | X-Fade | well, just learn swipe some very long word :) |
| 15:40.50 | kulve | is the "DirectUI's Declarative Settings Language" documented somewhere? |
| 15:40.51 | X-Fade | See, now I do it too.. Learn swype :) |
| 15:40.56 | kevin_b | So I need to teach swype :D? |
| 15:41.26 | X-Fade | kevin_b: just type a long word, hit the word, and it will ask you if it needs to save it. |
| 15:42.48 | ZogG_laptop | damnit, i'm egzosted with that stupid camera |
| 15:43.02 | ZogG_laptop | there is no way noone tried to use camera in qml |
| 15:43.45 | ZogG_laptop | X-Fade: ping |
| 15:44.11 | X-Fade | ZogG_laptop: yes? |
| 15:44.50 | kevin_b | when I swype a large S on the swipe input method, it doesnt write the 's' |
| 15:44.53 | kevin_b | is that normal? |
| 15:45.01 | ZogG_laptop | X-Fade: what about Qr-code integration in site as download links (for now as simple links) |
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| 15:45.22 | ZogG_laptop | djszapiN9: hey |
| 15:45.23 | X-Fade | ZogG_laptop: Is already a todo in our issue tracker. |
| 15:45.38 | kevin_b | I needs swipe input method lessons :p |
| 15:45.46 | ZogG_laptop | X-Fade: and btw can you make testing/not-testing switch on site global? |
| 15:46.01 | kevin_b | where can we add words to the swipe dictionary |
| 15:46.17 | X-Fade | ZogG_laptop: ? |
| 15:46.17 | ZogG_laptop | kevin_b: you just swype or swipe |
| 15:46.37 | ZogG_laptop | X-Fade: when i go to apps for review and i click on newest i get back to normal apps |
| 15:47.03 | X-Fade | ZogG_laptop: Oh that, yes. Also still a todo. |
| 15:47.12 | ZogG_laptop | X-Fade: :* |
| 15:47.28 | ZogG_laptop | djszapiN9: can you try something for me? |
| 15:47.50 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: ping |
| 15:48.22 | djszapi | ZogG_laptop: shout |
| 15:48.25 | ZogG_laptop | i think that was tricky that Nokia gave n950 and n9 to developers and than gave the same people wp =) |
| 15:48.37 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: sup |
| 15:48.39 | djszapi | (I am sitting on a unity3d presentation though) |
| 15:48.54 | ZogG_laptop | =\ |
| 15:49.25 | ZogG_laptop | unity is a mistake, you need to optimize a lot of things for tablet before optimizing wm |
| 15:49.45 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: anyway, i'll paste some qml code, if you mind to try it |
| 15:49.51 | kevin_b | I discovered swipe I.M it 's great |
| 15:50.08 | kevin_b | everyday harmattan stuns me |
| 15:52.02 | TSCHAK | since when did Nokia ship N9's to devs? |
| 15:52.02 | kevin_b | Best user experience on a phone ever lived |
| 15:53.34 | ZogG_laptop | TSCHAK: on qt dev meeting |
| 15:54.16 | lucido | I'm using QSqlDatabase QSQLITE to store about 500 rows of 4 doubles on an N9 and it takes approximately 30 seconds to complete, how can I buffer queries or speed this up? |
| 15:56.17 | Avengence | any change of installing extra codecs in such a way that the included video player will use them? i.e. quicktime stuff so that videos recorded on iphone and sent by email can be played on N9? they are .mov file and it tries to play but then says unsupported format. they work on the laptop with whatever mess of gstreamer codecs are installed |
| 15:56.25 | Avengence | s/change/chance |
| 15:57.19 | Avengence | I was pleasantly surprised by how nicely the IM stuff integrates into the system just by installing libpurple, telepathy-haze and im-additions |
| 15:59.32 | gabriel9 | just convert them |
| 16:00.54 | jreznik | Avengence: it should work just by installing missing plugins for gstreamer... just someone has to do it first :) |
| 16:10.33 | Avengence | so if i or whoever compile the other gstreamer plugins and drop them in place it'll 'just work' like with the telepathy plugin. good to hear |
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| 16:15.07 | jreznik | is not sure it's going as easy as it sounds but I guess it should work, even the gstreamer plugin dir is on the list of allowed ones |
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| 16:28.06 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2336306/imgrup_0.0.4.beta_armel.deb - menu - camera - can you try? |
| 16:46.25 | ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK: ping |
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| 17:07.09 | lucido | how to handle operations that possible take several seconds, becasue the system says that my app stopped responding and if I want to quit it during long database access operations for example? |
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| 17:11.14 | itsnotabigtruck | lucido: do it in a separate thread, probably |
| 17:11.19 | itsnotabigtruck | keep long running stuff off the gui thread |
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| 17:12.23 | ten0r | hello |
| 17:12.51 | ten0r | id like to use strace on one of the system daemons. but it fails with EPERM, i guess because of aegis. is there any way around this? |
| 17:34.55 | M4rtinK | ZogG_laptop: ? |
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| 18:33.37 | kulve | how can I get debug prints from meego applications (plugins) to somewhere? |
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| 18:45.54 | npm | twit.tv on ces "some nokias have really nice cameras" |
| 18:47.18 | npm | has anybody made proper use of the 12mp "nice camera" on the n950? (work-aroudn n9's 8mp limit) |
| 18:47.41 | djszapi | lucido: respont something on another thread. |
| 18:48.54 | ieatlint | npm: has it actually been confirmed by anyone that the n950s sent out in the community program (ie, the "dev kit" n950s) actually have the 12mp camera? |
| 18:49.09 | djszapi | respond* |
| 18:49.12 | ieatlint | i was under the impession only the internal original ones did |
| 18:49.14 | lucido | djszapi, what's the question? |
| 18:49.22 | ieatlint | hey djszapi |
| 18:49.59 | djszapi | ieatlint: hello :) |
| 18:50.17 | djszapi | lucido: it is an answer for your previous question. It seems my N9 did not work when I sent it. |
| 18:51.37 | lucido | probably, I don't see it here |
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| 18:52.04 | lucido | djszapi, wht was the answer? |
| 18:54.19 | djszapi | lucido: Q: http://mg.pov.lt/harmattan-irclog/latest.log.html#t2012-01-10T19:07:09 A: http://mg.pov.lt/harmattan-irclog/latest.log.html#t2012-01-10T20:47:41 |
| 18:54.39 | djszapi | kulve: to stderr for instance |
| 18:55.06 | djszapi | ieatlint: I dislike the metroui after getting this Lumia |
| 18:55.09 | kulve | djszapi: and where should I see the print? |
| 18:55.18 | djszapi | kulve: cli |
| 18:55.41 | kulve | in this case the share-ui is launched from the gallery application. I'm not sure if I can launch it |
| 18:55.53 | ieatlint | djszapi: indeed... i'm trying to not be too biased since it's microsoft and it killed off a platform i love |
| 18:56.00 | ieatlint | but i really do not like it |
| 18:56.01 | kulve | and if I launch the gallery application from the command line I didn't see qDebugs nor qCriticals |
| 18:56.02 | Avengence | lumia = gimped N9 |
| 18:56.14 | Avengence | good hardware, crap OS |
| 18:56.16 | djszapi | kulve: you can print to any log files, but you can also get qDebug work by enabling the qt debug things properly. |
| 18:56.17 | ieatlint | i got slightly less angry at it when i found out what happens when you hold down the back button |
| 18:56.35 | kulve | djszapi: ok |
| 18:56.46 | ieatlint | the lumia 900 will be disorienting... larger than the n9, but otherwise looks damn near identical again |
| 18:56.54 | djszapi | ieatlint: I like Windows 7 for instance, but the metroui is creepy in /my/ opinion. |
| 18:57.06 | ieatlint | djszapi: well, metro is win8, so enjoy :P |
| 18:57.21 | ieatlint | it's depressing that nokia's first LTE phone will be a windows phone |
| 18:57.40 | djszapi | I cannot run multiple applications simultaneously (no taskbar). |
| 18:58.01 | djszapi | the camera zoom in/out are also creepy, icons are squared rectangles, and so on. cannot swipe between screen, just home or back |
| 18:58.27 | ieatlint | djszapi: for "multitasking", hold down the back button |
| 18:58.31 | djszapi | orientation does not follow the turning of the device in my hand properly, just in 10%, I need to register a Windows Live ID for almost everything, there is no KDE on that, no Qt, and not even C++, the VKB is awful. |
| 19:00.33 | Avengence | the underlying OS is wince so c/c++, but unless you hack it you can't write native, just silverblight and whatever the fuck the gimped xbox sdk is called |
| 19:00.50 | ieatlint | yeah, many of the built in apps are c++ |
| 19:01.02 | djszapi | well, I have access to the native SDK in my company, but cannot really publish what I write. |
| 19:01.13 | ieatlint | MS keeps excitedly telling me tha IE on the phone is from the same code branch as the desktop one |
| 19:01.33 | djszapi | ieatlint: when I saw IE, well I started crying :) |
| 19:01.35 | ieatlint | "that's great, but seeing as i couldn't do that if i wanted to, it means dick to me" |
| 19:01.41 | djszapi | even here, the demon ?! :) |
| 19:01.50 | djszapi | haha |
| 19:01.53 | Avengence | i did winmob devel (5.x) for a few years for us govt and to really do anything useful required making custom sdk by shoving a bunch of the wince files into the winmob sdk |
| 19:04.05 | djszapi | the settings dialog is also a joke in a sense |
| 19:04.19 | ieatlint | a lot of nokians i've met seem to think qt will come to windows phone this year |
| 19:04.23 | ieatlint | i'll believe it when i see it |
| 19:05.24 | djszapi | well, we need native SDK first. |
| 19:06.19 | ieatlint | i think MS has already said there will be some sort of native SDK for the next release, but they haven't detailed any restrictions or anything |
| 19:06.48 | djszapi | if that happens, the community can at least make a proper qt port. |
| 19:07.02 | ieatlint | sadly, the path forward for someone who wants to keep writing qt for phones is android |
| 19:07.19 | djszapi | said it half a year ago :) |
| 19:08.22 | djszapi | or the new Nokia feature phone in progress. |
| 19:09.12 | ieatlint | that sounds about as exciting as symbian belle |
| 19:09.43 | ieatlint | as i understand, meltemi will be qml only for apps |
| 19:09.45 | djszapi | btw, from today (Qt5 && Harmattan): http://lists.qt-project.org/pipermail/development/2012-January/001371.html |
| 19:10.01 | djszapi | ieatlint: ...and what is wrong about qml2 ? :) |
| 19:10.12 | RST38h | ieatlint: Who said it will be QML at all? |
| 19:11.08 | ieatlint | djszapi: it doesn't exist :P |
| 19:11.27 | ieatlint | plus, it doesn't solve the reasons we need to use c++ backends with harmattan for instance |
| 19:11.42 | ieatlint | if they have more components, it could be possible, but even then... |
| 19:12.04 | djszapi | I am pretty sure it is gonna be immature as usual ;-) |
| 19:12.09 | ieatlint | perhaps it'll allow you to create compiles imports you can use |
| 19:12.20 | ieatlint | compiled |
| 19:12.59 | djszapi | but at least the community can port Qt5 Harmattan |
| 19:13.04 | djszapi | to* |
| 19:13.40 | ieatlint | if there's a reasonable performance boost, sure |
| 19:13.59 | djszapi | that, and significant feature boost |
| 19:14.06 | ieatlint | but v8 and scene graph are the only things i've seen that i find interesting |
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| 19:14.30 | ieatlint | yeah, shaders and such in qml2... |
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| 19:14.53 | djszapi | plus many things from KDE. |
| 19:28.33 | ieatlint | heh, someone just pushed code to me for production that has the minor bug of disabling the touchscreen driver :P |
| 19:29.26 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: djszapi M4rtinK can you try my deb to see what i mean by wierd camera behaviour? |
| 19:30.32 | ieatlint | link? |
| 19:31.32 | ZogG_laptop | http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2336306/imgrup_0.0.4.beta_armel.deb |
| 19:32.28 | djszapi | I cannot |
| 19:32.29 | ieatlint | ah, already have 0.0.3 installed ;) |
| 19:33.05 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: it;s 0,0,4,3 |
| 19:33.40 | ieatlint | this is? |
| 19:33.46 | ZogG_laptop | 0.0.4,2 was last and in this i wanted to add camera |
| 19:33.54 | ieatlint | says 0.0.4.2 on the installer |
| 19:34.12 | ZogG_laptop | i didn't change version yet is it's not finshed |
| 19:34.35 | ieatlint | ah, i see |
| 19:34.41 | ieatlint | i have the app open and in camera mode |
| 19:34.51 | ieatlint | it is indeed the wrong orientation |
| 19:34.57 | ieatlint | how are you using the camera module? |
| 19:35.51 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: landscape is ok though |
| 19:36.26 | ieatlint | yes |
| 19:36.48 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: reported bug |
| 19:36.58 | ieatlint | i thought there was a way to have the native camera app launch, take a picture, and then send the path of that pic to your app so you could use it |
| 19:37.00 | ZogG_laptop | just wanted to be sure |
| 19:37.12 | ieatlint | that way you get full featues of the camera app without reinventing the wheel/changing the familiar ui |
| 19:37.17 | ZogG_laptop | meh it would be lame |
| 19:37.54 | ZogG_laptop | opening app takes time and you can set the setting of minimul quality reuest |
| 19:38.22 | ieatlint | can or can't? |
| 19:38.38 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: actually i used buildin component of qml in qtmediakit |
| 19:39.00 | ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: in app you can as you have a lot of settings and you control you |
| 19:39.07 | ZogG_laptop | last you = ui |
| 19:39.07 | ieatlint | well, assume you have to work around the bug |
| 19:39.08 | jonni | ZogG_laptop: did you already tried the rotation: 90 thingie that I pasted yesterday to you? |
| 19:39.30 | ieatlint | because even if they try to fix it, i wouldn't count on it making pr1.2 |
| 19:39.48 | ieatlint | and pr1.3 i think is still a maybe with an unknown future date |
| 19:40.11 | djszapi | and unknown feature list |
| 19:40.22 | djszapi | (or bugfix list) |
| 19:40.43 | ZogG_laptop | wontfix bug list |
| 19:40.59 | djszapi | (if there is PR1.3 at all) |
| 19:41.19 | ZogG_laptop | jonni: i tryed but it has no such componenet |
| 19:41.49 | jonni | ZogG_laptop: hmm, rectancle ? :) |
| 19:41.53 | ieatlint | i'm just hoping pr1.2 hits soon |
| 19:41.56 | lucido | I really wish they'd come up with harmattan 1-2 years ago |
| 19:42.35 | ieatlint | they did, and it was called maemo |
| 19:42.43 | ieatlint | and the n900 was released 2+ years ago |
| 19:42.46 | ieatlint | and it was awesome |
| 19:42.47 | jonni | ZogG_laptop: afaik rectancle has rotation :) |
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| 19:43.59 | djszapi | Item has it. |
| 19:44.07 | djszapi | and Rectangle inherits that |
| 19:44.16 | ieatlint | the n900's camera still gives the n9 a decent challenge |
| 19:44.28 | ieatlint | especially with the low level control... the hdr app is still awesome |
| 19:44.47 | djszapi | ieatlint: ...and the Lumia camera management... ;-) |
| 19:45.23 | djszapi | (on software side) |
| 19:45.34 | ieatlint | if the n950 had the 12mp camera module and low level access like the n900...... |
| 19:46.48 | djszapi | N900 had 12 MP ? |
| 19:47.15 | ieatlint | no, 5 |
| 19:47.23 | ieatlint | i mean low level access like the n900 |
| 19:47.40 | djszapi | for what ? |
| 19:48.09 | ieatlint | you could get the raw image off the ccd |
| 19:48.43 | ieatlint | and nokia research used a group of university students to make an awesome hdr app for it |
| 19:49.04 | djszapi | what did that app do ? |
| 19:49.31 | *** join/#harmattan tbf_ (~mathias@p57BD752F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:49.38 | ieatlint | took X photos at different exposures/shutter speeds in rapid succession, then merged them together so you had incredible colour and depth |
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| 19:53.16 | djszapi | well, the community can do whatever they want out of Harmattan after a while soon when there are no official maintenance releases anymore ;-) |
| 19:54.40 | ieatlint | wish i had the time to do anything in that regard |
| 19:55.43 | djszapi | well, as for Nokia proper, there is no need for such an access anyway since they goddevelopers ;-) |
| 19:55.50 | djszapi | are* |
| 19:58.12 | djszapi | I think there might be some post-Harmatan community doing releases. It is not that bad hardware after all. |
| 19:58.47 | ieatlint | i still wish the nfc stuff was finished, and SNEP (a p2p protocol) is added |
| 19:58.56 | ieatlint | am hoping that will appear in pr1.2 |
| 19:59.33 | ieatlint | i'm led to believe that one can implement parts of the missing nfc support via direct dbus calls, but again, no time these days :( |
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| 20:03.27 | djszapi | ieatlint: seems Quim has Qt5 running on N950: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARpK4V3Jr40 |
| 20:03.47 | ieatlint | yep, donald carr got it working |
| 20:04.05 | djszapi | yeah: http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2011/11/21/testing-qtquick-2-on-your-n9n950/ |
| 20:04.22 | ieatlint | i worked with him briefly on the raspberry pi stuff |
| 20:05.05 | djszapi | it would be nice if they can send those out. |
| 20:05.12 | djszapi | could* |
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| 20:05.34 | ieatlint | should be very soon, although i know nothing extra |
| 20:05.44 | djszapi | I guess it is gonna work by FOSDEM. |
| 20:05.57 | ieatlint | ok, me food, bbl |
| 20:08.14 | admiral0 | djszapi: you work for nokia? |
| 20:08.25 | admiral0 | (hi) |
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| 20:09.30 | djszapi | Hi. nope, but for the Nokia project. :) |
| 20:11.13 | oytunx | djszapi: hope not get involved for aegis project |
| 20:12.03 | djszapi | I have been one of the developers behind it.. |
| 20:13.16 | oytunx | nice job! |
| 20:15.42 | *** join/#harmattan wirwe (~wirwe@91-64-44-75-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 20:16.43 | admiral0 | i just got my "made in finland" N9 and i'm missing some things |
| 20:16.55 | admiral0 | like an IRC cllient |
| 20:17.04 | admiral0 | s/cll/cl/ |
| 20:17.36 | admiral0 | and also saw my bug closed as WONTFIX :( |
| 20:18.30 | djszapi | admiral0: irc-chatter I use. |
| 20:18.51 | djszapi | admiral0: j.mp/uS4sL3 |
| 20:21.06 | admiral0 | thank you djszapi |
| 20:21.18 | admiral0 | what do you think about this? https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=584 |
| 20:21.24 | _MeeGoBot_ | Bug 584 enh, ---, ---, ext-risto.lahti, RESO WONTFIX, Add API to add custom pages to meegotouchhome |
| 20:25.03 | wirwe | admiral0: irssi is available in the store, if you like simplicity. |
| 20:25.50 | admiral0 | i stopped using irssi, was bad for my mental health |
| 20:26.32 | djszapi | irssi is everything but simple on handsets. |
| 20:26.59 | djszapi | (in /my/ opinion) |
| 20:28.04 | admiral0 | and irc chatter stuck on connecting forever -.- |
| 20:28.09 | wirwe | it is okay if one doesn't want to be online all the time^^ |
| 20:29.02 | djszapi | admiral0: do you have the network working properly ? |
| 20:29.07 | admiral0 | yep |
| 20:29.19 | djszapi | mobile internet ? |
| 20:29.28 | admiral0 | downloaded deb on the device |
| 20:29.36 | admiral0 | no, home wifi |
| 20:30.07 | admiral0 | device froze :O |
| 20:30.34 | djszapi | try to reboot. |
| 20:31.02 | admiral0 | rebooting |
| 20:32.09 | petteri | admiral0: if you jus got your N9 and it is not running PR1.1, try updating it |
| 20:32.47 | djszapi | admiral0: your FR is not that bad, but it would make the whole thing cluttered. |
| 20:32.54 | djszapi | I personally like the simplicity. |
| 20:33.15 | admiral0 | cluttered if user is dumb |
| 20:34.09 | admiral0 | the frustrating fact is that even android users can customise that with a simple application |
| 20:35.48 | admiral0 | and i consider meego-nokia more dev-friendly than that |
| 20:35.59 | djszapi | You asked my opinion, but I like it this simple =) |
| 20:36.16 | admiral0 | yes, i understand, i like it too |
| 20:36.26 | admiral0 | but i want it even better |
| 20:37.19 | admiral0 | most n900 interesting stuff was either a widget or a status area plugin |
| 20:37.38 | admiral0 | this would make happy a lot of ex n900 users |
| 20:37.55 | admiral0 | (still connecting forever) |
| 20:41.48 | admiral0 | is http://apps.javispedro.com/nit/hicg/ broken? |
| 20:46.18 | djszapi | seems so. |
| 20:46.35 | *** join/#harmattan zk8 (~tester@dslb-188-102-239-095.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:48.09 | djszapi | I have just written an email to javispedro. |
| 20:50.55 | *** join/#harmattan gabriel9 (~gabriel9@31.223.217.110) |
| 20:52.43 | *** join/#harmattan fuz_ (nobody@vau75-10-88-164-23-88.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:54.47 | admiral0 | man need to emerge php for it :( |
| 20:54.56 | amppa | ok, this is just stupid |
| 20:55.04 | amppa | all N9 devices in RDA have PR1.1 |
| 20:56.18 | *** part/#harmattan jpnurmi (jpnurmi@hilla.kapsi.fi) |
| 20:57.03 | djszapi | amppa: I can help tomorrow with PR1.0 |
| 20:58.38 | amppa | that would be very nice |
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| 21:10.59 | *** join/#harmattan tbf_ (~mathias@p57BD752F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:14.42 | e-yes | btw, if meego-nokia is "more friendly"... |
| 21:14.45 | e-yes | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:16.23 | djszapi | what would be the benefit to change the whole procedure how it has been working for a while ? |
| 21:16.49 | djszapi | there are no manpower for such a change anyway. |
| 21:16.53 | e-yes | to make it really more |
| 21:17.01 | e-yes | more dev-friendly |
| 21:17.17 | djszapi | witout manpower ? |
| 21:17.20 | djszapi | without* |
| 21:17.45 | djszapi | and I wish this was the most serious problem ever, really ;-) |
| 21:19.26 | e-yes | manpower? are you kidding? (git push externalremotename megadevelopment_branch -- is it really hard??) |
| 21:19.57 | ieatlint | i also fail to see exactly what that would do |
| 21:20.05 | *** part/#harmattan e-yes (~e-yes@94.45.165.69) |
| 21:20.05 | ieatlint | if you want it in git, put it in git |
| 21:20.11 | *** join/#harmattan e-yes (~e-yes@94.45.165.69) |
| 21:20.59 | e-yes | merging, back/forward porting, history/logs |
| 21:21.15 | djszapi | e-yes: and refactor the whole continous integration, static analyzers, all the build servers, all the test servers |
| 21:21.22 | ieatlint | yeah, that was never going to happen |
| 21:21.24 | djszapi | do not kid, it is a whole process, not about a git push. |
| 21:21.28 | djszapi | try to think in systems |
| 21:21.30 | ieatlint | that would include internal info as well |
| 21:21.50 | e-yes | heh. why this happening with google? |
| 21:21.55 | *** join/#harmattan beford (~fercho@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 21:22.13 | e-yes | (and a lot of companies in the world) |
| 21:22.34 | e-yes | even nokia itself uses gitorious for qt development |
| 21:22.51 | ieatlint | you mean google's reference kernel? |
| 21:23.39 | e-yes | i mean google reference kernel (aka common), emulator (goldfish) and device specific branches (tuna, maguro) |
| 21:23.45 | djszapi | e-yes: no it does not |
| 21:23.51 | djszapi | actually even qt4 was ported to gerrit today |
| 21:23.53 | ieatlint | considering the other openness issues in harmattan, methinks you're picking an add one to make an issue of |
| 21:24.08 | djszapi | and qt5 has already been on gerrit for a quite while. |
| 21:24.24 | e-yes | well gerrit != git |
| 21:24.40 | djszapi | not sure how you confuse that in here. |
| 21:24.51 | djszapi | you said, Nokia uses gitorious for qt, no it does not |
| 21:24.56 | e-yes | don't mess vcs and codereview system. and CI too;) |
| 21:25.38 | djszapi | anyway, I do not see the point of this complain :) |
| 21:27.50 | e-yes | i suspect you don't waste time (right now) trying to merge/cherry-pick commits from 2.6.39 to nokia-provided-crapshot |
| 21:28.00 | djszapi | actually my opinion is opposite. Intel left the existing and working procedure at Nokia |
| 21:28.19 | djszapi | when we worked with Intel on MeeGo. They always wanted to reinvent the wheel on "open" sites for no real reasons. |
| 21:28.28 | djszapi | that is one reason behind the big meego fail. |
| 21:29.35 | ieatlint | and why tizen will succeed |
| 21:29.54 | djszapi | that is a valid question ;- |
| 21:29.59 | djszapi | ;-) |
| 21:30.13 | djszapi | but Intel reinvented the wheel over there in many aspects as well :) |
| 21:30.23 | e-yes | what relation does Intel have to kernel snapshot for Nokia N9? |
| 21:30.37 | djszapi | Intel wanted the same like you |
| 21:30.41 | djszapi | and they hilariously failed. |
| 21:30.54 | djszapi | Nokia did not want, and Nokia is still alive. |
| 21:32.18 | e-yes | Murtazin says it's not |
| 21:32.41 | e-yes | switched on trolling mode too |
| 21:32.54 | ieatlint | uh, wait, how is inel dead and nokia alive? |
| 21:32.57 | ieatlint | intel |
| 21:33.02 | ieatlint | they both are off meego.. |
| 21:33.07 | djszapi | meego was done at the end by Intel right ? |
| 21:33.15 | djszapi | Harmattan was done by Nokia, right ? |
| 21:33.23 | djszapi | meego is dead, Harmattan is still alive to a sort. |
| 21:33.35 | e-yes | доктор сказал в морг. хуле |
| 21:33.53 | *** join/#harmattan vladest (~Vlad@235-69-200-46.pool.ukrtel.net) |
| 21:33.54 | ieatlint | it's been sundowned since release |
| 21:34.18 | ieatlint | canceled, and the teams gutted, but not 100% dead |
| 21:34.27 | djszapi | I do not see any point in refactoring a whole, more years old and working process |
| 21:34.46 | djszapi | just for the sake of changing, and with all its risks to even make a sillier result than it is now. |
| 21:35.16 | djszapi | Harmattan was not cancelled as far as I know |
| 21:35.18 | djszapi | MeeGo was. |
| 21:36.00 | ieatlint | ok, not cancelled, just gutted of developers |
| 21:36.19 | djszapi | this is pointless, it is still developed |
| 21:36.38 | djszapi | what I wanted to show is the Intel way got dead, and this was exactly the way asked abo ve. |
| 21:37.06 | djszapi | (a.k.a. change everything radically for the sake of fail) |
| 21:38.31 | djszapi | sadly, Intel has been doing the same game with Tizen, today debian, but future rpm, and so on.. |
| 21:39.26 | ieatlint | sounds like there should be committee setup to discuss this |
| 21:39.41 | mgedmin | grins |
| 21:44.14 | djszapi | back to the cherry pick things, it is probably not a real problem actually |
| 21:44.48 | djszapi | since the common changes were more or less upstreamed, and just the really specific additions not. So if there is even a conflicting situation, it should not be that hard to resolve imo. |
| 21:51.54 | e-yes | upstreamed. something already in mainline kernel, something not yet, something rejected. something was not submitted |
| 21:52.26 | djszapi | the common things are more or less upstreamed. |
| 21:52.34 | djszapi | and there are not many things like that after all |
| 21:52.36 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@catv-89-134-153-62.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 21:52.36 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 21:52.48 | e-yes | djszapi, cap |
| 21:52.51 | djszapi | evening Venemo :) |
| 21:52.56 | Venemo | hey djszapi :) |
| 21:53.04 | djszapi | Venemo: admiral0 has some issues with irc-chatter |
| 21:53.24 | Venemo | admiral0, hi! :) could you please join #irc-chatter and tell me more about your issues? |
| 21:54.05 | Venemo | oh, by the way |
| 21:54.13 | Venemo | has fallen to the dark side. |
| 21:55.54 | ieatlint | ? |
| 21:55.57 | ieatlint | switched to android? |
| 21:56.01 | Venemo | nope, worse |
| 21:56.09 | ieatlint | or do i need to just start laughing at you for using the lumia 800? |
| 21:56.17 | Venemo | yeah... :P |
| 21:56.27 | ieatlint | points and laughs |
| 21:56.33 | Venemo | thanks :P |
| 21:57.00 | ieatlint | np |
| 21:57.48 | Venemo | also, not just using it, developing for it as well. |
| 21:58.07 | petteri | :( |
| 21:58.11 | ieatlint | nokia will be pleased to know that they actually got a convert |
| 21:58.14 | djszapi | Venemo: we are not friends anymore, you know ? ;) |
| 21:58.23 | Venemo | I'm not fully converted... |
| 21:58.33 | *** join/#harmattan admiral0_n9 (~ircchatte@adsl-ull-85-129.48-151.net24.it) |
| 21:58.33 | Venemo | I'm also developing for Harmattan still :) |
| 21:58.53 | djszapi | port C# to Harmy ? :P |
| 21:59.02 | djszapi | or the metroui ? ;) |
| 21:59.12 | Venemo | what'd be the point of doin that? |
| 21:59.44 | djszapi | well, C# is not that bad, I would like to get it ported, for instance mono |
| 22:01.03 | ieatlint | raspberry pi went into full production |
| 22:02.23 | *** join/#harmattan ajalkane (~ajalkane@a88-115-212-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 22:02.23 | admiral0 | C# ? |
| 22:02.30 | admiral0 | oh lord why? |
| 22:04.05 | djszapi | because it is a real OOP language unlike C++ |
| 22:05.26 | admiral0 | it's too verbose |
| 22:05.33 | ieatlint | senses a language war approaching |
| 22:05.35 | ieatlint | runs |
| 22:05.42 | petteri | heheh: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_programming#Criticism |
| 22:06.28 | *** part/#harmattan djszapi (~lpapp@plexyplanet.org) |
| 22:06.31 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo_N950 (~venemo@fedora/Venemo) |
| 22:09.03 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 22:12.19 | *** join/#harmattan admiral0_n9 (~yxycuvxyc@adsl-ull-85-129.48-151.net24.it) |
| 22:21.18 | auenf | finally, PR1.1 OTA |
| 22:22.18 | ieatlint | make sure you backup *everthing* :P |
| 22:22.42 | ieatlint | the pr1.1 ota update seems notorious for failing and forcing a full reflash |
| 22:25.40 | mgedmin | good thing I didn't know THAT when I upgraded |
| 22:25.44 | mgedmin | my upgrade went smoothly |
| 22:25.45 | admiral0 | it failed for me |
| 22:25.51 | mgedmin | I don't know what I'd do if I had to reflash |
| 22:26.07 | admiral0 | had no data on my n9 though :D |
| 22:29.59 | mgedmin | and I've no firmware image, and I'm on linux, so no navifirm |
| 22:33.40 | admiral0 | mgedmin: there is a navifirm clone in C++ that you can run under wine |
| 22:33.52 | admiral0 | tested and works for me |
| 22:34.09 | mgedmin | I sincerely hope I'll never need to experience it |
| 22:34.30 | admiral0 | flashing is quick and painless if you have backed up |
| 22:35.09 | *** join/#harmattan diggy (~diggy@178-60-64.dynamic.cyta.gr) |
| 22:45.50 | ieatlint | hah, intel demoed a reference platform smartphone based on the atom chip |
| 22:46.11 | leinir | *nods* That's the one which /would/ have run meego... |
| 22:46.14 | ieatlint | i suspect this was to be a meego phone a few months ago :P |
| 22:46.17 | leinir | Yup |
| 22:46.18 | ieatlint | yep |
| 22:46.46 | leinir | (hardly a secret, now, but let's say i'm probably a bit more annoyed about that than most people here) |
| 22:46.48 | ieatlint | looks like android in the photos |
| 22:46.56 | mgedmin | url? |
| 22:47.09 | ieatlint | http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/10/intel-demos-medfield-based-smartphone-reference-design-at-ces-v/ |
| 22:47.11 | ajalkane | Doesn't look anything special from photos :(. Was hoping more. |
| 22:47.21 | mgedmin | is atom really power-efficient enough these days to be used in smartphones? |
| 22:47.28 | SpeedEvil | Not atom |
| 22:47.29 | ieatlint | ajalkane: just a reference platform, it's not supposed to be a retail device really |
| 22:47.42 | ieatlint | err, right, SpeedEvil is correct, i said atom and am wrong |
| 22:47.55 | ajalkane | ieatlint: yeah, true. MeeGo proper didn't look anything too special either from photos. |
| 22:48.19 | ieatlint | ajalkane: that was also just a reference UI, and wasn't supposed to be for retail devices |
| 22:48.20 | ajalkane | But the APIs that were published seems lackluster also. |
| 22:49.09 | ajalkane | But I'm still hopeful. Lack of Qt is a major bummer though. |
| 22:49.28 | ieatlint | you mean tizen? |
| 22:49.35 | ajalkane | yeah |
| 22:49.47 | ajalkane | are talking about something else? |
| 22:50.14 | mgedmin | huh? the engadget link claims " 1.6GHz Intel Atom Z2460" |
| 22:50.48 | ajalkane | s/are/are we/ |
| 22:51.27 | ajalkane | oh right, that engadget link seems to claim it's Android. |
| 22:51.41 | ieatlint | mgedmin: i don't even now know |
| 22:52.01 | ieatlint | my intel lingo is outdated... is medfield a line of atom cpus? |
| 22:55.41 | kimju | the whole platform, including cpu and peripherals. |
| 23:09.21 | ieatlint | ah |
| 23:19.43 | ajalkane | ah fuckity doo. I've been trying to figure out for 3 days what's wrong why my code does not work. Seems like it was qt-components bug with TextField, compiling from snapshot solved the problem. So beware Nokia FN-PPA qt-components package, it's out-dated. |
| 23:46.40 | ieatlint | yeah... i hate it when that happens :( |
