| 00:06.09 | faenil | guys how can I set ListView's height so that it takes as much as it needs for its children? |
| 00:06.15 | faenil | childrenRect.height doesn't work |
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| 00:20.04 | Mek | faenil: isn't a listview that is big enough to fit all its children just a Column with a Repeater inside? |
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| 00:26.38 | faenil | Mek: mmm... |
| 00:28.48 | franz` | inception and the possibility of a mobilesubstrate-style thing for harmattan? today is a good day! |
| 00:35.16 | franz` | kinda want to watch inception now to get the references lol |
| 00:35.28 | franz` | pasiv is the machine from the movie, I know that much |
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| 00:50.51 | Necrosporus | There is now X11 for android, so N9 lost the biggest advantage, stuff like swipe UI is not free software, right? Than it doesn't count as advantage, as any additional bit of source-less code is disadvantage |
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| 01:11.01 | beford | franz`, mobilesubstrate-style thing for harmattan? <- more info? xD |
| 01:11.33 | franz` | was reading the backlog, mohammad ag mentioned something like that a couple hours ago |
| 01:12.03 | franz` | don't want foster false hopes, it's just "possible" |
| 01:23.48 | beford | oh |
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| 01:35.51 | Sazpaimon | can anyone else not install the romaxa fennec builds on PR1.2? |
| 01:37.20 | Sazpaimon | I'm getting issues with the qt version it wants |
| 01:38.49 | Sazpaimon | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:38.49 | Sazpaimon | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:38.52 | Sazpaimon | etc |
| 01:39.07 | Sazpaimon | it works fine if I force it, but that will probably lead to problems down the road |
| 01:42.00 | Sazpaimon | looks like it's a known issue |
| 01:42.15 | Sazpaimon | hopefully romaxa fixes it |
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| 04:23.47 | itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82898 |
| 04:23.53 | itsnotabigtruck | this is pretty crappy of nokia :/ |
| 04:24.07 | itsnotabigtruck | as if ovi store acting up has anything at all to do with the country it's used from |
| 04:25.43 | SpeedEvil | It may actually be - CDNs are wierd |
| 04:26.04 | SpeedEvil | ah |
| 04:26.07 | SpeedEvil | nvm |
| 04:27.03 | itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: well, even if it does have anything at all to do with the country it's used from, it's still nokia's problem |
| 04:27.21 | itsnotabigtruck | if it's the client, it's an N9 firmware problem = they have to deal with it |
| 04:27.43 | itsnotabigtruck | if it's the servers, it's an ovi store server problem = they have to deal with it |
| 04:28.26 | itsnotabigtruck | at no point is "we didn't distribute that phone where you are" anything but a cheap excuse |
| 04:53.24 | itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: did you find the energy to try installing flash? |
| 04:53.35 | itsnotabigtruck | if so, did you see what precisely failed? |
| 04:53.45 | SpeedEvil | I just tried through the GUI so far |
| 04:57.44 | itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: so yeah, try dpkg -i'ing it, you could also use pkgmgr install-file -f, i think it prints out the dpkg output if things go south |
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| 06:12.14 | Khertan | lbt, X-Fade: don't know if you have touch something on the cobs but now the package as been moved. Thx |
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| 06:31.19 | itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1176315#post1176315 |
| 06:31.24 | itsnotabigtruck | ^ can someone verify that? |
| 06:31.41 | itsnotabigtruck | that is, EPERM when running things in a chroot |
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| 06:49.56 | ZogG_laptop | khertan_: \o/ |
| 06:52.34 | ZogG_laptop | itsnotabigtruck: morning |
| 06:53.50 | itsnotabigtruck | ZogG_laptop: yo |
| 06:54.35 | itsnotabigtruck | i'm not super interested in the chroot stuff but in theory... |
| 06:54.56 | itsnotabigtruck | i think aegis-su -c -caps sh, then the chroot scripts, ought to work |
| 07:09.30 | jonni | itsnotabigtruck: unsigned binaries in closed mode (in chroot) start to work after you disable the source identity check from aegis. |
| 07:11.08 | jonni | s/in chroot/and in chroot/ |
| 07:12.44 | itsnotabigtruck | jonni: well, that's the "relaxed mode" i mentioned, right |
| 07:12.58 | itsnotabigtruck | then aegis will put all the chroot stuff into SRC:: and it'll work |
| 07:13.27 | itsnotabigtruck | but it'll fail with EPERM if the user tries to run the chroot with *every privilege* which is what i bet is going on |
| 07:13.28 | jonni | itsnotabigtruck: nope, relaxed mode only removes hash checking from unsigned binaries, but not the origin check |
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| 07:23.09 | jonni | if you disable origin checking then unlisted execs are not treated as unknown source origin. |
| 07:31.17 | tomma | is there service manual for n950? |
| 07:38.35 | itsnotabigtruck | tomma: probably not...well, one might exist inside nokia |
| 07:38.58 | itsnotabigtruck | we have the service manuals we do because they were distributed widely to nokia repair shops |
| 07:39.05 | itsnotabigtruck | N950s don't have any sort of end-user warranty |
| 07:39.42 | itsnotabigtruck | and it's doubtful said shops will ever see one (maybe if a very confused n950 owner brings one in :p) |
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| 07:58.09 | itsnotabigtruck | jonni: yep, looks like you were right on the money |
| 07:58.54 | jonni | yep, posted reply on that thread. |
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| 08:45.11 | gabriel9 | does qt comes on WP? |
| 08:47.41 | leinir | gabriel9|work: well, there's some people at kdab who has been working on the compact edition stuff, but as for WP8 (not before, need native app support), well... it'll happen, we just don't know who'll be doing that support, of course :) |
| 08:47.53 | flux | so how many are going to upgrade to pr1.3, should it ever arrive, if it 'breaks' inception?-) of course, there's tons of personal data security to be gained that way.. |
| 08:48.01 | leinir | Could be community work, could be nokia, could even arguably be microsoft, but who knows :) |
| 08:48.48 | gabriel9|work | so we are in the dark here |
| 08:49.39 | leinir | Well... yes |
| 08:49.50 | leinir | the only people who really know anything are the WP8 team :P |
| 08:50.06 | gabriel9|work | has anyone tried qt quick on iPhone |
| 08:50.15 | leinir | wait... why is this discussed on #harmattan? |
| 08:50.16 | gabriel9|work | i belive project is called lighthouse |
| 08:50.30 | gabriel9|work | it is general talk :) |
| 08:51.04 | gabriel9|work | and i wish to know is there future for qt Quick on other platforms |
| 08:51.05 | leinir | lighthouse is just another name for the Qt Platform Abstraction system (or QPA to be TLA Compliant ;) ) |
| 08:52.11 | leinir | but, for info on that you'll want to check the qt4ios people out |
| 08:54.17 | gabriel9|work | hm, so there is no easy way to port apps |
| 08:54.31 | gabriel9|work | from harmattan to droid and ios |
| 08:54.46 | itsnotabigtruck | gabriel9|work: concerning qt |
| 08:55.01 | itsnotabigtruck | my understanding is that nokia ported it, but i have no idea if it'll ever be available outside of nokia |
| 08:55.13 | itsnotabigtruck | since wp7 is supposed to be pure .net to outsiders |
| 08:55.24 | itsnotabigtruck | it might be solely for their maps app |
| 08:55.29 | itsnotabigtruck | and things like it |
| 08:55.43 | gabriel9|work | swit jisus, so they create phone N9, OS for it and tools for porting and they give up from it |
| 08:55.47 | itsnotabigtruck | but i'm not really in the know with such things...i've just heard it exists |
| 08:55.50 | Termana | flux, I don't see any reason not to upgrade just because of inception. I haven't seen anything that gives it really any advantages over Open Mode. |
| 08:55.54 | gabriel9|work | they must have so much monney and want to be stupid |
| 08:56.06 | itsnotabigtruck | Termana: the main benefit is a) no disclaimer, b) it's easy |
| 08:56.14 | flux | termana, hmm, can you use nokia maps etc in Open Mode? |
| 08:56.22 | Termana | flux, AFAIK yes |
| 08:56.29 | itsnotabigtruck | the problem was: there's basically nothing available that actually takes advantage of open mode to Do Cool Things |
| 08:56.39 | itsnotabigtruck | it existed, but without anything built around it, it's useless |
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| 08:57.04 | itsnotabigtruck | so it had to be made easier for both users and devs to gain open-mode-type access |
| 08:57.38 | Termana | itsnotabigtruck, the only advantage I see there is maybe having no disclaimer might not scare a few people |
| 08:57.58 | flux | how about the usb-host/otg-thingy on n9, has it folded? fmtx? |
| 08:57.58 | itsnotabigtruck | so that devs (many of which aren't compelled to go open mode) and users (most of which won't consider open mode) can build apps and use them |
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| 08:58.27 | itsnotabigtruck | flux: current status of fmtx is that it appears there's no antenna |
| 08:58.35 | itsnotabigtruck | not sure if it's speculation or reality, but that doesn't sound unlikely |
| 08:59.28 | itsnotabigtruck | anyway, open mode, it's great for things like nitdroid, but few users are going to bother with it just to get a few apps that might come out |
| 09:00.23 | itsnotabigtruck | and flux: re the usb thing, i think the current status is that the author is busy and isn't super interested in the N9 now |
| 09:00.56 | itsnotabigtruck | iirc there's two prongs to it, a) providing sufficient power over the usb, b) enabling it through the kernel |
| 09:01.24 | itsnotabigtruck | i'm pretty sure it's doable, it's a matter of how to pull it off |
| 09:02.19 | psycho_oreos | itsnotabigtruck, ping |
| 09:02.26 | itsnotabigtruck | psycho_oreos: what's up |
| 09:02.47 | psycho_oreos | itsnotabigtruck, fyi that inception doesn't work against pr1.0 :) |
| 09:03.13 | itsnotabigtruck | psycho_oreos: hrm, should have tested for that |
| 09:03.31 | itsnotabigtruck | no reason to stay on pr1.0 anyway though...the grass is greener with 1.2 :) |
| 09:03.50 | psycho_oreos | too bad otoh pr1.2 isn't available for 64GB variant |
| 09:04.07 | Aard | psycho_oreos: don't mention that in front of my phone, please |
| 09:04.11 | psycho_oreos | well not for the one I have on hand.. not without using something like navifirm and flashing it completely |
| 09:04.22 | itsnotabigtruck | Termana: keep in mind that much of TMO is reluctant to flash their phones at all |
| 09:04.30 | psycho_oreos | Aard, don't mention what? |
| 09:04.33 | Termana | smells like Nokia |
| 09:04.40 | Aard | psycho_oreos: that it can't be running pr1.2 |
| 09:05.02 | itsnotabigtruck | doing a complete wipe of all data to enable open access will not appeal to so many people |
| 09:05.13 | itsnotabigtruck | (and then doing so again if they change their mind) |
| 09:05.22 | psycho_oreos | Aard, its probably a thing to do with various country releases :p |
| 09:06.12 | rigo | ?? I have the 64GB variant and I have PR 1.2 |
| 09:06.36 | itsnotabigtruck | Aard: unless you're deliberately avoiding upgrading, there's no reason not to load up pr1.2 right now |
| 09:06.59 | psycho_oreos | rigo, read what I said, it could be a country specific release |
| 09:07.12 | rigo | I would even encourage that as it improves battery lifetime and adds lots of features |
| 09:07.28 | psycho_oreos | pr1.2 the last I checked is NOT available for Australian 64GB |
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| 09:07.48 | Aard | itsnotabigtruck: I'm running pr1.2 on a 64gb n9, he mentioned it wouldn't be available |
| 09:07.49 | psycho_oreos | and you lose openmode kernel access |
| 09:08.09 | rigo | psycho_oreos, I see, this is because of the difference in the magnetic field of the southern hemisphere ;) |
| 09:08.10 | itsnotabigtruck | Aard: pr1.2 is definitely available for 64gig N9s... |
| 09:08.20 | itsnotabigtruck | however, there are a lot of product codes (numbers printed on the sim tray) |
| 09:08.34 | itsnotabigtruck | nokia has a rather...strange...firmware releasing process and frequently misses a lot of product codes |
| 09:08.40 | itsnotabigtruck | in that case you just flash it, which is quite safe to do |
| 09:08.49 | psycho_oreos | rigo, the magnetic field isn't as strong as the one in the northern hemisphere :p |
| 09:08.59 | rigo | here you go! |
| 09:09.35 | psycho_oreos | and I'm looking at the OTA releases |
| 09:10.01 | psycho_oreos | or unless one must update to pr1.1 before they can update to pr1.2 via OTA |
| 09:10.07 | rigo | nokia has anticipated that and has avoided the upgrade down under so your phone doesn't float away because of PR 1.2 lightness |
| 09:10.50 | rigo | oh, you already missed 1.1? |
| 09:10.51 | itsnotabigtruck | you can go straight from pr1.0 to pr1.2 via ssu btw, in fact, now that pr1.2 is out you can't go to pr1.1 |
| 09:10.57 | itsnotabigtruck | because pr1.2 is what's in the repo |
| 09:11.35 | romaxa | did anyone try to stop mcompositor/meegotouch and render something into framebuffer/null ws eglContext? |
| 09:11.40 | psycho_oreos | rigo, what does yours float? that'd be the first. Put it on water and youtube it |
| 09:12.11 | Termana | psycho_oreos, the real question is, will it blend? |
| 09:12.17 | Termana | Try it and put it on youtube |
| 09:12.24 | rigo | I can't, I'm in northern hemisphere eating my "caike" :) |
| 09:12.52 | psycho_oreos | Termana, you're the one who suggested that idea, you should try it first |
| 09:12.55 | rigo | so the magnetic field is too strong here, you said |
| 09:13.12 | psycho_oreos | rigo, what you worried that it'll float towards artic? |
| 09:13.21 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: have you looked into the dependency issue on the firefox builds? (sorry to pounce on you like this) |
| 09:13.34 | rigo | psycho_oreos, antarctic |
| 09:13.35 | itsnotabigtruck | it looks like the situation is that building with the PR1.3 SDK gives the produced deb PR1.3 dependencies |
| 09:13.35 | psycho_oreos | arctic rather |
| 09:13.58 | rigo | psycho_oreos, but if you want to brick your phone, just listen to this channel and do everything they suggest :) |
| 09:14.02 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: yep, romaxa.info already has packages with PR1.2 deps |
| 09:14.32 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: oh, awesome |
| 09:14.39 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: alsi install now public sdk and rebuilding packages in that environment |
| 09:14.46 | psycho_oreos | rigo, fyi, antarctic is south, not north. Your geology failed |
| 09:15.04 | gabriel9|work | can you guys install debuging packages on N9? |
| 09:15.30 | itsnotabigtruck | gabriel9|work: that's been a problem |
| 09:15.41 | itsnotabigtruck | they didn't update libc6-dbg to match the PR1.2 libc |
| 09:15.53 | itsnotabigtruck | = no local debugging until they fix their stuff |
| 09:15.59 | itsnotabigtruck | actually... |
| 09:16.07 | itsnotabigtruck | now that the pr1.2 sources are out, you can probably make your own :D |
| 09:16.25 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: so practically it should work everywhere after that, basically you can check http://romaxa.info/fennec/mozilla-release/fennec_10.0.2_armel.deb, just uploaded new version compiled against public SDK |
| 09:16.34 | itsnotabigtruck | just do a scratchbox build of libc6 and put the -dbg package on the N9 |
| 09:16.47 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: nice work |
| 09:16.52 | gabriel9|work | well i don't have time now for that |
| 09:17.04 | gabriel9|work | but i will check how to build stuff for me :) |
| 09:17.29 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: also try http://romaxa.info/fftest/adobe-flashplayer_4.0.0-73_armel.deb - also compiled with public SDK, should be installable even on Pr1.0 |
| 09:20.04 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: I'm thinking about running b2g on N950/N9... but first need to kill meegotouch/X/mcompositor in order to get direct rendering to fb0... is there are safe instructions which show how to stop these services without trashing whole system? |
| 09:26.45 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: testing those packages now |
| 09:27.07 | itsnotabigtruck | but i'm probably not of much help with your question... |
| 09:27.33 | itsnotabigtruck | it seems like there has to be a better way to go than taking over the framebuffer, but i have no idea how fennec's rendering works |
| 09:28.37 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: I got b2g/fennec working on beagleboard with minimal ubuntu/debian rootstock image + SGX binary drivers from http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardUbuntu |
| 09:30.02 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: it works without X11, without Qt/gtk |
| 09:30.47 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: ah, i didn't realize you were talking about boot to gecko |
| 09:31.02 | itsnotabigtruck | maybe it would make sense to cook an image without having meegotouch in the first place? |
| 09:31.39 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: did that already, works fine |
| 09:34.43 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: ok, tested packages by myself on 2.2011.39-5 - seems to work fine |
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| 09:36.08 | romaxa | itsnotabigtruck: mult.ru - flash works |
| 09:37.17 | itsnotabigtruck | romaxa: yep, seems to work fine (but i'm testing on pr1.2 which doesn't prove much) |
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| 09:41.16 | itsnotabigtruck | the first thing i tested with the flash player was the all important www.zombo.com |
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| 10:05.18 | djszapi | hi javispedro, long time no seen ya :) |
| 10:05.26 | javispedro | hi djszapi |
| 10:09.51 | ieatlint | i'm not sure i have enough alcohol in my apartment for this week |
| 10:10.36 | djszapi | weird to think only about this week :) |
| 10:10.57 | ieatlint | i've had a pet die saturday, and in the past 24h my uncle died and an ex randomly contacted me with lonely/suicidal thoughts |
| 10:11.37 | djszapi | ouch :/ commiseratings :/ |
| 10:12.48 | ieatlint | thx, but is ok, both pet and uncle exceeded their life expectencies |
| 10:13.20 | ieatlint | just.. alcohol |
| 10:15.54 | djszapi | the mer yaml thingie is quite buggy at this stage... |
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| 10:21.26 | Rantwolf | hi |
| 10:22.07 | Rantwolf | is there a way for me to bring my old messages from my iphone to my new n9? |
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| 10:22.55 | javispedro | harbaum, there? |
| 10:23.52 | djszapi | javispedro: what are you up to nowadays in your pastime ? |
| 10:24.25 | javispedro | mostly real work (TM) and a business trip to the states |
| 10:25.17 | djszapi | javispedro: what area in "real work" ? |
| 10:25.17 | javispedro | djszapi, but now that I have the sources and debug symbols I plan to update my garmin gps simulator stuff for harmattan |
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| 10:26.00 | javispedro | djszapi, i am working in electronic design automation tools |
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| 10:27.53 | javispedro | djszapi, and what are you doing these days? :) |
| 10:28.19 | djszapi | javispedro: android :) |
| 10:28.23 | javispedro | hah |
| 10:28.35 | javispedro | qt for android stuff at least I hope ;P |
| 10:29.10 | djszapi | nah, platform :P |
| 10:29.11 | djszapi | pure C/C++ |
| 10:29.21 | djszapi | but yes, I will try to port KDE to it in my pastime. |
| 10:29.23 | ieatlint | javispedro: if your trip includes san francisco, i'll buy you a beer |
| 10:29.27 | javispedro | no Java at least :) |
| 10:29.44 | javispedro | ieatlint, nah, i'm back from it already :) was in NY and NC |
| 10:30.05 | ieatlint | well, NY is fun at least :P |
| 10:30.24 | javispedro | (but thanks for the offer :) ) |
| 10:30.49 | ieatlint | anytime.. |
| 10:31.52 | javispedro | harbaum: (to avoid firing up an email client ;P) you are looking for eglGetProcAddress |
| 10:35.01 | harbaum | javispedro: thanks :_ |
| 10:35.22 | javispedro | good luck! |
| 10:35.47 | harbaum | we'll see ... sounds less trivial than i hoped ... |
| 10:35.57 | javispedro | yeah |
| 10:36.09 | javispedro | someone could try and do a glext-like library |
| 10:36.35 | harbaum | i wonder why the includes are there then |
| 10:36.37 | javispedro | but if you already got to the point where you are just missing the actual function addresses it should not be hard |
| 10:37.03 | javispedro | just create a few global pointer-to-functions and load them at some point and that's it |
| 10:37.20 | javispedro | no idea, I think the std only defines that the typedefs should be there |
| 10:37.22 | harbaum | yes |
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| 10:42.02 | djszapi | javispedro: no java :p |
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| 11:02.55 | djszapi | hey faenil I have playbooks around :) |
| 11:02.58 | djszapi | now* |
| 11:04.09 | faenil | djszapi, argghhhh :D |
| 11:04.46 | aquarius | yay, PR1.2 browser plays audio properly, hooray! However, audio stops when the screen locks, or when I switch apps. Can I stop the screen locking when music's playing, perhaps? |
| 11:05.58 | djszapi | faenil: I think there are two or three around |
| 11:06.37 | faenil | djszapi, wanna send me one? lol |
| 11:06.45 | faenil | djszapi, just need it for one day :D |
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| 11:10.22 | javispedro | they also seemingly shipped free playbooks on mwc =) |
| 11:10.43 | faenil | javispedro, yeeees! and I wasn't there xD |
| 11:10.43 | faenil | and at another event too |
| 11:10.51 | javispedro | no idea why rim does not start shipping qnx phones |
| 11:11.13 | faenil | javispedro, maybe it's WIP |
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| 11:11.31 | djszapi | faenil: no, sorry :p |
| 11:11.37 | djszapi | it is for KDE stuff :p |
| 11:11.41 | faenil | djszapi, dammit XD |
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| 11:12.16 | faenil | djszapi, I'm tired of uploading 20mb each time and looking for someone who has so much free time that he wants to spend it testing my 3d model viewer xD |
| 11:12.45 | djszapi | what should I tell you, if you do not wanna be smart as advised ? :p |
| 11:13.54 | faenil | djszapi, ? |
| 11:14.19 | djszapi | If I were you, I would write a simple app to get a free playbook... |
| 11:14.30 | djszapi | not an overcomplicated workflow to get one which might end up .... |
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| 11:15.26 | faenil | djszapi, the app is already working man :D I just people to test the things I add :D |
| 11:22.29 | gri | endless rain ... will it ever end :( |
| 11:22.48 | djszapi | gri sunshine in Darmstadt :D |
| 11:23.28 | gri | djszapi: grr, what are you doing there? |
| 11:23.50 | djszapi | gri breathing air for instance :) |
| 11:26.45 | djszapi | gri: beyong the joke: we have a Plasma Active sprint in here. |
| 11:26.59 | gri | damn, sattelite photo shows rainless everywhere except here |
| 11:28.34 | faenil | 15° here, sun shining |
| 11:28.54 | djszapi | gri at least now snow as in Finland :p |
| 11:28.57 | djszapi | be optimist :) |
| 11:31.22 | gri | wants summer |
| 11:32.22 | faenil | I can see it's almost summer here XD |
| 11:32.25 | djszapi | ho to new zealand :p |
| 11:32.27 | djszapi | go* |
| 11:33.51 | gri | djszapi: I already bought a lottery ticket yesterday and hope for the best :P |
| 11:34.39 | djszapi | good luck :) |
| 11:34.49 | djszapi | do not forget we are good friends once you win ;) |
| 11:35.40 | gri | I think once I win I will have many good friends :/ |
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| 16:03.12 | *** topic/#harmattan is A place for harmattan device and development discussions | Customers help customers on #N9, hurry and you're the senior member | Please stay on topic and no NDA stuff here | Developers : http://library.developer.nokia.com/ | http://wiki.meego.com/N950_landing_page | logs: http://mg.pov.lt/harmattan-irclog/ | ~aegis-no-thanks | LATEST ~update |
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| 17:37.57 | itsnotabigtruck | http://www.ace-pcb.com/flashindex.html lol @ this flash intro |
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| 19:16.52 | ZogG_N9 | why instead of closing bug tracker nokia didnt close themself |
| 19:17.07 | ZogG_N9 | or opened harmattan |
| 19:17.31 | ZogG_N9 | i remember at least 5 years support promises and long term support |
| 19:17.44 | ZogG_N9 | but now less time than maemo passed |
| 19:18.16 | ZogG_N9 | is it bad that i want to push in the face all stupid people |
| 19:19.40 | ZogG_N9 | i just know its same in company i work, when my hands are tied on decision of not tech people, but they like to talk bullshit with a lot of tech words, like they do understand |
| 19:19.46 | ZogG_N9 | =/ |
| 19:21.10 | ZogG_N9 | ~ping |
| 19:21.10 | infobot | ~pong |
| 19:21.17 | ZogG_N9 | hmm |
| 19:24.02 | rzr | ZogG_N9: so true |
| 19:24.05 | itsnotabigtruck | hey ZogG_N9 |
| 19:24.18 | rzr | ZogG_N9: how to deal with non tech pple ? |
| 19:24.24 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, hey |
| 19:24.34 | rzr | ignore them? educate them ? |
| 19:24.36 | itsnotabigtruck | this bug tracker shutdown is definitely problematic...what were they thinking |
| 19:24.39 | *** join/#harmattan loxionworld (~Roberts@41.112.242.72) |
| 19:24.40 | itsnotabigtruck | if nothing else it's a PR faux pas |
| 19:24.48 | ZogG_N9 | rzr let them be sellers at bazaar where they belong |
| 19:25.39 | rzr | but they're everywhere... |
| 19:26.01 | ZogG_N9 | kill them? =/ |
| 19:26.47 | ZogG_N9 | i just want nokia to be sold so i can say - told ya |
| 19:28.05 | jonni | there is no bugs left, sw is perfect :) |
| 19:29.15 | rzr | then you can close your door |
| 19:29.18 | itsnotabigtruck | hehe |
| 19:30.11 | ZogG_N9 | jonni, like stalin said |
| 19:30.15 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: let me rate your app on a4m |
| 19:30.22 | ZogG_N9 | no person no problem |
| 19:30.34 | rzr | if you can do that on redak too , i want to push a new release |
| 19:30.40 | ZogG_N9 | no os no problem |
| 19:31.01 | ZogG_N9 | rzr, are you testers before testing? |
| 19:31.09 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: good timing, i just added the afm repo to my n9 |
| 19:31.17 | itsnotabigtruck | so i can load up redak from there |
| 19:31.24 | rzr | and plz rate it |
| 19:31.35 | rzr | once it get 6+ it should be published |
| 19:31.40 | itsnotabigtruck | note that the approvals reset after you update |
| 19:31.43 | itsnotabigtruck | so publish the update first |
| 19:31.49 | ZogG_N9 | rzr, gonna rate but wait for khertan_ editor |
| 19:32.14 | itsnotabigtruck | it would be nice to get some ratings on ad-hac, or anything else in afm for that matter |
| 19:32.27 | itsnotabigtruck | it seems that no one has approved anything for months |
| 19:32.33 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: once the testing version is published , update will be puslished |
| 19:33.32 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, not using them - cant rate =( |
| 19:33.42 | itsnotabigtruck | ZogG_N9: what do you mean? |
| 19:33.49 | ZogG_N9 | didnt get the milk tracker |
| 19:33.49 | itsnotabigtruck | afaik anyone with a meego.com account can approve anything |
| 19:33.54 | itsnotabigtruck | 6 approvals = migration |
| 19:34.04 | rzr | yes |
| 19:34.10 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, ad hac, i have ad host anyway |
| 19:34.43 | ZogG_N9 | i mean i dont rate if i didnt install |
| 19:35.43 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: voted on mt |
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| 19:37.13 | ZogG_N9 | i didnt get what is mt for |
| 19:37.17 | rzr | ZogG_N9: http://apps.formeego.org/n9testing |
| 19:37.24 | rzr | apps://1527 |
| 19:37.50 | itsnotabigtruck | ZogG_N9: it's for making module files |
| 19:38.03 | itsnotabigtruck | like the old school 8-bit-console-style music |
| 19:38.03 | ZogG_N9 | rzr gave 5 starts before |
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| 19:38.10 | itsnotabigtruck | also i'm not talking about reviews |
| 19:38.15 | itsnotabigtruck | reviews don't actually do anything useful |
| 19:38.18 | itsnotabigtruck | it's approvals that matter |
| 19:38.22 | itsnotabigtruck | the community QA button |
| 19:38.39 | ZogG_N9 | i need to go to comp to do it |
| 19:38.40 | loxionworld | hei guys. very new to this n9 linux game. im very interested to lesrn from all u guys ** |
| 19:38.48 | ZogG_N9 | client cant do it |
| 19:39.10 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, sorry bugtracker is closed |
| 19:39.27 | ZogG_N9 | rip harmattan =) |
| 19:39.33 | loxionworld | meant to learn *typo* |
| 19:39.49 | ZogG_N9 | viva la nitroid and mer, hacks and community |
| 19:39.57 | itsnotabigtruck | loxionworld: well, you're probably in the right place |
| 19:40.16 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: amiga mod where on 16bits isnt it ? |
| 19:40.32 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, try linux on computer as second os, that might help |
| 19:40.55 | loxionworld | is the coding for n9 the same as pc os? |
| 19:41.04 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: good point...well, you get the idea :p |
| 19:41.08 | itsnotabigtruck | loxionworld: very similar |
| 19:41.23 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, not exactly, what language u want to code? |
| 19:41.23 | jonni | ZogG_N9: public bugtracker is closed, if you find some really major bug it still can be entered to internal tracker. |
| 19:41.25 | itsnotabigtruck | you can install scratchbox, which makes programming for the N9 almost like programming for a normal linux pc |
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| 19:41.49 | ZogG_N9 | jonni, we all know the story man |
| 19:42.07 | itsnotabigtruck | just to make it clear for everyone involved ^ rzr ZogG_N9 etc. |
| 19:42.10 | ZogG_N9 | jonni, we passed maemo5 story same way |
| 19:42.16 | itsnotabigtruck | REVIEWING does not approve an app |
| 19:42.28 | itsnotabigtruck | you must a) find the page on the AFM website |
| 19:42.31 | itsnotabigtruck | b) log in |
| 19:42.33 | *** join/#harmattan risca (~risca@wi-secure-7315.cc.umanitoba.ca) |
| 19:42.34 | itsnotabigtruck | c) click community qa |
| 19:42.40 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, i got it |
| 19:42.50 | itsnotabigtruck | d) tick the checkbox at the top and verify that everything below is true, then click da button |
| 19:43.05 | itsnotabigtruck | well, i'm just noticing that you guys have been reviewing each other's apps and *not* approving them :p |
| 19:43.10 | ZogG_N9 | jonni, at least no "wontfix" |
| 19:43.20 | loxionworld | im running on a quad cpu with 4gig ram. which linux will b gud enough for my system? |
| 19:43.37 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, doing it from client and i did qa few apps before |
| 19:43.44 | ZogG_N9 | my app is not there |
| 19:43.55 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, any |
| 19:44.27 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: i'll approve your app after doing a little validation on your package |
| 19:44.42 | itsnotabigtruck | i'd definitely like for it to be a bit more polished...overall the quality of apps submitted to AFM has been very unsatisfying |
| 19:44.44 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, ubuntu is mantaine and most of outofbox pretty looking, but i prefer hardcore gentoo =) |
| 19:45.12 | itsnotabigtruck | instead of being the non-corporate alternative to ovi, or whatever, it seems to have turned into an agglomeration of b-team apps |
| 19:45.21 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, thats why i said no voting if not installed |
| 19:45.25 | loxionworld | i think ive got fedora iso somewher in my external but i think its 4-6 years old. gud enough? |
| 19:46.08 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, yes, but better to get new, with proper drivers and stuff |
| 19:46.11 | loxionworld | @zog whats hard core for u? |
| 19:46.40 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, source based, with all things to config manually |
| 19:47.48 | loxionworld | does all linux come will drivers or do i have to download? |
| 19:47.56 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: the current one is far better |
| 19:48.24 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: what's up with the postist/prerm scripts? |
| 19:48.30 | loxionworld | with i meant *typo* |
| 19:48.38 | itsnotabigtruck | you don't need maintainer scripts just to make a symlink |
| 19:49.01 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, fedora would do it instead of you |
| 19:49.34 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, you can boot with cd into os and check before installing |
| 19:49.47 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: i'll look how to do that the debian way |
| 19:49.50 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: http://man.he.net/man1/dh_link |
| 19:50.12 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, just go to ubuntu.com |
| 19:52.07 | ZogG_N9 | rpc uses xml right or not or depends? |
| 19:52.09 | Corsac | damnit |
| 19:52.16 | Corsac | my n9 is back from warranty |
| 19:52.19 | Corsac | they upgraded it to pr1.2 |
| 19:52.35 | ZogG_N9 | Corsac, what was the problem? |
| 19:52.48 | Corsac | which means I'm not sure I can restore my backups... |
| 19:52.51 | Corsac | ZogG_N9: broken glass |
| 19:52.53 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: you need a non-default package manager icon |
| 19:53.17 | ZogG_N9 | i want to make remote app for transmission one day |
| 19:53.20 | rzr | let me update the current version |
| 19:53.28 | rzr | if you want to review it |
| 19:53.36 | itsnotabigtruck | ah, the one on AFM isn't current? |
| 19:53.39 | rzr | this is stupid to review old crap |
| 19:53.40 | rzr | no |
| 19:53.53 | itsnotabigtruck | oh ok |
| 19:54.06 | itsnotabigtruck | then i guess i should give the package-nazi treatment to the new one instead :p |
| 19:54.13 | rzr | :-) |
| 19:54.20 | ZogG_N9 | rzr, you have vim in repos? move some usefull tools to a4m |
| 19:54.45 | itsnotabigtruck | ZogG_N9: a lot of them probably need to be harmattanized with user/ sections and package manager icons and stuff |
| 19:54.46 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, thats why my pkg is not there |
| 19:54.50 | rzr | vim what an heresy ! you want to kill an emacs user like me |
| 19:55.17 | itsnotabigtruck | not having a p-m icon is probably excusable for a command line app though |
| 19:55.27 | ZogG_N9 | itsnotabigtruck, no need for that, vim from console at least if you dont wan to make meevim |
| 19:55.34 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: will push new one tonite ok ? |
| 19:55.48 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: ok cool |
| 19:55.53 | ZogG_N9 | rzr, ok now or never =) |
| 19:56.12 | ZogG_N9 | coz planning to kill myself later today |
| 19:56.23 | ZogG_N9 | do your last chance |
| 19:56.32 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck: i thought it would be good to have a version in accepted and an oter one testimg |
| 19:56.49 | itsnotabigtruck | rzr: don't, it's hard enough getting 6 approvals for one version |
| 19:56.52 | rzr | thats what i wanted it to be accepted before uploading the testing one |
| 19:57.10 | rzr | ok thx for this advice |
| 19:58.05 | itsnotabigtruck | Corsac: they accepted your N9 for warranty service for a broken screen? |
| 19:58.18 | itsnotabigtruck | btw http://apps.formeego.org/staging/applications/n9/pr1.0/harmattan/Network/ad-hac/ if anyone could approve this, that would be awesome |
| 19:58.31 | itsnotabigtruck | that said i guess most of you here don't use it since you have no need for it :p |
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| 20:01.51 | itsnotabigtruck | has to memorize a bunch of block cipher modes for the test coming up :( |
| 20:03.13 | *** join/#harmattan piggz (~piggz@host-2-100-147-33.as13285.net) |
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| 20:04.20 | ZogG_N9 | we need to make proper qa team luke in maemo |
| 20:05.01 | ZogG_N9 | like |
| 20:09.42 | itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82877 |
| 20:09.44 | itsnotabigtruck | strange |
| 20:10.04 | itsnotabigtruck | it looks like this person's phone wasn't actually flashed to PR1.2, despite them saying so |
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| 20:10.16 | itsnotabigtruck | i bet s/he did something like flash the rootfs only |
| 20:10.39 | ZogG_N9 | loxionworld, how is it going? |
| 20:11.02 | ZogG_N9 | gonna go |
| 20:11.36 | ZogG_N9 | time to pay attention to gf |
| 20:27.11 | Corsac | itsnotabigtruck: no, I paid for the repair |
| 20:27.24 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@2.80.56.168) |
| 20:27.46 | Corsac | hmhm, does anyone know if I can send my smses from an e71 to the n9? |
| 20:28.10 | itsnotabigtruck | Corsac: i think so...or maybe try using nokia suite |
| 20:28.30 | Corsac | I don't have windows so no pc suite for me, but maybe some bluetooth sync |
| 20:28.45 | Corsac | (though I'd like to only send smses from e71 to n9, not get the smses from n9 to e71) |
| 20:32.03 | *** join/#harmattan DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
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| 21:04.02 | divan | hi. is it possible to install git on the device with latest firmware (pr1.2)? |
| 21:04.22 | divan | I stuck with the openssl1.0.0 dependency problem |
| 21:05.05 | teleshoes | i have git working on PR1.1 |
| 21:05.08 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@bl19-56-168.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 21:08.14 | teleshoes | 1.6.5.7-0maemo0~rzr2 |
| 21:09.27 | teleshoes | devel-su |
| 21:09.27 | teleshoes | echo 'deb http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/rzr:/harmattan/MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_Maemo.org_MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_standard/ ./' > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/home-rzr-harmattan.list |
| 21:09.27 | teleshoes | apt-get update |
| 21:09.27 | teleshoes | apt-get install git |
| 21:13.52 | divan | teleshoes, and how about git-core package? |
| 21:14.15 | teleshoes | yep, libssl dep |
| 21:14.19 | teleshoes | same as you |
| 21:15.18 | teleshoes | just didnt notice |
| 21:16.09 | teleshoes | i dont know what git-core provides these days |
| 21:16.15 | teleshoes | i sorta thought nothing |
| 21:17.04 | teleshoes | i use git every day on my n9 |
| 21:17.06 | divan | teleshoes, i've installed git successfully, but i got weird errors on git clone from my repo, so I guess git-clone is needed |
| 21:17.15 | teleshoes | ah, its a path issue |
| 21:17.27 | teleshoes | /usr/libexec/git-core |
| 21:17.38 | teleshoes | pop PATH=$PATH:/usr/libexec/git-core in your profile or bashrc |
| 21:18.12 | divan | oh nice |
| 21:18.27 | divan | teleshoes, thanks a lot |
| 21:18.31 | teleshoes | np |
| 21:20.17 | *** join/#harmattan harbaum (~harbaum@dslb-092-074-255-170.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 21:20.23 | DocScrutinizer | open!mode kernel 1.2 pending publication |
| 21:21.04 | teleshoes | ive heard that you dont need to patch the kernel to get openmode in PR1.2 |
| 21:21.57 | DocScrutinizer | openmode is easy, just toggle a bit |
| 21:22.03 | teleshoes | that harmattan honors the trusted bit |
| 21:22.07 | DocScrutinizer | open!mode though is a bit different |
| 21:22.09 | teleshoes | oh |
| 21:22.13 | teleshoes | thought you were just excited |
| 21:22.16 | teleshoes | whats open!mode? |
| 21:22.18 | *** join/#harmattan gabriel9 (~gabriel9@31.223.217.150) |
| 21:22.22 | *** join/#harmattan divan (~divan@89.209.253.77) |
| 21:22.24 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: most people using open mode expect the hacktified behavior delivered by doc's kernel modification |
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| 21:22.31 | teleshoes | ah |
| 21:22.40 | DocScrutinizer | the patched openmode kernel that always returns OK on any aegis call |
| 21:22.43 | teleshoes | mm |
| 21:23.15 | itsnotabigtruck | btw DocScrutinizer: instead of patching aegis like that, consider perhaps instead removing the verification of validator-init |
| 21:23.22 | DocScrutinizer | it's not my kernel modification |
| 21:23.30 | itsnotabigtruck | then patching validator-init to not seal/enforce aegis |
| 21:23.33 | *** join/#harmattan divan (~divan@89.209.253.77) |
| 21:23.52 | itsnotabigtruck | DocScrutinizer: close enough, it's your kernel build anyway |
| 21:23.59 | DocScrutinizer | neither |
| 21:24.02 | itsnotabigtruck | oh ok |
| 21:24.09 | teleshoes | whozit? |
| 21:24.15 | itsnotabigtruck | in any case, disabling aegis from the start seems like a more elegant mode of operation |
| 21:24.19 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: an anonymous benefactor |
| 21:24.24 | teleshoes | heh |
| 21:24.32 | itsnotabigtruck | or, actually, putting aegis into permissive mode |
| 21:24.37 | itsnotabigtruck | disabling aegis will break things |
| 21:25.06 | Corsac | so what's open!mode then? |
| 21:25.15 | Corsac | open is starting to be a little confusing :) |
| 21:25.17 | *** join/#harmattan niqt (~quassel@188.11.106.198) |
| 21:25.23 | itsnotabigtruck | Corsac: doc's name for a kernel with nulled-out aegis permission checks |
| 21:26.41 | DocScrutinizer | actually with aegis permission checks that always return OK - well I already said that like 5 lines above |
| 21:26.59 | teleshoes | openmode is like what you got here for PR1.1: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.1/unpatched_openmode_kernel/ |
| 21:27.16 | teleshoes | open!mode is like what you got here for PR1.1: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.1/ |
| 21:27.31 | DocScrutinizer | exactly, and the patched one is where I've put the open!mode kernel |
| 21:28.12 | itsnotabigtruck | DocScrutinizer: also, that last part in the open-hack-patch, that enables all capabilities for root |
| 21:28.32 | itsnotabigtruck | the "proper" way to do that is that there's a securebits flag that governs whether becoming root grants all capabilities |
| 21:28.33 | DocScrutinizer | and I wonder if I shall create http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.2/ now, or better rename the whole mess |
| 21:28.43 | itsnotabigtruck | aegis sets that flag and locks it on |
| 21:28.53 | divan | and what does inception tool then? https://endno.de/~itsnotabigtruck/inception/ |
| 21:29.04 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@2.80.56.168) |
| 21:29.32 | teleshoes | i think keeping it the same has some advantages |
| 21:29.33 | itsnotabigtruck | so it might be desirable instead to e.g. not mess with cap_capable, and instead add a new bit to the aegis securityfs stuff that overrides that |
| 21:29.49 | itsnotabigtruck | which will keep the linux capability system operating normally |
| 21:29.53 | DocScrutinizer | it's an exploit of a security vulnerability in normal mode aegis, that will not work with next update |
| 21:29.57 | jussi | Hrm, Ive got duplicate icons on my newly upgraded pr1.2 n9. any ideas? |
| 21:30.25 | itsnotabigtruck | divan: it's most of the benefits of "open mode", but you can install it in 5 mins without erasing any data |
| 21:30.29 | itsnotabigtruck | and uninstall it just the same |
| 21:31.14 | teleshoes | plus inception has, from what i understand, no BigScaryWarning |
| 21:32.07 | teleshoes | DocScrutinizer is there a link to the patch from the anonymous benefactor? |
| 21:32.13 | DocScrutinizer | which it should, as it actually introduces an attack vector that compromises *all* N9, also those of users that love the 'security' aegis provides |
| 21:32.23 | teleshoes | mm |
| 21:32.37 | DocScrutinizer | teleshoes: they are all in this very dir |
| 21:33.02 | DocScrutinizer | except the "magic one-line patch" |
| 21:33.23 | teleshoes | yea, whats that? |
| 21:33.39 | itsnotabigtruck | DocScrutinizer: it's not like i /created/ the vulnerability |
| 21:33.58 | DocScrutinizer | I heard it's been bombed with hints on wich line to comment out on all the forums |
| 21:34.00 | itsnotabigtruck | and your open mode kernel arrangement completely breaks aegis |
| 21:34.29 | DocScrutinizer | itsnotabigtruck: so what? |
| 21:34.30 | itsnotabigtruck | though aegis already neutralizes itself, sort of, merely by booting into open mode, so i suppose it's a moot point |
| 21:34.36 | DocScrutinizer | can any malware exploit it? |
| 21:34.42 | teleshoes | totes |
| 21:35.13 | itsnotabigtruck | DocScrutinizer: of course...on the other hand, such malware is unlikely to ever actually exist |
| 21:35.32 | DocScrutinizer | openmode kernel (and open!mode kernel) are *supported* by Nokia |
| 21:35.46 | teleshoes | open!mode is?? |
| 21:35.46 | itsnotabigtruck | but assuming there's skilled developers building malware, they'd have been explotiing things like what INCEPTION does from...inception |
| 21:35.54 | CissWit | DocScrutinizer: so i get support if i install open!mode and that it crashes my phone ? |
| 21:36.05 | DocScrutinizer | BS |
| 21:36.29 | itsnotabigtruck | there's a multitude of ways to go from zero permission to all permission in aegis - inception utilizes one of them |
| 21:37.20 | DocScrutinizer | it's guaranteed not to crash your phone, and it's guaranteed NOT to get nuked by Nokia on next upgrade. this other "tool" is guaranteed to cease to work at latest with next OS upgrade |
| 21:37.24 | DocScrutinizer | probably sooner |
| 21:37.43 | teleshoes | it probably will, but its not guaranteed to |
| 21:37.55 | DocScrutinizer | believe me, it is |
| 21:38.07 | itsnotabigtruck | i'll never understand how you get so emotional about this |
| 21:38.11 | CissWit | DocScrutinizer: there somethinig else you told earlier that surprised me. You said you've been knowing about the vulnerability used by inception for long |
| 21:38.22 | CissWit | did you report it to nokia ? How long ago ? |
| 21:38.26 | DocScrutinizer | as much as Nokia internals can guarantee anything about what the company will do |
| 21:38.27 | teleshoes | its a pretty glaring hole |
| 21:38.47 | DocScrutinizer | CissWit: WUT? |
| 21:39.03 | CissWit | DocScrutinizer: ? |
| 21:39.16 | jussi | bah, no one has duplicate icons? |
| 21:39.21 | teleshoes | i do! |
| 21:39.24 | DocScrutinizer | we don't report anything to Nokia |
| 21:39.28 | teleshoes | in pr1.1 all the time |
| 21:39.41 | jussi | teleshoes: its pr1.2 :/ |
| 21:39.45 | teleshoes | i know |
| 21:39.50 | teleshoes | so i cant help you yet |
| 21:39.51 | DocScrutinizer | itsnotabigtruck implicitly did |
| 21:39.54 | itsnotabigtruck | DocScrutinizer: instead of getting all angry about this, the obvious thing to do on your part is make open mode the best it can be |
| 21:40.02 | CissWit | DocScrutinizer: and that's much better than doing nothing |
| 21:40.08 | itsnotabigtruck | which includes making the kernel patch a bit more elegant |
| 21:40.18 | jussi | teleshoes: :/ :( |
| 21:40.26 | itsnotabigtruck | and promote detailed and accurate instructions for deploying it |
| 21:40.30 | DocScrutinizer | CissWit: you're trying to pester me, do you? |
| 21:40.55 | CissWit | no, i don't understand your point about all this inception thing |
| 21:40.57 | itsnotabigtruck | maybe make an automated utility for installing open mode on a user's phone |
| 21:41.05 | teleshoes | hey hey, itsnotabigtruck did us TWO services by making inception |
| 21:41.05 | CissWit | what you say is that it will get broken on next update |
| 21:41.23 | teleshoes | first, we can now get around aegis for awhile in a nice way |
| 21:41.24 | DocScrutinizer | because that's what I hear from Nokia |
| 21:41.28 | CissWit | great, a vulnerability will be corrected, making the security brought by aegis a little more reliable |
| 21:41.38 | teleshoes | and second, nokia is much more liekly to fix a bad hole |
| 21:42.08 | teleshoes | DocScrutinizer: is a nokia dev the anonymous benefactor of the open!mode kernel? |
| 21:42.09 | CissWit | but you said you ve been knowing the vulns for long, and what ? You just did nothing ? That'e what you think is better than releasing a working exploit ? |
| 21:42.24 | DocScrutinizer | teleshoes: well, you can put it this way, yes |
| 21:42.51 | DocScrutinizer | CissWit: are you a whitehat? |
| 21:42.59 | CissWit | kind of |
| 21:43.01 | DocScrutinizer | are you a developer? |
| 21:43.07 | CissWit | kind of |
| 21:43.15 | CissWit | i'm more a n9 user there |
| 21:43.24 | DocScrutinizer | are you contributing ANYTHING to this whole mess? |
| 21:43.29 | CissWit | concerned with the security of his phone |
| 21:43.38 | *** join/#harmattan messerting (~messertin@39.79-161-65.customer.lyse.net) |
| 21:43.47 | DocScrutinizer | ok, so please shut up or move to #n9 |
| 21:44.16 | itsnotabigtruck | maybe we all need to take a break |
| 21:44.23 | CissWit | i can develop a working exploit to if it gives me the privilege to talk to you. |
| 21:44.28 | CissWit | too* |
| 21:44.28 | itsnotabigtruck | this is getting worse by the minute |
| 21:44.37 | *** join/#harmattan javispedro (~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro) |
| 21:45.12 | DocScrutinizer | javispedro: sorry I'm leaving. Madness shit hits the fan again here |
| 21:45.22 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@2.80.56.168) |
| 21:45.27 | CissWit | DocScrutinizer: i was just acurious about what you said |
| 21:45.39 | CissWit | i was not trying to "pester you" |
| 21:45.47 | javispedro | grabs the popcorn |
| 21:45.49 | DocScrutinizer | they now love to accuse us for not publishing the aegis exploits |
| 21:46.08 | CissWit | i really don't understand your point there, but i'd like to. |
| 21:46.26 | *** part/#harmattan DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 21:46.37 | javispedro | CissWit: it is simple. I did not want this platform to attract a bunch of android/iphone mindset wannabe crackers |
| 21:46.48 | javispedro | this is supposed to be something "better" |
| 21:46.59 | teleshoes | buuut |
| 21:47.18 | teleshoes | this hole totally nullifies aegis |
| 21:47.34 | teleshoes | the interpreter one |
| 21:47.46 | javispedro | until the next PR |
| 21:47.52 | teleshoes | mm |
| 21:47.57 | *** join/#harmattan SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 21:48.01 | teleshoes | ahhhh |
| 21:48.07 | teleshoes | i see, nokia has known about it forever |
| 21:48.39 | teleshoes | no need to pub it; they were already working on patching it |
| 21:48.42 | teleshoes | yea? |
| 21:48.56 | javispedro | look |
| 21:49.06 | javispedro | I would not even put my finger on whether a new release will EVER happen |
| 21:49.21 | teleshoes | those asshats, closing the trakker |
| 21:49.24 | javispedro | but in any way the last time I published a hole it was promptly fixed and triggered a rage rant from me |
| 21:49.32 | teleshoes | oh right! |
| 21:49.34 | teleshoes | i remember that |
| 21:49.37 | javispedro | since then I publicly decided not to publish any new holes |
| 21:49.57 | javispedro | and we've using them to e.g. explore the contents of the crypto stuff to duplicate it for open mode |
| 21:50.09 | teleshoes | ahhh |
| 21:50.32 | itsnotabigtruck | javispedro: well, i'm pretty sure they shut down the tracker due to a freeze on pr1.3, which has been in development for a while |
| 21:50.55 | teleshoes | yea, its likely there will be one more release |
| 21:50.56 | CissWit | javispedro: ok |
| 21:51.15 | Corsac | shut down the tracker? |
| 21:51.20 | teleshoes | the bug tracker |
| 21:51.21 | teleshoes | this morning |
| 21:51.25 | teleshoes | no more new bugs |
| 21:51.28 | itsnotabigtruck | Corsac: the bug tracker, it's now read-only |
| 21:51.30 | Corsac | oh. |
| 21:51.50 | CissWit | javispedro: that make things clearer to me, thx. |
| 21:54.03 | javispedro | I would not put my finger on it ever being reopened either :P |
| 21:54.21 | teleshoes | yea no |
| 21:54.58 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah, that idea is wishful thinking on the part of some TMO people |
| 21:55.01 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@catv-89-134-153-62.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 21:55.01 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 21:55.16 | teleshoes | completely understandable wishful thinking |
| 21:57.51 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@2.80.56.168) |
| 21:58.27 | teleshoes | hey, so if you need an aegis hole to make the open kernel, why do i see everyone promising that there will always be an open kernel? |
| 21:59.01 | javispedro | you do not a hole |
| 21:59.04 | javispedro | *need a hole |
| 21:59.23 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: you don't...i think javispedro was talking about r/eing the aegis crypto system |
| 21:59.28 | javispedro | I was saying that we've been using them to investigate how stuff works |
| 21:59.51 | itsnotabigtruck | which you don't even really need a ryunning system in order to do... |
| 22:00.03 | teleshoes | i...dont follow |
| 22:00.08 | teleshoes | oh |
| 22:00.31 | javispedro | itsnotabigtruck: you can't really decrypt aegisfs stuff offline, because bb5 hasn't been cracked. |
| 22:01.18 | teleshoes | but you can online? |
| 22:02.04 | javispedro | it is happening at every moment... |
| 22:02.46 | teleshoes | right, but i assumed by closed source binaries |
| 22:03.25 | itsnotabigtruck | javispedro: oh, thought you were referring to making the aegis crypto logic behave in open mode as it does in closed mode |
| 22:07.15 | teleshoes | itsnotabigtruck: why exactly do we want this anyway? |
| 22:07.27 | teleshoes | to not break other things? |
| 22:08.47 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: yeah |
| 22:08.51 | itsnotabigtruck | i think |
| 22:08.58 | teleshoes | like faceblork |
| 22:09.02 | teleshoes | k |
| 22:09.40 | sahibkhadaffi | has screen been ported over to harmattan? if so is the case, in which repository does it reside? |
| 22:10.51 | Corsac | pff, this sms transfer is really an epic fail |
| 22:11.12 | teleshoes | hey, so this seems like the right place to ask |
| 22:11.16 | teleshoes | so i like to back up, have a human readable copy, and restore my texts and call history |
| 22:11.42 | teleshoes | so apparently everything uses /home/user/.cache/tracker/meta.db |
| 22:12.20 | teleshoes | the same place that the usual purposes of tracker {music album cover art, document search, etc} |
| 22:12.23 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@bl19-56-168.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 22:12.55 | teleshoes | does anyone know of a sensible way to backup/restore texts/calls? |
| 22:13.04 | tehdely | man the twitter client sure is a slow CPU hog |
| 22:15.13 | Corsac | tehdely: https://github.com/cuckoohello/smssync |
| 22:16.08 | tehdely | what does it do? |
| 22:16.17 | itsnotabigtruck | Corsac: perhaps you meant @ teleshoes? |
| 22:16.30 | itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: any chance you could community QA ad-hac on afm? |
| 22:16.35 | itsnotabigtruck | (and anyone else who's using ad-hac) |
| 22:16.54 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: hmm, if you're in the US you might find ad-hac useful also |
| 22:17.02 | teleshoes | i use ad-hac |
| 22:17.04 | teleshoes | in fact |
| 22:17.05 | Corsac | itsnotabigtruck: indeed :) |
| 22:17.15 | itsnotabigtruck | http://apps.formeego.org/staging/applications/n9/pr1.0/harmattan/Network/ad-hac/ < afm page |
| 22:17.41 | teleshoes | believe it or now, i dont know how to use apps.formeego.org |
| 22:17.43 | itsnotabigtruck | need to get 6 approvals for to migrate out of testing...at the current rate the heat death of the universe will happen first :) |
| 22:17.49 | teleshoes | oh, ill give it |
| 22:17.56 | teleshoes | heh |
| 22:18.15 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: well, to approve it, you log into your meego.com forums account and click the community qa button |
| 22:18.22 | itsnotabigtruck | tick the checkbox and make sure it complies with the requirements listed |
| 22:18.30 | itsnotabigtruck | for downloading things from afm, open a devel-su shell and |
| 22:18.31 | teleshoes | right, but, how in the name of god do i get afm to give me a deb |
| 22:19.03 | itsnotabigtruck | echo 'deb http://repo.apps.formeego.org/harmattan/apps-testing/ ./' > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/appsformeego-testing.list |
| 22:19.10 | teleshoes | oh snap theres a repo |
| 22:19.13 | teleshoes | coool |
| 22:19.14 | teleshoes | thx |
| 22:19.16 | itsnotabigtruck | echo 'deb http://repo.apps.formeego.org/harmattan/apps/ ./' > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/appsformeego.list |
| 22:19.23 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get install aegis-community-source-policy |
| 22:19.25 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get update |
| 22:19.39 | teleshoes | i...dont really...need that bit |
| 22:19.50 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: the last part is important |
| 22:20.00 | itsnotabigtruck | the community source policy registers it into aegis |
| 22:20.02 | teleshoes | i use an openkernel |
| 22:20.07 | teleshoes | yea |
| 22:20.20 | teleshoes | one day ill use inception |
| 22:20.23 | teleshoes | probably next week |
| 22:20.26 | teleshoes | but til then |
| 22:20.28 | itsnotabigtruck | heh |
| 22:20.42 | itsnotabigtruck | and then, if you want the gui client, you can apt-get install org.formeego.apps |
| 22:20.46 | teleshoes | i have a REALLY GOOD QUESTION |
| 22:20.48 | itsnotabigtruck | yes, the package is named like a java package, don't ask me why |
| 22:20.56 | itsnotabigtruck | the gui client is a bit clunky but it works |
| 22:20.57 | teleshoes | why isnt the repo anywhere to be found on their wabsite |
| 22:21.07 | itsnotabigtruck | good question, they want everybody to use their gui client it seems |
| 22:21.09 | teleshoes | i dont like guis |
| 22:21.54 | itsnotabigtruck | make sure you get both of those repos, too |
| 22:22.03 | teleshoes | yea, i understand adhac is still in testing |
| 22:22.20 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah, along with basically everything else |
| 22:22.26 | teleshoes | heh |
| 22:22.29 | itsnotabigtruck | getting people to do qa approvals has been a bit troublesome :p |
| 22:22.43 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@bl19-56-168.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 22:23.14 | itsnotabigtruck | also installing the aegis-community-source-policy is still a good idea, it allows downloaded packages to be apt-verified |
| 22:23.30 | *** join/#harmattan forked (~andro@81-234-78-61-no121.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 22:23.51 | itsnotabigtruck | (it installs the apt key for appsformeego) |
| 22:23.59 | teleshoes | mm |
| 22:24.04 | teleshoes | if only to remove the warning |
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| 22:27.39 | teleshoes | hey now, Corsac |
| 22:27.47 | teleshoes | smssync |
| 22:28.16 | teleshoes | what precisely is this? |
| 22:28.21 | teleshoes | does it have a cli? |
| 22:28.47 | teleshoes | hey! |
| 22:28.54 | teleshoes | this is pretty much EXACTLY what i wanted |
| 22:29.40 | teleshoes | somebody to work out the NMO tracker namespace thing in the context of qmessage |
| 22:29.59 | itsnotabigtruck | heh |
| 22:30.31 | teleshoes | cant tell whether it has the feature-set im looking for yet |
| 22:30.44 | teleshoes | any feature list or readme or homepage or something Corsac? |
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| 22:32.20 | Corsac | teleshoes: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=5721 and http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=5725 |
| 22:32.52 | teleshoes | jesus, this is wonderful thanks a ton for the tip |
| 22:34.31 | gabriel9 | guys, can anyone share some stats about share market and number of apps from major players? |
| 22:34.38 | gabriel9 | MS, Droids and nokia |
| 22:35.00 | gabriel9 | i am creating presentation and google is not helping |
| 22:35.15 | gabriel9 | and i will show them N9 |
| 22:35.26 | gabriel9 | and talk about Qt and Qt quick |
| 22:35.27 | Corsac | n9 market share is 0 |
| 22:35.28 | gabriel9 | :) |
| 22:35.40 | gabriel9 | ok |
| 22:35.46 | gabriel9 | that's start :) |
| 22:36.01 | teleshoes | we're pretty much all right here ;) |
| 22:36.17 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@2.80.56.168) |
| 22:36.23 | teleshoes | though from what i hear there were many times more n9s sold than their windows phone counterpart |
| 22:36.45 | gabriel9 | The N9 are on TV |
| 22:36.46 | gabriel9 | :) |
| 22:36.55 | gabriel9 | in my country |
| 22:37.01 | teleshoes | mm, lucky |
| 22:37.10 | teleshoes | i would love to see a commercial on tv |
| 22:37.19 | Corsac | http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/24/nokia-largest-windows-phone-maker/ |
| 22:37.37 | Corsac | not sure if there were 900 000+ n9 sold |
| 22:37.47 | teleshoes | i think it was 2M |
| 22:37.54 | teleshoes | from hear-say |
| 22:38.01 | teleshoes | heresay? |
| 22:38.03 | teleshoes | heresy |
| 22:38.11 | teleshoes | hearsay |
| 22:38.29 | teleshoes | nokia didnt pub so its an estimate |
| 22:38.50 | teleshoes | => possibly a wild guess on a fanboy's part |
| 22:38.54 | teleshoes | lemme find where i got that from |
| 22:38.56 | gabriel9 | hm |
| 22:39.06 | gabriel9 | is there any graph |
| 22:39.15 | gabriel9 | with numbers for all of them |
| 22:39.38 | teleshoes | no, theres no official number |
| 22:39.42 | teleshoes | on the n9, that is |
| 22:40.44 | teleshoes | 1.4M is the estimate i found on tmo |
| 22:40.47 | gabriel9 | on the android |
| 22:40.50 | teleshoes | but its nothing like a relaible number |
| 22:40.54 | gabriel9 | and ios |
| 22:41.31 | teleshoes | hey, so Corsac or somebody |
| 22:41.37 | teleshoes | how do i restore using smssync |
| 22:41.49 | Corsac | I'm not sure it can do that at all |
| 22:41.53 | teleshoes | awwww |
| 22:41.55 | teleshoes | whats it for? |
| 22:42.01 | teleshoes | back up without restore |
| 22:42.08 | Corsac | look at the sources, but.. |
| 22:42.19 | teleshoes | yea, i didnt see any code for it at first glance |
| 22:42.27 | teleshoes | ugh |
| 22:42.29 | teleshoes | oh well |
| 22:45.00 | teleshoes | damnit, yea, doesnt look like it does what i want |
| 22:45.07 | teleshoes | ill just back up the meta.db |
| 22:45.12 | teleshoes | like ive been doing |
| 22:45.24 | Corsac | you can use the backup app too |
| 22:45.29 | Corsac | though it does a full backup |
| 22:45.34 | Corsac | and no way to do partial restores |
| 22:45.43 | teleshoes | yea, its pretty annoying |
| 22:45.48 | teleshoes | it basically just does what i do anyway |
| 22:45.51 | teleshoes | copy the tracker db |
| 22:46.04 | teleshoes | which is extremely over-used imo |
| 22:46.41 | Corsac | agreed |
| 22:46.47 | teleshoes | i guess what ill do is backup the db nightly |
| 22:46.54 | Corsac | tracker should have been used just for indexing data |
| 22:46.54 | teleshoes | and when i need to restore, pull out the MBs of crap |
| 22:46.57 | teleshoes | yea |
| 22:46.57 | Corsac | not for storing it |
| 22:47.01 | teleshoes | yep |
| 22:47.11 | teleshoes | that is exactly whats wrong with it |
| 22:47.34 | teleshoes | tracker isnt intended to store data, but to be a transparent cache to speed things up |
| 22:47.53 | teleshoes | this is probably the source of all the tracker bugs people complain about |
| 22:48.03 | teleshoes | contacts take 20s to load, |
| 22:48.13 | teleshoes | phone freezes while it crawls, |
| 22:48.13 | teleshoes | etc |
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| 22:50.59 | Corsac | unfortunately it's obvious that it won't change |
| 22:51.21 | teleshoes | heh |
| 22:51.29 | teleshoes | nemo's looking better |
| 23:01.27 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@bl19-56-168.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 23:01.38 | teleshoes | hey, speaking of which, anybody on here use nemo on the n9? |
| 23:04.00 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@catv-89-134-153-62.catv.broadband.hu) |
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| 23:26.47 | djszapi | is back to Helsinki |
| 23:28.22 | *** join/#harmattan pinheiro_ (~pinheiro@bl19-56-168.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 23:29.43 | djszapi | Venemo: hey :) |
| 23:29.45 | djszapi | How is life ? |
| 23:30.09 | Venemo | hey djszapi :) |
| 23:30.13 | Venemo | life is good, as usual :) |
| 23:31.24 | Venemo | djszapi, I'm a little bit over my head at my workplace, but I'm feeling good nevertheless. just watched a movie with a good friend of mine |
| 23:35.31 | djszapi | Venemo: nice :) |
| 23:35.35 | djszapi | sounds good! |
| 23:36.21 | Venemo | also, it seems that the latest update for the lumia isn't much good |
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| 23:49.26 | itsnotabigtruck | w00t, finally got the crypto token to behave |
| 23:49.57 | djszapi | I always think you talk to "w00t", but he has not been here for ages. |
| 23:50.36 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah...maybe i should stop sing that exclamation here, lol |
| 23:50.41 | itsnotabigtruck | but w00t didn't invent w00t :p |
| 23:51.04 | djszapi | is close to collapsing |
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| 23:56.04 | Venemo | djszapi, what's wrong? |
| 23:56.07 | Venemo | itsnotabigtruck :) |
| 23:56.57 | itsnotabigtruck | it |
| 23:57.07 | itsnotabigtruck | er, it's a shame software for crypto tokens tends to be on the flaky side of things |
| 23:57.15 | djszapi | Venemo: it was a fruitful sprint with lot of energy put into it ... |
| 23:57.47 | Venemo | djszapi, ah, I'm happy for you! :) |
| 23:57.56 | Venemo | djszapi, was this the Plasma Active sprint? |
| 23:59.09 | djszapi | Venemo: yes... |
| 23:59.22 | djszapi | but keep tunned, we have some plans around the desktop soon... |