| 00:01.07 | Creteil | Even on the comprehensive n9 flashing guide on TMO it's not clear, I mean they focus on how to flash but not on how to backup ... (I have already flashed the other one I have ordered for my girlfriend without any data to save before ...) ... |
| 00:02.06 | Creteil | On this device, Nokia clearly made big mistake in terms of data backup & flash imho ... |
| 00:02.37 | Creteil | I don't really understand what does the backup option do ... |
| 00:03.33 | Enforcer | backs up certain stuff to a .backups folder iirc |
| 00:04.20 | Creteil | Enforcer, you must admit at least even your answer is not clear :-) it's like everything is not clear on this device :-) |
| 00:04.33 | Enforcer | /home/user/MyDocs/.backups |
| 00:05.15 | Enforcer | i'm 99% sure it doesnt backup conversations ('Messages') |
| 00:05.54 | itsnotabigtruck | Enforcer: he's probably going to flash the emmc |
| 00:05.59 | itsnotabigtruck | so the stuff needs to be backed up OFF THE N9 |
| 00:06.13 | Creteil | Enforcer, now if I use the backup function and after that use the flash of both eMMC and main, does the .backup directory removed by the procedure ? |
| 00:06.21 | Creteil | ah |
| 00:06.23 | Creteil | yes !!! |
| 00:06.30 | Creteil | thanks itsnotabigtruck |
| 00:06.46 | Creteil | this answering my question ... |
| 00:07.04 | Enforcer | everything under MyDocs is the EMMC |
| 00:07.46 | itsnotabigtruck | ugh |
| 00:07.53 | itsnotabigtruck | youtube apparently doesn't allow you to buffer an entire video anymore |
| 00:07.54 | Creteil | so, reading many threads on TMO about pr1.2 flashing, I see many answer saying for many bugs really fixed by pr1.2 we need to flash main + emmc ... |
| 00:08.01 | itsnotabigtruck | i load the page, pause the vid, and it stops loading |
| 00:08.12 | itsnotabigtruck | i seek back to the beginning and play and it starts loading again, but only seconds ahead |
| 00:08.30 | itsnotabigtruck | also seeking back itself resets the buffer |
| 00:08.46 | Creteil | itsnotabigtruck, it's one of the less important trouble I see about this device :-) |
| 00:09.11 | itsnotabigtruck | i was talking about youtube w/ flash on the pc btw, not the N9 :p |
| 00:09.27 | itsnotabigtruck | anyway, yeah, you should probably upgrade to pr1.2 with a full flash in all cases |
| 00:09.37 | itsnotabigtruck | upgrading through the update system is kind of hit or miss |
| 00:09.52 | itsnotabigtruck | sorry about your data loss, a lot of people here really don't like tracker because of stuff like this |
| 00:10.08 | itsnotabigtruck | it's an interesting concept but badly implemented |
| 00:10.24 | Creteil | itsnotabigtruck, I was reluctant about full flashing since pr1.2, but now I have no more options, look like I in the way to flash main + emmc |
| 00:10.39 | Enforcer | why flash emmc? |
| 00:11.00 | itsnotabigtruck | Enforcer: for one it'll obliterate any b0rked tracker database left behind |
| 00:11.12 | Creteil | hope the surprise of pr1.3 is the fix for all these problems/implementations ... |
| 00:11.23 | itsnotabigtruck | and a lot of the pr1.2 upgrade problems are due to config files, tracker stuff, etc. being left behind |
| 00:11.26 | Enforcer | tracker db is under MyDocs? |
| 00:11.28 | itsnotabigtruck | precisely the stuff flashing emmc gets rid of |
| 00:11.33 | itsnotabigtruck | it's under ~ i believe |
| 00:11.54 | itsnotabigtruck | ~user and ~user/MyDocs are both eliminated with the emmc image afaik |
| 00:11.55 | infobot | itsnotabigtruck: okay |
| 00:11.57 | junglizer | itsnotabigtruck: Yay! Flashing |
| 00:12.22 | itsnotabigtruck | whoops, lol |
| 00:12.24 | itsnotabigtruck | ~user |
| 00:12.25 | infobot | user is, like, currently detached. Talk to this user upon their return. You will now be ignored. [HackFactor Elite 2.0], or a synonym for moron |
| 00:12.36 | Enforcer | /dev/mmcblk0p3 == /home (2GB) |
| 00:12.37 | itsnotabigtruck | ~user and ~user/MyDocs |
| 00:12.37 | infobot | user and ~user/mydocs are both eliminated with the emmc image afaik |
| 00:12.42 | itsnotabigtruck | lol |
| 00:13.04 | Enforcer | /dev/mmcblk0p1 == /home/user/MyDocs (53.7GB) |
| 00:13.17 | itsnotabigtruck | Enforcer: yep |
| 00:13.19 | Enforcer | so anything under home is emmc |
| 00:13.21 | Creteil | And a new s**t occur :-) since I want to benefit the pr1.2 quickly I have flashed the version 006 in case of the original 005 of my device ... |
| 00:13.32 | Enforcer | but MyDocs is much bigger than the rest of /home |
| 00:13.52 | itsnotabigtruck | Creteil: if you were on PR1.1, you should flash PR1.2 001 |
| 00:14.01 | Enforcer | err, 005? |
| 00:14.03 | itsnotabigtruck | afaik 006 gets updates no faster than 005 |
| 00:14.09 | Creteil | now I need to launch navifirm from my mother slow dsl connection to feetch pr1.2 version 005 ... |
| 00:14.15 | itsnotabigtruck | however, 001, 005, 006, and 009 all get updates pretty fast |
| 00:14.25 | itsnotabigtruck | 100 and higher takes forever to get updates, you don't want those |
| 00:14.31 | itsnotabigtruck | 003 is the china version, you don't want that either |
| 00:14.34 | Enforcer | 299 ftw |
| 00:14.59 | itsnotabigtruck | 299 not ftw :p |
| 00:15.09 | Creteil | itsnotabigtruck, I know how to flash, it's just the files I need to download ... |
| 00:15.17 | Creteil | from a slow connection ... |
| 00:15.30 | Creteil | I'm on vacation at my mother home ... |
| 00:15.31 | itsnotabigtruck | junglizer: so did it work? |
| 00:15.32 | junglizer | YES YES YES! |
| 00:16.08 | itsnotabigtruck | i'm guessing that's a yes |
| 00:16.17 | itsnotabigtruck | lol |
| 00:16.20 | junglizer | yes |
| 00:16.21 | Creteil | look like :-) |
| 00:16.23 | Creteil | ehehehehe |
| 00:16.29 | itsnotabigtruck | now get this https://endno.de/~itsnotabigtruck/inception/ |
| 00:16.39 | Creteil | good to know someone can be happy with this device :-) |
| 00:16.54 | itsnotabigtruck | also get this http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82715 |
| 00:17.01 | itsnotabigtruck | if you get apps for meego, you can install ad-hac through there |
| 00:18.11 | itsnotabigtruck | and this too http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=83357 though setting a overclock that's too high is a good way to corrupt your tracker and other stuff and have to reflash like creteil is doing :p |
| 00:18.41 | itsnotabigtruck | seems like many people have had good results with a mild 100 MHz overclock |
| 00:18.47 | itsnotabigtruck | and no overvolting |
| 00:19.57 | Creteil | Don't remember, does the N9 can be accessed in usb host mode when I turn it off and connect it to my computer via usb cable ? |
| 00:20.52 | itsnotabigtruck | Creteil: you can put it in mass storage mode while it's turned on, if that's what you mean |
| 00:21.08 | itsnotabigtruck | when powered down, it only charges |
| 00:21.17 | Creteil | ok |
| 00:21.36 | itsnotabigtruck | the N9 itself can't be put into host mode (yet, anyway) but i don't think that's what you meant |
| 00:22.08 | Creteil | sorry s/usb host mode/usb mass storage/ |
| 00:22.53 | Creteil | by chance I have leave the 2 files with 006 version on my computer !!! |
| 00:23.27 | Creteil | no need to reload 006 version (now I have already 006 flashed, so cannot downgrade to the 005 version ...) . |
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| 00:34.05 | Creteil | how to save a favorite drive ? |
| 00:38.10 | Necrosporus | How do I remove preinstalled packages, keeping mp-harmattan-001-pr on place? |
| 00:46.20 | itsnotabigtruck | Necrosporus: one way is to edit /var/lib/dpkg/status and modify the dependencies of mp-harmattan-001-pr |
| 00:46.37 | itsnotabigtruck | be careful to preserve the format of the file |
| 00:56.17 | Creteil | oh damn, I also see we can't properly save notes on this f*****g phone ... |
| 00:56.25 | Creteil | tsss |
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| 02:20.53 | Arie | tgalal: I just wanted to know why wazapp is a stand alone app vs. a telepathy plugin? |
| 02:26.00 | tgalal_ | Arie: because nokia's documentation for harmattan is SHIT and there were no guarantees I'd be able to achieve many of whatsapp's features as a telepathy plugin. features that are not even supported by any of the existent protocol plugins even as a proof of concept |
| 02:26.40 | tgalal_ | message delivery statuses, sending media, sending location, user typing and others |
| 02:27.52 | Enforcer | yet there is plenty of telepathy plugins currently? |
| 02:28.39 | Enforcer | does wazapp allow sms fallback? |
| 02:29.10 | itsnotabigtruck | i think telepathy is fairly well documented, after all it's not a nokia project anyway |
| 02:29.20 | itsnotabigtruck | as for accounts plugins, that's another story |
| 02:29.24 | itsnotabigtruck | if you need any help with that just ask |
| 02:30.39 | itsnotabigtruck | the best approach for the accounts plugin probably depends on how authentication in whatsapp actually works |
| 02:30.42 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal_ ^ |
| 02:31.18 | itsnotabigtruck | one of the benefits of the telepathy approach is that it would be possible to slot it in on a linux system and use whatsapp from there |
| 02:32.04 | itsnotabigtruck | it's a real shame the accounts stuff is so poorly documented and difficult to use, a lot of apps could take advantage of it |
| 02:32.24 | itsnotabigtruck | but few devs have taken it on |
| 02:33.04 | itsnotabigtruck | i tried to fix up aard_'s account plugin for xmpp (non-google-talk) and make it use SignOn for authentication, turns out it's rather difficult and i put that project on the backburner :( |
| 02:33.18 | itsnotabigtruck | though i did get the SignOn stuff working eventually |
| 02:33.35 | tgalal_ | itsnotabigtruck: it's like they cancelled documenting it, it starts nice and informative, then nothing, emptyness, a black whole |
| 02:33.43 | tgalal_ | hole |
| 02:34.08 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal_: well, again, if you're having trouble you need to ask, because if you're going to get info about it anywhere it's probably here |
| 02:34.24 | itsnotabigtruck | the main source of info is the libaccounts-ui source code on gitorious |
| 02:34.46 | tgalal_ | itsnotabigtruck: yeah I know I did get it to work eventually so it's okay now |
| 02:35.09 | tgalal_ | i'm almost there |
| 02:35.10 | tgalal_ | lol |
| 02:35.14 | itsnotabigtruck | also somewhere on the nokia developer site is the code for the dropbox account plugin, sharing plugin, and signon plugin |
| 02:35.21 | itsnotabigtruck | or some variant of it anyway |
| 02:35.39 | tgalal_ | no signon for python |
| 02:36.03 | itsnotabigtruck | no anything for python, if you want to integrate with the harmattan system stuff python isn't an option |
| 02:36.12 | itsnotabigtruck | besides, aren't you a qt ambassador? |
| 02:36.19 | itsnotabigtruck | you should live and breathe c++ and qt :p |
| 02:36.41 | tgalal_ | but I am using qt |
| 02:37.03 | tgalal_ | and now I know I should have used c++ |
| 02:37.37 | tgalal_ | oh wait |
| 02:37.45 | tgalal_ | how did u know I'm a qt ambassador :D |
| 02:38.03 | itsnotabigtruck | it's not terribly difficult to find... |
| 02:38.39 | Arie | tgalal_: you also work for Nokia now too if I'm not mistaken |
| 02:52.17 | itsnotabigtruck | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy61r3Qkm6o |
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| 03:12.47 | tgalal_ | finally resolved resgistration issues ! |
| 03:13.10 | tgalal_ | it runs smoothly now, from registration to actual usage |
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| 03:14.17 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal_: how does whatsapp authenticate? |
| 03:14.28 | itsnotabigtruck | it might be advisable to use SignOn |
| 03:15.05 | Arie | tgalal_: congratulations |
| 03:16.03 | tgalal_ | itsnotabigtruck: will I be able to use SignOn from python ? |
| 03:16.53 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal_: doubt it, but it does provide the ability to protect credentials with aegis |
| 03:17.19 | itsnotabigtruck | though that isn't exactly strong protection...but it does make it significantly more difficult to grab passwords anyway |
| 03:18.09 | Tronic | tgalal_: You should make a plugin instead of stand-alone app. |
| 03:18.26 | Tronic | The beauty of Harmattan is that everything is integrated with the OS instead of zillion stand-alone apps. |
| 03:18.27 | tgalal_ | itsnotabigtruck: ah I wouldn't worry about protecting whatsapp's credentials. how whatsapp registers and logins is shit anyway |
| 03:19.51 | tgalal_ | it's so damn insecure that I can literally setup a website where people can use it to hijack each others accounts |
| 03:20.19 | itsnotabigtruck | does it use SSL or some other crypto layer |
| 03:20.38 | itsnotabigtruck | if it does but it's optional (e.g. like most xmpp servers) it would be advisable to lock it to on |
| 03:21.17 | tgalal_ | itsnotabigtruck: it's not about what it uses, it's about how it does it, it has a flaw, but I'm not exposing it just yet |
| 03:25.19 | tgalal_ | Tronic: do you know how many times per day I get told that :) |
| 03:27.14 | itsnotabigtruck | well, that's because it's true...of course, it is your app and your discretion |
| 03:27.24 | itsnotabigtruck | but now people who insist on an integrated experience have to reinvent the wheel |
| 03:28.07 | itsnotabigtruck | the standalone app approach is usually not a preferred option, it's just the only option on most platforms |
| 03:28.47 | Arie | tgalal_: after you release the source, we have to re-engineer the whatsapp client as a plugin |
| 03:31.53 | tgalal_ | Arie: not really, I might have no problem participating in that |
| 03:32.33 | Arie | tgalal_: you're saying you will participate in that? |
| 03:33.39 | tgalal_ | Arie: I said maybe :P |
| 03:34.31 | Arie | tgalal_: Will you take itsnotabigtruck's help? |
| 03:35.27 | itsnotabigtruck | eh, i'm not committing to putting work into whatsapp stuff :p |
| 03:35.33 | itsnotabigtruck | it has about zero applicability to me |
| 03:35.42 | itsnotabigtruck | but i'll try to help if i can anyway |
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| 03:41.54 | tgalal | ah finally no underscores! |
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| 03:42.49 | beford | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:43.16 | tgalal | beford: I do own it, but it got stuck for some reason |
| 03:46.04 | Arie | tgalal: irc ftw! |
| 03:48.13 | itsnotabigtruck | agh, so much laundry to do |
| 03:50.38 | Arie | itsnotabigtruck: get a maid or a gf |
| 03:51.21 | itsnotabigtruck | lol |
| 03:52.09 | tgalal | same here |
| 03:52.11 | Arie | itsnotabigtruck: or get a gf that's a maid for her part-time job, problem solved :) |
| 03:52.54 | tgalal | i'm having an interesting day |
| 03:54.13 | tgalal | I've been working on the app since I got back from work (like 11 hours ago), and now I'm preparing to head to work again |
| 03:54.58 | itsnotabigtruck | damn, you pulled an allnighter for it? |
| 03:55.05 | CreamyG31337 | lol |
| 03:55.12 | CreamyG31337 | sorry to hear that |
| 03:55.14 | Arie | tgalal: you are dedicated |
| 03:55.23 | itsnotabigtruck | i guess that makes sense, you're in UTC+something and it's about 0400Z |
| 03:55.27 | CreamyG31337 | i can't code without sleep |
| 03:55.38 | Arie | CreamyG31337: there you are |
| 03:55.45 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah, never mind my design opinions, that's commitment :p |
| 03:56.04 | CreamyG31337 | i was watching thor. had to switch my usa netflix to canadian netflix for it :| |
| 03:56.10 | tgalal | Arie: I want this app for N9 as much as anyone waiting for it lol |
| 03:56.21 | Arie | CreamyG31337: I can't sleep without code |
| 03:56.38 | CreamyG31337 | sleep(); |
| 03:56.38 | Arie | tgalal: why is whatsapp so important? |
| 03:56.54 | CreamyG31337 | there you go, you owe me :) |
| 03:57.23 | tgalal | it's not "important", I just use it alot |
| 03:57.53 | Arie | tgalal: is it expensive to text in egypt or is gtalk not used? |
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| 04:01.40 | tgalal | Arie: it's not so expensive to text, and gtalk is used, although not very popular there. I don't know what's so special about, maybe because it was originally created for mobile communication so it packs features suitable for mobile phones, that are not found in others |
| 04:03.21 | Arie | tgalal: I'm a us N9 user, my family and friends mostly use iphones or android, my friends outside of the us are on gtalk, to me the idea of whatsapp and it's insecurity doesn't make me eager to use it at all |
| 04:03.52 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal: except almost all of the "killer" whatsapp features you mention can be done with MMS |
| 04:04.14 | itsnotabigtruck | and on the N9 delivery status reports are turned on by default (which i think you mentioned as important) |
| 04:06.37 | tgalal | itsnotabigtruck: so you're saying whatsapp is similar to using a combination of SMS, MMS, and perhaps additional method like gtalk for groups convs |
| 04:07.06 | itsnotabigtruck | tgalal: well, i'm saying it's ~= to the first two |
| 04:07.22 | itsnotabigtruck | which is intentional, whatsapp is deliberately trying to be a low-cost internet replacement for sms and mms |
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| 04:07.27 | itsnotabigtruck | so the feature set directly mirrors sms and mms |
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| 04:08.22 | itsnotabigtruck | i mean, the entire selling point is that it's a drop-in replacement for SMS |
| 04:08.31 | itsnotabigtruck | that doesn't even require using a new addressing scheme |
| 04:08.54 | itsnotabigtruck | otherwise there isn't much novel to it |
| 04:12.15 | CreamyG31337 | maybe it can do mms better than my provider, my messags always get "formatted for my device" which makes them like 64x64 pixels |
| 04:12.40 | CreamyG31337 | i hate shit like that because i don't know who is at fault - my provider - friend's provider- or phone |
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| 04:27.39 | itsnotabigtruck | lol |
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| 05:54.57 | Corsac | hmhm I don;t know much twitter but is there a way to refresh / get new tweets? |
| 05:56.22 | CreamyG31337 | drag the list down in app |
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| 07:16.02 | ieatlint | does the panorama app crash on the n950 for anyone else? |
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| 07:44.03 | tgalal | i don't get it, shouldn't mnotification take care of sound notifications as well according to specified eventType?! |
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| 07:52.01 | MohammadAG | tgalal: Should, but doesn't afaik |
| 07:53.50 | tgalal | MohammadAG: ignores eventType, ignores images, arghh! |
| 07:53.58 | MohammadAG | I'm guessing this is for Wazapp |
| 07:54.12 | tgalal | yeah |
| 07:54.14 | MohammadAG | What images? |
| 07:55.02 | tgalal | image or icon that appears in notifications |
| 07:56.10 | MohammadAG | That works fine |
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| 07:58.11 | MohammadAG | tgalal: https://gitorious.org/qtbook/sociality-mtf/blobs/master/src/notificationssheet.cpp#line101 |
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| 08:00.14 | tgalal | MohammadAG: yes it's very similar to what I'm doing, except that I'm using python, but I'm sure I'm calling dbus method with required params |
| 08:00.55 | MohammadAG | tgalal: It's a valid image right? |
| 08:01.13 | MohammadAG | Also I found it uses extension rather than mime type to load images |
| 08:01.30 | MohammadAG | So be sure that the image has an extension |
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| 08:03.27 | tgalal | MohammadAG: it does, and I'm using the same exact image as the app icon which shows fine |
| 08:04.02 | MohammadAG | With the full path? |
| 08:04.20 | tgalal | yeah absolute path |
| 08:04.50 | MohammadAG | What's the mime of the image? |
| 08:05.05 | MohammadAG | Also, pm / /query |
| 08:06.43 | tgalal | image/png |
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| 08:10.04 | MohammadAG | And the extension is .png I imagine |
| 08:10.11 | MohammadAG | This is weird |
| 08:12.40 | rigo | Elleo, have you had any chance to advance the identi.ca client? |
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| 08:15.28 | Elleo | rigo: depends since when you mean ;), I released a new version about a week ago, and a couple of versiosns since we last spoke about it |
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| 08:15.38 | Elleo | but nothing since I released 0.2.1 |
| 08:15.57 | rigo | hm, can it already post? |
| 08:16.09 | Elleo | rigo: yep, that's been there for about a month |
| 08:16.11 | Elleo | rigo: http://blog.mikeasoft.com/tag/statusnet-meego/ |
| 08:16.21 | Elleo | alternatively you can get it in apps for meego's testing repository |
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| 08:16.52 | rigo | Yeah! |
| 08:16.58 | rigo | will install NOW! |
| 08:17.03 | Elleo | cool :) |
| 08:17.12 | rigo | do you have it in the store? |
| 08:17.29 | rigo | ovi store that is |
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| 08:17.39 | Elleo | rigo: 0.2 passed QA a few weeks ago for the Ovi store, but it still hasn't been published by them |
| 08:18.17 | Elleo | so Apps for MeeGo is probably your best option to get the latest version as it comes out and to stay updated automatically |
| 08:18.21 | rigo | ok, installing from web site (because install from store is good for your statistics) |
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| 08:19.45 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 08:19.57 | rigo | Good Morning, it's time for lunch |
| 08:20.00 | rigo | :) |
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| 08:22.23 | rigo | Elleo, is there a dpkg-URI for Apps for Meego that I can add? (spares me the searching if you have it handy) |
| 08:22.49 | Elleo | rigo: not sure, the best idea is probably to install the apps for meego client though |
| 08:23.03 | Elleo | that way you can see reviews, ratings, and help with community QA though |
| 08:23.13 | rigo | from ovi store? |
| 08:23.15 | Elleo | which you can get from http://apps.formeego.org/n9client |
| 08:23.23 | rigo | ah |
| 08:23.29 | rigo | will do, review is important |
| 08:23.51 | Elleo | QA is especially helpful, it needs 6 positive community QA tests to move from testing into stable |
| 08:24.31 | Elleo | currently it has 2 positive and 1 negative, although I think the negative one is from someone who doesn't quite understand the form (since its all positive apart from the option to allow it into the store) |
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| 08:25.54 | rigo | installing |
| 08:25.58 | Elleo | rigo: once you have apps for meego installed just go to settings and fill in your meego.com account details and click the button to enable review mode |
| 08:26.03 | Elleo | then you'll be able to install stuff from testing |
| 08:26.15 | rigo | ok |
| 08:26.26 | Elleo | alternatively you can also do QA through the website: http://apps.formeego.org/staging/applications/n9/pr1.0/harmattan/Other/statusnet-meego/ |
| 08:26.50 | Elleo | by clicking the community QA button on the left, although you can't rate or review it there |
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| 08:31.28 | rigo | rats, my nick is already taken |
| 08:31.48 | Elleo | rigo: if you have a meego.com account it shares the same details |
| 08:31.58 | Elleo | e.g. for the meego forums or similar |
| 08:33.15 | rigo | no, a Mexican was faster :/ |
| 08:33.23 | Elleo | ah, heh |
| 08:33.46 | rigo | never used his account |
| 08:33.56 | rigo | will invent something else |
| 08:37.15 | Elleo | X-Fade: it'd be nice if users who reject apps in QA were asked to give a reason, I can't really work out why this user has "Should the application be in this catalog" unticked when everything else is positive: http://apps.formeego.org/package/forms/post/632e252e916011e19059e33b89b05c1f5c1f/ |
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| 08:48.15 | rigo | Elleo, account made, now in quue for installing |
| 08:48.22 | Elleo | great |
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| 09:45.13 | rigo | Elleo, works, but for my first post, I need your identi.ca handle |
| 09:45.37 | Elleo | rigo: @mikesheldon |
| 09:45.44 | rigo | ha! |
| 09:46.59 | rigo | yep! |
| 09:47.57 | rigo | First suggestion, increase the size of the editing window :) Hard to review one's text if it's hidden as the edit line only displays 40 charakters |
| 09:48.07 | rigo | will vote now |
| 09:48.17 | Elleo | yeah, I plan to; also want to add a count down for the number of characters left as well |
| 09:48.50 | Elleo | but need to change the design a bit for that, since the standard qt toolbard element I'm using at the bottom doesn't expand to be bigger very well |
| 09:48.55 | Elleo | so I need to replace it with something custom |
| 09:49.45 | rigo | I think so, the twitter client gives you three lines once you tap into it and re-collapses once you tap again outside the edit window |
| 09:50.01 | Elleo | yeah, that sounds like a reasonable way to go |
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| 10:09.16 | djszapi | anybody having qtmultimedia experience from C++ without qml ? |
| 10:13.00 | rigo | you look for a KDE developer, don't you? |
| 10:13.44 | djszapi | I am not. |
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| 11:13.05 | DocScrutinizer | FWIW: with TPS65951 (N9 (+N950?) companion chip) the USB VBUS voltage tolerance (aka ABS MAX RATING) changed from 0..7V to an incredible -2..20V |
| 11:14.01 | DocScrutinizer | means your N9 should be prety much indestructible by plugging in defect chargers to USB |
| 11:16.27 | DocScrutinizer | modulo the ABS MAX of bq2415x charger chip |
| 11:19.20 | DocScrutinizer | bq24153 ABS MAX INPUT: 20V |
| 11:19.42 | dm8tbr | mains voltage + diode still doesn't work though ;) |
| 11:20.18 | deram | oh, does that mean that just connecting 9V battery can be used as emergency power? |
| 11:20.27 | mankeli | try 300 diodes! |
| 11:20.46 | deram | or does it still need the pullups for phone to start charging |
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| 11:24.53 | rigo | Elleo, how to make a donation for the nice identi.ca client? |
| 11:25.09 | Elleo | rigo: no need for a donation, just enjoy it :) |
| 11:35.37 | DocScrutinizer | deram: nope, the ABS MAX doesn't say it can operate like normal. It just means it won't break |
| 11:36.46 | deram | DocScrutinizer: ok. |
| 11:38.03 | DocScrutinizer | in http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/bq24153.pdf there's a note "VOVP 6.5V" which I read as overvoltage protection kicking in at 6.5V and then your charging will get stopped |
| 11:39.08 | deram | ok.. just checked that Vin min is specified as 2.7V, so would couple of 1.5V cells be enough to charge? |
| 11:39.18 | DocScrutinizer | with 4 pcs alkaline primary cells however... |
| 11:40.10 | DocScrutinizer | deram: I doubt that. AIUI bq2415x are step-down converters for charging from USB |
| 11:40.25 | DocScrutinizer | so your input voltage has to be higher than battery voltage |
| 11:40.44 | DocScrutinizer | I.E >4.5V |
| 11:41.25 | DocScrutinizer | you might be able to keep battery at 10% charge with as low as 3.8V |
| 11:41.30 | rigo | :( ls: unrecognized option '--color=auto' |
| 11:41.44 | DocScrutinizer | ~messybox |
| 11:41.44 | infobot | messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils |
| 11:42.25 | DocScrutinizer | IOW: apt-get install core-utils |
| 11:42.55 | DocScrutinizer | hmm's |
| 11:43.14 | DocScrutinizer | maybe that's not THAT simple a thing to do, regarding paegis |
| 11:44.33 | DocScrutinizer | deram: |
| 11:44.40 | DocScrutinizer | ~4 * 1.67 |
| 11:44.40 | infobot | 6.68 |
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| 11:45.03 | DocScrutinizer | nominal voltage of a alkaline: 1.5V |
| 11:45.08 | DocScrutinizer | ~4*1.5 |
| 11:45.08 | infobot | 6 |
| 11:45.30 | DocScrutinizer | real life voltage of a somewhat used cell: 1.4V |
| 11:45.37 | DocScrutinizer | ~4*1.4 |
| 11:45.37 | infobot | 5.6 |
| 11:46.02 | deram | DocScrutinizer: yeah I know, I'll just stick with my plan with 5V requlator + 9V battery, as those are more handy than separate cells |
| 11:46.26 | DocScrutinizer | but also have max 250mAh |
| 11:46.54 | DocScrutinizer | sufficient for ~30min operation of device |
| 11:47.55 | DocScrutinizer | while a AAA has up to 2000mAh I'd guess |
| 11:48.44 | deram | hmm.. is it that bad.. well it is 6 AAAA cels after all.. |
| 11:48.48 | DocScrutinizer | 4 pcs AA NiMH make a nice 2200mAh 4.8V battery, rechargable |
| 11:49.22 | deram | but that one is huge to be carried around in pocket just in case |
| 11:50.01 | DocScrutinizer | for that purpose I usually get original battery errr, sorry wrong chan, wrong device |
| 11:50.12 | deram | lol |
| 11:51.25 | DocScrutinizer | there are relatively convenient formfactor external USB battery packs |
| 11:52.44 | DocScrutinizer | e.g http://www.google.de/products/catalog?q=cabstone+solar+charger&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=13371631769264447576 |
| 11:53.19 | DocScrutinizer | which, despite the name, can get charged also via USB, like your phone. And has a 1000mAh LiIon battery |
| 11:53.28 | DocScrutinizer | delivers proper 5V |
| 11:54.17 | deram | does it deliver enough for N9 to charge... I have one Philis branded powerpack, that does not charge at all |
| 11:54.52 | DocScrutinizer | yes, it works (you just have to take care about shorting D+/D-, as usual) |
| 11:54.54 | deram | it says it has 350mA, which used to be enough for couple of previous phones |
| 11:58.05 | DocScrutinizer | even if you don'T short D+-, device still shall charge @ 100mA |
| 11:58.07 | deram | "Not enough power from the USB in order to charge the device" |
| 12:00.42 | DocScrutinizer | this will result from device pulling higher current from USB than the USB battery pack can provide. Voltage drops (possibly even to a total cutout), and device detects low voltage on USB and pops up this msg |
| 12:01.56 | DocScrutinizer | anyway I charged a N900 from empty to ~75% with one of the cabstone |
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| 12:03.14 | DocScrutinizer | and the nice thing: it never gets sour when even when you don't recharge for months and years, as long as you keep it somewhere where daylight occasionally powers the PV-cell |
| 12:03.49 | DocScrutinizer | complete charging in direct sunlight will take like one day however |
| 12:04.12 | DocScrutinizer | maybe even two |
| 12:04.58 | jonni | I made a short tutorial howto shorcircuit d+d- in here http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=83519&page=2 |
| 12:05.14 | DocScrutinizer | which otoh means, with 6 of them you should be fine for your camping in the south |
| 12:05.31 | DocScrutinizer | (north if you're an aussi :-D) |
| 12:06.16 | DocScrutinizer | jonni: oh, the n-th tutorial? fine :-D |
| 12:07.14 | jonni | heh, yes, its been asked so many times, and I just happeded to get couple of those 1.5euro flex adapters so I couldnt resist |
| 12:08.26 | DocScrutinizer | the micro-mini-howto: take an arbitrary USB cable, carefully cut the outer sleeve and remove braid/shielding on ~5cm, cut the white and green cable, connect white to green on the end of cable that goes to plug which plugs to phone |
| 12:09.06 | jonni | my version was for blind people who dont know how to be carefull :) |
| 12:09.11 | DocScrutinizer | s/green cable/green wire/ |
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| 12:12.55 | DocScrutinizer | W*T*F*?? I read "200 Ohm resistor" AGAIN! |
| 12:14.20 | RST38h | Ohm ohm ohm |
| 12:15.43 | jonni | Omg :) |
| 12:21.26 | Corsac | CreamyG31337: doesn't seem to work (twitter refresh) when searching on a random hashtag |
| 12:21.38 | Corsac | CreamyG31337: though it might be because I don't have an account, but I'd find that a bit weird |
| 12:24.59 | DocScrutinizer | jonni: I leave it up to you to explain all those fools who "wnat to do it the safe way" that MAX 200R doesn't mean using a 200R to short D+/- is any safe |
| 12:26.07 | DocScrutinizer | inability to read specs speak resulting in "common sense" false assumptions |
| 12:27.02 | DocScrutinizer | "value X of MAX n" mean value=n is WORST case and already at border to failure |
| 12:27.45 | DocScrutinizer | SAFE is trying to push n all the way in the opposite direction |
| 12:28.38 | DocScrutinizer | I.E "max 200R" means "short it!" |
| 12:32.10 | DocScrutinizer | when noobs hear "short" they immediately think "fuse blows, blackout, sparks and smoke", so they prefer to go for the "MAX 200 Ohms" solution, as it feels more technically evolved and less scary |
| 12:33.21 | DocScrutinizer | jonni: I suggest you edit http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1189766&postcount=11 and delete the " (or add 200Ohms)" |
| 12:35.43 | deram | well, usually the best is to go somewhere between the max and the other end, so I'd say 100Ohm wuld be the preferred |
| 12:35.57 | DocScrutinizer | NO |
| 12:35.59 | DocScrutinizer | http://makergeek.co.uk/2010/01/31/n900-charging-from-dumb-charger/ |
| 12:36.51 | DocScrutinizer | deram: your idea is again false assumptions based on "common sense" and spec speak illiteracy |
| 12:37.34 | DocScrutinizer | your idea was correct IF there was any minimum resistance mentioned |
| 12:38.23 | DocScrutinizer | like MIN 1R MAX 200R - yes we should use sth near 100.5R for optimum |
| 12:39.03 | deram | but if your specs says it should be exactly 200Ohm, and some other specs says max 200Ohm, which one is wrong |
| 12:39.07 | DocScrutinizer | if however there's only one extreme mentioned, you best go all the way away from that extreme |
| 12:39.38 | DocScrutinizer | deram: HUH? |
| 12:39.50 | deram | "Page 7 shows the connection, “A Dedicated Charging Port is required to short the D+ and D- lines with a resistance of RDCHG_DAT”, page 29 specifies max 200 ohms across D+ and D-. Although the wording on page 7 suggests it should be exactly 200 ohms… Also on Page 29, a minimum of 2 MEGA ohms of resistance between D+ and ground or vbus. That is, not connected together at all." |
| 12:39.52 | DocScrutinizer | "my" spec says "max 200R" |
| 12:40.45 | deram | well, something is wrong in the specs if that part is not meaning the 200 is the correct |
| 12:42.14 | jonni | edited that away, easier |
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| 12:53.51 | pa | how do i logout from scratchbox? it left a lot of stuff fuse-mounted |
| 12:56.05 | DocScrutinizer | deram: nope, the specs are absolutely correct when stating "**short** with a resitance <=200R" |
| 12:56.39 | deram | DocScrutinizer: ok. didn't read other than that part, which seemed little contradictory |
| 12:56.51 | DocScrutinizer | for the EE this clearly reads as "make sure your wires and contacts don't sum up to >200R, when shorting the D+/-" |
| 12:58.55 | DocScrutinizer | IOW it means that the spec for a device, to test for fastcharger, is: "probe resistance between D+ and D-. Consider each value lower than 200R as fastcharger idication" |
| 12:59.26 | DocScrutinizer | indication* |
| 12:59.52 | DocScrutinizer | from that you easily can see why using a 200R to short the wires is a BAD idea |
| 13:00.11 | deram | yep, that is why i'd go for 100R or 1R, or read the usb fastcharger specs completely before deciding to go 0R |
| 13:00.34 | DocScrutinizer | well, you're free to do that :-) |
| 13:00.43 | DocScrutinizer | I did, a gazilion times |
| 13:01.14 | deram | but if that specs says it means shorted, then the 0R is the preferred way to do it |
| 13:01.25 | DocScrutinizer | yes |
| 13:02.04 | DocScrutinizer | see my post 6 up |
| 13:02.13 | DocScrutinizer | for the EE this clearly reads as "make sure your wires and contacts don't sum up to >200R, when shorting the D+/-" |
| 13:03.08 | deram | some might think there is delicate driver circuitry in that bus, so just shorting it might damage that... but if that is how it is designed, then those canät be harmed like that |
| 13:04.35 | DocScrutinizer | "connect with a cable of MIN 10A power rating" doesn't mean "find the thinnest cable that just barely can handle 10A" |
| 13:05.20 | DocScrutinizer | "short with a resistance of MAX 200R" doesn't mean find a resistor as close to 200R as possible to short this |
| 13:05.47 | deram | yes, that is true |
| 13:09.12 | DocScrutinizer | for the cable, how think may it get to make you think "duh, it's too strong, it might break the device that needs a MIN 10A rated cable"? |
| 13:10.06 | DocScrutinizer | likewise for the resisance of the short: how low may you go when it says "200R MAX"? of course as low as you can |
| 13:11.40 | DocScrutinizer | think of a tunnel with a sign "2,2m max headroom" |
| 13:12.04 | DocScrutinizer | ;-D |
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| 13:13.06 | DocScrutinizer | you won't want to go as close to 2,2m height as possible with your car, and you don't worry if your Lamborghini maybe is too flat |
| 13:14.27 | DocScrutinizer | unless there's another sign "not allowed for vehicles less than 110cm high" |
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| 13:15.06 | DocScrutinizer | THEN you start calculating and pick the middle between 110cm and 2,2m |
| 13:34.16 | DocScrutinizer | jonni: I'm not sure I see this correctly on your pictures over at http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=83519&page=2, but is it true your crappy flex adapter is using BLACK and green for D+/- ? |
| 13:35.54 | DocScrutinizer | it quite looks like they swapped black and white, I hope they did on other end of adapter as well ;-) |
| 13:35.59 | jonni | yep, there is no universal standard on those colours :) |
| 13:36.08 | DocScrutinizer | there is |
| 13:36.17 | jonni | not for made in china :) |
| 13:36.21 | DocScrutinizer | even in USB specs |
| 13:36.28 | DocScrutinizer | indeed :-D |
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| 13:36.59 | jonni | as long as its matching on both ends Im happy, I tested that it works |
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| 13:37.47 | DocScrutinizer | a user facing problems with h-e-n usb hostmode finally turned out to have bought USB-F-F adapters that swapped VBUS and GND ;-P |
| 13:38.03 | DocScrutinizer | made in china |
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| 13:38.32 | DocScrutinizer | contacted 1:1 from one receptacle to other, like = rather than X |
| 13:39.56 | DocScrutinizer | amazingly he didn't fry a single device or gadget by using those, it just didn't work (surprise surprise) |
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| 13:56.41 | itsnotabigtruck | Elleo: yeah, when asking people to approve your apps make sure to emphasize that the checkbox at the top should be checked |
| 13:57.57 | itsnotabigtruck | and regarding coreutils, i'd like to see somebody make a harmattanized deb that won't break stuff |
| 13:58.01 | itsnotabigtruck | or something |
| 13:58.10 | itsnotabigtruck | also it needs to be incepted |
| 13:58.11 | Elleo | itsnotabigtruck: yeah, it seems a bit odd that the default for everything is positive apart from the most important one |
| 13:58.47 | itsnotabigtruck | because otherwise things will break if some trusted shell script runs a utility program |
| 14:00.14 | Elleo | unfortunately I don't know who the guy is that didn't tick the checkbox, and so have no way of getting in touch to see if he really had a reason it shouldn't be included or if he just made a mistake :/ |
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| 14:43.11 | khertan | Hello All ! |
| 14:43.41 | khertan | exit |
| 14:43.46 | Siva | khertan: Hello! |
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| 14:49.05 | beford | hi Khertan |
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| 15:10.23 | junglizer | alright, I've got a new issue, post-reflashing |
| 15:10.35 | junglizer | I have duplicate shortcuts in the home/app screen |
| 15:10.50 | junglizer | of the non removable icons, Phone, Web, Messages |
| 15:11.14 | junglizer | any ideas? I checked /usr/share/applications |
| 15:11.20 | junglizer | but no duplicates are listed |
| 15:12.18 | jonni | best idea is to look again :) |
| 15:12.33 | Khertan | or refresh the icon cache |
| 15:12.39 | Khertan | don't know how :) |
| 15:16.45 | itsnotabigtruck | weird :/ |
| 15:17.31 | beford | did you have that app for the shorcut bar? |
| 15:17.44 | beford | I read somewhere it duplicated shortcuts |
| 15:18.04 | itsnotabigtruck | http://www.cracked.com/article_19491_5-criminals-who-pulled-off-major-crimes-with-only-phone_p2.html |
| 15:18.08 | itsnotabigtruck | (see end) |
| 15:18.42 | itsnotabigtruck | wtf, this guy mounts a genius escape, then instead of fleeing town...he hangs out with his girlfriend who helped pull it off |
| 15:32.21 | rigo | what are people using to manage packages except apt-get on the N9 phone? |
| 15:32.47 | itsnotabigtruck | rigo: pkgmgr works for "user packages" |
| 15:32.54 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get install x -> pkgmgr install -p x |
| 15:33.02 | itsnotabigtruck | dpkg -i x.deb -> pkgmgr install-file -f x.deb |
| 15:33.15 | itsnotabigtruck | dpkg -r x -> pkgmgr uninstall -p x |
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| 15:33.39 | itsnotabigtruck | the benefit of using pkgmgr is that for GUI apps it makes the uninstall-from-home-screen feature work correctly |
| 15:33.46 | rigo | hey itsnotabigtruck :) I wasn't looking for a commandline tool, rather for something similar to aptitude |
| 15:33.57 | itsnotabigtruck | also using it avoids some problems with lockfiles (that pkgmgr actually causes :p) |
| 15:34.00 | itsnotabigtruck | oh... |
| 15:34.12 | itsnotabigtruck | meecatalog but it has ads now and it's closed source |
| 15:34.25 | itsnotabigtruck | i'd suggest just using the command line |
| 15:34.57 | rigo | is not religious about open/closed as long as it is non lock-in and standards compliant |
| 15:35.30 | itsnotabigtruck | there's still the ad factor |
| 15:35.53 | itsnotabigtruck | and i've taken a hardline position on ads given how much they've ruined things on other phones |
| 15:36.22 | itsnotabigtruck | this ad is quite unobtrusive (it's a very small banner at the bottom of one of the screens) but i still don't like it |
| 15:38.04 | rigo | and now Apps for Meego gives me login error |
| 15:38.07 | rigo | :( |
| 15:38.58 | itsnotabigtruck | you might have to wait a while before you log in |
| 15:39.01 | itsnotabigtruck | i think there |
| 15:39.10 | itsnotabigtruck | *there's some delays in syncing accounts around |
| 15:42.55 | rigo | just erasing and re-typing my password did help |
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| 16:11.00 | teleshoes | hey, can someone tell me whether dependencies prevent getting an app on the ovi store? |
| 16:12.00 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: yes |
| 16:12.02 | itsnotabigtruck | well, sometimes |
| 16:12.04 | teleshoes | fuck |
| 16:12.04 | beford | really? |
| 16:12.13 | itsnotabigtruck | dependencies that are in the nokia repos are OK |
| 16:12.21 | teleshoes | oh |
| 16:12.21 | beford | I was going to submit an app that depended on imagemagick |
| 16:12.21 | itsnotabigtruck | like python and wireless-tools and libsdl1.2 |
| 16:12.26 | beford | from nokia repo |
| 16:12.28 | teleshoes | oh thats cool, these are |
| 16:12.32 | itsnotabigtruck | dependencies that aren't in the nokia repos aren't ok |
| 16:12.35 | beford | ok |
| 16:12.57 | itsnotabigtruck | also, y u write ovi apps :p |
| 16:13.09 | teleshoes | whaaaaat |
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| 16:13.24 | itsnotabigtruck | writing something that can be submitted to ovi != writing cool new out-of-the-box stuff |
| 16:13.38 | teleshoes | oh, its already written, with 50+ users |
| 16:13.45 | itsnotabigtruck | i get the feeling almost everyone here's only interested in the 1st part |
| 16:13.46 | teleshoes | i just wanted to reach a wider base |
| 16:14.54 | SpeedEvil | I keep getting mail from Nokia about wanting to promote my Lumia apps |
| 16:15.06 | teleshoes | https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ Packages |
| 16:15.09 | teleshoes | thats ok, right? |
| 16:15.19 | teleshoes | thats the main nokia repo |
| 16:15.23 | teleshoes | ? |
| 16:15.32 | teleshoes | apt-cache policy has that entry for all my dependencies |
| 16:15.39 | teleshoes | apt-cache policy xresponse x11-utils python-qmsystem python-qtmobility.multimediakit python-qtmobility.systeminfo python-pyside.qtgui python-pyside.qtcore |
| 16:16.00 | teleshoes | actually, xresponse? thats in the main download repo? am i holding this thing right? |
| 16:16.01 | RST38h | Speed: so do I. funny. |
| 16:16.22 | beford | lumia apps? traitors! |
| 16:16.23 | itsnotabigtruck | teleshoes: that's not a complete repo line |
| 16:16.28 | itsnotabigtruck | there's 3 different built-in repos |
| 16:16.36 | teleshoes | yea, its whats reported from apt-cache policy |
| 16:16.42 | RST38h | considering that this dumb phone isn't even programmable in any real programminglanguage |
| 16:16.45 | itsnotabigtruck | no, i meant the earlier part |
| 16:16.49 | itsnotabigtruck | it looks like you copied that from apt-get update |
| 16:16.53 | itsnotabigtruck | which shows the server not the repo |
| 16:17.00 | teleshoes | no, i copied it from apt-cache policy |
| 16:17.01 | itsnotabigtruck | but yeah, you can depend on stuff in apps and tools |
| 16:17.12 | itsnotabigtruck | oh ok |
| 16:17.26 | teleshoes | python-pyside.qtcore: |
| 16:17.26 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.26 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.26 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.26 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.27 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.27 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.28 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.28 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.28 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.29 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.30 | teleshoes | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:17.31 | teleshoes | does that look right? |
| 16:18.08 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah but you should probably take the SDK repo off your phone to avoid any trouble |
| 16:18.19 | teleshoes | i hate that shit |
| 16:18.27 | teleshoes | nokia doesnt expect me to develop n9 apps on the n9 |
| 16:18.41 | teleshoes | and so the sdk repo is half useless for pr 1.2 |
| 16:19.05 | teleshoes | is there a repo setup yet with binary packages? |
| 16:19.13 | teleshoes | for devel headers |
| 16:19.18 | itsnotabigtruck | well, you really shouldn't, you should use scratchbox...but i mentioned that because you might depend on sdk repo stuff when you shouldn't |
| 16:19.24 | itsnotabigtruck | and i don't think so :( |
| 16:19.40 | teleshoes | how well does scratchbox run on the n9? |
| 16:19.55 | itsnotabigtruck | it doesn't, you don't put it on the N9 |
| 16:19.59 | teleshoes | i, i |
| 16:20.01 | teleshoes | i know |
| 16:20.03 | teleshoes | i meant it |
| 16:20.05 | teleshoes | ironically |
| 16:20.10 | teleshoes | i like to develop on my phone |
| 16:20.11 | itsnotabigtruck | well, why do you insist on it |
| 16:20.14 | itsnotabigtruck | it's a bad idea |
| 16:20.16 | itsnotabigtruck | period |
| 16:20.19 | teleshoes | ....? |
| 16:20.21 | teleshoes | how can you say that? |
| 16:20.22 | itsnotabigtruck | i mean, i like the idea of being able to |
| 16:20.26 | teleshoes | its so convenient |
| 16:20.27 | itsnotabigtruck | but practically it's kind of stupid |
| 16:20.32 | teleshoes | tiny little computer |
| 16:20.37 | teleshoes | i do it all the time |
| 16:20.40 | itsnotabigtruck | with no keyboard |
| 16:20.42 | teleshoes | btkb |
| 16:20.45 | teleshoes | i have a nice one |
| 16:20.54 | itsnotabigtruck | or you could carry around a laptop and program the proper way |
| 16:21.03 | teleshoes | laptops are expensive and heavy |
| 16:21.07 | itsnotabigtruck | preferably a thinkpad |
| 16:21.10 | teleshoes | yea |
| 16:21.13 | teleshoes | w520, here |
| 16:21.22 | teleshoes | the only computer with a nipple mouse |
| 16:22.00 | teleshoes | but i mean, programming on the train while going into the city to see friends |
| 16:22.09 | teleshoes | im not going to lug my 9lbs machine around |
| 16:22.23 | itsnotabigtruck | there's your problem, you bought a 9 lb laptop :p |
| 16:22.27 | teleshoes | but im totally cool with a 4oz pocket-friendly keyboard |
| 16:22.34 | teleshoes | i need a machine like that |
| 16:22.35 | teleshoes | for work |
| 16:22.52 | teleshoes | and i dont wanna buy another to fulfill a level of portability that i already have |
| 16:22.56 | itsnotabigtruck | i really don't get why people buy big heavy laptops |
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| 16:23.18 | itsnotabigtruck | that don't have the portability of a compact laptop nor the performance of a desktop |
| 16:23.18 | teleshoes | i mean, its not too heavy to take to the park and work every day |
| 16:23.30 | teleshoes | they do have MORE performance |
| 16:23.42 | itsnotabigtruck | more performance than a suitably specced desktop? er, no |
| 16:23.45 | teleshoes | no |
| 16:23.53 | itsnotabigtruck | laptop components are *always* behind the state of the art |
| 16:23.53 | teleshoes | more performance than a more portable machine |
| 16:23.56 | teleshoes | yes |
| 16:23.56 | itsnotabigtruck | it's the nature of portability |
| 16:23.57 | teleshoes | i know |
| 16:24.09 | teleshoes | i mean, theres the tradeoff between portability and performance |
| 16:24.21 | teleshoes | i love my sandy bridge 3.2 ghz quadcore processor |
| 16:24.22 | teleshoes | to pieces |
| 16:24.29 | itsnotabigtruck | right, but what i'm saying is that the entire point of a laptop is portability, so if you buy something that ends up being tethered down to your desk all the time anyway |
| 16:24.36 | itsnotabigtruck | you might as well do it right and get a beefy desktop for the same money |
| 16:24.38 | teleshoes | oh, i take it places |
| 16:24.42 | teleshoes | like the park |
| 16:24.44 | teleshoes | and the cafe |
| 16:24.55 | teleshoes | and a friends house to watch movies |
| 16:25.10 | teleshoes | on the too-large-but-at-least-really-high-dpi-screen |
| 16:25.22 | itsnotabigtruck | heh |
| 16:25.26 | teleshoes | its a lovely machine |
| 16:25.33 | teleshoes | its just not ok for walking around with all day |
| 16:25.35 | itsnotabigtruck | anyway, of course all that is beside the point in any case |
| 16:25.42 | teleshoes | mm |
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| 17:58.47 | Khertan | The MeeGo Harmattan client is available only from source at the moment as i ve a refresh bug to fix : https://github.com/khertan/KhtNotes |
| 17:58.52 | Khertan | oups wrong window |
| 18:01.37 | RST38h | "A new report from iLounge said that the sixth-generation iPhone will launch this fall with a taller 4-inch screen, metal back, remade dock connector and new aspect ratio" <== Apple to release N950? =) |
| 18:06.11 | Khertan | :) |
| 18:06.48 | Khertan | someone know how to package html5 apps for android, wp7, and iOS that can be deployed easilly ? |
| 18:07.00 | RST38h | create a web site. |
| 18:07.05 | Khertan | (yeah for harmattan as you can see the client will be native) |
| 18:07.16 | Khertan | RST38h, hum ... |
| 18:07.23 | Khertan | RST38h, already done |
| 18:07.24 | Khertan | :) |
| 18:07.31 | RST38h | stop worrying then |
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| 18:07.48 | RST38h | doubts wp7 can handle full html5though |
| 18:08.56 | Khertan | :) i wan't to package it... |
| 18:08.57 | Khertan | pfff |
| 18:09.18 | Khertan | RST38h, any comment about PhoneGap or MoSync ? |
| 18:13.05 | Khertan | rah for iOs the sdk require a mac |
| 18:13.14 | Khertan | and for wp the sdk require windows 7 |
| 18:13.16 | Khertan | pfff |
| 18:16.07 | RST38h | screw phonegap etc |
| 18:16.39 | RST38h | in fact, screw anything that is js based |
| 18:17.02 | teleshoes | like the internet |
| 18:17.19 | beford | and qml |
| 18:18.33 | RST38h | teleshoes: so, which part of the internet is based on js? |
| 18:18.43 | RST38h | Care to cite relevant RFCs? |
| 18:18.47 | teleshoes | sorry, i meant the intarwabs |
| 18:18.51 | teleshoes | not the Internet |
| 18:19.25 | teleshoes | im all about protocols for enabling communication between peers |
| 18:19.26 | Khertan | RST38h, could you do the native devel for all other plateform than Harmattan for me ? |
| 18:19.51 | teleshoes | in a nice, friendly, distributed atmosphere |
| 18:20.05 | teleshoes | like with chocolate waterfalls |
| 18:20.09 | teleshoes | and fondue for everyone |
| 18:20.31 | teleshoes | i just hate browsers |
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| 18:29.25 | Creteil | well, full flashed the device like it was recommended on TMO : http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82693&highlight=comprehensive+flash |
| 18:29.59 | Creteil | Now, the question is : Can I expect to send mail from this device using a mail account from ovi.com ??? |
| 18:30.14 | Creteil | Actually I can receive my mails but cannot send anything ... |
| 18:30.32 | Creteil | I really thinking this device is a joke ... |
| 18:35.28 | itsnotabigtruck | like i said before, the web didn't succeed because of HTML and JS and CSS and whatnot |
| 18:35.32 | itsnotabigtruck | it succeeded despite them |
| 18:36.01 | itsnotabigtruck | it takes extreme skill to make high quality web apps that consistently work in the face of those disasters |
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| 18:36.32 | itsnotabigtruck | just because people manage to turn out good results with javascript doesn't mean javascript is a good language |
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| 18:39.51 | Anssi138 | it's not all bad because it looks like c |
| 18:39.59 | Anssi138 | but that's maybe the issue actually |
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| 18:43.03 | itsnotabigtruck | Anssi138: it looks sort of like C but doesn't work like C in the slightest |
| 18:44.01 | itsnotabigtruck | also the standard library/DOM APIs/etc. are so awful and fragmented that you *need* a framework library like jquery for web page JS to be remotely usable |
| 18:44.42 | itsnotabigtruck | i think some of those frameworks have made people forget precisely how terrible JS is, but it becomes pretty obvious once you have to do something unusual |
| 18:45.06 | Khertan | itsnotabigtruck, i didn't say that html/js is a must ... i just will port what i ve already done for browser to other plateform by despite |
| 18:45.18 | Khertan | i can't buy all plateform i ll like to target |
| 18:45.48 | Anssi138 | itsnotabigtruck: my personal opinion is that is actually "interesting design" choice to combine c syntax and functional style. Causing endless issues. Coffee script style would be nicer syntax for it imho. |
| 18:46.26 | itsnotabigtruck | well, JS isn't a functional language...it just has some functional stuff bolted on that doesn't work like anyone would expect |
| 18:46.46 | itsnotabigtruck | like the endless surprises related to binding of the this variable in closures |
| 18:47.33 | Anssi138 | well it would have worked better in more functional syntax, it was i was thinking. Something like coffee script does. |
| 18:49.34 | teleshoes | closures are like the only cool feature of ecmascript |
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| 19:13.36 | tripzero | why can't the music player open up some tracks? |
| 19:14.05 | teleshoes | do they not show up |
| 19:14.10 | teleshoes | or do you get errors while opening them |
| 19:14.18 | tripzero | they don't show up |
| 19:14.20 | teleshoes | tracker |
| 19:14.29 | tripzero | hmm... some of these songs are reporting 0bytes |
| 19:14.30 | tripzero | odd |
| 19:14.34 | teleshoes | oh |
| 19:14.35 | teleshoes | or that |
| 19:14.45 | teleshoes | search for music and tracker on the forums |
| 19:14.56 | tripzero | kk |
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| 23:02.28 | *** topic/#harmattan is A place for harmattan device and development discussions | Customers help customers on #N9, hurry and you're the senior member | Please stay on topic and no NDA stuff here | Developers : http://library.developer.nokia.com/ | http://wiki.meego.com/N950_landing_page | logs: http://mg.pov.lt/harmattan-irclog/ | ~aegis-no-thanks | LATEST ~update |
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