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| 04:10.21 | gambitrex | hello, I have some doubts about an account plugin (qml) named waxmppplugin |
| 04:10.27 | gambitrex | anyone can help? |
| 04:10.47 | gambitrex | actually, is this the right place? |
| 04:11.21 | itsnotabigtruck | gambitrex: i'm guessing the wa is whatsapp? |
| 04:11.29 | itsnotabigtruck | and about as good as any, really |
| 04:11.48 | gambitrex | yes |
| 04:12.19 | gambitrex | First: really noob in Qt here. I need to build an app, and I like very much the UI from Wazapp. |
| 04:12.49 | gambitrex | So I am looking the source code, and the author says it's called waxmppplugin |
| 04:13.21 | gambitrex | I tought it was an "official" plugin or something |
| 04:13.38 | gambitrex | but as you're saying, seems like he did all by himself |
| 04:13.41 | gambitrex | is that correct? |
| 04:14.24 | gambitrex | actually my app will show all contacts as well, so that's why I was trying to use the same plugin or something |
| 04:15.29 | gambitrex | I just finished the "background" part (retrieve all contacts based on a search criteria, and a lot of other stuffs), now I need to show all contacts (name and picture) in a list |
| 04:15.31 | itsnotabigtruck | it's certainly not official in any way |
| 04:15.39 | gambitrex | I see |
| 04:15.45 | itsnotabigtruck | i don't know much about it, i wasn't even aware the source was out |
| 04:16.08 | gambitrex | yes, it is: https://github.com/tgalal/wazapp |
| 04:16.19 | itsnotabigtruck | what sort of application is this |
| 04:16.28 | itsnotabigtruck | the proper way to do an im app is to write a telepathy "connection manager" |
| 04:16.34 | itsnotabigtruck | i.e. a backend that connects to an im network |
| 04:16.43 | gambitrex | no, it's not an IM |
| 04:17.03 | gambitrex | basically, here in Brazil (some states) there will be added a new digit in phone numbers |
| 04:17.16 | gambitrex | it was 8-digit, now will be 9-digit |
| 04:17.32 | gambitrex | so people will need to manually change their contacts |
| 04:17.41 | gambitrex | add '9' before the number |
| 04:17.45 | itsnotabigtruck | oh lovely :p |
| 04:17.59 | gambitrex | and I want to help people to do that change |
| 04:18.02 | itsnotabigtruck | so why an accounts plugin? i think you can just make a utility that loops over all your contacts and puts in a 9 |
| 04:18.16 | gambitrex | no, because there are some rules |
| 04:18.19 | gambitrex | not all numbers |
| 04:18.20 | itsnotabigtruck | i think contacts are stored in tracker, which is a much-hated sql database |
| 04:18.27 | gambitrex | only cellphones and only a few states |
| 04:18.36 | gambitrex | no problem, I am able to do that already |
| 04:18.54 | gambitrex | I spent some hours to do that, and that part is done |
| 04:19.20 | gambitrex | consider that only phones from some area (states) will be changed |
| 04:19.47 | gambitrex | eg phones that start with 011-XXXX-XXXX will be 011-9XXXX-XXXX |
| 04:19.56 | gambitrex | that I can do, no problem |
| 04:19.57 | gambitrex | BUT |
| 04:20.23 | gambitrex | you can save the phone number WITHOUT the area code, so phone numbers like KKKK-KKKK could be from area 11 or not |
| 04:20.52 | gambitrex | so, for that number, I need to allow the user to decide if that number is from someone from *given* state or not |
| 04:20.59 | gambitrex | :) |
| 04:21.26 | itsnotabigtruck | where does the account plugin come in... |
| 04:21.37 | gambitrex | for that, I can list all contacts. Once you tap a contact, I show the phone numbers for that contact, and you can select or not that phone number |
| 04:21.40 | itsnotabigtruck | this still sounds like a one-time thing the user runs that's separate from any account stuff |
| 04:21.43 | itsnotabigtruck | keep it simple! |
| 04:22.05 | gambitrex | but the user must select the phone number by contact that will be changed |
| 04:22.09 | itsnotabigtruck | could make it a nice gui app that prompts the user when it's time to make some hard decisions |
| 04:22.41 | gambitrex | not sure if you get it. |
| 04:22.49 | gambitrex | for example, someone named Jack |
| 04:23.06 | gambitrex | Jack is from area 11, and he has 3 phone numbers in my contact |
| 04:23.32 | gambitrex | Jack_Phone1 is 011-XXXX-XXXX <== for that I can automatically change |
| 04:24.19 | gambitrex | Jack_Phone2 is YYYY-YYYY <== I cannot tell if I should add a new digit or not, because 1. I dont know if it's a cellphone and 2. I dont know if it's from area 11 |
| 04:24.43 | gambitrex | so, for all people, I show them in a list (THE PLUGIN) |
| 04:24.59 | itsnotabigtruck | oh ok...maybe the name threw me off |
| 04:25.07 | itsnotabigtruck | i thought you were talking about an accounts plugin |
| 04:25.11 | gambitrex | and then the user selects for ALL contacts the phone number that will be changed |
| 04:25.12 | itsnotabigtruck | the thing that shows up in the accounts app |
| 04:25.20 | itsnotabigtruck | what you want is a gui that lists contacts |
| 04:25.25 | itsnotabigtruck | a la wazapp |
| 04:25.29 | gambitrex | yes |
| 04:25.31 | gambitrex | the plugin! |
| 04:25.36 | itsnotabigtruck | not a plugin |
| 04:25.43 | itsnotabigtruck | well, should be a matter of studying the wazapp code and the nokia docs |
| 04:25.50 | itsnotabigtruck | sounds like you're most of the way there with the tracker stuff |
| 04:26.35 | gambitrex | yes, but I tought that there was a plugin or something, that allows me to show a list of contacts out-of-the-box |
| 04:26.48 | gambitrex | pretty much like a button is out-of-the-box, for example |
| 04:26.55 | gambitrex | in QtCreator |
| 04:27.03 | gambitrex | did I made myself clear? |
| 04:27.23 | itsnotabigtruck | don't think so, but again, look through the wazapp code :p |
| 04:27.30 | itsnotabigtruck | i didn't write it >_> but tgalal did |
| 04:27.32 | itsnotabigtruck | he isn't here much though |
| 04:27.45 | itsnotabigtruck | i think he only shows up to ask questions, isn't into the whole harmattan social scene :p |
| 04:27.56 | gambitrex | :) |
| 04:28.41 | gambitrex | OK, I will look the source code... it's quite complicated to me, because I started to play with Qt today, so it will take some time |
| 04:28.51 | gambitrex | and BTW, I really suck to build UI |
| 04:29.05 | gambitrex | thank you for your time and patience |
| 04:30.04 | gambitrex | also, do I need to ask him permission to use any snippets from his code? |
| 04:30.26 | itsnotabigtruck | what license is it under |
| 04:30.35 | gambitrex | dont know, lemme check |
| 04:30.42 | itsnotabigtruck | if it's some variety of gpl, be advised of the implications of transferring any code |
| 04:31.05 | gambitrex | gpl2 |
| 04:31.10 | itsnotabigtruck | if it's a permissive license like mit or bsd, do whatever you want with the code as long as you copy the license banner including copyright statement into each file that the code touches |
| 04:31.28 | itsnotabigtruck | ok, so your entire program has to be gpl2 or gpl3, if you incorporate wazapp code |
| 04:31.40 | itsnotabigtruck | and the files that contain wazapp code need to include tgalal's copyright line plus your own |
| 04:31.52 | itsnotabigtruck | all files need to have the gpl comment header with copyright lines |
| 04:32.11 | gambitrex | ok then. will do that |
| 04:32.13 | gambitrex | thanks again |
| 04:32.42 | itsnotabigtruck | later! |
| 04:32.59 | itsnotabigtruck | of course if you don't actually incorporate wazapp code you can do whatever |
| 04:33.19 | itsnotabigtruck | well, generally speaking |
| 04:34.19 | gambitrex | yes, I think I will use the *idea*, but it will be different |
| 04:34.27 | gambitrex | I will use the code to learn about the elements |
| 04:34.33 | gambitrex | and events (onClick, and so on) |
| 04:35.02 | gambitrex | but I like the scrollbar, and another stuff |
| 04:35.05 | gambitrex | let's see |
| 04:35.06 | gambitrex | :) |
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| 04:52.13 | beford | hi |
| 04:56.35 | gambitrex | hi |
| 04:57.45 | beford | sup |
| 04:58.15 | gambitrex | nothing new, u? |
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| 05:10.45 | beford | not much |
| 05:10.52 | beford | oh GA fixed his n950? |
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| 05:23.41 | itsnotabigtruck | beford: he did? |
| 05:23.51 | itsnotabigtruck | earlier today he was having major trouble with it |
| 05:24.15 | beford | GAN950 == GeneralAntilles |
| 05:24.23 | beford | so I guess he did it :p |
| 05:24.36 | beford | yea |
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| 05:45.13 | itsnotabigtruck | night! |
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| 05:58.46 | niwakame | anyone using QSettings here? |
| 06:01.23 | niwakame | Sometimes it's not saving for me |
| 06:02.00 | ieatlint | i use it, works for me |
| 06:02.34 | ieatlint | note that it's per user though... running something via qtcreator on the phone will store things into a different db vs running it as a user on the device |
| 06:03.21 | niwakame | really? the config file is created in user .config dir for me while using QtCreator |
| 06:04.03 | ieatlint | that's unusual, as qtcreator logs in as 'developer' |
| 06:04.20 | niwakame | But sometimes the values are simply not stored, I read up yesterday to destroy the QSettings object, because it will write out when being deleted |
| 06:04.54 | ieatlint | just make sure you set the parent for qsettings |
| 06:05.05 | ieatlint | you don't need to destroy it yourself explicitly |
| 06:06.23 | niwakame | Thing is here I want to separate the code a bit and created a own settings class which does other things, but primarily uses QSettings |
| 06:06.28 | niwakame | and I want that to be persistent |
| 06:07.18 | niwakame | you're right btw about /home/developer/.config |
| 06:07.26 | niwakame | ;) |
| 06:07.59 | ieatlint | yeah, just commented in the chance that could somehow be the issue |
| 06:08.18 | ieatlint | ok, so it sounds like qsettings isn't being destroyed correctly |
| 06:08.31 | niwakame | I have getter and setter methods for the properties |
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| 06:08.40 | niwakame | and now I'll try something like... |
| 06:08.53 | niwakame | QSettings settings(a, b); |
| 06:08.57 | ieatlint | does your custom class for settings that includes a qsettings object inherit qobject? |
| 06:09.17 | niwakame | jup |
| 06:09.39 | niwakame | but before it wasn't destroyed anyway |
| 06:09.42 | niwakame | only on app exit |
| 06:09.43 | ieatlint | are you setting the parent when you create the instance of your custom class and when you create the qsettings class? |
| 06:10.15 | ieatlint | also, qsettings should be kept to a pointer |
| 06:10.42 | niwakame | ok it was before...hmmm I think I missed to pass the parent to QSettings directly |
| 06:11.01 | ieatlint | well, without a parent set or you explictly destroying it, the qsettings deconstructor will never be called |
| 06:11.24 | ieatlint | it'll be treated like leaked mem, simply freed |
| 06:11.36 | niwakame | will the QSettings class cache all changed values? |
| 06:12.14 | ieatlint | not sure, don't know the internals of it really |
| 06:12.28 | niwakame | ok then I'll fix up the parent and try again |
| 06:12.52 | ieatlint | yeah, it's a good place to start regardless.. good programming practice |
| 06:13.30 | niwakame | Well Qt is somewhat new for me |
| 06:13.50 | ieatlint | the parent is used for garbage collection |
| 06:14.19 | ieatlint | good practice says any qobject should be a pointer and have a parent set, |
| 06:14.31 | niwakame | I'm just used to having that being set inexplicit upon creation in other langs |
| 06:14.38 | ieatlint | if the parent is set, then you don't have to worry about it being destroyed on exit |
| 06:14.41 | niwakame | maybe a problem, but I'll keep your advice in mind :> |
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| 06:16.20 | ieatlint | i came from c where it felt dirty to pull things from the heap and let something else delete/free them, you get used to it :P |
| 06:17.58 | niwakame | I only do scientific Java and C# programming for a living |
| 06:18.05 | niwakame | So it's the other way around xD |
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| 06:18.49 | niwakame | But it's good that segfaulting isn't as easy as in C |
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| 06:19.35 | ieatlint | hah, yeah |
| 06:20.05 | niwakame | should I use the QApplication as topmost parent? |
| 06:20.18 | ieatlint | well, another reason to keep qobjects in pointers.. put a qobject on the stack with a parent set, and you'll get a segfault :) |
| 06:21.05 | ieatlint | nah, qapplication isn't a qobject |
| 06:21.39 | ieatlint | the top level qobject won't have a parent set |
| 06:22.28 | ieatlint | (the top level qobject you typically also leave on the stack [ie, no pointer]) |
| 06:22.39 | niwakame | ah ok |
| 06:23.07 | niwakame | using new just seems more natural to me :> |
| 06:23.47 | ieatlint | the deconstructor won't get called if you use 'new' |
| 06:24.53 | niwakame | you mean at the topmost level? |
| 06:25.19 | ieatlint | yes |
| 06:25.45 | niwakame | yeah therefore my intuition was to tie it to QApplication ^^ |
| 06:26.07 | niwakame | But this should be okay with using stack now... |
| 06:26.16 | ieatlint | the top level qobject has its deconstructor called when the program exits, and it then calls the deconstructor of all of its children, who call the deconstructor of their children, etc |
| 06:27.27 | niwakame | I only have to supply references now, because I have to use one QSettings object there and not multiple instances |
| 06:28.00 | niwakame | oh gosh, this xchat theme is giving me visual illusions |
| 06:28.53 | beford | http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ouya/ouya-a-new-kind-of-video-game-console |
| 06:29.52 | niwakame | huh |
| 06:30.49 | niwakame | it will definitely bring pixel memories to remember to kids playing on this |
| 06:31.39 | niwakame | It's sad that nowadays youth is all about graphics realism when you grew up on Turrican or Monkey Island :> |
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| 06:53.51 | niwakame | ieatlint: works! thanks! |
| 06:55.08 | ieatlint | nie :) |
| 06:55.10 | ieatlint | nice |
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| 06:55.42 | niwakame | :) |
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| 07:14.56 | vladest | ieatlint: running app under qtcreator means running for different user ie different settings location |
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| 07:16.50 | niwakame | vladest: he told me already :) |
| 07:17.06 | vladest | ok :) |
| 07:17.55 | niwakame | problem was only that I didn't do the parent structure right and therefore it wouldn't write out changes due to not being destroyed but garbage collected |
| 07:22.42 | niwakame | Ok let's prepare for picking up my RaspberryPi :> |
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| 09:09.24 | unreal- | hello internet! |
| 09:11.11 | unreal- | i've got an interesting bug since i updated to 1.3: if I open the store, select any app, and choose "Reviews", the loading icon goes around and around, and nothing ever loads |
| 09:14.30 | jreznik | unreal-: it was broken before pr 1.3, at least for me (if I understand it correctly) |
| 09:15.14 | unreal- | mmmm, well it seems it's the other way around for me |
| 09:15.33 | unreal- | because it used to work (pr 1.2), and now it does not (pr 1.3) |
| 09:15.48 | rigo | unreal, have the same bug |
| 09:16.04 | unreal- | oh good! i'm not alone! |
| 09:16.42 | unreal- | no workaround? |
| 09:20.04 | unreal- | <joke>maybe they'll fix it in 1.4</joke> |
| 09:21.22 | gabriel9|work | i also have that bug :/ |
| 09:21.41 | gabriel9|work | maybe the issue is in store(server side) |
| 09:22.46 | phako | unreal-: it was already broken on 1.2, this is a apparently a server-side bug |
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| 09:33.50 | rigo | since 1.3 my N9 shows the 3G symbol on top, but isn't connected. This is weird.. rebooting |
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| 09:51.22 | mf2hd | rigo: mine did the same today, 3g symbol switched between white and blue and internet connection was broken. Rebooting did not help, but problem went away by itself after ~30min |
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| 09:54.35 | unreal- | i believe i had that bug as well |
| 09:54.59 | unreal- | it's nice to see nokia has added some new bugs ;) |
| 09:56.32 | mf2hd | aye :/ |
| 09:56.40 | mf2hd | something new at least :P |
| 09:57.15 | unreal- | at least we get value for money ;) |
| 09:57.51 | unreal- | (but the be quite honest, PR1.3 is a good release, I have very few bugs left) |
| 09:59.04 | unreal- | if PR1.4 is ever released, i'll defintely wait for user feedback before updating, because 1.3 is working fine |
| 10:00.05 | mf2hd | yeah, but imho that 3g bug is quite bad |
| 10:00.18 | mf2hd | worst this far |
| 10:01.38 | unreal- | euh, for me the killer bug was PR 1.2 ;) |
| 10:01.43 | unreal- | worst bug ever :p |
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| 10:05.35 | mf2hd | i skipped 1.2 :P |
| 10:06.05 | unreal- | :) |
| 10:06.07 | mf2hd | tried once and updater was screwed allready just with additional repos so, ty bye cya thx... ;) |
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| 10:21.21 | pa | unreal-, i dont know what you are talking about |
| 10:21.26 | pa | 1.2 was working fine for me |
| 10:22.09 | pa | 1.3 sucks, phone goes slower and the battery lasts 30% less |
| 10:22.14 | unreal- | well for me it didn't fix one single bug i was having, and was a slow as hell |
| 10:22.28 | unreal- | at least 1.3 fixes some bugs |
| 10:22.38 | pa | for me 1.3 is way slower than 1.2 |
| 10:22.44 | pa | even the ui is not smooth anymore |
| 10:22.54 | unreal- | euh |
| 10:23.04 | unreal- | i do not agree |
| 10:23.12 | pa | maybe i have to reflash, then |
| 10:23.26 | pa | i will try, as soon as i will feel brave enough to reinstall the apps |
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| 10:26.21 | clau | hi, does anybody know if icd2 is opensource? |
| 10:26.48 | mf2hd | 13:22:09 < pa> 1.3 sucks, phone goes slower and the battery lasts 30% less |
| 10:27.24 | mf2hd | i think too that there is some more powerdrain than before |
| 10:27.41 | SpeedEvil | clau: It i not |
| 10:27.44 | SpeedEvil | s |
| 10:27.47 | clau | :( |
| 10:27.55 | clau | I am trying to automate openvpn on n9 |
| 10:28.08 | *** join/#harmattan deztruct0r (~deztruct0@a91-152-69-234.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 10:28.36 | clau | and right now it connects automatically when an interface comes up, icd2 notifies the rest of the system of the new connection before openvpn establishes a connection and the mail app will give an error |
| 10:28.47 | clau | it recovers after a few minutes, but it's still a bit unpleasent |
| 10:28.57 | mf2hd | powerdrain could be related to 3g bug? |
| 10:29.08 | clau | *unpleasant |
| 10:32.20 | *** join/#harmattan ghjgfjghjbn (~jdfgf@c-67-173-179-137.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 10:38.33 | *** join/#harmattan ZogG_laptop (~ZogG@bzq-109-65-230-179.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 10:42.26 | pa | mf2hd, i dont think so |
| 10:42.32 | pa | i have the device in 2g mode |
| 10:42.38 | pa | and even in flight mode, it does it |
| 10:42.50 | pa | but it seems to me that the ui is also slower now |
| 10:42.56 | pa | animations are not smooth anymore |
| 10:43.13 | pa | but i upgraded ota, maybe i should try to reflash before confirming |
| 10:43.26 | pa | the problem is reinstalling all the apps |
| 10:45.54 | *** join/#harmattan rigo (~rigo@ANancy-551-1-105-18.w92-130.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 10:48.00 | rigo | now 3G connected for the first time fine in roaming |
| 10:48.53 | rigo | but with SFR it doesn't connect |
| 10:48.57 | *** join/#harmattan Arkenoi (~ark@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru) |
| 10:49.33 | rigo | even if I disconnect, it doesn't stop the idle |
| 11:13.35 | Necrosporus | Is it true all the harmattan developers are fired from Nokia? |
| 11:14.08 | Necrosporus | Nokia N9 would be good, but it doesn't have hardware keyboard |
| 11:14.29 | Necrosporus | And N950 is not available for buyers |
| 11:14.41 | Necrosporus | Also microsim and no microSD |
| 11:15.22 | denism1 | "harmattan developers are fired from Nokia" - it is absolutely not true. |
| 11:15.36 | denism1 | I have a lot of friend who have worked for N9 and who is still employed by Nokia |
| 11:17.01 | vladest | denism1: ask your friend when we will get pr1.3 for n950 plz |
| 11:17.10 | vladest | friends |
| 11:17.36 | *** join/#harmattan arcean (~Arcean@aacr158.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 11:17.36 | denism1 | vladest: I have not said that they are working for Harmattan _now_ :) They are working for Nokia :) |
| 11:18.29 | vladest | denism1: learning .net and html5? :> |
| 11:18.47 | denism1 | vladest: :) |
| 11:19.00 | Lava_Croft | adaptation is a good thing |
| 11:19.24 | vladest | its not adaptation, its rolling back |
| 11:19.33 | Lava_Croft | its adaptation |
| 11:19.51 | Lava_Croft | views on wethers its forwards of backwards differ |
| 11:19.53 | vladest | in terms of new modern Nokia - yes. |
| 11:20.05 | vladest | in terms of personal growth - no |
| 11:20.08 | Lava_Croft | in terms of mainstream smartphones, its forward |
| 11:20.28 | Lava_Croft | but in terms of common sense mobile computing, wellll |
| 11:20.30 | vladest | hates mainstrems |
| 11:20.33 | Lava_Croft | :< |
| 11:20.36 | vladest | mainstreams |
| 11:21.40 | mf2hd | pa, i installed via flash and i dont have any ui lag issues more than before, but batterydrain is worse than before |
| 11:33.40 | unreal- | BTW, i don't understand why OTA updates should be a problem for nokia |
| 11:33.59 | *** join/#harmattan lildeimos (~lildeimos@95.236.25.218) |
| 11:34.03 | unreal- | they use apt, it's tried and tested technology... what are they doing wrong? |
| 11:34.46 | pa | good question |
| 11:34.53 | denism1 | yes it is tried and tested technology - and there are hundreds of ways to mess up the device |
| 11:34.54 | pa | but it's the same on ubuntu or debian |
| 11:35.13 | pa | when you do distribution upgrade, it can well happen that your distro gets messed up |
| 11:35.35 | pa | even they always suggest to do a clean installation |
| 11:42.38 | jonni | most of the times it works, usually failures are end users fault as they have added custom repoes, inception/system-ui etc. |
| 11:46.13 | jonni | ota works for people who never have enabled developer mode, and in the other hand if you have enabled developer mode, you are expected to solve the problems that you caused yourself :) |
| 11:47.36 | *** join/#harmattan rigo (~rigo@ANancy-551-1-105-18.w92-130.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 11:47.45 | pa | jonni, so performance should be as fast as reflashing? |
| 11:47.56 | pa | coz here it seems slower |
| 11:48.33 | jonni | pa: I havent noticed any performance or battery impacts on PR1.3. Usually after PR update tracker might take some more cpu cycles for few days. |
| 11:49.58 | jonni | ofcourse on ota update, you have all your custom old applications as payload, so ofcourse full reflash will be faster, since it has less background processes. |
| 11:51.16 | jonni | but ofcourse you can rebuild your tracker db from scratch, use fastern n9 or compcache kludges to speedup even more. |
| 11:51.58 | Lava_Croft | meh |
| 11:52.04 | Lava_Croft | I have to mail my broken N9 to Nokia |
| 11:52.13 | Lava_Croft | apparently, they are closing ALL their Care Points in the Netherlands |
| 11:52.16 | Lava_Croft | :< |
| 11:53.19 | rigo | presence costs money. And with the Windows phones there is no presence needed anymore |
| 11:55.48 | *** join/#harmattan trx (~ns-team@93.87.57.249) |
| 11:56.13 | Lava_Croft | i wonder if when i states that it rains outside |
| 11:56.20 | Lava_Croft | people on IRC will start to explain the cycle of water to me |
| 11:56.21 | Lava_Croft | ;) |
| 11:56.39 | Lava_Croft | i dont think your logic is exactly true either |
| 11:56.47 | Lava_Croft | the thing is, presence needs a reason |
| 11:56.55 | Lava_Croft | if you sell 20 phones a year, who needs a Care Point in every city |
| 11:57.08 | Lava_Croft | rephrase: 20 phones that you actually support |
| 11:57.12 | rigo | if you think it to the end, there will remain one office with hardware designers in Helsinki and that's it. Production is in China by sub-corps that produce chips on demand |
| 11:57.25 | Lava_Croft | naturally |
| 11:57.38 | Lava_Croft | Nokia is lagging so much behind that by the time Apple moved all factory work to the US |
| 11:57.46 | Lava_Croft | Nokia just finished moving all the factory work to China and Vietnam orso |
| 11:57.47 | Lava_Croft | ;) |
| 11:58.03 | Lava_Croft | i will miss the care points tho |
| 11:58.15 | Lava_Croft | it was nice to be able to put a face to the giant |
| 11:58.28 | Lava_Croft | even tho that someone rarely knew shit about maemo devices that you brought in |
| 11:58.41 | Lava_Croft | nokia care guys helped me out tremendously with getting my N900 back |
| 11:58.51 | Lava_Croft | and i mean the local Care Point people |
| 11:59.01 | *** join/#harmattan lizardo (~lizardo@201.76.96.77) |
| 11:59.12 | Lava_Croft | the actual nokia care facilities are full of robots that dont like me as a customer |
| 11:59.17 | unreal- | and during that time apple is busy putting apple stores everywhere with people that do know how to fix the products they sell |
| 11:59.27 | Lava_Croft | and just want to send me symbian^3 or lumia devices in exchange for my broken Maemo devices |
| 11:59.30 | unreal- | nokia win |
| 11:59.33 | Lava_Croft | unreal-: :) |
| 12:00.24 | unreal- | i'm not absolutely sure, but it would seem apple's strategy is in fact paying off |
| 12:01.01 | unreal- | Lava_Croft: however nokia's response is logical |
| 12:01.15 | unreal- | if you have nothing to sell that anyone wants to buy |
| 12:01.23 | unreal- | you don't need customer support |
| 12:01.43 | Lava_Croft | unreal-: I didnt think i was mentioning the closing down in any way that made people think i didnt understand why they were closing down |
| 12:01.47 | Lava_Croft | but yeah, you are right |
| 12:01.48 | unreal- | because that would indeed assume you're actually selling something |
| 12:02.13 | unreal- | nokia has fixed the "customer support" problem |
| 12:02.19 | Lava_Croft | i didnt even use a question mark |
| 12:02.26 | Lava_Croft | nokia itself always was horrible with customer support |
| 12:02.47 | Lava_Croft | it were the local care point folks, who werent actual Nokia employees, who were nice |
| 12:03.01 | Lava_Croft | thats why im a bit sad about the care points closing down |
| 12:03.20 | Lava_Croft | now i have to communicate directly with the 'central' Nokia Care here in the Netherlands |
| 12:03.27 | Lava_Croft | and those people cost me about 6 months to get my N900 back |
| 12:04.44 | clau | regarding moving the production in China... I bought a Nokia N9 white not long ago, it was made in Finland |
| 12:04.56 | clau | and, sorry to say, it was a piece of crap |
| 12:05.11 | clau | I had it returned, and bought later a Nokia N9 black, made in China |
| 12:05.21 | clau | and it works as it is supposed to |
| 12:05.58 | clau | the one made in Finland had the following problems: dust got into the back camera |
| 12:06.02 | Lava_Croft | apparently, it seems that the better N9's are produced in China |
| 12:06.05 | Lava_Croft | from what i read here and there |
| 12:06.12 | clau | the vibrator made a sound like it was broken |
| 12:06.14 | Lava_Croft | my camera broke:< |
| 12:06.25 | clau | yeah, it looks like it and it makes me sad |
| 12:06.43 | Lava_Croft | oh, i dont care where its produced at all |
| 12:06.45 | clau | I specifically wanted one made in Finland, to avoid helping them exploit the people on the other side of the world |
| 12:07.04 | Lava_Croft | What are those people on the other side of the world going to do without a factory making Nokia phones |
| 12:07.05 | clau | but you know, only if the quality is the same or better |
| 12:07.07 | Lava_Croft | grow rice? |
| 12:07.15 | Lava_Croft | its exploitation, but its not one-sided |
| 12:07.28 | clau | agreed, but still we're talking about double standards and so on |
| 12:07.42 | Lava_Croft | double standards are prevalent throughout our world |
| 12:08.01 | Lava_Croft | i can't really be bothered by that |
| 12:08.26 | clau | oh well, I would care more if they'd actually produce quality good in Europe |
| 12:08.40 | clau | *goods |
| 12:08.54 | clau | after that I couldn't even find another N9 White |
| 12:08.56 | Lava_Croft | that would cost you quite a bit more |
| 12:09.03 | Lava_Croft | europeans are whiners |
| 12:09.07 | Lava_Croft | and they have unions |
| 12:09.13 | clau | I waited about 2 months to get the first one, and I couldn't find a replacement |
| 12:09.18 | *** join/#harmattan blueslee (~blueslee@ip-109-84-0-88.web.vodafone.de) |
| 12:09.29 | clau | I am a member of the working class too, you know :) |
| 12:09.36 | clau | I won't complain about being socially protected |
| 12:10.03 | clau | though, in Romania I'm protected only theoretically |
| 12:10.05 | Lava_Croft | I live in the Netherlands |
| 12:10.14 | Lava_Croft | i can just go outside naked and masturbate in front of someone |
| 12:10.17 | Lava_Croft | and my life is set |
| 12:10.18 | clau | =)) |
| 12:10.20 | Lava_Croft | never work again |
| 12:10.31 | clau | awesome :) |
| 12:10.32 | Lava_Croft | china is a bit different:) |
| 12:10.47 | clau | hehehe |
| 12:11.32 | clau | regarding n9, and specifically meego, what's the news? any future at all? :( |
| 12:11.56 | clau | considering what I found on the web the future is not too good |
| 12:13.01 | clau | the only encouraging news I found recently is this: http://linux.slashdot.org/story/12/07/07/2036239/ex-nokia-staff-to-build-meego-based-smartphones |
| 12:13.14 | clau | doesn't yet mean much for n9 owners though |
| 12:13.28 | Lava_Croft | there is Jolla indeed |
| 12:13.42 | Lava_Croft | for the N9, i dont really think anyone here knows |
| 12:13.53 | Lava_Croft | i dont even think most people inside nokia know:< |
| 12:13.57 | clau | :( |
| 12:14.13 | jonni | for harmattan its save to say that N9 is the last product that it will see. |
| 12:14.19 | Lava_Croft | oh, totally |
| 12:14.20 | jonni | safe |
| 12:14.24 | Lava_Croft | its the last maemo device ever |
| 12:14.27 | clau | yeah, no doubts about it |
| 12:15.43 | Lava_Croft | http://www.intomobile.com/2012/07/11/interview-jussi-hurmola-ceo-jollamobile-audio-and-text-available/ |
| 12:16.22 | clau | thanks |
| 12:31.17 | pa | for n9, your best bet of development is nitdroid |
| 12:31.39 | pa | and those open projects to run android and tizen apps on harmattan |
| 12:31.57 | pa | s/development/future |
| 12:32.25 | pa | i wonder whether it will ever support camera/gps/other sensors , tho |
| 12:34.25 | clau | what about mer project? |
| 12:38.20 | Lava_Croft | i rather not use N9 than use nitdroid on it |
| 12:39.13 | flux | is it reasonable to write a project that target both harmattan and android? can they share any code?-) |
| 12:39.35 | pa | why? |
| 12:39.51 | pa | whats wrong with nitdroid? |
| 12:40.09 | Lava_Croft | its droid |
| 12:40.37 | pa | at least its not abandoned :) |
| 12:41.02 | Lava_Croft | doesnt make it any better |
| 12:41.55 | jonni | flux: yes is reasonable, if you write qt/qml application to harmattan, then it should also for in android (if the device has installed Necessitas) |
| 12:42.08 | flux | ah, forgot about that |
| 12:42.10 | jonni | should work even |
| 12:42.32 | flux | it seemed pretty complete the last time I saw a video of it |
| 12:45.04 | clau | seems like mer supports n9 too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mer_%28operating_system%29#Supported_hardware |
| 12:45.36 | denism1 | clau: as I understand, mer does not have any UI |
| 12:45.43 | clau | :| |
| 12:45.53 | Lava_Croft | mer is just the OS core, anyone else can put anything else on top of it |
| 12:45.58 | Lava_Croft | well, 'just' |
| 12:46.17 | Arkenoi | I see just no reason to stick with Nokia hardware if you run android anyway |
| 12:47.01 | Elleo | nemo is mer + a ui |
| 12:47.07 | Stskeeps | plus a hw adaptation |
| 12:47.23 | Elleo | It's just the old MeeGo handset ui though iirc |
| 12:47.32 | Stskeeps | not 'just' |
| 12:47.35 | Stskeeps | we actually polished a fair bit |
| 12:47.38 | clau | check this: http://wiki.merproject.com/wiki/Nemo |
| 12:47.40 | Elleo | oh cool |
| 12:48.34 | GeneralAntilles | Back to an analog watch. Boo! |
| 12:52.48 | clau | so, nemo is a possible alternative for the future, if nokia drops support entirely |
| 12:55.06 | unreal- | 14:31 < pa> for n9, your best bet of development is nitdroid <-- it's a long long way from being a useable OS :/ |
| 12:55.23 | unreal- | -OS +ROM |
| 12:55.32 | jonni | for N9 best development env is harmattan |
| 12:56.11 | unreal- | i like android, but seriously, what use is a rom without GPS or phonecalls? |
| 12:56.44 | unreal- | pa: we've seen many many many android ROM that went nowhere |
| 12:57.12 | unreal- | so until nitdroid slows it's going somewhere, the best bet for the n9 is harmattan |
| 12:57.20 | unreal- | shows |
| 12:57.27 | clau | I didn't buy n9 to run android on it :| |
| 12:57.34 | unreal- | me neither |
| 12:58.01 | unreal- | but I would like to see a decent ICS/JB ROM for it... |
| 12:58.23 | clau | I wonder if the hw is enough for ics |
| 12:58.28 | unreal- | yes |
| 12:58.29 | clau | any clue? |
| 12:58.32 | clau | I see |
| 12:58.48 | unreal- | I have ICS running on a really old Motorola Milestone |
| 12:59.02 | unreal- | it's slow because 256MB of RAM |
| 12:59.05 | pa | well nitdroid runs well, except for what it doesnt support |
| 12:59.25 | unreal- | the n9 would run android without any problem |
| 13:00.04 | unreal- | has anyone been looking at this: http://android.doshaska.net/cm9 ? |
| 13:00.20 | pa | but if i were google, i would help the project. after all their plan for android 5 is to being installable almost everywhere, coz they want to enlarge their userbase |
| 13:00.26 | unreal- | the milestone does have some common stuff with the n9 |
| 13:00.41 | unreal- | like the GPU, DSP and stuff |
| 13:00.54 | pa | yea, i think the hardest part will be the camera |
| 13:01.00 | pa | but i dont know, im not a kernel hacker |
| 13:01.24 | unreal- | nadlabak has got the latest TI GPU drivers working on the milestone, and almost the video dsp working |
| 13:01.36 | unreal- | there's months and months of work there |
| 13:01.54 | clau | is there any particular reason why we shouldn't put our hopes in nemomobile? |
| 13:02.42 | unreal- | clau: a didn't but the n9 because it was running linux, i didn't buy it because it was running meego/maemo |
| 13:02.58 | unreal- | i bought it because the swipe interface was so beautiful |
| 13:03.27 | clau | yeah, it is. and it's a shame it will be lost :( |
| 13:03.41 | unreal- | so unless someone manages to produce another beautiful interface, what's the point? |
| 13:04.21 | clau | myeah, I can understand that |
| 13:04.57 | unreal- | who cares what's running underneith, what matters is that the SDK allows dev to right beautiful apps, and that the UI is beautiful |
| 13:05.03 | unreal- | write |
| 13:05.11 | unreal- | (i need more sleep!) |
| 13:05.53 | pa | unreal-, well, a big plus of harmattan is that it's a linux |
| 13:05.54 | clau | I can tell you one thing, n9 was the last nokia phone I will own |
| 13:06.06 | pa | you have tons of tools and utilities that you can compile&&use |
| 13:06.48 | unreal- | never been a big nokia fan... but i was so amazed by the swipe interface, i needed one the instant i saw it |
| 13:07.00 | pa | well indeed |
| 13:07.20 | pa | i am a bit disappointed that jolla will drop it without even trying to get the IP to keep it |
| 13:07.21 | MohammadAG | wooo |
| 13:07.22 | MohammadAG | http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=RtsfPxLn |
| 13:07.48 | pa | does it work out of the box? |
| 13:07.54 | Arkenoi | pa, i doubt Elop will let it go or it is even worth trying |
| 13:07.58 | unreal- | pa: the HW is pretty too, and since nokia is using the same design for windows phone... |
| 13:08.01 | pa | or still need to be incepted? |
| 13:08.03 | MohammadAG | it? |
| 13:08.17 | pa | led notifier |
| 13:08.24 | MohammadAG | only one package needs to be incepted, an enabler |
| 13:08.34 | MohammadAG | the package adds a domain of mine that allows all credentials |
| 13:08.35 | pa | Arkenoi, indeed. he will rather kill it. but hey, he's such a good CEO |
| 13:08.39 | pa | doing so good for nokia |
| 13:09.17 | MohammadAG | http://pastebin.com/fzM3LDBk |
| 13:09.25 | Arkenoi | most people would rather kill Elop |
| 13:09.36 | pa | nic e:) |
| 13:09.41 | unreal- | a microsoft executive working for a european company... what could possibly go wrong? |
| 13:09.45 | MohammadAG | not sure if that's everything |
| 13:09.50 | pa | yeah, i had this feeling myself too :) |
| 13:09.54 | MohammadAG | but this should reduce user confusion |
| 13:10.08 | pa | not sure some crazy one wont attempt, tho |
| 13:10.08 | MohammadAG | user no longer has to figure out how to install something |
| 13:10.18 | MohammadAG | they simply apt-get install <package> |
| 13:11.17 | chem|st | pa: jolla will not support NokiaMeegoUpdates does not mean MerCore-Meego won't be on N9s |
| 13:11.44 | *** join/#harmattan hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net) |
| 13:12.10 | Stskeeps | Mer core and Nemo will continue to come for N950/N9/N900 but there's no internals working on closed bits anymore |
| 13:12.59 | MohammadAG | in other news, this should allow a CSSU on Harmattan |
| 13:13.12 | pa | well the question is: can we use harmattan ui on mer/nemo? |
| 13:13.23 | MohammadAG | but it'll need inception or open mode |
| 13:13.31 | pa | or at least remake it? |
| 13:13.34 | chem|st | MohammadAG: cssu? no different system on n9 for good... |
| 13:14.22 | MohammadAG | chem|st, ? |
| 13:14.40 | MohammadAG | chem|st, I'm not talking about Jolla |
| 13:15.09 | chem|st | I am talking about mer |
| 13:15.26 | MohammadAG | I'm not :P |
| 13:15.29 | chem|st | :) |
| 13:15.45 | MohammadAG | I'm talking about adding a domain that's higher than Nokia's and provides all tokens |
| 13:15.52 | MohammadAG | I've done it for a repo I'll be releasing soon |
| 13:16.01 | *** join/#harmattan rigo (~rigo@ANancy-551-1-105-18.w92-130.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 13:16.12 | chem|st | sounds like harmattan cssu ;) |
| 13:16.50 | MohammadAG | no, but it does sound like it :P |
| 13:17.19 | MohammadAG | the repo I'm making would house led-event-notifier, unrestricted-system-ui, mt-toggles, quick-status-updater etc |
| 13:17.48 | jonni | for better compatibility imho you should just add pgp key to com.nokia.maemo, that way you have same level of trust and ota updates would work |
| 13:17.49 | MohammadAG | Since this worked out just the way I wanted it, I might write a package manager |
| 13:18.09 | MohammadAG | jonni, not sure how to do that |
| 13:18.18 | MohammadAG | and no OTA updates imo |
| 13:18.39 | jonni | I mean package updates. |
| 13:19.55 | MohammadAG | no, I meant I don't expect any future OTA updates from Nokia :p |
| 13:20.31 | jonni | I was meaning like single package updates through ota, like bugfixes to some packages in PR1.3 |
| 13:20.39 | MohammadAG | ah |
| 13:20.59 | jonni | if you add higher trustlevel, then those will fail, so its better to keep level at same |
| 13:21.08 | MohammadAG | # they say this is The Right Way (tm) to check for |
| 13:21.09 | MohammadAG | # scratchbox environment |
| 13:21.09 | MohammadAG | if [ -L /targets/links/scratchbox.config ]; then |
| 13:21.09 | MohammadAG | # hehe |
| 13:21.15 | MohammadAG | What's Nokia's trust level? |
| 13:21.17 | MohammadAG | mine's -100 |
| 13:21.47 | jonni | I've added my personal pgp key to on my device as com.nokia.maemo, its quite simple to do. that way origins dont conflict. |
| 13:22.13 | jonni | but inception way was -100, which caused problems for 1.2 to 1.3 upgrade |
| 13:22.45 | MohammadAG | adding a .fiasco file to /var/lib/fiasco-flasher/staging/ flashes it at reboot |
| 13:22.49 | MohammadAG | just a note :p |
| 13:22.57 | MohammadAG | jonni, how do you do it then? |
| 13:27.32 | jonni | you just add key to aegis manifest and install as com.nokia.maemo. you can look for hints in source-policy packages. And hard way is to modify restok and domain files by hand and resign. |
| 13:29.44 | jonni | but ofcourse if there never is going to be pr releases or bugfixes to packages, then it doesnt matter. But if you want to be futureproof for possible bugfixes or if by some miracle there is PR1.4, then you might want to consider. |
| 13:30.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | "there'll never be any need for more than 1MB of RAM on any PC" |
| 13:31.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | "32 bit for IP address is more than we ever will need" |
| 13:32.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | "why use 4 bytes for char* date-year when we can get away with using just 2?" |
| 13:33.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi MohammadAG |
| 13:33.26 | MohammadAG | hi |
| 13:34.01 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer05, there were people working on those, the MeeGo team is no more |
| 13:34.06 | MohammadAG | well, Harmattan team |
| 13:34.43 | MohammadAG | remote: error: failed to lock refs/heads/master hmm |
| 13:34.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | the original ITF also is no more ;-D |
| 13:35.25 | *** join/#harmattan e-yes (~e-yes@94.25.130.1) |
| 13:36.30 | MohammadAG | heh |
| 13:36.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | and we got fremantle-PR1.3.1 |
| 13:36.55 | MohammadAG | there was a team for that :p |
| 13:37.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | when _nobody_ thought we'd see anything like that |
| 13:37.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually iirc there was no more team for that |
| 13:38.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | at last not any more a team than is for HARM now |
| 13:38.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | but well, that's all just speculations |
| 13:38.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | fact is you don't want to botch if you know how to do it better |
| 13:39.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | thne otoh... HARM(!)... :-/ |
| 13:41.19 | MohammadAG | https://github.com/harmattan/unrestricted-system-ui/blob/master/src/systemui/shutdownui.cpp#L105 example on disabling swipe by nokia |
| 13:41.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | I might as well bother about future of OS/2 |
| 13:43.22 | MohammadAG | actually that file has a lot of examples related to X11 handling on MeeGo |
| 13:43.24 | MohammadAG | I'm amazed, really |
| 13:43.53 | MohammadAG | epic Fixes: NB#230034 - Low power mode ui is static and burn display |
| 13:44.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | welllllll |
| 13:45.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's quite epic indeed |
| 13:45.24 | MohammadAG | it's a year ago, wonder how many internal devices they lost that way :p |
| 13:45.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | good example why software department needs an ambassador to "negotiate" to EE/hw |
| 13:46.31 | flux | yeah, I wonder when I'll break my n9 with bedside clock ;) |
| 13:46.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | "every noob" knows about OLED burnin |
| 13:47.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | hell, that's why screensavers got invented |
| 13:47.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | back in the times when we used an ancient technology called CRT |
| 13:48.34 | MohammadAG | yeah, even I know about it |
| 13:48.43 | MohammadAG | <3 Galaxy SII |
| 13:48.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | duh! was about to paste a wikipedia link |
| 13:49.17 | MohammadAG | I had something on and kept the display on, it got burned for a day |
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| 13:50.05 | *** join/#harmattan DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 13:50.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | duh! was about to paste a wikipedia link |
| 13:50.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | for the youngsters |
| 13:51.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | curses his D-Link DR-615 and heads out to get a fritzbox NOW |
| 13:51.24 | Lava_Croft | you'd be amazed how many crts are still in use |
| 13:51.37 | MohammadAG | I still see them, daily |
| 13:52.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | MohammadAG: where from you harvest those supposedly internal NokiaBugs? |
| 13:54.02 | phako | DocScrutinizer: commit message or debian changelog |
| 13:54.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | ahh |
| 13:54.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | I thought low power mode UI was closed source |
| 13:58.02 | MohammadAG | https://github.com/harmattan/unrestricted-system-ui/ |
| 13:58.05 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, ^ |
| 13:58.06 | jonni | thats not really epic one, since it was fixed in PR0 images well before any device was in the shop :) |
| 13:58.11 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer05, ^ |
| 13:58.25 | MohammadAG | jonni, yeah, but it's epic cause they didn't consider it in the first place |
| 13:59.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | indeed |
| 13:59.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | should have been part of module design spec |
| 14:00.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | or whatever Nokia calls this paper |
| 14:02.50 | jonni | MohammadAG: they did considered it in the first place and was in design spec, that specific bug was just regression that they fixed. Bugs sometimes happends even if design spec says that ui should move. So nothing epic in there. |
| 14:03.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok :-D |
| 14:03.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | fair enough |
| 14:05.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually it easily slips checks, as nobody usually is watching standby screen for long enough no notice the regression |
| 14:06.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonni: sorry for my sarcasm then |
| 14:07.15 | jonni | sometimes sarcasm is good, there has been epic fails sometimes, but not just on that specific time :) |
| 14:22.20 | jonni | I'm just making one of my N9's to be dualboot, step one replace the openmode warning screen with custom one. I ended up in this http://linuxi.org/disclaimer.png looks pretty decent on the boot (I just tested that my custom rle generator works). Next step is to decide if I put nemo or mer on the second partition :) |
| 14:23.40 | jonni | good for anti-theft too, since not that many know how to clear rle from CAL :) |
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| 14:39.56 | MohammadAG | jonni, /usr/share/osso/rle? :P |
| 14:47.27 | jonni | yep default rles are in /usr/share/osso/boot/rle |
| 14:52.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmm nuttin |
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| 14:55.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:55.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | and that's all in /usr/share/osso |
| 14:56.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, I guess they "get eaten" on next boot? |
| 14:59.58 | jonni | not really only if language changes, and if you trigger openmode to lock cal, then your custom rle stays forever :) |
| 15:02.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm still puzzled by this CAL lock, how it works |
| 15:04.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | just CBA to read those 3000++ pages of SPRUF98D omap TRM again, to check if there's such a thing like HS-lock on oneNAND pages |
| 15:04.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | I seem to recall there are locks on NAND, but those usually are unlocked as easily as locked |
| 15:05.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | of course HS architecture *might* intercept there |
| 15:06.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | "trustzone2 or whatever the name of the abomination |
| 15:07.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | but tbh I'd be surprised to find it can't get unlocked |
| 15:07.17 | jonni | after reading bootloader code Im not that puzzled anymore, yes bootloader/PA can unlock it, but as kernel nor userspace have access to call unlock then its out of the reach :) |
| 15:08.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, aiui we can execute arbitrary bootloader? |
| 15:08.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | just that it's not in HS mode anymore |
| 15:09.06 | jonni | once bootloader decides thats its locked, then its locked and we cant do anything about it. and no arbitary bootloaders, since that is protected by nokia root ca |
| 15:09.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-S |
| 15:09.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | back to hw-unlocking this brick |
| 15:10.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | change bootmode by cutting/grounding a few pins |
| 15:10.37 | jonni | but anyways CAL is not that usefull anyways, you can just rewrite the codebits that use cal in openmode. |
| 15:10.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | or simply find a less hostile device |
| 15:12.40 | jonni | (you can even make custom mtd block device to emulate CAL, that way your openmode works perfectly :D) |
| 15:20.39 | MohammadAG | jonni |
| 15:20.50 | MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles's device could be revived if cal can be written to |
| 15:21.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | "oops your self destruction unit fired by accident. We're sorry. Sincerly Nokia" |
| 15:23.11 | jonni | MohammadAG: if openmode has been triggered, then he is out of luck, his options is to wait PR1.3 for N950, or return device to developer relations for replacement (or get R&D cert). |
| 15:23.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I fail to get the point why I should pay money or spend time on a device/OS that tries to kill me or itself on me touching it |
| 15:24.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | and yeah "it's all just for your security" |
| 15:24.43 | jonni | well that one was self caused by replacing repositories cross device boundary. |
| 15:24.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | doesn't matter at all |
| 15:25.00 | MohammadAG | jonni, or make a fiasco with a higher version, but then he can never go back to stock roms |
| 15:25.03 | MohammadAG | actually he can |
| 15:25.17 | MohammadAG | first and hopefully last time I call it rom |
| 15:27.57 | jabis | pile of crap that no downgrade can be made imo |
| 15:28.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry when I think all my valuable data and assets on a N9 are way more on peril by threat from aegis than by any thief or silly loss of device |
| 15:28.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | or any malware |
| 15:28.42 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer05, any ideas where the file that shows what bricks when it's edited is? |
| 15:28.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~may-i-edit |
| 15:28.59 | infobot | mayIedit () { grep "`basename $1`" /var/lib/aegis/refhashlist && echo "probably not" && return; echo "edit if you feel venturous"; } |
| 15:29.30 | MohammadAG | probably not |
| 15:29.32 | MohammadAG | meh |
| 15:30.07 | MohammadAG | wonder if this system-services package can be replaced |
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| 15:30.40 | MohammadAG | ohai /usr/sbin/show_malf |
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| 15:38.18 | MohammadAG | can someone review a patch? to be sure |
| 15:39.26 | MohammadAG | actually it's quite simple, nevermind |
| 15:39.27 | MohammadAG | https://github.com/harmattan/unrestricted-system-ui/commit/53cb8341e3ff96caa67dbd7c3e2eb4fef7f1fed8 |
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| 16:50.27 | rigo | Success! |
| 16:50.52 | rigo | dev-mode works again |
| 16:51.07 | rigo | now playing back my the backup of my user-dir |
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| 17:02.46 | MohammadAG | anyone got an N9 and feels like testing something? |
| 17:02.53 | MohammadAG | inception required |
| 17:03.21 | valdur55 | yea. sure |
| 17:03.42 | valdur55 | give a shoot |
| 17:05.53 | MohammadAG | valdur55, pm |
| 17:09.35 | valdur55 | ok |
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| 17:21.41 | MohammadAG | meh |
| 17:22.35 | rigo | MohammadAG, just repaired mine. No great eagerness to experiment at the moment :-/ |
| 17:23.15 | MohammadAG | guess one N950 test should do |
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| 17:39.43 | djszapi|windows | Hi! Anybody using miniusb cable between the PC and the Harmattan device with Windows? |
| 17:39.59 | djszapi|windows | I wonder what the simplest way is to get the pictures out of the phone I have taken on my Windows box. |
| 17:40.20 | djszapi|windows | I do not have internet connection on the phone for uploading to the website. |
| 17:40.56 | dm8tbr | a) it's MICRO USB not mini |
| 17:41.13 | MohammadAG | dm8tbr, you could've just answered no :P |
| 17:41.28 | dm8tbr | b) it speaks mass storage mode, what's the problem? |
| 17:41.41 | MohammadAG | or bluetooth, or ad-hoc |
| 17:42.01 | ieatlint | mass storage mode is the least painless by far |
| 17:42.09 | e0x | indeed |
| 17:42.16 | ieatlint | you'll be there pressing retry for the next hour if you try to do bluetooth |
| 17:43.47 | djszapi|windows | hmm, yeah, the mass storage mode way is pretty simple, thanks |
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| 17:59.55 | djszapi|windows | ieatlint: sup |
| 18:01.15 | ieatlint | not much.. |
| 18:01.20 | ieatlint | you? |
| 18:03.49 | djszapi|windows | not much, http://dot.kde.org/2012/07/09/kde-rely-qt-protect-qts-freedom-contribute-it |
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| 18:05.24 | ieatlint | heh, the whole game now is less about what nokia will do, and instead about who gets what/who |
| 18:06.14 | *** join/#harmattan ga (badc410a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.186.220.65.10) |
| 18:09.57 | ga | Hi, I have a noob question regarding QML Page component. Anyone? |
| 18:10.11 | djszapi|windows | http://liveblue.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/koncat03.png |
| 18:10.22 | djszapi|windows | ga: go ahead |
| 18:11.56 | ga | OK, I started to play with Qt stuff yesterday, and I want to make a really simple app, with a few pages. For that, I have created some .qml files for those pages. For example, I have a file AboutPage.qml which contains a Page component and its id property is pgAbout |
| 18:12.11 | ga | How can I push that page to a page stack in another file? |
| 18:12.20 | ga | something like this: pageStack.push(AboutPage.pgAbout)? |
| 18:12.28 | djszapi|windows | have you checked the basic examples? |
| 18:12.44 | ga | the ones that come with QtCreator? |
| 18:13.23 | ga | I checked some, and as far as I have seen, they put all Pages inside the same file |
| 18:13.40 | ieatlint | you want to create an instance of each page in the main.qml... |
| 18:13.42 | djszapi|windows | ga: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/qt-components/qt-components-meego-pagestack.html?tab=1 |
| 18:13.49 | ieatlint | eg AboutPage { id: pgAbout } |
| 18:13.56 | ieatlint | then pageStack.push( pgAbout ) |
| 18:14.03 | djszapi|windows | ieatlint: what is not always needed. |
| 18:14.06 | djszapi|windows | that* |
| 18:14.20 | ieatlint | for a small program and someone just starting, it's simple and best |
| 18:14.30 | ga | ieatlint: but for that, I need to declare all pages inside one file (main.qml). Right? |
| 18:14.39 | ieatlint | yes |
| 18:14.44 | djszapi|windows | ga: just read the example above. |
| 18:15.03 | djszapi|windows | ieatlint: well, when I was beginner, I did not instantiate those in the main.qml :p |
| 18:15.11 | djszapi|windows | when the application became heftier, I had to. |
| 18:15.20 | ga | ieatlint: not sure if it's the best option. I know I'm just starting, but the app will (luckly) grow, and the code would be "illegible" |
| 18:15.30 | ga | djszapi|windows: thank, will check |
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| 18:15.33 | ieatlint | qml is illegible :P |
| 18:15.47 | ga | ieatlint: good point. :) |
| 18:16.02 | ieatlint | but the risk there is less that you'll make it hard to read, and more that you'll declare everything at launch, increasing the memory footprint and load time |
| 18:16.30 | djszapi|windows | the qml launch is already horribly slow :p |
| 18:16.44 | ga | is there any other option to qml? |
| 18:16.56 | djszapi|windows | ga: assembly ^^ |
| 18:17.06 | ieatlint | heh, there's mtf |
| 18:17.23 | ieatlint | a qwidget-based set of widgets in the meego style |
| 18:17.32 | ga | djszapi|windows: djszapi|windows PageStack is only for harmattan? If I want to port my app to maemo5 or symbian, I would need to rewrite it all? :-( |
| 18:17.43 | ieatlint | symbian has pagestack |
| 18:18.01 | *** join/#harmattan mlong (~mlong@fw1.weatherdata.com) |
| 18:18.01 | ieatlint | there are a few minor differences between symbian components and the harmattan components |
| 18:18.02 | djszapi|windows | ga: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/platform-api-reference/showdoc.php?pkn=libmeegotouch&wb=daily-docs&url=Li94bWwvZGFpbHktZG9jcy9saWJtZWVnb3RvdWNo |
| 18:18.18 | GeneralAntilles | itsnotabigtruck, no. That's just my ZNC. |
| 18:18.21 | djszapi|windows | ga not only, but many platforms do not have that |
| 18:18.29 | djszapi|windows | ga like Plasma Active |
| 18:18.40 | djszapi|windows | oh sorry, PageStack |
| 18:18.44 | djszapi|windows | well, that is pretty standard |
| 18:18.48 | djszapi|windows | PageStackWindow is not. |
| 18:19.27 | djszapi|windows | (btw, I am not here for helping, just asking :) |
| 18:19.46 | djszapi|windows | good luck with your issues! |
| 18:19.47 | ga | thanks |
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| 18:20.08 | GeneralAntilles | jonni, interestingly, I don't actually think it was the PR1.3 updates that caused the problem. |
| 18:20.33 | ga | one last question: Beside assembly, is there any option to QML? I also think that it's quite slow to load it (runtime) |
| 18:20.35 | GeneralAntilles | jonni, robbiethe1st had the same symptoms with a Fennec update earlier in the year |
| 18:20.39 | GeneralAntilles | and it was the Fennec update that failed. |
| 18:21.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | and fennec killed the HARM? |
| 18:22.05 | GeneralAntilles | That's my working assumption |
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| 18:22.09 | GeneralAntilles | Based on very little data. |
| 18:23.53 | ieatlint | ga: that's what the mtf/libmeegotouch stuff was.. an alternative, but not what nokia recommends |
| 18:24.13 | jonni | I have fenner 12 vs 13 version conflict and ota update from pr1.2 to pr1.3 went just fine, so its not fennec, unless you installed it from nightly build web |
| 18:24.23 | jonni | fennec even |
| 18:26.22 | ga | ieatlint: thanks. seems like I'll need to spend some time learning about all this QML mess. :P |
| 18:26.52 | GeneralAntilles | jonni, :shrug: only occurrence of these symptoms I'd previously seen reported was due to a Fennec update. |
| 18:27.44 | jonni | are there pastebins of the flashing attempts somewhere? |
| 18:29.44 | GeneralAntilles | I think it's expired |
| 18:29.53 | GeneralAntilles | Don't have the link handy, but this is the same: http://pastebin.com/pEwGQhUz |
| 18:29.54 | jonni | ofcourse easy for me to say, since I can always recover firmware from any situation, but that doesnt help you unless your visiting in Tampere ;) |
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| 18:32.22 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: and what happens if you extract the bins from ocf, and just flash with -F .bin --flash-only kernel,rootfs |
| 18:33.21 | GeneralAntilles | One sec, let me grab the laptop to see how that failed. |
| 18:35.21 | GeneralAntilles | http://pastebin.com/RezvLUxA |
| 18:38.21 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: and if you do "sudo flasher -a N9-21-3.bin -F N950pr12.bin --flash-only kernel,rootfs" or extract kernel,rootfs from N950 image, and then "sudo flasher -F N9-21.3.bin -r rootfs -k kernel --flash-only kernel,rootfs" |
| 18:40.04 | GeneralAntilles | I'll have to try it tonight. |
| 18:40.08 | GeneralAntilles | 10 minutes left for lunch |
| 18:40.09 | jonni | or the other way around "sudo flasher -a N950pr12.bin -F N921-3.bin -r rootfs -k kernel --flashonly kernel,rootfs" |
| 18:40.15 | GeneralAntilles | need to download the N9 image. |
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| 18:44.11 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: and I just re-read your log, it fails because your trying to flash beta2 image on top of beta3, so first thing to do is to download beta3 image and retry :) |
| 18:44.34 | GeneralAntilles | That first link isn't mine. |
| 18:44.34 | jonni | that causes the downgrade error :) |
| 18:44.37 | GeneralAntilles | It's old |
| 18:44.41 | GeneralAntilles | My N950 is PR1.3 |
| 18:44.51 | GeneralAntilles | There is no PR1.3 available for N950. |
| 18:44.59 | jonni | I was reading the second pastebin |
| 18:45.18 | rigo | AppsForMeego is missing in Repository http://repo.apps.formeego.org/harmattan/apps/armel/ |
| 18:45.28 | jonni | it says that your trying to flash N950 PR1.1 image over N950 PR1.2 |
| 18:45.41 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: or wasnt that second pastebin yours either? |
| 18:45.46 | GeneralAntilles | It was |
| 18:45.48 | GeneralAntilles | Hrm |
| 18:45.53 | GeneralAntilles | Um, 39-5 is PR1.1? |
| 18:46.04 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: yep, 2-6 is pr1.2 |
| 18:46.11 | jonni | 39-5 IS PR1.1 |
| 18:46.25 | GeneralAntilles | Where's the FIASCO image for 2-6? |
| 18:46.36 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/release/N950/firmware/ |
| 18:46.38 | arcean | "Version of 'sw-release': DFL61_HARMATTAN_3.2012.02-6_PR_RM680" |
| 18:46.42 | arcean | heh |
| 18:46.45 | alterego | Well, PR1.2 would delete mail, but crash and close when I did it, PR1.3 will delete one email, but after that it just sticks with the refresh loop running infinitely. |
| 18:46.58 | GeneralAntilles | If this works, I'm going to have to kill myself. |
| 18:47.06 | GeneralAntilles | Or be this channel's slave for the duration of the Summer. |
| 18:47.06 | arcean | GeneralAntilles: PR1.2 beta oneclickflasher should help you :) |
| 18:47.10 | jonni | GeneralAntilles: hopefully this is only PR1.1 vs PR1.2 error :) |
| 18:47.40 | GeneralAntilles | Well, download's not going to finish before I have to be back at work. |
| 18:47.53 | GeneralAntilles | The suspense will kill me if the ritualize suicide doesn't. |
| 18:50.05 | GeneralAntilles | As this is very clearly going to fix my "problem" (well, the immediate one with the N950) |
| 18:50.35 | GeneralAntilles | First, I'd like to thank jonni, MohammadAG, DocScrutinizer, arcean, itsnotabigtruck, and anybody else who wasted time and energy pondering on this "issue" |
| 18:50.47 | GeneralAntilles | and, second, I'd like to say: I'm an idiot. |
| 18:50.53 | GeneralAntilles | back to work. |
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| 18:58.25 | rigo | rrr. AppsForMeego refuses to install "installation interrupted" |
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| 19:12.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: >>> I said we’re definitely going for the larger public, but we also want to enable the developers and the community and enthusiasts by giving them a “developer mode” option. We want to cater to both audiences. I think this became their two device<<< |
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| 19:12.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~aegis |
| 19:12.54 | infobot | http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or http://en.qi-hardware.com/w/images/1/10/ME_382_LockedUpTechnology2.gif |
| 19:13.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | sounds painfully like aegis-perpetuated |
| 19:14.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | so much for "two words can spoil your day, hell your week even" |
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| 19:21.57 | Lava_Croft | there goes my N9, by mail, to Nokia RepairCare |
| 19:22.06 | Lava_Croft | goodbye dear N9, I hope they don't send me a Lumia back. |
| 19:23.21 | rzr | where did you get that N9 |
| 19:23.28 | Lava_Croft | EU |
| 19:23.34 | Lava_Croft | from a Dutch company |
| 19:23.40 | Lava_Croft | even tho its not officially for sale here |
| 19:23.50 | Lava_Croft | I'm completely safe by EU law |
| 19:23.54 | Lava_Croft | but that really doesnt bother Nokia |
| 19:23.58 | rzr | where was it made ? fi or cn ? |
| 19:24.20 | Lava_Croft | fin |
| 19:24.24 | rzr | my E7 is about to go to NRC too :( |
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| 19:24.33 | Lava_Croft | i preferred a local nokia care point |
| 19:24.40 | Lava_Croft | people there werent nokia employees and actually cared |
| 19:24.48 | Lava_Croft | all my experience with the 'central' nokia care have been nothing but fucking awful |
| 19:25.10 | Lava_Croft | a bunch of people trying to explain to me that Symbian Belle is a really a reason to just accept the N8 they sent me to replace my N900 |
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| 19:28.40 | AnlaShok | ~aegis |
| 19:28.40 | infobot | http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or http://en.qi-hardware.com/w/images/1/10/ME_382_LockedUpTechnology2.gif |
| 19:30.59 | Lava_Croft | lol |
| 19:31.10 | Lava_Croft | nokia online repair is just the local monopolist phone insurance company in NL |
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| 19:48.34 | rigo | GSM stack crashed on N9 PR 1.3 |
| 19:48.43 | rigo | never happened in PR 1.2 |
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| 19:58.41 | HtheB | MohammadAG: you there? |
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| 20:01.56 | HtheB | MohammadAG: you there? |
| 20:01.57 | MohammadAG | HtheB: Sorta |
| 20:01.59 | HtheB | (was just looking for you |
| 20:02.00 | HtheB | ah |
| 20:02.09 | HtheB | welcome :) how are you |
| 20:02.46 | HtheB | Can you compile the system-ui and change a warning? :( |
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| 20:17.31 | MohammadAG | What? |
| 20:17.33 | MohammadAG | HtheB: What do you mean? |
| 20:17.45 | HtheB | check pm |
| 20:17.53 | HtheB | or: it's about this: |
| 20:17.54 | HtheB | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85424 |
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| 20:48.13 | rigo | rats, signature check for org.formeego.apps failed |
| 20:48.17 | rigo | where is that key? |
| 20:49.28 | Ariadeno | has anyone been able to run man-db on harmattan with success?? |
| 20:52.43 | gabriel9 | is there a lightphp package for N9 |
| 20:53.06 | gabriel9 | or repo with php and lightphp? |
| 20:53.19 | gabriel9 | i wish to turn my N9 into web server :) |
| 20:53.48 | rigo | I have seen web servers but no PHP |
| 20:54.36 | gabriel9 | can i use this? http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/p/php5/ |
| 20:54.49 | gabriel9 | i found http://elblogdelqt.blogspot.com/2011/12/web-server-on-n950.html |
| 20:54.59 | gabriel9 | maybe it will work :) |
| 20:55.51 | gabriel9 | this php is too old :( |
| 20:56.31 | rigo | do restful instead :-P |
| 20:58.03 | Ariadeno | it's really killing me to not been able to run man-db anyone help?? |
| 20:58.50 | Ariadeno | all the utils that are in conflict with busybox |
| 20:59.09 | Ariadeno | I downloaded them in another folder and unpacked them |
| 20:59.29 | HtheB | lol |
| 20:59.36 | Ariadeno | i got it to work adding it to PATH and making a simlink to man.lib |
| 20:59.54 | Ariadeno | however still not access to the manpages itself |
| 21:00.16 | Ariadeno | man works tough |
| 21:00.26 | Ariadeno | i guess the problem lies in manpath |
| 21:04.56 | HtheB | MohammadAG: did you check the link? |
| 21:06.06 | gabriel9 | what do you mean restfull? :) |
| 21:06.19 | gabriel9 | i know what is REST(service) |
| 21:07.23 | Ariadeno | oohh linux people who can live without manpages.. only at meego I guess :P |
| 21:08.54 | jonni | gabriel9: there are multiple webservers that work in harmattan, but if your trying to find one that has php then your out of luck. |
| 21:09.11 | gabriel9 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=67749 |
| 21:09.20 | gabriel9 | this dude says it has installed it :D |
| 21:10.07 | jonni | gabriel9: thats for N900, not harmattan |
| 21:10.38 | gabriel9 | damnation |
| 21:10.50 | rigo | jonni, I have a key in /var/lib/apt/lists for org.formeego.apps but apt-get install says origin cannot be determined -- signature check failed |
| 21:11.21 | rigo | so I can't install apps for meego, which is sad |
| 21:11.36 | jonni | rigo: apt-get --reinstall install aegis-community-source-policy |
| 21:11.56 | jonni | maybe your just missing formeego pgp key? :) |
| 21:14.08 | rigo | jonni++ that worked... |
| 21:14.31 | rigo | I owe you many beers if we ever cross paths somewhere |
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| 21:40.22 | Namek | grabiel9: you can follow the instructions on http://elblogdelqt.blogspot.com/2011/12/web-server-on-n950.html |
| 21:40.32 | Namek | I have tried that and it works |
| 21:40.39 | Namek | tough I don't know about php |
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| 21:42.40 | rrobert | I would like to flash my N9, but NaviFirm doesnt know my exact product code. :( |
| 21:42.53 | rrobert | can I choose another file? |
| 21:44.24 | Kozzi | you can use the one with similar countr/area code |
| 21:44.47 | Kozzi | I mean those 001,002,.... |
| 21:45.30 | rrobert | Kozzi: I have 059L504 |
| 21:45.43 | rrobert | so the 4 is important? |
| 21:46.17 | ieatlint | no |
| 21:46.56 | ieatlint | if you go to the about screen in your phone, it should give a version number for the software that ends in something like "_PR_001" |
| 21:46.58 | Kozzi | no, http://wiki.maemo.org/Flashing_N9 |
| 21:47.00 | ieatlint | match that number |
| 21:47.44 | Kozzi | or open Dialer and call *#0000# |
| 21:49.44 | rrobert | it is PR_232 |
| 21:51.26 | ieatlint | that means you have a specific carrier variant... the risks of using navifirm increase as i understand |
| 21:53.02 | rrobert | ieatlint: I bought it in germany as a no branded unlocked device. on the packaging switzerland is mentioned |
| 21:54.01 | ieatlint | rrobert: presuambly you'd want to flash the PR_001 variant, which is the generic european one, but the standard warnings apply that you may irreversably brick your phone and simultaneously void your warranty |
| 21:54.15 | ieatlint | and i personally have no idea how likely that is |
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| 22:23.48 | rzr | itsnotabigtruck, reclaim your prize http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=261062433504#ht_500wt_1289 |
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| 23:14.29 | GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, insteresting. |
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