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| 00:20.19 | Soyburg | good day |
| 00:21.26 | Soyburg | I accidently removed my task bar, in kde 4.2 I can't find a way to re-add it. Anyone know how to do that kind of thing? |
| 00:21.54 | Soyburg | Task bar being the component that holds all the programs that are currently running. |
| 00:21.59 | Soyburg | I think. |
| 00:22.50 | Soyburg | I tried right-click, add mini-program but there isn't a task bar on the menu. |
| 00:24.46 | Soyburg | Never mind. I found it. It was there all along, but it was oddly named. Sorry. |
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| 00:41.00 | RichiH | hmm, kde 4.2.2 recognizes my middle mouse button just fine, yet konqui ignores it.. any ideas why? |
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| 01:06.22 | b1999 | in kde, when i have mplayer open, if i click on another file, how can i make it open in the same player. and not open another player? |
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| 01:31.16 | thehardman | hi. |
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| 01:31.51 | maazu | hi |
| 01:32.31 | thehardman | I am running kde 3.5 under debian and am trying to get userscript 0.1.1 to work with konqueror |
| 01:32.33 | g2g591 | yes I am high |
| 01:32.42 | thehardman | good for you. me too. |
| 01:33.24 | thehardman | ne help? |
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| 01:36.44 | wm4 | does kde4 use ~/.kde at all? |
| 01:39.34 | wm4 | and how can I get the kde3 look back? |
| 01:41.09 | g2g591 | wm4: to change to a kde3 ish theme, right click on any window's title bar and click "configure window behavior" then click window decoration, then click on the theme you want to use |
| 01:41.33 | wm4 | g2g591: I checked the themes, none of it looks like kd3 |
| 01:41.37 | wm4 | *kde |
| 01:41.44 | g2g591 | wm4: try plastik |
| 01:42.00 | g2g591 | wm4: thats what most distros used by default on kde3 |
| 01:42.45 | wm4 | I only see "Plastique" |
| 01:43.05 | Jucato | KDE 4 and KDE 3 themes are not compatible (unless the KDE 3 has been ported) |
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| 01:43.55 | g2g591 | wm4: thats not even in the list on my system that appears when do what I just described |
| 01:44.11 | Jucato | g2g591: that only changes the window decoration |
| 01:44.26 | Jucato | (there's not Plastique window decoration, but there is a Plastique widget style) |
| 01:44.38 | g2g591 | Jucato: I know |
| 01:44.58 | wm4 | oh, I thought you were talking about "Style"... seems there's also Windows Decorations, but I can't find this one in systemsettings |
| 01:45.36 | Jucato | wm4: System Settings -> Appearance -> Windows |
| 01:46.12 | wm4 | no "Appearance" here, I guess I miss some packages |
| 01:46.25 | g2g591 | wm4:" to change to a kde3 ish theme, right click on any window's title bar and click "configure window behavior" then click window decoration, then click on the theme you want to use " |
| 01:46.25 | Jucato | wm4: again, you can't use KDE 3 themes (window decoration or widget style) unless those have been ported to KDE 4 (which makes them KDE 4 themes) |
| 01:47.04 | wm4 | g2g591: well I'm not using the KDE window manager, so clicking on the title bar doesn't work as you intend |
| 01:47.05 | Jucato | wm4: where did you see "Style" then? it's under the Apperance group |
| 01:47.23 | Jucato | Plastique is close to KDE 3's Plastik style |
| 01:47.37 | wm4 | Jucato: oh, now I get it... the window contents change completely... I forgot there was more when clicking on the back button |
| 01:48.42 | wm4 | can I make all those GUI animations and color gradients go away? |
| 01:48.43 | g2g591 | wm4: I thought you were talking more about the window decorations, was going to point you to the plastique thing afterwards |
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| 01:49.03 | Jucato | "kde3 look" can mean a lot of things... |
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| 01:51.11 | p1mrx | has anyone else noticed that GTK windows resize really slowly (2 fps) in KDE 4.2.x ? |
| 01:51.44 | p1mrx | actually, they move pretty quickly at first, but as soon as I try to make the window too small, it slows to a crawl |
| 01:52.19 | p1mrx | "killall kwin" causes resizing to speed up again |
| 01:52.57 | p1mrx | I've tried it with Firefox, Chromium pre-Alpha, and Audacious. All slow. |
| 01:53.09 | wm4 | seriously, those ughly gradients need to go away... I don't know how anyone could find them beatiful |
| 01:53.33 | wm4 | +u |
| 01:54.57 | maazu | gotta go |
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| 01:59.52 | wm4 | how to change the mouse cursor? |
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| 02:03.05 | wm4 | are the gradients configurable? how? |
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| 02:07.34 | p1mrx | looks like it's a 2-month-old unconfirmed bug: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=183263 |
| 02:07.54 | p1mrx | is there anyone who can confirm it *not* happening? |
| 02:08.17 | p1mrx | just resize a GTK window, make it too small, and see if the resize performance plummets for that window |
| 02:08.42 | Zarin | How can you make a window "too small"? |
| 02:08.53 | p1mrx | well, just make it as small as possible |
| 02:08.55 | Zarin | They set minimum size hints so it's GTK+'s fault if it slows down |
| 02:09.26 | p1mrx | I define "too small" to be "shrunk to such a size that kwin decides to slow down from that point onward" |
| 02:09.50 | Zarin | Doesn't happen for me so I have no idea what "too small" is |
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| 02:11.56 | p1mrx | a definite way to trigger it for me is: grab the resize widget in the bottom right corner, move it above the top left of the window, and move it back. I don't even have to let go of the mouse button |
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| 02:14.00 | p1mrx | er, I actually meant "Audacity", not "Audacious". although the resizable dialogs in Audacious exhibit the behavior as well |
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| 02:16.06 | comawhite | p1mrx: blame GTK+ |
| 02:16.18 | p1mrx | I just did "killall kwin; twm", and everything stays fast when resizing. |
| 02:16.37 | wm4 | so, how to deal with the speed problem of kde4? it's slower than kde3 |
| 02:16.47 | wm4 | any theme I should use for more speed? |
| 02:17.02 | comawhite | what video cards? |
| 02:17.03 | p1mrx | I bring back kwin, and the behavior returns |
| 02:17.03 | Zarin | p1mrx, so the resize mark inside the application and not the decoration itself? |
| 02:17.13 | Zarin | wm4, use KDE 3 |
| 02:17.21 | wm4 | comawhite: talking to me? it shouldn't depend from the video card |
| 02:17.23 | p1mrx | Zarin: hold on, let me check |
| 02:17.33 | wm4 | Zarin: oh I would, but as far as I know, it's unmaintained |
| 02:17.45 | Zarin | wm4, it's not unmaintained |
| 02:17.52 | Zarin | Whoever says so is ignorant |
| 02:18.18 | wm4 | Zarin: oh... I thought because Debian switched to kde4... anyway, it's a dead end, isn't it? |
| 02:18.20 | Zarin | It's not prefered, but it's still usable and still gets bug fixe |
| 02:18.22 | Zarin | a |
| 02:18.23 | Zarin | s |
| 02:18.34 | Zarin | wm4, dead end yes, unmaintained no |
| 02:18.51 | JukeBoxHero | Droid Family should be the default font on KDE, i swear it fits perfectly and the two are inseparable.. |
| 02:18.52 | p1mrx | Zarin: I can grab any corner, and the slowness happens. |
| 02:18.54 | Zarin | KDE 4 requires newer hardware. Any new software requires newer hardware |
| 02:19.11 | p1mrx | it also happens if I grab the resize widget inside the bottom-right corner |
| 02:19.14 | Zarin | You can't get more power out of nothing |
| 02:19.17 | wm4 | Zarin: laughable |
| 02:19.25 | wm4 | just plain laughable |
| 02:20.38 | p1mrx | I recall reading that KDE 4 was supposed to be faster than KDE 3.5; I haven't noticed much of a difference, bugs aside. |
| 02:20.54 | Zarin | It all depends on your hardware p1mrx |
| 02:20.57 | wm4 | I noticed scrolling is quite slower than in kde3 |
| 02:21.04 | Zarin | KDE 4 uses more hardware acceleration so if you have sucky drivers it's slower |
| 02:21.12 | Zarin | But if you have decent drivers it's MUCH faster |
| 02:21.20 | JukeBoxHero | yep |
| 02:21.23 | Zarin | Bad thing is that most Linux drivers suck |
| 02:21.34 | JukeBoxHero | on that note, i would say, KDE is made for meh PC! |
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| 02:21.39 | wm4 | Zarin: looks like the kde4 devs made a great choice! |
| 02:21.44 | Jucato | like what someone said before, "If you insist on using old hardware, please use old (compatible) software." |
| 02:21.46 | wm4 | plain laughable, why put so much work into crap |
| 02:21.56 | Zarin | wm4, Eh? |
| 02:22.23 | wm4 | Zarin: well they turned kde4 into some sort of graphgics demo |
| 02:22.38 | Jucato | wm4: right, let's put 200% more work on systems/hardware that will no longer be in mass use 2-3 years from now |
| 02:22.51 | n0sq | ok, i give up, how does one add widgets in kde 4.2.2? (mandriva 2009.0) - i see stuff in ~/Desktop but they're not showing up on the desktop |
| 02:23.15 | wm4 | Jucato: "let's make everything slower just for spiffy looks nobody cares about" |
| 02:23.16 | Zarin | wm4, no. I use KDE 4 perfectly fine and I can run my entire desktop with less than 1% hardware usage. It's no demo |
| 02:23.28 | Zarin | KDE 3 used more |
| 02:23.34 | Jucato | wm4: no one made it slower. it just feels slow because of hardoware and/or drivers |
| 02:23.46 | Jucato | (older hardware, to be more precise, and crappy drivers) |
| 02:23.56 | wm4 | I use the nvidia driver, so I'm not sure what to say |
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| 02:24.07 | JukeBoxHero | my system is up on 4.2.1 for 28 days now without a hiccup |
| 02:24.32 | Jucato | you seem to be pretty sure what to say ;) |
| 02:24.41 | JukeBoxHero | n0sq: i think you should ask that in Mandriva |
| 02:25.02 | wm4 | Jucato: you see, nvidia is one of the most efficient graphics drivers for Linux |
| 02:25.13 | wm4 | Jucato: scrap that, it _is_ the cream of the top |
| 02:25.14 | Jucato | I use nvidia driver as well, which is why I know it's nvidia's fault (and for a long time, it has been). KDE 4 runs smoother on my intel laptop |
| 02:25.30 | Jucato | wm4: you seem to be still living 2 years in the past |
| 02:25.40 | Zarin | wm4, I used nVidia as well and agree that they currently produce the best drivers for Linux |
| 02:25.48 | wm4 | so mkde4 is only for highend systems? |
| 02:25.49 | Jucato | emphasis on *current* |
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| 02:26.20 | Zarin | It's for _new_ system, if you get it running on older systems then that's a bonus |
| 02:26.36 | Zarin | Where "new" is anything in the last three years or so |
| 02:26.46 | wm4 | anyway, KDE4 is the Vista of Linux |
| 02:26.47 | Jucato | or, if you're focusing on a graphics card, one that isn't so high-end but is supported by the latest nvidia driver |
| 02:26.57 | JukeBoxHero | wm4: it is more than that |
| 02:27.03 | JukeBoxHero | how lame a comment is that |
| 02:27.15 | drantin | thinks |
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| 02:27.20 | drantin | pretty lame |
| 02:27.30 | wm4 | well, it's accurate |
| 02:27.31 | p1mrx | Zarin: I've never seen the "KDE4 is not recommended for older systems" claim. Is that written somewhere? |
| 02:27.35 | Jucato | if by that you mean "breaking from the chains of the past in order to face the realities of today and the prospects of tomorrow", then that's fine |
| 02:27.56 | wm4 | Jucato: what are these "prospects of tomorrow"? |
| 02:28.08 | Jucato | wm4: hardware and drivers that don't suck |
| 02:28.13 | drantin | things older computers couldn't do |
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| 02:28.44 | Zarin | If new hardware didn't provide anything that was useful we would still all be using older stuff |
| 02:28.50 | Jucato | wm4: KDE 4 (and Qt 4) revealed a lot of inefficiencies in the nvidia drivers, that nvidia has been very cooperative in fixing. updating to the latest driver version has solved a lot of issues |
| 02:29.26 | wm4 | that said, a GUI environment should work even with SVGA drivers |
| 02:29.45 | JukeBoxHero | wm4: i am gaming on 4.2.1 on a 128mb nvidia card, cod4, vendetta online, trackmania, all neatly needed graphic games,. |
| 02:29.56 | Zarin | wm4, So you're saying KDE4 should work on a 286 with a GeForce 2? |
| 02:30.04 | Zarin | Use your brain dude |
| 02:30.13 | Zarin | There is a line |
| 02:30.25 | Zarin | If you have old hardware use old software |
| 02:30.32 | wm4 | and you set the line to the latest graphic drivers, the latest hardware... |
| 02:30.38 | Zarin | Nothing stopping you from doing that |
| 02:30.41 | Jucato | wm4: there is no *should* here. use what you want and can use. don't force others to follow your own vision. this is free software. no one's forcing you to use the latest and greatest |
| 02:31.00 | p1mrx | Zarin: "if you have old hardware, use old software" is not a universal claim. Look at the Linux kernel, for example. |
| 02:31.02 | Jucato | <Jucato> like what someone said before, "If you insist on using old hardware, please use old (compatible) software." |
| 02:31.09 | wm4 | it's just that I kind of liked kate and konqueror |
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| 02:31.21 | Zarin | p1mrx, The Linux 2.6 kernel does not work on a 286 |
| 02:31.25 | Zarin | You need to use 2.4 |
| 02:31.31 | wm4 | of course you can go with the opinion "fuck the users" |
| 02:31.31 | p1mrx | Linux never worked at all on a 286 |
| 02:31.43 | Jucato | wm4: watch the language |
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| 02:31.47 | wm4 | and the users will have to use something else, fork the software, or to adapt |
| 02:32.03 | wm4 | Jucato: does it count if it's in quotes? |
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| 02:32.24 | Jucato | wm4: does the meaning change in the quotes? |
| 02:32.26 | Zarin | Feel free to fork |
| 02:32.34 | wm4 | Jucato: yes it does |
| 02:32.34 | Zarin | Feel free to use something else |
| 02:32.40 | Jucato | riiiight |
| 02:32.55 | wm4 | Zarin: exactly... but is this what the KDE devs want? users going away? a fork? |
| 02:33.04 | p1mrx | The very first version of Linux required a 386, and I wouldn't be surprised if 2.6.29 worked on Linus' original machine |
| 02:33.17 | dwidmann | Hmm, is there any convenient way to search the "Klipper" history? |
| 02:33.24 | Zarin | wm4, if you want to fork go for it. The only thing stopping you is that any code added to the fork can just be added to the mainline |
| 02:33.26 | Jucato | dwidmann: type as you search |
| 02:33.30 | Zarin | We need developers |
| 02:33.34 | Zarin | Not opinions |
| 02:33.55 | drantin | p1mrx: there are non-official branches of linux that work on 286s |
| 02:34.04 | Zarin | If there's someone that wants to write the thousands of lines of code required to support older hardware then please come help us |
| 02:34.14 | Zarin | Ten of thousands rather |
| 02:34.16 | dwidmann | Jucato: of course, that's what I'm looking for, and what I don't see :\ |
| 02:34.23 | drantin | p1mrx: http://elks.sourceforge.net/introduction.html |
| 02:34.25 | Jucato | dwidmann: just start typing |
| 02:34.45 | wm4 | anyway, repeating my question: how to change the mouse cursor? |
| 02:34.45 | Jucato | dwidmann: click on klipper to raise the list, then start typing |
| 02:35.02 | Jucato | wm4: System Settings -> Keyboard & Mouse -> Mouse -> Theme |
| 02:35.33 | dwidmann | Jucato: Hah! hidden feature |
| 02:35.35 | wm4 | Jucato: that's not there... installation issue, maybe |
| 02:35.42 | dwidmann | Jucato: it seems to be a bit on the slow side though |
| 02:36.12 | wm4 | oh wow, rather "user is blind issue", sorry |
| 02:36.23 | Jucato | dwidmann: and also case-sensitive... |
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| 02:36.30 | dwidmann | Bet that would run a lot faster if it didn't search after every since keypress ... |
| 02:36.41 | dwidmann | **single |
| 02:36.48 | Jucato | that's how most filter search behave though... |
| 02:36.50 | p1mrx | wm4: and blind people don't care about scrolling performance. there, 2 problems solved at once. |
| 02:36.53 | Jucato | (even akregator and dolphin) |
| 02:36.59 | JukeBoxHero | Jucato: is there some way i can sort the user list in konvi so that all ops are above? |
| 02:37.05 | Jucato | whacks p1mrx on the head |
| 02:37.27 | Jucato | JukeBoxHero: Settings -> Configure Konversation -> Nickname List |
| 02:37.37 | wm4 | is there a way to make kde not use its own cursors at all? |
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| 02:40.41 | dwidmann | Jucato: just because it's popular doesn't mean it's a good idea, I wonder if there are any bug reports related to these issues |
| 02:40.58 | Jucato | dwidmann: I didn't say anything about "popular" |
| 02:41.11 | JukeBoxHero | ty Jucato |
| 02:41.21 | wm4 | by the way, to be fair, gnome's development sucks just as much or even more than kde's |
| 02:41.30 | Jucato | dwidmann: I said it's how they behave, so possibly, it's a common widget/implementation |
| 02:43.23 | Jucato | dwidmann: it also probably depends on the limit you've set for klipper.I only have 50 entries |
| 02:43.33 | oneforall | hmm I see that settings to change the clock when applied doesn't work |
| 02:43.39 | oneforall | miss the right click |
| 02:43.44 | dwidmann | I only have 2000 ... which is apparently the max last I checked |
| 02:43.56 | oneforall | asked for the pasword abd still it doesn't change |
| 02:44.08 | Jucato | dwidmann: well no wonder :P |
| 02:44.25 | Jucato | but yeah, there should probably be a sane delay for fast typers like you |
| 02:44.34 | dwidmann | Jucato: not full up at the moment though ... only has my last day worth of selections |
| 02:44.52 | dwidmann | Jucato: exactly! |
| 02:44.55 | Jucato | (finally, bye!) |
| 02:45.04 | seria-mau | can parley export to xml.gz readable by pauker? afaics it can import this format, but can it be exported again? |
| 02:45.05 | oneforall | weirdit just changed now . strange lag |
| 02:45.32 | Jucato | dwidmann: still probably not as much as my 50 limit... which filters quite quickly, with my fast typing too |
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| 02:47.04 | dwidmann | Jucato: even when I'm typing my very fastest, i-t- -s-e-a-r-c-h-e-s- -a-n-d- -r-e-n-d-e-r-s- after every single key I press ... which makes it feel slow/stuttery, of course |
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| 02:51.03 | seria-mau | and i get severe rendering fragments |
| 02:51.21 | seria-mau | ...mostly plasma |
| 02:51.36 | JukeBoxHero | i am on Konvi Version 1.1.75+ #3400, compiled against qt4 libs on 64bit Fedora KDE 4.2.1, it isnt notifying in the tray or the panel when i get a new channel message |
| 02:52.03 | JukeBoxHero | nor does it do that blinking thing on the panel |
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| 02:58.10 | Zarin | p1mrx, I can now reproduce the slow resize thing |
| 02:59.47 | JukeBoxHero | anybody? |
| 03:01.33 | dwidmann | Jucato: ooh, neato, it takes regular expressions too |
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| 03:14.56 | wm4 | so I set the mouse cursor theme via systemsettings |
| 03:15.04 | wm4 | but it's going back from time to time to the old theme |
| 03:15.06 | wm4 | why? |
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| 03:16.20 | wm4 | also, how do disable "soft scrolling" in konqueror? |
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| 03:22.46 | wm4 | so hwo do I disable this soft scrolling feature? at least tell me if it's possible |
| 03:22.49 | wm4 | *how |
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| 04:03.31 | wm4 | KDE keeps resetting its mouse cursors |
| 04:03.47 | wm4 | which is bad, because thew default theme looks incomprehensibly ugly |
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| 04:04.17 | Moult | have any of you guys tried the effect "Sharpen"? Does it do anything for you? The only thing it seems to do for me is make my X incredibly laggy and unresponsive until I have to quit via ctrl-alt-backspace. |
| 04:04.48 | Moult | wm4: what default theme? oxygen? or only the white/black cursor (i forget which is default) |
| 04:05.28 | wm4 | Moult: I get the oxygen theme (some gray thick mess), I want black and white cursors (the Industrial theme seem good enough) |
| 04:05.46 | Moult | wm4: some grey thick mess? don't think so - try screenshot for me? |
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| 04:06.50 | wm4 | Moult: if you point me somewhere I can upload an image with one click... |
| 04:06.50 | Moult | wm4: http://upload.failnation.com |
| 04:06.50 | gucampos | kde 4.2 global shortcuts work for any of you? |
| 04:06.50 | Moult | gucampos: yes |
| 04:06.50 | gucampos | oh crap |
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| 04:06.51 | gucampos | I bound Alt + Return to run konsole |
| 04:06.58 | gucampos | but it simply don't work |
| 04:07.06 | Moult | gucampos: let me try |
| 04:07.12 | Moult | wm4: what distro are you on btw - suse? |
| 04:07.19 | wm4 | Moult: http://upload.failnation.com/scr.png |
| 04:07.24 | wm4 | Moult: Debian unstable |
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| 04:08.23 | Moult | wm4: oh you're saying the default cursor looks ugly |
| 04:08.45 | wm4 | Moult: am I wrong? well I guess it's all about tastes |
| 04:09.02 | Moult | wm4: i use oxygen white. i don't have industrial - maybe industrial is a gnome theme? |
| 04:09.31 | wm4 | Moult: that's possible |
| 04:10.14 | Moult | gucampos: i just tried setting it - it works for me. |
| 04:11.05 | Moult | gucampos: did you go to System Settings -> Input actions? Then right click on the list -> new -> global shortcut -> command |
| 04:11.26 | gucampos | I did it from system settings / keyboard mouse / global shortcuts |
| 04:11.31 | gucampos | let me try from there |
| 04:11.50 | wm4 | also, does anybody know why the height of the menu bar is too high? http://upload.failnation.com/scr2.png |
| 04:12.11 | wm4 | it's twice the size it should be |
| 04:12.27 | Moult | wm4: no, but it looks like a theme issue - most likely the style or the window border - what sort of (ugly :P) theme are you using? |
| 04:12.40 | gucampos | funny |
| 04:12.45 | gucampos | Moult it worked now |
| 04:12.54 | wm4 | Moult: it's less ugly than the default theme... I use Plastique |
| 04:13.14 | gucampos | The funny thing is it warned me that the shortcut was already set Oo |
| 04:13.17 | Moult | gucampos: i haven't figured out the difference between those two, but i think the input keys one uses khotkeys |
| 04:13.29 | Moult | wm4: you should try Bespin - it's a great theme. |
| 04:13.31 | gucampos | yeah |
| 04:13.52 | gucampos | in the keybouard / mouse section I have the settings for various apps ... Khotkeys is just one of them |
| 04:14.12 | gucampos | but it's weird, since in K/M settings the Khotkeys entry has various shortcuts set, none working |
| 04:14.14 | wm4 | Moult: it's not there |
| 04:14.31 | gucampos | but from input actions I had only one from KMenuEdit, and now my new konsole one |
| 04:14.34 | gucampos | both work oO |
| 04:14.57 | Moult | wm4: yes you have to install it - check in your package manager, or try kde-look.org |
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| 04:15.22 | gucampos | Moult / wm4 I'm using Skulptura and loving it |
| 04:15.34 | Moult | gucampos: have you tried bespin? |
| 04:15.35 | wm4 | a fast and simple theme would be good |
| 04:15.59 | gucampos | moult yes I have it installed too |
| 04:16.09 | gucampos | I'm not a big fan of rounded stuff though =D |
| 04:16.20 | Moult | gucampos: you can set it not rounded - it's very customisable |
| 04:16.28 | gucampos | oh |
| 04:16.34 | gucampos | I think I never tried so |
| 04:16.38 | gucampos | let's see =) |
| 04:16.47 | gucampos | wow |
| 04:16.48 | wm4 | rounded stuff = slow, ugly, unneeded, annoying |
| 04:16.50 | wm4 | HATE |
| 04:17.06 | gucampos | there's definitely a lot of config options here =D |
| 04:17.10 | Moult | gucampos: the customisable stuff in bespin is amazing - you can change everything |
| 04:17.15 | wm4 | Moult: whatever that site does, the only useful thing seems to be displaying ads |
| 04:17.38 | wm4 | when doing a "download", all I got was a screenshot |
| 04:17.43 | Moult | gucampos: btw i can't find skulptura on kde-look, any links/screenshots? |
| 04:18.57 | gucampos | Let' me search, if I can't find I'll host a screenshot for you |
| 04:19.29 | gucampos | oh, my bad |
| 04:19.32 | gucampos | it's skulpture =D |
| 04:20.23 | wm4 | sigh, we kde3 I wouldn't have to go through this |
| 04:21.06 | Moult | gucampos: hmm nah prefer bespin - skulpture looks too oldschool :P |
| 04:21.23 | Moult | wow! |
| 04:21.31 | Moult | I just realised there was a widget for the mac style toolbar at the top |
| 04:21.45 | gucampos | I like oldschool hehe - for instance, the Alt + Return run Konsole is an addiction from Xmonad =D |
| 04:22.21 | gucampos | Moult, can't find where to change the rounded corners on Bespin |
| 04:22.36 | gucampos | there's a checkbox for this in Buttons tab, but it's already unchecked oO |
| 04:23.08 | Moult | gucampos: hmm wait i'm sorry i don't think there is an option for removing the rounded corners on Windows - you can remove it for popups, menus, buttons, and the rest though |
| 04:23.14 | SandGorgon | wow.. skulpture looks cool. thanks guys |
| 04:23.39 | gucampos | the windows are not round here, since I'm still using the Skulpture window frame |
| 04:23.48 | gucampos | I'm particulary interested in buttons |
| 04:24.48 | wm4 | asking again: why is the height of the menu bar too high? http://upload.failnation.com/scr2.png |
| 04:25.38 | gucampos | wm4 looks weird, can't think of something |
| 04:26.55 | wm4 | I just started iceweasel, and there it uses the oxygen mouse cursor |
| 04:27.00 | wm4 | whatever is the reason |
| 04:27.11 | wm4 | sigh, Linux sure is crap |
| 04:27.27 | wm4 | the desktop, that is, can't blame the kernel |
| 04:28.41 | gucampos | wm4 that depends so much |
| 04:28.57 | gucampos | For various tasks I prefer to use a tiling window manager |
| 04:29.23 | gucampos | you can't get that in windows, nor mac os (i believe) and they're just too awesome =D |
| 04:29.46 | wm4 | I'm not comparing it to other systems |
| 04:30.06 | wm4 | the mouse cursor just seems to be picked by random |
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| 04:32.38 | Alien_Freak | I'm have trouble getting the KDE4 special effects to work. My 3d Acceleration works fine, I was |
| 04:32.53 | Alien_Freak | playing UT2004 a few minutes ago...but It bitches when I try to enable desktop effects |
| 04:36.06 | Moult | wm4: no, it isn't - just that kde4 is beta software. |
| 04:36.15 | Moult | wm4: try restarting your X. that should fix it. |
| 04:36.25 | wm4 | fix what? |
| 04:36.36 | Moult | wm4: the change in mouse. it's a known bug. |
| 04:36.56 | wm4 | I can't count how often I did restart X, and it didn't go away |
| 04:37.12 | wm4 | I can't afford restarting X anyway |
| 04:37.37 | wm4 | to work with the system, it should be able to run at least 30 days without restart |
| 04:37.47 | Moult | wm4: restarting x != restarting system |
| 04:38.07 | wm4 | in the end it's the same: all apps using X need to be restarted |
| 04:38.16 | Moult | wm4: save your session then. |
| 04:38.35 | gucampos | anybody using xmms2 knows of a good Qt frontend? |
| 04:38.37 | wm4 | the apps I'm using are not all KDE |
| 04:39.02 | Moult | wm4: like i said earlier - kde 4 is still a work in progress. if you want stability, use something less bleeding edge. you don't see servers all running X do you? |
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| 04:42.30 | wm4 | also asking again: how to disable "soft" scrolling in konqueror? |
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| 04:44.10 | Alien_Freak | so... any ideas on getting Desktop effects working? |
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| 04:48.40 | gucampos | Alien_Freak what's your vga? Have you run desktop effects before in any window manager? |
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| 04:50.19 | gucampos | Kde 4 mounts USB storage on demand, is there any way to configure it to mount automatically on KDE startup? Like gnome gvfs? |
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| 04:53.08 | Moult | wm4: mine is disabled, i can't remember how i did it though |
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| 05:02.23 | greeneg | hi * |
| 05:02.51 | greeneg | anyone else seeing god aweful performance in konqueror for 4.2.2? |
| 05:03.20 | greeneg | if you aren't, please let me know which distribution your on |
| 05:03.43 | gucampos | I don't use konqueror, but it looks normal in my Archlinux |
| 05:03.56 | greeneg | hmmm, |
| 05:04.10 | wm4 | in Debian, it works fine |
| 05:04.18 | greeneg | wonders if there is a problem in the build for OpenSuSE.... |
| 05:04.21 | wm4 | apart from a load of other bugs, of course |
| 05:04.39 | greeneg | takes forever to get to a site here |
| 05:04.41 | gucampos | thinks OpenSuSe is an error for itself |
| 05:04.54 | wm4 | greeneg: oh, you mean network performance |
| 05:05.02 | greeneg | though I wonder if some of it is the fact that this is running under a VM |
| 05:05.09 | greeneg | wm4: yes |
| 05:05.14 | gucampos | greeneg, it can be |
| 05:05.19 | gucampos | it's only konqueror? |
| 05:05.28 | greeneg | gucampos: yes |
| 05:05.39 | gucampos | hmm hard to tell |
| 05:05.49 | gucampos | IO in vm's are naturally troublesom |
| 05:05.53 | luke-jr | Qt4 has performance issues :/ |
| 05:06.03 | greeneg | firefox seems to perform OK. (with all its normal sluggishness) |
| 05:06.15 | gucampos | but as everything else is working ok, I can't see why only konqueror would perform bad |
| 05:06.33 | greeneg | gucampos: makes zero sense for me too |
| 05:07.00 | gucampos | Well, you can always try opera =D |
| 05:07.37 | greeneg | blech... no. I've had to deal with the speedo engine's oddities too much when writing websites |
| 05:07.50 | gucampos | oh I see |
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| 05:08.12 | gucampos | that made me switch to webkit |
| 05:08.43 | gucampos | I tried midori for sometime, but it's too minimalist |
| 05:09.00 | gucampos | sticking with firefox until Chrome comes to us =/ |
| 05:09.27 | greeneg | the only engines I write sites for now are MSHTML 7 and 8, Gecko, webkit 2, and KHTML |
| 05:09.55 | wm4 | what toolkit will chrome use? |
| 05:10.14 | gucampos | chrome uses Webkit |
| 05:10.16 | greeneg | wm4: gtk+ port of webkit |
| 05:10.48 | gucampos | greeneg I don't bother too much with KHTML, maybe I should |
| 05:10.58 | gucampos | but I'm not a professional webdev/webdesigner anyway =D |
| 05:11.14 | wm4 | by "toolkit" I meant the GUI... so gtk it is? |
| 05:11.23 | wm4 | also, isn't Webkit = KHTML? |
| 05:11.28 | greeneg | the sites I write are for internal use at work. |
| 05:11.37 | gucampos | wm4 definitely not =D |
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| 05:11.45 | greeneg | wm4: not anymore. the two diverged a great deal |
| 05:12.15 | greeneg | and yes, Chrome will be in Gtk+ for Linux |
| 05:12.30 | gucampos | I pretty much believe webkit is just the best web toolkit around |
| 05:13.11 | greeneg | Win32 forms on Windows, Cocoa on Mac OS X, and Gtk+ for Linux and other UNIX-like platforms |
| 05:13.20 | luke-jr | greeneg: you mean Presto |
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| 05:13.35 | luke-jr | gucampos: Firefox sucks, and Chrome is not much better |
| 05:14.00 | gucampos | luke-jr Firefox is good enough, and I depend on a lot of extensions for some of my work |
| 05:14.01 | greeneg | luke-jr: yes, presto. speedo is the javascript engine in opera iirc |
| 05:14.07 | luke-jr | ah |
| 05:14.17 | gucampos | Chrome is just awesome, can't find a better browser |
| 05:14.29 | wm4 | gucampos: define awesome |
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| 05:14.48 | Moult | awesome is a minimalist window manager. |
| 05:14.51 | Moult | :D |
| 05:14.54 | gucampos | wm4 fast, standard compliant (better than most others) |
| 05:15.00 | greeneg | gucampos: too bad they won't allow for normal webkit plugins, since it requires out of process plugins |
| 05:15.06 | luke-jr | gucampos: there is nothing special about Chrme |
| 05:15.12 | gucampos | Moult a very good one indeed, but I like xmonad most =D |
| 05:15.49 | gucampos | luke-jr for me it's just the fastest browser around, and it renders everything as it should |
| 05:15.53 | gucampos | simple enough |
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| 05:15.56 | wm4 | I'm surprised chrome is fast, despite that process-isolation thing |
| 05:15.56 | kaushal | hi |
| 05:16.11 | kaushal | anyone here using konsole ? |
| 05:16.20 | luke-jr | gucampos: faster than Konqueror? |
| 05:16.29 | luke-jr | kaushal: most of us, I presume |
| 05:16.32 | greeneg | well, time for me to test this tweak on konqy... logging out to reload new environment vars |
| 05:16.41 | gucampos | luke-jr yes, I believe so. Hard to tell though, since I can't use them side-by-side |
| 05:17.08 | luke-jr | gucampos: WINE? |
| 05:17.10 | kaushal | luke-jr: when i login to a remote host, the shell name does not get renamed automatically |
| 05:17.22 | kaushal | is there a way to fix it ? |
| 05:17.32 | luke-jr | kaushal: WFM |
| 05:17.36 | gucampos | luke-jr that won't be fair, the wine layer could slow down chrome significantly |
| 05:17.44 | luke-jr | gucampos: unlikely |
| 05:17.50 | luke-jr | gucampos: WINE is generally faster than Windows |
| 05:17.52 | gucampos | And til the last time I tried, it didn't work on wine |
| 05:17.52 | kaushal | luke-jr: WFM ? |
| 05:17.58 | gucampos | luke-jr that's an urban legend |
| 05:18.02 | luke-jr | gucampos: no it isn't |
| 05:18.14 | luke-jr | gucampos: at least one version of IE (I forget which) runs quicker in WINE than Windows |
| 05:18.18 | luke-jr | kaushal: Works For Me |
| 05:18.23 | kaushal | ok |
| 05:18.40 | gucampos | luke-jr that doesn't make it >> generally << faster than windows |
| 05:18.51 | luke-jr | well, it is generally faster ⺠|
| 05:19.09 | kaushal | luke-jr: do you want my verison of konsole ? |
| 05:19.17 | gucampos | it's sometimes, in specific environments, with specific applications, and specific scenarios, possibly faster |
| 05:19.19 | luke-jr | kaushal: no, I like my working version |
| 05:19.23 | kaushal | I am running it on KDE |
| 05:19.24 | gucampos | that doesn't sound any general to me |
| 05:19.36 | luke-jr | gucampos: most of the time, it is faster |
| 05:19.38 | kaushal | luke-jr: whats ur working version ? |
| 05:19.41 | gucampos | omg |
| 05:19.43 | luke-jr | kaushal: 4.2.2 I think |
| 05:20.02 | wm4 | anyone using the official nvidia drivers here? what driver/card are you using? |
| 05:20.09 | gucampos | i'm not begining a flame war with you luke-jr |
| 05:20.17 | gucampos | stay happy with your thoughts |
| 05:20.24 | luke-jr | wm4: no, I only use legal drivers |
| 05:20.33 | luke-jr | that's why I buy ATi |
| 05:20.54 | gucampos | wm4 I'm using them on a 7600GS |
| 05:21.06 | wm4 | luke-jr: the official drivers are illegal? |
| 05:21.20 | luke-jr | wm4: their ones for Linux anyhow |
| 05:21.24 | luke-jr | I suppose the BSD ones are legal |
| 05:21.28 | wm4 | I heard the ATI drivers, no matter which, are horrible |
| 05:21.40 | gucampos | why would them be ilegal |
| 05:21.43 | gucampos | ? |
| 05:21.43 | luke-jr | wm4: works for me |
| 05:21.50 | luke-jr | gucampos: copyright infringement |
| 05:22.08 | gucampos | luke-jr you say they use GPL'd code inside the driver? |
| 05:22.11 | *** join/#kde pquarles (n=lee@unaffiliated/pquarles) |
| 05:22.14 | luke-jr | gucampos: if you need details, go to an IP lawyer |
| 05:23.11 | gucampos | I don't want legal details, just want to know which part of the driver infringes anything |
| 05:23.23 | luke-jr | gucampos: the source code wrapper, IIRC |
| 05:23.42 | wm4 | the driver binary doesn't contain any GPL code that isn't owned by nvidia, thus it's legal |
| 05:23.49 | luke-jr | being a derived work of Linux, it is required to be GPL |
| 05:23.55 | luke-jr | being GPL, it cannot link to nVidia's blob |
| 05:24.05 | gucampos | no luke-jr |
| 05:24.10 | wm4 | just because it _depends_ from other GPL code, that doesn't make it legal |
| 05:24.16 | wm4 | illegal I mean |
| 05:24.16 | gucampos | it's not derived from linux |
| 05:24.18 | luke-jr | gucampos: yes, now go to an IP lawyer if you want legal guidance |
| 05:24.30 | luke-jr | gucampos: it is impossible to write a video driver for Linux that is no derived |
| 05:24.38 | luke-jr | wm4: yes it does |
| 05:24.40 | luke-jr | wm4: read the GPL |
| 05:24.41 | gucampos | no it1s not |
| 05:24.53 | wm4 | luke-jr: which paragraph? |
| 05:24.56 | gucampos | the code uses Linux apis |
| 05:24.59 | luke-jr | gucampos: if you want to learn Linux architecture, I don't have time for that either |
| 05:25.00 | gucampos | that's not be derived |
| 05:25.05 | luke-jr | gucampos: Linux does not HAVE driver APIs |
| 05:25.11 | luke-jr | wm4: the entire thing |
| 05:25.13 | gucampos | you know what I mean luke-jr |
| 05:25.19 | luke-jr | gucampos: you mean INTERNAL symbols |
| 05:25.32 | wm4 | doesn't matter if internal or not |
| 05:25.34 | luke-jr | which are clearly governed by the license |
| 05:25.36 | kaushal | anybody here can help me in fixing the automatic rename session of the konsole while i login to remote host ? |
| 05:25.45 | wm4 | with your logic, any program running under Linux would have to be GPLed |
| 05:25.55 | luke-jr | wm4: no, Linux clearly makes an exception for system calls |
| 05:26.09 | wm4 | does it |
| 05:26.19 | luke-jr | now if you need legal advise, go to an IP lawyer; if you need to study Linux architecture, start with the COPYING file in the sources |
| 05:26.25 | luke-jr | wm4: it does |
| 05:26.35 | luke-jr | in that COPYING file |
| 05:26.40 | wm4 | luke-jr: I think nvidia has good lawyers |
| 05:26.57 | luke-jr | wm4: if their lawyers tell them to violate the license, I don't |
| 05:27.00 | gucampos | maybe too good indeed |
| 05:27.02 | gucampos | lol |
| 05:27.16 | luke-jr | I don't like lawyers who take a "legal or not, we can get away with it" attitude |
| 05:27.31 | wm4 | sue them |
| 05:27.35 | gucampos | unfortunatelly those are the 'good' lawyers |
| 05:27.42 | luke-jr | wm4: I hope the persons owning the copyright do |
| 05:27.57 | luke-jr | unfortunately, too many nVidia customers will get all whiny at the wrong people |
| 05:28.03 | luke-jr | and they know that |
| 05:28.08 | wm4 | luke-jr: right now, they didn't even disable the use of non-GPL modules |
| 05:28.22 | luke-jr | wm4: there was a patch to, a year or so ago |
| 05:28.30 | luke-jr | Linus blocked it from inclusion |
| 05:28.31 | wm4 | luke-jr: it wasn't accepted |
| 05:28.35 | luke-jr | but that doesn't make it any more legal |
| 05:29.05 | luke-jr | logically, however, the patch would have been bad |
| 05:29.07 | *** join/#kde SoftVision (n=quassel@125.99.51.133) |
| 05:29.12 | luke-jr | it would hurt only the nVidia customers |
| 05:29.15 | luke-jr | and not help anyone |
| 05:29.23 | wm4 | this too |
| 05:29.24 | luke-jr | suing nVidia would be better than blocking their drivers |
| 05:29.39 | wm4 | nvidia would just stop Linux support, maybe |
| 05:29.40 | luke-jr | at least that would address the root of the problem |
| 05:29.49 | luke-jr | wm4: maybe, but that wouldn't stop a lawsuit ⺠|
| 05:30.03 | luke-jr | ideally, the lawsuit would sue for funds to develop a legal driver |
| 05:30.08 | wm4 | luke-jr: it would only hurt Linux nvidia customers? |
| 05:30.19 | wm4 | lol |
| 05:30.44 | wm4 | well, it's not like I don't want an open source nvidia driver |
| 05:30.45 | luke-jr | so winning the lawsuit not only pisses off the innocent people, but also solves the problem eventually |
| 05:30.56 | wm4 | fortunately, there's still nouveau |
| 05:31.07 | luke-jr | blocking the driver merely pisses off the innocent people, without solving the real problem |
| 05:31.10 | wm4 | luke-jr: I don't thunk that'd work |
| 05:31.26 | wm4 | that reminds me I have to try to compile my nvidia driver |
| 05:31.27 | luke-jr | wm4: plus, imagine if ATi and Intel got in on it ;) |
| 05:31.32 | luke-jr | they have even MORE damages |
| 05:31.34 | gucampos | noone willl sue Nvidia cause the drivers are not illegal |
| 05:31.49 | gucampos | at least not indoubtbly illegal |
| 05:31.58 | luke-jr | gucampos: they are. go hire an IP lawyer. |
| 05:32.18 | gucampos | luke-jr ther's a lot of IP lawyers out there that disagree with you |
| 05:32.39 | gucampos | the arguing about the concept of 'derivative work' is not new |
| 05:32.49 | gucampos | and again, i'm not starting a flame war over that |
| 05:33.24 | gucampos | You should just stop spreading your personal opinions as they were the only truth, like some fundamentalist religious troll |
| 05:34.33 | wm4 | open source activist often have similarities to fundamentalist religious trolls, sadly |
| 05:34.39 | wm4 | everyone is hobby lawyer |
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| 05:34.52 | gucampos | wm4 indeed, and that's pretty sad |
| 05:35.40 | gucampos | Lot's of potential open source users turn their back on open source software just because open source guys tend to be a pain in the ass |
| 05:36.49 | luke-jr | gucampos: you're the one who insists on arguing that it's legal when it isn't |
| 05:36.58 | gucampos | I'm not arguing it's legal |
| 05:37.02 | luke-jr | I've kept trying to defer you to an IP lawyer all along |
| 05:37.12 | luke-jr | and I'll do it again ;) |
| 05:37.30 | gucampos | I'm saying that's discussable |
| 05:37.46 | gucampos | and so it is, there's no official resolution on that |
| 05:38.02 | gucampos | that's why Nvidia is happy releasing drivers two times a week =p |
| 05:38.32 | wm4 | two times a week? |
| 05:38.45 | wm4 | there ought to be a stable one under all those releases |
| 05:38.46 | gucampos | wm4 it happened one or two times in the last months |
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| 05:39.03 | luke-jr | gucampos: can we agree that it's as illegal as is possible without a court ruling? |
| 05:39.37 | gucampos | we can agree that it can be illegal if a court agrees about your concept of derivative work |
| 05:40.05 | *** part/#kde siamba (n=dani@home.d.fs.ia64.org) |
| 05:41.51 | *** join/#kde ForgeAus (n=forgefro@112.141.72.216) |
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| 05:51.32 | ForgeAus | I don't understand the disconnect between additional Desktop "Activities" (and/or virtual desktops) and Multiple Desktops, in KDE3 it didn't have Activities or zoomout-able desktop, (might have had a larger desktop than screen res possible I didn't try that - I'm overlooking that because I'm guessing thats still there) but in KDE3 switching desktops was all integrated simple, go from 1 to n in order... KDE4 seems to complicate it no end... |
| 05:52.06 | ForgeAus | but then I'm just a user, I'm not so sure I'm supposed to understand all this desktops stuff lol :) |
| 05:53.12 | SandGorgon | guys ... how do I turn off animations in KDE. I'm using it in a VM, and animations like tooltips, or deleting plasmoids all get to be too irritating. Note that desktop effects are not switched on |
| 05:54.58 | ForgeAus | uh it should all be in system-settings as far as I know.... |
| 05:55.19 | wm4 | SandGorgon: ah that's funny, some hours ago I was told kde is only for "new computers" |
| 05:55.20 | ForgeAus | can't quite check right now (I'm busy in OSX) |
| 05:55.59 | SandGorgon | wm4: sigh .. i really hope not. |
| 05:56.00 | ForgeAus | hmm interesting I thought KDE was able to run on relatively low-end pc's just fine... |
| 05:56.17 | ForgeAus | KDE4's new kwin extras, of course I wouldn't expect to... |
| 05:56.30 | ForgeAus | (as in desktop effects, etc) |
| 05:56.49 | ForgeAus | or maybe I'm still thinking KDE3 ??? ... |
| 05:56.52 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: it should. its just that a lot of effects are enabled as default (like progress bar animation) that need to be explicitly turned off to get decent performance on older comps |
| 05:57.04 | gucampos | SandGordon I don't really know, but I believe it can be a per style setting |
| 05:57.12 | Zarin | KDE 4 can run on older computers but it's entirely YMMV |
| 05:57.20 | ForgeAus | progress bar animation is in appearance tab in system-settings that one I know... |
| 05:57.32 | ForgeAus | whats YMMV stand for? |
| 05:57.39 | gucampos | ForgeAus it's the only one I've found here too =/ |
| 05:57.44 | Zarin | "Your milage may vary". As in it may or may not work |
| 05:58.15 | SandGorgon | gucampos : yes and turning it off is quite a chore in excavation. |
| 05:58.17 | ForgeAus | as for tooltips, thats one I haven't tried turning off yet so I wouldn't exactly know where to look for it! |
| 05:58.52 | ForgeAus | SandGorgon, that depends on your visual style, like oxygen or qtcurve... often you have to go into the config of them independantly for that stuff |
| 05:58.53 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: I wish there was a blanket setting to turning off animation - in tooltips, progress bars, etc. |
| 05:59.35 | gucampos | well guys |
| 05:59.51 | *** join/#kde mabu (n=mabu@cmb32-29.dial-up.arnes.si) |
| 05:59.54 | gucampos | it's witch hour over here, maybe I should go sleep before the witches come =D |
| 06:00.04 | ForgeAus | SandGorgon, sounds like a good suggestion to developers, there does seem to be lots of disconnect in KDE4 at the moment in that sense, lots of separate components... a little integration of some parts of the desktop might help... |
| 06:00.07 | *** join/#kde marcelo_ (n=marcelo@36andc-89-31-12-12.attalascom.net) |
| 06:00.33 | gucampos | hmm before I go |
| 06:00.40 | gucampos | anybody using Xmms2 around? |
| 06:01.08 | ForgeAus | uh I've tried it in the past... but I probably aren't your guy gucampos |
| 06:01.19 | gucampos | oh |
| 06:01.36 | gucampos | I'm thinking about giving it a new try, |
| 06:01.56 | gucampos | but I can't build Esperanza on my archlinux, so I was looking for another Qt4 client =/ |
| 06:02.13 | ForgeAus | Xmms2 is qt4? |
| 06:02.24 | gucampos | xmms2 is headless =D |
| 06:02.33 | ForgeAus | exactlee... |
| 06:02.42 | ForgeAus | I find it very confusing |
| 06:02.45 | gucampos | there are clients written in Gtk, Qt4 and so |
| 06:02.54 | ForgeAus | oh IC |
| 06:03.04 | gucampos | I would like to use one written in qt4, if possible |
| 06:03.06 | ForgeAus | xmms2 is like the engine and the clients are like front-ends... |
| 06:03.20 | gucampos | but for now the only one working nicely here is gxmms2, which is Gtk |
| 06:03.30 | gucampos | more or less |
| 06:03.37 | gucampos | xmms2 is a daemon |
| 06:03.38 | ForgeAus | shrugs... |
| 06:03.57 | gucampos | it runs a headlless server |
| 06:04.07 | ForgeAus | Quassel is kinda similar (the core version anyway... client only is more like konversation) |
| 06:04.19 | gucampos | never heard of |
| 06:04.31 | gucampos | Xmms2 is pretty close to mpd |
| 06:04.34 | ForgeAus | Quassel is an IRC app |
| 06:04.39 | gucampos | oh ic |
| 06:04.52 | gucampos | been using xchat since I can remember =D |
| 06:05.04 | ForgeAus | lol IC |
| 06:05.20 | *** join/#kde mlarsen (n=mlarsen@0x57370334.esnqu1.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 06:05.40 | ForgeAus | xchat is kinda ok, can't say much bad about it, it just isn't my preference (something I tend to like keeping around just in case... ) |
| 06:05.53 | ForgeAus | (similar to irssi, if my x-server goes down, at least I can still chat!) |
| 06:06.02 | gucampos | I see, I never tried another one though |
| 06:06.24 | gucampos | irssi could be a good option, some time ago I had this lsit of terminal apps to use when X is down |
| 06:06.39 | gucampos | it was useful cause I was a Gentoo user, and moving to arch linux |
| 06:06.41 | ForgeAus | but X-chat is not so useful for a backup plan since if my x-server goes down that won't work either lol :) |
| 06:07.08 | gucampos | since both have very basic initial installs, I played on the terminal a lot of time while waiting for graphical stuff to install |
| 06:07.27 | ForgeAus | yeah, makes sense... |
| 06:07.58 | gucampos | the list is nice, tmsnc for msn, cmus for music, mplayer for video |
| 06:08.05 | ForgeAus | I'm doing something similar for OSX right now (only its all graphical) I'm chatting while I'm waiting for kde4base-mac (native aqua KDE4) to compile in fink |
| 06:08.12 | gucampos | you can do pretty much anything in terminals these days |
| 06:08.23 | ForgeAus | (fink is essentially a Debian-like package manager for Mac..) |
| 06:08.30 | gucampos | cool |
| 06:08.37 | gucampos | wish I had a mac to play around =D |
| 06:09.04 | ForgeAus | lol uh... I dont (its a hackintosh here! ... ) |
| 06:09.08 | wm4 | iceweasel still uses the KDE oxygen cursors, how can I undo this? |
| 06:09.17 | ForgeAus | normal PC running Leo... |
| 06:09.24 | gucampos | oh |
| 06:09.34 | gucampos | It works nice? Heard about a lot of bugs |
| 06:09.53 | gucampos | wm4 I don't really know, that is a big mess |
| 06:10.06 | ForgeAus | its interesting, my PC is getting too long in the tooth for its video to be supported properly tho thats the only major issue I've been having |
| 06:10.08 | gucampos | when I used gnome, all qt apps had a different cursor |
| 06:10.14 | *** join/#kde splspsks (n=tyty@83.54.113.233) |
| 06:10.35 | ForgeAus | wm4, it might be that your running iceweasel as a different user? |
| 06:10.40 | gucampos | with kde4 they just worked with the right cursors, never did anything |
| 06:10.47 | wm4 | ForgeAus: that too |
| 06:10.50 | ForgeAus | (ie root probably has a different cursor theme, for example) |
| 06:11.02 | wm4 | ForgeAus: however, that other user didn't ever run kde or gnome |
| 06:11.03 | gucampos | ForgeAus got a real point |
| 06:11.14 | ForgeAus | yes well when you set it, it gets set on a per-user basis) |
| 06:11.35 | ForgeAus | wm4, thats fine, but the default settings will probably be oxygen cursors |
| 06:11.47 | ForgeAus | so you need to run system settings as that user to alter the default... |
| 06:11.54 | wm4 | ForgeAus: eh? oxygen is a KDE thing |
| 06:12.07 | ForgeAus | (it creates a fresh .kde in their home on first use) |
| 06:12.12 | wm4 | ForgeAus: I repeat, that user doesn't even have a single kde configuration file |
| 06:12.13 | gucampos | hey guys, I tried to "Configure Window Behavior" for terminal windows to be transparent, but it's not working |
| 06:12.23 | gucampos | anyone knows about a known bug in that? |
| 06:12.26 | ForgeAus | oxygen is the current KDE4 default wigetset (and probably cursor theme) |
| 06:12.42 | wm4 | ForgeAus: well, that just doesn't matter |
| 06:12.48 | ForgeAus | I think Ozone is actually the default window-decorator nowerdays.... not entirely sure |
| 06:12.51 | ForgeAus | (but there is an oxygen one of them too) |
| 06:13.06 | ForgeAus | wm4, they should have a config file.. |
| 06:13.07 | gucampos | oops |
| 06:13.12 | gucampos | wrong option |
| 06:13.17 | wm4 | ForgeAus: why? |
| 06:13.22 | gucampos | I meant 'Special Application Settings' |
| 06:13.24 | ForgeAus | its in /home/user/.kde (or ./kde4 depending on how it was installed) |
| 06:13.48 | ForgeAus | the . folder is "hidden" in most linux distros, so you may need to unhide it to find it... |
| 06:13.55 | wm4 | ForgeAus: it doesn't exist |
| 06:14.03 | wm4 | ForgeAus: because that user never has run kde |
| 06:14.15 | ForgeAus | wm4, thats odd... |
| 06:14.24 | ForgeAus | kde or a kde application as that user? |
| 06:14.25 | wm4 | ForgeAus: that's not odd at all |
| 06:14.31 | *** join/#kde timgreen (n=timgreen@58.207.176.160) |
| 06:14.52 | gucampos | wm4 if you run a kde app it should create the directory, even if kde itself never run |
| 06:15.03 | wm4 | but I run iceweasel |
| 06:15.09 | ForgeAus | afaik iceweasel itself isn't even a kde app |
| 06:15.14 | wm4 | exactly |
| 06:15.15 | gucampos | not really |
| 06:15.16 | gucampos | nor gnome |
| 06:15.21 | *** join/#kde elmargol (n=elmargol@host124-6-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 06:15.35 | gucampos | but it may be bound to .gtkrc-2.0 settings |
| 06:15.41 | gucampos | as a gtk app |
| 06:15.48 | wm4 | eh, I guess I'll replace the oxygen cursor theme files with my files |
| 06:15.59 | wm4 | that's devilish, but it will force it to use the correct cursors |
| 06:16.01 | gucampos | give the gtkrc file a try |
| 06:16.08 | wm4 | gucampos: the gtkrc is clean |
| 06:16.18 | ForgeAus | wm4 firstly what distro? (is it kde-based on install or did you install kde ontop of it?) |
| 06:16.21 | gucampos | you can put your cursor theme in there |
| 06:16.27 | wm4 | Debian unstable |
| 06:16.28 | gucampos | the same one you're using in kde |
| 06:16.53 | ForgeAus | ahh debian unstable, so I think that means you install a debian base system and kdebase ontop of that right? |
| 06:17.04 | wm4 | let me clearify: I'm running without a desktop enviroment, I only use icewm. I run some kde apps, though. I have a second UNIX user which I use for web browsing with iceweasel (aka Firefox). |
| 06:17.38 | wm4 | that second user is completely clean (only has some config files for iceweasel) |
| 06:17.58 | gucampos | hmm |
| 06:18.06 | wm4 | but ti uses the cursors that I set as standard in the first user's config |
| 06:18.09 | ForgeAus | ok so it seems like hte second user is being bound by default kde settings then?... |
| 06:18.18 | *** join/#kde insulina (n=insulina@bl5-149-171.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 06:18.24 | ForgeAus | that would explain why no /.kde in their user home |
| 06:18.31 | wm4 | it's something about how X uses cursors, I don't know about this |
| 06:18.41 | wm4 | the actual problem is that KDE keeps resetting the cursor theme |
| 06:18.54 | gucampos | wm4 I know that you can change X cursors using the .xprofile/.xdefaults file |
| 06:19.01 | gucampos | xrdb should handle that |
| 06:19.04 | wm4 | gucampos: how? |
| 06:19.19 | wm4 | I see this in xrdb -query: Xcursor.theme: #kde_legacy# |
| 06:19.34 | gucampos | Hmmm I don't recall correctly, I changed a long time ago, while I was still a fluxbox guy |
| 06:19.48 | ForgeAus | fluxbox is nice |
| 06:19.53 | wm4 | (oh Linux is really an exciting text MMORPG adventure game) |
| 06:20.02 | gucampos | but anyway, GTK/Gnome/Kde settings may overwrite that |
| 06:20.10 | ForgeAus | lol wm4! |
| 06:20.15 | wm4 | gucampos: apparently they do... it's a huge confusion |
| 06:20.18 | gucampos | wm4 that's the funny part for most of us =D |
| 06:20.34 | wm4 | gucampos: isn't so funny if you're forced to play it, though |
| 06:20.35 | ForgeAus | so the cursor theme isn't in kde config its in xconfig... |
| 06:20.45 | ForgeAus | brb... |
| 06:20.45 | gucampos | that mess was one of the strong motives for me to change from a window manager to a desktop environment |
| 06:20.57 | wm4 | gucampos: never., |
| 06:21.02 | gucampos | lol |
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| 06:21.11 | wm4 | desktop environments are far too annoying |
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| 06:21.13 | gucampos | wm4 I know how you feel |
| 06:21.16 | gucampos | it hurts |
| 06:21.19 | wm4 | heh |
| 06:21.44 | gucampos | I left fluxbox for gnome some time ago, and struggle to live with it |
| 06:21.47 | wm4 | right now, most stuff works and I found out some things about X I never knew before, so I'm in a good mood |
| 06:21.48 | ForgeAus | annoying? I find KDE pretty good for the most part |
| 06:21.53 | gucampos | but now I'm getting confortable with kde 4 |
| 06:21.56 | ForgeAus | argh gnome! :( |
| 06:22.04 | ForgeAus | its just... ugly! |
| 06:22.08 | gucampos | a bunch of annoying bugs yet, but the system itself feels very nice |
| 06:22.25 | gucampos | ForgeAus with Murrina theme engine and some tweaking it can look pretty good |
| 06:22.37 | wm4 | I guess the toolkits set the cursor using raw X API (e.g. set an image cursor per X window) |
| 06:22.47 | gucampos | but my Kde 4.2 with Skulpture is just gordgeous |
| 06:22.50 | wm4 | and determining the actual cursor image is the toolkit's work, bot X |
| 06:22.51 | ForgeAus | still since the KDE3->KDE4 I'm not so sure KDE is quite "there" yet, but its getting better |
| 06:23.00 | ForgeAus | yeah I'm using skupture :) |
| 06:23.01 | gucampos | if it was a girl, I could easily flirt it |
| 06:23.09 | wm4 | and there has to be some "convention" across GUI toolkits how to determine a cursor image |
| 06:23.16 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: my wife simply wont use KDE cos, it looks like a psychedelic Abba song. And she hates the tooltips too. I think the structure is there, but it needs to be more usable |
| 06:23.17 | wm4 | but how? how does it work? |
| 06:23.39 | gucampos | wm4 big mistery |
| 06:23.41 | wm4 | I for one use _programs_, not a desktop environment |
| 06:23.42 | ForgeAus | I don't mind dekorator (crystal) Skulpture, Quartz or Ozone... decorators... |
| 06:23.44 | gucampos | maybe your answer is 42 |
| 06:24.05 | ForgeAus | she hates tooltips, thats odd... |
| 06:24.11 | wm4 | xmms is gtk1, iceweasel is something with GTK2, kate is KDE, konqueror is KDE, xterm is raw X, xchat is GTK2 |
| 06:24.21 | wm4 | xmms is GTK1 |
| 06:24.24 | wm4 | wow |
| 06:24.26 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: the ones in gnome are fine (the small yellow ones) |
| 06:24.35 | ForgeAus | thats right... |
| 06:24.39 | ForgeAus | xmms is GTK1 |
| 06:24.42 | gucampos | well, these days I only fall back to a wm when I get some trouble in KDE, or when using a lot of terminals only, so I load my beloved Xmonad session =D |
| 06:24.49 | wm4 | I didn't find a "better" player than xmms yet |
| 06:24.58 | wm4 | xmms is really bad, but it's not annoying |
| 06:24.58 | Zarin | Amarok 1.4 |
| 06:25.00 | gucampos | oh, xmms doesn't fit my needs |
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| 06:25.07 | wm4 | Amarok is the definition of "annoying2 |
| 06:25.12 | gucampos | it doesn't scale to 15k songs, my case |
| 06:25.26 | Zarin | Then you're using it wrong, I use my Amarok like it is XMMS for the most part |
| 06:25.27 | gucampos | Amarok is toooooo slow, but still the best i've got so far |
| 06:25.34 | ForgeAus | the psychadelic abba song thing is what KDE4 is meant to look like, a clean dazzling interface... something you can enjoy looking at!... |
| 06:25.39 | wm4 | everything iTune-sy is annoying |
| 06:25.40 | gucampos | Winamp 5 is my shining star, still |
| 06:26.01 | ForgeAus | then again it doesn't matter what desktop imagery you use theres always going to be people who don't like it... |
| 06:26.13 | gucampos | wm4 you should give Audacious a try, it's mostly a modern version of the classic xmms |
| 06:26.21 | Zarin | Linux users are the most difficult to please |
| 06:26.24 | ForgeAus | (like me with Ubuntu gnomes oranges and chocolate browns... makes me feel nauseus...) |
| 06:26.25 | wm4 | gucampos: I didn't like it |
| 06:26.38 | gucampos | Zarin it's because there are options |
| 06:26.50 | gucampos | Windows users are easy to please cause they don't have any options |
| 06:27.00 | Zarin | gucampos, yeah, and they want more but are not willing to give back anything. |
| 06:27.00 | gucampos | whatever comes to them, they take |
| 06:27.05 | ForgeAus | lol I don't think thats true |
| 06:27.15 | ForgeAus | I'm a former windows user, very difficult to please with Linux... |
| 06:27.31 | gucampos | Have you guys heard of a blind test realized with some common users, that were put to test Kde 4 believing it was Windows 7? |
| 06:27.43 | SandGorgon | i have problems with usability - for example deleting themes. |
| 06:27.49 | ForgeAus | in fact I'm still more windows-centric in the way I use my PC... even if I rarely use windows these days (since mine is mostly broken) |
| 06:27.52 | Zarin | gucampos, Reverse Mojav done by CNet.au |
| 06:28.01 | gucampos | Zarin that must be it |
| 06:28.11 | ForgeAus | Sandgorgon, there is a #Kde-Usability channel... |
| 06:28.32 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: oh i filed a bug :) |
| 06:28.38 | gucampos | The big problem with Linux, for me, these days, are the lacking of a standard |
| 06:28.52 | gucampos | options are good, but things should work seamlesly together |
| 06:28.59 | luke-jr | they do? |
| 06:29.00 | gucampos | so troubles like wm4's wouldn' occur |
| 06:29.03 | ForgeAus | deleting themes shouldn't, however be a problem, many of them you can simply remove the package that contains them, or use the delete icon (although some may be in a base-config and therefore non-deletable) |
| 06:29.06 | wm4 | gucampos: actually, there has been quite some development |
| 06:29.16 | wm4 | gucampos: in earlier times, it was much worse |
| 06:29.18 | gucampos | wm4 for sure, but we are far from ideal |
| 06:29.36 | luke-jr | what exactly is wm4's problem? |
| 06:29.45 | ForgeAus | I think its getting better, but I'm not sure I like the direction its heading... |
| 06:29.49 | wm4 | luke-jr: inconsistent cursors, cursor theme bug in kde4 |
| 06:29.57 | ForgeAus | I felt way more comfy in KDE3 than I do in kde4 still |
| 06:30.05 | luke-jr | wm4: default cursors work fine for me.. |
| 06:30.16 | ForgeAus | lol luke! the cursors work |
| 06:30.32 | ForgeAus | its the theme is oxygen when he didn't set it to be for a non-kde user... |
| 06:30.34 | wm4 | luke-jr: they are ugly... also, how to make cursors between icewm, gtk and kde consistent? |
| 06:30.42 | luke-jr | wm4: they always have been for me |
| 06:30.47 | luke-jr | though I avoid GTK like the plague |
| 06:31.13 | ForgeAus | (I think its because when he runs iceweasel as a different user, KDE set his x configuration instead of having it somewhere in <userhome>/.kde ) |
| 06:31.22 | wm4 | luke-jr: what's so bad about gtk? |
| 06:31.28 | SandGorgon | ForgeAus: what direction of KDE 4 is bothering u? |
| 06:31.28 | luke-jr | wm4: ugly, slow, etc |
| 06:31.36 | ForgeAus | why use GTK when you have QT :) |
| 06:31.47 | wm4 | ForgeAus: actually, it's just that iceweasel uses the KDE theme... you can dumb it down to this |
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| 06:31.58 | wm4 | ForgeAus: other nthan that, I'm plagued by the KDE cursor theme bug |
| 06:31.59 | gucampos | luke-jr you should try murrine engine, but still qt is much better for now |
| 06:32.08 | wm4 | luke-jr: hey that's what I thought about KDE |
| 06:32.10 | ForgeAus | SandGorgon, mostly the stuff they leave behind! ... |
| 06:32.26 | Zarin | ForgeAus, you mean the stuff that hasn't been ported yet ;-) |
| 06:32.32 | wm4 | is there a bug report for the kde cursor theme thing? |
| 06:32.49 | gucampos | speaking on non-ported software, any news about K3B on Qt4? |
| 06:32.54 | ForgeAus | qt-curve should work fine for both GTK and QT... |
| 06:33.05 | Zarin | gucampos, it's slowly getting there |
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| 06:33.24 | wm4 | k3b is kde3 only? |
| 06:33.26 | gucampos | ForgeAus I'm using gtk-qt-engine here and anjoying it |
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| 06:33.32 | gucampos | wm4 yeap |
| 06:33.43 | ForgeAus | hehe I still have my KDE3 somehow, so I'm not missing K3b (although kcontrol is gone... ) |
| 06:33.46 | gucampos | Zarin can't wait, it's the only software using kde3libs here |
| 06:33.49 | Zarin | wm4, K3B has yet to be ported to Qt4, it's still available in KDE4 as a Qt3 application |
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| 06:34.27 | ForgeAus | ok then maybe I still have my qt3... I don't know.. its confusing |
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| 06:34.35 | ForgeAus | my kde3 apps still work anyway... |
| 06:35.05 | gucampos | ForgeAus you just need the libs to be there for it, the desktop itself can be purged |
| 06:35.12 | wm4 | oh, just I went with my mouse cursor over iceweasel, and it's different again |
| 06:35.14 | wm4 | funfunfun |
| 06:35.19 | gucampos | lol |
| 06:35.29 | gucampos | wm4, give up, come to the easier side of the force |
| 06:35.32 | ForgeAus | hehehe |
| 06:35.41 | gucampos | I mean |
| 06:35.43 | Zarin | wm4, what WM you running? |
| 06:35.47 | wm4 | Zarin: icewm |
| 06:35.47 | gucampos | the easier side, inside the funny side |
| 06:35.52 | gucampos | please don't use windows |
| 06:36.01 | Zarin | To get the same cursor on all windows it's the WM's job to set it |
| 06:36.09 | peaches | anyone know if message list font size in kmail is supposed to work somehow |
| 06:36.09 | Zarin | I believe |
| 06:36.24 | Zarin | Not 100% sure, but there is cursor setting code in KWin |
| 06:36.26 | SandGorgon | btw, there is a minimal QT based desktop - called antico |
| 06:36.28 | wm4 | could anyone point me to where the cursor theme are stored on the filesystem? |
| 06:36.40 | Zarin | wm4, some generic place |
| 06:36.44 | Zarin | It's shared with GTK |
| 06:36.45 | wm4 | Zarin: I believe something else |
| 06:36.51 | wm4 | oh |
| 06:36.57 | gucampos | Zarin that's the point I think, I believe (not sure) gtk apps will read .gtkrc and override the WM settings, the same occur with KDE apps |
| 06:37.17 | ForgeAus | Zarin I think its an X11 thing as opposed to a WM thing?... |
| 06:37.40 | Zarin | X11 doesn't have code for getting a global cursor |
| 06:37.45 | Zarin | It's done per window |
| 06:37.51 | wm4 | if anyone could clearify this, I'd be thankful |
| 06:38.05 | wm4 | right now, all I know is this line in xrdb: Xcursor.theme: #kde_legacy# |
| 06:38.11 | ForgeAus | shrugs.. ok I have no idea then... |
| 06:38.51 | ForgeAus | wm4 thats probably why its oxygen (KDE has set the default for X)... |
| 06:39.17 | Zarin | "Xcursor (mostly) follows the freedesktop.org spec for theming icons. The default search path it uses is $HOME/.icons, /usr/share/icons, /usr/share/pimaps, /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/icons. Within each of these directorys, it searches for a directory using the theme name. Within the theme directory, it looks for cursor files in the 'cursors' subdirectory. It uses the first cursor file found along the path. " |
| 06:39.28 | ForgeAus | at least thats what I'm assuming... |
| 06:39.35 | wm4 | Zarin: yay, useful information |
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| 06:40.42 | gucampos | well |
| 06:40.50 | gucampos | good night to all |
| 06:41.01 | wm4 | it's very plain :( http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/cursor-spec |
| 06:41.08 | wm4 | only defines some cursor names |
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| 06:48.48 | ArmOrAttAk | i'm wondering why firefox has access to fonts better than konqueror on my kde system |
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| 06:49.41 | ArmOrAttAk | like deju vu sans lighter works in ff not konq |
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| 06:50.38 | ArmOrAttAk | and then urw gothic l doesn't show up yet i can select it for default |
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| 06:52.29 | ArmOrAttAk | or even trebuchet ms |
| 06:52.42 | ArmOrAttAk | any ideas kde people? |
| 06:53.24 | ForgeAus | apparently fonts and cursors aren't my forte |
| 06:54.41 | wm4 | in my opinion, they all should use fontconfig |
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| 06:55.01 | wm4 | try the fc-list or fc-match commands if you find the fonts... |
| 06:56.12 | ArmOrAttAk | okay |
| 06:56.35 | wm4 | what cursor theme is the default on KDE4? |
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| 06:57.15 | ForgeAus | afaik oxygen |
| 06:57.17 | ArmOrAttAk | i'm on 3.5 |
| 06:57.24 | wm4 | there are several oxygens |
| 06:57.36 | Zarin | Oxygen black small |
| 06:58.07 | wm4 | ah, ok... thought it was "oxygen default" |
| 06:58.15 | ForgeAus | yeah kde3.5 had crystal ones... |
| 06:58.18 | wm4 | now oxygen black is really ugly |
| 06:58.24 | ForgeAus | oxygen default probably works... |
| 06:58.41 | ForgeAus | I agree oxygen black isn't so nice at least not for me, thats why I use the blue one instead :) |
| 06:58.46 | Zarin | There's an "oxygen default"? |
| 06:58.52 | Zarin | uses white |
| 06:58.55 | wm4 | Zarin: apparently |
| 06:59.09 | Zarin | Is it a symlink? |
| 06:59.23 | wm4 | um.. no idea... it uses gray and blue colors |
| 06:59.31 | ForgeAus | wm4 what are you trying to do? delete it? |
| 06:59.48 | wm4 | ForgeAus: I'll switch the oxygen black files with the ones I want |
| 07:00.00 | ForgeAus | oh IC |
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| 07:00.31 | ForgeAus | kewl... no problem then I ws just concerned if you deleted it that you could have caused some kinda error for the files (that were referenced) being missing thats all |
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| 07:04.33 | wm4 | ok the kde cursor bug goes like this: 1. start systemsettings 2. select one cursor theme and apply 3. select another cursor theme and apply 4. start new kde app |
| 07:04.48 | wm4 | the new kde app will have "oxygen black" cursors, instead of the one selected in 3. |
| 07:04.56 | wm4 | can anyone reproduce this? |
| 07:05.35 | wm4 | erm, kde 4.2.2 |
| 07:05.39 | ForgeAus | right now I'm in MacOSX so the answer... is no... |
| 07:06.12 | ForgeAus | but it is apparent that there are problems with keeping settings changes anyhow... |
| 07:06.20 | ForgeAus | its a known issue... |
| 07:06.45 | ForgeAus | (the other day someone stated that oxygen is harder to escape than air ) lol |
| 07:06.47 | wm4 | also, I'd like to know why KDE is allowed to set the cursor of _all_ X applications... this shouldn't happen |
| 07:07.00 | ForgeAus | (I tend to have to keep setting my widget theme to qt-curve alot |
| 07:07.06 | ForgeAus | I agree wm4 |
| 07:07.07 | wm4 | if a property is X global, KDE should only set it if it was started as the desktop environment |
| 07:07.19 | wm4 | KDE, don't be Gnome! |
| 07:08.48 | Zarin | Let me repeat: X has no way to globally set the cursor, it must be done on a per-window basis. If a cursor is not set then the default X unstyled one will be used. |
| 07:09.09 | wm4 | Zarin: but what about Xcursor.theme |
| 07:09.11 | Zarin | Lots of applications don't set their cursor |
| 07:09.14 | wm4 | that seems to be very much global |
| 07:09.14 | ForgeAus | Zarin that doesn't seem to be whats happened tho |
| 07:09.19 | wm4 | also, it _does_ happen |
| 07:09.21 | Zarin | So something else needs to make sure it's set |
| 07:09.23 | SandGorgon | Droid fonts rock |
| 07:09.31 | wm4 | I'm sure iceweasel doesn't read the KDE settings from a different unix user! |
| 07:09.45 | wm4 | it _has_ to be x global |
| 07:09.55 | wm4 | even if it's a bug |
| 07:10.15 | Zarin | The cursor files itself is available globally, but it's the applications/WM's/DE's task to actually set them on the window |
| 07:10.24 | Zarin | Each one separately |
| 07:10.29 | Zarin | No idea what Firefox does |
| 07:10.36 | ForgeAus | your saying ICEWM has neglected to change it |
| 07:10.48 | Zarin | That is the most likely cause yes ForgeAus |
| 07:10.54 | ForgeAus | so it stays on KDE's one when they run the iceweasel app? |
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| 07:11.09 | ForgeAus | which makes it an IceWM bug not a KDE one... |
| 07:11.25 | Zarin | No idea, why don't you go ask in the IceWM channel instead of this one... |
| 07:11.32 | Zarin | You're not even using KDE |
| 07:12.04 | ForgeAus | hehe I'm using Aqua right now, but I do use KDE4 on my Kubuntu installation |
| 07:13.28 | wm4 | also, it could be by convention |
| 07:13.48 | wm4 | all apps implement some weird convention, which causes them to read specific cursor files |
| 07:13.58 | wm4 | and the convention could include reading a global theme value |
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| 07:14.31 | Zarin | wm4, http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=29177 |
| 07:14.41 | Zarin | First Google result for "Firefox Linux cursor" |
| 07:14.59 | wm4 | oh nice |
| 07:15.13 | wm4 | but I still don't think it's a firefox specific problem |
| 07:15.14 | ForgeAus | iceweasel is based on mozilla but it is not firefox... afaik |
| 07:15.45 | wm4 | ForgeAus: they're practically the same, Debian is using a different name for legal reasons |
| 07:15.47 | Zarin | Iceweasel is Firefox with some patches to make it fully GPL compliant |
| 07:16.09 | Zarin | Such as removal of the logo |
| 07:16.20 | Zarin | As it's trademarked |
| 07:16.29 | blip- | guys I installed kubuntu 8.10 recently and it came with kde 4.1 and desktop 3D effects worked fine on my nvidia 8600GT laptop ... so I installed kde 4.2.2 through backports and it's working fine, except the desktop effects don't get enabled any more.... Trying to enable them tells me: |
| 07:16.32 | blip- | "Failed to activate desktop effects using the given configuration options. Settings will be reverted to their previous values.Check your X configuration. You may also consider changing advanced options, especially changing the compositing type." |
| 07:16.51 | Zarin | blip-, ask in the distribution channel |
| 07:17.14 | Zarin | Sounds like incorrectly set up xorg.conf |
| 07:17.38 | blip- | Zarin: it hasn't change though... I'll play around with it and see what happens. thanks |
| 07:17.41 | blip- | *ed |
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| 07:30.53 | hibread_ | Hello! GTK appearance settings have disappeared from the kde control center (for a while now). Whats the app to install for that? i forget |
| 07:31.32 | wm4 | do you want gnome-appearance-properties, or a simple theme switcher? |
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| 07:31.57 | Zarin | gtk-qt-engine |
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| 07:32.15 | Zarin | It's the one that adds the settings to system settings |
| 07:32.20 | beer_ | morning |
| 07:32.29 | hibread_ | not sure exactly.. theme type setup for gnomey programs :) gtk-qt-engine might be it |
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| 07:55.02 | beer_ | http://wiki.debian.org/KDEBugDay <- may be interrested by people who are using debian |
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| 08:08.17 | OnlyWhisky | Hello! Is there any kde app for launching applications by schedule with dialog window like: something going to start in x seconds. Cacnel? |
| 08:09.06 | OnlyWhisky | I wish to make backups (most probably using rdiff-backup) |
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| 08:17.44 | Losowski | Hello...I enabled KDM on my Arch LInux distribution...when I start my pc, I get the KDM dialog box with my username already in it...I then proceed to type in my password, and it doesn't boot into KDE, it simply goes back to the dialog box again....how can I fix this? thanks |
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| 08:18.26 | Losowski | if I type 'startx' at the command line user prompt, I can go into KDE with no problem |
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| 08:19.21 | beer_ | I have had something similar. with me it was becouse kde tought that I could use kwin with 3 d effect on a intelhardware bug the intel driver was buged (back in xserver 1.6 beta/alpha dayes) |
| 08:20.45 | Zarin | Losowski, It's some sort of bug with Arch Linux, try again |
| 08:20.56 | Zarin | It always works the second time for me |
| 08:20.57 | Losowski | beer_: If I don't use KDM at all and simply log onto my system at boot / cli, I can easily start KDE just by typing in 'startx'..but KDM won't work or recognize my user passowrd |
| 08:21.04 | Losowski | *password |
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| 08:21.17 | Losowski | I tried it twice, but still doesn't work |
| 08:21.49 | Zarin | What is your DAEMONS variable set to in /etc/rc.conf? |
| 08:21.59 | beer_ | then it is not the smae problem |
| 08:22.24 | Losowski | I didn't enable KDM via the daemon...I adjusted inittab in /etc instead |
| 08:22.48 | Zarin | Losowski, you're breaking your distribution... =\ |
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| 08:23.14 | Losowski | Zarin: That proc is the 'preferred method' in the Arch Linux wiki |
| 08:23.22 | Zarin | Huh |
| 08:23.24 | Zarin | Since when? |
| 08:23.35 | Losowski | http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Adding_a_login_manager_(KDM,_GDM,_or_XDM)_to_automatically_boot_on_startup |
| 08:23.38 | Zarin | It was adding "kdm" to the DAEMONs variable when I checked a few weeks ago |
| 08:23.53 | Losowski | "The inittab method is recommended for various reasons, one being that it will allow you to boot directly into framebuffer mode from GRUB." |
| 08:24.29 | Zarin | Never seen that before |
| 08:24.38 | Zarin | All other pages recommend daemon |
| 08:24.41 | Losowski | Zarin: Can you blame me? That's what I used |
| 08:24.45 | Zarin | :) |
| 08:24.46 | Losowski | it's in the wiki |
| 08:25.20 | Zarin | Try disabling and using the daemon. See if that fixes it |
| 08:25.45 | Zarin | Immediately exiting KDE back to KDM sounds like it can't run the startkde program |
| 08:25.57 | Zarin | Either because of permissions or otherwise |
| 08:26.19 | Zarin | Maybe ask in #archlinux |
| 08:26.37 | Losowski | Zarin: I asked, but nobody helped me l( |
| 08:26.40 | Losowski | :( |
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| 08:27.49 | ponto | Hi, kmail from KDE 3.x was able to delete message threads such that just the next item in the list was selected. kmail from KDE 4.2.2 has not this feature by default. How to get it back? |
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| 08:34.32 | *** join/#kde behnam (n=quassel@overflow.chacalcrou.fr) |
| 08:34.40 | behnam | Hello |
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| 08:35.30 | behnam | I'm using KDE 4.2.2 on Kubuntu 9.04 RC and I have little problem with the starting |
| 08:35.48 | behnam | Indeed, when KDE start, it restores all the windows that were open when I shutdown the computer |
| 08:35.57 | behnam | How can I disable this feature ? |
| 08:36.54 | wm4 | I don't know, but this "feature" is called session managment if this helps |
| 08:37.10 | behnam | Oh ok I think I found ! |
| 08:37.32 | behnam | KDE control center >> session managment >> start an empty session |
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| 08:38.32 | behnam | wm4: Thanks ! :) |
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| 08:54.25 | wm4 | and ark is as ugly as usual in kde4 |
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| 08:57.46 | beer_ | ark is not ugly on kde 3.5 so I would not say as usual ;) |
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| 09:01.07 | wm4 | kde4 doesn't recognize that "hand" cursor from xcursor themes |
| 09:01.20 | wm4 | I want to smash the person responsible for this |
| 09:01.45 | PhilRod | you have the code, scratch your itch |
| 09:02.23 | thiago_home | wm4: you seem to think that someone intentionally removed support for it |
| 09:04.52 | thiago_home | wm4: and that they did so to spite you |
| 09:05.08 | wm4 | thiago_home: well, _why_ did they remove it? |
| 09:05.17 | thiago_home | that's the problem here |
| 09:05.22 | thiago_home | you're assuming someone *did* remove |
| 09:05.34 | thiago_home | have you stopped to consider that no one knew that feature was there? |
| 09:05.36 | wm4 | it works with their own themes, so I don't really think it's a bug |
| 09:05.38 | thiago_home | so no one even added support for it? |
| 09:06.03 | thiago_home | you're assuming ill-intent |
| 09:06.11 | thiago_home | when usually the reason is that no one knew about this |
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| 09:06.36 | reavertm | thiago_home: I saw you did it! You can't hide the truth forever! |
| 09:07.45 | wm4 | thiago_home: maybe you could explain to me how kde retrieves the hand cursor image |
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| 09:08.18 | thiago_home | I would if I knew anything about the subject |
| 09:08.58 | reavertm | wm4: so.. what version of kde4 you're ranting about and what was the last that provided hand cursor theme (it's tricky question as you may have been using xcursor themes bundled with Xorg) |
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| 09:09.42 | wm4 | reavertm: kde 4.2.2, look at the "Rodent" cursor theme which is, I think, from xfce |
| 09:10.13 | thiago_home | and the second part of his question? |
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| 09:10.54 | wm4 | thiago_home: kde4 doesn't read various cursor symbols, like the one for links (looks like a hand) |
| 09:11.19 | thiago_home | the second part of the question was: which version last supported that? |
| 09:11.48 | wm4 | thiago_home: I don't know, cursor were always inconsistent |
| 09:11.58 | wm4 | possibly never... or in kde3 |
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| 09:12.08 | thiago_home | then it's a feature never implemented |
| 09:12.26 | pinotree | wm4: the default cursor shape - at least in debian - is provided by the system of "alternatives" |
| 09:13.18 | reavertm | and have you updated that cursor theme meanwhile? because, you know... it may have been broken there if it ever worked before |
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| 09:17.45 | wm4 | meh, and all that just for stupid cursors |
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| 09:23.41 | wekt | Does KDE4.2 have a feature to minimize all windows? (show desktop) |
| 09:23.47 | wekt | I can't find it. |
| 09:24.09 | thiago_home | yes |
| 09:24.16 | thiago_home | add the widget to your plasma |
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| 09:48.41 | wm4 | scrolling in kate is very slow |
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| 10:04.32 | Dumble | Hello world : |
| 10:04.45 | wm4 | is there any way to disable any gui animations? |
| 10:04.54 | Dumble | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:06.32 | annma | what gui animations? |
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| 10:07.40 | wm4 | annma: for example, when I move the mouse over an icon, it is highlighted over time |
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| 10:08.22 | annma | over an icon on desktop? |
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| 10:09.42 | wm4 | annma: I'm not quite sure where exactly I spotted that one, but I never want to see it again |
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| 10:10.51 | wm4 | fuck this, I'll try to downgrade to kde3 |
| 10:12.30 | annma | animations should be disabled as defaults |
| 10:12.34 | annma | distro? |
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| 10:14.04 | reavertm | wm4: try in systemsettings->desktop |
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| 10:14.31 | wm4 | reavertm: there's nothing |
| 10:14.50 | wm4 | only "screensaver" and launch notification something |
| 10:15.12 | annma | distro? |
| 10:15.25 | reavertm | I see plentry of animation settings out there :P |
| 10:15.33 | reavertm | plenty |
| 10:15.55 | wm4 | annma: debian unstable |
| 10:16.00 | wm4 | reavertm: exactly where? |
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| 10:16.50 | reavertm | [ ] Various animations, and below Animation speed [ Normal ] |
| 10:16.51 | reavertm | :P |
| 10:17.03 | reavertm | you can disable desktop effect completely as well |
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| 10:17.41 | ixM` | Hi there, I can't remember the name of the command which is used to display all the events (keyboard, mouse) in the console |
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| 10:17.59 | ixM` | does someone know which command it is ? |
| 10:18.35 | b9anders | I am using kde 4.3 dailies on arch linux. I just tried out the blackboard desktop and find that now I can't change it back. The blackboard doesn't respond to right clicks and I can't find any other way to access the desktop settings. Anyone who knows the command to raise it? |
| 10:18.44 | wm4 | reavertm: this is all I see http://upload.failnation.com/scr_1.png |
| 10:18.55 | wm4 | (and what are these black regions????) |
| 10:19.20 | reavertm | well, that's pretty much incomplete installations |
| 10:19.21 | wm4 | ixM`: xev? |
| 10:19.47 | ixM` | great |
| 10:19.48 | ixM` | thanx |
| 10:19.50 | ixM` | thanks |
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| 10:22.55 | reavertm | wm4:install all packages from kdebase-runtime and kdebase-workspace |
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| 10:24.24 | reavertm | or try some more desktop friendly distro, kde4 should be polished in debian in 2 years |
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| 10:25.08 | wm4 | are you sure this deals with those little trivial gui animations, and not with the window manager and not those opengl compiz-like effects? |
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| 10:32.22 | sacarde | hi |
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| 10:32.44 | sacarde | what is difference between : |
| 10:32.53 | sacarde | orum.kde.org |
| 10:32.56 | sacarde | and |
| 10:33.05 | sacarde | ww.kde-forum.org |
| 10:33.26 | pinotree | forum.kde.org is the officialone, while kde-forum.org is not |
| 10:33.29 | Jucato | sacarde: forum.kde.org is official |
| 10:33.33 | Jucato | what he said |
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| 10:34.18 | sacarde | ok |
| 10:34.59 | reavertm | wm4: yes, it's about window manager and compositing - if you want to disable that icon selection animation in dolphin/konqueror - then no - why would anyone want to disable it anyway |
| 10:35.21 | wm4 | reavertm: because it's annoying, unnecessary, and makes everything slower? |
| 10:35.42 | reavertm | disputable, very disputable, not at all |
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| 10:37.13 | sacarde | do you know if kde3.5 is still supported ? |
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| 10:41.57 | sunrayser | does anyone have an idea why my terminal windows (mainly konsole, but I can notice it with gnome-terminal too) take more than one second to restore from the taskbar when compiz is enabled? |
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| 10:44.13 | sunrayser | and it's slow at maximizing too |
| 10:47.45 | thiago_home | sunrayser: does it happen with kwin? |
| 10:48.11 | sunrayser | thiago_home: yes, compiz with kwin4 decorator |
| 10:48.30 | thiago_home | that's not the answer to my question |
| 10:48.37 | thiago_home | does it happen with kwin? |
| 10:48.59 | Zarin | You using radeon sunrayser? |
| 10:49.06 | sunrayser | kwin with effects enabled or disabled? (radeon fglrx) |
| 10:49.12 | thiago_home | either |
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| 10:49.17 | thiago_home | does it happen with effects on? |
| 10:49.43 | sunrayser | with no effects it's ok, but with any desktop effects the issue occurs |
| 10:49.56 | sunrayser | both comiz and kwin |
| 10:50.06 | sunrayser | I think emerald too |
| 10:50.31 | Zarin | It's a problem with the way X and drivers work. You can work around the issue by setting KWin settings to always keep window pixmaps |
| 10:50.32 | thiago_home | which KDE version? |
| 10:50.35 | Zarin | In advanced settings |
| 10:50.45 | sunrayser | 4.2.2 |
| 10:52.36 | sunrayser | Zarin: can you explain in detail where I can find that option? (now I'm in systemsettings main screen) |
| 10:52.49 | Zarin | Desktop -> advanced |
| 10:52.56 | Zarin | Second option |
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| 10:53.55 | sunrayser | Zarin: ok I set it to always. WIll it affect compiz too, or only kwin? |
| 10:54.18 | Zarin | Only KWin, Compiz doesn't have that setting |
| 10:54.18 | *** join/#kde drbobb (n=quassel@chello089077175076.chello.pl) |
| 10:54.28 | Zarin | But be warned: Other problems will happen |
| 10:54.33 | *** join/#kde macccco (n=mythtv@host110-189-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:54.34 | *** join/#kde spawn57 (n=sunil@n219078019246.netvigator.com) |
| 10:54.41 | Zarin | Such as Plasma not marking minimized windows as minimized |
| 10:54.50 | *** join/#kde Paddy_EIRE (n=Paddy@78.144.187.130) |
| 10:54.56 | macccco | i would like to launch a screensaver by hand. how do I? |
| 10:55.08 | Paddy_EIRE | hey macccco |
| 10:55.11 | *** join/#kde Ryan64 (i=ryan@h144.18.36.67.wyan.org) |
| 10:55.21 | Paddy_EIRE | lots of C's |
| 10:55.31 | macccco | hey Paddy_EIRE |
| 10:56.03 | macccco | yes, a bit too many |
| 10:56.52 | sunrayser | Zarin: well it works for kwin, thanks for the tip.. if it goes wrong, I'll switch back |
| 10:56.57 | b9anders | does anyone know the command to launch desktop settings? the dekstop isn't responding the rightclicks. |
| 10:57.55 | *** join/#kde Bruno_Kante_ (n=Bruno_Ka@ip-88-152-95-201.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 10:57.58 | Bruno_Kante_ | http://brunokante.mybrute.com |
| 10:58.00 | *** part/#kde Bruno_Kante_ (n=Bruno_Ka@ip-88-152-95-201.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 10:58.06 | Zarin | Advert |
| 10:59.07 | wm4 | now I know why I hate gui animations: it gives the impression of lagging behind |
| 10:59.21 | wm4 | instead of executing the action immediately, you have to wait until the animation is finished |
| 10:59.29 | wm4 | or at least, you seem to notice a delay |
| 10:59.38 | wm4 | even if it's not really a delay |
| 11:00.22 | wm4 | the gui is practically telling the user: "I'm on my way!", which is completely, utterly pointless if it can execute the action immediately anyway |
| 11:00.34 | wm4 | I'm not sure what retard thought gui animations would be a good idea |
| 11:00.42 | wm4 | but sure, it can look nice |
| 11:01.26 | wm4 | and it's hard to program; time wasted for anti-features instead of fixing bugs and so on |
| 11:02.02 | sunrayser | wm4: but it's a good argument against aero:D |
| 11:03.16 | wm4 | sunrayser: and the attitude to pander to Windows user is annoying too |
| 11:03.23 | wm4 | if they want windows, they should just use windows |
| 11:03.33 | wm4 | nothing will be as windows as windows |
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| 11:03.58 | Zarin | I want Windows but I'm stingy |
| 11:04.07 | sunrayser | wm4: but they're working hard on it |
| 11:04.08 | Zarin | And don't want to break any laws :) |
| 11:04.17 | Paddy_EIRE | why would you want "self imposed encumberment"? |
| 11:04.22 | wm4 | Zarin: die. |
| 11:04.40 | Paddy_EIRE | the only thing I use windows for is games |
| 11:04.49 | Paddy_EIRE | and that is slowly dying |
| 11:04.53 | jpirie23 | same here |
| 11:04.57 | *** join/#kde Moult (n=Moult@124.13.233.148) |
| 11:05.09 | Jucato | wm4: since that's not in quotes, I will have to tell you to behave, again. |
| 11:05.09 | wm4 | I think I didn't boot my windows partition for some months now |
| 11:05.23 | wm4 | Jucato: but you said quotes don't matter anyway |
| 11:05.27 | jpirie23 | I took my Windows sticker off my machine and stamped on it haha |
| 11:05.47 | Jucato | wm4: yes. in short, behave. quote or no quote |
| 11:05.49 | Paddy_EIRE | I always remove branding from just about everythin |
| 11:05.52 | wm4 | Jucato: anyway, it's clearly ironic... do you think I'd really want him die? and even if, telling him over the internet won't do |
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| 11:06.09 | sunrayser | wm4: did you see the video floating around somewhere when they showed the average user KDE4 and told them it was Vista? And they believed it :D:D |
| 11:06.37 | wm4 | sunrayser: that's... that's not really a compliment for KDE4 |
| 11:06.56 | Paddy_EIRE | it just shows how brain dead people are wm4 |
| 11:07.21 | sunrayser | wm4: but shows how much it doesn't matter what it really is if it satisfies their needs |
| 11:07.42 | Zarin | is away: Dead |
| 11:07.51 | wm4 | oh no, what did I do |
| 11:07.56 | Paddy_EIRE | lol |
| 11:08.04 | Paddy_EIRE | pinotree: are you alive mate |
| 11:08.20 | *** join/#kde quassel208 (n=quassel@ip5653aa82.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 11:08.26 | Paddy_EIRE | hmm.. I guess not |
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| 11:09.04 | Jucato | wm4: you killed him |
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| 11:10.19 | Paddy_EIRE | trying to find a property to rent is driving me insane :( |
| 11:10.56 | wm4 | the GUI animation I was complainign about is in the file open dialog: if you move the mouse over a file icon, it changes brightness over time |
| 11:11.06 | wm4 | I want to switch this off, is it possible? |
| 11:11.14 | Paddy_EIRE | wm4: on kde? |
| 11:11.19 | Moult | wm4: file open dialog? |
| 11:11.23 | Paddy_EIRE | I have not noticed this effect |
| 11:11.28 | wm4 | Paddy_EIRE: yes, kde 4.2.2, the KDE file open dialog |
| 11:11.29 | Jucato | "over time"? |
| 11:11.44 | Paddy_EIRE | wm4: no idea mate sorry |
| 11:11.45 | sunrayser | Jucato: certainly not weeks |
| 11:11.50 | wm4 | Jucato: the brightness is a function that depends from the time |
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| 11:12.15 | Moult | wm4: if i move my mouse over the folder icon yes it turns brighter...but gosh i am straining my eyes and i don't see it glowing |
| 11:12.21 | Jucato | the highlighting is almost instant for me (and note, very old nvidia card and driver) |
| 11:12.46 | Jucato | unless "over time" means "less than a second" |
| 11:13.04 | wm4 | same when I drop a folder on the "places" bar |
| 11:13.11 | wm4 | Jucato: yes, maybe 0.5 sec |
| 11:13.24 | Moult | hahaha |
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| 11:13.29 | Moult | actually yes i think you can turn this feature off |
| 11:13.30 | wm4 | I explained it above, it feels like lag, and lag is bad |
| 11:13.33 | Moult | surprisingly |
| 11:13.40 | sunrayser | what I hate is the massive lagging when scrolling in firefox with compiz |
| 11:13.46 | Moult | and, no it doesn't feel like lag at all, it's almost instant. definitlye not .5 seconsd |
| 11:13.49 | Moult | wm4: are you on nvidia? |
| 11:13.50 | Paddy_EIRE | wm4: sounds like you are on some seriously underpowered hardware.. or using bad drivers |
| 11:14.22 | wm4 | Moult: lag is noticeable even when very short (ask a gamer if in doubt) |
| 11:14.37 | Moult | wm4: my question was are you on nvidia |
| 11:14.42 | Jucato | game UI and desktop UI are not exactly similar... |
| 11:14.43 | wm4 | I use nvidia drivers, 180.44, I don't think the driver is misbehaving, I think the animation is running as intended |
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| 11:14.58 | *** part/#kde elo (n=elo@nat-n21-020.tsi.tychy.pl) |
| 11:14.58 | Paddy_EIRE | wm4: no problems here |
| 11:15.01 | seto | where is the best way to ask for a whish feature for klipper ? ( I wonder if it's possible to have some number in klipper to select the buffer with keyboard, and without doing a search) |
| 11:15.04 | Moult | wm4: have you tried applying the xorg.conf nvidia tweaks? |
| 11:15.08 | Jucato | lol! he's complaining and he's able to use the 180.xx driver? :) |
| 11:15.16 | Paddy_EIRE | hehe |
| 11:15.16 | Jucato | seto: bugs.kde.org |
| 11:15.22 | wm4 | Moult: what teaks |
| 11:15.23 | Moult | seto: maybe brainstorm too? |
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| 11:15.34 | Moult | wm4: are you still complaining since i was last here? |
| 11:15.43 | Paddy_EIRE | wm4: which distro are you using? |
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| 11:15.51 | wm4 | Paddy_EIRE: debian unstable |
| 11:15.53 | wm4 | Moult: maybe yes |
| 11:15.55 | Jucato | I'm on an NVIDIA GeForce4 MX 4000 with, take note, a 96.xx driver! |
| 11:15.56 | seto | hmm brainstorm is the place I think, thx |
| 11:16.06 | Moult | Jucato: hahaha :P |
| 11:16.26 | Moult | i'm on 185.19 - pwnage :D |
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| 11:16.45 | wm4 | is there anything wrong with 180.44? |
| 11:17.03 | Moult | wm4: yes, probably a PEBKAC issue |
| 11:17.05 | DexterF | hi |
| 11:17.16 | DexterF | is adept a kde thing or kubuntu specfifc? |
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| 11:17.28 | annma | kubuntu |
| 11:17.32 | DexterF | dang |
| 11:17.34 | wm4 | Moult: what? |
| 11:17.34 | annma | no adept here |
| 11:17.50 | DexterF | annma: what's the prefered apt thing for kde? |
| 11:17.51 | wm4 | Moult: just to inform you, 180.44 is the driver version in debian unstable |
| 11:18.02 | annma | apt thing? |
| 11:18.02 | apt | hmm... thing is that returning from sleep mode is special "reset" sequence on SA1100 process, so we certainly need bootloader support ot recognize such special reboot mode |
| 11:18.04 | Moult | wm4: ...so? |
| 11:18.05 | annma | KDE does not apt |
| 11:18.08 | sunrayser | DexterF: nothing on fedora either |
| 11:18.14 | wm4 | Moult: so? |
| 11:18.17 | annma | KDE ships tarballs DexterF |
| 11:18.34 | Moult | wm4: so i'm saying whether or not it's in debian unstable doesn't matter. |
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| 11:18.37 | annma | DexterF: KDE developers builds from svn sources |
| 11:18.48 | sunrayser | DexterF: use apt-get install :) |
| 11:18.50 | Moult | wm4: what i'm saying is try and google up nvidia kde optimisation and try some tweaks. |
| 11:18.59 | wm4 | Moult: I expect the debian maintainer to know more about which driver versions are stable and which have problems |
| 11:19.00 | DexterF | annma: no, i meant a graphcal frontend to apt in general |
| 11:19.07 | Moult | wm4: otherwise, i think there are quite a lot of problems on your end |
| 11:19.22 | wm4 | Moult: that's not the point though, the animation is working fine |
| 11:19.33 | wm4 | Moult: it's just that I don't want the animation at all |
| 11:19.35 | annma | DexterF: that's not KDE job |
| 11:19.39 | Moult | wm4: then can you explain why we all experience differently than you? |
| 11:19.50 | wm4 | Moult: that's because I hate animations |
| 11:19.51 | annma | that might be a third KDE app but not official KDE |
| 11:19.56 | wm4 | Moult: while you don't |
| 11:19.56 | annma | DexterF: ^^ |
| 11:20.02 | annma | as KDE has nothing to do with apt |
| 11:20.16 | Moult | wm4: no. it isn't we like animations and you don't |
| 11:20.24 | Moult | wm4: it's "we don't get an animation because it is instant" |
| 11:20.51 | wm4 | Moult: you mean the animation is shorter than 0.5 secs on your side? |
| 11:20.55 | DexterF | annma: well, if you wanna see it that way. same as saying kde has nothing to do with themes, X settings and whatnot, still it has config options for that. and should have. |
| 11:21.00 | Jucato | wm4: just because you hate them or don't find them necessary for an overall feel of a desktop doesn't mean they are 100% wrong. it just so happens that you are having issues with your hardware (surprisingly) |
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| 11:21.17 | annma | DexterF: KDE has no X settings |
| 11:21.34 | annma | KDE shis config stuff for things that go in KDE |
| 11:21.38 | annma | ships |
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| 11:21.42 | DexterF | annma: we simply won't be getting anywhere in the big picture when we tell users to install stuff by typing on a console. |
| 11:21.50 | annma | KDE does not allow you to configure X |
| 11:22.04 | annma | your distro gives you what you need |
| 11:22.10 | Moult | wm4: yes, the "animation" if there is any at all, is instant |
| 11:22.15 | Zarin | has the animation wm4 is explaining |
| 11:22.19 | annma | package manager should not be a KDE thing |
| 11:22.19 | Zarin | It's very smooth and nice |
| 11:22.24 | Zarin | And so extremely minor... |
| 11:22.26 | annma | what about GNOME users then |
| 11:22.31 | Zarin | Don't think there is a setting to disable it |
| 11:22.35 | annma | or XFCE or whatever |
| 11:22.39 | Moult | Zarin: what animation is this? |
| 11:22.44 | Jucato | but Zarin, it's essential to a responsive desktop!!!!!!!! |
| 11:22.46 | Jucato | ;) |
| 11:22.48 | annma | that's the big picture DexterF |
| 11:22.57 | Zarin | Moult, icon highlighting on hover |
| 11:23.05 | Zarin | It increases the brightness by like 15% or something |
| 11:23.08 | Zarin | Ever so tiny |
| 11:23.20 | Moult | Zarin: from what he has explained, he says if you hover over an icon, the icon animates into a highlight. |
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| 11:23.28 | Zarin | It does |
| 11:23.30 | Zarin | It fades |
| 11:23.36 | Moult | yes i see a highlight change |
| 11:23.41 | Zarin | ~250ms by my guess |
| 11:23.44 | Moult | but it isn't slow |
| 11:23.52 | wm4 | Moult: I never said it's slow |
| 11:23.52 | Jucato | DexterF: most distros ship with their own system admin tools anyway, making KDE's own tools unused or suck in comparison. but regarding package management, instead of just a GUI for apt, there is work being done on a KDE PackageKit app |
| 11:23.57 | Moult | is it the same highlight animation effect |
| 11:24.08 | Moult | is it the same highlight animation effect you get when you hover over the K menu icon? |
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| 11:24.34 | DexterF | annma: the big picture is a layer like for everything else that leads to different backends. one package handling app that connects to a dist-specific backend |
| 11:24.42 | Jucato | I wish there was a way I could time things to the millisecond... I'm sure it's faster than 0.5 secs :) |
| 11:24.51 | Zarin | Moult, yes by the looks |
| 11:24.52 | annma | a leyr = a distro layer |
| 11:24.55 | annma | not a KDE layer |
| 11:25.08 | annma | anyway, distros which suck do not have anything |
| 11:25.12 | DexterF | Jucato: intriguing. |
| 11:25.15 | annma | thus rely on KDE to do it all |
| 11:25.20 | Zarin | Jucato, work on KWin effects for a year or os |
| 11:25.30 | Zarin | Lots of KWin effects are 150ms, 250ms and 500ms |
| 11:25.31 | buscher_ | http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_qapdbswj4rA/SepOEZUcVvI/AAAAAAAAAvc/PIe1l6Owqp8/s1600-h/feeds11.png < what kde theme is it? |
| 11:25.35 | annma | sane distros have all tools users need to administrate their system |
| 11:25.35 | Jucato | Zarin: I'm mental. not suicidal |
| 11:25.51 | wm4 | I wonder why these animation effects were integrated at all? |
| 11:25.55 | Jucato | buscher_: bespin (ew) |
| 11:25.55 | wm4 | what's the point? |
| 11:26.01 | buscher_ | thx |
| 11:26.11 | DexterF | annma: too many cooks. one face to the user, I say. |
| 11:26.15 | Moult | wm4: and you're complaining...about a 250ms animation? |
| 11:26.27 | wm4 | Moult: like I said, it feels like lag |
| 11:26.33 | Jucato | and here I was presuming hours ago that you had ancient hardware |
| 11:26.45 | Jucato | man, your video card makes mine look like a dinosaur |
| 11:27.00 | wm4 | Moult: do you remember win 3.11? there this lag was real... now in kde4, this lag is artificial... laughable. |
| 11:27.05 | annma | it feels lag |
| 11:27.11 | annma | nice |
| 11:27.59 | Moult | wm4: animations are good for interface feedback to the user. it let's the user know what can be modified, what can be editable, what can be interacted with and what is the current focus. this fade is an example of good UI feedback. if you were complaining about wobbly windows, fine that's eyecandy and may be annoying, but what you're talkin about is extreme. i think there is an option for turning off/changing the feedback effect from a highlight to nothing ro |
| 11:27.59 | Moult | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:28.02 | Jucato | wm4 you're the first (and probably only) person to have ever complained about lag in that context... there are far more laggier parts of KDE that people have whined about. but never the hover highlight |
| 11:28.07 | wm4 | also, animations require additional programmer work and maintainance, and are slow for users of old computers and VMs |
| 11:28.23 | Jucato | that's from the view point of someone who has actually worked on this? |
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| 11:28.44 | wm4 | " i think there is an option for turning off/changing the feedback effect from a highlight to nothing " but where? |
| 11:29.29 | Moult | wm4: i think nobody but you really cares about it - i just stumbled across it long ago so i recall it exists. but now it's up to you to search for it. |
| 11:29.31 | wm4 | Jucato: yeah, maybe it's a stupid example... but I'm also asking to get rid of other animations that might exists |
| 11:29.33 | *** join/#kde buntfalke (n=nobody@unaffiliated/buntfalke) |
| 11:29.57 | Moult | wm4: found it |
| 11:29.57 | wm4 | worst I've experienced so far is Firefox |
| 11:30.11 | Moult | wm4: System Settings -> Appearance -> icons -> advanced |
| 11:30.30 | Moult | wm4: ooh, not only can you change the effect, you can turn off the animations. looks like somebody up there likes you |
| 11:31.31 | wm4 | Moult: 1. I already unchecked the "animate icons" checkboxes, 2. if you disable the "effect", the icons looks the same, even if the mouse is over the icon |
| 11:31.45 | Moult | wm4: yes...and you're point is? |
| 11:31.58 | Moult | wm4: you mean even if you uncheck the animate icons, it still animates itself? |
| 11:32.10 | wm4 | Moult: yes, it still fades over time |
| 11:32.38 | Moult | wm4: then my good sir, you have just experienced a fail. |
| 11:32.46 | Moult | wm4: :D |
| 11:33.02 | Moult | wm4: maybe change the effect something you prefer than a highlight |
| 11:33.06 | wm4 | of kde/Linux UIs in general? I'm used to this |
| 11:33.06 | Zarin | wm4, it works for me |
| 11:33.09 | Moult | wm4: otherwise, you're on your own. |
| 11:33.16 | Zarin | Change the "active" effect to "no effect" |
| 11:33.56 | wm4 | Zarin: yes, but then the icon looks the same even if the mouse is over the icon... not only the animation goes away, the highlighting itself goes away |
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| 11:34.07 | Zarin | wm4, I guess it's a bug then, report it |
| 11:34.18 | Zarin | As as far as I can see that "animate icons" checkbox is supposed to remove the fade |
| 11:34.21 | Moult | wm4: it works for me too - unchecking the animate icons makes it instant. |
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| 11:34.39 | Zarin | Hmm, maybe we need to restart the applications? |
| 11:34.55 | Moult | Zarin: perhaps, but it isn't an issue i would lose sleep over :P |
| 11:35.13 | wm4 | Zarin: no, unchecking the animation checkbox was the first thing I did when going over the KDE configuration |
| 11:35.24 | wm4 | Moult: what kde version are you using? |
| 11:35.25 | Zarin | Yeah, looks like a bug |
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| 11:36.14 | Moult | wm4: 4.2.69 |
| 11:36.24 | *** join/#kde penguin_ (n=quassel@41.214.238.74) |
| 11:36.51 | wm4 | I have 4.2.2, so that bug is probably fixed in later versions |
| 11:36.55 | wm4 | hopefully, that's it |
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| 11:47.45 | DexterF | umm. I don't have a kmenu in kde4... what applet do i need to install? |
| 11:47.59 | brot | DexterF: gentoo ? |
| 11:48.04 | DexterF | brot: kub |
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| 11:48.27 | brot | okay, because missing menu was a bug gentoo had when you used the -devel ebuilds. |
| 11:48.35 | Jucato | DexterF: Add Widgets -> Application Launcher |
| 11:48.45 | Jucato | (ask in #kubuntu if you don't have that in the list) |
| 11:49.16 | DexterF | ah, ok, its there, just has a weird icon. bug I guess. |
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| 11:49.51 | DexterF | alright, I wanted to move it to the left side. can't. how do I move stuffa round on kde4 kicker? (is it still "kicker" anyway?) |
| 11:50.17 | Jucato | "plasma". click on the cashew/plasma icon at the far right. it will take you to panel configuration mode. |
| 11:50.22 | Jucato | then you can click and move items |
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| 11:51.09 | DexterF | wonders if he likes that new behaviour |
| 11:51.44 | DexterF | wonders if anything was wrong the way kde3 handled it. |
| 11:51.48 | DexterF | mmh. no. |
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| 11:52.53 | wm4 | is it possible that KDE changed the background color of my xterm? |
| 11:53.09 | Jucato | xterm is not a KDE app, so no |
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| 11:54.04 | wm4 | Jucato: well, KDE changed the cursors for other applications too |
| 11:54.22 | wm4 | Jucato: so xterm not being a KDE application doesn't exclude the possibility completely |
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| 11:55.10 | Jucato | wm4: cursors are a user-wide setting. KDE doesn't touch xterm directly either unless you do that manually through some other means. KDE has its own terminal emulator |
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| 11:55.10 | DexterF | how can I change the color scheme of plasma items? white font on black screen = not good to my eyes |
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| 11:56.01 | Jucato | DexterF: change the Plasma theme (right-click on desktop -> Appearance Settings) or tweak individual parts of a theme in System Settings -> Advanced -> Desktop THeme Details |
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| 11:59.18 | DexterF | Jucato: hm. I seleceted "white glass" in desktop theme details but the "apply" button stayed grayed out |
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| 12:04.48 | DexterF | Jucato: worked from apperance settings. well, still, doesnt give me the grade of control I like. |
| 12:05.04 | DexterF | sigh. debian lenny then, I guess. |
| 12:06.05 | Rasi | DexterF: desktop theme is not the style |
| 12:07.03 | Rasi | if you are talking about systemsettings -> advanced -> desktop theme |
| 12:07.03 | Rasi | apply buttons and such are controlled by the kwin style (systemsettings -> appearance -> style) |
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| 12:07.14 | Rasi | the other thing is only about plasma themes |
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| 12:08.03 | wm4 | does anyone know if kate being slow is a nvidia problem? |
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| 12:09.06 | thiago_home | no, it shouldn't be |
| 12:09.15 | thiago_home | kate doesn't do OpenGL |
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| 12:10.07 | annma | wm4: file a bug report to kate and attach a sample file |
| 12:10.15 | wm4 | thiago_home: it does do a lot of text rendering, though... and rendering is really really slow (feels like 0.5 seconds to switch a file) |
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| 12:11.27 | annma | rendring in kate? |
| 12:11.35 | annma | switch? |
| 12:11.43 | annma | explain, using Kate menu items names |
| 12:11.57 | annma | I use Kate all the time so I should reproduce |
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| 12:12.52 | annma | wm4: can you explain me what you do in details and what is slow |
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| 12:13.43 | wm4 | annma: I'm doing nothing specific... I opened two relatively small files (with syntax highlighting enabled), and switched between the two opened documents by clicking into the document side bar |
| 12:14.37 | annma | I do that all the time |
| 12:14.43 | annma | so what is slow? |
| 12:14.49 | annma | can you screencast it? |
| 12:15.00 | bowhuntr | I am running sidux with kde 4.2.2, in the appearance settings I have no button to fetch new wallpapers from kde-look.org |
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| 12:15.24 | seria-mau | which irc client for kde 4 do you recommend? |
| 12:15.27 | wm4 | annma: screencast? and what's slow is switching between the two documents... scrolling in a document is also slow |
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| 12:15.59 | bowhuntr | Everybody else that I have talked to that upgraded to kde 4.2.2 has that button, even my laptop has it when I upgraded it. |
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| 12:16.22 | annma | switching is slow? |
| 12:16.29 | annma | wm4: explain what you mean |
| 12:16.42 | annma | I click on a new doc in the document bar and it displays |
| 12:16.57 | annma | what's happening for you? |
| 12:17.03 | annma | screencast = video of it |
| 12:17.13 | wm4 | it displays, after, say, 500 milliseconds |
| 12:17.17 | annma | so we can "see" your slowness |
| 12:17.25 | annma | 500 milliseconds |
| 12:17.36 | annma | video it so I can see that |
| 12:17.57 | seria-mau | in "present windows"-mode some windows are rendered darker sometimes. how can i disable that? i darken inactive windows and in combination this is rather irritating |
| 12:17.57 | annma | for me it is as instantaneous as I can "see" it |
| 12:18.05 | annma | wm4: ^^ |
| 12:18.19 | wm4 | annma: you can see nothing in these 500 ms, just the old document is being displayed |
| 12:18.32 | annma | but I would see your click on the new doc |
| 12:18.42 | annma | and I would comapre to what I have myself |
| 12:19.02 | annma | even on my old PC I don't "see" a delay |
| 12:19.13 | annma | so I am quite puzzled |
| 12:19.19 | freeedrich| | bowhuntr: maybe you need to install "knewstuff" |
| 12:19.31 | annma | just get a screencast program and video it wm4 |
| 12:19.34 | annma | it's easy |
| 12:19.46 | bowhuntr | I will check for that, I do know I can fetch new widgets but I will check |
| 12:20.39 | wm4 | annma: taking a video of it would be pointless because you can't see a mnouseclick, and the additional cpu load would change behavior anyway |
| 12:21.01 | annma | so it's not so slow that it can be showed |
| 12:21.20 | bowhuntr | freeedrich|, that's not showing in my repos |
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| 12:21.24 | annma | either only kate is slow and you can prove it and you issue a bug report |
| 12:21.25 | wm4 | oh, so you're saying a lag of 500 ms is nothing to complain about? |
| 12:21.37 | annma | I am saying you cannot show it to us |
| 12:22.05 | annma | is kwrite also slow in scrolling? |
| 12:22.19 | seria-mau | how can i tell the application launcher that it should take keyboard-focus if i start it via keyboard shortcut (alt-f1)? |
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| 12:22.53 | cb400f | seria-mau: it's a bug in 4.2.2.. it's fixed in svn.. and in some distro packages |
| 12:22.54 | Bou | hi |
| 12:22.55 | seria-mau | (without extra klicks) |
| 12:23.02 | Bou | is someone here using NetBeans under KDE? |
| 12:23.21 | Bou | i just installed it and all the fonts look ugly.. ( |
| 12:23.35 | wm4 | annma: kwrite is also slow, although it feels a bit faster |
| 12:23.36 | seria-mau | cb400f: the issue with "present window" animation or application launcher? |
| 12:23.53 | cb400f | kickoff |
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| 12:24.12 | annma | wm4: the engine is the same than kate |
| 12:24.22 | annma | file a bug to kwrite for scrolling |
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| 12:32.29 | wm4 | in the KDE file open dialog, how can I open a folder with a single click? |
| 12:32.54 | StealthCP | hi there, I'm having a spot of bother regarding the 'Effects' in KDE 4.2.2, I'm running Kubuntu 9.04 and using the latest provided fglrx driver |
| 12:34.03 | mren | hm, maybe I'm just blind but how do I disable graphical smileys in Knode? I just wanna see ";)" as-is |
| 12:35.04 | StealthCP | when effects are enabled, the desktop can go blank at any random time, sometimes it flicks up again and away quickly (I'd assume this is kwin, it's the first time I've used KDE since 3.5.50 |
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| 12:35.19 | StealthCP | s/0/) |
| 12:36.58 | stbuehler | hi! on my sys (debian sid, kde 4.2.2, fgrlx-9-4-1, kernel 2.6.29, effects disabled) some operations take >8 secs (all leaving actions, switching to dashboard); oprofile indicates that it spends its time in libpixman. is there any option which might help? |
| 12:40.40 | stbuehler | looks like it tries to convert from x8r8g8b8 to a8r8g8b8 with fbFetch_x8r8g8b8 |
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| 12:42.07 | seria-mau | is there a way to center windows in the "flip switch" animation? i always overlook small windows |
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| 12:50.43 | roman_ | are there global configuration for base and alternating colors? |
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| 12:53.50 | dfrkp | Hi folks, I have a little problem with dolphin, dolphin doesnt find installed applications and also doesnt remember which app I choose. Everytime I open a pdf I have to say open with okular.. |
| 12:54.17 | dfrkp | How can I fix that? im using gentoo linux and dolphin 4.2.2 |
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| 12:54.38 | annma | it's not dolphin probably |
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| 12:54.48 | annma | if you open a pdf in konqueror, does it do it? |
| 12:55.26 | dfrkp | eehm, i dont have konquerer installed :) im not using kde as desktop enviroment, just a few parts of it :) |
| 12:55.39 | dfrkp | so maybe there is something missing? |
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| 12:56.56 | roman_ | kde3 or kde4? |
| 12:57.04 | annma | kde4 if dolphin |
| 12:57.25 | roman_ | ah )) |
| 12:57.28 | roman_ | yep |
| 12:57.56 | annma | the file associations are set in system settings |
| 12:58.06 | annma | you need to associate pdfs with okular |
| 12:58.08 | roman_ | dfrkp: try to set this setting in systemsettings ->advanced->file assotiations |
| 12:58.20 | annma | provided you have system settings |
| 12:58.30 | dfrkp | ah ok, so i at first need to install systemsettings :) |
| 12:58.56 | annma | you need system settings to personalize your KDE |
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| 12:59.16 | dfrkp | ah ok, makes sense :) |
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| 12:59.36 | roman_ | dfrkp: what type of install do u have?? i've thought it belongs to some base package |
| 13:00.16 | dfrkp | roman_: i have only dolphin ktouch and okular |
| 13:00.25 | annma | roman_: he said he does not run KDE as a desktpo |
| 13:00.32 | annma | hey ktouch! |
| 13:00.38 | dfrkp | :) |
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| 13:01.12 | roman_ | dfrkp: ok.. try krusader instead of dolphin ;) |
| 13:01.59 | dfrkp | at the moment im doing daily backup after that i will install systemsettings and hope that it helps, thank you so far :) |
| 13:02.32 | dfrkp | roman_: for something like that i use mc ;) |
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| 13:03.10 | dfrkp | but on the screensht krusader looks nice too :) hmm i will try it =) |
| 13:03.32 | roman_ | dfrkp: mc does not have shortcut to show/hide "dot" folders )) |
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| 13:04.04 | dfrkp | right :) |
| 13:04.07 | roman_ | dfrkp: and mc is really for the person that does not have X at all )) |
| 13:04.27 | roman_ | dfrkp: i.e. very limited in functionality |
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| 13:05.00 | dfrkp | mc and zsh is my world ;) |
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| 13:05.48 | dfrkp | s/is/are/ |
| 13:06.04 | dfrkp | ;) |
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| 13:10.05 | dragy | #macedonia |
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| 13:17.54 | seria-mau | in kmail: what's the difference between imap and disconnected imap? does the later cache localy? |
| 13:18.53 | dragy | dddd |
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| 13:21.49 | wm4 | how can I switch off "soft" scrolling (when using the mouse scroll wheel) in konqueror? |
| 13:24.25 | pinotree | settings â configure konqueror â look â smooth scrolling |
| 13:25.09 | wm4 | pinotree: thanks... I didn't find this although going through the options several times |
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| 13:28.50 | seria-mau | does the google reader support in akregator actually work? i configured it but nothing happens. |
| 13:32.53 | wm4 | when you open a pdf file in konqueror, how can you hide the bar on the bottom that shows the page number? |
| 13:33.32 | pinotree | no |
| 13:34.21 | wm4 | it eats a lot of space |
| 13:34.33 | pinotree | no more than 30px vertically |
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| 13:35.39 | wm4 | for nothing |
| 13:35.47 | pinotree | ... you say |
| 13:36.19 | wm4 | all there is is the page number and the button... no reason to eat _all_ the space on the bottom |
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| 13:36.33 | pinotree | ... you say |
| 13:36.44 | wm4 | what's your point? |
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| 13:37.47 | pinotree | that you shouldn't assume that everything you see is really everything |
| 13:38.07 | wm4 | and you can even disable the scrollbar |
| 13:38.12 | wm4 | but not that thing on the bottom |
| 13:38.16 | wm4 | ridiculous |
| 13:38.31 | maccco | i would like to launch a screensaver by hand. how do I? |
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| 13:39.15 | pinotree | maccco: run its .kss executable |
| 13:39.29 | maccco | ciao pinotree |
| 13:39.32 | maccco | i did |
| 13:39.45 | ombra09 | can i answer about k3b? |
| 13:39.54 | maccco | but noway to make it show on top of plasma |
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| 13:40.07 | pinotree | try passing it the --root switch |
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| 13:40.37 | pinotree | ombra09: sure, just wait for somebody's question |
| 13:41.00 | ombra09 | k |
| 13:41.21 | maccco | pinotree: already did, runs windowed, and not on top of plasma |
| 13:41.29 | ombra09 | musicbrainz 2.1.5 doesn't work with k3b 1.0.5 |
| 13:42.02 | pinotree | no idea about interaction with plasma |
| 13:43.14 | maccco | hod do kscreensaver launch ks files? |
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| 13:47.21 | wm4 | how do I make konqueror not remember its window size? e.g. resize konqueror, then start new konqueror -> new konqueror has same size as previously resized konqueror, which is bad |
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| 13:50.36 | *** join/#kde cuco (n=diego@93-173-251-94.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 13:52.39 | *** join/#kde _julian (n=quassel@dslb-082-083-139-105.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:52.42 | _julian | hi |
| 13:52.49 | LnxSlck | h |
| 13:53.03 | _julian | is it possible to execute some script before and after powerdevil enters a standby/suspend state? |
| 13:53.28 | *** join/#kde mini-man (n=ohai@65-103-20-87.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 13:57.35 | Half-Left | wm4: Save the profiile in the state you want |
| 13:58.42 | *** join/#kde Simon_Wang (n=linfves@117.11.173.75) |
| 13:58.48 | wm4 | Half-Left: this didn't change the fact that the window size is stored... |
| 13:59.25 | Half-Left | wm4: Well tell it to save it in it's window settings then |
| 13:59.45 | *** join/#kde zir0faive (n=zir0faiv@mar92-2-82-67-214-216.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:00.13 | wm4 | Half-Left: what? how? |
| 14:01.08 | Half-Left | Configure Window behavior>Window Specific |
| 14:01.43 | *** join/#kde thehardman (n=thehardm@173-102-200-101.pools.spcsdns.net) |
| 14:02.34 | *** join/#kde buggarag1 (n=buggarag@xdsl-87-78-122-56.netcologne.de) |
| 14:03.14 | wm4 | Half-Left: I find this nowhere, is that a thing specific to when you use the kde window manager? |
| 14:03.52 | Half-Left | Yes, just right click the window boarder |
| 14:04.21 | wm4 | well, I don't use the kde window manager |
| 14:04.41 | Half-Left | Thats not our problem :) |
| 14:05.03 | *** join/#kde root (n=root@117.192.102.147) |
| 14:05.30 | wm4 | KDE software only is supported when running under the kde window manager? |
| 14:05.34 | Half-Left | Ask support for the window manager you're using |
| 14:05.43 | wm4 | eh, there are standards |
| 14:05.52 | seria-mau | is it possible to configure the weather applets in a way that they can be used for german cities? |
| 14:05.57 | Half-Left | We only support KDE software here |
| 14:05.58 | wm4 | and I'm sure it isn't my window manager who remembers the window size |
| 14:06.08 | wm4 | Half-Left: Xorg isn't kde software |
| 14:06.15 | wm4 | Half-Left: Linux isn't KDE software |
| 14:06.27 | devilsadvocate | wm4, windows sizes are window managers responsibility |
| 14:06.35 | wm4 | devilsadvocate: not really |
| 14:06.45 | Half-Left | And which we don't answer those sorts of questions |
| 14:06.50 | Jucato | wm4: that's why we don't answer questions related to those you mentioned. we ask them to ask in related channels |
| 14:07.12 | Jucato | what do you think window managers do? just display pretty borders? :) |
| 14:07.33 | wm4 | devilsadvocate: you see, it's the KDE app that requests a larger size... my window manager _does_ _not_ remember the sizes of various applications and restores the window size if that app is started again, it's an application thing, and the application is a kde program |
| 14:07.53 | *** join/#kde kmk67 (n=koen@dhcp-077-250-161-174.chello.nl) |
| 14:08.04 | annma | what window manager do you use? |
| 14:08.09 | wm4 | icewm |
| 14:08.29 | annma | again, file a bug report if you have a bug |
| 14:08.42 | wm4 | not sure if this is a bug or feature |
| 14:09.07 | annma | if it makes you complain then it's a bug |
| 14:09.15 | *** join/#kde Dario_Andres (n=Dario_An@host209.201-253-169.telecom.net.ar) |
| 14:10.04 | wm4 | kde is a bug? |
| 14:10.28 | Half-Left | icewm is perfect? |
| 14:10.37 | annma | if you don't like KDE you have other things |
| 14:10.49 | annma | just switch to something else and to another channel |
| 14:10.55 | annma | in the same process |
| 14:11.05 | Moult | gosh |
| 14:11.10 | Moult | wm4 is still talking? |
| 14:11.17 | wm4 | no, I'll just revert to kde3 later |
| 14:11.17 | annma | kde is maybe not for you |
| 14:11.21 | annma | yup |
| 14:11.30 | annma | kde3 is ok then? |
| 14:11.34 | wm4 | where kde was still _useful_ |
| 14:11.37 | annma | good to know |
| 14:11.43 | annma | sure |
| 14:12.00 | Moult | wm4: if you have complaints, start a thread in the kde forum with a detailed explanation of what you find bad, why you find it bad, and practical solutions on how it can be improved. dont' spam this channel with your negativity. |
| 14:12.00 | thehardman | wm4, your real name isnt linus is it? |
| 14:12.02 | pinotree | notes konq in kde3 remembers the window size as well |
| 14:12.20 | *** join/#kde buggarage (n=buggarag@xdsl-87-78-122-56.netcologne.de) |
| 14:12.29 | Moult | thehardman: :P |
| 14:12.30 | Half-Left | Yes, we like useless software here, go to #kde-useful |
| 14:12.36 | wm4 | pinotree: the behaviour was a bit different in kde3 |
| 14:12.37 | *** join/#kde clif4d (n=clif4d@ip-26-233.bnaa.dk) |
| 14:12.41 | pinotree | wm4: no |
| 14:12.49 | *** join/#kde Raylz (n=quassel@193.170.53.51) |
| 14:12.56 | thehardman | hehe |
| 14:13.03 | bowhuntr | Does the kde run a little slow when it comes to sending an activation email to be allowed to post on the forums? |
| 14:13.09 | wm4 | pinotree: yes it was |
| 14:13.16 | Moult | Half-Left: :( i believed it was channel almost. |
| 14:13.58 | Half-Left | muuhaha |
| 14:14.09 | Moult | doodoodoodoodoo |
| 14:14.16 | *** join/#kde cappy (n=cappy@4623.uMa.HeT.oT.telnet.bg) |
| 14:14.21 | Moult | wm4: please, go write a forum post |
| 14:14.36 | Moult | goes off to write an essay, seeya guys! don't let wm4 get you down! |
| 14:14.39 | cappy | hey, kstartupconfig doesn't work on kde 3.5.10 ? |
| 14:14.44 | wm4 | Moult: I prefer IRC |
| 14:15.47 | *** join/#kde Moufinure (n=pg@80.185.136.84) |
| 14:15.47 | bowhuntr | Does anyone here have anything to do with the forums? |
| 14:15.56 | Half-Left | Well Sarcastic comments are called for in this instance :p |
| 14:16.09 | pinotree | bowhuntr: try in #kde-forum for forums-related issues |
| 14:16.17 | bowhuntr | Ok, thanks |
| 14:16.30 | seria-mau | there are kde forums? :) |
| 14:16.44 | seria-mau | or do you mean mailinglists |
| 14:16.50 | Half-Left | Yep, a forum |
| 14:18.01 | pinotree | points seria-mau to the topic |
| 14:18.18 | wm4 | oh, and about kde3 being actual useful, while kde4 is not: usefulness = benefit - required_work |
| 14:18.54 | pinotree | love to the generic statement |
| 14:19.41 | Half-Left | I guess gnome must be beyond useless then going by that statement :p |
| 14:20.06 | *** join/#kde Kbyte (n=kvirc@host-84-221-31-157.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 14:20.09 | seria-mau | i think kde 4.2.2 then has usefulness > 0 for me... |
| 14:20.19 | Half-Left | thinks gnome is not useless |
| 14:20.43 | bowhuntr | Does anyone have a problem with the new wallpaper button in appearance settings not being there? |
| 14:21.06 | Half-Left | Nope |
| 14:21.14 | harry_ | in kde 3, Konquerer had a graphical filesize viewer button, I had see that this has been removed in kde4 and is now it's own application, anyone know it's name? |
| 14:21.33 | annma | bowhuntr: Get New Wallpapers... button |
| 14:21.48 | seria-mau | there are annoying things like plasma, dolphin and konqueror, but kile and kmail outweigh that |
| 14:21.48 | bowhuntr | My problem is the button isn't there for me |
| 14:22.00 | seria-mau | ...and okular is great, too |
| 14:22.10 | annma | bowhuntr: ask your distro channel then |
| 14:22.25 | annma | maybe you forgot something |
| 14:22.47 | bowhuntr | Well, they seem to have no idea either and I have searched the repo but can't find anything |
| 14:22.50 | Half-Left | yer, yer, urhm, kdegames is much better as well :p |
| 14:23.13 | annma | bowhuntr: distro? |
| 14:23.17 | bowhuntr | sidux |
| 14:23.28 | annma | no idea what this is |
| 14:23.34 | *** join/#kde draugdel (n=draugdel@91-115-76-29.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 14:23.40 | annma | do other users have this button? what KDE version? |
| 14:23.42 | seria-mau | Half-Left: well, i don't judge desktop environments by their games :) |
| 14:24.01 | seria-mau | annotations in okular is a real killer feature |
| 14:24.03 | seto | annma: sidux = debian sid + some other package to help to configure |
| 14:24.05 | Half-Left | seria-mau: Flawed thinking :) |
| 14:24.19 | annma | do other users have this button? what KDE version? bowhuntr |
| 14:24.27 | bowhuntr | 4.2.2 and my laptop has the button running the exact same thing |
| 14:24.37 | bowhuntr | And others have it as well |
| 14:24.42 | annma | bowhuntr: is this a new user? |
| 14:24.59 | annma | or did you upgrade and maybe some config file is stalled |
| 14:25.00 | seria-mau | bowhuntr: what wallpaper button? |
| 14:25.10 | bowhuntr | I upgraded |
| 14:25.18 | annma | Get New Wallpapers... |
| 14:25.30 | tuxick | i still have the nonworking alt-f1 thing |
| 14:25.31 | Dario_Andres | is "KDE Classic" a widget style on KDE3 ? |
| 14:25.33 | tuxick | any clues? |
| 14:25.35 | annma | bowhuntr: I suggest you set up a brand new user on the laptop |
| 14:25.38 | tuxick | it's getting a bit annoying |
| 14:25.45 | seria-mau | it's only there here if i set Type to "picture" |
| 14:25.53 | pinotree | Dario_Andres: where? |
| 14:26.14 | annma | seria-mau: really? I have it for Slideshow here |
| 14:26.38 | Dario_Andres | pinotree: bug 190073 ... I tell the user to change the widget style and he states that he selected "KDE Classic" |
| 14:26.48 | seria-mau | annma: yep, i am positive. |
| 14:26.52 | annma | for everything except "color" |
| 14:26.53 | Dario_Andres | I don't remember it being a widget style but a Icon theme .. or may be a kwin deco |
| 14:27.04 | annma | it changed then |
| 14:27.07 | tuxick | http://mail.kde.org/pipermail/unassigned-bugs/2008-December/005061.html |
| 14:27.10 | tuxick | nice posting :) |
| 14:27.22 | seria-mau | annma: only for "picture" |
| 14:28.23 | seria-mau | tuxick: lol :) |
| 14:28.43 | Half-Left | hehe |
| 14:28.45 | annma | seria-mau: I am running trunk so as I said, it changed |
| 14:29.18 | SSJ_GZ | tuxick: Good grief :) |
| 14:29.21 | *** join/#kde thrashold (n=europan@3mhz.net) |
| 14:29.21 | tuxick | seria-mau: sadly i have to agree with the guy |
| 14:29.28 | tuxick | it's )*$)(*%^ annoying and still no solution |
| 14:29.38 | thrashold | Is there any way to speed up KDE 4.2 editors (Kate, KWrite) to make them at least usable? |
| 14:29.39 | seria-mau | annma: since i am not running trunk: could you check if the online reader feature in akregator works with google reader for you? it does nothing here (4.2.2) |
| 14:29.45 | Half-Left | Keyboard shortcust are basics eh?, well KDE will never be desktop worthy to the average job without that would it :p |
| 14:29.54 | Half-Left | joe* |
| 14:30.03 | annma | I don't have akregator built |
| 14:30.30 | annma | people posting insults or slang do not realize the internet is public |
| 14:31.00 | seria-mau | Half-Left: i wouldn't bother using a DE without that basic shortcuts, too. but maybe i am not an "average joe" ^^ |
| 14:31.12 | tuxick | and the status is NOT 'resolved' |
| 14:31.22 | Half-Left | Yer, you're not because they wouldn't use shortcuts |
| 14:31.40 | tuxick | well i do |
| 14:31.42 | tuxick | even on windows |
| 14:31.51 | seria-mau | so that's supposed to be "advancde stuff"? power user, anyone? :) |
| 14:31.52 | tuxick | in fact windows handles that remarkably well |
| 14:32.09 | *** join/#kde BentJ (n=bent@95.209.235.24.bredband.3.dk) |
| 14:32.12 | Half-Left | Most of them don't know how to use capitals without pressing Caps Lock |
| 14:32.19 | tuxick | and i've been without alt-f1 ever since i started trying kde4 |
| 14:32.27 | tuxick | so i can imagine the guy's pissed off |
| 14:32.51 | tuxick | i agree swearing is no help though |
| 14:33.22 | *** join/#kde cgoncalves (n=carlos@opensuse/member/Cgoncalves) |
| 14:33.23 | annma | and might look very wrong on a future employeer checking on this guy |
| 14:33.29 | Half-Left | All he needed to do is input the shortcut in the menu setting |
| 14:33.33 | wm4 | I LOVE CAPS LOCK |
| 14:33.45 | tuxick | "Zero Bugs found" my food |
| 14:33.49 | annma | you might but we don't |
| 14:33.53 | tuxick | Half-Left: where? |
| 14:34.00 | Half-Left | "Application Launcher Settings" |
| 14:34.02 | tuxick | and why is it broken in the first place? |
| 14:34.22 | tuxick | i mean disabled, whatever |
| 14:34.27 | Jucato | tuxick: because keyboard shortcuts to activate Plasma items was only *added* (not broken) lately |
| 14:34.40 | tuxick | aaah *there* it's hidden |
| 14:34.42 | Jucato | s/lately/recently |
| 14:34.55 | tuxick | and silly me searching under "keyboard shortcuts" |
| 14:35.24 | Half-Left | Well plasma has shortcuts on their widgets |
| 14:35.32 | *** join/#kde aga (n=aga@chello089074120252.chello.pl) |
| 14:35.42 | tuxick | plasma is a separate list under global shortcuts |
| 14:35.52 | tuxick | well hardly a list, but still |
| 14:36.04 | Half-Left | If people had bothered to know that then maybe they wouldn't be such moaners |
| 14:36.23 | tuxick | well it's basic functionality |
| 14:36.34 | tuxick | so i think it's normal to expect this to simply work |
| 14:36.44 | Half-Left | ON one hand they want to customize their DE, yet don't bother to look |
| 14:36.52 | tuxick | i did look |
| 14:37.00 | tuxick | under keyboard shortcuts |
| 14:37.01 | Half-Left | I'm not talking about you |
| 14:37.04 | *** join/#kde vesuv (n=igor@p5DDF98FE.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:37.09 | vesuv | hi there guys |
| 14:37.19 | Half-Left | But the fact is, it IS there |
| 14:37.29 | tuxick | true, so it's not 'broken' per se |
| 14:37.40 | tuxick | you mean it's somewhere :) |
| 14:37.40 | Half-Left | And not broken, just a different way |
| 14:37.52 | vesuv | i'm in dire need of a bandwith shaper. but something with a gui, not trickle ,) |
| 14:38.11 | tuxick | maybe adding it in the system settings dialogs avoid confusion |
| 14:38.48 | *** join/#kde Jean (n=jean@93-36-229-49.ip62.fastwebnet.it) |
| 14:39.14 | Half-Left | Well I'm not sure, because as it is you have to wade through all the keyboard shorts |
| 14:39.16 | tuxick | heh, "application launcher settings Ctrl-S" |
| 14:39.36 | tuxick | guess what doesn't do a thing :) |
| 14:40.09 | Half-Left | Works fine here, I mapped it to Alt, F1 |
| 14:40.18 | vesuv | no tips, hu? |
| 14:40.33 | Jucato | vesuv: try searching in kde-apps.org. I know KDE doesn't ship with one |
| 14:40.45 | vesuv | thx |
| 14:40.48 | vesuv | will do |
| 14:41.46 | *** join/#kde soa2ii (n=soa2ii@i59F55E55.versanet.de) |
| 14:42.02 | tuxick | Half-Left: i mean the ctrl-s is not responding |
| 14:42.12 | seria-mau | Half-Left: maybe this guy is handicapped/disabled in a way that he relies on keyboard shortcuts. now mandriva(?) comes along and updates his kde3 to kde 4.1 and suddenly he even can't reach systemsettings because there's no way to open it in the first place |
| 14:42.13 | tuxick | i added this clue to that bug thread though |
| 14:42.38 | tuxick | or what if cat stole his mouse! |
| 14:42.51 | annma | was the bug a KDE one? |
| 14:43.00 | annma | I did not follow it all |
| 14:43.02 | *** join/#kde CyrilleB (n=cyrille@wahe.diwi.org) |
| 14:43.05 | Half-Left | seria-mau: I don't think so some how |
| 14:43.09 | tuxick | annma: that was going to be my next question |
| 14:43.19 | tuxick | is it up to packager to enable alt-f1? |
| 14:43.22 | tuxick | and if so, how? |
| 14:43.32 | annma | nop |
| 14:43.40 | annma | the packager packages |
| 14:43.50 | tuxick | well distributor, whatever |
| 14:43.54 | annma | <tuxick> i added this clue to that bug thread though |
| 14:44.03 | Jucato | wait... a handicapped person is able to do Alt+F1 but can't move a mouse and click? (note that you have to press *and* hold Alt for it to work...) |
| 14:44.03 | annma | I asked if it was a KDE bug thread |
| 14:44.08 | Half-Left | tuxick: Alt, S works here to |
| 14:44.14 | tuxick | annma: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=178909 |
| 14:44.22 | tuxick | Half-Left: it says "Ctrl-S" |
| 14:44.23 | annma | tuxick: so, yes |
| 14:44.34 | tuxick | sorry, yes what? |
| 14:44.45 | Half-Left | Ctrl,S works as well |
| 14:45.29 | Half-Left | I think his distro remapped it or broken it |
| 14:45.32 | *** part/#kde thrashold (n=europan@3mhz.net) |
| 14:45.32 | tuxick | i meant to ask annma what yes :) |
| 14:45.35 | annma | tuxick: open a new bug report as the f one was closed |
| 14:45.46 | tuxick | annma: means i can't add comment? |
| 14:45.56 | annma | means it's useless |
| 14:46.06 | tuxick | it was just for people running into this report |
| 14:46.10 | annma | well people like when it is useless in this channel* |
| 14:46.12 | tuxick | it's nice to find a solution there |
| 14:46.16 | tuxick | instead of a deadend |
| 14:46.48 | tuxick | if it's a dist issue, it's up to distributor anyway |
| 14:47.03 | tuxick | so i suppose there's no point opening a new one |
| 14:47.21 | tuxick | anyway, case closed! |
| 14:47.43 | tuxick | which reminds me, i was busy rebuilding my work system |
| 14:47.50 | tuxick | "kwin crashed too often" etc |
| 14:48.14 | tuxick | gentoo fun :) |
| 14:49.56 | tuxick | annma: would it make sense to ask to put this thing under the system settings "keyboard shortcuts" as well? |
| 14:50.04 | *** join/#kde brot (n=quassel@vs248136.vserver.de) |
| 14:50.06 | tuxick | this seems the logical place to look |
| 14:50.25 | *** join/#kde wasynyt (n=timo@a82-197-12-244.mpynet.fi) |
| 14:50.47 | annma | if you think so, file a new wish bug report |
| 14:50.55 | Half-Left | ok, so how about all the widget shortcuts? |
| 14:51.12 | Half-Left | Every widget has a shortcut remember |
| 14:51.24 | tuxick | well it thought maybe there's a solid reasoning behind this |
| 14:51.41 | tuxick | hmm, somehow i broke my ctrltab now ;p |
| 14:52.06 | Half-Left | To me a makes sense you should put it's shortcut in it's own configuration setting(which is just a click away) |
| 14:52.50 | tuxick | well i mean there too |
| 14:52.59 | tuxick | won't hurt |
| 14:53.05 | Half-Left | So how will every widget add it? |
| 14:53.15 | tuxick | it's centralized anyway, no? |
| 14:53.17 | tuxick | i mean the config |
| 14:53.35 | tuxick | i just find it a bit odd not to find it under system settings |
| 14:53.55 | Half-Left | Not really because plasma is not centralized anyway |
| 14:54.18 | tuxick | ok |
| 14:54.33 | tuxick | user perspective will differ of course |
| 14:54.51 | tuxick | for me plasma is matter so hot electrons leave orbit |
| 14:54.58 | tuxick | not a shortcut |
| 14:55.04 | Half-Left | Centralizes is ok but it depends how you're applying it |
| 14:55.39 | tuxick | that's technical/implemtation |
| 14:55.42 | tuxick | i'm talking user pov |
| 14:56.08 | Half-Left | Plasma is not like your other desktops so you have to think different |
| 14:56.48 | Half-Left | Thats like saying you should have a systemsettings setting for widgets |
| 14:56.53 | *** join/#kde ihad (n=quassel@dslc-082-082-174-078.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:58.53 | tuxick | i see your point |
| 14:59.02 | tuxick | but even those i'd expect to find there yes :) |
| 14:59.10 | tuxick | i'm still talking user perspective! |
| 14:59.30 | Half-Left | Well yes because they automatically think that based on KDE3 |
| 14:59.36 | tuxick | or windows |
| 14:59.37 | tuxick | or mac |
| 14:59.39 | tuxick | or anything |
| 15:00.01 | tuxick | well all those DE's of course have preferences dialogs |
| 15:00.13 | tuxick | some hide those under "edit" though ;p |
| 15:00.26 | Half-Left | Like I said, plasma is unlike anything in Windows or OS X |
| 15:00.40 | tuxick | time for a chance!! |
| 15:00.42 | tuxick | change too |
| 15:00.52 | Half-Left | So you have to think different :) |
| 15:00.59 | tuxick | yeah, suppose so |
| 15:01.18 | *** join/#kde NSaibot (n=quassel@dslb-092-075-208-229.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:01.48 | tuxick | btw, many many moon ago i've done some kde/qt programming, afair it was possible to define app menu etc in a small xml file |
| 15:01.56 | tuxick | what was the name of that approach? |
| 15:02.13 | tuxick | it seems to have been dropped from kde |
| 15:02.22 | Half-Left | People who think different get ridiculed all the time |
| 15:02.27 | tuxick | hehe |
| 15:02.27 | annma | KXmlGUIWindow |
| 15:03.30 | tuxick | cheers, that looks like what i meant ye |
| 15:04.17 | *** join/#kde caotic (n=caotic@189.183.26.100) |
| 15:04.22 | ajavid | hey annma! |
| 15:04.50 | annma | hi! |
| 15:04.52 | ajavid | annma, how are you doing |
| 15:04.53 | ajavid | its me stoned |
| 15:05.05 | ajavid | or Nyle |
| 15:05.07 | annma | lol OK I was wondering! |
| 15:05.11 | ajavid | hehe |
| 15:05.12 | Half-Left | I would go as far as to say, plasma should have it's on configuration centralized |
| 15:05.15 | annma | I'm OK thanks, and you? |
| 15:05.27 | ajavid | I moved back to louisiana, living with parents and going to grade school |
| 15:05.31 | ajavid | im having fun |
| 15:05.36 | ajavid | I left nyc |
| 15:05.43 | ajavid | and I also started using kde4 fulltime |
| 15:05.52 | ajavid | I was gonna wait until 2010, but I can't |
| 15:05.55 | Half-Left | own* |
| 15:06.20 | ajavid | its not that bad anymore, it is still lacking a bit of config options here n there but its ok |
| 15:06.26 | *** join/#kde sabocat (n=sabocat@c-76-22-75-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 15:06.32 | ajavid | thats probably going to come with time or something |
| 15:06.43 | ajavid | I love the new structure of the entire suite |
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| 15:07.48 | ajavid | annma, I'm also very stoned right now |
| 15:07.54 | annma | lol |
| 15:07.58 | annma | nice |
| 15:07.59 | Half-Left | Well in ways it's more configurable than KDE3 is |
| 15:08.05 | Half-Left | :p |
| 15:08.19 | ajavid | annma, uhm... GRAD school |
| 15:08.20 | *** part/#kde CyrilleB (n=cyrille@wahe.diwi.org) |
| 15:08.29 | ajavid | not grade school, lol, I probably sounded like a kid |
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| 15:08.45 | TheLorax | when I download a theme off kde-look.org how do I install it? |
| 15:09.10 | Half-Left | what theme type? |
| 15:09.10 | ajavid | instructions should be there, usually you just go to the settings, install new theme and pick one locally no? |
| 15:09.22 | ajavid | for whatever it is |
| 15:09.30 | ajavid | like mouse theme, or window decoration or style or color |
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| 15:10.09 | TheLorax | this one http://kde-look.org/content/show.php/QtCurve+(KDE4%2C+KDE3%2C+%26+Gtk2+Theme)?content=40492 |
| 15:10.45 | TheLorax | I'm messing around in system settings but I don't see any "import theme" button |
| 15:10.52 | Half-Left | Compile it or get a package |
| 15:10.55 | TheLorax | only for icons and mouse buttons |
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| 15:11.23 | ajavid | yeh its not made yet |
| 15:11.51 | seria-mau | Jucato: sticky keys |
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| 15:11.57 | ajavid | unpack it, move into its unpacked dir |
| 15:12.06 | ajavid | mkdir build, move into biuld |
| 15:12.48 | ajavid | make, checkinstall -D, andswer stuff, and get .deb packages (unless you're on non-deb based) |
| 15:13.51 | ajavid | kdelibs4-dev <- you will need this package |
| 15:14.02 | TheLorax | sounds pretty complicated |
| 15:14.13 | ajavid | its not |
| 15:14.17 | ajavid | trivial really |
| 15:15.19 | ajavid | http://filebin.ca/hfrkxo/qtcurve-kde3_0.62.7-0_i386.deb |
| 15:15.44 | TheLorax | cool. thanks |
| 15:15.46 | ajavid | it may or maynot work, you can try it |
| 15:15.47 | TheLorax | but I'm on kde4 |
| 15:15.53 | ajavid | doesn't matter |
| 15:16.06 | ajavid | it was built on kde3 but will work on 4 |
| 15:17.01 | ajavid | I don'tlike qtcurve anyway |
| 15:17.03 | ajavid | ugly |
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| 15:18.56 | ajavid | I wonder if my cam will work |
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| 15:25.47 | Klaus_Dieter | hello world |
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| 15:27.03 | Klaus_Dieter | I am wondering about the "Show todo/fixme tasks in the document structure view" feature of kile. How is this feature configurable? I am using the todonotes package and want to change the string for matching those tasks from % TODO to \todo |
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| 15:27.18 | Klaus_Dieter | so that I can navigate between my todo boxes in the document using the kile infrastructure |
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| 15:32.20 | mini-man | um, I'm using KDE 4.3 trunk, and everytime I try to open desktop settings plasma completely locks up |
| 15:32.36 | mini-man | I tried removing the plasma* rc's in ~/.kde4/share/config, and restarting plasma-desktop, but to no avail |
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| 15:32.57 | annma | mini-man: you built yourself? or using a distro? |
| 15:33.12 | mini-man | annma: using a distro |
| 15:33.23 | annma | mini-man: did you ask them about it then? |
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| 15:33.27 | mini-man | annma: yes |
| 15:33.29 | mini-man | "\ |
| 15:33.30 | mini-man | :\ |
| 15:33.40 | annma | try a brand new user then |
| 15:34.00 | annma | I guess you kept your KDEHOME and something is stalled |
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| 15:36.18 | sabayonuser | hola |
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| 15:37.46 | alsadi | hi, are panels in kde plasma widgets ? |
| 15:38.06 | sabayonuser_ | speak spanish? |
| 15:38.07 | annma | they are containments |
| 15:38.14 | annma | alsadi: ^^ |
| 15:38.35 | mini-man | Ok, tried a new user, same effect, and FWIW, running it in the terminal I get the same message everytime desktop settings is clicked |
| 15:38.37 | mini-man | KDirWatch: "/usr/share/wallpapers/Air" is a directory. Use addDir! |
| 15:38.42 | mini-man | repeat for every wallpaper in /usr/share/wallpapers |
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| 15:40.13 | annma | mini-man: your install is messed |
| 15:40.25 | mini-man | ._. |
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| 15:40.50 | alsadi | annma: I want to know how things are stacked in it http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=190084 |
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| 15:42.06 | annma | there's no kicker in plasma |
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| 15:42.45 | annma | -reverse is wrong? |
| 15:43.04 | alsadi | annma: yes, the developer in the pointer bug thought it's solved when it wasn't |
| 15:43.25 | alsadi | pointed* |
| 15:43.34 | annma | this report is confusing |
| 15:43.51 | annma | why don't you say what should happen and what's happening |
| 15:44.05 | annma | what language do you use? |
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| 15:44.14 | alsadi | "works fine in trunk running either plasma -reverse or plasmoidviewer -reverse." < comment #2 2008-06-28 |
| 15:44.20 | annma | please |
| 15:44.23 | annma | stay focus |
| 15:44.35 | annma | we're looking at your bug report |
| 15:44.36 | alsadi | ok, |
| 15:44.45 | annma | so what language? |
| 15:45.06 | alsadi | any RTL language, Arabic Persian, Hebrew ..etc. |
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| 15:45.32 | alsadi | ok, let me give you some details |
| 15:45.34 | annma | so when you switch to such a language |
| 15:45.40 | annma | what should happen? |
| 15:46.00 | alsadi | ok, in rtl locales things should be stacked from left to right |
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| 15:46.08 | ponto_ | Has kmail lost the ability to sort by the date of receiving a mail? |
| 15:46.11 | alsadi | from right to left I mean |
| 15:46.54 | alsadi | annma: kde developer used to emulate that with -reverse to make sure things work fine |
| 15:46.59 | alsadi | and that used to be OK |
| 15:47.05 | annma | WAIT |
| 15:47.20 | annma | <alsadi> ok, in rtl locales things should be stacked from right to left |
| 15:47.27 | alsadi | yes |
| 15:47.30 | annma | what does thatmean for the panel? |
| 15:47.34 | alsadi | yes |
| 15:47.37 | alsadi | every thing |
| 15:47.38 | annma | ? |
| 15:47.41 | annma | please |
| 15:47.45 | annma | be precise |
| 15:48.59 | alsadi | icons in quick launch, tasks in tasks menu, icons in desktop, k menu should be on right, systray goes to left |
| 15:49.08 | alsadi | in short the desktop should be mirrored |
| 15:49.18 | annma | all the desktop? |
| 15:49.35 | annma | so what happens currently? can you make a screenshot? |
| 15:49.57 | alsadi | wait the problem is more deeper than that |
| 15:50.37 | annma | please start with visual |
| 15:50.53 | alsadi | once a friend of mine reported a bug which was solved yesterday but the developer though he solved it sometime before 2008-06-28 |
| 15:51.06 | alsadi | http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=165100 |
| 15:51.13 | annma | you're too confused to be efficient |
| 15:51.24 | annma | we were talking about the panel |
| 15:51.37 | alsadi | yes, yes, but the problem is not just the panel |
| 15:51.40 | annma | you are unable to give precise facts |
| 15:51.48 | annma | start with the panel |
| 15:51.56 | annma | how is it currently |
| 15:52.19 | messerting__ | I've got a network printer that has duplex set as default. However, when I print from an kde app, duplex is not activated. Where can I set the printer defaults? |
| 15:52.41 | alsadi | the panel currently is stacked from left to right even in RTL locales |
| 15:52.49 | annma | so it's all wrong* |
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| 15:52.52 | alsadi | yes |
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| 15:52.58 | alsadi | but the problem is deeper than that |
| 15:53.00 | annma | nothing is correct at all |
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| 15:53.18 | annma | so where is it deeper? |
| 15:53.57 | alsadi | http://www.linuxac.org/forum/linuxac2/thread21197.html#post195720 < notice the 10 links and in 9 in #16 all are links to rtl bugs |
| 15:54.31 | alsadi | my guess is that the kde developers took rtl in consideration but they get wrong emulation by -reverse |
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| 15:55.01 | WarriorSlayer | ppl how can i change the color opacity and range of the shadows in my kwin? |
| 15:55.10 | annma | your guess is not interesting |
| 15:55.19 | *** join/#kde swalko (n=swalko@gw100-111.imafex.sk) |
| 15:55.21 | annma | what is interesting is what is wrong |
| 15:55.26 | annma | a list of what is wrong |
| 15:55.26 | Zarin | WarriorSlayer, system settings -> desktop -> all effects -> shadow |
| 15:55.37 | annma | the rest is up to the devels, which I am part of |
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| 15:55.52 | alsadi | annma: I'm looking into tasksmenu.cpp and I notice that the developers do have code to handle rtl cases |
| 15:55.57 | WarriorSlayer | Zarin, ty dude :] |
| 15:55.58 | Zarin | WarriorSlayer, The blue glow in Oxygen is not customizable yet though, only the other shadows |
| 15:56.09 | annma | alsadi: either you look in the code and propose patches |
| 15:56.15 | annma | or you make a list of what is wrong |
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| 15:56.42 | ponto_ | has kmail been forked early in the kde 4 development, or why did it loose some features compared to kde 3.5? |
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| 15:59.52 | annma | ponto_: what features? |
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| 16:00.05 | ponto_ | annma: like sorting by date of arrival. |
| 16:00.17 | annma | it can do that |
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| 16:00.32 | annma | the four icons on the right |
| 16:00.37 | annma | look at them |
| 16:00.53 | ponto_ | annma: or removing messages of threads did not disturb the sorting. |
| 16:01.08 | annma | ? |
| 16:01.10 | ziomatto | hello, got a problem with kde4 apps and printing and cups. The kde app print always to pdf file and cups doesn't understand that. GTK apps print fine. Any solution ? |
| 16:01.29 | ponto_ | annma: I checked the icons. I do not see how to get the desired sorting again. |
| 16:01.45 | alsadi | annma: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=190084#c1 |
| 16:02.22 | alsadi | I have added a screenshot and some details |
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| 16:02.41 | ponto_ | annma: if you sort by date. and you remove from a thread the first message. the rest of the thread is moved to another position. |
| 16:03.06 | annma | ponto_: it is moved to the date of the message |
| 16:03.15 | annma | logically |
| 16:03.37 | annma | if you have a thread with 3 days and you remove day1 messages then it is moved to day2 |
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| 16:03.59 | annma | alsadi: elaborate to other problems now |
| 16:04.22 | annma | you said it is deeper |
| 16:04.34 | ponto_ | annma: in kde 3.5 this was not done. and it was better because one did not have the jumps while working through a list of unread mails. |
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| 16:04.58 | alsadi | ok, in my friends bug the developer though he fixed some time before 2008-06-28 |
| 16:05.12 | alsadi | annma: but it was fixed just yesterday |
| 16:05.23 | annma | ponto_: if this does not suit you, issue a bug report: explain what happens in what settings and what you would expect |
| 16:05.25 | annma | be precise |
| 16:05.27 | alsadi | his though was based on his use of -reverse |
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| 16:05.34 | alsadi | thought* |
| 16:05.36 | ponto_ | annma: i'll do. |
| 16:06.30 | alsadi | when I used it, I got an emulation that it was solved when it wasn't |
| 16:06.32 | annma | alsadi: what is this screenshot? |
| 16:06.41 | annma | is it default KDE??? |
| 16:07.37 | annma | is quite lost here |
| 16:07.37 | alsadi | it's "LC_ALL=ar_JO.UTF-8 plasmoidviewer tasks" |
| 16:07.37 | annma | ??? |
| 16:07.47 | annma | you talk about the panel in the bug report |
| 16:08.17 | alsadi | sorry, what screenshot ? < annma: alsadi: what is this screenshot? |
| 16:08.25 | annma | how do you want to be taken seriously if you are so confused |
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| 16:08.34 | annma | teh one you attached in your bug report |
| 16:08.52 | annma | http://bugsfiles.kde.org/attachment.cgi?id=32930 |
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| 16:09.15 | annma | can anyone tell me if this screenshot represents wrong doing in rtl language for the panel |
| 16:09.16 | alsadi | I though we passed that subject when you said "elaborate to other problems now, you said it is deeper" |
| 16:10.11 | annma | any other arabic users here? or other rtl languages? |
| 16:10.23 | harry_ | in kde 3, Konquerer had a graphical filesize viewer button, in kde4 is now it's own application, anyone know it's name? |
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| 16:11.09 | alsadi | anyway, "plasmoidviewer tasks" can be used when you want to preview without the need to logoff and login with different locale |
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| 16:11.27 | annma | and tasks is the panel? |
| 16:12.16 | alsadi | annma: the bug is titled "Bug 190084 â rtl problem in plasma's tasks widget" |
| 16:12.30 | annma | what is tasks widget? |
| 16:12.51 | alsadi | task bar, tasks menu, |
| 16:12.59 | annma | task manager |
| 16:13.09 | annma | but the task manager is not the panel |
| 16:13.16 | annma | you taled about K menu |
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| 16:14.18 | annma | it's all confusing and thus developers at first have to waste time to make sense of it all |
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| 16:14.40 | alsadi | yes, that's the problem I did not report on bugzilla and I'm her to know how to report it, and I knew (thanks to you) against which to report it you said it's the containments/panel |
| 16:14.50 | alsadi | here* |
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| 16:15.14 | annma | so first rename the bug report to panel and not only tasks |
| 16:15.27 | annma | second make a screenshot of default KDE panel in rtl |
| 16:15.28 | alsadi | no it's not rename, it's a different bug |
| 16:15.30 | annma | DEFAULT |
| 16:15.35 | annma | part of it |
| 16:15.54 | annma | task manager is a subset of panel |
| 16:17.14 | alsadi | thanks, I need to logoff now |
| 16:17.19 | alsadi | BRB |
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| 16:18.37 | ponto_ | annma: is this ok. or should i add more infos? https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=190092 |
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| 16:19.49 | annma | as long as I did not leave the directory. |
| 16:19.53 | annma | I don't get that |
| 16:21.28 | ponto_ | annma: ups. should be the folder. |
| 16:22.07 | ponto_ | annma: leaving the folder and reentering gave the correct ordering again. |
| 16:22.24 | annma | where isthis alsadi guy |
| 16:22.43 | annma | so it's a temporary bug ponto_ |
| 16:23.04 | annma | I mean that it shoudl be easy to fix |
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| 16:23.18 | annma | where is this rtl guy |
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| 16:23.31 | annma | I switched to Arabic and my panel is all changed |
| 16:24.35 | annma | hmmm I can't save the screenshot in Arabic though ;) |
| 16:25.56 | ponto_ | annma: yes. fixing this can be easy. just preserve the item ordering as long as you do not leave the folder. new messages are just sorted in into the existing order. |
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| 16:26.49 | _julian | I am just trying to add a vertical control panel to the right side of my second screen (nvidia twinview) in kde 4.2.2, but this does not seem to work. anytime I drop it there it will just stay at the top of the screen and the configure button would move to it's bottom center |
| 16:26.54 | _julian | has anyone else seen this? |
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| 16:38.06 | annma | OK I managed to save the screenshot in Arabic |
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| 16:47.51 | AriMartti | Hi all! What is the correct way to get any window on KDE4 desktop borderless by default? |
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| 16:48.36 | AriMartti | I can modify windows using alt + mouse buttons and get window modify menu using alt + F3 and so on |
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| 16:49.04 | AriMartti | there is Advanced > No border in window modify menu |
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| 16:50.35 | Half-Left | I think it can only be done window specific from what I can see |
| 16:51.13 | Oceanwatcher | Hi - can anyone tell me how to choose what audio system/card (in lack of a better word) to use with Kopete? I am not talking about system wide settings that effect other programs, I am talking about a setting that only affects Kopete. |
| 16:51.46 | AriMartti | i want to set default behaviour to borderless windows |
| 16:51.48 | Half-Left | Oceanwatcher: KDE4? |
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| 16:52.08 | Oceanwatcher | Sorry - Kubuntu 9.04 - KDE 4.2.2 |
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| 16:52.31 | Half-Left | AriMartti: Maybe some config file, I don't see such option, do you mean ALL windows? |
| 16:52.59 | AriMartti | yes, every windows |
| 16:53.22 | Half-Left | Oceanwatcher: All kde apps use phonon, you can pick which backend phonon uses, i.e xine or gstreamer |
| 16:53.38 | AriMartti | i think i can read window's title from taskbar |
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| 16:54.21 | Half-Left | Well yes you can set it per window but I don't see a option for 'all' windows |
| 16:54.32 | Oceanwatcher | Half-Left: As I said - I am NOT looking for a general solution for the system. I am looking for a setting specifically for Kopete. I want to be able to control ONLY Kopete. |
| 16:54.46 | AriMartti | and the best thing in linux is modify windows using alt + mouse buttons |
| 16:54.52 | Half-Left | Oceanwatcher: No, you can't |
| 16:55.00 | *** join/#kde Tirili (n=opera@kel30.kel.stud.uni-goettingen.de) |
| 16:55.12 | Tirili | Hi |
| 16:56.02 | Oceanwatcher | Thank you. That has been my experience. And I wonder why it is not possible. I have several options for sound, and I want to different applications to play out of different outputs... |
| 16:56.33 | cga | hi all, is it possible (or planned to be included) to save profiles? (profile may be composed by: plasma theme + active plasmoids + color scheme + icones + mouse cursor + whatever else) |
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| 16:56.49 | Half-Left | Oceanwatcher: Why do you want that? |
| 16:56.54 | *** join/#kde gucampos (n=gucampos@201.80.10.156) |
| 16:56.59 | Tirili | Is there a way to change a contact's name in kopete? I cannot find the "rename" button. Or is it required to have a metacontact to rename it? |
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| 16:57.36 | ElTimo | Tirili: try right clicking and then going to properties |
| 16:57.54 | Tirili | Ah |
| 16:57.59 | Tirili | ;) Display name source. |
| 16:58.08 | ElTimo | there you go ;) |
| 16:58.16 | Half-Left | cga: No, but there is a theme Details setting in the systemsettings>Advanced for plasma |
| 16:58.16 | Tirili | Thank you! :D |
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| 16:58.25 | ElTimo | no problem :) |
| 16:58.26 | Tirili | I didn't see it... |
| 16:58.49 | ElTimo | eh, it happens. for the longest time i couldn't figure out how to change the plasma theme |
| 16:59.10 | Oceanwatcher | Half-Left: Because I want to play music from Amarok and VLC out of my nice speakers (sometimes), use my USB headset for Kopete if it is connected. But I do not want warning messages from Kopete to go to the nice speakers unless I am away from my PC. Then I want to switch them over so I hear it from a distance. |
| 16:59.11 | Tirili | The usual blindness. |
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| 16:59.18 | ElTimo | lol yup |
| 16:59.47 | cga | Half-Left: i see and used that but profile is something more expanded. i might brainstorm it then. thanks |
| 17:00.28 | Oceanwatcher | Half-Left - I also configure special notifications for some of my contacts and sometimes it can be ok to play through a separate output. |
| 17:00.58 | Half-Left | I see |
| 17:02.34 | Oceanwatcher | Half-Left: Take a look at Skype. It is done right. The ringing tone is loud and you would not want that in your ear through a headset. As well as you WOULD want it over some kind of loudspeaker to hear it when you are away from your desk. But the conversation needs to run on the headset. |
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| 17:03.12 | AriMartti | you have no interest about my problem? |
| 17:03.16 | ElTimo | Oceanwatcher: now all they need to get right is to not have Skype crash every time someone farts |
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| 17:03.41 | Oceanwatcher | Half-Left: So they have settings for this. Admittedly, the audio implementation in Skype is crappy, but the intention is correct :-) |
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| 17:03.51 | AriMartti | or no any idea, where I can edit some setup file or something to get truly borderless kwin :D |
| 17:04.01 | AriMartti | by default i mean |
| 17:04.12 | ElTimo | AriMartti: there's an option in systemsettings under window behavior |
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| 17:04.28 | Oceanwatcher | ElTimo: I think they need to come up with a brand new version. Or maybe I am just farting too much - lol |
| 17:04.39 | ElTimo | lol could be both |
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| 17:05.59 | ElTimo | AriMartti: go to the window-specific and add a new rule to affect Window Class * |
| 17:06.08 | ElTimo | set it to regular expression of course |
| 17:06.10 | Oceanwatcher | I am dependent on Skype. A lot of people are. And there is no way I can "go on a crusade" to change hundreds of people over to something else. So I really hope Skype will do something about it... |
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| 17:06.59 | ElTimo | Oceanwatcher: they haven't updated it since they added video support about 6 months ago. what makes you think they'll actually start caring? |
| 17:08.14 | ElTimo | is there any way to speed up window movement? |
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| 17:08.31 | Oceanwatcher | ElTimo: I don't. But I can always hope. Actually, 6 months is not that bad. If they can release a new version every 6-12 months, they are ok. At least if there are real improvements in each version... |
| 17:08.58 | ElTimo | Oceanwatcher: that's true. at least they actually SUPPORT linux |
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| 17:11.36 | Oceanwatcher | Regarding window problems: Something that is driving me up the walls is the way windows are placed when I open an application. I know I can change it per window, but I wish there was a switch I could use that could remove those "smart" windows placements. I want the size and location of a program to open exactly the way I closed it. And then be able to hold down, let's say, the ALT key to temporarily disable it if needed (as if a program |
| 17:11.36 | Oceanwatcher | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:11.44 | AriMartti | ElTimo: i tried to set from "Preferences" tab to select "No border" and Force but there is no effect for me? |
| 17:12.22 | ElTimo | AriMartti: hmm, i wasn't even entirely sure it would work, but i figured it would be worth a try. why do you want borderless windows anyway? |
| 17:13.13 | AriMartti | ElTimo: becouse i think i can read window title from taskbar and it may be one extra line for my irssi and so on |
| 17:13.37 | ElTimo | AriMartti: fair enough. are you on a netbook? |
| 17:13.58 | AriMartti | no, I have 24" tft by 1920x1200 resolution :D |
| 17:14.18 | ElTimo | AriMartti: lol then why are you worried about one more line for irssi? |
| 17:14.35 | AriMartti | i don't like titlebar anyway :) |
| 17:14.42 | AriMartti | becouse I can :P |
| 17:14.53 | ElTimo | AriMartti: that's the best reason for everything |
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| 17:15.02 | AriMartti | i know that |
| 17:15.16 | Half-Left | "because I can" is a good enough reason as any :p |
| 17:15.42 | ElTimo | if not better :P |
| 17:15.44 | AriMartti | Half-Left: it's very linux way answer |
| 17:16.14 | AriMartti | Half-Left: maybe u think i should use ratpoison anyway? |
| 17:16.46 | Half-Left | Well yes, thats why I said it |
| 17:17.25 | gucampos | I've set the Window Specific Settings for xterm to Force 80% opacity on active windows, but they're still the same =/, Settings are saved and still there after logout/login, any clues? |
| 17:17.28 | AriMartti | i've tried it and it's very good window manager but maybe i want to try kde 4 :) |
| 17:18.04 | gucampos | AriMartti RatPoison is good, but I'd sugest Awesome or XMonad if you like tiling WM's |
| 17:19.00 | AriMartti | but what's bad in kde4 if i want try it's desktop elements |
| 17:19.06 | ElTimo | i couldn't get awesome to work quite right for me. i just didnt like the lack of alt-f2 |
| 17:19.10 | AriMartti | and if kwin can be truly borderless |
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| 17:19.59 | Oceanwatcher | Anyone here know anything about the addressbook? I put my own name in to test with as many details as possible. And each time I choose it in the address book, a dialog box pops up with two e-mail addresses. And I have to click a lot of times on it to make it go away... This HAS to be a bug? |
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| 17:20.37 | gucampos | Eltimo you can use dmenu for that, it's very good indeed |
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| 17:21.02 | ElTimo | gucampos: i know that now, but now i have kde ;) |
| 17:21.22 | gucampos | ElTimo actually me too =D |
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| 17:21.47 | gucampos | I only fall back to tiling window managers at very specific tasks, when I want lots of terminals open all the time |
| 17:23.34 | AriMartti | and windows modify by dragging it with alt pressed is very awesome propery |
| 17:23.37 | AriMartti | property |
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| 17:28.03 | arthur_ | hi everybody |
| 17:28.10 | arthur_ | just installed kde-4.2.2 |
| 17:28.18 | arthur_ | from the cli |
| 17:28.32 | arthur_ | and the pb i have is that when i run /usr/bin/kdm |
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| 17:28.49 | arthur_ | even though the file's there and the permissions are right |
| 17:28.52 | arthur_ | it sats it isn't there |
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| 17:29.33 | Half-Left | Did you run it as root? |
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| 17:30.53 | fengshaun | where does the Air theme like in anonsvn? |
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| 17:31.51 | arthur_ | yes |
| 17:31.53 | Half-Left | playground |
| 17:31.56 | arthur_ | i am root |
| 17:31.57 | arthur_ | why? |
| 17:32.18 | fengshaun | Half-Left, thanks! |
| 17:32.28 | Half-Left | So what does it say when you run kdm? |
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| 17:34.14 | Scoobaspeaz | does anyone know why compositing is not working right with nvidia drivers 180.xx |
| 17:34.23 | Scoobaspeaz | it works fine with the 179 or 185 drivers but not 180 |
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| 17:35.19 | jamesd__ | Scoobaspeaz, perhaps it was a bug introduced in 180 and fixed before 185 |
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| 17:36.29 | Scoobaspeaz | well that might be the case and very well could be but I didnt know if anyone knew of this issue or had the issue themselves and found a way to make it work with the 180 drivers |
| 17:37.42 | Oceanwatcher | Hmm... The 185 drivers are not showing in my hardware settings yet... Anyone know when they will get there? |
| 17:38.23 | Oceanwatcher | I have 96, 173 and 180. |
| 17:38.56 | Half-Left | Ask your distro channel, 185's are beta |
| 17:39.12 | Oceanwatcher | Ok. Thanks. |
| 17:40.34 | Scoobaspeaz | Oceanwatcher: i got these from the #nvidia channel..its listed in the topic. However if you do not feel comfortable installing nvidia drivers then i would wait for your distro to release it |
| 17:41.40 | Oceanwatcher | I would probably be ok installing them, but will wait anyway. Trying to follow the distro as much as possible. |
| 17:41.48 | Oceanwatcher | At least for a while :-) |
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| 17:43.03 | Half-Left | The newer 180's fix opengl plasma crashes BTW |
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| 17:44.47 | Scoobaspeaz | yea i noticed that Half-Left and i was happy for that |
| 17:44.55 | LnxSlck_ | when i open kde autentication manager it's on read only mode |
| 17:45.00 | LnxSlck_ | how to put it writable |
| 17:45.02 | Scoobaspeaz | but the compositing issue was bothering me and i was glad to see that fixed in the 185 drivers |
| 17:45.06 | LnxSlck_ | so i can change settings? |
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| 17:58.10 | arthur_ | when i try to run kdm i get -bash: /usr/bin/kdm: No such file or directory |
| 17:58.19 | thiago_home | does the file exist? |
| 17:58.22 | arthur_ | yes |
| 17:58.37 | arthur_ | i'm running it as root |
| 17:58.44 | arthur_ | and the permissions are right |
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| 18:01.27 | thiago_home | ldd it |
| 18:01.31 | thiago_home | any libraries not found? |
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| 18:04.02 | arthur_ | dunno |
| 18:04.04 | seria-mau | lol |
| 18:04.17 | arthur_ | that's the only error it displays |
| 18:04.34 | seria-mau | my whole kde 4.2.2 session crashed in several steps while i was typing in kopete |
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| 18:05.01 | seria-mau | after kopete plasma went completely away - no automatic restart |
| 18:05.47 | Half-Left | You blew out your desktop, nice |
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| 18:06.17 | seria-mau | http://paste.debian.net/33946/ |
| 18:06.19 | Half-Left | Just restart it with Alt, F2 and type plasma |
| 18:06.32 | seria-mau | i tried that in the konsole, doesnt work |
| 18:06.47 | seria-mau | see paste |
| 18:06.49 | annma | backtrace? |
| 18:06.57 | annma | paste is useless |
| 18:07.02 | seria-mau | dunno |
| 18:07.07 | annma | backtrace woth debug symbols is needed |
| 18:07.23 | Half-Left | Looks like your graphics driver blew plasma out :p |
| 18:07.33 | seria-mau | wtf |
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| 18:08.38 | Half-Left | Try Turning off Desktop effects and rerun plasma |
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| 18:09.33 | seria-mau | i dont have debugging symbols for libplasma |
| 18:10.25 | seria-mau | i cant turn off desktop effects because i cant start systemsettings |
| 18:10.39 | seria-mau | same strange dbus error |
| 18:11.32 | seria-mau | that's just annoying |
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| 18:12.06 | seria-mau | brb. killing xserver and trying to login again |
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| 18:13.33 | seria-mau | lol |
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| 18:13.38 | seria-mau | can't start kdm too |
| 18:14.02 | seria-mau | looks like some keyboard error |
| 18:14.12 | seria-mau | ... problem with the keymap |
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| 18:14.37 | seria-mau | i set a keymap in systemsettings today, but that was a few hours ago |
| 18:15.29 | tonz | hi folks, i'm using opensuse 11.1 and kde 4.2.2 from their buildservice. my problem is: i can't change the kdm theme it is simply ignored. any suggestions? |
| 18:15.48 | seria-mau | gdm works just fine, so it's not a hardware or xorg failur |
| 18:16.00 | seria-mau | how can i reset the keyboard settings for kde? |
| 18:16.14 | seria-mau | which file in ~/.kde do i have to delete? |
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| 18:17.18 | thiago_home | soething with kxkb I guess |
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| 18:19.02 | seria-mau | doesn't change a thing |
| 18:19.04 | seria-mau | *sigh* |
| 18:19.08 | seria-mau | i dont have time for this |
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| 18:32.19 | D_Traka | http://www.myspace.com/tetrapakbeats |
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| 18:42.31 | vahnx | is ftp.kde.org down right now? |
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| 18:43.16 | vahnx | i'm trying to install kde 3.5 via konstructor but it's hanging on "Connecting to ftp.kde.org|131.220.16.1|:21..." |
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| 18:43.55 | thiago_home | it's not responding |
| 18:45.01 | vahnx | oh well, ill continue my kde 3.5 source download and ill attempt to compile |
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| 19:06.20 | nille_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:06.30 | gucampos | Phonon won't let'me play two different sounds at the same time with the default config, must I use pulseaudio for that? |
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| 19:14.11 | blq | hi |
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| 19:14.58 | blq | hi |
| 19:15.08 | gucampos | hi |
| 19:15.11 | nille_ | blq hi |
| 19:16.54 | blq | I did set opengl to "fallback" (for kwin) ... kwin crashed.. now I am unable to get back to kde :/ |
| 19:17.07 | blq | (kde4) |
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| 19:18.15 | nille_ | you can't start kde? |
| 19:18.54 | blq | kwin crashes the whole thing |
| 19:19.27 | nille_ | and you can't restart kde at all after that? |
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| 19:20.01 | blq | I can try as often as I want kde starts and crashes immediatly and then I am back to kdm |
| 19:20.17 | blq | where are the configfiles for kwin? |
| 19:20.23 | blq | so I can fix that |
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| 19:21.33 | blq | I found it |
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| 19:50.36 | cibaer | hi, i have a question to kde4-color-settings: where can I change the "toggle"-color? (in dolphin detail-view-file-list/ akregator feeds/kopete contacts/..) |
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| 19:52.32 | insulina | does anyone knwos a svg viewer with zoom ? |
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| 19:54.54 | Half-Left | insulina: gwenview, it's the default kde4 viewer |
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| 19:58.34 | insulina | i dont have kde4 in this computer , just kde3 , it is a little instable on my distro |
| 19:58.44 | cibaer | or inkscape for opening svg |
| 19:59.37 | cibaer | nobody knows about toggle colors? |
| 19:59.44 | cibaer | perhaps its not possible? |
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| 20:00.31 | Half-Left | Inkscape is a editor, gwenview can view svg files and properly zoom them |
| 20:02.16 | cibaer | mhm, I have opened a svg in gwenview at the moment, zooming works, but then I cannot scroll |
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| 20:03.35 | Half-Left | You can if you grab the image |
| 20:03.59 | cibaer | no, does not work (gwenview/kde3) |
| 20:04.17 | cibaer | and now i have opened an svg, with which gwenview has serious problems |
| 20:04.21 | Half-Left | Don't know about version 3 but in KDE4 is works |
| 20:04.46 | Half-Left | It will, depends on the file and how it's done |
| 20:06.10 | Half-Left | You mean your svg has serious problems :p |
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| 20:07.44 | seria-mau | any ideas about my crash earlier? i can't start a single kde app. they all crash :( |
| 20:07.44 | seria-mau | even when i start them under gnome |
| 20:07.56 | Half-Left | Compiled? |
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| 20:08.11 | seria-mau | no, debian unstable packages |
| 20:08.21 | Half-Left | ^, thats a clue then |
| 20:08.31 | seria-mau | ? |
| 20:08.34 | Half-Left | Ask them about it |
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| 20:09.08 | seria-mau | they worked fine until kde crashed for no reason at all. what should i ask the packagers about? |
| 20:09.26 | Half-Left | "unstable" |
| 20:09.44 | seria-mau | you give fedora users the same hint? |
| 20:10.04 | Half-Left | Everyone who doesn't compile yes |
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| 20:11.10 | caibbor | Anyone: I have Numlock thing turned on in Peripherals section of config (kde 3.5) but at login, numlock is still always off... |
| 20:11.32 | seria-mau | i think it's one of the many bugs in kde 4 which trashed some configuration file |
| 20:11.53 | Half-Left | You have to prove it first |
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| 20:16.27 | caibbor | Anyone: I have Numlock thing turned on in Peripherals section of config (kde 3.5) but at login, numlock is still always off... |
| 20:16.29 | cibaer | I now tried gwenview/kde4, scrolling works, but this time my first svg renders wrong. however who's fault it is, inkscape will open much more svgs correctly than gwenview. |
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| 20:30.07 | lskfjlsdk | i want to change the forground/background colors of Konsole |
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| 20:32.48 | Half-Left | lskfjlsdk: Edit the profile |
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| 20:46.45 | LnxSlck | kde4 authentication manager is read only |
| 20:46.46 | LnxSlck | why? |
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| 20:47.45 | thiago_home | what authentication manager? |
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| 20:47.51 | LnxSlck | the kdm one |
| 20:48.58 | LnxSlck | system administration - authentication manager |
| 20:49.11 | LnxSlck | how can i change it's options? |
| 20:51.39 | thiago_home | you have to run that GUI as root |
| 20:51.57 | LnxSlck | how? |
| 20:51.59 | LnxSlck | wich command? |
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| 21:03.57 | lovingsuse | hello |
| 21:04.12 | lovingsuse | i would like to know if kde can do much more effects vs gnome? |
| 21:05.24 | thiago_home | which effects can gnome do? |
| 21:05.28 | *** join/#kde zippy (n=zuppy@xdslgh166.osnanet.de) |
| 21:05.33 | thiago_home | in fact, which WM are you thinking of when you say gnome? |
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| 21:06.50 | rufsketch | hey all. is there anyway to get proper window gradients working in gtk/qt apps yet? |
| 21:07.18 | lovingsuse | well all the cubes and fx stuff |
| 21:07.20 | lovingsuse | is that all kde ? |
| 21:07.28 | lovingsuse | or gnome is equal in fx ? |
| 21:07.36 | lovingsuse | to kde? |
| 21:07.42 | rufsketch | all kde |
| 21:07.45 | rufsketch | gnome needs to use compiz |
| 21:07.54 | rufsketch | for most of those effects |
| 21:07.59 | thiago_home | and since compiz isn't part of gnome, we conclude KDE can do a lot more than GNOME can |
| 21:08.10 | rufsketch | kde has them built in |
| 21:08.27 | thiago_home | rufsketch: which window gradients? |
| 21:08.29 | rufsketch | gtk apps however, still manage to look like shit in kde |
| 21:08.39 | thiago_home | rufsketch: well... gtk's problem |
| 21:08.42 | lovingsuse | i see |
| 21:08.46 | rufsketch | the top down gradient |
| 21:08.47 | lovingsuse | well very informative thanx |
| 21:09.04 | thiago_home | rufsketch: I know oxygen applies some gradients, but you'll have to be more specific |
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| 21:09.19 | rufsketch | thiago_home: i figured the kde team would have had enough by now and contributed their own code to the gtk/qt engine |
| 21:09.36 | thiago_home | rufsketch: the engine is not part of KDE |
| 21:09.38 | thiago_home | or Qt |
| 21:09.45 | thiago_home | we don't touch it, we have no idea what's in it |
| 21:09.49 | rufsketch | thiago_home: the gradient that appears from the top window border. and carries on all throughout the window. down to the bottom |
| 21:10.23 | rufsketch | thiago_home: i know it's not a part of kde. but it's extensively used by kde users. and so should be a primary concern |
| 21:12.08 | thiago_home | we can't fix all applications people use |
| 21:12.17 | thiago_home | more importantly, we suck at writing Gtk code |
| 21:12.45 | thiago_home | we have enough to do fixing KDE applications |
| 21:13.00 | thiago_home | doesn't use any non-Qt application in his daily work |
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| 21:13.14 | LnxSlck | anybody knows how to run the kdm authentication manager (kde4) as root? |
| 21:13.32 | pumphaus | log in as root and run it? |
| 21:13.52 | LnxSlck | pumphaus, other way than that? |
| 21:13.59 | pumphaus | many |
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| 21:14.06 | LnxSlck | pumphaus, if i knew the name of the application i could run it as root |
| 21:14.16 | pumphaus | how about kdm? |
| 21:14.21 | blauzahl | LnxSlck: i'm pretty sure the kdm documentation tells you how to set it up |
| 21:14.27 | LnxSlck | in kde3 it had an administration mode button |
| 21:14.40 | LnxSlck | pumphaus, it's not kdm itself, it's the configuration panel |
| 21:14.48 | pumphaus | oh you mean that |
| 21:14.52 | lovingsuse | can we use transmission with kde? |
| 21:15.10 | devilsadvocate | LnxSlck, try to run it, it should ask you for the password before opening |
| 21:15.24 | devilsadvocate | (in sudo land it does, done know about with root) |
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| 21:15.34 | pumphaus | LnxSlck: "kcmshell4 kdm" does what you want |
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| 21:16.26 | LnxSlck | pumphaus, thanks |
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| 21:22.29 | rufsketch | thiago_home: what channel do the gtk-qt engine developers use? |
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| 21:22.53 | thiago_home | I don't know any of their developers, sorry |
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| 21:25.05 | freinhard | anyone with a laptop with two batteries? battery monitor looks quite strange here. |
| 21:25.42 | p-f | I'm trying to bind alt+shift to change the keyboard layout (like on windows), but the shortcut input button won't allow me to - it expects another key. Is there a way to do it? |
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| 21:25.57 | thiago_home | p-f: no |
| 21:26.05 | thiago_home | p-f: shortcuts must always contain at least one non-modifier |
| 21:26.25 | p-f | thiago_home: darn, thanks anyways |
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| 21:50.57 | luger | Hey. I have an ATI card with properietary driver (fglrx) and KDE 4.2 and cannot get a dual screen setup to work. With the default xorg.conf from aticonfig --initial I have a cloned screen. When I do aticonfig --initial=dualhead the second screen is just black, but I can move the mouse over there (when moving off right the first screen). |
| 21:51.07 | luger | systemsettings lists only one display (default) |
| 21:51.20 | luger | amdcccle properly identifies the both screens |
| 21:51.40 | luger | Any ideas on how to configure this properly? |
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| 21:53.03 | luger | I don't know, but with the aticonfig --initial=dualhead configuration I'd think it's a kwin problem or something, as I can move the mouse over to the second screen, which is all black, but I cannot move over any windows and there's also no plasma desktop there. |
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| 21:55.48 | luger | I am a bit confused on what I should or should not try. What's the state of the art way to do a dual screen (extended desktop) with ATI (fglrx) and KDE 4.2? Xinerama, xrandr, ..? |
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| 21:56.24 | luger | Googling didn't result in anything too useful, unfortunately. It seems to be possible, but as I said, I am a bit confused on what to do |
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| 21:59.03 | drantin | anyone know if tellico uses bugs.kde.org ? |
| 21:59.34 | drantin | since tellico is on kde's svn now |
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| 22:00.28 | balance | can you tell me wich are the best effects to enable on the latest kde as i got just defualt ones now so i can get the 3 desktop cube etc etc ? |
| 22:01.44 | LnxSlck | i think you need compiz for that |
| 22:03.01 | lovingsuse | i see |
| 22:03.51 | drantin | ... |
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| 22:04.02 | drantin | kwin has effects too |
| 22:04.49 | drantin | LnxSlck: KDE4 doesn't need compiz for desktop effects... |
| 22:05.02 | LnxSlck | drantin, i was talking about the cube |
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| 22:05.20 | lovingsuse | ok from configure desktop effects what i select either then defult i got now that gives me just wobly windows wich are the coolest? |
| 22:05.26 | luger | ok, it's working now. --xinerama=on as an option to aticonfig did the trick. |
| 22:05.32 | drantin | LnxSlck: kde4 has had the cube since 4.0.1 at least |
| 22:05.59 | pinotree | 4.2 |
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| 22:06.36 | LnxSlck | drantin, just using kwin effects? |
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| 22:07.22 | drantin | LnxSlck: yes, although it may have been 4.2, as the video I'm looking at on youtube seems to have been an svn build at the time... |
| 22:07.27 | drantin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arZSxLuwv_E |
| 22:07.34 | drantin | from last July |
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| 22:10.31 | alecs1 | hi, what should I do when kaddressbook tells "there is no resource available"? |
| 22:10.46 | alecs1 | I found the answer last time on google, but this time not :) |
| 22:11.22 | Nimor | ïðèâåò íàðîä! |
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| 22:30.04 | kuaera | Is there a seekbar in DragonPlayer, or did I accidentally hide it? If I've somehow hidden it, is there some way to get it back? I've scoured the documentation to no avail. |
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| 22:35.11 | LnxSlck_ | kuaera, yes there is |
| 22:35.43 | kuaera | LnxSlck_: That's good to know. Is it a hotkey, or? |
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| 22:35.59 | LnxSlck_ | no |
| 22:36.01 | LnxSlck_ | just a bar |
| 22:36.13 | kuaera | Oh :( |
| 22:36.27 | kuaera | I've tried purging DragonPlayer, deleting its configuration... |
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| 22:38.24 | Lektron | i am running kde 4.2.2 on debian sid |
| 22:38.32 | Lektron | ~/.kde/share/apps/kabc contains the "std.vcf" file, |
| 22:38.41 | Lektron | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:38.49 | Lektron | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:39.03 | Lektron | am i doing something wrong? |
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| 23:47.59 | TheLorax | where are all the app settings stored for kde? |
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| 23:48.06 | TheLorax | I can't find .kopete or .amarok in my home folder. |
| 23:48.17 | TheLorax | or .k* for that matter |
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| 23:49.35 | pinotree | TheLorax: ~/.kde/share/config |
| 23:50.29 | TheLorax | pinotree, empty folder.... |
| 23:50.41 | pinotree | ~/.kde4/share/config then |
| 23:51.21 | TheLorax | pinotree, thanks |
| 23:51.24 | reavertm | where I could change bahaviour of KDEDIRS a bit? (to not take precedense over kde4-config) - in kdelibs somewhere i suppose? |
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| 23:54.37 | reavertm | hmm, 6 hits, could be worse.. |
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