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| 10:28.08 | *** topic/#kde is KDE Plasma 5.10 and KDE Applications 17.08 are out! See www.kde.org | http://userbase.kde.org | http://forum.kde.org | Don't flood the channel, use http://paste.kde.org | Distro related questions go in your distro channel | Offtopic in #kde-chat | State your distribution and KDE version when asking questions | Don't delete ~/.kde,~/.kde4,~/.local or ~/.config |
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| 11:11.44 | sponge | Oh, JackWinter1, I just read what you said. Thank you for clarifying this. I'm still learning. |
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| 12:10.08 | BluesKaj | Hiyas all |
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| 13:41.34 | OnkelTem | Hi all. What are Activities now in Plasma 5? Has the paradigm been changed and now I can't bind specific applications to activities? |
| 13:42.05 | OnkelTem | Honestly I've never used them before. But from what I've learned watching some old videos about introduction of Activities into KDE |
| 13:42.14 | tosky | the paradigm did not change, afaik |
| 13:42.15 | OnkelTem | I understand that they're like virtual machines |
| 13:42.23 | kishore96 | OnkelTem: you can in the window rules. |
| 13:42.56 | OnkelTem | kishore96: ok, let me check that out |
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| 13:45.30 | OnkelTem | kishore96: hm, and how they are related? |
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| 13:46.05 | kishore96 | There's a setting in the window rules by which you can force windows to be in a particular acitivity. |
| 13:46.06 | OnkelTem | What is activity after all? At least now. And do you guys use them? |
| 13:46.34 | OnkelTem | kishore96: so you mean selecting some widnows and automatically push it to some activity, correct? |
| 13:47.05 | kishore96 | Yeah. You can match windows by application, so that should let you do what you want. |
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| 13:48.38 | kishore96 | I mainly use activities for the session saving thing, so that I can free up ram when needed without having to go through the pain of closing and reopening multiple applications. |
| 13:49.29 | OnkelTem | Okay. Well, I expected something different I thought I can first bind and configure some apps to an activity, and then by one click shut all them down or launch |
| 13:50.06 | kishore96 | OnkelTem: That's what suspending activities allows you to do. |
| 13:50.30 | OnkelTem | Oh, wait. Does it relate to Desktop Session > Restore/Start new? Because I've set it to Start new |
| 13:50.40 | kishore96 | No. That's different. |
| 13:51.06 | OnkelTem | Then how to "save" activity? Isn't it enough to start some applications in an acitivy to bind them there? |
| 13:51.07 | kishore96 | I'm talking about the red button near each active activity in the activity manager. |
| 13:51.15 | OnkelTem | Erm |
| 13:51.22 | kishore96 | Press meta+Q |
| 13:51.35 | kishore96 | You should get a sidebar thingy. |
| 13:52.00 | OnkelTem | Yeah, I saw it thought didn't know I can get it by Meta-Q (used Meta-Tab popup only before) |
| 13:52.03 | OnkelTem | though* |
| 13:52.12 | OnkelTem | So the red button says Stop |
| 13:52.17 | kishore96 | Mouse over an activity, and you'll see two buttons. One lets you edit the name, icon &c, and the other 'suspends' the activity. |
| 13:52.28 | OnkelTem | Wow |
| 13:52.32 | kishore96 | Yeah. The red one. |
| 13:53.00 | kishore96 | So you can keep your applications open in an activity, and stop it when you're not using them. |
| 13:53.28 | kishore96 | Then when you need to use them again, you can just click on that activity to open all of them again. |
| 13:55.20 | BluesKaj | OnkelTem, you can make apps stick to an activity by right clicking on the the tillebar, choosing 'more actions', the choosing 'special app settings' , then 'remember on position, size and activity |
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| 13:57.36 | OnkelTem | BluesKaj, kishore96 thanks guys! |
| 13:57.47 | OnkelTem | Cool |
| 13:58.04 | BluesKaj | np |
| 13:58.29 | kishore96 | Activities are a KDE conspiracy to ensure I won't use any other DE. :P |
| 13:58.30 | OnkelTem | But.. how it is implemented after all? Barely it's about creating an isolated parent process for them right? |
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| 14:00.22 | OnkelTem | kishore96: I've switched to KDE from Gnome when they'd broken locales in 14.04. I love KDE and but have been using Awesome WM. If I knew this activity thing before I wouldn't probably try AWM :) |
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| 14:01.17 | kishore96 | It's pretty well hidden nowadays. xD |
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| 14:01.46 | OnkelTem | Basically, in I liked AWM because using one script I can configure many things. But honestly scripting trivial things seemed to me like an odd acitivity :) |
| 14:02.50 | OnkelTem | I'm going to experiment with acitvities now more. Promising thing |
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| 14:10.14 | Alloysious | Are there any Centos users here? |
| 14:12.09 | shtrb | Everyone makes mistakes in life |
| 14:12.21 | shtrb | just kidding !ask |
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| 14:12.31 | shtrb | !ask |
| 14:14.18 | Alloysious | I guess I'm curious if there was any further steps to make Plasma 5+ available |
| 14:14.44 | Alloysious | I struggled through building it a year or so ago, and there was work done to get some parts of kf5 in EPEL |
| 14:15.50 | shtrb | what plasma version are you targating ? |
| 14:15.53 | shtrb | *targeting |
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| 14:16.18 | asturm | Alloysious: I don't think it got beyond kf5 yet. and they are bound to hit the ceiling with kf-5.37 requiring qt-5.7 that is nonexistent in centos repo |
| 14:16.19 | mefistofeles | hello |
| 14:16.22 | mefistofeles | question for yakuake users |
| 14:16.32 | mefistofeles | is there a way to stop yakuke from changing focus between "splits" when using it with f12? |
| 14:16.45 | mefistofeles | everytime I activate it it changes focus of window/split |
| 14:18.01 | shtrb | asturm , isn't group "KDE plasma workspace" including Kf5 ? |
| 14:18.30 | asturm | shtrb: erm |
| 14:18.37 | asturm | in so far as you can't build plasma without kf5 |
| 14:19.25 | shtrb | ok , didn't touch centos for a while so I guess I was wrong |
| 14:20.34 | Alloysious | on my box "KDE plasma workspace" includes "kde-desktop" which resolves to kdeplasma-addons-4.10.5-5 |
| 14:20.45 | Alloysious | so, doesn't look like it |
| 14:21.04 | tosky | CentOS includes Plasma 4 |
| 14:21.22 | shtrb | in that case I was wrong |
| 14:24.31 | Alloysious | I did however just get the centos 7.4 (1708) update... and they rebased gnome all the way to 3.22 |
| 14:25.10 | Alloysious | bleeding edge i tell ya |
| 14:25.37 | asturm | gnome comes naturally for them |
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| 14:29.14 | Alloysious | hmm maybe someone will make a copr repo someday |
| 14:29.28 | shtrb | maybe , you can start :) |
| 14:30.26 | shtrb | oh my ISP loves kontact users so much (if they are with IMAP) |
| 14:31.23 | shtrb | kontact will refetch your entire IMAP box if you had been missing some messages :) |
| 14:32.10 | Alloysious | Maybe I will |
| 14:32.27 | shtrb | Example: log_imapresource: Detected inconsistency in local cache, we're missing some messages. Server: 63202 Local: 44900, log_imapresource: Refetching complete mailbox. |
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| 14:33.21 | asturm | Alloysious: that will be a rather big repository considering all the (modern) deps that are required for an up to date Qt, Frameworks and Plasma |
| 14:34.15 | Alloysious | hmm.. most of the parts are already there... kf5 is all in EPEL... wayland updates are jmliger copr... I think it should just be a bump in qt5 |
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| 14:48.45 | Alloysious | asturm: is qt5.7 req a new thing? Looking at my old logs it seems I was building 5.21 just fine with default qt5.6 |
| 14:48.56 | asturm | Alloysious: kf-5.37 as I said |
| 14:49.19 | Alloysious | eep |
| 14:49.54 | Alloysious | yes we have 5.36 available |
| 14:51.04 | Alloysious | Is there a frameworks - desktop release comparison somewhere? how do I match these two up? |
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| 14:51.43 | asturm | Alloysious: plasma tells you what it needs |
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| 14:52.04 | asturm | via cmake |
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| 14:54.43 | Alloysious | ah right - centos has the wise idea to rename cmake cmake3 |
| 14:59.00 | tosky | Alloysious: required; it's to allow the co-installation with cmake (which is 2.8.12) |
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| 15:54.27 | shtrb | Is there something that can intergrate piwall (or anything similiar) to plasma ? |
| 15:54.49 | shtrb | so I could choose it as a device in systemsettings |
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| 16:13.56 | anug | dolphin force closes if i try to delete files |
| 16:15.26 | anug | also this appeared during update |
| 16:15.28 | anug | warning: could not get file information for usr/share/locale/uk/LC_MESSAGES/plasma_applet_org.kde.plasma.printmanager.mo |
| 16:15.45 | asturm | during update |
| 16:16.14 | asturm | anug: you've update Plasma components? just restart your session? |
| 16:16.42 | anug | i've did several restarts |
| 16:17.50 | shtrb | anug , try changing the target |
| 16:17.55 | shtrb | or restart |
| 16:18.15 | anug | shtrb, what target |
| 16:18.37 | shtrb | from graphical to multi user and back |
| 16:18.47 | shtrb | *if you are using systemd |
| 16:19.02 | anug | shtrb, i dont understand |
| 16:19.24 | shtrb | in that case just try to restart the machine |
| 16:19.51 | anug | i have tried already. trying again just in case |
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| 16:23.01 | anug | problem still occurs |
| 16:23.11 | anug | but not happening in new user |
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| 16:27.38 | shtrb | anug , have you tried using the same local as the new user ? |
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| 17:12.07 | samo19048123 | Hey guys, what could prevent active screen borders from working? I have set the top left corner to to "show windows - all workspaces" (as it was from the start) but nothing happens if I move the pointer there. It worked at the beginning. (kde 5.10.5-1 on arch) |
| 17:14.34 | samo19048123 | Just noticed, it's only the "show windows - *" stuff that doesn't work. |
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| 17:22.14 | pratyush | hi! |
| 17:22.37 | pratyush | I'm having an issue with sarting emacs |
| 17:22.43 | pratyush | I get 'Undefined color: "WINDOW_FOREGROUND"' |
| 17:24.18 | pratyush | I'm on arch and plasma 5.10 |
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| 17:26.39 | pratyush | Could someone help me please? |
| 17:27.06 | baizon | with what issue |
| 17:27.08 | baizon | ? |
| 17:27.48 | pratyush | I'm having an issue with sarting emacs |
| 17:27.54 | pratyush | I get 'Undefined color: "WINDOW_FOREGROUND"' |
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| 17:29.20 | pratyush | @baizon ^ |
| 17:31.10 | baizon | pratyush: have you tried resetting the config? |
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| 17:37.32 | AiwendilH | samo19048123: Have you checked if maybe kwin compositing is turned off? I think the show window effect needs it to run...so if for some reason compositing is deisabled it might do nothing |
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| 18:00.31 | samo19048123 | AiwendilH: ok I just read I can temporarly switch effects with alt+shift+f12. after that it works. how to make that permanent? didn't find a switch in system settings and i'm almost sure i never switched it on purpose (and also never used alt+shift+f12. weird) |
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| 18:01.32 | AiwendilH | samo19048123: systemsettings -> Display and monitor -> Compositor -> Enable compositor at startup |
| 18:01.47 | AiwendilH | but that should be set by default I think |
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| 18:02.36 | AiwendilH | compositor can be turned off in other ways though I think...fullscreen applications migth disable the compositor (andn to sure what happens if one of those crashes) |
| 18:02.56 | samo19048123 | AiwendilH: isn't set, will set it now. |
| 18:03.24 | thiago | the compositor disables itself if there's a fullscreen aplication |
| 18:03.52 | samo19048123 | so it should reenable itself at least at the next login then? |
| 18:04.06 | thiago | it should enable itself once the window is no longer fullscreen |
| 18:04.13 | thiago | and definitely at the next log in, if that's what you configured it |
| 18:04.27 | AiwendilH | if that setting is set samo19048123...sorry, no clue why it wasn't set for you by default...I always assumed it's on by default |
| 18:04.41 | thiago | it is |
| 18:04.50 | thiago | but it may have turned off if the compositor ran into too many problems |
| 18:05.26 | samo19048123 | AiwendilH: i'm pretty sure it was set, as the show windows effect worked at the beginning. so it somehow got unchecked, maybe i was too clumsy. allthough i'd have had to hit "apply".... |
| 18:06.05 | samo19048123 | thiago: ok? well, i'll be back if it gets turned off again. |
| 18:06.12 | samo19048123 | thank you guys :) |
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| 18:31.59 | shtrb | how safe would it be to use kube with a real IMAP account ? |
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| 18:34.32 | Sho_ | shtrb: it's done nothing bad to mine at least |
| 18:34.42 | Sho_ | (using the develop branch |
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| 18:34.51 | Sho_ | ) |
| 18:34.51 | shtrb | I thought about the flatpak option |
| 18:35.19 | shtrb | Kontact once had a very nice bug (erased the entire box ) :) |
| 18:35.25 | Sho_ | fun |
| 18:35.58 | shtrb | does it really download the entire box locally ? |
| 18:36.44 | Sho_ | i don't know. what i can tell you is that the time-to-email was much shorter than with kmail or thunderbird. that is, i added my account, clicked a very big folder, and was getting emails listed and readable in <20 seconds |
| 18:37.05 | Sho_ | with kmail it's more like waiting two hours to sync first, and thunderbird needs like a few mins |
| 18:37.33 | Sho_ | so i was quite impressed |
| 18:37.35 | shtrb | Kmail does download your entire box (so getting your gazzilion GB box locally is an issue :) ) |
| 18:37.51 | Sho_ | (I tried it out for the first time this week) |
| 18:38.04 | shtrb | flatpak or built from source ? |
| 18:38.33 | Sho_ | source |
| 18:38.41 | shtrb | thanks |
| 18:39.02 | asturm | UI needs more polish though |
| 18:39.29 | thiago | kmail downloads if you configure it to download |
| 18:39.55 | shtrb | yes that too :) |
| 18:40.02 | asturm | and I didn't expect I would find necessary code to build in an 'examples' subdir |
| 18:40.30 | shtrb | but kmail and kontact does not seem to get much love recently |
| 18:40.58 | asturm | kontact+frieds are being hacked on like crazy |
| 18:41.02 | asturm | *friends |
| 18:41.17 | Sho_ | asturm: I didn't find necessary code to build in an examples subdir ..? |
| 18:41.25 | asturm | Sho_: I think it was sink |
| 18:42.26 | Sho_ | sink built easily without any magic here |
| 18:43.16 | shtrb | asturm , oh I have seen some nice flow in it (if you missed some emails it will refeth your entire box ) |
| 18:43.17 | Sho_ | I even stole a tiny bit of Kube code for the ongoing Konversation UI rewrite :) |
| 18:43.24 | asturm | Sho_: yeah it does. I've just had to disable the usual magic ;) |
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| 18:45.13 | asturm | shtrb: I'm not saying grave bugs are getting fixed. it just is being actively developed, more so than many other parts of applications |
| 18:45.40 | shtrb | ahh |
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| 18:49.43 | OnkelTem | Guys, why do I have to type my SSH password every time I connect to the same host? |
| 18:49.58 | OnkelTem | That is not an issue on my other computer |
| 18:50.10 | OnkelTem | I can't understand what is WRONG with this 16.04 |
| 18:50.37 | OnkelTem | It is mostly default, haven't done something weird with it, keep set of packages clean |
| 18:50.41 | OnkelTem | keeping* |
| 18:51.17 | pualj | do u have a key enabled for this host in ur ssh config file? |
| 18:51.19 | OnkelTem | ssh-agent isn't running, just check the proceses |
| 18:51.45 | OnkelTem | pualj: no, there is nothing in my config file about this specific host. |
| 18:51.56 | crazy | OnkelTem: not a issue with kde apps but with your ssh configuration(s) |
| 18:52.43 | crazy | OnkelTem: so enable that , generate your keys , setup ssh-agent or keychain etc and be done with it |
| 18:53.29 | OnkelTem | I didn't do something with it, with the configuration. It is default. I only copied keys from my other computer. And whenever I try to access the key I have to type my password |
| 18:54.02 | OnkelTem | so keys are generated, what do you mean - setup ssh-agent? Does it require some configuration? |
| 18:54.20 | tosky | well, it should be started |
| 18:54.35 | OnkelTem | I thought it should just work, out of the box, because I'm not configuring some new disto, I've just installed Kubuntu :) |
| 18:54.52 | OnkelTem | Is it my job to setup its start? I just don't get |
| 18:55.08 | OnkelTem | Why it was just working on 14.04 and now it's not? |
| 18:55.21 | crazy | ofc is your job to setup ssh-agent |
| 18:55.34 | crazy | OnkelTem: ask kubuntu folks |
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| 18:55.36 | Sho_ | maybe ask in #kubuntu something like "14.04 had ssh-agent by default and 16.04 doesn't?" |
| 18:55.41 | OnkelTem | Ok, so what is the KDE way to setup ssh-agent? |
| 18:55.49 | OnkelTem | Sho_: ok, thanks |
| 18:56.14 | tosky | the Plasma way is to add a scripts which executes your program during the startup of the session |
| 18:56.43 | tosky | so ~/.config/plasma-workspace/env/ |
| 18:56.51 | Sho_ | i think some distros wrap startkde in ssh-agent tho |
| 18:57.02 | Sho_ | maybe kubuntu used to and no longer does, and OnkelTem is struggling with this |
| 18:57.07 | Sho_ | that's why it's worth asking them |
| 18:57.53 | OnkelTem | All this is so irritating guys, when you need to configure basic functions for days and weeks! |
| 18:57.59 | OnkelTem | Which just worked before |
| 18:58.06 | OnkelTem | I don't mean KDE |
| 18:58.09 | OnkelTem | I mean distro |
| 18:58.14 | Sho_ | yeah, understandable |
| 18:59.48 | OnkelTem | What I don't get clearly for now - is the role of KWallet. I read on the Internet that it can break into ssh-agent business. Is that true? Because it doesn't seem to be its function to not keeping the password but to trigger ssh-add |
| 19:00.19 | Sho_ | the way things fit together is that ssh-agent asks for passwords, right? and it can start a gui to do so |
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| 19:00.35 | Sho_ | there's a kde gui called ksshaskpass, which will store (and retrieve from) the pw from kwallet |
| 19:00.57 | Sho_ | so what a distro could do is set up both ssh-agent and ssh-agent to use ksshaskpass and then things work |
| 19:01.01 | OnkelTem | yeah, that's what happening on my other system: even if I trigger a key from a console script I get GUI input |
| 19:01.09 | Sho_ | aye |
| 19:01.49 | OnkelTem | Okay. Let me btw check that name on the other system :) I mean ksshaskpass |
| 19:03.05 | OnkelTem | hah, not such a thinkg. But I wouldn't surprise if it start Gnome's analogue. Since I once accidently installed Gnome stuff there on my other system |
| 19:04.24 | OnkelTem | Ksshaskpass is a front-end for ssh-add which stores the password of the |
| 19:04.26 | OnkelTem | sh key in KWallet. |
| 19:05.07 | OnkelTem | Sorry, I wanted to quote it. Didn't expect it would post it (so it had a newline). So.. |
| 19:05.27 | Sho_ | Konversation handles that better |
| 19:06.24 | OnkelTem | Sho_: I'm going to marry weechat so don't try to seduce me with something else :P |
| 19:07.05 | OnkelTem | So Kssgaskpass doesn't seem to be the program I need. Because from its description it uses KWallet to keep SSH password while it should be ssh-agen |
| 19:07.14 | OnkelTem | Ksshaskpass |
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| 19:08.48 | Sho_ | OnkelTem: well the point is that it gets the pw out of kwallet and hands it ssh-agent (so you don't need to type it, just your kwallet master password, or nothing at all if the wallet is alread open) |
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| 19:09.52 | crazy | OnkelTem: you can't call *ssh* setups *basic* to start with.. there are really complicate ones need *you* to confgirue scripts and keys so trying to do that macially is plain wrong |
| 19:10.35 | crazy | OnkelTem: then you need to *know* what you want .. want use kwallet ? if so want to type your passwort ? if no install kwallet-pam etc etc |
| 19:11.37 | crazy | Sho_: yes with kwallet-pam ( assuming the distro supports it ) , keychain , ksshaskpass you have a basic setup in minutes |
| 19:14.02 | OnkelTem | "in minutes" become days if you don't know how this kitchen works |
| 19:14.34 | OnkelTem | Btw, I tried to configure to not type password using kwallet_pam but it's failed too |
| 19:15.08 | AiwendilH | If I remeber right OnkelTem is on plasma 5.6..where kwallet setup realyl was stil la bit rought with pam integration..at least for me |
| 19:15.10 | OnkelTem | I checked out my pam configs and it seemed look fine, at least for my no-expert eye |
| 19:15.54 | OnkelTem | AiwendilH: 5.5.5 here. And I tried to upgrade but found no PPA with updates. The one which was recommended just didn't bring any new things |
| 19:15.59 | crazy | OnkelTem: again please ask in #kubuntu maybe they need special stuff .. I can tell you is working just fine here |
| 19:16.07 | crazy | OnkelTem: lol 5.5.5 ? |
| 19:16.12 | OnkelTem | yep! |
| 19:16.13 | asturm | ouch |
| 19:16.54 | OnkelTem | Sorry didn't mean to make you hurt! |
| 19:17.18 | AiwendilH | nah...it's just so long ago that probably nobody here will even still remember how they did their setup ;) |
| 19:17.30 | crazy | OnkelTem: update or use some distro has something newer .. at least 5.8 which is still supported from plasma TEAM since is LTS .. for evrything < 5.8 please bug your Distro about bugs |
| 19:17.49 | OnkelTem | crazy: I see |
| 19:17.51 | OnkelTem | thank you |
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| 19:19.22 | OnkelTem | AiwendilH: just out of curiosity - what it was released (5.5.5) (approximately) |
| 19:19.37 | OnkelTem | wgen* |
| 19:19.38 | AiwendilH | ahm.... |
| 19:19.40 | OnkelTem | when* |
| 19:19.58 | AiwendilH | https://www.kde.org/announcements/plasma-5.5.0.php |
| 19:20.06 | AiwendilH | end 2015 |
| 19:20.14 | OnkelTem | :facepalm: |
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| 19:21.27 | OnkelTem | "Buy why? Because fuck you, that's why!" - a hypotetic conversation with distro maintainers |
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| 19:22.16 | OnkelTem | Ok, then I'm going to stop asking questions before I figure out a way to upgrade |
| 19:22.52 | AiwendilH | It's around hte time I switched ffrom kde4 to plasma5..and I remeber running in some problems with kwallet at the start... |
| 19:23.14 | asturm | OnkelTem: if that's ubuntu, afaik they have some backports ppa for you to restore sanity in LongTermSucking land :) |
| 19:23.14 | AiwendilH | so yeah...an updated might be helpful in your case |
| 19:24.18 | asturm | OnkelTem: it will at least provide you with a reasonably outdated release |
| 19:24.38 | crazy | asturm: lol |
| 19:25.24 | shtrb | reasonably outdated release lol |
| 19:25.44 | crazy | :) |
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| 19:32.13 | OnkelTem | asturm: what distro do you use? It that's not a secret |
| 19:32.19 | OnkelTem | If* |
| 19:32.39 | asturm | OnkelTem: Gentoo, since you asked |
| 19:32.47 | OnkelTem | ok |
| 19:37.08 | OnkelTem | Kubuntu 17.04 has Plasma 5.9 |
| 19:37.38 | OnkelTem | Seems to be fresh enough |
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| 22:01.07 | OnkelTem | Installed 17.04, apps are crashing on every other movement |
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| 22:05.18 | tosky | all applications? |
| 22:05.36 | tosky | if they crash, they should popup the dialog which allows you to report the bug |
| 22:06.00 | tosky | without the backtrace from the crash is really complicated, if not impossible, to find the issue |
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