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| 03:14.41 | Kcstephens | How do I reset the LDS account password after it gets locked out |
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| 04:00.23 | josephscott | says scgallafent is on the call |
| 04:00.52 | scgallafent | sees josephscott in Meetingplace |
| 04:01.05 | josephscott | guess what just came back on line |
| 04:05.36 | scgallafent | All is right with the world again |
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| 14:59.03 | smootar | ************************************************ |
| 14:59.03 | smootar | ***** Begin - LDSTech Meeting - 3 NOV 2011 ***** |
| 14:59.03 | smootar | ************************************************ |
| 14:59.10 | smootar | Moin bretheren... |
| 14:59.15 | smootar | Who is here? |
| 14:59.36 | scgallafent | raises hand |
| 14:59.48 | smootar | waves |
| 15:00.15 | tdeforest | waves |
| 15:00.30 | smootar | scgallafent, do you want to start? |
| 15:00.36 | scgallafent | OK |
| 15:01.00 | *** join/#ldstech TimRiker (~TimRiker@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker) |
| 15:01.00 | *** mode/#ldstech [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 15:01.12 | scgallafent | I sent emails a couple of days ago about the LDSTech service day this week. I've had one response from someone who joined LDSTech when she was in a family history calling and isn't involved in that now. |
| 15:01.15 | scgallafent | Not a good sign. |
| 15:01.46 | scgallafent | I'll keep poking, but I may not go to the stake center tomorrow since I've been alone the past couple of months. |
| 15:02.10 | scgallafent | I said in the email that I would be at the stake center if anyone was planning to attend, but haven't gotten a "yea" from anyone. |
| 15:02.11 | tdeforest | is glad i'm not alone at being alone |
| 15:02.33 | scgallafent | We can be alone together. Is that even possible? |
| 15:02.45 | smootar | :) |
| 15:03.04 | smootar | Did you ask if there was another time people wanted to meet? |
| 15:03.17 | scgallafent | Yes. |
| 15:03.20 | scgallafent | ... |
| 15:03.27 | smootar | hmmm |
| 15:03.30 | smootar | ok |
| 15:03.44 | scgallafent | I asked what people were looking for in an LDS Tech chapter, how it could benefit them, and what would work for meetings. |
| 15:04.14 | scgallafent | I'll start visiting personally with some people I know who may be interested and see what kind of input I can get. |
| 15:04.34 | tdeforest | I get the same response when I ask. I think people just have a lot going on. |
| 15:05.20 | smootar | As I have been talking with people who are interested in a Service Mission (I think it applies to other volunteers), I am asking about what they are passionate about and trying to align work with passion. |
| 15:05.27 | smootar | nods |
| 15:05.44 | scgallafent | Right now I'm trying to get people to show a little passion. |
| 15:05.54 | scgallafent | I get little bursts of excitement, but nothing beyond that yet. |
| 15:06.27 | scgallafent | At the recprop meeting last night, Steve Knudsen indicated he would like to get to the point where we have three instances running: one production instance, one staging instance, and the cdev instance. The staging instance and production instance could both run on the new server. I think the server probably has capacity for it. Have we been able to log into the new server? |
| 15:07.31 | *** join/#ldstech KFitz (~MittRomne@proxy.lds.org) |
| 15:07.39 | smootar | dlhace or TimRiker might be able to answer that one. |
| 15:07.48 | KFitz | g'day |
| 15:07.52 | smootar | KFitz, is dlhace in? |
| 15:07.58 | TimRiker | cdir came back up about 10pm last night. |
| 15:07.59 | smootar | moin KFitz. |
| 15:08.32 | TimRiker | scgallafent, there is a stage instance as well. it's been setup as a dual host for testing that. not all projects are there at present. |
| 15:08.47 | TimRiker | http://tech-stage.lds.org/ldstech/joomla/ |
| 15:09.01 | scgallafent | That makes things a little easier. :) The URI scheme was a concern I had. |
| 15:09.15 | scgallafent | We're not quite ready for it now, but at least I know the problem is easily addresses. |
| 15:09.20 | scgallafent | s/addresses/addressed/ |
| 15:09.21 | KFitz | I havent had a chance to walk the isles yet.. I got in just now |
| 15:10.07 | scgallafent | I was just getting an email ready with an item for TimRiker to test on cURL/Google Groups/certificate validation. I'll send that after the meeting. |
| 15:10.17 | TimRiker | k |
| 15:10.31 | scgallafent | Next. |
| 15:11.11 | smootar | scgallafent, I was told that our Google Groups guy has been heads down with an exchange upgrade. |
| 15:11.29 | smootar | It sounds like he may be coming up for air and we can discuss the tech.lds.org gg's. |
| 15:11.30 | *** topic/#ldstech by TimRiker -> LDSTech http://tech.lds.org/ || Public IRC Logs: http://infobot.rikers.org/%23ldstech/ || https://code.lds.org/ || CIA is in #ldstech-commits || contact TimRiker for new #ldstech-* channels || LDSTech Service Day Nov 4th 9am-9pm http://tech.lds.org/wiki/LDSTech_Service_Days |
| 15:11.33 | scgallafent | Do we just do it ourselves? |
| 15:11.44 | smootar | I don't know. |
| 15:11.53 | smootar | Let's talk with him first. |
| 15:12.01 | scgallafent | OK |
| 15:12.09 | smootar | tdeforest? |
| 15:12.18 | smootar | Thx scgallafent. |
| 15:12.39 | tdeforest | got word from chad fullmer yesterday on the philippines team |
| 15:13.28 | tdeforest | they are ready for me to engage. i've scheduled a meeting for tonight 8pm eastern time (8am friday manila) |
| 15:13.34 | tdeforest | a Skype mtg |
| 15:13.51 | tdeforest | all are welcome to join who would like :) |
| 15:13.54 | TimRiker | reverts cdev to use cdir |
| 15:14.00 | tdeforest | i'll be getting them oriented to the project |
| 15:14.55 | *** join/#ldstech scgallafent2 (~scgallafe@c-67-185-194-104.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 15:15.18 | tdeforest | i could use help sometime today from josephscott re learning to add templates to the framework. |
| 15:15.52 | smootar | looks for josephscott to poke his head in. |
| 15:16.06 | josephscott | sure |
| 15:16.11 | smootar | :) |
| 15:16.14 | tdeforest | todd will also be having me conduct interviews for the potential hires he's been talking with |
| 15:16.54 | smootar | tdeforest, I would like to chat with them as well. Can you help coordinate that? |
| 15:17.07 | tdeforest | you bet |
| 15:17.14 | smootar | Thx |
| 15:17.59 | tdeforest | that is all |
| 15:18.08 | smootar | Thx. |
| 15:18.10 | smootar | TimRiker? |
| 15:18.26 | *** mode/#ldstech [+o scgallafent] by ChanServ |
| 15:19.02 | TimRiker | not much to report for yesterday. cdir and cdev were down most of the day. I spent some time trying to track down an iOS bug. not quite identified it yet. |
| 15:19.13 | *** join/#ldstech dlhace (d831b5fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.49.181.254) |
| 15:19.30 | TimRiker | will be back on the resync tool today. should have something for jira, and then start on svnrm. |
| 15:20.44 | TimRiker | taking a long lunch today. that's all. |
| 15:21.00 | smootar | Thx TimRiker |
| 15:21.02 | smootar | KFitz? |
| 15:21.58 | smootar | dlhace? |
| 15:22.21 | KFitz | I dont have anything |
| 15:22.51 | smootar | dlhace, I was told that the staging Jira is close to being ready. |
| 15:23.11 | smootar | Small configuration change to finalize WAM for jira in Staging was all that was left. |
| 15:23.29 | dlhace | I saw a message on it, but don't have a confirmation that it is ready |
| 15:23.30 | smootar | Could you follow-up with Howard O. today? |
| 15:23.35 | KFitz | I saw that pingdom showed wam being up for cdev |
| 15:23.37 | dlhace | sure |
| 15:24.13 | KFitz | also showed that tech.lds.org had a 5 min outage last night at 6:05 |
| 15:24.31 | smootar | dlhace did you confirm that it was the VMware upgrade that caused our outage all day yesterday? |
| 15:25.27 | KFitz | I did have a question for dlhace. Didnt we purchase a hardware F5 for the CDMZ? and not a software F5 for it... |
| 15:25.29 | smootar | KFitz, my IRC bounced at about that same time. I think it was network connectivity, but not sure. |
| 15:26.02 | smootar | dlhace has two questions. |
| 15:26.14 | dlhace | No it was a software F5, that was the recommendation of the networking team |
| 15:26.58 | KFitz | do we notice, or has anyone on the network team noticed, any performance differences with software vs appliance? |
| 15:27.18 | KFitz | (just a curiosity question) |
| 15:27.27 | dlhace | I actually have liked it. The administatrive interface is much faster than the appliances. I had discussed with Joe Martin on going to their new module based F5 system |
| 15:27.44 | smootar | repeat: dlhace did you confirm that it was the VMware upgrade that caused our outage all day yesterday? |
| 15:27.58 | dlhace | But it was all going to be dependent on budget |
| 15:27.59 | KFitz | smoot, do you mean the WAM outage? |
| 15:28.08 | dlhace | yes it is configrmed |
| 15:28.18 | dlhace | they rolled back the ESX upgrade |
| 15:28.27 | smootar | It was the F5 outage in cdev. |
| 15:28.28 | dlhace | then they are going to upgrade the F5 software |
| 15:28.46 | dlhace | and then they are going to reupgrade the ESX cluster |
| 15:29.17 | smootar | Have they tested the F5 upgrade on the new ESX cluster? |
| 15:29.29 | smootar | I would prefer they try it before they do the upgrade in cdev. |
| 15:29.59 | dlhace | Joe Martin confirmed with F5 that the 10.x software was not supported on ESX 5.0 |
| 15:30.09 | smootar | nods |
| 15:31.00 | dlhace | We wanted to upgrade to 11.x anyway because of the problems we have been having with the ObSSOCookie rewrite |
| 15:31.11 | TimRiker | dlhace, and confirmed that the 11.x is supported, yes? |
| 15:31.26 | dlhace | I had asked them to upgrade us and now they have to |
| 15:31.32 | smootar | :) |
| 15:31.59 | dlhace | yes, in the same communication F5 said that 11.x was supported on ESX 5.x |
| 15:32.19 | smootar | thinks that is good. |
| 15:32.37 | smootar | not excited about another full day outage. |
| 15:32.39 | TimRiker | I'm good with the plan then. if it fails they will have to downgrade esx again. but we expect it will work. |
| 15:32.59 | smootar | Can you let us know when they are going to do that? |
| 15:33.12 | TimRiker | we don't have another test environment that I'm aware of, so we get to be the guinea pigs |
| 15:33.17 | smootar | It would be nice to coordinate rather than getting surprised. |
| 15:34.02 | smootar | We had a good meeting with lds.org calendar team yesterday. |
| 15:34.16 | smootar | It was very informative about how they had great success in testing with the community. |
| 15:34.36 | smootar | I would like to have our mobile group try the adhoc testing that they did on calendar. |
| 15:34.51 | smootar | While we are waiting for the Swarm Tester to be available. |
| 15:35.14 | smootar | KFitz, could we try the adhoc testing and pattern it after what they did for calendar? |
| 15:35.41 | KFitz | The problem is getting the information from the forums to jira |
| 15:35.42 | smootar | This doesn't replace the test case management of Swarm Tester, but would still be valuable I think. |
| 15:35.58 | smootar | agrees. |
| 15:36.20 | KFitz | they already get great feedback from Testflight emails |
| 15:36.32 | smootar | Asiel now has a service missionary helping with support questions. |
| 15:36.36 | KFitz | I'm on the TF admin group, so I see all the feedback… |
| 15:36.38 | smootar | We met this morning. |
| 15:36.50 | TimRiker | mobile team uses the google group in a similar manner. new gl for android was just released and the gg has users reporting and testing issues. |
| 15:36.53 | KFitz | We, you and the missionary, or you and asie |
| 15:37.06 | KFitz | l |
| 15:37.09 | smootar | Larry Van Every, Asiel and I met. |
| 15:37.13 | KFitz | ahh |
| 15:37.30 | smootar | Larry is in Washington State and will be using OSTicket to answer iOS support issues. |
| 15:37.38 | KFitz | cool |
| 15:37.46 | smootar | He will be working two full days each week for 2 years. |
| 15:37.52 | smootar | Tuesday and Friday. |
| 15:38.16 | smootar | He is very excited and this was his career prior to retiring and is very well versed in iPhone and iPad. |
| 15:38.18 | smootar | Has both. |
| 15:38.33 | TimRiker | stephan set up a new osticket on l5487 that we are looking at. we will likely want to do some integration with that from joomla |
| 15:38.34 | smootar | He does work at the Bishop Storehouse two days per week as well. |
| 15:39.00 | smootar | I have about 8-10 more missionaires that I will be working with. |
| 15:39.16 | smootar | We have 3 missionaries commited now. |
| 15:39.28 | smootar | All working from their home. |
| 15:39.53 | tdeforest | cool |
| 15:39.54 | smootar | I have a new guy that just became and empty nester that will probably be a project manager for Hilton. |
| 15:40.13 | smootar | He is in Texas and may be moving to Utah. |
| 15:40.27 | smootar | Anyway, there is a lot of interest. |
| 15:40.43 | smootar | Most missionaries want to thelp with QA. |
| 15:40.56 | smootar | We are 10 minutes over. |
| 15:40.58 | smootar | Sorry. |
| 15:41.11 | smootar | ************************************************ |
| 15:41.11 | smootar | ***** End - LDSTech Meeting - 3 NOV 2011 ******* |
| 15:41.11 | smootar | ************************************************ |
| 15:41.17 | smootar | Thanks everyone for joining us. |
| 15:41.23 | smootar | LDSTech Service Day tomorrow. |
| 15:41.23 | KFitz | we are only 10 mins over if 9:30 were the norm ;) |
| 15:41.34 | KFitz | since 9:45 is the norm we are right on time |
| 15:41.50 | smootar | Lee Gibbons will be coming from the COB to broadcast at 9am about lds.org. |
| 15:41.59 | smootar | KFitz, OUCH! |
| 15:42.03 | smootar | I deserve that. |
| 15:42.06 | smootar | :) |
| 15:42.22 | smootar | Invite your friends. |
| 15:42.22 | KFitz | BTW I just finished the book "unbroken" |
| 15:42.25 | KFitz | its a good one |
| 15:42.33 | smootar | author? |
| 15:42.47 | tdeforest | what does an F5 do? |
| 15:42.55 | KFitz | http://www.amazon.com/Unbroken-World-Survival-Resilience-Redemption/dp/0739319698 |
| 15:43.03 | smootar | Load balancer + |
| 15:43.54 | tdeforest | thx. what's an ESX cluster? |
| 15:43.55 | smootar | audio book? |
| 15:44.08 | smootar | VMware cluster. |
| 15:44.24 | KFitz | We also use it to manage our traffic.. IE VIPS, etc |
| 15:44.38 | KFitz | smootar I used the epub version |
| 15:44.49 | josephscott | tdeforest: next question should be why both of our F5 instances are on the same vmware cluster :-) |
| 15:44.56 | smootar | http://www.vmware.com/products/vsphere/esxi-and-esx/index.html |
| 15:45.31 | smootar | wonders the same. |
| 15:45.32 | scgallafent | josephscott: Now don't go getting all practical on us. |
| 15:45.59 | smootar | thinks it should be fixed. |
| 15:46.08 | josephscott | what, I haven't even brought up if they are running on the same vmware instance ;-) |
| 15:46.23 | tdeforest | hehe. didn't realize they were both on the same cluster. does that defeat the purpose of load balancing? |
| 15:46.24 | smootar | lol |
| 15:46.27 | josephscott | or the same server hardware, redundant power, san, etc. |
| 15:46.46 | scgallafent | tdeforest: No, but it defeats the purpose of having two instances. |
| 15:46.50 | josephscott | tdeforest: bingo :-) |
| 15:47.41 | scgallafent | At least the redundancy part of having two instances. |
| 15:48.01 | scgallafent | shouldn't try to reserve a book at the library and think at the same time |
| 15:48.04 | josephscott | cdir-dev provides some fun LDAP stats, try: curl -B ldap://cdir-dev.ldschurch.org |
| 15:48.34 | josephscott | scgallafent: what we want to test is to pull the plug on one of the F5 instances and see if everything stays up |
| 15:48.43 | josephscott | no firedrill, no confidence |
| 15:48.48 | scgallafent | Yup. |
| 15:48.52 | smootar | nods |
| 15:49.07 | josephscott | for those who don't have LDAP support in cURL, the results of that query is: http://pastebin.com/L3t1v1fy |
| 15:49.09 | smootar | Maybe dlhace can help us with that drill. |
| 15:49.55 | tdeforest | ~x en gr all greek to me |
| 15:50.17 | josephscott | I'd rather find out that it doesn't work when people are actively watching it to fix it then to find out it doesn't work when no one is around to fix it |
| 15:50.36 | scgallafent | I have a friend who used to run a data center with flywheel UPS. The flywheel UPS provided 25 seconds of backup power. Generators were supposed to come online within 14 seconds, if I remember correctly. They ran a test early on the first Sunday of every month. He said it was a white knuckle experience every time. |
| 15:51.16 | scgallafent | josephscott: Knudsen is busy this morning. |
| 15:51.36 | josephscott | 11 seconds is a pretty tight window |
| 15:51.52 | scgallafent | Yes, it is. |
| 15:52.01 | TimRiker | tdeforest, I broke that the other day. not gotten around to finding out why |
| 15:52.17 | scgallafent | The flywheels require less maintenance than the big battery systems they had, but you sure put a lot of trust in your generator startup time. |
| 15:52.30 | tdeforest | TimRiker hehe. i remember it was broken. thought i'd try anyway :) |
| 15:54.55 | smootar | ~x en gr Just testing to see if it is still broken, TimRiker fixes stuff pretty fast. :) |
| 15:55.04 | smootar | Bummer. |
| 15:55.08 | TimRiker | heh |
| 15:55.32 | smootar | :) |
| 15:55.50 | scgallafent | That would be all Greek to my sister -- and she speaks Greek. |
| 15:56.22 | tdeforest | josephscott: i'd like to add /web/stats/ to swarm. how do i do that? |
| 15:56.55 | josephscott | edit config/config.php |
| 15:57.07 | josephscott | add an entry for the $_k['routes'] array |
| 15:57.26 | josephscott | for easy reading I suggest it being in alphabetical order |
| 15:58.04 | josephscott | so it would look something like http://pastebin.com/pUscnQXt |
| 15:58.25 | josephscott | create a stats.php in /routes |
| 15:58.41 | josephscott | that does what ever work/logic/templates need to be done |
| 15:58.57 | tdeforest | cool. easypeasy |
| 15:59.12 | josephscott | yep, that is the goal :-) |
| 15:59.40 | tdeforest | this hack appreciates it ;) |
| 16:00.57 | *** join/#ldstech dhazar__ (~dhazar@proxy.lds.org) |
| 16:01.09 | macnewbold | ~josephscott++ |
| 16:01.21 | macnewbold | so does your framework thing have a name? |
| 16:01.30 | macnewbold | i see "k" around a lot, is there something behind that? |
| 16:02.45 | josephscott | code named Kib |
| 16:03.27 | KFitz | smootar do we have space for missionaries here on site? |
| 16:04.21 | KFitz | we have another local missionary available for the next 3-6 months to do QA or PHP dev work |
| 16:14.35 | smootar | We will at the end of the month when "the temporary" team leave. |
| 16:14.40 | smootar | leaves |
| 16:14.58 | smootar | Who is that? |
| 16:15.56 | smootar | KFitz, is that a missionary that you have been speakin with? |
| 16:16.44 | smootar | The desk space by the printer is also a place we can use for missionaries, but I would prefer the desks if they are available. |
| 16:31.55 | *** join/#ldstech dbkjar (~kjar@sharedserver.org) |
| 16:55.03 | TimRiker | is purging the cdev forums |
| 16:57.36 | *** join/#ldstech KathrynGZ (d831b5fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.49.181.254) |
| 17:16.34 | dlhace | I just got back from meetings. |
| 17:16.38 | dlhace | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:29.54 | KFitz | smootar its a kid in dwards ward |
| 17:30.10 | KFitz | he doesnt leave for his mission for another 4+ months |
| 17:30.42 | KFitz | and is looking for something to fill his time. he works late at night at a movie theater, but his dad doesnt want him idle during the day |
| 17:30.54 | KFitz | but doesnt want him working from home |
| 17:31.58 | *** join/#ldstech marquicus (~mrojas@200.13.124.36) |
| 17:38.13 | KathrynGZ | TimRiker, |
| 17:38.29 | KathrynGZ | Oops, hit enter accidentally. Anyway, did you see my last email? |
| 17:39.18 | TimRiker | looks |
| 17:42.54 | TimRiker | KathrynGZ, the report needs the unit name, no? so adding the stake unit number just duplicates the information that will already be there in the one mlu call to get the ward unit information. |
| 17:44.20 | TimRiker | so if MLU reports a different stake than the one listed on the order, which would we display? and if we display the one from these new fields, that means we are doing two mlu lookups per entry instead of one. so it will slow down the system, not speed it up. |
| 17:51.22 | KathrynGZ | is thinking |
| 17:51.45 | KathrynGZ | Yeah, good point. I forgot there has to be a name lookup for each number. |
| 17:52.09 | KathrynGZ | Do you think we should start storing the name? The lookup really seems to be bogging down, esp. in the field. |
| 17:52.12 | TimRiker | replied in email |
| 17:52.33 | KathrynGZ | As for which ward/stake we'd display, I'd think we'd display the original one attached to the order, even if there was a change after that. |
| 17:52.36 | TimRiker | our DSA does not allow us to store the name. we'd have to go through that again. |
| 17:53.06 | KathrynGZ | I think your response also answers my question about whether to have Hyrum just make the changes. |
| 17:53.38 | KathrynGZ | So that I don't play middle...gal, :) can I just have him contact you with questions about changes to the database? |
| 17:53.42 | TimRiker | we could cache the names in the current session to avoid multiple calls to MLU for the same unit during report generation. |
| 17:54.12 | KathrynGZ | That sounds like a good idea. |
| 17:54.14 | TimRiker | sure. I think he had copied me on that one, and I had just not gotten around to replying. sry. |
| 17:54.28 | KathrynGZ | Yes, I'm sure you had nothing else to do ;) |
| 17:54.36 | KathrynGZ | No apology needed :) |
| 17:55.02 | *** join/#ldstech josephscott (~josephsco@208.95.152.44) |
| 17:55.08 | KathrynGZ | Anyway, thanks for your time and solid advice, as usual :) |
| 17:56.03 | TimRiker | any time! =) I'm headed out for a couple hours, but I'm here most of the time. |
| 17:58.04 | KathrynGZ | Thanks! |
| 18:11.40 | smootar | scgallafent, TimRiker, just got off the phone with matt Hyer about tech.lds.org gg. |
| 18:12.03 | smootar | He told me it looks like someone has already setup this domain. |
| 18:12.07 | smootar | Have either of you done that? |
| 18:12.31 | smootar | He said that he saw our logo out there. |
| 18:13.24 | TimRiker | hmm. I don't recall doing it, but perhaps I did. |
| 18:15.54 | smootar | http://google.com/a/tech.lds.org |
| 18:16.05 | smootar | Try logging in, my credentials failed. |
| 18:16.40 | smootar | scgallafent, maybe you could try your credentials as well. |
| 18:17.02 | scgallafent | I didn't do it. I'll look at it. |
| 18:18.13 | TimRiker | hmm. didn't get in... gotta run. back in a couple hours. |
| 18:18.27 | scgallafent | My credentials don't work there. |
| 18:18.45 | smootar | OK, after he gets back form lunch I think he can help us. |
| 18:18.54 | smootar | s/form/from/ |
| 18:19.05 | scgallafent | I triggered an admin password reset request. It says that the request went to an ldschurch.org address, but that's all the detail that it gives. |
| 18:19.32 | smootar | I wonder if it went to Matt. |
| 18:19.40 | smootar | I will connect with him after lunch. |
| 18:20.23 | scgallafent | If it didn't, there is an option to gain administrative access to the domain by creating a CNAME record. Then we could look at the domain control panel to see who is listed as the secondary email address. |
| 18:22.53 | smootar | Matt just got a reset request from google. He is looking at it now. |
| 18:24.19 | scgallafent | That must mean that Matt is listed as the secondary contact. |
| 18:26.15 | smootar | I've requested that he add tim's email as an admin, he can then add the rest of us. |
| 18:26.41 | smootar | He is working on it now. |
| 18:28.45 | smootar | He was able to login using his phone. |
| 18:28.58 | smootar | He will add tim when he gets back to his desk after lunch. |
| 18:29.16 | scgallafent | OK. Do we want to have him request a cdev.lds.org account while we're at it? |
| 18:29.25 | smootar | Yes. |
| 18:29.30 | smootar | I will send him a note. |
| 19:17.47 | *** join/#ldstech dhazar__ (~dhazar@proxy.lds.org) |
| 20:11.37 | smootar | cdev.lds.org has now been created. |
| 20:11.48 | smootar | tech.lds.org is also created. |
| 20:12.10 | smootar | In the next few minutes, TimRiker should get access to the two domains as an admin. |
| 20:12.36 | smootar | TimRiker can then add scgallafent and smootar as an admin. |
| 20:13.09 | smootar | TimRiker or any admin will then need to put a page up on both domains that provide a unique ID that verifies that we own the domain. |
| 20:13.40 | smootar | There is also a request to get the API's turned on for each domain. tech.lds.org has already had that happen. cdev.lds.org does not. |
| 20:13.50 | smootar | So, that will need to happen. |
| 20:17.28 | smootar | I was just told there is a 3,000 account limit on each domain. That will work for now for those assigned to a project. But we may bump into this barrier within about 6 months at our current growth rate. |
| 20:17.51 | scgallafent | I'll look at the limits for groups.... Hold on. |
| 20:18.32 | smootar | I was told in the contract it was 3,000. i don't know what the real technicial limit is for a non profit group. |
| 20:19.07 | smootar | We should be able to test it to see if that is a hard limit as well. |
| 20:19.33 | smootar | Either way, we do want to update the contract with google to allow us to go over that limit. |
| 20:20.56 | scgallafent | No limit to the number of groups that can be created. |
| 20:21.04 | scgallafent | No limit to the number of members a group can have. |
| 20:21.23 | scgallafent | It doesn't say if those members count against the 3,000 account limit. |
| 20:22.04 | smootar | OK. |
| 20:22.12 | scgallafent | Email sending limits: 2,000 messages per day |
| 20:22.23 | scgallafent | Unique recipients per day: 3,000 (2,000 external) |
| 20:22.44 | scgallafent | Realistically, our trouble is going to come when we start to see a lot of traffic in the groups. |
| 20:22.56 | smootar | nods |
| 20:23.01 | scgallafent | Max total recipients per day (5 emails to 10 addresses = 50 recipients): 10,000 |
| 20:23.45 | smootar | Is that how they calculate messages? Or is it 5 emails to any size group is 5 messages? |
| 20:24.31 | scgallafent | No. Five emails to five recipients counts as 25 out of 10,000. |
| 20:24.51 | scgallafent | That's the first point we most likely run into the limits. |
| 20:25.26 | smootar | hmmmm, is there a way to monitor this? |
| 20:25.48 | smootar | It would be good to know when we are approaching the limit. |
| 20:25.53 | scgallafent | I haven't seen one. |
| 20:26.18 | smootar | I hope that we don't have to count those ourselves. |
| 20:27.17 | scgallafent | We could probably estimate relatively easily initially by counting messages and multiplying by group members to get a rough number. |
| 20:27.17 | smootar | I would hope they would have some notification that could tell the admin of the domain when we are within a 1,000 of the limit, then periodically as we get close. |
| 20:27.40 | smootar | Then send out big scary emails when you cross over the limit. |
| 20:27.50 | smootar | Or other notificaiton. |
| 20:31.26 | *** join/#ldstech josephscott (~josephsco@208.95.152.44) |
| 20:31.26 | scgallafent | I'll have to dig around and see what the options are. I can't imagine that there aren't organizations that go over those limits. |
| 20:32.02 | scgallafent | In a university setting there could be several thousand students (well past the 3K limit) and I could see group activity running way past that limit if they were being used for class discussions, etc. |
| 20:32.17 | josephscott | has been wondering if the google groups is over thinking the process |
| 20:33.11 | scgallafent | hasn't been too worried about it because he thinks it is going to take a while to reach those limits |
| 20:35.27 | scgallafent | is going to go get some lunch and run an errand |
| 20:36.07 | josephscott | wonders how long we can have a conversation about ourselves in the third person |
| 20:37.37 | scgallafent | hears conversations like this from his children all of the time |
| 20:39.06 | josephscott | wonders if scgallafent is part of the royal family |
| 20:39.36 | scgallafent | We are not allowed to answer that question. :) |
| 20:42.10 | TimRiker | smootar, someone dropped a lunch on your desk. I'd hate to see it go to waste.... |
| 20:44.49 | smootar | Please eat it. |
| 20:44.53 | smootar | asap. |
| 20:45.05 | smootar | It is probably from yesterday. :( |
| 20:45.10 | smootar | It may be bad. |
| 20:45.34 | TimRiker | looks |
| 20:45.38 | smootar | Pick through it and find a cookie. |
| 20:47.03 | josephscott | ~cookie++ |
| 20:47.11 | smootar | :) |
| 20:47.22 | smootar | TimRiker, did you see that email from Matt on gg's |
| 20:47.31 | TimRiker | just reading it, yes |
| 20:47.34 | smootar | both cdev and tech domains are created. |
| 20:47.42 | smootar | you have an admin account. |
| 20:48.02 | smootar | If you could create an admin account for scgallafent and smootar that would be great. |
| 20:49.56 | smootar | TimRiker, it looks like you will have to create an html page that matches the ID in the admin page. This will verify with google that we are the owners. |
| 20:50.04 | smootar | This should then activate that domain. |
| 20:50.32 | smootar | There is some other step to turn on the API for that domain. Not sure if it is a setting or a request to google. |
| 20:53.56 | smootar | TimRiker, anything good in the lunch? |
| 20:56.53 | TimRiker | has not looked yet... one interrupt after another. |
| 21:02.47 | TimRiker | is now tim@tech.lds.org |
| 21:05.56 | TimRiker | sets up yet another google account... |
| 21:11.01 | smootar | cool email. :) |
| 21:12.37 | smootar | send tim@tech.lds.org |
| 21:12.48 | smootar | sends tim@tech.lds.org |
| 21:13.02 | smootar | wonders if it works. |
| 21:15.56 | smootar | From Matt: Once the domain ownership is updated, looks like it should update the version of the Google Apps domain to the Education Edition. That will give us access to use the API set. |
| 21:17.42 | TimRiker | is looking for where we verify the domain right now for tech |
| 21:26.46 | TimRiker | adds smootar and scgallafent to tech and emails them at their new addresses |
| 21:32.02 | smootar | rountrip to tim@tech.lds.org worked. |
| 21:32.13 | smootar | s/rountrip/roundtrip/ |
| 21:32.20 | TimRiker | note: sent the reply to smootar@tech.lds.org |
| 21:33.48 | smootar | Got it in my exchange account. |
| 21:33.58 | smootar | thought he would have to go to google. |
| 21:34.29 | TimRiker | I forwarded the test emails as l5488 is the mx handler for tech still. if we move that, we break mailman |
| 21:35.01 | josephscott | is mailman being used for anything? |
| 21:35.57 | TimRiker | yes. wamulator mostly. we'll create ggs for them and move them once we're ready. |
| 21:40.18 | smootar | TimRiker, Did you have to throw a page on our server? |
| 21:40.31 | TimRiker | no. not found anything asking for that yet |
| 21:40.41 | smootar | ok |
| 21:42.09 | TimRiker | k, moved your mail to gmail. |
| 21:43.12 | TimRiker | brownie from lunch was still good. :) |
| 21:46.47 | smootar | OK, what's the url? |
| 21:47.00 | smootar | gmail.tech.lds.org? |
| 21:48.44 | TimRiker | https://mail.google.com/mail/ with your new gg account username/password. |
| 21:48.57 | TimRiker | on the admin pages there's an inbox link in the upper right |
| 21:53.22 | TimRiker | https://mail.google.com/a/tech.lds.org should also work |
| 21:53.52 | smootar | Did you set a password on my account? |
| 22:00.36 | TimRiker | no. the email I sent should have had a link to set your password. |
| 22:09.20 | TimRiker | api should be enabled on cdev |
| 22:15.41 | *** join/#ldstech scgallafent (~scgallafe@c-67-185-194-104.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 22:15.41 | *** mode/#ldstech [+o scgallafent] by ChanServ |
| 22:20.49 | TimRiker | smootar, note: the @cdev.lds.org emails will NOT resolve. there's no mx entry. |
| 22:21.08 | TimRiker | opens a ticket to get MX entries added for cdev.lds.org |
| 22:25.24 | smootar | nods |
| 22:25.54 | smootar | is happy about progress on this even though it isn't done yet. |
| 22:35.03 | TimRiker | I still don't see any way to add non domain users to lists. are we saying that all ldstech users will need to use a @tech.lds.org email address? |
| 22:35.29 | josephscott | there should be an option to add any email addr to a group |
| 22:36.44 | josephscott | at least my personal google apps account has an option for that "Access level" |
| 22:37.08 | smootar | nods. |
| 22:37.23 | smootar | scgallafent I think has been doing that for the lds.org that he has been using. |
| 22:37.31 | smootar | scgallafent, can you confirm? |
| 22:37.36 | josephscott | lds-cpas-dev@josephscott.org on google apps has email addresses from all over |
| 22:37.54 | scgallafent | That is correct. |
| 22:38.03 | scgallafent | Users from outside the domain can be added. |
| 22:38.17 | josephscott | ohhh, but this is different I think |
| 22:38.39 | josephscott | you guys are talking about creating a Google Group, which is different from a group in a google apps account |
| 22:38.58 | scgallafent | They're similar. |
| 22:39.06 | smootar | What is the difference? |
| 22:39.28 | smootar | They should be the same, but with a different domain. |
| 22:39.45 | scgallafent | The Google Apps (Free) accounts don't have the Google Groups functionality (web interface is the primary difference). |
| 22:39.59 | smootar | OK |
| 22:40.05 | scgallafent | The underlying technology is the same. They look similar on my free Google Apps account as they do on the lds.org account. |
| 22:40.14 | scgallafent | Did TimRiker get me added to the new accounts? |
| 22:40.25 | smootar | thinks he did. |
| 22:40.43 | TimRiker | scgallafent, yes. you should have two invite emails. |
| 22:40.51 | scgallafent | OK. I'll go look for them now. |
| 22:40.55 | TimRiker | also, you are scgallafent@tech.lds.org now |
| 22:43.25 | josephscott | gets another email address |
| 22:43.32 | josephscott | josephscott@cdev.lds.org |
| 22:43.42 | TimRiker | :) |
| 22:46.18 | josephscott | is collecting email addresses |
| 22:46.47 | TimRiker | are we having fun yet? |
| 22:47.19 | josephscott | ~fun++ |
| 22:48.16 | TimRiker | ~karma fun |
| 22:48.16 | infobot | fun has karma of 1 |
| 22:48.31 | TimRiker | ~karma josephscott |
| 22:48.31 | infobot | josephscott has karma of 10 |
| 22:48.44 | TimRiker | ~karma ~fun |
| 22:48.44 | infobot | ~fun has neutral karma |
| 22:48.48 | TimRiker | hehe |
| 22:48.52 | josephscott | ~karma karma |
| 22:48.52 | infobot | karma has karma of 5 |
| 22:57.02 | scgallafent | ~karma karma karma karma karma chameleon |
| 22:57.02 | infobot | karma karma karma karma chameleon has neutral karma |
| 22:58.04 | *** join/#ldstech heppy (~heppy@fw.baysidebusinessplaza.com) |
| 22:58.20 | *** part/#ldstech heppy (~heppy@fw.baysidebusinessplaza.com) |
| 22:59.20 | smootar | ~karma |
| 22:59.20 | infobot | smootar has neutral karma |
| 22:59.28 | smootar | ~karma karma |
| 22:59.28 | infobot | karma has karma of 5 |
| 22:59.55 | smootar | was hoping for neg karma. |
| 23:00.27 | smootar | ~karma TimRiker |
| 23:00.27 | infobot | timriker has karma of 21 |
| 23:00.39 | smootar | cool. |
| 23:02.38 | TimRiker | scgallafent, so, do we have what we need? I still see upgrade notices on both domains so I don't know if we are educational/non-profit or just test accounts. |
| 23:04.52 | scgallafent | Still checking. API access is enabled, which make me think it's correct. Still poking around. |
| 23:08.53 | TimRiker | goes back to poking at the forum on cdev |
| 23:21.23 | smootar | ~karma scgallafent |
| 23:21.23 | infobot | scgallafent has neutral karma |
| 23:21.42 | smootar | thinks scgallafent needs more karma |
| 23:22.04 | scgallafent | 'Twould be nice. |
| 23:22.17 | smootar | thinks he should have more karma then /me |
| 23:33.28 | scgallafent | TimRiker: It let me create the group via the API. I'm doing some additional testing. |
| 23:35.34 | scgallafent | TimRiker, smootar: I think it's a free Google Apps account. It shows a limit of 10 users and the lds.org account shows up as Google Apps for Education. I'm not sure if getting switched to Apps for Ed is an offline process. That might be something to follow up with Matt. |
| 23:36.38 | smootar | OK, he mentioned something about getting validated as a non-profit org before it was a valide education/non-profit account. |
| 23:36.59 | scgallafent | I'm guessing they have to do that manually on their end and we just need to wait for the process to complete. |
| 23:37.19 | smootar | is this true for both tech and cdev? |
| 23:37.31 | scgallafent | I've been poking at cdev. Logging into tech now. |
| 23:38.35 | scgallafent | Same situation with tech. |
| 23:39.38 | scgallafent | I think we just keep an eye on it and see what happens over the next day or so. |
| 23:45.35 | TimRiker | nods. email to matt about the current status would be a Good Thing |
| 23:47.18 | smootar | will send an email to Matt |
| 23:52.47 | *** join/#ldstech tdeforest (~tdeforest@cpe-74-78-85-69.maine.res.rr.com) |
| 23:52.47 | *** mode/#ldstech [+o tdeforest] by ChanServ |