| 00:09.29 | *** join/#neo900 knttl (~knttl@dyndsl-085-016-176-191.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
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| 01:20.02 | *** topic/#neo900 is http://neo900.org | CCCAMP15 lightning talks at http://neo900.org/stuff/cccamp15/ - major: http://neo900.org/stuff/cccamp15/ccc2015talk/neo900-wpwrak_CCC2015.webm | conversations are logged to http://infobot.rikers.org/%23neo900/ and http://irclog.whitequark.org/neo900 | Welcome newest team member metacollin! https://neo900.org/news/neo900-update-2017-09-03 |
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| 02:11.44 | Juesto | DocScrutinizer05: is the production halted? which OSes has it been tested on? is the device itself finished? |
| 02:12.20 | Joerg-Neo900 | we wait for layouter metacolin to finish layout of prot_v2 |
| 02:12.37 | Juesto | how many prototypes it'll have? |
| 02:12.54 | Juesto | is the first one not good? |
| 02:13.30 | Joerg-Neo900 | Juesto: developing a design usually needs incremental evolutionary steps of prottypes |
| 02:14.13 | Juesto | well, still would like some insight on the first, Joerg-Neo900, such as what's the goal, how it turned out, pro and cons, etc |
| 02:14.40 | Joerg-Neo900 | we got a proto_v1 fro mechanical stuff and modem testing, we are about to do proto_v2 and we hope to have a golden production-ready sample with proto_v3 |
| 02:15.39 | Joerg-Neo900 | there are photos of proto_v1 on tmo |
| 02:16.26 | Juesto | how many people are in it? how long did proto_v1 took? |
| 02:18.52 | Juesto | Link? is it difficult to find? |
| 02:19.17 | Juesto | Ah used google |
| 02:19.20 | Juesto | think i found it |
| 02:20.17 | Juesto | welp, a bit too long to find :( |
| 02:22.19 | Juesto | page at least? |
| 02:27.03 | Joerg-Neo900 | sorry, busy in a meeting |
| 02:27.12 | Joerg-Neo900 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142 |
| 02:28.50 | Juesto | oops |
| 02:29.07 | Juesto | yeah found that thread |
| 02:29.10 | Joerg-Neo900 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1412240&highlight=proto#post1412240 around there somewhere |
| 02:29.59 | Juesto | thanks |
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| 11:30.16 | cc_1 | hello people |
| 11:30.18 | cc_1 | _o/ |
| 12:13.02 | enyc | meows |
| 12:13.27 | enyc | cc_1: iirc DocScrutinizer05 is awaiting the return of metacollin to complete layout work.. not sure exactly whtat else is goin on |
| 12:25.16 | cc_1 | enyc: is he well health-wise ? |
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| 12:38.58 | enyc | different people... different situations |
| 12:39.06 | enyc | i got impression metacollin got some toher job |
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| 13:49.13 | sn0wmonster | sadly, i don't think that's the case |
| 13:49.28 | sn0wmonster | i think it's more to do with personal issues. we all run into them sometimes, the timing was just poor. |
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| 14:29.46 | NitroNills | How is it w/ metacollin - back in business? |
| 14:56.03 | sn0wmonster | nope, still MIA |
| 15:16.24 | atk | I also noticed |
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| 15:16.32 | atk | FSF is funding some silly android phone |
| 15:16.36 | atk | wtf |
| 15:17.10 | atk | I've cancelled my membership recently because I would like to save up every little bit of cash I can for the next year or so |
| 15:17.16 | atk | so I don't have that leverage anymore |
| 15:17.22 | atk | I think I'll email them about this BS though |
| 15:17.40 | atk | they have an android phone where presumably the baseband and the CPU are merged and share address space |
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| 15:17.50 | atk | and they think that's "good enough" |
| 15:18.14 | atk | If this boils down to the "can't replace the firmware because instructions aren't provided" BS then they're absolute plonkers |
| 15:27.29 | sn0wmonster | atk, in all fairness, there are no legitimate options on the table |
| 15:27.41 | sn0wmonster | that doesn't excuse them for suggesting or supporting smoething though |
| 15:28.22 | atk | sure, but I would say that the Neo900 is at least borderline better than the samsung phone they promote |
| 15:29.08 | atk | I mean, it's a different kind of niche all things considered |
| 15:29.11 | sn0wmonster | for security and privacy? probably |
| 15:29.15 | sn0wmonster | for the average end user? probably not |
| 15:29.22 | sn0wmonster | they need something *stupid* that works too |
| 15:29.29 | sn0wmonster | by they i mean stupid people |
| 15:29.50 | atk | stupid is not quite right |
| 15:29.59 | atk | more like not as privacy focused |
| 15:30.09 | sn0wmonster | no i mean literally stupid people who dont understand how phones work |
| 15:30.15 | sn0wmonster | and won't take the time to learn |
| 15:30.22 | sn0wmonster | those people aren't going to like a linuxy phone |
| 15:30.26 | sn0wmonster | they're going to want something apply |
| 15:30.27 | atk | I think most people don't understand how phones work, or do you mean how to use a phone? |
| 15:30.30 | sn0wmonster | apple-y |
| 15:30.38 | sn0wmonster | how to use a phone properly yes |
| 15:31.16 | atk | What's maybe a more interesting thing than phones is cars these days. |
| 15:31.45 | atk | I wonder if FSF has anything to say about those |
| 15:34.56 | atk | and here's the other thing |
| 15:35.14 | atk | if they're interested in an appley phone, why are they pushing laptops which are borderline out of date at this point |
| 15:35.59 | atk | Unless something like the X220 with nerfed IME is on their RYF list |
| 15:47.56 | sn0wmonster | i second your frustration |
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| 16:51.29 | cc_1 | atk: are you talking about the purism phone ? or some replicant device ? |
| 16:51.49 | atk | no, it was a replicant device |
| 16:52.43 | cc_1 | I'm surprised they are giving some money then |
| 16:53.03 | cc_1 | with all nonfree software removed it's not even a phone |
| 16:54.44 | atk | Well yeah, they're keeping the baseband modem firmware |
| 16:55.00 | atk | that's the caveat in the description iirc |
| 16:55.05 | atk | let me try to find the page |
| 16:56.27 | cc_1 | I think replicant does not even try to hack some phones anymore |
| 16:56.34 | cc_1 | they are working on tablets now |
| 16:56.46 | cc_1 | because no GSM firmware |
| 16:57.02 | atk | https://www.fsf.org/givingguide/v6/ |
| 16:57.33 | atk | So it's not direct funding, but it's advertising and endorsement |
| 16:57.42 | atk | at least I don't think there's any direct funding |
| 17:19.59 | cc_1 | oh I see |
| 17:20.17 | cc_1 | yes that's because technoethic started selling those |
| 17:33.22 | sixwheeledbeast | Looks like they needed a device in production to tick the "smartphone" box on the website to me. |
| 18:29.58 | Joerg-Neo900 | in all fairness, it's a "giving guide" - they need to list stuff that is available there |
| 18:35.37 | sixwheeledbeast | exactly the way I see it. |
| 18:38.04 | Joerg-Neo900 | it's still a pathetic kob of FSF to not even mention Neo900 |
| 18:38.11 | Joerg-Neo900 | job* |
| 18:41.02 | Joerg-Neo900 | except the >> I am > strongly in favor of it, and I am willing to say so. Where and how > should I say so?<< in Mr Stallman's email |
| 18:41.13 | Joerg-Neo900 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1396903&highlight=stallman#post1396903 |
| 18:54.14 | Joerg-Neo900 | maybe somebody just needs to send RMS a email telling him to "according to your former email, please say so on FSF site" |
| 19:29.33 | cc_1 | they won't speak of an unreleased product on the FSF site |
| 20:08.51 | sicelo | does FSF know about Neo900? |
| 20:30.49 | Juesto | yes, it looks like? |
| 20:31.06 | Juesto | good question |
| 20:34.05 | anon- | we should draft a letter to the FSF to present the Neo900 as a better alternative to their current phone |
| 20:34.24 | anon- | FSF funding could make this project work |
| 20:34.39 | Juesto | which phone? |
| 20:35.06 | anon- | "Tehnoetic S2 with Replicant" - see atk's link |
| 20:36.51 | anon- | also they need to understand the significance of their nonfree modem "caveat" |
| 20:37.25 | Joerg-Neo900 | S2 prolly has modem separation |
| 20:37.48 | Joerg-Neo900 | at least partially, not sure if they have shared RAM |
| 20:53.24 | anon- | that's not enough. the modem needs to be able to be turned off completely |
| 20:55.46 | anon- | I always take notice when I read an article where cell phone tracking was used in an investigation, so it's being used |
| 20:56.00 | anon- | all that is required is that the phone is connected to the network |
| 20:57.11 | Joerg-Neo900 | sure thing. We're aware of that |
| 20:58.00 | Joerg-Neo900 | but even RYF is not "Respects Your Privacy" |
| 20:58.35 | Joerg-Neo900 | Freedom in the definition of FSF is strictly in a FOSS context |
| 20:59.56 | Joerg-Neo900 | it doesn't *really* cover neither Security nor Privacy |
| 21:01.34 | Joerg-Neo900 | the "fun" part in FSF's "RYF cert": they don't even have a means to certify a mere hardware provided to them without any software at all |
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| 21:02.17 | Joerg-Neo900 | the whole RYF thing is sw-focused. A product consisting of hardware only doesn't exist for them |
| 21:02.25 | anon- | but even the software isn't free if they have the baseband processor in there |
| 21:03.34 | anon- | I don't think that technoethical is good either |
| 21:03.56 | anon- | they charge extreme prices for reflashing ebay hardware |
| 21:04.14 | Joerg-Neo900 | let's send them a Samsung S2 and a Neo900, both without any software I.E erased storage, the ask for their assertion which is more appropriate to receive a RYF certification or any other approval |
| 21:04.57 | Joerg-Neo900 | anon-: *nod* that is what I understood they do |
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