irclog2html for #openzaurus on 20060112

`00:26.09`	`*** join/#openzaurus Geo_KM (n=keith@bh02i525f01.au.ibm.com)`
`00:34.12`	`*** join/#openzaurus Geo_KM (n=keith@bh02i525f01.au.ibm.com)`
`00:52.40`	`*** join/#openzaurus johnX (n=john@c-24-16-192-158.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)`
`01:44.47`	`*** join/#openzaurus lev3k (n=lev3k@c-24-7-161-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`01:45.49`	`*** join/#openzaurus sheepbat (n=lev3k@c-24-7-161-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`02:04.11`	`*** join/#openzaurus noosphere (n=dgram_@gateway1.moebius.com.au)`
`02:46.02`	`*** join/#openzaurus soci0path (n=user@205.234.34.155)`
`03:03.09`	`*** join/#openzaurus mrz80 (n=scotsman@n128-227-50-163.xlate.ufl.edu)`
`03:53.55`	`*** join/#openzaurus sleeplap (n=sleeplap@24-116-26-66.cpe.cableone.net)`
`04:03.23`	`*** join/#openzaurus soci0path (n=user@net34-155.netkaster.ca)`
`04:31.59`	`*** join/#openzaurus grendal_prime (n=shawng@dsl166-053.caltel.com)`
`04:32.09`	`grendal_prime`	`hey guys hows it hanging?`
`04:32.21`	`grendal_prime`	`sooo i got my new holux gps ultra`
`04:32.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`can you get me one? =p`
`04:32.36`	`grendal_prime`	`hehehe`
`04:32.52`	`grendal_prime`	`was cheep actually took forever to get here though`
`04:32.52`	`Luke-Jr`	`does it work?`
`04:32.56`	`grendal_prime`	`dont know`
`04:33.10`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, get me one and I'll try to see if I can make it work =p`
`04:33.33`	`grendal_prime`	`was going to ask if there was a quick and dirty app to check it with..i know slightly more than dick on the subject`
`04:33.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`not that I have time to give it a good attempt, actually :/`
`04:33.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`shrug. try gpsdrive`
`04:33.57`	`grendal_prime`	`opie`
`04:34.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`What Z?`
`04:34.28`	`grendal_prime`	`5500`
`04:34.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`um`
`04:34.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`what kind of GPS is it?`
`04:34.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`not USB, obviously...`
`04:34.50`	`grendal_prime`	`ive got several gps apps installed`
`04:34.55`	`grendal_prime`	`its cf`
`04:34.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok`
`04:35.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`plug it in and paste the last bits of 'dmesg' on pastebin.com`
`04:35.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`run dmesg in a terminal`
`04:35.39`	`grendal_prime`	`it may just work...it recognizes it as a bluetooth sleve?`
`04:35.43`	`grendal_prime`	`ok hold on`
`04:35.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`wtf? it's bluetooth?`
`04:36.37`	`grendal_prime`	`compaq ipaq blooth sleeve is what the cf reporter deally bobber says`
`04:36.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`is it one piece or two?`
`04:38.27`	`grendal_prime`	`one`
`04:38.39`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok, then it confuses me =p`
`04:38.57`	`grendal_prime`	`brb`
`04:47.07`	`jnc`	`umm, anybody awake that knows how to build OZ ?`
`04:47.22`	`jnc`	`i'm on amd64 and want to build the 3.5.4 branc`
`04:47.25`	`jnc`	`branch, evne`
`04:53.40`	`mnm`	`Is there anybody nice enough with the proper sdk do me a BIG favor and compile for me a compatible binary of a patched hostap driver module that I have for the vanilla 3.5.3 OZ collie kernel for a Zaurus 5500? :)`
`04:54.08`	`jnc`	`!VOTEKICK mnm`
`04:54.09`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Dunno?`
`04:54.16`	`mnm`	`?`
`04:54.59`	`mnm`	`i thought it was a support channel and nice people with kind hearts.. :(`
`04:55.31`	`jnc`	`yes`
`04:55.38`	`jnc`	`not sheep to be slaughtered`
`04:55.47`	`mnm`	`ok good`
`04:56.17`	`jnc`	`cdbot: trouble is, the build requires a 2.4.20 kernel be built, and that needs gcc 2.95`
`04:56.38`	`jnc`	`my host is amd64. so, the problem for me is that gcc 2.95 does not build on amd64 host`
`04:56.58`	`mnm`	`this is about my request or I'm out of it...`
`04:57.28`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Don't know, don't care`
`04:57.45`	`jnc`	`oh`
`04:57.50`	`mnm`	`heh`
`04:58.53`	`mnm`	`Well if anybody likes to take up my request just gimme a holler. I'll be around...`
`04:59.02`	`mnm`	`Thanks`
`04:59.55`	`grendal_prime`	`grrr`
`05:00.05`	`grendal_prime`	`i think its working i just cant figure out what tty its on`
`05:00.14`	`jnc`	`what is 'it'`
`05:00.39`	`grendal_prime`	`gps`
`05:00.52`	`grendal_prime`	`holux ultra`
`05:01.00`	`grendal_prime`	`gm270`
`05:01.43`	`jnc`	`ohhh no kidding`
`05:01.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a gpslim236`
`05:01.53`	`jnc`	`i like it a lot'`
`05:02.48`	`grendal_prime`	`this is a cf card on a 5500`
`05:02.59`	`jnc`	`okay`
`05:03.01`	`grendal_prime`	`any advice for configureing the thing would be appreciated`
`05:03.19`	`jnc`	`the GPSlim236 needed to talk to gpsd before it would spit out NEMA`
`05:03.43`	`jnc`	`i would diagnose your card to make sure it works on another system first, if possible and convenient`
`05:03.55`	`grendal_prime`	`what system?`
`05:04.04`	`jnc`	`maybe a windows box`
`05:04.06`	`grendal_prime`	`i have a laptop with a pcmcia`
`05:04.14`	`grendal_prime`	`dont have a single windows system here`
`05:04.15`	`johnX`	`jnc: if you don't have any luck finding gcc-2.95 compiled for amd64 you might try some of the stuff here: https://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/21/debian-amd64-howto.html#id271960`
`05:04.26`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay`
`05:04.35`	`grendal_prime`	`see this jnc http://midtoad.homelinux.org/wp/index.php?p=9`
`05:04.45`	`jnc`	`johnX: it seems though no one thinks gcc 2.95 can be made to compile on amd64`
`05:04.46`	`grendal_prime`	`that is the exact screen i have in front of me..`
`05:04.49`	`jnc`	`which may be true`
`05:05.55`	`johnX`	`if you're really lucky, after installing ia32-libs you might be able to just run the i386 binaries`
`05:06.12`	`grendal_prime`	`now question is will gpsd talk to it if it is unable to get a fix. because im inside right now`
`05:08.50`	`jnc`	`johnX: hmm`
`05:09.18`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay that being said, maybe i can grab a build from someone else`
`05:09.39`	`johnX`	`what system are you compiling for?`
`05:09.40`	`jnc`	`amd64 is obviously not a supported build platform for the 3.5.4 branch`
`05:09.59`	`johnX`	`and are you intentionally building the kernel? or is it just getting pulled in?`
`05:10.01`	`jnc`	`since the 3.5.4 branch requires 2.4.20 kernel, which needs the gcc 2.95 to build`
`05:10.09`	`jnc`	`it's being pulled in`
`05:10.22`	`jnc`	`2.6.x kernels do not exist (AFAIK) in the 3.5.4 oz branch`
`05:10.36`	`jnc`	`which is what i want to target, and file bug reports against`
`05:10.47`	`grendal_prime`	`ya this is going to make me crazy`
`05:11.06`	`johnX`	`jnc: yeah, I skipped ahead to the 2.6 kernel and all the latest stuff`
`05:11.20`	`jnc`	`johnX: i heard that HEAD was borked, to stay away from it`
`05:11.32`	`johnX`	`I think I'm on the prebreakage tag`
`05:11.36`	`johnX`	`or whatever the heck`
`05:11.59`	`johnX`	`anyways, I built 2.6.15+GPE for my C1000 the other day`
`05:12.16`	`johnX`	`after quick fix from RP over in #oe last night everything works swell`
`05:12.25`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:12.32`	`jnc`	`sounds good`
`05:13.02`	`johnX`	`here...I'm gonna take a crack at running gcc-2.95 arm-cross compiler on my Athlon 64`
`05:13.12`	`jnc`	`it's not going to work`
`05:13.21`	`johnX`	`well I have a chroot :)`
`05:13.25`	`jnc`	`ohhh`
`05:14.00`	`jnc`	`i have a chroot for things like macromedia flash web browser plugin, and mplayer win32 codecs`
`05:14.34`	`johnX`	`download this http://handhelds.org/download/projects/toolchain/archive/cross-2.95.3.tar.bz2`
`05:14.59`	`johnX`	`unpack it somewhere and run ./2.95.3/bin/arm-linux-gcc --version`
`05:14.59`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:15.11`	`johnX`	`get the ia32-libs package if you don't have it`
`05:15.15`	`jnc`	`the alternative is to supplant the 2.4.20 kernel with a 2.6.x one`
`05:15.27`	`jnc`	`which i think may be more desirable to me`
`05:15.48`	`johnX`	`what Zaurus are you compiling for?`
`05:16.00`	`jnc`	`spizt`
`05:16.30`	`jnc`	`Sharp Zaurus C3000 (spitz)`
`05:16.33`	`johnX`	`yeah 2.6 should be fine on that`
`05:16.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a 2.6.x kernel on my hardware now, it's just the rest of the OS that is fubar`
`05:16.56`	`johnX`	`ah`
`05:17.14`	`johnX`	`and you can get around that nicely if you just compile your own image at the same time as the kernel`
`05:17.50`	`jnc`	`err? what do you mean by that`
`05:18.11`	`johnX`	`mixing and matching a kernel image here and a fs image here doesn't work to well`
`05:18.29`	`johnX`	`so building them from the same source tree at the same time ensures they "match"`
`05:18.33`	`johnX`	`that's all I meant`
`05:18.45`	`jnc`	`ohhhh`
`05:18.49`	`johnX`	`however, if you really want to bug test for 3.5.4 you'll want a 2.4 kernel I think, because AFAIK 3.5.4 will ship with 2.4 and 2.6 will be a later addon`
`05:18.57`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:19.16`	`jnc`	`shoot, so i should really be finding a way to build this in a chroot huh`
`05:19.48`	`johnX`	`on my ubuntu 5.10 machine I can run gcc 2.95 arm-cross compiler outside of chroot`
`05:20.15`	`johnX`	`if you download that package I linked, and follow the directions here, you should be fine: http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/ZaurusKernels`
`05:20.37`	`johnX`	`ubuntu 5.10 on an Athlon 64 I should say`
`05:29.03`	`*** join/#openzaurus Timelord0 (n=TL@4.78.4.43)`
`05:30.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 1. GCC 2.95 does not work on x86_64`
`05:30.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 2. you shouldn't ever need or use GCC 2.95`
`05:30.49`	`johnX`	`what about to build the 2.4 kernel?`
`05:30.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`OZ has used 2.6 kernels for nearly a year now`
`05:31.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`IIRC`
`05:31.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`certainly 6 months`
`05:31.20`	`johnX`	`not on all machines`
`05:31.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`all machines worth owning`
`05:31.30`	`johnX`	`heh`
`05:31.39`	`johnX`	`so a 5500 and a C1000 aren't worth owning?`
`05:31.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000 works w/ 2.6 fine, IIRC`
`05:31.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`5500 isn't, no`
`05:31.58`	`johnX`	`right, which happened just a bit ago`
`05:32.06`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000's release was just a bit ago`
`05:32.34`	`johnX`	`until mid december 2.6 on the C1000 was pretty buggy`
`05:32.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`either way`
`05:33.10`	`johnX`	`3.5.4 will be released with a 2.4 kernel for the C1000, C3000, and C3100`
`05:33.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`just backup your /lib/modules to /home somewhere when installing a new image`
`05:33.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`and restore it after`
`05:33.50`	`webmind`	`any idea when it will be released ?`
`05:34.01`	`johnX`	`http://openzaurus.org/wordpress/2006/01/09/openzaurus-354-release-plans/`
`05:34.13`	`johnX`	`no clue`
`05:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, if anyone here wants to build GPE on a x86_64 box`
`05:34.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you'll need to either hack sqlite-2* or copy an ipk from somewhere else`
`05:35.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`mainly because sqlite-2 doesn't cross-compile correctly`
`05:35.43`	`Luke-Jr`	`and it detects sizeof(char) = 8 (on x86_64) where sizeof(char) on ARM is 4`
`05:35.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`so the resulting ipk will not work`
`05:36.20`	`johnX`	`oh, and FWIW gcc-2.95 runs fine on x86_64, provided ia32-libs are installed (if you're on debian or ubuntu)`
`05:36.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`no, GCC 2.95 only runs on x86_32`
`05:36.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you are most likely putting your CPU into x86_32 mode for that`
`05:37.11`	`johnX`	`ok, but either way it can be made to run outside of a 32-bit chroot`
`05:37.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`only if your system is dual x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:37.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`it won't work on a x86_64 only system`
`05:37.50`	`johnX`	`are there any x86_64 only systems?`
`05:37.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`mine is one example`
`05:37.59`	`jnc`	`mine is`
`05:38.00`	`Luke-Jr`	`I'm sure it's not alone`
`05:38.10`	`jnc`	`i mean, i have amd64 but i don't use the ia32 compat stuff`
`05:38.16`	`Luke-Jr`	`dual systems use twice the disk space`
`05:38.22`	`johnX`	`not really`
`05:38.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes, really`
`05:38.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`you need libraries built for both x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:39.05`	`johnX`	`yes, but you don't need all the libraries for everything, just the stuff you need to run the app you want`
`05:40.15`	`jnc`	`the goal is to have a kernel 2.6.x which eliminates need for gcc-2.95 yes?`
`05:40.22`	`johnX`	`eventually`
`05:40.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`pretty much`
`05:40.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`the only reason I can see to use a 2.4 kernel these days is if you need a microphone`
`05:40.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's not working in 2.6 yet`
`05:41.10`	`johnX`	`or if you're testing for the 3.5.4 release or if you have a 5500 :)`
`05:41.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ah, sad`
`05:42.10`	`johnX`	`well I have a C1000 too`
`05:42.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`my OZ fork is optimized and only runs on SL-C models`
`05:42.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`Cxx0, mainly, though I imagine Cxk wouldn't be too difficult to add`
`05:42.58`	`johnX`	`what is so different that you needed to fork it?`
`05:43.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`but when/if I get a Cxk, I wouldn't be cross compiling for it`
`05:43.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: for a start, optimizing my packages`
`05:43.49`	`Luke-Jr`	`OpenSSH instead of Dropbear`
`05:44.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`stuff like that`
`05:44.17`	`johnX`	`yeah, I gave up on dropbear too`
`05:44.29`	`johnX`	`one of the first things I do on a new image is kill dropbear and install openssh`
`05:44.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`there were more differences back a few months, when GPE images weren't too nice w/ OZ`
`05:45.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`Like including firefox and killing keylaunch (which broke the image at the time)`
`05:45.22`	`Luke-Jr`	`and gpe-appmgr`
`05:45.26`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is interesting`
`05:45.34`	`grendal_prime`	`it works with cumulus`
`05:45.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`?`
`05:45.54`	`grendal_prime`	`set to /dev/ttyS3`
`05:45.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, it's fun to run KDE on the Z ;)`
`05:46.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, to use it anyway`
`05:46.21`	`johnX`	`I'm gonna try and make the e17 image compile`
`05:46.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`haven't been able to crosscompile it yet (and thus not run it)`
`05:46.25`	`johnX`	`that should be interesting`
`05:46.48`	`grendal_prime`	`Luke-Jr, i tried that it was weird`
`05:46.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`but just from running it on the Z's X display, it looks nice`
`05:46.57`	`grendal_prime`	`the kde bit on my 5500`
`05:47.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: I'm still stuck on getting kdelibs-dcop-native to build`
`05:47.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`I don't expect KDE would ever fit on a 5500...`
`05:47.20`	`grendal_prime`	`i dont think you can`
`05:47.20`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i may sell my C3000`
`05:47.27`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: ?`
`05:47.39`	`jnc`	`it's like ten thousand geek points`
`05:47.41`	`jnc`	`but uh`
`05:47.48`	`jnc`	`i can't see myself putting it to good use`
`05:47.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`install a full blown OS on it ;)`
`05:48.03`	`Luke-Jr`	`fork Gentoo`
`05:48.04`	`grendal_prime`	`i need a backup gps for the plane`
`05:48.27`	`johnX`	`that's a painful thought...stage 1 self-hosting install on a zaurus`
`05:48.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`hehe`
`05:48.40`	`johnX`	`building images takes long enough on my 800 Athlon`
`05:48.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, that's why the OS I'm working on supports and encourages peer-to-peer distributed compiling ;)`
`05:49.21`	`jnc`	`the crap for networking built into the Z disturbs me`
`05:49.23`	`grendal_prime`	`the 5500 is perfect size. i need to get the gps app working...i have the entire os running from sd, so i can back it all up and have a second copy of it just in case`
`05:49.39`	`johnX`	`that's pretty slick`
`05:49.41`	`jnc`	`i've got a DWL-660 wifi card and USB host cable adapter`
`05:49.44`	`jnc`	`etc.`
`05:49.52`	`jnc`	`it's too unwieldly IMO`
`05:50.07`	`grendal_prime`	`the thing fits perfect in my flight jacket incase the console in the plane croaks..(which it has done in the past)`
`05:50.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: add WiFi internally?`
`05:50.38`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: no space, really`
`05:50.54`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: adding bluetooth internally has been discussed and it may be possible`
`05:50.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: IIRC, someone on the forum was looking at adding it`
`05:51.03`	`jnc`	`if you replace the internal drive`
`05:51.13`	`jnc`	`hmm yeah`
`05:51.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`via a second USB host connection`
`05:51.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's apparently in the Cxk chips`
`05:51.36`	`jnc`	`oh, far out`
`05:51.57`	`jnc`	`know where i might get a shorter more concise USB host cable?`
`05:52.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`so add a USB wifi dongle to that and you've got builtin wireless`
`05:52.08`	`jnc`	`the one i have is a GoldX, it sticks out too far`
`05:52.20`	`Luke-Jr`	`Walmart sells USB adapters...`
`05:52.50`	`jnc`	`um. i'm looking for a one piece USB mini A male to USB A female`
`05:52.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`right`
`05:53.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`I think that's in the set`
`05:53.09`	`grendal_prime`	`this thing picks up 4 sats even when im inside the house`
`05:53.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it has a USB extention cable and onepiece adapters for all the sizes`
`05:53.18`	`jnc`	`the ones i saw were all changeable ends and stuff`
`05:53.21`	`jnc`	`ohh hmm`
`05:53.33`	`grendal_prime`	`but why the hell does one app see it and not the other`
`05:53.43`	`jnc`	`i'd really like one that is flexible, like the iRiver host cable`
`05:53.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`hm`
`05:54.30`	`jnc`	`i think i'm going to hook up a Model M keyboard to my zaurus`
`05:54.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`lol`
`05:54.37`	`jnc`	`i know the USB adapter to use`
`05:54.49`	`jnc`	`there is only one USB ps2 adapter that will do it right`
`05:54.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`oh`
`05:55.05`	`jnc`	`the Model M fan site sells them for $50usd and up`
`05:55.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`honestly, I just want one of those Apple USB keyboards w/ side ports`
`05:55.10`	`jnc`	`but they are cheap if you know what they are`
`05:56.11`	`jnc`	`side ports?`
`05:56.19`	`jnc`	`the apple pro keyboards?`
`05:56.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`on the left/right of the kb, there's USB ports`
`05:57.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`you can never have enough USB ports ;)`
`05:57.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got all 8 of mine filled`
`05:57.19`	`jnc`	`yeah`
`05:57.32`	`johnX`	`anyone here have a video player working under GPE?`
`05:57.42`	`jnc`	`it's a shame USB fucking sucks with recent linux kernels on desktop hardware sigh`
`05:57.56`	`jnc`	`it hasn't worked right since kernel 2.6.5`
`05:58.16`	`jnc`	`and i swear it gets worse with each kernel release`
`05:58.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: eh? news to me`
`05:58.41`	`jnc`	`oh um`
`05:58.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: haven't tried, sorry`
`05:58.53`	`jnc`	`urb request failures are the new cool, apparently`
`05:58.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: you're not using the USB Block Device grab?`
`05:59.04`	`Luke-Jr`	`crap*`
`05:59.08`	`grendal_prime`	`ok sys log reports the device is being pluged in... reports it as ttys03 at port 0xc48503f8 (irq =35)`
`05:59.36`	`grendal_prime`	`but cumulus sees the card at ttys3 now is that odd or is that pretty normal?`
`05:59.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`normal/expected`
`06:01.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`what's happening is that the kernel is naming it ttyS03`
`06:01.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`but udev is calling it ttyS3`
`06:01.53`	`grendal_prime`	`ok well when i put in ttys3 on qpeGPS does not see it, however cumulus does`
`06:01.55`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i have many devices with USB; 6 channel audio, midi interfaces, serial GPS converter, several input devices, bluetooth adapter, storage devices`
`06:02.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I don't know what my USB ports are doing, I just know they're filled`
`06:02.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: capitalize it properly`
`06:03.26`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: it's been a losing battle since kernel 2.6.5; as of kernel 2.6.15 all non-input USB devices are rendered useless`
`06:04.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: er... good thing I haven't upgraded`
`06:04.05`	`grendal_prime`	`with the cap S ya that is right`
`06:04.47`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: kernel 2.6.11 was acceptable functionally with USB, other things were broken for amd64 though`
`06:05.57`	`Luke-Jr`	`OS: GNU/Linux 2.6.14-gentoo-r2-ljr/x86_64 - CPU: 1 x AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+ (2202.883 MHz) - Processes: 218 - Uptime: 6d 23h 53m - Users: 31 - Load Average: 3.29 - Memory Usage: 2088MB/1003MB (208%)`
`06:08.03`	`jnc`	`208%?`
`06:08.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`yup :\`
`06:08.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`1 gig just isn't enough`
`06:08.29`	`jnc`	`what the hell does that mean`
`06:08.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`2.08 times total RAM`
`06:09.05`	`jnc`	`what, that includes swap?`
`06:09.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes`
`06:09.11`	`jnc`	`ah]`
`06:09.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it's usage`
`06:09.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got 5 GB swap activated now`
`06:10.57`	`jnc`	`that's a lot`
`06:11.11`	`jnc`	`what do you do that requires such a great deal of memory?`
`06:12.54`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I'm a multitasker`
`06:13.12`	`Luke-Jr`	`on my IRC/OE virtual desktop alone, I have 8 windows open`
`06:13.29`	`Luke-Jr`	`and I've got nearly 20 virtual desktops, about 10 of which are used on average`
`06:14.47`	`jnc`	`short ass attention span wow`
`06:14.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`though I suspect my memory goes to unknown places too`
`06:15.16`	`jnc`	`the most workspaces i've needed to fill was about six`
`06:15.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`even before I start X on a fresh boot, there's around 200 MB used IIRC`
`06:15.23`	`jnc`	`it was way too much`
`06:15.38`	`Luke-Jr`	`I often get one desktop waiting on a long process`
`06:15.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`and go off to another`
`06:15.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`or I'm just doing tons of crap at once ;)`
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`06:17.06`	`johnX`	`I farm off long term processes to entirely different machines`
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`06:24.52`	`jnc`	`i think i may end up building inside the chroot`
`06:24.54`	`jnc`	`sigh`
`06:30.55`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is making me fkn crazy`
`06:31.10`	`grendal_prime`	`makes no sence what so ever`
`06:34.20`	`johnX`	`jnc, did you try installing ia32-libs and running gcc-arm ( or whatever it's called)?`
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`06:59.36`	`jnc`	`johnX: i'm not going to muddle my system up with 32-bit code support`
`06:59.52`	`jnc`	`johnX: i will likely just run a chroot`
`06:59.55`	`jnc`	`get'r'done`
`07:00.00`	`johnX`	`whatever you say`
`07:00.50`	`johnX`	`all I can say is I've had ia32-libs installed on ubuntu here for months with no problem`
`07:00.57`	`johnX`	`but of course it's your choice`
`07:01.30`	`jnc`	`the point is that i know why this build process is failing`
`07:01.54`	`johnX`	`ah`
`07:01.59`	`jnc`	`really, there should be some logic to tell users that the reason it failed is that gcc-2.95 is not buildable on amd64`
`07:02.20`	`johnX`	`bitbake has some rough edges ;)`
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`07:09.18`	`jnc`	`hmm what's that URL for how to build OZ?`
`07:09.24`	`jnc`	`i lost it, google isn't much help`
`07:09.57`	`*** join/#openzaurus johnX (n=john@c-24-16-192-158.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)`
`07:12.07`	`jnc`	`johnX: http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/OpenZaurus ... what's the URL for the page that shows you steps needed to build OZ?`
`07:12.25`	`jnc`	`i can't seem to remember/find it`
`07:13.06`	`johnX`	`http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/GettingStarted`
`07:13.31`	`johnX`	`is that what you mean?`
`07:13.57`	`jnc`	`ah yes!`
`07:14.10`	`jnc`	`perfect, thank yo`
`07:14.16`	`jnc`	`u$`
`07:27.35`	`johnX`	`I'm off to sleep, stayed up way too late last night`
`07:27.41`	`johnX`	`'night all`
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`07:44.08`	`jnc`	`okay, bitbake nano is rolling in an ia32 chroot`
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`08:48.07`	`XorA`	`morning`
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`09:09.37`	`NetAmp`	`ibot slashdot`
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`09:36.06`	`alan\|laptop`	`bonjour, world !`
`09:38.38`	`XorA`	`yo alan`
`09:38.59`	`alan\|laptop`	`hey XorA`
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`04:32.09`	`grendal_prime`	`hey guys hows it hanging?`
`04:32.21`	`grendal_prime`	`sooo i got my new holux gps ultra`
`04:32.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`can you get me one? =p`
`04:32.36`	`grendal_prime`	`hehehe`
`04:32.52`	`grendal_prime`	`was cheep actually took forever to get here though`
`04:32.52`	`Luke-Jr`	`does it work?`
`04:32.56`	`grendal_prime`	`dont know`
`04:33.10`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, get me one and I'll try to see if I can make it work =p`
`04:33.33`	`grendal_prime`	`was going to ask if there was a quick and dirty app to check it with..i know slightly more than dick on the subject`
`04:33.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`not that I have time to give it a good attempt, actually :/`
`04:33.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`shrug. try gpsdrive`
`04:33.57`	`grendal_prime`	`opie`
`04:34.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`What Z?`
`04:34.28`	`grendal_prime`	`5500`
`04:34.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`um`
`04:34.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`what kind of GPS is it?`
`04:34.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`not USB, obviously...`
`04:34.50`	`grendal_prime`	`ive got several gps apps installed`
`04:34.55`	`grendal_prime`	`its cf`
`04:34.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok`
`04:35.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`plug it in and paste the last bits of 'dmesg' on pastebin.com`
`04:35.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`run dmesg in a terminal`
`04:35.39`	`grendal_prime`	`it may just work...it recognizes it as a bluetooth sleve?`
`04:35.43`	`grendal_prime`	`ok hold on`
`04:35.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`wtf? it's bluetooth?`
`04:36.37`	`grendal_prime`	`compaq ipaq blooth sleeve is what the cf reporter deally bobber says`
`04:36.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`is it one piece or two?`
`04:38.27`	`grendal_prime`	`one`
`04:38.39`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok, then it confuses me =p`
`04:38.57`	`grendal_prime`	`brb`
`04:47.07`	`jnc`	`umm, anybody awake that knows how to build OZ ?`
`04:47.22`	`jnc`	`i'm on amd64 and want to build the 3.5.4 branc`
`04:47.25`	`jnc`	`branch, evne`
`04:53.40`	`mnm`	`Is there anybody nice enough with the proper sdk do me a BIG favor and compile for me a compatible binary of a patched hostap driver module that I have for the vanilla 3.5.3 OZ collie kernel for a Zaurus 5500? :)`
`04:54.08`	`jnc`	`!VOTEKICK mnm`
`04:54.09`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Dunno?`
`04:54.16`	`mnm`	`?`
`04:54.59`	`mnm`	`i thought it was a support channel and nice people with kind hearts.. :(`
`04:55.31`	`jnc`	`yes`
`04:55.38`	`jnc`	`not sheep to be slaughtered`
`04:55.47`	`mnm`	`ok good`
`04:56.17`	`jnc`	`cdbot: trouble is, the build requires a 2.4.20 kernel be built, and that needs gcc 2.95`
`04:56.38`	`jnc`	`my host is amd64. so, the problem for me is that gcc 2.95 does not build on amd64 host`
`04:56.58`	`mnm`	`this is about my request or I'm out of it...`
`04:57.28`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Don't know, don't care`
`04:57.45`	`jnc`	`oh`
`04:57.50`	`mnm`	`heh`
`04:58.53`	`mnm`	`Well if anybody likes to take up my request just gimme a holler. I'll be around...`
`04:59.02`	`mnm`	`Thanks`
`04:59.55`	`grendal_prime`	`grrr`
`05:00.05`	`grendal_prime`	`i think its working i just cant figure out what tty its on`
`05:00.14`	`jnc`	`what is 'it'`
`05:00.39`	`grendal_prime`	`gps`
`05:00.52`	`grendal_prime`	`holux ultra`
`05:01.00`	`grendal_prime`	`gm270`
`05:01.43`	`jnc`	`ohhh no kidding`
`05:01.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a gpslim236`
`05:01.53`	`jnc`	`i like it a lot'`
`05:02.48`	`grendal_prime`	`this is a cf card on a 5500`
`05:02.59`	`jnc`	`okay`
`05:03.01`	`grendal_prime`	`any advice for configureing the thing would be appreciated`
`05:03.19`	`jnc`	`the GPSlim236 needed to talk to gpsd before it would spit out NEMA`
`05:03.43`	`jnc`	`i would diagnose your card to make sure it works on another system first, if possible and convenient`
`05:03.55`	`grendal_prime`	`what system?`
`05:04.04`	`jnc`	`maybe a windows box`
`05:04.06`	`grendal_prime`	`i have a laptop with a pcmcia`
`05:04.14`	`grendal_prime`	`dont have a single windows system here`
`05:04.15`	`johnX`	`jnc: if you don't have any luck finding gcc-2.95 compiled for amd64 you might try some of the stuff here: https://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/21/debian-amd64-howto.html#id271960`
`05:04.26`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay`
`05:04.35`	`grendal_prime`	`see this jnc http://midtoad.homelinux.org/wp/index.php?p=9`
`05:04.45`	`jnc`	`johnX: it seems though no one thinks gcc 2.95 can be made to compile on amd64`
`05:04.46`	`grendal_prime`	`that is the exact screen i have in front of me..`
`05:04.49`	`jnc`	`which may be true`
`05:05.55`	`johnX`	`if you're really lucky, after installing ia32-libs you might be able to just run the i386 binaries`
`05:06.12`	`grendal_prime`	`now question is will gpsd talk to it if it is unable to get a fix. because im inside right now`
`05:08.50`	`jnc`	`johnX: hmm`
`05:09.18`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay that being said, maybe i can grab a build from someone else`
`05:09.39`	`johnX`	`what system are you compiling for?`
`05:09.40`	`jnc`	`amd64 is obviously not a supported build platform for the 3.5.4 branch`
`05:09.59`	`johnX`	`and are you intentionally building the kernel? or is it just getting pulled in?`
`05:10.01`	`jnc`	`since the 3.5.4 branch requires 2.4.20 kernel, which needs the gcc 2.95 to build`
`05:10.09`	`jnc`	`it's being pulled in`
`05:10.22`	`jnc`	`2.6.x kernels do not exist (AFAIK) in the 3.5.4 oz branch`
`05:10.36`	`jnc`	`which is what i want to target, and file bug reports against`
`05:10.47`	`grendal_prime`	`ya this is going to make me crazy`
`05:11.06`	`johnX`	`jnc: yeah, I skipped ahead to the 2.6 kernel and all the latest stuff`
`05:11.20`	`jnc`	`johnX: i heard that HEAD was borked, to stay away from it`
`05:11.32`	`johnX`	`I think I'm on the prebreakage tag`
`05:11.36`	`johnX`	`or whatever the heck`
`05:11.59`	`johnX`	`anyways, I built 2.6.15+GPE for my C1000 the other day`
`05:12.16`	`johnX`	`after quick fix from RP over in #oe last night everything works swell`
`05:12.25`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:12.32`	`jnc`	`sounds good`
`05:13.02`	`johnX`	`here...I'm gonna take a crack at running gcc-2.95 arm-cross compiler on my Athlon 64`
`05:13.12`	`jnc`	`it's not going to work`
`05:13.21`	`johnX`	`well I have a chroot :)`
`05:13.25`	`jnc`	`ohhh`
`05:14.00`	`jnc`	`i have a chroot for things like macromedia flash web browser plugin, and mplayer win32 codecs`
`05:14.34`	`johnX`	`download this http://handhelds.org/download/projects/toolchain/archive/cross-2.95.3.tar.bz2`
`05:14.59`	`johnX`	`unpack it somewhere and run ./2.95.3/bin/arm-linux-gcc --version`
`05:14.59`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:15.11`	`johnX`	`get the ia32-libs package if you don't have it`
`05:15.15`	`jnc`	`the alternative is to supplant the 2.4.20 kernel with a 2.6.x one`
`05:15.27`	`jnc`	`which i think may be more desirable to me`
`05:15.48`	`johnX`	`what Zaurus are you compiling for?`
`05:16.00`	`jnc`	`spizt`
`05:16.30`	`jnc`	`Sharp Zaurus C3000 (spitz)`
`05:16.33`	`johnX`	`yeah 2.6 should be fine on that`
`05:16.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a 2.6.x kernel on my hardware now, it's just the rest of the OS that is fubar`
`05:16.56`	`johnX`	`ah`
`05:17.14`	`johnX`	`and you can get around that nicely if you just compile your own image at the same time as the kernel`
`05:17.50`	`jnc`	`err? what do you mean by that`
`05:18.11`	`johnX`	`mixing and matching a kernel image here and a fs image here doesn't work to well`
`05:18.29`	`johnX`	`so building them from the same source tree at the same time ensures they "match"`
`05:18.33`	`johnX`	`that's all I meant`
`05:18.45`	`jnc`	`ohhhh`
`05:18.49`	`johnX`	`however, if you really want to bug test for 3.5.4 you'll want a 2.4 kernel I think, because AFAIK 3.5.4 will ship with 2.4 and 2.6 will be a later addon`
`05:18.57`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:19.16`	`jnc`	`shoot, so i should really be finding a way to build this in a chroot huh`
`05:19.48`	`johnX`	`on my ubuntu 5.10 machine I can run gcc 2.95 arm-cross compiler outside of chroot`
`05:20.15`	`johnX`	`if you download that package I linked, and follow the directions here, you should be fine: http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/ZaurusKernels`
`05:20.37`	`johnX`	`ubuntu 5.10 on an Athlon 64 I should say`
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`05:30.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 1. GCC 2.95 does not work on x86_64`
`05:30.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 2. you shouldn't ever need or use GCC 2.95`
`05:30.49`	`johnX`	`what about to build the 2.4 kernel?`
`05:30.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`OZ has used 2.6 kernels for nearly a year now`
`05:31.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`IIRC`
`05:31.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`certainly 6 months`
`05:31.20`	`johnX`	`not on all machines`
`05:31.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`all machines worth owning`
`05:31.30`	`johnX`	`heh`
`05:31.39`	`johnX`	`so a 5500 and a C1000 aren't worth owning?`
`05:31.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000 works w/ 2.6 fine, IIRC`
`05:31.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`5500 isn't, no`
`05:31.58`	`johnX`	`right, which happened just a bit ago`
`05:32.06`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000's release was just a bit ago`
`05:32.34`	`johnX`	`until mid december 2.6 on the C1000 was pretty buggy`
`05:32.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`either way`
`05:33.10`	`johnX`	`3.5.4 will be released with a 2.4 kernel for the C1000, C3000, and C3100`
`05:33.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`just backup your /lib/modules to /home somewhere when installing a new image`
`05:33.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`and restore it after`
`05:33.50`	`webmind`	`any idea when it will be released ?`
`05:34.01`	`johnX`	`http://openzaurus.org/wordpress/2006/01/09/openzaurus-354-release-plans/`
`05:34.13`	`johnX`	`no clue`
`05:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, if anyone here wants to build GPE on a x86_64 box`
`05:34.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you'll need to either hack sqlite-2* or copy an ipk from somewhere else`
`05:35.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`mainly because sqlite-2 doesn't cross-compile correctly`
`05:35.43`	`Luke-Jr`	`and it detects sizeof(char) = 8 (on x86_64) where sizeof(char) on ARM is 4`
`05:35.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`so the resulting ipk will not work`
`05:36.20`	`johnX`	`oh, and FWIW gcc-2.95 runs fine on x86_64, provided ia32-libs are installed (if you're on debian or ubuntu)`
`05:36.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`no, GCC 2.95 only runs on x86_32`
`05:36.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you are most likely putting your CPU into x86_32 mode for that`
`05:37.11`	`johnX`	`ok, but either way it can be made to run outside of a 32-bit chroot`
`05:37.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`only if your system is dual x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:37.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`it won't work on a x86_64 only system`
`05:37.50`	`johnX`	`are there any x86_64 only systems?`
`05:37.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`mine is one example`
`05:37.59`	`jnc`	`mine is`
`05:38.00`	`Luke-Jr`	`I'm sure it's not alone`
`05:38.10`	`jnc`	`i mean, i have amd64 but i don't use the ia32 compat stuff`
`05:38.16`	`Luke-Jr`	`dual systems use twice the disk space`
`05:38.22`	`johnX`	`not really`
`05:38.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes, really`
`05:38.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`you need libraries built for both x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:39.05`	`johnX`	`yes, but you don't need all the libraries for everything, just the stuff you need to run the app you want`
`05:40.15`	`jnc`	`the goal is to have a kernel 2.6.x which eliminates need for gcc-2.95 yes?`
`05:40.22`	`johnX`	`eventually`
`05:40.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`pretty much`
`05:40.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`the only reason I can see to use a 2.4 kernel these days is if you need a microphone`
`05:40.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's not working in 2.6 yet`
`05:41.10`	`johnX`	`or if you're testing for the 3.5.4 release or if you have a 5500 :)`
`05:41.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ah, sad`
`05:42.10`	`johnX`	`well I have a C1000 too`
`05:42.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`my OZ fork is optimized and only runs on SL-C models`
`05:42.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`Cxx0, mainly, though I imagine Cxk wouldn't be too difficult to add`
`05:42.58`	`johnX`	`what is so different that you needed to fork it?`
`05:43.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`but when/if I get a Cxk, I wouldn't be cross compiling for it`
`05:43.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: for a start, optimizing my packages`
`05:43.49`	`Luke-Jr`	`OpenSSH instead of Dropbear`
`05:44.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`stuff like that`
`05:44.17`	`johnX`	`yeah, I gave up on dropbear too`
`05:44.29`	`johnX`	`one of the first things I do on a new image is kill dropbear and install openssh`
`05:44.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`there were more differences back a few months, when GPE images weren't too nice w/ OZ`
`05:45.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`Like including firefox and killing keylaunch (which broke the image at the time)`
`05:45.22`	`Luke-Jr`	`and gpe-appmgr`
`05:45.26`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is interesting`
`05:45.34`	`grendal_prime`	`it works with cumulus`
`05:45.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`?`
`05:45.54`	`grendal_prime`	`set to /dev/ttyS3`
`05:45.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, it's fun to run KDE on the Z ;)`
`05:46.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, to use it anyway`
`05:46.21`	`johnX`	`I'm gonna try and make the e17 image compile`
`05:46.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`haven't been able to crosscompile it yet (and thus not run it)`
`05:46.25`	`johnX`	`that should be interesting`
`05:46.48`	`grendal_prime`	`Luke-Jr, i tried that it was weird`
`05:46.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`but just from running it on the Z's X display, it looks nice`
`05:46.57`	`grendal_prime`	`the kde bit on my 5500`
`05:47.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: I'm still stuck on getting kdelibs-dcop-native to build`
`05:47.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`I don't expect KDE would ever fit on a 5500...`
`05:47.20`	`grendal_prime`	`i dont think you can`
`05:47.20`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i may sell my C3000`
`05:47.27`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: ?`
`05:47.39`	`jnc`	`it's like ten thousand geek points`
`05:47.41`	`jnc`	`but uh`
`05:47.48`	`jnc`	`i can't see myself putting it to good use`
`05:47.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`install a full blown OS on it ;)`
`05:48.03`	`Luke-Jr`	`fork Gentoo`
`05:48.04`	`grendal_prime`	`i need a backup gps for the plane`
`05:48.27`	`johnX`	`that's a painful thought...stage 1 self-hosting install on a zaurus`
`05:48.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`hehe`
`05:48.40`	`johnX`	`building images takes long enough on my 800 Athlon`
`05:48.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, that's why the OS I'm working on supports and encourages peer-to-peer distributed compiling ;)`
`05:49.21`	`jnc`	`the crap for networking built into the Z disturbs me`
`05:49.23`	`grendal_prime`	`the 5500 is perfect size. i need to get the gps app working...i have the entire os running from sd, so i can back it all up and have a second copy of it just in case`
`05:49.39`	`johnX`	`that's pretty slick`
`05:49.41`	`jnc`	`i've got a DWL-660 wifi card and USB host cable adapter`
`05:49.44`	`jnc`	`etc.`
`05:49.52`	`jnc`	`it's too unwieldly IMO`
`05:50.07`	`grendal_prime`	`the thing fits perfect in my flight jacket incase the console in the plane croaks..(which it has done in the past)`
`05:50.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: add WiFi internally?`
`05:50.38`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: no space, really`
`05:50.54`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: adding bluetooth internally has been discussed and it may be possible`
`05:50.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: IIRC, someone on the forum was looking at adding it`
`05:51.03`	`jnc`	`if you replace the internal drive`
`05:51.13`	`jnc`	`hmm yeah`
`05:51.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`via a second USB host connection`
`05:51.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's apparently in the Cxk chips`
`05:51.36`	`jnc`	`oh, far out`
`05:51.57`	`jnc`	`know where i might get a shorter more concise USB host cable?`
`05:52.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`so add a USB wifi dongle to that and you've got builtin wireless`
`05:52.08`	`jnc`	`the one i have is a GoldX, it sticks out too far`
`05:52.20`	`Luke-Jr`	`Walmart sells USB adapters...`
`05:52.50`	`jnc`	`um. i'm looking for a one piece USB mini A male to USB A female`
`05:52.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`right`
`05:53.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`I think that's in the set`
`05:53.09`	`grendal_prime`	`this thing picks up 4 sats even when im inside the house`
`05:53.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it has a USB extention cable and onepiece adapters for all the sizes`
`05:53.18`	`jnc`	`the ones i saw were all changeable ends and stuff`
`05:53.21`	`jnc`	`ohh hmm`
`05:53.33`	`grendal_prime`	`but why the hell does one app see it and not the other`
`05:53.43`	`jnc`	`i'd really like one that is flexible, like the iRiver host cable`
`05:53.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`hm`
`05:54.30`	`jnc`	`i think i'm going to hook up a Model M keyboard to my zaurus`
`05:54.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`lol`
`05:54.37`	`jnc`	`i know the USB adapter to use`
`05:54.49`	`jnc`	`there is only one USB ps2 adapter that will do it right`
`05:54.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`oh`
`05:55.05`	`jnc`	`the Model M fan site sells them for $50usd and up`
`05:55.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`honestly, I just want one of those Apple USB keyboards w/ side ports`
`05:55.10`	`jnc`	`but they are cheap if you know what they are`
`05:56.11`	`jnc`	`side ports?`
`05:56.19`	`jnc`	`the apple pro keyboards?`
`05:56.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`on the left/right of the kb, there's USB ports`
`05:57.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`you can never have enough USB ports ;)`
`05:57.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got all 8 of mine filled`
`05:57.19`	`jnc`	`yeah`
`05:57.32`	`johnX`	`anyone here have a video player working under GPE?`
`05:57.42`	`jnc`	`it's a shame USB fucking sucks with recent linux kernels on desktop hardware sigh`
`05:57.56`	`jnc`	`it hasn't worked right since kernel 2.6.5`
`05:58.16`	`jnc`	`and i swear it gets worse with each kernel release`
`05:58.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: eh? news to me`
`05:58.41`	`jnc`	`oh um`
`05:58.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: haven't tried, sorry`
`05:58.53`	`jnc`	`urb request failures are the new cool, apparently`
`05:58.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: you're not using the USB Block Device grab?`
`05:59.04`	`Luke-Jr`	`crap*`
`05:59.08`	`grendal_prime`	`ok sys log reports the device is being pluged in... reports it as ttys03 at port 0xc48503f8 (irq =35)`
`05:59.36`	`grendal_prime`	`but cumulus sees the card at ttys3 now is that odd or is that pretty normal?`
`05:59.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`normal/expected`
`06:01.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`what's happening is that the kernel is naming it ttyS03`
`06:01.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`but udev is calling it ttyS3`
`06:01.53`	`grendal_prime`	`ok well when i put in ttys3 on qpeGPS does not see it, however cumulus does`
`06:01.55`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i have many devices with USB; 6 channel audio, midi interfaces, serial GPS converter, several input devices, bluetooth adapter, storage devices`
`06:02.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I don't know what my USB ports are doing, I just know they're filled`
`06:02.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: capitalize it properly`
`06:03.26`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: it's been a losing battle since kernel 2.6.5; as of kernel 2.6.15 all non-input USB devices are rendered useless`
`06:04.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: er... good thing I haven't upgraded`
`06:04.05`	`grendal_prime`	`with the cap S ya that is right`
`06:04.47`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: kernel 2.6.11 was acceptable functionally with USB, other things were broken for amd64 though`
`06:05.57`	`Luke-Jr`	`OS: GNU/Linux 2.6.14-gentoo-r2-ljr/x86_64 - CPU: 1 x AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+ (2202.883 MHz) - Processes: 218 - Uptime: 6d 23h 53m - Users: 31 - Load Average: 3.29 - Memory Usage: 2088MB/1003MB (208%)`
`06:08.03`	`jnc`	`208%?`
`06:08.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`yup :\`
`06:08.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`1 gig just isn't enough`
`06:08.29`	`jnc`	`what the hell does that mean`
`06:08.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`2.08 times total RAM`
`06:09.05`	`jnc`	`what, that includes swap?`
`06:09.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes`
`06:09.11`	`jnc`	`ah]`
`06:09.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it's usage`
`06:09.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got 5 GB swap activated now`
`06:10.57`	`jnc`	`that's a lot`
`06:11.11`	`jnc`	`what do you do that requires such a great deal of memory?`
`06:12.54`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I'm a multitasker`
`06:13.12`	`Luke-Jr`	`on my IRC/OE virtual desktop alone, I have 8 windows open`
`06:13.29`	`Luke-Jr`	`and I've got nearly 20 virtual desktops, about 10 of which are used on average`
`06:14.47`	`jnc`	`short ass attention span wow`
`06:14.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`though I suspect my memory goes to unknown places too`
`06:15.16`	`jnc`	`the most workspaces i've needed to fill was about six`
`06:15.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`even before I start X on a fresh boot, there's around 200 MB used IIRC`
`06:15.23`	`jnc`	`it was way too much`
`06:15.38`	`Luke-Jr`	`I often get one desktop waiting on a long process`
`06:15.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`and go off to another`
`06:15.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`or I'm just doing tons of crap at once ;)`
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`06:17.06`	`johnX`	`I farm off long term processes to entirely different machines`
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`06:24.52`	`jnc`	`i think i may end up building inside the chroot`
`06:24.54`	`jnc`	`sigh`
`06:30.55`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is making me fkn crazy`
`06:31.10`	`grendal_prime`	`makes no sence what so ever`
`06:34.20`	`johnX`	`jnc, did you try installing ia32-libs and running gcc-arm ( or whatever it's called)?`
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`06:59.36`	`jnc`	`johnX: i'm not going to muddle my system up with 32-bit code support`
`06:59.52`	`jnc`	`johnX: i will likely just run a chroot`
`06:59.55`	`jnc`	`get'r'done`
`07:00.00`	`johnX`	`whatever you say`
`07:00.50`	`johnX`	`all I can say is I've had ia32-libs installed on ubuntu here for months with no problem`
`07:00.57`	`johnX`	`but of course it's your choice`
`07:01.30`	`jnc`	`the point is that i know why this build process is failing`
`07:01.54`	`johnX`	`ah`
`07:01.59`	`jnc`	`really, there should be some logic to tell users that the reason it failed is that gcc-2.95 is not buildable on amd64`
`07:02.20`	`johnX`	`bitbake has some rough edges ;)`
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`07:09.18`	`jnc`	`hmm what's that URL for how to build OZ?`
`07:09.24`	`jnc`	`i lost it, google isn't much help`
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`07:12.07`	`jnc`	`johnX: http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/OpenZaurus ... what's the URL for the page that shows you steps needed to build OZ?`
`07:12.25`	`jnc`	`i can't seem to remember/find it`
`07:13.06`	`johnX`	`http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/GettingStarted`
`07:13.31`	`johnX`	`is that what you mean?`
`07:13.57`	`jnc`	`ah yes!`
`07:14.10`	`jnc`	`perfect, thank yo`
`07:14.16`	`jnc`	`u$`
`07:27.35`	`johnX`	`I'm off to sleep, stayed up way too late last night`
`07:27.41`	`johnX`	`'night all`
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`07:44.08`	`jnc`	`okay, bitbake nano is rolling in an ia32 chroot`
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`08:48.07`	`XorA`	`morning`
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`09:09.37`	`NetAmp`	`ibot slashdot`
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`09:38.38`	`XorA`	`yo alan`
`09:38.59`	`alan\|laptop`	`hey XorA`
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`04:32.09`	`grendal_prime`	`hey guys hows it hanging?`
`04:32.21`	`grendal_prime`	`sooo i got my new holux gps ultra`
`04:32.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`can you get me one? =p`
`04:32.36`	`grendal_prime`	`hehehe`
`04:32.52`	`grendal_prime`	`was cheep actually took forever to get here though`
`04:32.52`	`Luke-Jr`	`does it work?`
`04:32.56`	`grendal_prime`	`dont know`
`04:33.10`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, get me one and I'll try to see if I can make it work =p`
`04:33.33`	`grendal_prime`	`was going to ask if there was a quick and dirty app to check it with..i know slightly more than dick on the subject`
`04:33.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`not that I have time to give it a good attempt, actually :/`
`04:33.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`shrug. try gpsdrive`
`04:33.57`	`grendal_prime`	`opie`
`04:34.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`What Z?`
`04:34.28`	`grendal_prime`	`5500`
`04:34.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`eww`
`04:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`um`
`04:34.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`what kind of GPS is it?`
`04:34.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`not USB, obviously...`
`04:34.50`	`grendal_prime`	`ive got several gps apps installed`
`04:34.55`	`grendal_prime`	`its cf`
`04:34.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok`
`04:35.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`plug it in and paste the last bits of 'dmesg' on pastebin.com`
`04:35.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`run dmesg in a terminal`
`04:35.39`	`grendal_prime`	`it may just work...it recognizes it as a bluetooth sleve?`
`04:35.43`	`grendal_prime`	`ok hold on`
`04:35.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`wtf? it's bluetooth?`
`04:36.37`	`grendal_prime`	`compaq ipaq blooth sleeve is what the cf reporter deally bobber says`
`04:36.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`is it one piece or two?`
`04:38.27`	`grendal_prime`	`one`
`04:38.39`	`Luke-Jr`	`ok, then it confuses me =p`
`04:38.57`	`grendal_prime`	`brb`
`04:47.07`	`jnc`	`umm, anybody awake that knows how to build OZ ?`
`04:47.22`	`jnc`	`i'm on amd64 and want to build the 3.5.4 branc`
`04:47.25`	`jnc`	`branch, evne`
`04:53.40`	`mnm`	`Is there anybody nice enough with the proper sdk do me a BIG favor and compile for me a compatible binary of a patched hostap driver module that I have for the vanilla 3.5.3 OZ collie kernel for a Zaurus 5500? :)`
`04:54.08`	`jnc`	`!VOTEKICK mnm`
`04:54.09`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Dunno?`
`04:54.16`	`mnm`	`?`
`04:54.59`	`mnm`	`i thought it was a support channel and nice people with kind hearts.. :(`
`04:55.31`	`jnc`	`yes`
`04:55.38`	`jnc`	`not sheep to be slaughtered`
`04:55.47`	`mnm`	`ok good`
`04:56.17`	`jnc`	`cdbot: trouble is, the build requires a 2.4.20 kernel be built, and that needs gcc 2.95`
`04:56.38`	`jnc`	`my host is amd64. so, the problem for me is that gcc 2.95 does not build on amd64 host`
`04:56.58`	`mnm`	`this is about my request or I'm out of it...`
`04:57.28`	`cdbot`	`jnc: Don't know, don't care`
`04:57.45`	`jnc`	`oh`
`04:57.50`	`mnm`	`heh`
`04:58.53`	`mnm`	`Well if anybody likes to take up my request just gimme a holler. I'll be around...`
`04:59.02`	`mnm`	`Thanks`
`04:59.55`	`grendal_prime`	`grrr`
`05:00.05`	`grendal_prime`	`i think its working i just cant figure out what tty its on`
`05:00.14`	`jnc`	`what is 'it'`
`05:00.39`	`grendal_prime`	`gps`
`05:00.52`	`grendal_prime`	`holux ultra`
`05:01.00`	`grendal_prime`	`gm270`
`05:01.43`	`jnc`	`ohhh no kidding`
`05:01.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a gpslim236`
`05:01.53`	`jnc`	`i like it a lot'`
`05:02.48`	`grendal_prime`	`this is a cf card on a 5500`
`05:02.59`	`jnc`	`okay`
`05:03.01`	`grendal_prime`	`any advice for configureing the thing would be appreciated`
`05:03.19`	`jnc`	`the GPSlim236 needed to talk to gpsd before it would spit out NEMA`
`05:03.43`	`jnc`	`i would diagnose your card to make sure it works on another system first, if possible and convenient`
`05:03.55`	`grendal_prime`	`what system?`
`05:04.04`	`jnc`	`maybe a windows box`
`05:04.06`	`grendal_prime`	`i have a laptop with a pcmcia`
`05:04.14`	`grendal_prime`	`dont have a single windows system here`
`05:04.15`	`johnX`	`jnc: if you don't have any luck finding gcc-2.95 compiled for amd64 you might try some of the stuff here: https://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/21/debian-amd64-howto.html#id271960`
`05:04.26`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay`
`05:04.35`	`grendal_prime`	`see this jnc http://midtoad.homelinux.org/wp/index.php?p=9`
`05:04.45`	`jnc`	`johnX: it seems though no one thinks gcc 2.95 can be made to compile on amd64`
`05:04.46`	`grendal_prime`	`that is the exact screen i have in front of me..`
`05:04.49`	`jnc`	`which may be true`
`05:05.55`	`johnX`	`if you're really lucky, after installing ia32-libs you might be able to just run the i386 binaries`
`05:06.12`	`grendal_prime`	`now question is will gpsd talk to it if it is unable to get a fix. because im inside right now`
`05:08.50`	`jnc`	`johnX: hmm`
`05:09.18`	`jnc`	`johnX: okay that being said, maybe i can grab a build from someone else`
`05:09.39`	`johnX`	`what system are you compiling for?`
`05:09.40`	`jnc`	`amd64 is obviously not a supported build platform for the 3.5.4 branch`
`05:09.59`	`johnX`	`and are you intentionally building the kernel? or is it just getting pulled in?`
`05:10.01`	`jnc`	`since the 3.5.4 branch requires 2.4.20 kernel, which needs the gcc 2.95 to build`
`05:10.09`	`jnc`	`it's being pulled in`
`05:10.22`	`jnc`	`2.6.x kernels do not exist (AFAIK) in the 3.5.4 oz branch`
`05:10.36`	`jnc`	`which is what i want to target, and file bug reports against`
`05:10.47`	`grendal_prime`	`ya this is going to make me crazy`
`05:11.06`	`johnX`	`jnc: yeah, I skipped ahead to the 2.6 kernel and all the latest stuff`
`05:11.20`	`jnc`	`johnX: i heard that HEAD was borked, to stay away from it`
`05:11.32`	`johnX`	`I think I'm on the prebreakage tag`
`05:11.36`	`johnX`	`or whatever the heck`
`05:11.59`	`johnX`	`anyways, I built 2.6.15+GPE for my C1000 the other day`
`05:12.16`	`johnX`	`after quick fix from RP over in #oe last night everything works swell`
`05:12.25`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:12.32`	`jnc`	`sounds good`
`05:13.02`	`johnX`	`here...I'm gonna take a crack at running gcc-2.95 arm-cross compiler on my Athlon 64`
`05:13.12`	`jnc`	`it's not going to work`
`05:13.21`	`johnX`	`well I have a chroot :)`
`05:13.25`	`jnc`	`ohhh`
`05:14.00`	`jnc`	`i have a chroot for things like macromedia flash web browser plugin, and mplayer win32 codecs`
`05:14.34`	`johnX`	`download this http://handhelds.org/download/projects/toolchain/archive/cross-2.95.3.tar.bz2`
`05:14.59`	`johnX`	`unpack it somewhere and run ./2.95.3/bin/arm-linux-gcc --version`
`05:14.59`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:15.11`	`johnX`	`get the ia32-libs package if you don't have it`
`05:15.15`	`jnc`	`the alternative is to supplant the 2.4.20 kernel with a 2.6.x one`
`05:15.27`	`jnc`	`which i think may be more desirable to me`
`05:15.48`	`johnX`	`what Zaurus are you compiling for?`
`05:16.00`	`jnc`	`spizt`
`05:16.30`	`jnc`	`Sharp Zaurus C3000 (spitz)`
`05:16.33`	`johnX`	`yeah 2.6 should be fine on that`
`05:16.48`	`jnc`	`i've got a 2.6.x kernel on my hardware now, it's just the rest of the OS that is fubar`
`05:16.56`	`johnX`	`ah`
`05:17.14`	`johnX`	`and you can get around that nicely if you just compile your own image at the same time as the kernel`
`05:17.50`	`jnc`	`err? what do you mean by that`
`05:18.11`	`johnX`	`mixing and matching a kernel image here and a fs image here doesn't work to well`
`05:18.29`	`johnX`	`so building them from the same source tree at the same time ensures they "match"`
`05:18.33`	`johnX`	`that's all I meant`
`05:18.45`	`jnc`	`ohhhh`
`05:18.49`	`johnX`	`however, if you really want to bug test for 3.5.4 you'll want a 2.4 kernel I think, because AFAIK 3.5.4 will ship with 2.4 and 2.6 will be a later addon`
`05:18.57`	`jnc`	`hm`
`05:19.16`	`jnc`	`shoot, so i should really be finding a way to build this in a chroot huh`
`05:19.48`	`johnX`	`on my ubuntu 5.10 machine I can run gcc 2.95 arm-cross compiler outside of chroot`
`05:20.15`	`johnX`	`if you download that package I linked, and follow the directions here, you should be fine: http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/ZaurusKernels`
`05:20.37`	`johnX`	`ubuntu 5.10 on an Athlon 64 I should say`
`05:29.03`	`*** join/#openzaurus Timelord0 (n=TL@4.78.4.43)`
`05:30.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 1. GCC 2.95 does not work on x86_64`
`05:30.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: 2. you shouldn't ever need or use GCC 2.95`
`05:30.49`	`johnX`	`what about to build the 2.4 kernel?`
`05:30.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`OZ has used 2.6 kernels for nearly a year now`
`05:31.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`IIRC`
`05:31.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`certainly 6 months`
`05:31.20`	`johnX`	`not on all machines`
`05:31.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`all machines worth owning`
`05:31.30`	`johnX`	`heh`
`05:31.39`	`johnX`	`so a 5500 and a C1000 aren't worth owning?`
`05:31.48`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000 works w/ 2.6 fine, IIRC`
`05:31.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`5500 isn't, no`
`05:31.58`	`johnX`	`right, which happened just a bit ago`
`05:32.06`	`Luke-Jr`	`C1000's release was just a bit ago`
`05:32.34`	`johnX`	`until mid december 2.6 on the C1000 was pretty buggy`
`05:32.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`either way`
`05:33.10`	`johnX`	`3.5.4 will be released with a 2.4 kernel for the C1000, C3000, and C3100`
`05:33.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`just backup your /lib/modules to /home somewhere when installing a new image`
`05:33.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`and restore it after`
`05:33.50`	`webmind`	`any idea when it will be released ?`
`05:34.01`	`johnX`	`http://openzaurus.org/wordpress/2006/01/09/openzaurus-354-release-plans/`
`05:34.13`	`johnX`	`no clue`
`05:34.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, if anyone here wants to build GPE on a x86_64 box`
`05:34.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you'll need to either hack sqlite-2* or copy an ipk from somewhere else`
`05:35.23`	`Luke-Jr`	`mainly because sqlite-2 doesn't cross-compile correctly`
`05:35.43`	`Luke-Jr`	`and it detects sizeof(char) = 8 (on x86_64) where sizeof(char) on ARM is 4`
`05:35.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`so the resulting ipk will not work`
`05:36.20`	`johnX`	`oh, and FWIW gcc-2.95 runs fine on x86_64, provided ia32-libs are installed (if you're on debian or ubuntu)`
`05:36.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`no, GCC 2.95 only runs on x86_32`
`05:36.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`you are most likely putting your CPU into x86_32 mode for that`
`05:37.11`	`johnX`	`ok, but either way it can be made to run outside of a 32-bit chroot`
`05:37.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`only if your system is dual x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:37.33`	`Luke-Jr`	`it won't work on a x86_64 only system`
`05:37.50`	`johnX`	`are there any x86_64 only systems?`
`05:37.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`mine is one example`
`05:37.59`	`jnc`	`mine is`
`05:38.00`	`Luke-Jr`	`I'm sure it's not alone`
`05:38.10`	`jnc`	`i mean, i have amd64 but i don't use the ia32 compat stuff`
`05:38.16`	`Luke-Jr`	`dual systems use twice the disk space`
`05:38.22`	`johnX`	`not really`
`05:38.25`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes, really`
`05:38.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`you need libraries built for both x86_64 and x86_32`
`05:39.05`	`johnX`	`yes, but you don't need all the libraries for everything, just the stuff you need to run the app you want`
`05:40.15`	`jnc`	`the goal is to have a kernel 2.6.x which eliminates need for gcc-2.95 yes?`
`05:40.22`	`johnX`	`eventually`
`05:40.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`pretty much`
`05:40.46`	`Luke-Jr`	`the only reason I can see to use a 2.4 kernel these days is if you need a microphone`
`05:40.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's not working in 2.6 yet`
`05:41.10`	`johnX`	`or if you're testing for the 3.5.4 release or if you have a 5500 :)`
`05:41.59`	`Luke-Jr`	`ah, sad`
`05:42.10`	`johnX`	`well I have a C1000 too`
`05:42.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`my OZ fork is optimized and only runs on SL-C models`
`05:42.40`	`Luke-Jr`	`Cxx0, mainly, though I imagine Cxk wouldn't be too difficult to add`
`05:42.58`	`johnX`	`what is so different that you needed to fork it?`
`05:43.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`but when/if I get a Cxk, I wouldn't be cross compiling for it`
`05:43.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: for a start, optimizing my packages`
`05:43.49`	`Luke-Jr`	`OpenSSH instead of Dropbear`
`05:44.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`stuff like that`
`05:44.17`	`johnX`	`yeah, I gave up on dropbear too`
`05:44.29`	`johnX`	`one of the first things I do on a new image is kill dropbear and install openssh`
`05:44.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`there were more differences back a few months, when GPE images weren't too nice w/ OZ`
`05:45.11`	`Luke-Jr`	`Like including firefox and killing keylaunch (which broke the image at the time)`
`05:45.22`	`Luke-Jr`	`and gpe-appmgr`
`05:45.26`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is interesting`
`05:45.34`	`grendal_prime`	`it works with cumulus`
`05:45.36`	`Luke-Jr`	`?`
`05:45.54`	`grendal_prime`	`set to /dev/ttyS3`
`05:45.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`BTW, it's fun to run KDE on the Z ;)`
`05:46.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, to use it anyway`
`05:46.21`	`johnX`	`I'm gonna try and make the e17 image compile`
`05:46.24`	`Luke-Jr`	`haven't been able to crosscompile it yet (and thus not run it)`
`05:46.25`	`johnX`	`that should be interesting`
`05:46.48`	`grendal_prime`	`Luke-Jr, i tried that it was weird`
`05:46.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`but just from running it on the Z's X display, it looks nice`
`05:46.57`	`grendal_prime`	`the kde bit on my 5500`
`05:47.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: I'm still stuck on getting kdelibs-dcop-native to build`
`05:47.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`I don't expect KDE would ever fit on a 5500...`
`05:47.20`	`grendal_prime`	`i dont think you can`
`05:47.20`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i may sell my C3000`
`05:47.27`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: ?`
`05:47.39`	`jnc`	`it's like ten thousand geek points`
`05:47.41`	`jnc`	`but uh`
`05:47.48`	`jnc`	`i can't see myself putting it to good use`
`05:47.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`install a full blown OS on it ;)`
`05:48.03`	`Luke-Jr`	`fork Gentoo`
`05:48.04`	`grendal_prime`	`i need a backup gps for the plane`
`05:48.27`	`johnX`	`that's a painful thought...stage 1 self-hosting install on a zaurus`
`05:48.35`	`Luke-Jr`	`hehe`
`05:48.40`	`johnX`	`building images takes long enough on my 800 Athlon`
`05:48.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`well, that's why the OS I'm working on supports and encourages peer-to-peer distributed compiling ;)`
`05:49.21`	`jnc`	`the crap for networking built into the Z disturbs me`
`05:49.23`	`grendal_prime`	`the 5500 is perfect size. i need to get the gps app working...i have the entire os running from sd, so i can back it all up and have a second copy of it just in case`
`05:49.39`	`johnX`	`that's pretty slick`
`05:49.41`	`jnc`	`i've got a DWL-660 wifi card and USB host cable adapter`
`05:49.44`	`jnc`	`etc.`
`05:49.52`	`jnc`	`it's too unwieldly IMO`
`05:50.07`	`grendal_prime`	`the thing fits perfect in my flight jacket incase the console in the plane croaks..(which it has done in the past)`
`05:50.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: add WiFi internally?`
`05:50.38`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: no space, really`
`05:50.54`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: adding bluetooth internally has been discussed and it may be possible`
`05:50.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: IIRC, someone on the forum was looking at adding it`
`05:51.03`	`jnc`	`if you replace the internal drive`
`05:51.13`	`jnc`	`hmm yeah`
`05:51.15`	`Luke-Jr`	`via a second USB host connection`
`05:51.26`	`Luke-Jr`	`that's apparently in the Cxk chips`
`05:51.36`	`jnc`	`oh, far out`
`05:51.57`	`jnc`	`know where i might get a shorter more concise USB host cable?`
`05:52.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`so add a USB wifi dongle to that and you've got builtin wireless`
`05:52.08`	`jnc`	`the one i have is a GoldX, it sticks out too far`
`05:52.20`	`Luke-Jr`	`Walmart sells USB adapters...`
`05:52.50`	`jnc`	`um. i'm looking for a one piece USB mini A male to USB A female`
`05:52.58`	`Luke-Jr`	`right`
`05:53.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`I think that's in the set`
`05:53.09`	`grendal_prime`	`this thing picks up 4 sats even when im inside the house`
`05:53.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it has a USB extention cable and onepiece adapters for all the sizes`
`05:53.18`	`jnc`	`the ones i saw were all changeable ends and stuff`
`05:53.21`	`jnc`	`ohh hmm`
`05:53.33`	`grendal_prime`	`but why the hell does one app see it and not the other`
`05:53.43`	`jnc`	`i'd really like one that is flexible, like the iRiver host cable`
`05:53.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`hm`
`05:54.30`	`jnc`	`i think i'm going to hook up a Model M keyboard to my zaurus`
`05:54.34`	`Luke-Jr`	`lol`
`05:54.37`	`jnc`	`i know the USB adapter to use`
`05:54.49`	`jnc`	`there is only one USB ps2 adapter that will do it right`
`05:54.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`oh`
`05:55.05`	`jnc`	`the Model M fan site sells them for $50usd and up`
`05:55.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`honestly, I just want one of those Apple USB keyboards w/ side ports`
`05:55.10`	`jnc`	`but they are cheap if you know what they are`
`05:56.11`	`jnc`	`side ports?`
`05:56.19`	`jnc`	`the apple pro keyboards?`
`05:56.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`on the left/right of the kb, there's USB ports`
`05:57.09`	`Luke-Jr`	`you can never have enough USB ports ;)`
`05:57.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got all 8 of mine filled`
`05:57.19`	`jnc`	`yeah`
`05:57.32`	`johnX`	`anyone here have a video player working under GPE?`
`05:57.42`	`jnc`	`it's a shame USB fucking sucks with recent linux kernels on desktop hardware sigh`
`05:57.56`	`jnc`	`it hasn't worked right since kernel 2.6.5`
`05:58.16`	`jnc`	`and i swear it gets worse with each kernel release`
`05:58.37`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: eh? news to me`
`05:58.41`	`jnc`	`oh um`
`05:58.45`	`Luke-Jr`	`johnX: haven't tried, sorry`
`05:58.53`	`jnc`	`urb request failures are the new cool, apparently`
`05:58.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: you're not using the USB Block Device grab?`
`05:59.04`	`Luke-Jr`	`crap*`
`05:59.08`	`grendal_prime`	`ok sys log reports the device is being pluged in... reports it as ttys03 at port 0xc48503f8 (irq =35)`
`05:59.36`	`grendal_prime`	`but cumulus sees the card at ttys3 now is that odd or is that pretty normal?`
`05:59.51`	`Luke-Jr`	`normal/expected`
`06:01.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`what's happening is that the kernel is naming it ttyS03`
`06:01.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`but udev is calling it ttyS3`
`06:01.53`	`grendal_prime`	`ok well when i put in ttys3 on qpeGPS does not see it, however cumulus does`
`06:01.55`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: i have many devices with USB; 6 channel audio, midi interfaces, serial GPS converter, several input devices, bluetooth adapter, storage devices`
`06:02.21`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I don't know what my USB ports are doing, I just know they're filled`
`06:02.30`	`Luke-Jr`	`grendal_prime: capitalize it properly`
`06:03.26`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: it's been a losing battle since kernel 2.6.5; as of kernel 2.6.15 all non-input USB devices are rendered useless`
`06:04.01`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: er... good thing I haven't upgraded`
`06:04.05`	`grendal_prime`	`with the cap S ya that is right`
`06:04.47`	`jnc`	`Luke-Jr: kernel 2.6.11 was acceptable functionally with USB, other things were broken for amd64 though`
`06:05.57`	`Luke-Jr`	`OS: GNU/Linux 2.6.14-gentoo-r2-ljr/x86_64 - CPU: 1 x AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+ (2202.883 MHz) - Processes: 218 - Uptime: 6d 23h 53m - Users: 31 - Load Average: 3.29 - Memory Usage: 2088MB/1003MB (208%)`
`06:08.03`	`jnc`	`208%?`
`06:08.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`yup :\`
`06:08.19`	`Luke-Jr`	`1 gig just isn't enough`
`06:08.29`	`jnc`	`what the hell does that mean`
`06:08.47`	`Luke-Jr`	`2.08 times total RAM`
`06:09.05`	`jnc`	`what, that includes swap?`
`06:09.07`	`Luke-Jr`	`yes`
`06:09.11`	`jnc`	`ah]`
`06:09.14`	`Luke-Jr`	`it's usage`
`06:09.31`	`Luke-Jr`	`I've got 5 GB swap activated now`
`06:10.57`	`jnc`	`that's a lot`
`06:11.11`	`jnc`	`what do you do that requires such a great deal of memory?`
`06:12.54`	`Luke-Jr`	`jnc: I'm a multitasker`
`06:13.12`	`Luke-Jr`	`on my IRC/OE virtual desktop alone, I have 8 windows open`
`06:13.29`	`Luke-Jr`	`and I've got nearly 20 virtual desktops, about 10 of which are used on average`
`06:14.47`	`jnc`	`short ass attention span wow`
`06:14.55`	`Luke-Jr`	`though I suspect my memory goes to unknown places too`
`06:15.16`	`jnc`	`the most workspaces i've needed to fill was about six`
`06:15.18`	`Luke-Jr`	`even before I start X on a fresh boot, there's around 200 MB used IIRC`
`06:15.23`	`jnc`	`it was way too much`
`06:15.38`	`Luke-Jr`	`I often get one desktop waiting on a long process`
`06:15.44`	`Luke-Jr`	`and go off to another`
`06:15.56`	`Luke-Jr`	`or I'm just doing tons of crap at once ;)`
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`06:17.06`	`johnX`	`I farm off long term processes to entirely different machines`
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`06:24.52`	`jnc`	`i think i may end up building inside the chroot`
`06:24.54`	`jnc`	`sigh`
`06:30.55`	`grendal_prime`	`ok this is making me fkn crazy`
`06:31.10`	`grendal_prime`	`makes no sence what so ever`
`06:34.20`	`johnX`	`jnc, did you try installing ia32-libs and running gcc-arm ( or whatever it's called)?`
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`06:59.36`	`jnc`	`johnX: i'm not going to muddle my system up with 32-bit code support`
`06:59.52`	`jnc`	`johnX: i will likely just run a chroot`
`06:59.55`	`jnc`	`get'r'done`
`07:00.00`	`johnX`	`whatever you say`
`07:00.50`	`johnX`	`all I can say is I've had ia32-libs installed on ubuntu here for months with no problem`
`07:00.57`	`johnX`	`but of course it's your choice`
`07:01.30`	`jnc`	`the point is that i know why this build process is failing`
`07:01.54`	`johnX`	`ah`
`07:01.59`	`jnc`	`really, there should be some logic to tell users that the reason it failed is that gcc-2.95 is not buildable on amd64`
`07:02.20`	`johnX`	`bitbake has some rough edges ;)`
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`07:09.18`	`jnc`	`hmm what's that URL for how to build OZ?`
`07:09.24`	`jnc`	`i lost it, google isn't much help`
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`07:12.07`	`jnc`	`johnX: http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/OpenZaurus ... what's the URL for the page that shows you steps needed to build OZ?`
`07:12.25`	`jnc`	`i can't seem to remember/find it`
`07:13.06`	`johnX`	`http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/GettingStarted`
`07:13.31`	`johnX`	`is that what you mean?`
`07:13.57`	`jnc`	`ah yes!`
`07:14.10`	`jnc`	`perfect, thank yo`
`07:14.16`	`jnc`	`u$`
`07:27.35`	`johnX`	`I'm off to sleep, stayed up way too late last night`
`07:27.41`	`johnX`	`'night all`
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`07:44.08`	`jnc`	`okay, bitbake nano is rolling in an ia32 chroot`
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`08:48.07`	`XorA`	`morning`
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`09:09.37`	`NetAmp`	`ibot slashdot`
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`09:36.06`	`alan\|laptop`	`bonjour, world !`
`09:38.38`	`XorA`	`yo alan`
`09:38.59`	`alan\|laptop`	`hey XorA`
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`23:09.38`	`grendal_prime`	`ok what exactly is familliar?`
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