| 00:28.19 | *** join/#openzaurus MrZaius (n=cragos@pool-70-106-140-221.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 00:28.48 | MrZaius | are there any features in the 2.6.x kernel-based versions of Oz that make them compelling for use on Collies/5500s? |
| 00:29.01 | MrZaius | like, features important enough to warrant giving up SD support |
| 00:36.03 | agaffney | doubtful |
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| 03:11.30 | kantlivelong | sup all |
| 03:14.32 | summatusmentis | how goes it kantlivelong |
| 03:14.34 | summatusmentis | ? |
| 03:14.57 | kantlivelong | good good, saying byebye to opie... i like it for its checkbook app but thats about it.. |
| 03:15.11 | kantlivelong | now i am going to do a custom install from a bootstrap |
| 03:18.02 | kantlivelong | summatusmentis: is there a direct place i can dl feeds and depends? |
| 03:18.36 | summatusmentis | what do you mean? |
| 03:19.39 | kantlivelong | like i wanna install fluxbox from a bootstrap install... i know its gonna require alot of depends so how can i get all the ones i need w/o goin thru "required depend" errors |
| 03:20.18 | summatusmentis | I don't know anything about the bootstrap install, does it have ipkg on it? |
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| 03:20.40 | kantlivelong | summatusmentis: yeah it just doesnt have X and whatnot |
| 03:20.56 | summatusmentis | so then, the feeds should be set up already? |
| 03:23.09 | kantlivelong | summatusmentis: also do u know of a good bank mgment app like opie has |
| 03:23.09 | kantlivelong | ? |
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| 03:24.33 | kantlivelong | hmmm |
| 03:25.12 | summatusmentis | bankg management? mmm... not really |
| 03:26.49 | kantlivelong | summatusmentis: u use opie? |
| 03:27.04 | summatusmentis | no, GPE, but I don't do bank management |
| 03:27.12 | kantlivelong | ah |
| 03:47.25 | *** part/#openzaurus kantlivelong (n=shawn@168.sub-70-200-43.myvzw.com) |
| 04:04.25 | SlickMcSly | is there a way to change the cpu frequency in OZ? |
| 04:12.30 | summatusmentis | doesn't apm do that? |
| 04:29.02 | SlickMcSly | power management cnotrols cpu frequency? that sounds counter-inuitive |
| 04:30.43 | SlickMcSly | i want to slow down my Z to save power but not suspend it so it can run cf cards |
| 04:31.12 | SlickMcSly | how do i change the cpu frequency on a C1k? |
| 04:34.40 | summatusmentis | I'm not sure exactly how, but I know acpi on a regular linux install, coupled w/ a capable kernel, allows for frequency control |
| 04:36.18 | SlickMcSly | Z most certainly doesn't have acpi |
| 04:36.33 | SlickMcSly | can't find anything on the forums about changing cpu speed either |
| 04:36.48 | summatusmentis | hrm |
| 04:36.48 | SlickMcSly | there's a cpuspeed pack in the feeds, does it work at all? |
| 04:38.02 | summatusmentis | no idea, try it |
| 04:39.28 | NAbyss | SlickMcSly: Take a look in /sys/ for cpufreq |
| 04:40.05 | SlickMcSly | NAbyss, /sys is a big place... |
| 04:40.10 | summatusmentis | SlickMcSly, good luck |
| 04:40.16 | NAbyss | SlickMcSly: find /sys -name cpufreq |
| 04:42.06 | SlickMcSly | i tried find /sys -name "*freq*" and it returned nothing |
| 04:42.24 | SlickMcSly | i tried find /sys -name "*cpu*" and it returned a directory with a file called crash_notes |
| 04:43.01 | NAbyss | Hmm |
| 04:43.11 | NAbyss | Not sure then.. I've only played with cpufreq stuff on desktop |
| 04:44.32 | SlickMcSly | pdaxrom is too buggy and cacko is bound to qte, i hope i don't have to use one of them for cpu control |
| 06:51.48 | SlickMcSly | oh well doesn't matter anymore |
| 06:52.06 | SlickMcSly | i'm looking at about a week b4 i'm out of the zaurus business |
| 06:52.19 | SlickMcSly | that's about how long before i get my hands on a htc universal |
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| 09:46.18 | YoG | hi, I'm trying to use the msn-protocol with gaim (on boxer). It's crashing (SEGFAULT) when I try to connect regardless if my z is connected to the network :-( |
| 10:13.37 | YoG | hi, I'm trying to use the msn-protocol with gaim (on boxer). It's crashing (SEGFAULT) when I try to connect regardless if my z is connected to the network :-( |
| 10:23.48 | YoG | anyone? |
| 10:30.48 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 10:47.57 | YoG | I installed oe and compiled qpe-gaim from the feed, someone told me that the msn protocol works fine on gpe... can anyone guide me howto port the protocol from gpe? |
| 10:51.24 | hrw|work | bump libgaim-qpe? |
| 10:51.28 | hrw|work | or how it was called |
| 10:52.12 | YoG | well... it's called libgaim-protocol-msn (I think) and it was compiled along with qpe-gaim... |
| 10:52.41 | hrw|work | then try to bump qpe-gaim |
| 10:52.54 | YoG | sorry, bump? |
| 10:53.04 | hrw|work | update version |
| 10:54.10 | YoG | ah |
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| 10:56.59 | YoG | hrw: sorry for the question, but, how do I do that? |
| 10:57.35 | hrw|work | qpe-gaim is from 2004 |
| 10:57.41 | hrw|work | libgaim which it use is 1.5.0 |
| 10:57.46 | hrw|work | so both are old |
| 10:58.33 | YoG | ok, so how do I update them? |
| 10:58.43 | hrw|work | use OE and try |
| 10:58.56 | hrw|work | I'm at work and bit busy so no help |
| 10:59.02 | YoG | ah |
| 10:59.55 | YoG | anybody else here maybe free and willing to help? |
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| 17:49.43 | mimecar | hi... |
| 17:51.04 | CoreDump|home | hi mimecar |
| 17:51.23 | mimecar | evening CoreDump|home |
| 17:58.39 | mimecar | have zaurus prize been increased ? |
| 17:58.58 | mimecar | on some shops (pricejapan and pulster) zaurus cost mor money :( |
| 17:59.59 | mimecar | I did today |
| 18:00.25 | mimecar | pricejapan to europe => C1000 for 350 € |
| 18:00.34 | mimecar | with voltage converter and dhl |
| 18:00.59 | CoreDump|home | trisoft is 335 euro w/o shipping |
| 18:01.39 | mimecar | pulster had a similar price |
| 18:03.33 | CoreDump|home | when I was donated my C1000, it was ~690 euro =) |
| 18:04.13 | mimecar | and some years ago my collie was ~600 euro |
| 18:04.17 | mimecar | :p |
| 18:04.17 | CoreDump|home | true |
| 18:04.28 | mimecar | 1 or 2 years |
| 18:04.41 | CoreDump|home | I remember paying 400 euro for a new Collie =) |
| 18:05.04 | CoreDump|home | well, I stll use it every day for ebook reading |
| 18:05.15 | mimecar | I don't use many ma collie |
| 18:05.21 | mimecar | s / ma / my |
| 18:05.40 | mimecar | i feel is an old pda compared with my palm tx |
| 18:05.48 | CoreDump|home | true |
| 18:05.59 | mimecar | althought it have some features palm don't have |
| 18:06.09 | CoreDump|home | like a keyboard muhaha |
| 18:06.28 | mimecar | a keyboard and a gcc environment xD |
| 18:06.55 | CoreDump|home | yuck, I'd rather not imagine compiling natively on a Z :\ |
| 18:07.01 | CoreDump|home | ~praise OE |
| 18:07.04 | ibot | All hail OE! |
| 18:07.15 | mimecar | I compiled gpe-calculator |
| 18:07.18 | mimecar | it was funny |
| 18:07.44 | CoreDump|home | hehe |
| 18:07.53 | CoreDump|home | well, sounds very painful to me |
| 18:08.13 | mimecar | but calculator "lost" some numbers |
| 18:08.21 | CoreDump|home | =D |
| 18:08.24 | mimecar | there was no posible insert a 7 or a 9 |
| 18:08.32 | mimecar | because i changed the numbers :P |
| 18:08.52 | CoreDump|home | lol |
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| 18:09.52 | mimecar | it was a test only |
| 18:10.32 | mimecar | there's a progect to por openzaurus to another pda |
| 18:10.36 | mimecar | such as my TX |
| 18:10.46 | mimecar | s/progect/project |
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| 18:13.54 | CoreDump|home | mimecar: I see |
| 18:14.12 | CoreDump|home | that should be trivial once you get a kernel to boot |
| 18:14.28 | mimecar | It would be funny run openzaurus on a "update pda" |
| 18:15.54 | CoreDump|home | OZ runs on ipaqs already ;) |
| 18:16.20 | mimecar | well, ipaq is a gameboy emulator :) |
| 18:16.26 | CoreDump|home | =D |
| 18:16.45 | CoreDump|home | the familiar people might disagree hehe |
| 18:18.06 | mimecar | my laptop is a gameboy emulator |
| 18:19.37 | CoreDump|home | http://hentges.net/tmp/screenshots/Zaurus/Akita/Misc/uae.jpg |
| 18:19.39 | CoreDump|home | =D |
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| 18:29.52 | mimeca2 | re |
| 18:30.46 | CoreDump|home | wb |
| 18:31.11 | mimeca2 | CoreDump|home: after some minutes, opie will run on my tx |
| 18:31.16 | mimeca2 | if I get it :p |
| 18:31.22 | CoreDump|home | =) |
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| 18:54.01 | mimeca2 | CoreDump|home: IT WORKS :) |
| 18:54.15 | CoreDump|home | excellent! |
| 18:55.07 | hrw | hi |
| 18:55.19 | hrw | mimeca2: it was expected to be running |
| 18:55.38 | hrw | too bad that palm guys are not playing^Wcooperate with OE |
| 18:56.04 | mimeca2 | hrw: is a different project, isn't it ? |
| 18:56.36 | hrw | mimeca2: last time I checked some of those guys used OE |
| 18:58.21 | mimeca2 | it looks good, but wifi doesn't appear |
| 18:59.04 | mimeca2 | then, they only get some stuff to build the system ? |
| 19:00.33 | hrw | WLAN6064EB from SyChip |
| 19:01.03 | hrw | mimeca2: tx has nice audio - same as zaurus 6000l |
| 19:01.25 | mimeca2 | I find a big difference between TX and collie screen |
| 19:01.36 | hrw | man.. light years |
| 19:02.30 | mimeca2 | wifi doesn't work |
| 19:02.33 | mimeca2 | yet :( |
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| 20:33.55 | agaffney | CoreDump|home: it's not *that* bad |
| 20:34.10 | agaffney | but then, I've only done a collie, so I don't know how much easier poodle and akita are :) |
| 20:35.01 | CoreDump|home | compared to the other machines it is ;) |
| 20:35.26 | CoreDump|home | whoever thought about the "reset+c+d" combo should be shot |
| 20:35.36 | agaffney | I have to agree with you there |
| 20:35.41 | agaffney | it took me a few tries to get that one right |
| 20:35.52 | agaffney | you need 3 hands :P |
| 20:35.58 | CoreDump|home | =) |
| 20:38.46 | hrw|tv | I need one hand to keep collie and c-d and second hand to push fullreset |
| 20:41.38 | agaffney | I usually have to rest it sideways on my leg, press the buttons with my left hand, and push the full reset with the stylus with my right hand |
| 20:42.01 | hrw|tv | I have big hands |
| 20:45.06 | CoreDump|home | ugh |
| 20:45.20 | CoreDump|home | houston we have a problem |
| 20:45.48 | CoreDump|home | collie doesn't boot after flashing a known-good jffs2 and known-good kernel |
| 20:46.01 | hrw|tv | 2.4? |
| 20:46.05 | CoreDump|home | yes |
| 20:46.27 | hrw|tv | normal oz kernel? |
| 20:46.37 | hrw|tv | <1M in size one? |
| 20:47.18 | CoreDump|home | yes |
| 20:47.25 | CoreDump|home | as I said, it is an older kernel/jffs2 combo that is known to work |
| 20:47.54 | hrw|tv | md5sums match? |
| 20:48.01 | CoreDump|home | yes |
| 20:49.02 | agaffney | uh oh :P |
| 21:00.19 | CoreDump|home | last try: zeroed, newly partitioned and formated card w/ veryfied md5sums |
| 21:02.32 | CoreDump|home | YESS |
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| 21:04.23 | N00b506203637 | howdy |
| 21:04.26 | N00b506203637 | err |
| 21:04.49 | CoreDump|home | hey siriusnova |
| 21:04.49 | siriusnova | hi CoreDump |
| 21:04.51 | siriusnova | your the one that does the Hentges rom right? |
| 21:04.57 | CoreDump|home | right |
| 21:05.06 | siriusnova | cool |
| 21:05.22 | siriusnova | kinda offtopic but i was playing around with Cacko for my Z earlier |
| 21:05.39 | siriusnova | realised that there are _a lot_ of apps that aren't available in OZ :( |
| 21:05.53 | siriusnova | i need to track some stuff done and start recompiling them for OZ |
| 21:06.02 | CoreDump|home | ahem |
| 21:06.25 | CoreDump|home | the OZ feed is much, much ,MUCH larger than anything cacko has to offer |
| 21:06.39 | siriusnova | CoreDump - i would digress - alot of the OZ stuff is libs |
| 21:06.59 | siriusnova | for example a lot of Qtopia apps simply arent available for OZ |
| 21:07.12 | siriusnova | but anyway, i dont wanna pick a fight |
| 21:07.20 | siriusnova | im just going to see if i can recompile apps for OZ |
| 21:07.27 | CoreDump|home | a fight wasn't my intention =) |
| 21:07.44 | siriusnova | like for example if you check elsix |
| 21:07.46 | CoreDump|home | siriusnova: openembedded.org, read the getting started wiki page |
| 21:07.58 | siriusnova | oh i have an OE linux setup already |
| 21:08.31 | hrw|tv | siriusnova: how many of those qtopia apps are maintained? |
| 21:08.33 | CoreDump|home | great |
| 21:08.47 | siriusnova | hrw - not many unfortunately |
| 21:09.09 | *** join/#openzaurus Pimpinella (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org) |
| 21:09.10 | hrw|tv | siriusnova: then you know why they are not in OZ |
| 21:09.12 | siriusnova | blah but its no biggie ill see if i can go around recompile stuff to work on OZ |
| 21:09.48 | CoreDump|home | CURSE this BLASTED mediummount bug!! |
| 21:09.51 | siriusnova | if the source package is provided im sure ill find a way to cross compile it, considering qtopia and opie is similar no? |
| 21:10.57 | hrw|tv | siriusnova: its easy with most of apps |
| 21:13.19 | siriusnova | hrw - k good - ill find a way |
| 21:14.10 | siriusnova | CoreDump - what distro oZ? |
| 21:14.40 | CoreDump|home | well, hentges |
| 21:14.43 | CoreDump|home | ;) |
| 21:14.44 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 21:14.47 | CoreDump|home | which kinda is OZ |
| 21:14.50 | siriusnova | isn't hentges just a preconfigured OZ? |
| 21:15.21 | CoreDump|home | mostly yes |
| 21:16.05 | hrw|tv | it is based on OZ, use OZ feeds, has own packages etc |
| 21:16.17 | siriusnova | hrmm k |
| 21:16.18 | hrw|tv | and is supported just like OZ |
| 21:16.52 | siriusnova | im happy with OZ atm |
| 21:17.02 | siriusnova | i really dont like the sharp rom file system layout |
| 21:17.06 | siriusnova | OZ is more linuxy |
| 21:17.19 | CoreDump|home | it sure is |
| 21:18.25 | siriusnova | Cacko is nice for the Proprietary Apps, OZ is nice for the Open Source feeds and true to linux setup |
| 21:18.31 | siriusnova | there needs to be a Cacko/OZ hybrid rom :P |
| 21:18.53 | hrw|tv | siriusnova: sharprom does not fit in OZ.. |
| 21:19.02 | siriusnova | i know |
| 21:19.04 | siriusnova | i was joking |
| 21:19.05 | siriusnova | ;) |
| 21:19.49 | CoreDump|home | and the one other distro that would fit, doesn't want to join up ;) |
| 21:20.16 | siriusnova | btw anyone of you use mplayer on OZ? |
| 21:20.24 | siriusnova | how do you get it to resize videos and not corrupt the display |
| 21:20.38 | siriusnova | whenever i run it from a console it ends up corrupting the display |
| 21:21.01 | CoreDump|home | siriusnova: opie or GPE? which device? |
| 21:21.04 | siriusnova | opie |
| 21:21.08 | siriusnova | and 5500 |
| 21:21.17 | CoreDump|home | hmmm |
| 21:21.26 | *** join/#openzaurus bkudria (n=bkudria@129.49.7.102) |
| 21:21.27 | siriusnova | oh and the mplayer in the feed segfaults |
| 21:21.36 | siriusnova | so i used one from 3.5.3 |
| 21:21.40 | CoreDump|home | meh |
| 21:21.53 | CoreDump|home | 3.5.4 adds a default config for mplayer IIRC |
| 21:22.05 | siriusnova | yeah i know - i use the default config |
| 21:22.12 | siriusnova | and the mplayer from 3.5.3 |
| 21:22.28 | CoreDump|home | try running it w/ -vo sdl |
| 21:22.35 | bkudria | would anyone have any idea why kde's fish:// cannot copy a file to my zaurus? it creates a correctly named zero-length files, after saying "connection to hostname broken". scp works, and i can straight up create a file, but copying doesn't work. anyone seen this before? |
| 21:22.45 | siriusnova | hrmm k |
| 21:24.26 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: sounds familiar, try installing openssh* instead of the dropbear crap if space permits |
| 21:24.41 | siriusnova | yeah i should install openssh |
| 21:25.14 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: ok, i'll try that...do i neeed to remove dropbear? can i keep everything in .ssh the same? |
| 21:25.59 | CoreDump|home | openssh should take preference over dropbear even if it is not remove. .ssh should be unaffected |
| 21:28.11 | bkudria | grr, is there a faster way to search available packages than 'ipkg list | grep openssh'? |
| 21:28.16 | siriusnova | heh |
| 21:28.24 | siriusnova | you can use the package manager |
| 21:28.26 | siriusnova | in Opie |
| 21:28.38 | bkudria | siriusnova: not over ssh i can't :) |
| 21:28.39 | siriusnova | use filters, works for me, but it crashes when installing packages so dont install using it |
| 21:28.45 | siriusnova | hehe yeah |
| 21:28.54 | bkudria | i try and stay away from that |
| 21:29.36 | bkudria | i have a set of custom aliases in my bashrc that map to ipkg or apt-get/dpkg based on the contents of /etc/issue :) |
| 21:30.12 | siriusnova | oh also how does openzaurus transfer files via IR? |
| 21:30.20 | siriusnova | i think advancedfm or obex is buggy |
| 21:30.29 | bkudria | no idea...never used IR in my life |
| 21:30.37 | siriusnova | when i send a file via IR to my palm the Z locks up |
| 21:30.42 | siriusnova | but it can recieve just fine |
| 21:30.47 | siriusnova | weird |
| 21:33.51 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: hmm, it didn't seem to help...i installed openssh-sshd, and ran /etc/init.d/ssh restart, but the same thing happens |
| 21:35.11 | hrw|tv | install openssh-sftp |
| 21:35.24 | hrw|tv | and forget about fish:// - use sftp:// |
| 21:36.15 | bkudria | :( |
| 21:36.19 | bkudria | ok, i'll try |
| 21:37.22 | CoreDump|home | install openshh-scp as well, worth a try |
| 21:37.38 | bkudria | hrw|tv: btw, yes, i reinstalled the -cs packages for my new card (actually, i reflashed :)) and the card works now |
| 21:37.44 | bkudria | hrw|tv: so thanks |
| 21:39.02 | siriusnova | Coredump - what is 3.5.4.1 for Collie? |
| 21:39.09 | siriusnova | isnt Openzaurus up to 3.4.4 only? |
| 21:39.13 | siriusnova | 3.5.4 |
| 21:39.42 | CoreDump|home | well, officially yes =) |
| 21:40.08 | siriusnova | so whats the difference between 3.5.4.1 and 3.5.4 ? |
| 21:40.39 | CoreDump|home | updated packages, bugfixes. Nothing of great importance for Collie IIRC |
| 21:40.46 | siriusnova | hrmm k |
| 21:41.10 | bkudria | hrw|tv: sftp works great! thanks a lot |
| 21:41.18 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: thanks for the help too |
| 21:42.09 | siriusnova | CoreDump - how does snes9x work on the Collie, slow? |
| 21:42.41 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: you're welcome |
| 21:42.45 | bkudria | so if i want to have lots of stuff on my z (music), i should put it somewhere other than /home ? df says that is only 46.5 mb... |
| 21:42.49 | CoreDump|home | siriusnova: never tried on collie sorry |
| 21:42.53 | siriusnova | ahh k |
| 21:43.27 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: well, put it on a SD or CF card |
| 21:43.30 | siriusnova | its a shame opie is dying |
| 21:43.38 | CoreDump|home | my words exactly |
| 21:43.47 | siriusnova | its a pretty nice alternate to qtopia |
| 21:43.52 | siriusnova | and i like it better then gpe |
| 21:44.00 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: well i have a 3100, so i think i'll make use of my hd :) |
| 21:44.02 | siriusnova | gpe isnt polished compared to qtopia |
| 21:44.18 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: sweet =9 |
| 21:44.24 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: so i should be putting it in /media/hdd ? |
| 21:44.25 | CoreDump|home | s/9/) |
| 21:45.11 | bkudria | too bad all of my music is more than 6 gigs :( so i have to choose |
| 21:45.14 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: i'm not familiar w/ the partitioning / mountoints on sl-c3x00 |
| 21:45.43 | bkudria | either am i. :) /media/hdd is 3.6 gigs, according to df, so i guess it goes there |
| 21:46.17 | *** join/#openzaurus redguy_ (n=mati@adk16.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:46.17 | CoreDump|home | yeah |
| 21:46.22 | hrw|tv | I reformatted spitz to 1/1/2 |
| 21:46.38 | bkudria | i'll just use a symlink |
| 21:48.21 | siriusnova | gah |
| 21:48.25 | siriusnova | fbvncserver crashes |
| 21:48.26 | siriusnova | :/ |
| 21:49.39 | bkudria | ok, that solves all my issues |
| 21:49.41 | bkudria | thanks, guys |
| 21:57.42 | *** join/#openzaurus kolla (i=kolla@firda.kolla.no) |
| 22:07.17 | *** join/#openzaurus Timelord0 (n=TL@16.8c.d12c.cidr.airmail.net) |
| 22:28.04 | *** join/#openzaurus summatusmentis (n=summatus@206-15-138-211.dialup.ziplink.net) |
| 22:55.41 | *** join/#openzaurus bkudria (n=bkudria@129.49.7.102) |
| 22:57.07 | bkudria | i'm try to play music, and i've tried mediaplayer, mediaplyer2, and xmms...all play, but at what sounds like the max volume. adjusting the volume doesn't change anything. help? |
| 22:59.43 | *** join/#openzaurus Timelord (n=TL@16.8c.d12c.cidr.airmail.net) |
| 23:24.12 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: try alsamixer ;) |
| 23:29.02 | bkudria | CoreDump|home: which font should i install to make that look sane? and is there any gui app that lives in the systray and can ajduts those mixers? |
| 23:29.54 | CoreDump|home | bkudria: the gui mixers will be fixed for kernel 2.6 eventually |
| 23:30.18 | bkudria | until then, i cannot use my zaurus as an mp3 player... |
| 23:30.22 | bkudria | :( |
| 23:30.43 | CoreDump|home | :\ |
| 23:31.08 | bkudria | unless, is there a way to map the little wheel on my 3100 to vol up and vol down with alsactl ? |
| 23:32.22 | CoreDump|home | umm |
| 23:32.34 | CoreDump|home | no idea |
| 23:32.44 | bkudria | i guess i should ask on the forums |
| 23:32.56 | CoreDump|home | that might help, yes ;) |
| 23:33.05 | CoreDump|home | anyway, bed is calling. n8! |
| 23:41.30 | hrw|tv | I go sleep too |
| 23:41.31 | hrw|tv | cu |
| 23:44.58 | *** join/#openzaurus lindenle (n=lindenle@ppp-70-225-189-53.dsl.chmpil.ameritech.net) |
