| 00:05.13 | sontek | most artists on there are independant |
| 00:06.38 | encryptz | i support the indie scene, but i want to know what i'm getting into first. thus, last.fm |
| 00:10.08 | Heartsbane | suggests some Monzy - Kill dash Nine to encryptz. |
| 00:11.27 | encryptz | respawns |
| 00:55.25 | encryptz | heh. "the last.fm email monkey". nice |
| 00:55.37 | Heartsbane | :) |
| 01:38.10 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut linuxalien (n=linuxali@oalug/member/linuxalien) |
| 01:40.10 | Zelut | coolest t-shirt design I've seen in a long time : http://www.snorgtees.com/images/EvenGod_Fullpic_3.gif |
| 03:04.32 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut Gate (n=gate@unaffiliated/gate) |
| 04:09.31 | encryptz | heh |
| 04:09.33 | encryptz | 21:51 < fde> encryptz: If the user doesn't care to learn, he can use Ubuntu, they love that sort. Fedora contains a lot of the old timers, such laziness is not tolerated. |
| 04:09.54 | encryptz | my response? ubuntu also has a non-broken os |
| 04:09.59 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut ender__ (n=ender@c-76-23-49-252.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:10.03 | encryptz | (this is in #fedora) |
| 04:11.56 | encryptz | context, being the argument about to rtfm or not to rtfm |
| 04:12.11 | herlo | tends to agree with fde, although his generalism probably shouldn't be the norm... |
| 04:12.11 | encryptz | me, being not a fan of rtfm |
| 04:12.37 | herlo | encryptz: in fact, Paul Frields frowns heavily on this sort of action |
| 04:12.54 | encryptz | what action? rtfm, or help? |
| 04:12.59 | *** part/#ubuntu-us-ut AlmostThere (n=Woody@ppp-71-142-150-124.dsl.renocs.pacbell.net) |
| 04:13.04 | herlo | he wants more of a *helper* environment, but we all know that it has to be a 50/50 give and take |
| 04:13.29 | herlo | encryptz: the attitude of that person is *not* the attitude of the fedora project |
| 04:13.40 | encryptz | my stance is, if you are going to say 'rtfm', then point him to the specific manual to read. google doesn't count |
| 04:13.47 | herlo | agreed |
| 04:14.47 | herlo | like I said, its 50/50. I'll come half way as long as I don't have to answer that question from you again. I like to help, but I won't be suckered into my entire life helping someone unwilling to help themselves... |
| 04:15.01 | encryptz | i agree |
| 04:15.10 | encryptz | teach a man to fish, not give him a fish |
| 04:15.29 | herlo | its unfortunate that fde is being that way. I wonder if he's signed the CLA |
| 04:15.34 | encryptz | however, *teach* him how to fish. 'google it' isn't teaching |
| 04:15.39 | herlo | similar in form to the code of conduct |
| 04:16.03 | encryptz | it's a lazy-ass response to saying 'i went through hell figuring this out, so you should too' |
| 04:16.12 | herlo | not quite as absolute or as limiting in attitude though. Probably needs to have more of the 'help more, rtfm less' in it |
| 04:16.52 | encryptz | anyway, i'm done with that convo |
| 04:16.54 | herlo | encryptz: I'll bug stickster about this exact conv just as a point of comment. He *really* wants to solve this problem. |
| 04:17.19 | herlo | if you want |
| 04:17.43 | encryptz | nah. it won't bring any good out of it |
| 04:18.32 | herlo | I don't know, he's the Project Leader. Maybe there will be a better response next time |
| 04:18.39 | encryptz | it's the attack on ubuntu that got me, when i'm obviously there to help, and i don't even run the distro personally |
| 04:18.40 | herlo | if we don't do something, who will? |
| 04:18.59 | encryptz | which he prolly found via my hostmask |
| 04:19.21 | herlo | encryptz: hmm |
| 04:19.45 | encryptz | no worries. i'm not going to lose sleep over it |
| 04:19.51 | herlo | I don't necessarily disagree with him in general terms, but he shouldn't make such an assumption... |
| 04:21.19 | sontek | I don't think rtfm is beneficial for anyone, new users don't know what manual to read or what terms to search for |
| 04:21.35 | sontek | I like to just give the answer and some reading materials together |
| 04:21.47 | encryptz | sontek: agreed. if you don't provide them with the manual, then irc is just a good a resource as google, imnsho |
| 04:21.51 | sontek | but if I notice the same user *always* asking dumb questions, then i'll drop a read the fine manual |
| 04:22.20 | encryptz | well, there's a level of patience, of course. and there are trolls just there to annoy |
| 04:22.33 | herlo | right, which is more what I think should be done, this case shouldn't have been treated that way for sure. I wish people in every community were more friendly and willing to help or just not say anything |
| 04:22.56 | encryptz | but as a general rule, *if* rtfm, then provide the "fine manual" as sontek points out. :) |
| 04:22.59 | herlo | fde seems like a troll... |
| 04:23.16 | herlo | agrees with sontek and encryptz on these points |
| 04:23.26 | sontek | I think its just the mentality, "I was told that and I turned out just fine"! |
| 04:23.29 | herlo | just wishes that could be portrayed to the trolls |
| 04:23.43 | sontek | they figure if they went through the pain, so should everyone else |
| 04:23.47 | encryptz | herlo: where you at this week? |
| 04:23.59 | sontek | But I remember going through the RTFM pain and I like to keep as many people away from it that I can :P |
| 04:24.08 | herlo | encryptz: Portland, Intel onsite |
| 04:24.15 | encryptz | sontek: esp on linuxquestions |
| 04:24.21 | herlo | lol |
| 04:24.31 | herlo | encryptz: you? |
| 04:24.43 | encryptz | pittsburgh |
| 04:24.57 | herlo | has never been there while working for GL. |
| 04:25.00 | encryptz | highmark class |
| 04:25.06 | encryptz | for learning quest. |
| 04:25.09 | herlo | encryptz: go to Primanti Bros |
| 04:25.22 | herlo | or the Church Brew Works. Good Pizza |
| 04:25.38 | encryptz | primanti bros? |
| 04:25.51 | herlo | http://www.primantibros.com/ |
| 04:25.58 | herlo | trust me, its awesome! |
| 04:26.09 | bmac2 | no I won't trust you, you are ugly and dress funny |
| 04:26.13 | bmac2 | :-P |
| 04:26.14 | encryptz | ahh. i saw that at market square today. i'll check it out tomorrow |
| 04:26.49 | herlo | ~lart bmac2 |
| 04:26.49 | jbot | turns bmac2 into a lifesized tux doll |
| 04:26.56 | bmac2 | lol |
| 04:26.59 | herlo | jbot: he's already that size |
| 04:26.59 | bmac2 | I am short and fat |
| 04:27.03 | bmac2 | so that is not a big change |
| 04:27.08 | herlo | ~lart bmac2 |
| 04:27.08 | jbot | turns bmac2 into a lifesized tux doll |
| 04:27.12 | bmac2 | lol |
| 04:27.18 | bmac2 | ummmmm |
| 04:27.21 | bmac2 | I think he is broke |
| 04:27.23 | bmac2 | or stuck |
| 04:27.24 | encryptz | ~rlart |
| 04:27.25 | jbot | whips out a shotgun, trudges over to opapo, and goes postal |
| 04:27.25 | herlo | ~lart bmac2 |
| 04:27.25 | jbot | beats bmac2 into protomatter with the andromeda galaxy |
| 04:27.26 | bmac2 | or jsut a retart |
| 04:27.34 | herlo | retart? |
| 04:27.35 | bmac2 | lol |
| 04:27.39 | bmac2 | retard |
| 04:27.40 | herlo | ~lart bmac2 |
| 04:27.40 | jbot | executes killall -TERM bmac2 |
| 04:27.44 | bmac2 | lol |
| 04:27.44 | encryptz | ~rtfm herlo |
| 04:27.45 | jbot | ACTION tosses herlo a 50lb unix manual |
| 04:28.02 | sontek | ~ubuntu herlo |
| 04:28.03 | jbot | ACTION lovingly explains to herlo in a way that causes herlo to weep with gratitude that herlo must read the fine, friendly manual |
| 04:28.03 | herlo | ~lart bmac2 |
| 04:28.03 | jbot | shoves a crumpet down bmac2's throat, happy now?! Huh? Want some JAM with that? |
| 04:28.22 | herlo | heads to bed soon. Long day. |
| 04:28.24 | encryptz | ~fedora sontek |
| 04:28.25 | jbot | ACTION tells sontek that becoming RHCP certified, is The One True Way to Supreme Linux Knowledge |
| 04:28.36 | sontek | ~opensuse encryptz |
| 04:28.37 | jbot | ACTION improves encryptz's performance, stability, and over all look at feel. |
| 04:28.38 | herlo | encryptz: did you hear how our class is set up? |
| 04:28.38 | encryptz | rhcp? |
| 04:28.44 | herlo | professional |
| 04:28.49 | herlo | sontek looked it up |
| 04:28.54 | herlo | apparently it exists |
| 04:28.58 | sontek | yeah, we were questioning rhcp the other day |
| 04:29.21 | encryptz | heh |
| 04:29.24 | encryptz | there you go |
| 05:06.02 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut zjf (n=insanemo@oldoffice.bluehost.com) |
| 06:25.19 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut C4N (n=ph@c-76-27-14-233.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 07:33.26 | C4N | $ |
| 07:35.44 | C4N | Who's online |
| 07:35.44 | C4N | There are currently 0 users and 0 guests online. |
| 07:35.51 | C4N | am I not RECOGNIZED on j00r SITE?! |
| 07:35.55 | C4N | =( |
| 11:44.59 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut _2ooC4N- (n=ph@c-76-27-14-233.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 11:53.20 | encryptz | C4N: need some help? |
| 13:04.46 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut throck (n=aaron@c-24-10-194-231.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 14:12.59 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut thaddeusq (n=thaddeus@216.49.181.128) |
| 14:30.24 | C4N | no |
| 14:30.39 | C4N | I'm going to the meeting |
| 14:30.46 | C4N | then I'll have questions bua ha ha :-P |
| 15:26.29 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut C4N (n=ph@c-76-27-14-233.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:11.41 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut ender_ (n=ender@c-76-23-49-252.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:30.05 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut tapH20guru (n=tapH20gu@208.51.73.197) |
| 16:49.53 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut tapH20guru (n=tapH20gu@208.51.73.197) |
| 17:12.54 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut mrpull (n=Jake@newshell.xmission.com) |
| 17:37.57 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut |phoenyx| (n=|phoenyx@ip65-44-121-9.z121-44-65.customer.algx.net) |
| 18:04.51 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut C4N (n=ph@c-76-27-14-233.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 18:51.06 | fizz | hey guru labs guys |
| 18:51.14 | fizz | hiring at all? :) |
| 18:51.32 | Zelut | always |
| 18:51.49 | Zelut | you heard it from me before that damn herlo tries for the referral! |
| 18:52.02 | C4N | GG |
| 18:52.05 | fizz | where should i send resume? or who do i talk to? |
| 18:52.29 | Zelut | fizz: jobs@gurulabs.com I believe |
| 18:52.58 | fizz | cool. i'll be sending one today. |
| 18:53.33 | fizz | being a software qa engineer sucks. they should contract me but they bring me on as full time then i get laid off. |
| 18:53.36 | fizz | every time |
| 18:54.45 | bmac2 | Zelut, what are you saying about herlo? he is a referral hog? |
| 18:55.19 | bmac2 | I sent my resume to gurulabs like 2 months ago |
| 18:55.23 | bmac2 | never heard a word at all |
| 18:55.38 | bmac2 | not even an acknowledgement that it was received |
| 18:55.56 | bmac2 | kinda strange considering I have been teaching college for 7 years |
| 18:56.37 | fizz | over qualified? or maybe they met you! |
| 18:56.41 | Zelut | fizz: actually, shoot it to info@ |
| 18:56.41 | fizz | buh-zing |
| 18:56.47 | bmac2 | bite me bi-eatch |
| 18:56.51 | bmac2 | I dress up well |
| 18:56.53 | fizz | Zelut: thx |
| 18:57.00 | bmac2 | even able to hide the inbreeding |
| 18:57.03 | bmac2 | to an extent |
| 18:57.31 | Yorokobi | Maybe its the accent, bmac2 ... :) |
| 18:57.37 | bmac2 | nope |
| 18:57.43 | bmac2 | that is my storng point |
| 18:57.46 | bmac2 | hey Yorokobi |
| 18:59.11 | Zelut | bmac2: spelling is not, apparently. |
| 19:00.08 | fizz | also if anyone else in here knows of an open position let me know! |
| 19:00.51 | Yorokobi | fizz, still looking into QA? |
| 19:01.10 | bmac2 | nope spelling isn't |
| 19:01.14 | bmac2 | I was raized in Alabama |
| 19:01.21 | bmac2 | so spelling and reading isn't good |
| 19:02.02 | fizz | Yorokobi: possibly. |
| 19:02.52 | Yorokobi | fizz, well, if you are: jobs@part.net -- if you're any good with RHEL system administration, there's a position open there, too |
| 19:03.27 | Yorokobi | fizz, as with GL, mention that I referred you. :) |
| 19:04.34 | bmac2 | fizz, if you mention he referred you, I got an interview like 2 days later |
| 19:04.38 | bmac2 | from submitting my stuff |
| 19:04.48 | fizz | wait a qa position, eh? |
| 19:05.31 | Yorokobi | heh, two days after getting the resume, then 4 months waiting on the USG to issue a security waiver. :) |
| 19:05.53 | Zelut | Yorokobi: you say you have system admin positions? I'm looking for a little less travel to be honest. |
| 19:06.15 | Yorokobi | yep, we do, as of yesterday. |
| 19:06.33 | Zelut | Yorokobi: decent pay? benefits? its in SLC I assume? |
| 19:06.53 | bmac2 | Zelut, research park |
| 19:07.08 | bmac2 | just down the street from the Marriot hotel |
| 19:07.27 | Yorokobi | yep, that's where we are |
| 19:09.08 | bmac2 | Zelut, I really liked the people there too, hopefully within the next week or so they will finish my security clearnance and I can start work |
| 19:09.14 | bmac2 | that takes a while |
| 19:09.40 | Zelut | waiting four months sounds like a pain. |
| 19:10.03 | bmac2 | it is |
| 19:10.04 | bmac2 | lol |
| 19:10.06 | bmac2 | trust me |
| 19:10.16 | Zelut | what do ya'll do there? |
| 19:10.23 | bmac2 | but some people get it faster |
| 19:10.42 | bmac2 | i had to deal with a bunch of financial stuff because of being unemployed for the last 6 months |
| 19:10.51 | bmac2 | so don't take me as a good example |
| 19:11.48 | Yorokobi | some people get security waivers in a matter of weeks. |
| 19:13.54 | Yorokobi | It took me 3 months to get mine :) |
| 19:14.31 | sontek | Pfft, I could get security clearance in hours! |
| 19:17.01 | Zelut | sontek: shit, you're on the terrorist watch list. pfft. |
| 19:17.08 | Yorokobi | lol |
| 19:17.57 | sontek | lol, i'm on the no fly list |
| 19:18.14 | sontek | My friends got arrested for hacking into lowes so I got investigated by the FBI |
| 19:18.22 | sontek | so now I have to go through extra security every time I fly |
| 19:18.48 | sontek | Wonder how long it'd take to get security clearance with that on my record ;p |
| 19:19.35 | peno | sontek: they're afraid you'll hack the airplane from the headphone jack on the seat! |
| 19:19.40 | sontek | Zelut: you can't leave GL! You are Guru 4 Life! |
| 19:19.57 | C4N | LOL |
| 19:20.00 | sontek | peno: Or set off a nuclear bomb with my cellphone! |
| 19:20.02 | C4N | sontek, are they watching this channel? |
| 19:20.04 | C4N | looks around |
| 19:20.26 | C4N | at least we're popular because of you |
| 19:20.46 | peno | sontek: you've been watching too much independence day. |
| 19:21.39 | sontek | peno: It was independence day! |
| 19:22.10 | sontek | I interview at Novell on Thursday, if I don't get the position i'm going to finally become a Guru |
| 19:22.13 | sontek | i'm done with Orchid :P |
| 19:22.37 | peno | lies! |
| 19:22.51 | peno | you're a .NET monkey for lyfe! |
| 19:22.54 | Zelut | sontek: I'd be too afraid to work for Novell with as often as they do layoffs |
| 19:23.09 | sontek | Zelut: They only layoff useless divisions though |
| 19:24.53 | Zelut | sontek: it seems to volatile to me.. I don't think I could do it. |
| 19:25.32 | sontek | Zelut: I'm interviewing for their desktop team, which is pretty stable |
| 19:25.35 | sontek | Zelut: they like their SLED |
| 19:27.21 | Zelut | sontek: SLED is pretty slick. It seems like all the tech jobs are in Utah Cty, which sucks now that I'm up north |
| 19:29.01 | sontek | Zelut: there is Iomega up near you |
| 19:29.18 | sontek | They are in Roy |
| 19:30.15 | sontek | but yeah, I don't know many tech companies farther north than SLC |
| 19:32.59 | Zelut | AFCU has an ops center in Layton where I think they need a unix/linux guy.. that's all I've found up north. |
| 19:34.07 | Yorokobi | If you want to be abused, you can try the DISA DECC facility at HAFB |
| 19:34.26 | sontek | http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2008/0708081bruno1.html |
| 19:40.34 | herlo | bmac2: just to point this out, Zelut is the referral hog |
| 19:40.47 | bmac2 | oh ok |
| 19:40.52 | bmac2 | lol |
| 19:41.34 | herlo | :) |
| 19:41.57 | sontek | Zelut: can you refer me to a good job?!! ;P |
| 19:41.58 | herlo | bmac2: fizz: *I* referred you :) |
| 19:42.09 | bmac2 | lol |
| 19:42.14 | herlo | sontek: lol |
| 19:42.19 | fizz | it all boils down to this: |
| 19:42.31 | bmac2 | their both hogs? |
| 19:42.34 | fizz | who's name looks better on there? |
| 19:42.37 | bmac2 | is that what it boils down to? |
| 19:42.39 | sontek | Who is willing to share?! |
| 19:42.40 | fizz | :D |
| 19:43.02 | fizz | which name gives me a better chance of getting the job? |
| 19:43.49 | sontek | herlo has been there longer, but Zelut has many successful recruits |
| 19:44.16 | sontek | I say put them both down and let them fight over it! :P |
| 19:44.20 | bmac2 | put them both and tell the reviewer you like whoever he likes best |
| 19:44.21 | bmac2 | lol |
| 19:45.04 | sontek | Think GL will let me work for like 6 months straight? |
| 19:45.14 | sontek | I don't want the 1 week off |
| 19:45.17 | sontek | I just want to fly around |
| 19:52.54 | herlo | sontek: k, whatever... |
| 19:54.54 | Zelut | sontek: I'm up to 185K miles so far. free trip to Europe here I come. |
| 19:58.54 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut ph4se (n=ph4se@phase.staff.slcpl.org) |
| 19:59.39 | *** join/#ubuntu-us-ut ph4se (n=ph4se@205.127.244.62) |
| 19:59.45 | sontek | Zelut: I'm just bored of Utah, I want to get out for a few months |
| 20:00.09 | sontek | so I figure if they'll let me travel for a few months straight, it'll be sweet =) |
| 20:00.41 | Zelut | sontek: the country is a big place.. lots of other trouble for you to get into |
| 20:01.09 | sontek | Utah trouble is to easy! I need a challenge! |
| 20:02.56 | sontek | Plus I'd have lots of time to codez |
| 20:03.02 | sontek | on my own stuff |
| 20:03.07 | sontek | working on orchid stuff is boring :P |
| 20:04.17 | sontek | my distaste for orchid came when they made me work on 4th of July *again* :P |
| 20:06.27 | Zelut | epic fail |
| 20:12.53 | sontek | I don't mind being so busy that I have to work on a Holiday |
| 20:13.11 | sontek | I don't like my boss promising a client we'll work over the holiday weekend to get something done, the day before the holiday |
| 21:04.04 | *** part/#ubuntu-us-ut throck (n=aaron@c-24-10-194-231.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
