| 00:00.26 | Tem | orly |
| 00:00.29 | Tem | oh! |
| 00:00.35 | Cairenn | yarly |
| 00:00.37 | Tem | I wonder what happened to the Orly thing |
| 00:00.49 | Cairenn | got named something else, apparently |
| 00:00.55 | Tem | aww |
| 00:00.57 | Cairenn | yeah |
| 00:01.24 | Cairenn | so what's with roadChip? he travelling atm? |
| 00:01.33 | Tem | aye, I believe so |
| 00:01.48 | Tem | I wanna say he was in Alabama a few days ago |
| 00:02.25 | Cairenn | okay, you can say that |
| 00:02.30 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 00:02.31 | Kirkburn | Is it against your religion? |
| 00:03.24 | *** join/#wowi-lounge tragywydd (n=Tragywyd@cpe-24-59-191-241.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 00:03.40 | Kirkburn | I think the inquisition have taken him away |
| 00:05.06 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Parak (n=profi@user-0cev737.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 00:25.47 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Parak (n=profi@user-0cev737.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 00:30.24 | Iriel | ckknight : You could always just invoke OnMouseUp yourself |
| 00:30.33 | ckknight | already taken care of |
| 00:30.49 | Iriel | ckknight : Though it's somwhat disturbing if you can get an OnMOuseDown but not the subsequent OnMouseUp |
| 00:30.57 | ckknight | yea |
| 00:31.00 | Iriel | ckknight : The frame engine always seemed very good about that |
| 00:31.05 | *** join/#wowi-lounge ForgottenLords (n=Forgotte@059.216-123-195-0.interbaun.com) |
| 00:31.07 | ckknight | if the button is hid, OnMouseUp is never callsed |
| 00:31.09 | ckknight | called* |
| 00:32.00 | Iriel | Hidden and re-shown, or hidden period? |
| 00:33.26 | ckknight | hidden and reshown |
| 00:34.56 | Iriel | I guess hiding the button must release it's button-down lock |
| 00:37.28 | *** join/#wowi-lounge End (n=end@c-67-164-177-134.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 00:49.15 | ckknight | but it doesn't call OnMouseUp, which is a pain |
| 00:49.30 | ckknight | I'd rather have it keep its OnMouseDown state, or call OnMouseUp |
| 00:49.37 | ckknight | rather then just go away |
| 00:49.47 | ckknight | my fix was to check if it's being clicked, and if so, not hide it |
| 00:49.49 | ckknight | works fine |
| 00:50.39 | Iriel | *nod* |
| 00:51.11 | Iriel | Or you could track ifit's being clicked, and if so make OnHide call OnMouseUp |
| 01:03.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Miravlix (i=dragon@0x3e42aafc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 01:10.20 | Cairenn | well, it seems they aren't listening ... Satrina told them to remove his mods, they are still on the site |
| 01:10.31 | Cairenn | at least they pulled the CT stuff |
| 01:13.23 | ckknight | where? |
| 01:14.33 | Cairenn | http://wow.filenuts.com/ |
| 01:15.26 | clad|sleep | Iriel: Any chance of you getting something other than the Devilsaur as an avatar? |
| 01:15.39 | Tain | Maybe Purplesaurus Rex |
| 01:17.38 | *** join/#wowi-lounge norganna (n=chatzill@65.98.88.90) |
| 01:17.45 | Tain | norganna did it |
| 01:17.50 | cladhaire | I agree. |
| 01:18.25 | norganna | I didn't mean to |
| 01:19.36 | cmunn | O RLY? |
| 01:19.46 | norganna | YA RLY! |
| 01:21.26 | Iriel | cladhaire | I dont believe so, it's not an option I have access to |
| 01:22.44 | cladhaire | Iriel: I think they're working on it. If i'm not mistaken that was the purpose of Drysc posting on Drysc2 for a while, to test out a non-blizzard-super-power-happy-crazy account with a special avatar. I'd rather see a generic mvp icon than the devilsaur.. but congrats =) |
| 01:23.00 | cladhaire | Cairenn: I'm glad they pulled Catalyst before Tem exploded =0 |
| 01:23.14 | Cairenn | cladhaire: yeah, he saw it before they yanked it though |
| 01:23.36 | cladhaire | hehe |
| 01:23.55 | Tem | cladhaire: I sent them a Cease and Decist |
| 01:23.56 | Cairenn | but if you see Sat tonight, might want to let him know that they missed pulling his, when they went down the list |
| 01:24.02 | Tem | before they removed it |
| 01:24.10 | Cairenn | oh, that's right! I forgotted |
| 01:24.24 | cladhaire | Tem: Hawt |
| 01:24.29 | cladhaire | Cairenn: I told Sat.. he's pissed =) |
| 01:24.43 | Cairenn | I was just at the site, they are still there |
| 01:24.55 | cladhaire | ayew |
| 01:25.05 | Tem | cladhaire: tell him to google Cease and Decist. Like... the first result is a good generic CnD to send em |
| 01:25.09 | Cairenn | so, it looks like the only ones they pulled were CT? I wonder if Cide sent a C&D too, or whether they actually pulled 'em without threats |
| 01:25.33 | Tem | I haven't gotten a response from them on my email |
| 01:25.41 | Tain | Wow that was one of the best beers I have ever had. |
| 01:25.48 | cladhaire | Tain: What was it? |
| 01:26.11 | Tain | Samuel Adams Imperial Pilsner |
| 01:26.13 | Cairenn | cladhaire: did you see that there *is* one of Sat's up at CG, too? |
| 01:26.21 | Tem | so I'm not sure one way or the other if they pulled it before or after I sent them the nasty email |
| 01:26.30 | cladhaire | Cairenn: I think he knows about that one. |
| 01:26.41 | cladhaire | Tain: I'm inspired to go have a Bud Select |
| 01:26.42 | cladhaire | brb |
| 01:26.43 | cladhaire | =) |
| 01:26.51 | Cairenn | yeah, looks like, the file has been pulled and a note telling them to pull the rest of it |
| 01:26.59 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Depherios (n=Deph@67.189.88.161) |
| 01:27.35 | Tem | what annoyed me more than them having it up was the fact that they didn't bother to even have an up to date version |
| 01:27.41 | cladhaire | heheh |
| 01:27.42 | Tem | a version that had a bug |
| 01:27.42 | cladhaire | i know =) |
| 01:28.17 | Cairenn | *nod* |
| 01:28.46 | Tain | Down with bugs! |
| 01:29.20 | norganna | who's this? |
| 01:30.32 | Cairenn | http://wow.filenuts.com/ |
| 01:31.23 | Cairenn | auctioneer is there |
| 01:31.24 | Cairenn | not sure about gatherer & enchantrix, didn't notice off the top, but may very well be |
| 01:31.24 | Cairenn | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-interface-customization&t=370933&p=1&tmp=1#post370933 is the original thread |
| 01:32.07 | Kirkburn | Cairenn, I agree with your last comment. As long as people are forced to go to the 'official' download location first, I can't see many having a problem with it |
| 01:32.09 | Cairenn | ah, enchantrix isn't, but gatherer is |
| 01:32.52 | Cairenn | there was that other (very ugly, very slow) site we discovered today, too, but I can't remember it right now |
| 01:33.02 | Kirkburn | finkle something |
| 01:33.06 | Cairenn | yeah |
| 01:33.13 | Kirkburn | http://www.finkles-installer.com/ |
| 01:33.15 | Tain | westealaddons.com |
| 01:33.20 | Kirkburn | My eyes my eyes!!! |
| 01:33.25 | Cairenn | that's the one |
| 01:33.29 | Tain | The goggles! They do nothing! |
| 01:33.43 | Cairenn | *when* will people learn? |
| 01:33.58 | Tain | Survey says! |
| 01:33.59 | Tain | Never. |
| 01:34.06 | Kirkburn | (tain, that link doesn't work) |
| 01:34.08 | Cairenn | all it takes is 2 minutes to send out a form e-mail to the various authors saying "would you be okay with ..." |
| 01:34.26 | Tain | Are you kidding? First you'd have to look up the author's email address. |
| 01:34.32 | Tain | Then you'd have to wait for a response. |
| 01:34.47 | Tain | And addon authors are notoriously bad at responding to emails. |
| 01:35.02 | cladhaire | Finkles is horrible.. i cannot even see if my addons are there. |
| 01:35.15 | Cairenn | cladhaire: google site name/modname |
| 01:35.19 | cladhaire | yeah i know |
| 01:35.22 | cladhaire | but i'm lazy |
| 01:35.42 | Kirkburn | Perhaps we should have a petition: "We the players of WorldofWarcraft do NOT need more addon repositories" |
| 01:35.55 | Tain | No, more addon sites isn't the issue. |
| 01:36.04 | Tain | There's no problem with more addon sites if they add value. |
| 01:36.08 | Kirkburn | I was trying to think of a better way of writing that |
| 01:36.10 | Cairenn | Tain: funny, I've yet to ever have a problem with a mod author not responding to an email, with the sole exception of Titan |
| 01:36.30 | Tain | Cairenn: I've never actually emailed a mod author I don't think. |
| 01:36.48 | Tain | Oh except emailing cladhaire for svn access. But I had to promise favors in return. :/ |
| 01:36.58 | Kirkburn | ... |
| 01:37.33 | cladhaire | Tain: All it takes is naked pix., |
| 01:37.40 | cladhaire | id learned. |
| 01:37.43 | cladhaire | me loved me norweigans =) |
| 01:37.57 | Kirkburn | id` changed his name |
| 01:38.09 | Kirkburn | That probably wasn't what you meant |
| 01:38.14 | Kirkburn | But anyway ... |
| 01:38.17 | cladhaire | ... |
| 01:38.17 | Tain | He had to change his name to try to hide his shame. |
| 01:38.20 | cladhaire | huh? |
| 01:38.28 | Kirkburn | id` is now Industrial |
| 01:38.33 | cladhaire | yes, he always has been |
| 01:38.37 | cladhaire | i'm not sure i follow |
| 01:38.39 | Kirkburn | On here. |
| 01:38.44 | cladhaire | k |
| 01:38.46 | cladhaire | so? |
| 01:38.46 | Kirkburn | :) |
| 01:38.50 | Kirkburn | Oh shush |
| 01:39.39 | Tain | Oh no. Oh please no. Eddie Murphy wants to do Beverly Hills Cop 4. |
| 01:39.48 | cladhaire | haha |
| 01:39.57 | Kirkburn | Ah phew, get out clause. That's interesting Tain |
| 01:40.18 | Iriel | Okay, all my classes renamed, I can go home |
| 01:40.32 | Cairenn | later Iriel :) |
| 01:40.33 | Tain | Yay |
| 01:40.44 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kremonte (n=dan@ool-18b8808d.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 01:40.46 | Kirkburn | I'd like to rename my classes. Civil Engineering would become: Eat Chocolate and Sleep |
| 01:40.51 | Iriel | Heh |
| 01:40.57 | Kremonte | anybody around who could help me with something? :< |
| 01:41.04 | Iriel | In this case, ProxiedObjectId -> ObjectSeed |
| 01:41.13 | Iriel | and LocalDocumentIndexFactory -> DocumentIndexSoil |
| 01:41.26 | Depherios | http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000BXJ0L6/sr=8-1/qid=1146533867/ref=sr_1_1/104-6919057-0310308?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance |
| 01:41.34 | Depherios | .... you pump out bio-ooze |
| 01:41.38 | Kirkburn | You turned a local factory into soil? Poor workers! |
| 01:41.59 | Kremonte | i never thought i'd have this much trouble, but i'm trying to create a script that backs up (in a rar or tar or something) Interface/ WTF/ and WDB/ and uploads them via FTP. can't find directory iteration functions or archiving stuff in lua, archiving stuff in PHP, and i'm stumped with python |
| 01:42.00 | Kremonte | ._. |
| 01:42.19 | Kirkburn | But, if you're developing something on that soil Iriel, that's okay :) |
| 01:42.51 | Iriel | There's an ObjectGrower also |
| 01:42.56 | Codayus | Kremonte: Uh...sounds like a job for a bash script and tar to me... |
| 01:43.04 | Tain | Why iterate directories? Just execute an external zip statement |
| 01:43.07 | Iriel | but actually I might flip Soil and Grower to keep with the metaphor |
| 01:43.09 | Kremonte | Codayus: on windows |
| 01:43.20 | Codayus | Kremonte: in cygwin |
| 01:43.22 | Codayus | :-) |
| 01:43.22 | Kremonte | Tain: yea realized that a few minutes ago. either way, can't find archiving stuff in any of them |
| 01:43.22 | Iriel | Use scp instead of ftp and you dont have to deal with ftp's archaeicness |
| 01:43.30 | Kremonte | cygwin seems a little like overkill. |
| 01:43.40 | Codayus | You don't already have cygwin? oO |
| 01:43.57 | Kremonte | yea i have no data on my HD's pretty much right now, long story |
| 01:43.59 | Tain | There's no native scp in XP though. And if you're doing the same thing every time you can do a simple ftp script. |
| 01:44.03 | Codayus | Oh, and obviously Iriel is correct. It's been so long since I've used ftp instead of scp rsync over ssh I didn't even notice... |
| 01:44.11 | Kremonte | scp? |
| 01:44.17 | Iriel | secure copy |
| 01:44.24 | Iriel | part of the SSH bundle |
| 01:44.31 | Iriel | there's sftp too, if you're that way inclined |
| 01:44.34 | Kremonte | i am so lost |
| 01:44.41 | Codayus | s/scp rsync/scp or rsync |
| 01:44.45 | Kremonte | i just want to back up my stuff and upload it |
| 01:44.46 | Kremonte | ;( |
| 01:44.51 | Kirkburn | How about fertiliser? Kind of a medium between soil and growe? |
| 01:44.54 | Iriel | Another suggestion would be cp and svn commit |
| 01:44.54 | Kirkburn | *grower |
| 01:44.56 | Codayus | putty has a good scp implementation |
| 01:45.08 | Codayus | they call it pscp but whatever. |
| 01:45.14 | Kremonte | acronyms, multiple conversations, iriel speaking in computer speak, AHHHHHHHHHHHH |
| 01:45.27 | Tain | What are you using for archiver, Kremont? All of them have command line options even though you only ever see the GUI these days. |
| 01:45.38 | Kremonte | i have a million archivers |
| 01:45.39 | Kremonte | ><' |
| 01:45.46 | Kremonte | winrar for the most part, though. |
| 01:45.50 | Tain | It bugs me that I can only remember the command line parameters for pkzip |
| 01:46.20 | cladhaire | i can only think in terms of tar |
| 01:46.29 | tragywydd | whatever |
| 01:46.29 | Kremonte | you guys are too complicated. ; ; |
| 01:46.34 | Kremonte | man i am going crazy here |
| 01:46.39 | Kirkburn | Kremonte, if it makes you feel any better, no-one actually in my side of the conversation |
| 01:46.40 | tragywydd | *nix snob, imo |
| 01:46.41 | Kremonte | i thought i was just making a 10 line script or something |
| 01:46.57 | cladhaire | Kremonte: Why don't you just make an SVN repo, and switch between branches? |
| 01:47.07 | Kremonte | ... |
| 01:47.14 | Kremonte | no svn plz? |
| 01:47.19 | tragywydd | what's wrong with SVN? |
| 01:47.25 | Kirkburn | But anyway, I'm off to bed. Night night everyone! Sleep well! |
| 01:47.33 | Kremonte | because i already backup all my stuff on my domain manually, i just want to automate it |
| 01:47.36 | tragywydd | 'night Kirkburn |
| 01:47.43 | Cairenn | night Kirkburn |
| 01:47.43 | cladhaire | ok =) |
| 01:47.45 | Codayus | Kremonte: 10 lines? Could be WAY simpler. |
| 01:47.48 | Kremonte | only reason i need it is for when i'm switching between computers |
| 01:47.52 | cladhaire | it was just a suggestion =) |
| 01:47.55 | Kirkburn | =) night |
| 01:47.56 | Codayus | Hell, a one line rsync comamnd should do it... |
| 01:48.07 | Tain | winrar a -s addons.rar "c:\program files\world of warcraft\interface\addons" |
| 01:48.19 | Kremonte | Tain: interface\ wtf\ wdb\ |
| 01:48.34 | Kremonte | if winrar can do it all though then, i can use php which is fine |
| 01:48.57 | Tain | Yeah you could add each one, using the |
| 01:49.02 | Tain | winrar a |
| 01:49.15 | Tain | command and the same archive name it'll add each successive dir you put |
| 01:49.36 | Tain | So even if you had to run the command 3 times it would add each one to the same archive. |
| 01:49.39 | Kremonte | great |
| 01:49.40 | Kremonte | <3 |
| 01:50.38 | Kremonte | nice |
| 01:50.39 | Kremonte | it works |
| 01:50.42 | Tain | Then ftp is easy, just create a text file with the commands that you'd type in manually, one on a line. |
| 01:50.44 | Kremonte | tain poons all you ^_^ |
| 01:50.53 | Kremonte | afk being happy |
| 01:51.59 | Tain | I combined those two lines in my head and thought it said, "<Kremonte> afk being poopy" |
| 01:57.13 | Cairenn | night clad|sleep, sweet dreams |
| 01:57.18 | Tain | Didn't you just come out of clad|sleep like an hour ago? |
| 02:02.10 | clad|sleep | yeah |
| 02:02.15 | clad|sleep | that's how i roll =) |
| 02:05.04 | *** topic/#wowi-lounge by Cairenn -> Mod Dev Discussions. Happy Birthday Qzot! |
| 02:14.33 | cmunn | http://www.applegeeks.com/lite/strips/aglite4.jpg |
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| 02:38.12 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@adsl-68-127-172-95.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 02:39.14 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=masked@c-67-183-238-150.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 02:48.37 | Kaelten | heya guys |
| 02:48.55 | cmunn | back to your corner |
| 02:50.16 | Elviso | hrmmm, what are these new Password API functions |
| 02:50.22 | Tem | Next week is E3 right? |
| 02:50.55 | Kirov | 10-12 I believe |
| 02:51.51 | Tem | they are telling us the Alliance race at e3 right? |
| 02:52.07 | Cairenn | Tem: yes next week, that is the rumour |
| 02:53.36 | Tem | and what are the "viable" candidates? |
| 02:54.29 | Elviso | wow, you guys hear about this? " When patch 1.11 releases, Innervate will become a base ability for all Druids, trainable at level 40. Once the patch is live, any Druid who formerly had the Innervate talent will instead have the "Swiftmend" talent, which has been added to the Druid Restoration tree, replacing Innervate as the 31 point talent. This new ability will consume a Rejuvenation or Regrowth effect to produce an instant he |
| 02:54.29 | Elviso | al." |
| 02:54.47 | Kirov | http://cyberartist.shackspace.com/etc/WoWAlf.jpg |
| 02:55.06 | Tem | Elviso: link? |
| 02:55.08 | weab | and you read that from where? |
| 02:55.13 | Elviso | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?ForumName=wow-druid&ThreadID=863054 |
| 02:55.21 | Elviso | that's going to be really good for druids |
| 02:55.36 | Elviso | no more "must be 31 resto" to raid BS |
| 02:55.47 | Kirov | yay |
| 02:55.48 | weab | wow, i can't believe that's blue. |
| 02:55.50 | Tem | I'm so glad they are telling us stuff about druids |
| 02:55.58 | weab | say goodbye to resto druids |
| 02:55.59 | Kirov | more 6 minute cooldown trinkets! |
| 02:56.23 | Elviso | yeah swiftmend sounds somewhat weak, but giving ALL druids innervate will more than compensaet |
| 02:57.18 | Elviso | I heard mages are getting a Uproot Totem spell, and shaman are getting a SpellFury Totem :p |
| 02:57.18 | Kirov | Tem - for shamans they're making them act like target dummies where they only last as long as you're in combat, but you can drop as many as you want. |
| 02:57.39 | Kirov | They're also replacing all totems with flowers |
| 02:58.04 | Tem | terrific |
| 02:58.08 | Kirov | And if you still believe my lies, they're fixing the bug that let shamans sometimes die. |
| 02:59.34 | Tem | I hope they fix blink |
| 02:59.37 | Elviso | although....a NS+HT+SM+Regrowth+Rejuv+Regrowth is going to be a nasty combo |
| 02:59.50 | Tem | oh yeah... |
| 03:00.06 | Tem | so now Resto druids will completely own mages |
| 03:00.14 | Tem | they have 2 instant heals |
| 03:00.17 | weab | you mean like they already do? |
| 03:00.28 | Tem | if I get lucky I can take em out even including the one instant heal |
| 03:00.35 | Tem | with 2 they won't even have to try |
| 03:00.45 | Elviso | druids are really friggin hard to kill, but.....they do next to 0 DPS outside of moonfire spam |
| 03:00.47 | Tem | could probably wait for Moonfire to kill me |
| 03:02.06 | Tem | the mage changes better be fucking amazing |
| 03:02.18 | Tem | or I probably won't ever play mine again |
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| 04:05.16 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Wobin_ (n=Wobin_@221.221.21.92) |
| 04:12.24 | Miravlix | Hmm, SG1 as MMORPG, when I mentioned that the other day I had no idea they where making one. |
| 04:12.39 | Cairenn | you didn't? |
| 04:13.56 | norganna | Tem: Mages are getting back invisibility, right? |
| 04:14.05 | Tem | lol |
| 04:14.11 | Tem | I doubt that *very* seriously |
| 04:14.14 | norganna | no, seriously. |
| 04:14.17 | Cairenn | they are? it'd rock if they did ... |
| 04:14.32 | Tem | if we got it back it'd be so retardedly useless |
| 04:14.54 | Tem | they would make it like a <20 second ability and have it dump agro or something |
| 04:15.01 | norganna | I heard somewhere that they were, I can't put my finger on it tho. |
| 04:15.10 | Tem | if I get invis back, I want it to be like freakin stealth |
| 04:15.13 | Miravlix | I kinda suck as a 'fan' I don't look at web sites |
| 04:15.22 | Tem | I wan to bypass content like rogues |
| 04:15.26 | Tem | want* |
| 04:16.15 | Miravlix | Rogues and Druids |
| 04:17.11 | Miravlix | Mage invisibility would be like a druid contense skipper |
| 04:17.25 | Miravlix | Rogues is in a class of there own |
| 04:17.39 | Wobin_ | oh |
| 04:17.42 | Wobin_ | Brilliant |
| 04:17.42 | Wobin_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqO7zEWu0W0&search=warcraft |
| 04:17.49 | Wobin_ | I want gnome backup singers! |
| 04:20.44 | norganna | http://www.goblinworkshop.com/BlizzCon/2005/class-panel.html |
| 04:20.54 | norganna | search for "invisibility" in that page |
| 04:23.21 | Tem | norgs: hmm |
| 04:23.26 | Tem | I dunno |
| 04:23.32 | Tem | I would *love* to get invis back |
| 04:23.42 | Tem | but I fear it will be in such a nerfed form that it would be pointless |
| 04:23.42 | Cairenn | ditto |
| 04:23.46 | Cairenn | it rocked in CB |
| 04:24.33 | Miravlix | I don't see how they could nerf it |
| 04:25.12 | Miravlix | If they put it in, it will be stealth or shadowmeld on a timer, say 5 min |
| 04:27.09 | Miravlix | The very reason they changed Shadowmeld is prolly for Invisibility |
| 04:29.04 | Tem | Miravlix: I fear it will be a shadowmeld on a timer |
| 04:29.21 | Tem | making it nearly uselss for pvp |
| 04:29.42 | Tem | it would have to be useable in combat to have any real use in pve |
| 04:30.39 | Tem | and in pvp a shadowmeld that you can use in combat would be useless |
| 04:31.09 | Tem | "Oh look that mage vanished.. I *wonder* where he is now..." |
| 04:31.56 | Elviso | unless it gave some aggro-reduction when you 'vanish' |
| 04:32.21 | Tem | right |
| 04:32.23 | Elviso | or allow you to get ooc to drink |
| 04:32.24 | Tem | that would be the point |
| 04:32.35 | Tem | I doubt it would get you ooc |
| 04:32.37 | Elviso | but in pvp, it'd be hard to balance and make it useful |
| 04:32.51 | Tem | that's why I don't think we'll get it back |
| 04:33.06 | Elviso | they've said mages will get some form of invis I thought |
| 04:33.16 | Tem | because it would be too difficult to balance for pvp |
| 04:33.21 | Elviso | or that they're "working it back into the game" |
| 04:33.39 | Tem | it's purpose in pve would be an agro wipe which a lot of mages want *very* badly |
| 04:33.53 | Elviso | same here, mages pull aggro like mofos |
| 04:34.03 | Elviso | and/or have to limit their dmg alot |
| 04:34.09 | Tem | in endgame, if you pull agro it's so not your fault |
| 04:34.12 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Iriel (n=daniel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:34.21 | Elviso | heh, depends |
| 04:34.22 | *** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 04:34.22 | Tem | I *try* to pull agro and I can't |
| 04:34.29 | Elviso | its not hard on broodlord |
| 04:34.38 | Elviso | or the first 30s of chromag |
| 04:34.50 | norganna | as a priest, i wish fade caused loss of target / marks. |
| 04:34.52 | Tem | I speced AP/Fire before the trinkets were nerfed to try to pull agro in AQ20 |
| 04:35.02 | norganna | (in pvp) |
| 04:35.31 | Elviso | norganna, that'd be mostly a rogue nerf |
| 04:35.59 | Tem | you only lose your combo points if you target something else |
| 04:36.14 | Iriel | I though it got changed to ATTACK something elsE? |
| 04:36.22 | Tem | oh, maybe so |
| 04:36.27 | Elviso | true |
| 04:36.28 | Tem | my rogue isn't high enough to really know |
| 04:36.33 | Iriel | I dont actually know, but it was talked about here last week |
| 04:36.36 | Elviso | but they'd still cry the most :p |
| 04:36.41 | Tem | I did AP + both trinkets + Pom + Pyroblast on Moam <10 seconds after we engaged him and the tank kept agro |
| 04:36.43 | norganna | yes, if you retarget, the combo points are still there :) |
| 04:36.58 | Tem | but regardless, an addon could *easily* be written to destroy that |
| 04:37.17 | norganna | fade has a reasonably large timer |
| 04:37.25 | norganna | 3 mins from memory |
| 04:37.30 | Elviso | fade?? |
| 04:37.32 | Tem | really? |
| 04:37.35 | Elviso | it's 30s w/o talents |
| 04:37.36 | Tem | I thought it was like 30 seconds |
| 04:37.37 | Elviso | 15s with |
| 04:37.44 | norganna | really? |
| 04:37.53 | norganna | meh - shows how much i use it :P |
| 04:37.55 | Tem | norganna: what class do you play? |
| 04:37.56 | Elviso | and trans 5-piece gives reactive (free) fade |
| 04:38.08 | norganna | priest |
| 04:38.13 | Elviso | wow |
| 04:38.13 | norganna | my only 60 |
| 04:38.20 | Tem | what's the last time you logged on? |
| 04:38.32 | norganna | friday for mc :D |
| 04:38.39 | Tem | wow |
| 04:38.41 | norganna | who uses fade tho |
| 04:38.53 | Elviso | good priests? lol |
| 04:39.00 | Tem | ever do the Razorgore encounter? |
| 04:39.19 | norganna | if you're getting attacked by something, then someone's doing something wrong... |
| 04:39.36 | Elviso | so you call a wipe as soon as somethng bad happens? |
| 04:39.54 | Elviso | I've been raiding for a year now and never had a "perfect" run |
| 04:40.12 | norganna | my wars usually keep aggro off me |
| 04:40.31 | Elviso | and the bugs Ouro spawns randomly target, so no, someone doesn't have to do something wrong :p |
| 04:40.34 | norganna | sometimes i hit fade when they are not paying attention |
| 04:40.58 | norganna | ouro? |
| 04:41.13 | Elviso | worm PITA of AQ40 |
| 04:41.40 | norganna | nah - we've just killed rag at the moment |
| 04:42.44 | Cairenn | night all |
| 04:42.51 | Elviso | night Cairenn |
| 04:42.54 | norganna | tbh: memorizing cooldowns isn't my thing :P |
| 04:43.03 | norganna | night cair |
| 04:46.38 | Elviso | so, since I'm taking a sabbatical from WoW, I need a coding project to keep me busy... |
| 04:46.57 | Elviso | preferably PHP/Javascript, anyone have an idea for a website? |
| 04:47.31 | Wobin_ | .Net =) |
| 04:47.52 | Elviso | as in the technology? |
| 04:48.49 | Wobin_ | Learn C# |
| 04:49.12 | norganna | C# = Java++ |
| 04:50.29 | Elviso | I've played around w/C# |
| 04:50.46 | Elviso | but I'd rather do a project of actually creating something, rather than learning something new |
| 04:50.53 | Wobin_ | hm |
| 04:51.18 | Wobin_ | I can't not suggest something WoW related =P |
| 04:51.56 | Elviso | I *know* there's more....what'd be the term for it....sites like pastebin.com, imageshack, you-send-it.com, etc |
| 04:52.04 | Elviso | conveinence sites |
| 04:52.05 | KarlKFI | I have a project php javascript I would love done.. |
| 04:52.36 | KarlKFI | We need norganna's localization code applied to Cosmos |
| 04:53.02 | Elviso | that's a php/js project? |
| 04:53.04 | KarlKFI | with a sign in that will coordinate with our new vbulliten conversion |
| 04:53.08 | KarlKFI | ya |
| 04:53.28 | KarlKFI | he wrote it in php |
| 04:53.52 | norganna | http://norganna.org/localizer/index.phps |
| 04:53.55 | KarlKFI | it's for people to donate translations easily on the site |
| 04:54.06 | norganna | (that's the source) |
| 04:54.25 | norganna | get rid of the "s" at the end to view the actual site |
| 04:54.35 | Elviso | ya I love how adding the s to the .ext gives the source |
| 04:56.36 | KarlKFI | think you can do that? I can give you more detailed specs, but you might wanna see if you can set it up on yourown box to figure out how it works |
| 04:57.13 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kronus (n=Kronus@208.104.133.240) |
| 04:57.19 | Elviso | hrmmm I'm afraid not, would rather not do something wow-centric |
| 04:58.35 | norganna | KarlKFI: I could probably do that for you if that's something you'd want to do. |
| 04:59.15 | KarlKFI | definitely, It would require a bit of reworking on our side to have all our localization be the same format, but it would be very nice to have |
| 04:59.42 | norganna | nah - it'd be easier to make the website put out it's data in your format. |
| 05:00.06 | KarlKFI | well the thing is we dont really have a standard format |
| 05:00.16 | KarlKFI | just standard filenames |
| 05:00.48 | KarlKFI | but if you want to make it be able to handle tables that'd be cool |
| 05:00.54 | norganna | might be an idea to make a standard format first :P |
| 05:01.40 | KarlKFI | right, well the other option is to make a converter that takes input files and makes php templates for them |
| 05:02.30 | norganna | was supporting languages other than those natively supported by wow something that you wanted to achieve also? |
| 05:03.00 | KarlKFI | sure sure |
| 05:03.48 | KarlKFI | primarily we want to have en, fr, de, cn but the others would be great if we have the capibility, it's just hard to get consistant localizers |
| 05:04.35 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn (n=jbcc@d207-216-176-153.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 05:04.41 | Esamynn | Evening all |
| 05:04.47 | norganna | the way auctioneer works, is it has preferred languages, always falling back to english if no other more preferred localization exists |
| 05:05.56 | norganna | but generally with an open system like this, we end up with almost 100% localization anyhow |
| 05:07.23 | KarlKFI | ya, we have the english always loading and then the others loading if that lang is detected, how did you trigger the others? |
| 05:09.18 | norganna | the user selects their language preference, and then there's a function that we call with the translation name, and it works backwards through the user preferred locales, then the game locale, then finally the english locale to satisfy the request. |
| 05:13.07 | KarlKFI | ok, well how bout we make it so that the localization choice is stored and accessed by Sea or khaos optional dependancy and then if no prefrence is chosen or the dep isn't found it defaults to the current client lang... would that work? |
| 05:14.05 | norganna | there's other small matters as well. sometimes you always want the client-locale translation (for things like item-names etc) |
| 05:14.40 | KarlKFI | did you have different global names for each lang string? |
| 05:14.47 | End | hmm |
| 05:14.58 | End | perhaps I shouldn't code while raiding... |
| 05:15.01 | End | http://endif.cjb.net/misc/badtimetocode.jpg |
| 05:15.03 | norganna | so when you're comparing it with game-generated strings, it matches correctly regardless of the user-preferred locale |
| 05:15.34 | norganna | we get something like this: http://norganna.org/localizer/index.php/AucStrings.lua?a=download&prod=Auctioneer |
| 05:15.51 | KarlKFI | i know norg, the way we do it now the english is always loaded and then the others replace them at load time if that client is being used |
| 05:16.56 | KarlKFI | hmm |
| 05:17.04 | norganna | then we use this class to generate the strings: http://auctioneeraddon.com/trac/browser/trunk/auctioneer/Babylonian.lua |
| 05:17.23 | Kirov | woah |
| 05:18.04 | Kirov | end - why do you have orgimar overlayed on your screen? |
| 05:19.29 | End | Kirov, I was...trying something :P |
| 05:25.08 | KarlKFI | ya norg, that might be more than we need, lemme think |
| 05:25.28 | Esamynn | End: "Trying things" Isn't allowed! :P |
| 05:26.02 | norganna | Er, I thought it was "Having fun" was what's not allowed... |
| 05:26.11 | End | heh |
| 05:26.23 | Esamynn | norganna: that too |
| 05:26.34 | norganna | kk |
| 05:26.59 | KarlKFI | hmm, ok. non-client languages might not be viable. it would require major code rewrite in all addons |
| 05:27.16 | Esamynn | sigh, I'm starting to rue the day I decided to "fix" Gatherer's database structure :( |
| 05:28.20 | norganna | lol @ Esamynn |
| 05:28.20 | Esamynn | every new function I look at I feel the urge to smack my head because I'm going WTH would they do that!!!!! |
| 05:28.44 | norganna | i actually had a complete rewrite done, but by the time i finished it, the codebase had changed so much that it would have been a nightmare to reintegrate it. |
| 05:28.56 | norganna | so i just let them be |
| 05:29.16 | Esamynn | norganna: I decided to do it over the weekend when I installed it for a friend and discovered that the database can be restructured to be 25% of its current size without much of a restructuring at all |
| 05:29.38 | KarlKFI | ya, might jsut be easier to allow for the just the way it does it now, with globals that overwrite themselves |
| 05:30.19 | norganna | KarlKFI: no pain, no gain :P |
| 05:30.25 | Esamynn | I'm specifically concentrating on the database so I hope to be done by the end of the week |
| 05:30.46 | norganna | you want access to the SVN Esamynn ? |
| 05:30.52 | KarlKFI | i know, just rying to think of a way to do it with the least amount of change |
| 05:31.16 | Miravlix | We talking LanguageAddon? |
| 05:31.26 | Esamynn | norganna: you work on the project? |
| 05:31.27 | KarlKFI | no, but something similar |
| 05:31.39 | norganna | lol @ Esamynn :P |
| 05:31.43 | Cairenn|sleep | ROFL |
| 05:31.44 | Miravlix | With a bunch of OptionalDeps to know what code to load |
| 05:32.08 | Cairenn|sleep | Esamynn: norganna CREATED the project |
| 05:32.10 | Esamynn | hey, I have no idea who the original author is..... there are so many different places you can grab it, I couldn't tell |
| 05:32.12 | Esamynn | ahhh |
| 05:32.16 | Esamynn | sorry, I had no idea |
| 05:32.29 | Cairenn|sleep | along with gatherer and enchantrix |
| 05:33.17 | norganna | cair meains auctioneer, she's asleep tho, so the mistake can be excused easily :) |
| 05:33.27 | KarlKFI | I spose we could make a Language addon that is it's own localization handler lib that everyone could use |
| 05:33.29 | Esamynn | well, my appologies then, I hadn't really paid attention, I was just going to figure it out later ;) |
| 05:33.32 | Cairenn|sleep | errr, yeah, that too |
| 05:34.06 | norganna | so Esamynn: want svn access? |
| 05:34.24 | KarlKFI | then of course people will want to ba able to swith between them and have configs with default langs.. |
| 05:34.27 | Esamynn | norganna: see the PM |
| 05:34.45 | Miravlix | KarlKFI: Make the language library embedable |
| 05:34.54 | Cairenn|sleep | Iriel: shhhh ;) |
| 05:34.55 | Miravlix | So people can include them in there addon standalone |
| 05:35.02 | KarlKFI | mmm, maybe |
| 05:35.09 | Esamynn | lol, Cair always takes forever to get to sleep, after she says she is going |
| 05:35.09 | Cairenn|sleep | I was asleep ... yesterday |
| 05:35.37 | Miravlix | It's morning here, birds is singing and my darn cat isn't eating them |
| 05:35.38 | Cairenn|sleep | is cause I love you guys so much, it's hard to tear myself away |
| 05:35.39 | norganna | has anyone had experience writing a self-version-managing stand-alone addon? |
| 05:35.43 | KarlKFI | would have to have dynamic frames |
| 05:35.53 | Iriel | norganna : What do you mean? |
| 05:36.08 | Iriel | norganna : The 'standalone' part confuses me in that statement |
| 05:37.05 | norganna | er, s/stand-alone addon/embedded library/ |
| 05:37.05 | Miravlix | You want the ability to have multiple versions of the same addon in memory? |
| 05:37.20 | Iriel | http://www.iriel.org/wow/addondev/embedlibrary1.html |
| 05:37.23 | Iriel | You mean like that norganna ? |
| 05:37.25 | Cairenn|sleep | norgs, nice job, takes a lot to confuzzle the entire channel |
| 05:37.32 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kaelten (n=Kaelten@68.63.3.183) |
| 05:37.33 | KarlKFI | heh. many of us have written embeddables, yes |
| 05:37.47 | norganna | <3 iriel |
| 05:38.01 | norganna | i always wanted to do one of those... |
| 05:38.02 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Adrine_ (n=Adrine@208.187.119.42) |
| 05:38.13 | KarlKFI | now's your chance |
| 05:38.21 | KarlKFI | you could use iriel's or our method |
| 05:38.36 | norganna | cair: lol |
| 05:39.09 | Miravlix | For Multiversioned libraries you need Iriels version I think. |
| 05:39.18 | KarlKFI | why's that? |
| 05:39.38 | Miravlix | Iriel allow multiversions to exist in memory |
| 05:39.41 | Iriel | The Ace folks have a slightly altered version of mine too, with a couple of additional features |
| 05:39.45 | Miravlix | We just upgrade |
| 05:39.57 | KarlKFI | why do you need multiversioned?> |
| 05:40.11 | krka | i also have my own embedded-thingy |
| 05:40.13 | Tem | in case 2 incompatible version exist |
| 05:40.14 | krka | probably not as good though |
| 05:40.27 | KarlKFI | why would you make 2 incompatible versions |
| 05:40.38 | Esamynn | one version could be really old |
| 05:40.49 | Esamynn | and the new version is a completely re-written one |
| 05:41.05 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Qaarh (i=Qaarh@c-e51c72d5.029-112-6c6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 05:41.08 | Iriel | or a heavily customized non-compatible one |
| 05:41.17 | Miravlix | Esay: Might as well rename the library then |
| 05:41.26 | Miravlix | Make it Sky1 Sky2 Sky3 |
| 05:41.55 | Miravlix | Don't really need the addon to keep the same name. |
| 05:43.00 | Tem | that's basically what you are doing Miravlix only you do so with a major version change |
| 05:43.07 | norganna | true, but then your saved variables don't load |
| 05:43.11 | Tem | Major versions indicate incompatible API |
| 05:43.30 | Iriel | One reason, actually, is that with multi-names you need more stubs |
| 05:43.30 | Tem | norganna: you don't really have SV with embeded libraries |
| 05:43.34 | Iriel | Albeit a minor reason |
| 05:43.52 | Miravlix | norganna: Embedded libraries tend to avoid saving stuff |
| 05:44.04 | KarlKFI | well in this case you would need a single sv |
| 05:44.08 | Iriel | In my build file, the major version is machine generated |
| 05:44.14 | KarlKFI | language prefrence |
| 05:44.34 | Iriel | so it can end up like Iriel-dev-7e7103cfd9f18ad47bfa6e8e665fce6e |
| 05:44.39 | Iriel | if i've not committed stuff to svn |
| 05:46.20 | Miravlix | Embedded library would get it's language choice from the addons using it |
| 05:47.04 | KarlKFI | mmm, i dont think so |
| 05:47.10 | KarlKFI | i would make it a global var |
| 05:47.25 | Miravlix | If you do locale independent language selection. |
| 05:47.47 | KarlKFI | right, that was the idea |
| 05:48.06 | Miravlix | Then when you register with the library you also specify the error message language |
| 05:48.14 | Miravlix | The addon could get it's setting globaly |
| 05:48.39 | KarlKFI | why error msg? |
| 05:48.40 | norganna | KarlKFI: in auctioneer, we use a cvar to set the language preference, so that we have access to it even before SV is loaded. |
| 05:48.57 | KarlKFI | how early? |
| 05:49.05 | Miravlix | My embedded libraries only have locale issues with error messages |
| 05:49.40 | KarlKFI | aren't those client lang? |
| 05:49.41 | Iriel | Dont get me wrong but, what would you DO before SV's are loaded? |
| 05:49.45 | Miravlix | SeaSpellbook use GlobalStrings.lua |
| 05:49.46 | norganna | well, if the addon wants to output a string somewhere, and SV aren't loaded yet, then you are in trouble :P |
| 05:50.11 | Esamynn | good night all |
| 05:50.19 | KarlKFI | when is cvar avail? |
| 05:51.18 | Iriel | But since SV loads IMMEDIATELY after your addon files, you could conceivably just hold off doing anything until then |
| 05:52.04 | norganna | true, but my library doesn't want to put undue conditions on what the addon author may or may not do |
| 05:52.47 | norganna | karl - cvar is available all throughout the game, even from glue |
| 05:53.12 | KarlKFI | all i ask is a way to get the string in the prefered lang and a way to get it in the client lang |
| 05:55.29 | KarlKFI | make it two sepperate functions |
| 05:55.34 | Miravlix | Hmm, multi language support at run time, it does require everything to be in memory, but I guess thats the future. |
| 05:55.54 | norganna | the future? |
| 05:56.01 | KarlKFI | you could have it unload things |
| 05:56.18 | Miravlix | I can't unload Korean in case they switch to it later |
| 05:56.20 | KarlKFI | have a checkbox to automaticly nil other lanaguages |
| 05:56.35 | Iriel | Carry a gzip implementation and uncompress the languages on the fly |
| 05:56.35 | Iriel | 8-) |
| 05:56.45 | norganna | bitlib ftw! |
| 05:56.46 | Iriel | loadstring(gunzip(zippedLanguageData)) |
| 05:56.49 | KarlKFI | and just have a warning that you'll need to rl to get other langs back |
| 05:56.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge zespri (i=andrew@202.180.72.138) |
| 05:58.48 | Miravlix | Have to rewrite all language stuff to be in tables |
| 05:59.03 | Miravlix | So you can unload it at runtime easily. |
| 05:59.44 | Miravlix | I'm worried though about making translations files too complicated, but maybe the php solution fixes it so more people can help out. |
| 05:59.54 | norganna | i wonder if we could convince slouken to add gzip stuff for us... |
| 06:00.26 | Miravlix | When I wrote SeaSpellbook, I was really worried for a while doing the translation system, until I found GlobalStrings.lua |
| 06:00.57 | Miravlix | But we can't always be so lucky that Slouken provides translations strings |
| 06:01.10 | Iriel | I suspect it would depend on (a) the cleanliness (or not) of an all-lua solution, and the availability of a well tested open source lua gzip library |
| 06:01.33 | norganna | well, it'd just be a stub around libz |
| 06:01.55 | Iriel | But you'd need to add all the lua buffer mananagement stuff |
| 06:02.02 | norganna | (which wow already links agains) |
| 06:02.04 | Iriel | true, it's not a whole lot of work, but it's more than "none" |
| 06:03.12 | Miravlix | Do we have unlimited strings? |
| 06:04.10 | Tem | 'unlimited' until you run out of UI memory |
| 06:04.21 | norganna | iriel would know for sure, but i'm pretty sure we have "unreasonably huge strings" |
| 06:04.29 | Iriel | they become rather unweildy once they get big |
| 06:05.49 | norganna | there used to be some rather inadequate maximums on what would save in the SV files, but slouken fixed that ages ago |
| 06:06.03 | Miravlix | No one seems to use binary much in WoW. it's all strings. |
| 06:06.14 | Iriel | Well, "binary" has to be a string |
| 06:06.35 | Kirov | I have a version of LootLink that's binary |
| 06:06.35 | Iriel | I'm not sure NUL saves well in the SV file either, but I haven't tested it as far as I remember |
| 06:06.37 | Miravlix | s/all strings/all text strings/ |
| 06:06.54 | Kirov | nul saves fine, just looks ugly |
| 06:06.59 | norganna | and also, i find that people tend to overuse integers for small numbers |
| 06:07.37 | norganna | generally an itemid will be smaller (memory wise) as a string |
| 06:07.40 | Miravlix | How big is an integer? |
| 06:07.48 | norganna | there are no ints |
| 06:07.50 | Iriel | There's no integer |
| 06:07.53 | norganna | it's all floats |
| 06:07.59 | Iriel | you get the usual 16 byte 'value' that happens to use its "double" bit |
| 06:08.13 | Iriel | technically booleans are an integer |
| 06:08.19 | Iriel | but that's not very useful to us |
| 06:08.24 | norganna | so is that 8 bytes or 16 iriel? |
| 06:08.30 | Iriel | since we can't get at 31 of the 32 bits |
| 06:08.44 | Iriel | norganna : I believe the double itself is 8 bytes (It's a standard IEEE double) |
| 06:08.47 | Miravlix | 32 bit numbers in memory? |
| 06:08.55 | KarlKFI | just use strings for now norg |
| 06:09.01 | Tem | oh noes |
| 06:09.22 | norganna | also iriel, you may be able to answer this for me |
| 06:09.39 | Miravlix | 64 bit |
| 06:09.46 | Miravlix | Okay thats kinda big |
| 06:10.09 | Miravlix | But chars is UTF? |
| 06:10.10 | Iriel | Miravlix : Not all of those bits are 'easy' to use, but I think you can get at 56 or so as the value |
| 06:10.15 | norganna | i read somewhere that if you use all-integer indexes for a table in lua, that it creates a scalar array in memory |
| 06:10.17 | Iriel | chars is just bytes |
| 06:10.29 | Miravlix | More looking at it's memory footprint than what I can use |
| 06:10.38 | KarlKFI | oh and norg, make it use UTF-8 files with manual encodings |
| 06:10.39 | Iriel | norganna : Correct, in fact as long as >50% of the first 1-N integer indices has a value then that part is a scalar array |
| 06:11.09 | Iriel | norganna : Though it's sized in powers of 2 if you dynamically create it.. {} created tables are minimally sized for their content, however |
| 06:11.14 | Miravlix | So I can do 8 char numbers in the same memory footprint as a number |
| 06:11.21 | Iriel | Miravlix : Yes, ish. |
| 06:11.23 | Miravlix | Thats something to consider. |
| 06:11.28 | Iriel | Miravlix : Your string does have to live in the string table |
| 06:11.37 | Iriel | Miravlix : And that entry takes another, err, 16 bytes I think, i'd have to check |
| 06:11.50 | Miravlix | the number might even become reused |
| 06:11.53 | norganna | KarlKFI: what meanest thou? |
| 06:12.18 | Miravlix | So 4 char numbers to be safe? |
| 06:12.31 | Miravlix | Hmm, thats troublesome. 4 chars it not enough |
| 06:12.37 | KarlKFI | our svn eats special characters, we manyally encode them |
| 06:12.39 | Iriel | 4 char numbers would be very silly |
| 06:12.52 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Fix the mime-type on your entries |
| 06:12.55 | Miravlix | 5 is workable |
| 06:13.03 | KarlKFI | ? |
| 06:13.19 | Iriel | Storing anything in a string you could encode into a number is silly |
| 06:13.34 | Iriel | In fact, storing anything in a string you could encode into TWO numbers is probably also silly |
| 06:13.36 | Miravlix | But storing "1" is smaller than 1 |
| 06:13.41 | Iriel | Not really |
| 06:13.52 | Iriel | Storing 1 puts the value 1 into your value object |
| 06:14.24 | norganna | karl - that localizer page automatically escapes the UTF-8 encoded chars when it outputs it's localized files (is that what you mean?) |
| 06:14.26 | Iriel | Storing "1" adds a new 2 byte string to the environment, an 8 or 16 byte (I forget) entry to the string table (possibly, since it's allocated in powers of 2), and then stores the pointer to that string in your value object |
| 06:14.32 | Miravlix | And that object is 64 bits compared to a string thats 16 + numberofchars |
| 06:14.52 | Iriel | Miravlix : You forget that you have to pay for the object reference regardless |
| 06:15.05 | Iriel | Miravlix : and that's 16 bytes (or 80 if you happened to use named table entries) |
| 06:15.14 | Miravlix | Do we have chars? |
| 06:15.32 | Miravlix | aah sorry, always work in bits |
| 06:15.36 | Iriel | not on their own, no |
| 06:15.53 | Iriel | you have number (a double), boolean, and then a bunch of reference types |
| 06:16.12 | KarlKFI | iriel, which min encodings where? |
| 06:16.15 | KarlKFI | mine* |
| 06:16.16 | Miravlix | The string prolly has a size field too |
| 06:16.52 | Miravlix | We can store anything in strings, so it can't have a terminating char |
| 06:16.57 | Miravlix | So strings gets quite big |
| 06:17.59 | Miravlix | [08:06] <norganna> and also, i find that people tend to overuse integers for small numbers |
| 06:18.03 | Iriel | The string table entry for each string stores the hash and the size, and a pointer to the data |
| 06:18.15 | *** join/#wowi-lounge s|loup (n=loup@213.221.117.211) |
| 06:18.19 | s|loup | hi |
| 06:18.23 | norganna | Miravlix: yeah - maybe i was wrong about that one heheh |
| 06:18.36 | Miravlix | Seems so |
| 06:18.51 | norganna | i was trying to hide :P |
| 06:18.55 | Iriel | KarlKFI: It'd be something like svn propset 'svn:mime-type' 'application/octet-stream' Filename |
| 06:19.02 | Iriel | KarlKFI : If i'm remembering it correctly |
| 06:19.09 | Miravlix | Though for big numbers I see people overuse values |
| 06:19.23 | Miravlix | For one thing, CencusPlus can only count to 4m or so |
| 06:19.28 | Miravlix | Err, not 4m |
| 06:19.42 | Iriel | It's something like 72057594037927936 |
| 06:19.52 | Iriel | before you run out of space in the integer part of a double |
| 06:20.55 | norganna | well, i usually do stuff like: "12345|a|bcd|1|name", as opposed to { 12345, "a", "bcd", 1, "name" }. Do you think I'm actually saving memory? |
| 06:21.04 | Iriel | norganna : In that case, yes |
| 06:21.23 | Iriel | norganna : because it's one string header entry, plus the string's length + 17 |
| 06:21.42 | Iriel | norganna : Whereas the table is 12 bytes plus 16 per array entry |
| 06:21.46 | Iriel | PLUS the strings |
| 06:21.58 | Iriel | though there's a good chance they're shared |
| 06:22.04 | KarlKFI | just more overhead getting it out |
| 06:22.16 | Miravlix | Hmm |
| 06:22.26 | norganna | right, the array would be a scalar though, right? |
| 06:22.32 | Miravlix | Actually I think all CencusPlus can count to is 4294967296 |
| 06:22.48 | Iriel | so assuming string-use best case, it'd be 51 bytes for the string, versus 92 for the table |
| 06:22.55 | Iriel | Miravlix : How is that possible? |
| 06:23.08 | Iriel | Miravlix : How do you even manage a limit like that in wow's lua without EXPLICITLY coding it |
| 06:23.23 | Miravlix | Checking my math in game |
| 06:23.30 | norganna | iriel: make assumptions? |
| 06:23.59 | Iriel | norganna: I assumed best case for the table |
| 06:24.13 | Iriel | norganna : i.e. all the strings already existed, and it was created as a literal table and not dynamically allocated |
| 06:24.46 | norganna | no - i mean that if you assume the ints in game are normal ints and don't want to wrap, you code in a test-case for exceeding 4294967296 |
| 06:25.13 | Iriel | norganna : OH! |
| 06:25.20 | Iriel | norganna : That would be exceedingly silly wouldn't it 8-) |
| 06:25.22 | KarlKFI | seems to me like somehting that should be in the compiler, not the code.. |
| 06:25.35 | Miravlix | 39402006196394e+115 |
| 06:25.50 | Iriel | Miravlix : Well of course you'd never be able to count that high adding one at a time |
| 06:25.51 | norganna | but on the second line you said "without explicitly coding it" so you wrecked my answer... :( |
| 06:26.14 | Miravlix | Strange |
| 06:26.40 | Miravlix | Don't seem to have a limit to what numbers I can do with math |
| 06:26.55 | Miravlix | Aah got 1.#INF |
| 06:26.57 | Iriel | Miravlix : there is one, but it's VERY large |
| 06:27.09 | Miravlix | So why the hell can't CencusPlus count? |
| 06:27.11 | Elviso | wow, Chris Metzen looks nothing like I thought he would |
| 06:27.52 | Iriel | Elviso : What did youe xpect? a halo? |
| 06:28.09 | Elviso | norganna, a nerd of sorts |
| 06:28.11 | cmunn | Did you code Census+, Miravlix? |
| 06:28.17 | Elviso | s/norganna/nerd/ |
| 06:28.23 | Elviso | ... |
| 06:28.27 | Elviso | you get the point |
| 06:28.33 | Miravlix | No, then I would know why it keeps overflowing. :) |
| 06:28.45 | Miravlix | It keeps rolling over on my servers the XP count |
| 06:29.22 | cmunn | Oh |
| 06:29.27 | cmunn | It did that to me too |
| 06:29.48 | Miravlix | It has a very low upper limit and I'm wondering why |
| 06:31.26 | cmunn | Hrm |
| 06:31.51 | Miravlix | Not enough chars on my server at the moment to check when it rolls over |
| 06:32.17 | KarlKFI | so you think you can make the addon norgs? |
| 06:32.28 | norganna | the addon? |
| 06:32.36 | KarlKFI | the localization addon |
| 06:32.42 | Miravlix | The Addon to bind all other addons |
| 06:33.00 | norganna | convert cosmos you mean? |
| 06:33.01 | Miravlix | Hmm, that isn't even a joke considering what the addon does. |
| 06:33.03 | norganna | lol |
| 06:33.19 | norganna | i can setup the localizer page |
| 06:33.26 | norganna | i can import all your strings |
| 06:33.26 | Miravlix | 270171440 |
| 06:33.40 | Iriel | Miravlix : I know why |
| 06:33.47 | norganna | i can tie it into vbulletin |
| 06:33.57 | Miravlix | Hmm, XP count for 175 chars |
| 06:34.08 | norganna | i can output the data however you want it output |
| 06:34.21 | KarlKFI | ok, then you do that and I'll work on the adodn |
| 06:34.22 | Iriel | It's because it uses %d in its format strings |
| 06:34.22 | norganna | then.... you are on your own! lol |
| 06:34.30 | Iriel | Which means the double gets cast to an integer first |
| 06:34.33 | Miravlix | Need a server with population but thats hard to find at 8:30 in the morning |
| 06:35.29 | Iriel | Miravlix : It should do string.format("%.0f" instead |
| 06:35.49 | Miravlix | Searching and replacing and commiting. :) |
| 06:38.31 | KarlKFI | norgs, is there an easy way to convert new addons to use your format? |
| 06:38.52 | Iriel | If it's a new addon, it wouldn't be "converted" would it? |
| 06:39.47 | KarlKFI | i mean is there a way to feed localization files to the php and have it make default database info |
| 06:40.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=Tem@ip70-177-40-169.br.br.cox.net) |
| 06:41.09 | KarlKFI | also how do you have it integrated with your svn? |
| 06:41.13 | Miravlix | There CencusPlus with large number support. Cosmos only version, until someone tells the original author. |
| 06:41.41 | Iriel | Miravlix : Does it work? 8-) |
| 06:42.16 | Miravlix | What does it matter. :p |
| 06:42.26 | norganna | sorry KarlKFI - reading mage forums :P |
| 06:42.36 | KarlKFI | no worries, i'm in ubrs |
| 06:43.10 | KarlKFI | but its a guild run, so i can randomly afk just fine |
| 06:43.24 | norganna | my format is used by all my addons (gatherer is in the process of being converted to it) |
| 06:43.38 | norganna | i think it's pretty easy to use |
| 06:44.12 | KarlKFI | which format? |
| 06:44.18 | KarlKFI | the localization? |
| 06:44.29 | norganna | and it's not integrated with SVN at the moment. I (or one of the other devs) just go to that site, download the new copy of the file, and save, then commit it |
| 06:44.41 | KarlKFI | ah, that works |
| 06:45.40 | norganna | my addons just include that babylonian.lua file, then call it's methods to retrieve the localized strings when they need them |
| 06:45.41 | Miravlix | Doesn't look like I can find an EU server with a high enough population at this hour |
| 06:46.14 | KarlKFI | right, I'd prefer an embedable addon, but I can make one out of ur code |
| 06:46.52 | Miravlix | 304197920 |
| 06:47.15 | norganna | embedable? |
| 06:47.17 | Miravlix | Not getting over 4294967296 to test it |
| 06:47.33 | Iriel | Miravlix : Edit the code to make it exaggerate |
| 06:48.01 | KarlKFI | dont worry bout the addon, i'll make it |
| 06:48.05 | Miravlix | I can just commit it to Cosmos Alpha and wait for the reports. :) |
| 06:48.19 | Iriel | Ok, sleep now |
| 06:48.21 | Iriel | for real |
| 06:48.22 | Iriel | night all |
| 06:48.26 | norganna | nite |
| 06:49.59 | norganna | KarlKFI: I don't understand why you think that isn't embeddable? Do you want this to be a seperate addon? All my addons just include that same Babylonian.lua file (it's not a seperate addon) and use it's functions... |
| 06:50.28 | *** join/#wowi-lounge krka|work (n=kristofe@66.217.181.62.in-addr.dgcsystems.net) |
| 06:51.46 | KarlKFI | right, I don't like duplicate code in Cosmos, so I'll make an addon that we can just be dependant on for localization, then for standalone versions we can embed it |
| 06:52.26 | norganna | right :P |
| 06:52.37 | norganna | i think i understand now |
| 06:52.56 | norganna | you want it as a seperate addon somehow |
| 06:53.16 | KarlKFI | right, shouldn't be hard but you dont need to worry about that |
| 06:53.36 | norganna | yup - all you need to do is tell me how you want your data output |
| 06:53.41 | KarlKFI | :) |
| 06:54.11 | KarlKFI | sure sure, well your method should work fine with the sub functions, lemme figure out a name for the, |
| 06:55.54 | KarlKFI | global table* |
| 06:56.06 | KarlKFI | prolly gonna be different for each addon |
| 06:56.07 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth (n=kalroth@195.215.170.222) |
| 06:57.16 | norganna | basically the web-interface is just there to make it easy for the localizers to enter in the translations (without having to worry about SVN's, committing, character tables and escaping UTF characters) and for the developers to add new strings, revise the user localizations, and get updated localization files. |
| 06:58.09 | norganna | the biggest tricky thing here is gonna be tying it into vbulletin's user table. |
| 06:58.21 | norganna | since i don't have a copy :P |
| 06:59.00 | KarlKFI | what're u using on your site? |
| 06:59.13 | norganna | invision |
| 06:59.44 | KarlKFI | ah, k. well our vbulliten conversion isn't finished yet so we can do that last i think, just make an anon login for now |
| 07:00.39 | norganna | it should be ok... just need to get my hands on a vbulletin package somewhere (without paying for it) |
| 07:01.47 | krka|work | http://thepiratebay.org/search.php?q=vbulletin |
| 07:03.47 | KarlKFI | ok, well i need to get to bed so i can reconver from this cold. If you talk to sparkz and/or gryphon in cosmostesters they can help you with any web structure related questions |
| 07:04.09 | norganna | roger |
| 07:07.19 | KarlKFI | I'll see what I can do with the addon tomorrow, shouldn't be hard to get a demo up fast. the embedding code is short. The hard part for me will be making a sellection gui and dropdown using dynamic frames |
| 07:07.57 | KarlKFI | i'll have to see what iriel finnished int he way of converting the dropdown and button templates to dynamics |
| 07:08.09 | norganna | i might just write this without the vbulletin integration at the moment |
| 07:08.31 | KarlKFI | that's fine for now |
| 07:13.36 | cmunn | Ugh, Women |
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| 07:24.20 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (i=Elkano@client0484.vpn.uni-saarland.de) |
| 08:27.40 | norgs|away | nite all |
| 08:31.42 | KarlKFI | so much for sleep |
| 08:31.50 | KarlKFI | do I dare name an addon Localization? |
| 08:32.32 | Depherios | lol |
| 08:33.24 | Miravlix | As long as your the first |
| 08:43.52 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Djanee (n=his247@c-67-184-86-244.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 09:17.45 | Elviso | hrmm, this is somewhat interesting: "Using advanced technology in the LUA engine, you will be able to intergrate a "client->server" protocol while using technology ideas from bittorrent to create a stable 2D Game engine inside World of Warcraft." |
| 09:17.52 | Elviso | http://www.whataboutpp.com/users/ziot/wow-pokemon.html |
| 09:18.52 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (i=Elkano@client0047.vpn.uni-saarland.de) |
| 09:22.43 | cmunn | Interesting |
| 09:22.52 | cmunn | I'm less than optimistic though |
| 09:23.03 | Tem | ditto |
| 09:23.23 | Tem | his client-server model seems infeasible in the wow environment |
| 09:23.23 | Elviso | the idea of tieing the game into wow and wow into the game is pretty ambitious |
| 09:23.28 | cmunn | Even if they perfected the addon, you run into the issue that clients DC |
| 09:23.53 | cmunn | and the server HAS to be a client.. |
| 09:24.11 | Elviso | Nurfed has some pretty talented coders working for them, it'll be interesting to see what comes of it |
| 09:27.25 | Elkano | which addon are you talking about? |
| 09:27.25 | Elviso | http://www.whataboutpp.com/users/ziot/wow-pokemon.html |
| 09:28.28 | Codayus | Hmmm |
| 09:30.09 | Elkano | this will add a new dimension of spam to the barrens :/ "pokemon any1? /w me... im server..." |
| 09:30.22 | Codayus | Yeah, using a client server approach seems odd...but..hmmm |
| 09:30.38 | Codayus | May be a compromise between what's feasible to program, and what would be the ideal solution. :-) |
| 09:30.39 | *** join/#wowi-lounge netcurse (n=net@dslb-088-064-181-254.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 09:30.56 | Elkano | well, but p2p would add spam for those not having the addon installed or another chat channel... |
| 09:31.05 | Corrodias | so it's both impossible to write AND undesired by the users |
| 09:32.43 | Codayus | I'll give them this - it's ambitious and cool. |
| 09:33.02 | Codayus | Even if (as it may prove to be) pointless and doomed to failure. :-) |
| 09:33.43 | Codayus | (To clarify - I'm not predicting that it IS doomed to failure, I'm just saying that if it were, it'd still be pretty cool.) |
| 09:33.51 | Elviso | they're obvisouly bored and looking for something challenging to try to make |
| 09:33.53 | haste | about chat spam: why would people without the addon join the chat channel? |
| 09:34.14 | Elviso | I'd presume they wouldn't / couldn't |
| 09:34.29 | haste | You "can" prevent them, but only with a chan password |
| 09:34.41 | Elviso | the addon will probably moderate the channel, yes |
| 09:34.58 | haste | yaeh, you say something there |
| 09:35.14 | haste | anyway - back to installing windows for the first time in ages :D |
| 09:35.22 | Codayus | Hmm, probably don't need to worry about people joining a channel and getting spammed. |
| 09:35.48 | Codayus | But you may need to worry about people sabotaging a channel... |
| 09:36.30 | Codayus | Which remiends me, if a guild always used the same CTRA/oRA channel, is there anything nefarious you could do if you joined it? |
| 09:36.43 | *** join/#wowi-lounge zenzelezz_ (n=zenzelez@ti131310a080-6597.bb.online.no) |
| 09:36.44 | Elviso | you could totally wreck their CTRA |
| 09:37.00 | Elviso | (I assume) |
| 09:37.03 | Codayus | Hmmm. |
| 09:37.22 | Elviso | I dont have an intimate knowledge of how CTRA works |
| 09:37.23 | Tem | in an old version of CTRA, it didn't check if people were in your raid |
| 09:37.37 | Elviso | does it now? |
| 09:37.38 | Codayus | Awww, they check for that? Booo! |
| 09:37.53 | Tem | so if you joined a Guid's CTRA channel, you could do things like M$ You guys are going to wipe |
| 09:38.02 | Tem | (M$ is /rs) |
| 09:38.11 | Tem | good stuff |
| 09:38.12 | Codayus | *snicker* |
| 09:38.24 | Elviso | or you could make the HP values totally fubar'd |
| 09:38.34 | Elviso | make dead ppl appear alive, make alive ppl appear dead... |
| 09:38.40 | Tem | I don't think so |
| 09:38.58 | Codayus | Changing the MTs randomly every now and again would be amusing I guess. |
| 09:38.59 | Tem | that type of message has to come from that person |
| 09:39.00 | ckknight | frankly, I think the Pokemon mod looks cool |
| 09:39.09 | ckknight | change the MT to a priest |
| 09:39.09 | Elviso | ah |
| 09:39.10 | haste | Elviso: nope, they check if the request is from a valid source |
| 09:39.24 | haste | Elviso: and HP values are fetched trough the UI |
| 09:39.40 | Tem | I think it's a cool idea, but it seems highly infeasible to implement |
| 09:39.41 | haste | the only thing going on in the chan is buffs, cooldowns, messages, MTs, targeting |
| 09:39.43 | Elviso | are the /rs msg's not checking for (A) or (L)? |
| 09:39.53 | ckknight | Tem, yea, but I know _I_ could do it |
| 09:40.01 | Tem | Elviso: once upon a time no |
| 09:40.06 | Elviso | lol ckknight |
| 09:40.07 | Tem | but I think it does now |
| 09:40.18 | Elviso | I see, so knowing the channel wouldn't allow you to do much at all now |
| 09:40.24 | Codayus | Elviso: I believe that the /rs messages have a client side check so you can't send if you aren't. I have no idea if they now have one so you don't see it if the sender isn't... |
| 09:40.31 | haste | It won't allow you to do anything :) |
| 09:40.53 | Tem | Codayus: I don't think it did not all that long ago |
| 09:41.00 | haste | The message is prevented from being sent from the client (trough the slash commands) and on the client side |
| 09:41.02 | Tem | but I think now it checks on both sides now |
| 09:41.09 | Codayus | haste: Hmm, does oRA have any checks to see if the issuer of an MT command is in the raid? |
| 09:41.15 | haste | Codayus: yes |
| 09:41.17 | Elviso | you could always just spam the channel and try to disconnect them through nuking, if you didn't nuke yourself.. hehe |
| 09:41.26 | Codayus | Nifty. |
| 09:41.26 | Tem | Elviso: lol |
| 09:41.27 | haste | Codayus: oRA also doesn't trigger the event if the source is invalid |
| 09:41.50 | haste | Elviso: I was in a chat channel with 80 members yesterday, it works just fine :) |
| 09:41.58 | Tem | about the only thing you could do is sit in the channel until you are the only one present |
| 09:42.03 | haste | and the other guild used the threat meteer thingy... |
| 09:42.04 | Tem | and turn on moderation |
| 09:42.24 | haste | but that would be rather painful to do Tem :p |
| 09:42.25 | Codayus | haste: Holy mother of spam, eh? |
| 09:42.30 | Elviso | haste, was it used for CTRA/oRA or just as a normal channel? |
| 09:42.44 | haste | Elviso: CTRA/oRA/Threatmeter |
| 09:42.49 | Elviso | TemL now that would be nefarious |
| 09:43.00 | Elviso | s/l// |
| 09:43.06 | haste | :D |
| 09:43.20 | Elviso | DOH...anyways....just get ownership, but let them all join as normal |
| 09:43.26 | Tem | mmmm turning moderation on and keep voice away from everyone else |
| 09:43.32 | Elviso | then wait till mid raid, and mtue 3/4's the raid |
| 09:43.45 | haste | Tem: well, when most guild have a problem with the chan they just change it |
| 09:44.04 | Tem | "Are you guys not getting my ready checks?" |
| 09:44.06 | Elviso | "most" guilds wouldn't be smart enough to find that problem I dont think |
| 09:44.16 | Elviso | they'd keep just spamming the broadcast over and over |
| 09:44.27 | Elviso | and *maybe* change the channel, eventually |
| 09:44.46 | Tem | I know my guild would keep spamming the channel |
| 09:44.57 | Codayus | Write a quick mod that'll randomly mute and unmute people - keep about 1/5 of the raid muted, but keep changing it. |
| 09:45.01 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Crispix_ (n=Crispy@c-24-7-241-103.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 09:45.04 | Elviso | now, if you had a "guy on the inside" that'd alert you that they were working on it, just give voice back to everyone |
| 09:45.12 | Elviso | then wait 15m, unvoice all again |
| 09:45.21 | Tem | Elviso: lol |
| 09:45.35 | haste | so... evil : |
| 09:45.45 | Codayus | That should keep them confused for a while - various CTRA functions will randomly break for random people, and then start working again... |
| 09:45.57 | Tem | I'd rather have oRA / CTRA send raid chat to another channel |
| 09:45.59 | Elviso | lol |
| 09:46.19 | Tem | so you can 'spy' on them |
| 09:46.29 | Elviso | it'd be fun to mess w/their damage meters as well |
| 09:46.34 | Tem | lol |
| 09:46.36 | Codayus | Elviso: Oooh! |
| 09:46.43 | Elviso | give random priest +20k dmg |
| 09:47.26 | Codayus | That could be amazing - especially if you were familiar with the guild in question. Pick one person who's really proud of the their DPS output...and then give everyone else an extra few k damage... :-) |
| 09:47.27 | Elviso | i wonder if DM checks in-raid or not |
| 09:48.27 | Tem | I bet not |
| 09:48.44 | Tem | it doesn't seem 'smart enough' |
| 09:50.12 | Elviso | about the nuking: i know that I quit using CTRA because anytime I died and released, it'd disconnect me |
| 09:50.22 | Elviso | I got rid of CTRA and never had the problem again |
| 09:50.41 | Elviso | possibly unrelated coincidence, but I attributed it to the chat spam sent while I was zoning... |
| 10:01.27 | Codayus | Hmmm. |
| 10:01.34 | Codayus | In 1.11 all druids get Innervate. |
| 10:01.35 | Codayus | Nice. |
| 10:02.11 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Maldivia (i=the_real@tux.nerdheaven.dk) |
| 10:02.24 | haste | Elviso: I don't think CTRA is related. It sounds a little to strange |
| 10:02.49 | Elviso | that was awhile ago, probably 7-8 months |
| 10:03.05 | KarlKFI | so, anyone know how to make a simple dynamic frame for events? |
| 10:03.31 | haste | Was that back when CTRA was the only way you could get HP values? |
| 10:03.38 | Codayus | Also, the blue posts on this page amuse me: |
| 10:03.39 | haste | 'cause then it would be related I guess :) |
| 10:03.40 | Codayus | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-druid&t=863108&s=blizzard&tmp=1 |
| 10:04.16 | Elviso | haste: I'm unsure of the timeline of events for that |
| 10:04.53 | Elviso | haste: but I do know disabling CTRA fixed it. I'm sure that if that's what was causing my problems it's been fixed now though. |
| 10:05.12 | Elviso | but I have no need for CTRA....so I use oRA on the rare occassion I play my druid :) |
| 10:05.35 | haste | hehe |
| 10:09.21 | haste | KarlKFI: self.master:SetScript("OnEvent", self.OnEvent) |
| 10:09.35 | haste | (copy paste ftw) |
| 10:09.45 | KarlKFI | have to make the frame first, but yes |
| 10:10.16 | haste | self.master = CreateFrame("Frame", nil, UIParent) :) |
| 10:10.28 | KarlKFI | ya thx, i found it |
| 10:11.53 | Maldivia | *yawn* Morning |
| 10:19.25 | *** join/#wowi-lounge zenzelezz_ (n=zenzelez@ti131310a080-10668.bb.online.no) |
| 10:26.42 | wereHamster | morning |
| 10:27.29 | Elkano | maldivia <3 thanks for the enchanting list :) |
| 10:30.30 | Maldivia | hehe, np :) |
| 10:31.04 | Maldivia | it seems popular :) |
| 10:31.25 | Elkano | you could add different sorting/categorizing options if you want :) (so group all +agi, +str, +fire res) |
| 10:31.52 | Maldivia | well, right now it's sorted in the order it's specified in the data file ;) |
| 10:32.11 | Maldivia | I've tried to sort them the best I could, by slot and the by type |
| 10:34.15 | Elkano | but it's said that there is not GetEnchantInfo to return localized names :( |
| 10:34.26 | Elkano | s/said/sad/ |
| 10:35.15 | Maldivia | Elkano: there's a debug function in the code, that dumps all localized names to a chatframe :9 |
| 10:35.37 | Elkano | hmmm... |
| 10:35.46 | *** part/#wowi-lounge tragywydd (n=Tragywyd@cpe-24-59-191-241.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 10:36.07 | Maldivia | or well, it's actually a debug function I added for 1.10, to test if the names I've listed in the data files are correct, since 1.10 added disconnect on misspelled enchant-links :9 |
| 10:36.27 | Maldivia | but for another language, all should be wrong, so all enchants should be listed |
| 10:36.49 | Elkano | so on DEde I would be disconnected when linking? |
| 10:37.10 | Maldivia | I don't know... don't think so... |
| 10:37.43 | Maldivia | the servers are not language specific, and it's the server that validates, so I think you can link the english version just fine |
| 10:37.58 | Maldivia | but well, one way to find out ? :) |
| 10:38.38 | Maldivia | but if you can generate a list of the german names, I'll add a localization |
| 10:38.53 | Elkano | btw: what would be the commands to dump/save the names? |
| 10:39.52 | Maldivia | hmm, look in the EnchantMe.lua file, it's the function at the bottom, think it's called eme_test() or something :) |
| 10:40.25 | Elkano | will that only dump o chat or also safe the data to file? |
| 10:41.06 | Maldivia | it will dump to chat... let me make a quick addon that dumps to a SV, so you can mail me that file ? |
| 10:41.24 | Elkano | k :) |
| 10:44.47 | Maldivia | hmm, let me just test it :9 |
| 10:45.10 | Maldivia | hmm, 1.10.2 is out on live... |
| 10:45.22 | Maldivia | guess I can't test it... :9 |
| 10:46.58 | Elkano | well, you can still send it to me, in case it doesn't work I'll try fixing :) |
| 10:47.22 | Maldivia | http://nerdheaven.dk/~the_real/wow/mod/EnchantMe_Dump.zip |
| 10:47.29 | Maldivia | just run /script eme_dump() |
| 10:49.06 | Elviso | what is EnchantMe? |
| 10:49.23 | Maldivia | http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=4924 |
| 10:49.34 | Maldivia | Elviso: see above link |
| 10:49.40 | Elviso | ok ty |
| 10:51.29 | Cairenn|sleep | anyone still logged in to the blizz (us) forums? |
| 10:51.58 | Maldivia | bugger... no :| |
| 10:52.01 | Elkano | mail? |
| 10:52.09 | Maldivia | maldivia@gmail.com |
| 10:52.31 | Cairenn|sleep | ah well |
| 10:52.49 | Maldivia | morning Cairenn :) |
| 10:53.27 | Cairenn | morning :) |
| 10:53.35 | Elkano | ok, you forgot to add the savedvariabel :) |
| 10:54.44 | Maldivia | lol :9 |
| 10:54.50 | Maldivia | sorry |
| 10:54.59 | Cairenn | patch |
| 10:55.07 | Maldivia | yeah |
| 11:02.53 | JoshBorke | morning Cairenn |
| 11:03.02 | Cairenn | morning Josh |
| 11:03.26 | Elkano | ok, looks good :) |
| 11:03.44 | JoshBorke | morning all |
| 11:05.10 | Elkano | file is on the road :) |
| 11:05.21 | Cairenn | patch notes are up: http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4708 |
| 11:06.42 | Maldivia | Elkano: thanks :) |
| 11:06.53 | Codayus | Hmm, nothing too interesting. No surprise though... |
| 11:08.21 | Maldivia | hmm, now I just need someone with the french version to do the same :) |
| 11:10.37 | Maldivia | Elkano: but you don't get disconnected for linking the english versions, right? |
| 11:11.23 | Qaarh | I was looking at the patch notes and though "Mac, what class is that?".. then I realized what I was thinking.. doh |
| 11:11.33 | Cairenn | lol |
| 11:11.34 | Wobin_ | heh |
| 11:12.31 | Maldivia | hehe |
| 11:12.49 | Cairenn | and I thought I was still 3/4 asleep ... |
| 11:13.42 | Wobin_ | hrm, nothing too ... |
| 11:13.46 | Wobin_ | Oh someone said it already =P |
| 11:14.04 | Wobin_ | I thought the stacking of PI and AP was already patched |
| 11:15.20 | Maldivia | Wobin_: probably because 1.10.2 has been on PTR for a few weeks ? |
| 11:16.07 | Wobin_ | I must have read it somewhere else, I haven't been looking at the ptr at all |
| 11:17.31 | Wobin_ | Is ItemEquipLoc Localised? |
| 11:17.40 | Wobin_ | from GetItemInfo |
| 11:17.58 | Wobin_ | oh meh |
| 11:18.31 | Wobin_ | wuh? |
| 11:18.34 | Wobin_ | All string returns (itemName, itemType, itemSubType, itemEquipLoc(until 1.9)) are localized. |
| 11:18.50 | Wobin_ | until 1.9? Does that mean itemEquipLoc is no longer localized? |
| 11:20.01 | Maldivia | itemequiploc returns the name of a global string, that contains the localized name |
| 11:20.11 | Codayus | Uh...didn't they do something where...uh... equiploc now returns like...what Maldivia said. |
| 11:20.27 | Codayus | Bleh, tired. |
| 11:21.41 | Maldivia | Elkano: hmm, what would be a good word to use, in the German translation, for the miscellaneous category... |
| 11:22.11 | Wobin_ | Verschiedenes |
| 11:22.21 | Wobin_ | That's the one Blizzard uses I think |
| 11:22.34 | Elkano | Maldivia: didn't try linking and 'Verschiedenes' should be fine |
| 11:23.39 | Maldivia | Ok, thanks - have a german translation now :9 |
| 11:27.07 | Elkano | :) |
| 11:29.58 | Maldivia | the German translations of the enchants are somewhat inconsistant... |
| 11:31.10 | Maldivia | or well, for Spirit enchants anyway... they can't really decide if it should be Willenskraft or Willen it seems :) |
| 11:41.48 | Elkano | afair it used to be Weisheit for some time ^^ |
| 11:42.05 | Elkano | or was it 'Geist' |
| 11:43.51 | s|loup | [13:29:58] <Maldivia> the German translations of the enchants are somewhat inconsistant... <-- no we are just complicated ^^ |
| 11:44.09 | Cairenn | hey s|loup :) |
| 11:44.23 | s|loup | hi cairenn |
| 11:44.43 | Maldivia | s|loup: yes, I know the German language is complicated... I've had 6 years of German classes :) |
| 11:51.01 | Wobin_ | Geist as in ghost? |
| 11:51.25 | Wobin_ | not a particularly good translation, that... |
| 11:51.50 | Industrial | how do i cap my download speed in firefox |
| 11:51.59 | Wobin_ | Don't think you can |
| 11:52.04 | Industrial | ahjlkfsdalkjfsdahadsf |
| 11:52.07 | Industrial | shitty browser |
| 11:52.10 | Industrial | :p |
| 11:52.13 | Wobin_ | You can get an external program to do it though |
| 11:52.18 | Wobin_ | Try NetLimiter |
| 11:52.21 | Industrial | noooooo |
| 11:52.28 | Wobin_ | And then set firefox in it to wahtever cap you want |
| 11:52.33 | Industrial | netlimiter + nod32 antivirus == BSOD |
| 11:52.49 | Industrial | ;) |
| 11:52.56 | Industrial | its a great progem tho |
| 11:53.01 | Industrial | (both :p) |
| 11:53.11 | Industrial | program* |
| 11:55.58 | Elkano | [13:52] <Wobin_> Geist as in ghost? <-- more like in spirit |
| 11:57.11 | wereHamster | does anyone know a good linux program do create 2D graphs? graphviz kinda creates only directed graphs and that's not what I want. |
| 11:57.28 | Miravlix | Gimp? |
| 12:00.38 | Miravlix | http://www.gimp.org/ |
| 12:00.53 | Miravlix | Oh, they have Windows and Mac versions these days |
| 12:03.35 | Codayus | gimp is really a raster image program. Making graphs sounds like you're looking for vector graphics. |
| 12:04.01 | wereHamster | I have a list of values and I'd like to plot a 2D graph |
| 12:04.15 | Codayus | Oh, THAT kind of graph. |
| 12:05.39 | Codayus | gnuplot? |
| 12:06.06 | Codayus | http://gnuplot.info/ |
| 12:06.32 | wereHamster | Codayus, thanks, looks good |
| 12:07.59 | Codayus | The learning curve is pretty awful, but it's very powerful, and more or less the "standard". |
| 12:10.56 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (i=usr125@80.193.211.68) |
| 12:21.46 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Josh_Borke (n=Josh@antimatter.stl.gtri.gatech.edu) |
| 12:21.54 | Josh_Borke | morning again |
| 12:22.08 | Cairenn | wb Josh |
| 12:23.33 | wereHamster | Codayus, are you familiar with gnuplot? |
| 12:23.42 | Codayus | Not very, no. |
| 12:25.08 | Cairenn | and there's the other thing I like about you guys ... you don't bullshit what you do or don't know just to try to impress one another |
| 12:25.24 | Cairenn | *another |
| 12:25.36 | Industrial | I own at gnuplot |
| 12:25.39 | Industrial | i own j00 all |
| 12:25.41 | Industrial | huh! |
| 12:25.42 | *** join/#wowi-lounge [MoonWolf] (n=moonwolf@f176182.upc-f.chello.nl) |
| 12:25.46 | Codayus | Heh |
| 12:25.49 | Industrial | ;D |
| 12:25.51 | Cairenn | ~whaleslap Industrial |
| 12:25.57 | purl | ACTION beats Industrial upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 12:25.57 | Industrial | m00? |
| 12:27.12 | [MoonWolf] | lol |
| 12:27.29 | Cairenn | morning [MoonWolf] |
| 12:27.39 | [MoonWolf] | more like afternoon |
| 12:27.48 | Cairenn | yeah well ... ;) |
| 12:28.18 | Cairenn | patch on US side, notes are in the chit chat forum at wowi |
| 12:28.18 | [MoonWolf] | ah |
| 12:28.18 | [MoonWolf] | 1.10.2 ? |
| 12:28.18 | Cairenn | yeah |
| 12:28.24 | Cairenn | nothing overly thrilling |
| 12:28.31 | [MoonWolf] | * Arcane Power: This aura will no longer stack with Power Infusion. :( |
| 12:28.58 | Industrial | HAHA PWNT |
| 12:29.00 | Industrial | nerf mage! |
| 12:29.14 | Cairenn | ~whaleslap Industrial |
| 12:29.20 | purl | ACTION beats Industrial upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 12:29.34 | Industrial | I'm scizzors. Nerf rock. Paper's fine. |
| 12:29.36 | Industrial | :D |
| 12:29.51 | [MoonWolf] | ~whaleparry |
| 12:30.05 | [MoonWolf] | ~whaleparry Cairenn |
| 12:30.10 | purl | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry Cairenn's attacks. |
| 12:30.18 | Cairenn | heh |
| 12:30.28 | Cairenn | ~whaleblock Cairenn |
| 12:30.31 | purl | ACTION shields Cairenn with a freakishly huger whale named ollywag |
| 12:30.47 | Cairenn | I win |
| 12:31.08 | [MoonWolf] | damnit |
| 12:31.13 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 12:31.38 | Industrial | Cairenn always wins |
| 12:31.39 | Industrial | :p |
| 12:31.51 | Cairenn | funny how that works out ... |
| 12:32.06 | Industrial | work, dammit! |
| 12:35.07 | Maldivia | <rant> it's MS... what did you expect </rant> |
| 12:36.03 | Industrial | i know.. |
| 12:36.34 | Industrial | but its still a bishie dat dont work! >< |
| 12:42.57 | *** join/#wowi-lounge dieck (n=dieck@saengerschafter.de) |
| 12:44.08 | dieck | hi. Is there any api command to look (by name) if a player is online? (I'm working on an eqdkp/raidplanner-aware invite plugin) |
| 12:44.18 | Miravlix | It's just you who has misunderstood the concept of MSSQL |
| 12:44.51 | Miravlix | You just have to adjust your perception so you can see the inovation in it's functionality |
| 12:45.20 | Miravlix | dieck: /who |
| 12:46.49 | dieck | yes, the /who command can be used by SendWho, but then I have to wait till WHO_LIST_UPDATE is sent and parse that event |
| 12:48.17 | dieck | I'd rather like a direct api command, like "isOnline(playername); - returns true or false" :) |
| 12:48.37 | Miravlix | You will have to ask on the UI forum for features. |
| 12:49.03 | s|loup | i want a function to get the afk status |
| 12:49.30 | s|loup | why can i get the info for friends but not forr raidroster/grp? |
| 12:50.02 | Miravlix | You can, just send everyone a tell |
| 12:50.06 | Miravlix | Are you afk? |
| 12:50.13 | s|loup | this will be spam ;) |
| 12:50.50 | Miravlix | Yeps and thats precisely why I want the Blizzard chat system to have a code that makes it 'ignore' chat lines |
| 12:50.52 | s|loup | but why did they include a field in GetFriendInfo(index) to check the afk/dnd status? |
| 12:51.05 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (i=Elkano@client0707.vpn.uni-saarland.de) |
| 12:51.22 | Miravlix | There is a lot we can do, if the chat system has hidden chat lines |
| 12:51.39 | s|loup | i didnt understand the difference between friends and grp/raid |
| 12:51.44 | s|loup | in this matter |
| 12:53.28 | Miravlix | I'm not sure how well designed the Blizzard UI is, it seems to have it's fair share of woops code, that doesn't follow any defined design. |
| 12:53.54 | Elkano | moonwolf, are you there? |
| 12:53.57 | dieck | so, if someone's in your raid/grp and you want to get AFK status, just do a _dirty_ workaround: AddFriend(name), GetFriendInfo(), RemoveFriend(name). |
| 12:54.11 | dieck | ok, have a look not to remove friends that were there before you added them :) |
| 12:54.28 | dieck | I'll do the same for isOnline :) |
| 12:54.29 | Miravlix | But the friedsystem is certainly completely different from the party/raid system |
| 12:55.46 | Miravlix | So I can understand why the party/raid API doesn't have a afk/dnd scanner, but why the information is availble to the friend system and not /who is a mystery |
| 12:56.12 | s|loup | yes but you can get infos about friends and also about raid/grp so why not include a flag for raid/grp like for friends |
| 12:56.31 | Miravlix | Ask Slouken? |
| 12:56.38 | s|loup | hm i cant ;) |
| 12:56.41 | dieck | it's with every grown, unplanned structure: don't try to poke around or it'll become broken :) |
| 12:56.54 | Wobin_ | Hehe |
| 12:56.55 | Miravlix | My opinion on the matter doesn't make any difference. |
| 12:56.57 | s|loup | only if he is here |
| 12:57.07 | Wobin_ | You can do a quick 'friend person' 'check' 'unfriend |
| 12:57.08 | Wobin_ | ' |
| 12:57.26 | dieck | already on it, Wobin :) |
| 12:57.26 | Cairenn|afk | s|loup: yes you can, you can ask someone on the US side to post for you, or you can talk to the couple of folks that have his direct email addy |
| 12:57.28 | Wobin_ | (if they're not already friended) |
| 12:57.53 | Wobin_ | I'm tired =) |
| 12:58.05 | Wobin_ | And I need a better theme for gaim so I can actually read faster |
| 12:58.16 | Wobin_ | white on black, anyone? =P |
| 12:59.13 | s|loup | hm maybe slouken will be coming when i think close at him ^^ |
| 12:59.29 | s|loup | *ommmmmmmmmm**slouken**ommmmmm* |
| 13:00.51 | Wobin_ | why is it so hard to find a gaim theme? |
| 13:01.22 | Wobin_ | or am I looking for the wrong thing? |
| 13:01.57 | Miravlix | I soo prefair text mode IRC clients |
| 13:01.57 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Wobin_ (n=Wobin_@221.221.21.92) |
| 13:02.37 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Wobble (n=Wobin@221.221.21.92) |
| 13:03.14 | Miravlix | But I need 2K $ or so to buy a new machine first. Then I can convert this one into the new Linux server and use the console for IRC. |
| 13:03.18 | Wobin_ | Mucheasier to read |
| 13:03.58 | Miravlix | It's annoying when they change the bus, it's quite expensive getting a new cpu, motherboard and GFX card at the same time |
| 13:06.47 | s|loup | hm cairenn i think the most doesnt understand your questionsystem for e3 |
| 13:07.06 | dieck | ok, quick and dirty: http://wow.bandbreiter.de/addons/FriendsInfo.lua -- wrapper to return GetFriendInfo for people not on your friends list. |
| 13:09.32 | Maldivia | dieck: have you tested that it works, because as far as I know, the friend system is async. meaning an event fires when the data (requested with ShowFriends()) has been retrieved from the server |
| 13:10.06 | Miravlix | Yeah, the friend system can be horrible slow |
| 13:10.18 | s|loup | do you know that you must wait for the event FRIENDLIST_UPDATE to get newest infos? |
| 13:11.04 | s|loup | so calling ShowFriends() and then waiting for the event to get new infos |
| 13:11.31 | Industrial | Wobin_: look for gtk themes |
| 13:11.33 | Miravlix | Adding and checking a raid could take 10-20 mins |
| 13:11.39 | Industrial | art.gnome.org |
| 13:11.43 | Wobin_ | Industrial: Ta |
| 13:11.47 | Industrial | np |
| 13:11.48 | Maldivia | sometimes I'd wish we had some user-defined events |
| 13:11.55 | Industrial | Maldivia: ace :P |
| 13:12.04 | Industrial | kek |
| 13:12.06 | Industrial | ^____^ |
| 13:12.07 | s|loup | but i dont know if AddFriend() will produce the same effect as ShowFriends() |
| 13:12.44 | Wobin_ | What sort of user-defined events? |
| 13:12.47 | Maldivia | Miravlix: for afk raid checks, I would probably scan Guild information, since it has a status field for afk, and often the majority of members in the raid are guild-members :) |
| 13:12.59 | s|loup | oO |
| 13:13.05 | Wobin_ | But not all the time, Mal =) |
| 13:13.16 | s|loup | not in my raidgrp ^^ |
| 13:13.19 | Wobin_ | I for one am a non-guilded raider |
| 13:13.29 | Wobin_ | Since my guild is too small to effectively raid |
| 13:13.38 | Miravlix | I'm fairly sure that most raids is not guild based |
| 13:14.05 | Wobin_ | Except for some exceptionally large guilds |
| 13:14.06 | Maldivia | if we're talking 40-man raids, I'd say just the opposite |
| 13:14.07 | Miravlix | We are talking less than 10% that gets to do the big end game raids |
| 13:14.22 | Wobin_ | otherwise it's difficult to get the numbers together |
| 13:14.28 | s|loup | i think its more than 10% as in this time |
| 13:14.58 | Maldivia | but doing a friend and guild list scan, will probably give information about a good part of the raid (non PUGs ofcourse) |
| 13:14.58 | Miravlix | In Anarchy Online we have tons of people for raids |
| 13:15.20 | Miravlix | BWL, AQ40 and stuff like that is contense for a very very small minority |
| 13:15.26 | Industrial | Miravlix: :-) |
| 13:15.38 | Wobin_ | wouldn't that require the person with the addon to be 'friended' with the majority of the non-guildies? |
| 13:15.45 | Industrial | Miravlix: and like everyone has alts at a certain level to battle at the leve of those towers :P |
| 13:15.50 | Wobin_ | Which is probably not very likely... |
| 13:16.13 | Maldivia | a UnitStatus(unit) would be really nice, for returning AFK/DND etc status |
| 13:16.17 | s|loup | blizzard postet last year a estimate of 9% raiders but what should the 90% of players should do within the last 4-6 months? |
| 13:16.42 | Miravlix | I don't know why WoW players can't deal with non guild raids |
| 13:16.46 | s|loup | farming the 5-man instances would be odd |
| 13:16.56 | Maldivia | rep farming in 3 BGs ? |
| 13:17.09 | s|loup | so i think most go to raidgrps and now you will be find maybe 20-30% raid |
| 13:17.21 | Miravlix | Naah it hasn't changed |
| 13:17.37 | Miravlix | It's still an insignificant group that gets to raid |
| 13:17.52 | Maldivia | hmm, does tooltips show DND/AFK status, when you use SetUnit ? |
| 13:18.20 | s|loup | we have more than 50 raidgroups on my server increasing |
| 13:18.29 | s|loup | only on one side |
| 13:18.35 | Miravlix | You also have 6 million players |
| 13:18.42 | s|loup | @tooltip: yes can be |
| 13:18.53 | s|loup | could |
| 13:19.13 | s|loup | yes 6 million but not all on my server ^^ |
| 13:19.40 | Miravlix | Out of the 4-5K players pr. server you have 200/400 raiders |
| 13:20.20 | Kalroth | much more |
| 13:20.26 | Josh_Borke | hm, we have 200 raiders in our guild alone :-( |
| 13:21.03 | Miravlix | Then your guild is prolly the primary raid guild on your server |
| 13:21.08 | Kalroth | My server is small, only 5 Nef kills and maybe 15 Rag kills, but that's by at least 15 guilds |
| 13:21.26 | Kalroth | you'll need to be at least 50 accounts in a raid guild |
| 13:21.33 | Kalroth | most of them are 60-80 |
| 13:21.39 | Kalroth | if not more |
| 13:21.56 | Kalroth | so my my small server it's 15*70 = 1050 |
| 13:22.03 | Kalroth | so for my* |
| 13:22.20 | Kalroth | there's servers with 40+ rag killing guilds and 15+ nef killing guilds |
| 13:22.20 | Miravlix | The server goes into queue mode around 2400 players pr. side |
| 13:22.27 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cmunn (n=cmunn@wirelessdata-031-031.mycingular.net) |
| 13:23.01 | Kalroth | sure, 4800 players in total, what does that have to do with amount of raiders? :) |
| 13:23.25 | Miravlix | 50% of the total players that can play is going to BWL? |
| 13:23.40 | s|loup | not all going to bwl |
| 13:23.42 | Kalroth | 50%? |
| 13:23.55 | s|loup | most are just doing mc or onyxia |
| 13:24.15 | Kalroth | like I said, 5 nef killing guilds and ~15 (might be more) rag killing guilds |
| 13:24.25 | Kalroth | Onyxia is for PUGs now |
| 13:24.31 | *** join/#wowi-lounge haste (n=haste@host-81-191-131-80.bluecom.no) |
| 13:24.41 | Kalroth | and you can do the first part of MC with a PUG as well |
| 13:25.10 | Miravlix | If we just could get a DKP bot, we could do BWL with pugs |
| 13:25.19 | Kalroth | lol |
| 13:26.07 | Kalroth | Miravlix: Just join a poopsucking guild for MC adventures! |
| 13:26.15 | Maldivia | hehe... reminds me of ther very first pull I attended in MC - with a PUG :) |
| 13:26.40 | Maldivia | we wiped on the first 2 giants over and over... so fun to look back at now :9 |
| 13:26.44 | Kalroth | haha |
| 13:26.55 | Wobin_ | bababababababa MOOONFIREEE |
| 13:26.56 | s|loup | look the giants....stamp...down....LEAVE!!!! |
| 13:27.00 | Miravlix | If puging most of WoW isn't possible, then the current generation of MMORPG players suck |
| 13:27.14 | Kalroth | giants wasn't a problem for us, not even on the very first attempt |
| 13:27.17 | Kalroth | but the firelords |
| 13:27.32 | Kalroth | "Hay guyz, the spawn just split into 2, is it supposed to do that?" |
| 13:28.40 | Maldivia | next time I entered MC, was with my guild... not even a single death in the first 2xgiant pull : |
| 13:28.41 | Maldivia | In out first MC guild run... we had a double firelord pull... :9 |
| 13:28.41 | Kalroth | maybe the average wow player will gain a little more skill now that Stra/Scholo is limited to 5 and UBRS to 10 :) |
| 13:28.41 | Maldivia | hopefully |
| 13:28.41 | Josh_Borke | Miravlix: my guild isn't the primary raid guild on the server |
| 13:28.51 | cmunn | Well there's a difference between a PUG of players who have never run MC before attempting it, and a PUG of players who have run MC and know what to expect |
| 13:28.53 | Josh_Borke | there are at least 5 other alliance guilds that are doing much more content than we are |
| 13:29.06 | Kalroth | cmunn: indeed, but PUGs can get that experience too |
| 13:29.10 | cmunn | just as there's a difference when I run gnomeragan with a PUG of alts and when I run with mains... |
| 13:29.26 | Maldivia | I don't think I've ever PUGed UBRS with 10 man... I've done guild runis with 7 or 8, without any problem... but PUGs just seems to wipe constantly, with less than 15... |
| 13:29.43 | cmunn | True, I'm just pointing out that wipes on account of ignorance are acceptable in PUGs. |
| 13:29.58 | Wobin_ | I've had some good experiences with PUG UBRS |
| 13:30.00 | Kalroth | cmunn: oh of course, it's to be expected even |
| 13:30.02 | Miravlix | The raid group size limit is a problem |
| 13:30.16 | Kalroth | I've never done PUGs on my main, but I've done it on an alt char of mine |
| 13:30.18 | Miravlix | Makes it a lot harder for inexperinced and expeirnced to mingle |
| 13:30.26 | Wobin_ | yeah |
| 13:30.30 | Kalroth | I do it when I'm bored or down, it's awesome for a good laugh |
| 13:30.31 | cmunn | True |
| 13:30.41 | Miravlix | In AO there is no raid groups |
| 13:30.50 | Miravlix | So 100 players can show up |
| 13:30.57 | cmunn | Anarchy Online? |
| 13:30.58 | Miravlix | and the contense only need say 20 |
| 13:31.06 | Wobin_ | Zerg ftw |
| 13:31.13 | Miravlix | Nope |
| 13:31.25 | Miravlix | Totally clueless get you killed |
| 13:31.35 | Miravlix | But if you have a core that knows what they are doing |
| 13:31.47 | Miravlix | All the inexperinced players wont matter |
| 13:32.05 | Miravlix | Problem is in WoW all players has to *know* |
| 13:32.15 | Miravlix | You don't have a way to teahc them |
| 13:32.16 | Maldivia | "hmm, what happens if I use this taunt ability"... ohh, I die... ups... |
| 13:32.47 | Wobin_ | The one Onyxia PUR I did, the raid leader explained things fairly well |
| 13:32.53 | Wobin_ | we only wiped once |
| 13:32.55 | Miravlix | There is no watching and learning from experinced players |
| 13:32.55 | s|loup | you can teach them by using tools like teamspeak |
| 13:33.28 | Miravlix | Unless your English was perfect I couldn't use teamspeka for anything |
| 13:33.29 | Wobin_ | ts and vent are great tools |
| 13:33.36 | Miravlix | And I really doubt teamspeak is ever perfect |
| 13:33.37 | Wobin_ | STOP DPS |
| 13:33.51 | Wobin_ | Well, nobody ever said perfect, but they are good tools |
| 13:33.58 | Wobin_ | They help |
| 13:34.16 | Miravlix | Yeah when you live in a country where only same language people is involved |
| 13:34.35 | Wobin_ | Granted, I'm playing on the US servers, so chances are the language is fairly common |
| 13:34.48 | Kalroth | Wobin_: unless you run into a canuck! |
| 13:34.53 | Miravlix | I like in a country with 5 million people and a language difference inside the country thats so big I can't understand what someone from west is saying |
| 13:34.56 | Wobin_ | Kalroth: Then they speak English |
| 13:35.00 | Wobin_ | And it's alright =P |
| 13:35.21 | Kalroth | Wobin_: but they all go "eh? whatcha talkin' aboot!" |
| 13:35.34 | s|loup | hm the only ones who didnt speak my language are gold farmers ^^ |
| 13:35.53 | Wobin_ | I earned 15g doing translations for people wanting to talk to CGFs =) |
| 13:35.58 | Elkano | Miravlix, you're from sitzerland? |
| 13:36.10 | Miravlix | There is one country in Europa that speaks English and thats the UK |
| 13:36.17 | s|loup | denmark i think |
| 13:36.21 | Kalroth | Miravlix: like hell they do :) |
| 13:36.22 | Wobin_ | Ireland? |
| 13:36.24 | Miravlix | Elkano: No |
| 13:36.27 | cmunn | They help, but even with TS and differing languages, if you can communicate in /ra you can setup a few basic TS voice commands to expect from your raid leader |
| 13:36.50 | Miravlix | The rest of us has English as second or third language and we seldom ever get to use it in our daily life. |
| 13:36.51 | Kalroth | Miravlix: There's 7 brits in my guild and they all range from 'royal british' to 'chav/pikey british' :) |
| 13:37.09 | Wobin_ | "I fockin hate pikies!" |
| 13:37.10 | Kalroth | the latter being almost impossible to decypher |
| 13:37.28 | Kalroth | "fook joo" <- most common sentence used by druid classleader! |
| 13:37.45 | s|loup | hihi |
| 13:37.50 | Wobin_ | "Dya lahk daghs? Ah lahk dahgs!" |
| 13:38.12 | Kalroth | "come again?" -- "daghs!" |
| 13:38.22 | Miravlix | But most of us has a fairly good grasp of written English. |
| 13:38.28 | Kalroth | "oooh, dogs!" -- "ya, daghs!" |
| 13:38.32 | Wobin_ | I'm so going to have to rewatch Snatch |
| 13:39.19 | Miravlix | EU servers has a lot of nationality guilds |
| 13:39.37 | s|loup | oO |
| 13:39.38 | Kalroth | yup, quite natural |
| 13:39.57 | Miravlix | But I've always been of the opinion that if I want to be around my countrymen then my house has a door I can walk out of. |
| 13:40.09 | Kalroth | there's swedish only, hungarian only and uhmm, one spanish only guild on my server |
| 13:40.26 | cmunn | So the raid leader explains the encounter in /ra and lays out a few useful voice commands that everyone can follow... |
| 13:40.39 | Kalroth | Miravlix: Same, I prefer mixed guilds, as long as people understand english ;) |
| 13:41.42 | cmunn | Most of us speak a romantic or germanic language... so we wouldn't have that much trouble telling "No DPS" and "Si DPS" apart or even "DI clerisomething" |
| 13:42.45 | Miravlix | Bottom line is, the Instanced nature of WoW makes a good PuG culture nearly impossible to develope. |
| 13:43.12 | Wobin_ | I'm not sure WoW would work as well without the instances, though |
| 13:43.56 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Stylpe (n=Stylpe@210.80-202-248.nextgentel.com) |
| 13:43.58 | Miravlix | The stuff I like best is pure PuG |
| 13:43.59 | Miravlix | PvP |
| 13:44.50 | Miravlix | Doesn't seem to work all that badly |
| 13:45.02 | cmunn | difficult, but not nearly impossible... |
| 13:46.01 | Tain | Ack non-instanced WoW would have been an absolute disaster. |
| 13:46.43 | cmunn | I almost want to join an EU server now... |
| 13:46.46 | Miravlix | Doesn't have to be non-instanced |
| 13:47.03 | Miravlix | But the instances is far to small |
| 13:47.04 | Tain | There's a reason everything is instanced, Blizzard learned from games before them. |
| 13:47.14 | Miravlix | Could be 100 man instances |
| 13:47.50 | Tain | Well, that was a design decision, they stuck to 40 for a reason. But, yes they could. |
| 13:47.52 | Miravlix | AO is instances too, but there is room for the 'main' group and a ton of assisters |
| 13:48.14 | cmunn | True... We could use some instances too large for single guilds to attempt on their own |
| 13:48.34 | Tain | Personally I'm glad there's a limit, but that's only thinking of myslef. |
| 13:48.38 | Stylpe | Chu! |
| 13:48.47 | Maldivia | non-instanced in a PvP universe... and all you'll get is griefing... |
| 13:48.58 | Tain | I hated 100 man raids in EQ. |
| 13:49.04 | Miravlix | WoW instances size is based on difficulty when you have a perfect group |
| 13:49.05 | Wobin_ | UO all over again =) |
| 13:49.25 | Wobin_ | Miravlix: But when you get that group... woooo smooooooth. |
| 13:49.53 | Miravlix | Yes, but you do need a ton of repair bills and no one new can get in after you get the good group |
| 13:50.01 | Maldivia | none of the instances in wow are based around "the perfect group"... |
| 13:50.29 | Wobin_ | The 'perfect' group consists of completely epixxed out players burning through the mobs non-stop =P |
| 13:50.38 | Wobin_ | which isn't really challenging |
| 13:50.42 | Miravlix | No |
| 13:50.53 | Wobin_ | or enjoyable past the initial surge |
| 13:50.55 | Miravlix | The fully equiped group is what you get after doing the instance |
| 13:51.07 | Tain | Nah, there's no perfect group. You just have to aim higher than you need to make up for the idiots that will always be a part of it. |
| 13:51.14 | dieck | nope. The perfect group is the one that can do any instance without deads in a reasonable time. If they do it in greens or naked, ok. |
| 13:51.15 | Miravlix | Thats not a perfect group |
| 13:51.23 | Tain | It's what WoW is based on. |
| 13:51.38 | Wobin_ | The perfect group is one that can work together seamlessly despite what equipment |
| 13:51.49 | Tain | A group of all quality players, reagardless of class distribution, will blow through content. |
| 13:51.49 | dieck | ack |
| 13:52.06 | Tain | The larger the group, the more of a curve you get of good, bad, and average players. |
| 13:52.09 | dieck | but no females elves if the group raids naked -- too distracting :) |
| 13:52.12 | Wobin_ | I mean, even if we wipe multiple times, if the group is a good one, that works together, I won't feel like it was a bad experience |
| 13:52.12 | s|loup | the perfct grp is where the players have fun to play |
| 13:52.27 | Corrodias | the perfect group is any one i'm in |
| 13:52.33 | Maldivia | Tain: well, I'd like to see 40 mages handle MC :) |
| 13:52.45 | Miravlix | 40 druids can do it! |
| 13:52.47 | Wobin_ | Maldivia: As long as they have fun doing so... =) |
| 13:52.49 | s|loup | there is no cow lvl! |
| 13:52.55 | Miravlix | 40 Gnome Engineer mages! |
| 13:53.13 | Maldivia | Wobin_: ohh yeah... it would hell, but it would be fun! |
| 13:53.20 | Tain | 40 mages would do great, until you got to bosses. |
| 13:53.22 | Tain | :) |
| 13:53.43 | Wobin_ | I'm actually enjoying the non-mana aspect of roguing so far |
| 13:53.48 | Maldivia | dmg, dmg... kite... ice block... next "tank"... |
| 13:53.58 | Wobin_ | Hehe |
| 13:54.04 | Miravlix | Mana classes has a really annoying downtime |
| 13:54.18 | Tain | Statements like that make me weep. |
| 13:54.21 | Wobin_ | You could possibly trade off quite well... although Iceblock only temporarily pauses the aggro doesn't it? |
| 13:54.26 | Maldivia | end-game mana users have zero to none down time |
| 13:54.27 | Miravlix | We need more ways to restore mana in WoW, so it gets on par with non mana classes |
| 13:54.35 | Tain | Mana classes in WoW have a 30 second downtime at most. |
| 13:54.53 | Wobin_ | Maldivia: Although, if they're the -only- dps... =) |
| 13:54.57 | s|loup | so druids will get innervate for all type of druids |
| 13:55.00 | Tain | Trying to play a mana class in games before WoW you had minutes of downtime. |
| 13:55.02 | Miravlix | Leveling my mage, I am drinking 90% of the time and fighting 10% |
| 13:55.13 | Tain | I'd question your fighting tactics then. |
| 13:55.21 | Wobin_ | wand more =) |
| 13:55.23 | Tain | Because going to 60 with my Mage that was never the case. |
| 13:55.40 | Maldivia | solo-levelling a mage is: kill 4 mobs, drink, rinse repeat... |
| 13:55.58 | Tain | How you could be drinking for more than 30 seconds at a time I don't understand. |
| 13:56.03 | Miravlix | Not on a PvP server, have to keepyour mana up |
| 13:56.05 | Maldivia | solo-levelling a warrior: kill 2 mobs, bandage, kill 2 mobs, eat, rinse releat |
| 13:56.16 | Tain | Which means you're what fighting for 3 seconds? |
| 13:56.29 | Wobin_ | solo-levelling a rogue: kill mob, kill mob, kill mob, kill mob...rinse and repeat =P |
| 13:56.34 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Andalia (n=xx@p54ADB41A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:56.44 | Miravlix | Your fighting for 5-10 seconds then drinking for 30, fighting for for 5-10 seconds drinking for 30 |
| 13:56.44 | s|loup | solo a druid: kill 1 mob kill 1 mob kill 1 mob endless |
| 13:56.47 | Tain | You have to eat or bandage as a Rogue occasionally. ;) But Rogue was the most fun for me to level. |
| 13:57.00 | Tain | That's just not true Miravlix. Ok fine I'll qualify that. |
| 13:57.05 | Wobin_ | Tain: only if I get whalloped upon by more than two mobs |
| 13:57.07 | Tain | That was absolutely not true for me. |
| 13:57.26 | Wobin_ | Of course, explosives help too =) |
| 13:57.38 | Maldivia | I've leveled 2 mana users to 60 on a high population pvp server... and no, you don't have to constantly have more than 70% mana |
| 13:57.47 | zenzelezz | I've only levelled warriors past 20 :-| |
| 13:57.49 | Tain | Mage was my first character, I went to 60 in a mix of solo, groups, instances, raids, all content. |
| 13:58.12 | Tain | And there was *never* a case like you explain. |
| 13:58.45 | Miravlix | Well, my mage is 35 at the moment and he is stuck in BB, because I get tired of all the downtime |
| 13:59.06 | Miravlix | He just sell kittens to the horde now |
| 13:59.21 | cmunn | lol |
| 13:59.24 | Tain | Everyone needs snacks. |
| 13:59.33 | Wobin_ | kitty poker! |
| 13:59.39 | Maldivia | Kitty Poker! |
| 14:00.06 | Miravlix | But any time I try to quest with him, he has 50% or worse downtime |
| 14:00.11 | Maldivia | Long live the King, Joss Whedon |
| 14:00.29 | Wobin_ | Miravlix: I just love that line "I used to play a mage... but now all I do is sell kittens to the horde..." |
| 14:00.31 | Josh_Borke | yay for converting usenames! |
| 14:00.37 | Miravlix | My 35 Shadow Priest is a bit better with mana regain |
| 14:00.48 | Tain | Seriously Miravlix, I can't imagine how you're playing if you're actually being honest with those numbers. |
| 14:01.05 | Wobin_ | A priest can easily shield and cast or wand safely |
| 14:01.15 | Miravlix | I even went all out Arcane to get mana regain talents |
| 14:01.21 | Tain | I can't even manufacture circumstances in my head that you'd have that much downtime as a mage. Maybe if you're only fighting things 4 levels above you? |
| 14:01.25 | Wobin_ | That used to be my grinding tactic. shieldup and wand once mob was down about half |
| 14:01.38 | Miravlix | Yellow or lower quests |
| 14:01.45 | Maldivia | hell, I levelled my mage, using arcane missiles a lot, because I was lazy, and I didnt even have those downtimes |
| 14:02.10 | Wobin_ | I'm a hopeless mage |
| 14:02.13 | Maldivia | Wobin: hehe, I love playing with the wand... :) |
| 14:02.14 | Josh_Borke | Wobin_: i shield and use my staff after they are about 10% so i get full mana regen |
| 14:02.23 | Josh_Borke | trying to skill-up my staff :D |
| 14:02.30 | Wobin_ | Maybe I'll try relevelling when 1.11 comes |
| 14:02.47 | Tain | I got sick of playing a mage on raids so I quit and havent' played him since. |
| 14:02.51 | cmunn | Any class reworks expected in 1.11? |
| 14:02.55 | Wobin_ | at 50 I was grinding nonstop the undead in WP |
| 14:02.55 | Miravlix | Priest, Shield, Mind Blast, Mind Flay, Mind Flay, Mind Blast, Wand to death |
| 14:02.59 | Wobin_ | cmunn: Mage |
| 14:02.59 | Josh_Borke | druids get innervate |
| 14:03.00 | Maldivia | cmunn: Mage revamp |
| 14:03.03 | Wobin_ | cmunn: and shammies |
| 14:03.09 | cmunn | Ahh |
| 14:03.20 | Maldivia | Miravlix: dont forget PWP |
| 14:03.23 | Miravlix | and with spirit tap you get most mana back |
| 14:03.28 | Josh_Borke | priest: mind blast, SW:P, shield, mind flay, mind flay, mind flay, staff |
| 14:03.40 | Miravlix | Cast shield earlier |
| 14:03.45 | Wobin_ | nah |
| 14:03.48 | Maldivia | Josh: no no, wand - not staff :9 |
| 14:03.48 | Wobin_ | not really necessary |
| 14:03.49 | Miravlix | The mob will take it down |
| 14:03.54 | cmunn | I actually avoid MindBlast with my shadow priest |
| 14:04.07 | Miravlix | Well, life is easier now with 15 second shields |
| 14:04.09 | Wobin_ | My shield lasted until almost the end of combat for me |
| 14:04.16 | cmunn | SW:P, MindFlay, Shield at melee range, then mindflay down |
| 14:04.25 | Wobin_ | any damage I took from then regenned by the time I next pulled |
| 14:04.34 | Josh_Borke | my shield rarely doesn't last |
| 14:04.35 | cmunn | Oh, and VE |
| 14:04.40 | Josh_Borke | only when i'm fighting things 3 lvls above me |
| 14:05.11 | Maldivia | or certain rogue class mobs... |
| 14:05.13 | cmunn | MindBlast is just too mana inefficient for my tastes |
| 14:05.15 | Josh_Borke | currently grinding boars and what not in blasted lands. 10% per 30 minutes |
| 14:05.50 | Miravlix | Grinding isn't game play |
| 14:05.54 | Wobin_ | MB inefficient? I'd say Mindflay is somewhat inefficient? |
| 14:06.12 | Josh_Borke | i'd say mind flay is WAY more efficient than mind blast |
| 14:06.30 | Tain | I only use Mind Filet |
| 14:06.34 | Josh_Borke | Miravlix: it's the only way i'll advance him when I only have 30 minute chunks of time i can play :-) |
| 14:06.36 | cmunn | Mind flay, Mana per damage point is more efficient... |
| 14:06.44 | Miravlix | But on mage only choice is burn a long cooldown evocate or drink for 30 seconds |
| 14:07.10 | Josh_Borke | and i'm making wicked mad gold off of the skins and drops :D |
| 14:07.23 | Miravlix | Druid has shapes and doesn't need to burn mana so badly |
| 14:07.33 | Miravlix | Hunter is actually a mana problem class |
| 14:07.38 | Wobin_ | yeah |
| 14:07.46 | Wobin_ | Hunters can drain mana quite fast |
| 14:07.50 | Wobin_ | but autoshot isn't bad either |
| 14:07.51 | cmunn | Never played a hunter past 10 |
| 14:07.53 | Miravlix | But you can adjust your playstyle to lower your dps, since they are overpowered for PvE |
| 14:08.58 | Miravlix | Only class I seem to have a game play problem with is the mage. |
| 14:09.36 | Miravlix | I have 40 hunter, 42 warrior, 35 priest, 35 mage, 24 shaman, 20 paladin, 3x Rogue and 60 druid |
| 14:09.46 | Miravlix | 19 Warlock |
| 14:10.02 | Miravlix | But warlocks is great, they just burn there health and make the pet tank |
| 14:10.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=George@151.56.195.89) |
| 14:10.59 | cmunn | bbiaf |
| 14:12.32 | *** join/#wowi-lounge ForgottenLords (n=Forgotte@059.216-123-195-0.interbaun.com) |
| 14:13.37 | Miravlix | Hmm, anyone know a downtime recorder addon? |
| 14:13.58 | Wobin_ | How do you mean? |
| 14:14.31 | Miravlix | How long you have been eating/drinking, been in combat, not in combat? |
| 14:14.46 | Wobin_ | hm, not that I can recall |
| 14:15.25 | Miravlix | Would prolly get to a pitifull 0.01% in combat |
| 14:17.37 | Miravlix | Too bad a thing like that needs a decent GUI, or I could write it in a few minutes. |
| 14:18.54 | Corrodias | i wonder if DamageMeters keeps track of that, or of the opposite |
| 14:19.03 | Industrial | it would only need one button imo |
| 14:19.20 | Josh_Borke | why's it need a gui? |
| 14:19.23 | Industrial | 'start grinding/doing whatever repeated fighting' |
| 14:19.26 | Industrial | and stop |
| 14:19.28 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Suntiger (i=moonwolf@f176182.upc-f.chello.nl) |
| 14:19.28 | Josh_Borke | just have it output the info to the chaframe |
| 14:19.39 | Industrial | you'd want to start/stop counting |
| 14:19.47 | Industrial | and measure that time |
| 14:19.55 | Industrial | right? |
| 14:19.56 | Industrial | :p |
| 14:22.03 | s|loup | [16:19:03] <Industrial> it would only need one button imo <-- why not using the events for resting/combat? |
| 14:22.25 | Industrial | check the button to 'start grinding' |
| 14:22.30 | Industrial | and measure down time and combat time |
| 14:22.36 | Industrial | and check it again to stop grinding |
| 14:22.40 | Industrial | thats how i see it anyway |
| 14:22.51 | Industrial | why measure when you are in a city? ;) |
| 14:23.14 | Kirkburn | It amazes me that people are actually complaining about the Innvervate change |
| 14:23.31 | Kirkburn | *innervate |
| 14:23.44 | s|loup | hey most classes find that change imba ;) |
| 14:23.54 | Kirkburn | Yes but DRUIDS are complaining |
| 14:24.01 | Kirkburn | :S |
| 14:24.39 | s|loup | hm they are frightened about the coming flood of moonkins ^^ |
| 14:24.40 | Kirkburn | We'll I'm happy for druids, I wouldn't like to be forced into a raid spec |
| 14:24.44 | Kirkburn | heh |
| 14:25.30 | Industrial | what does moonkin form do |
| 14:25.34 | Kirkburn | I hardly ever see a Moonkin |
| 14:25.37 | Industrial | i only know bear and cat |
| 14:25.43 | Kirkburn | It's the balance spec form |
| 14:26.04 | Industrial | *shrug* |
| 14:26.04 | Kirkburn | Don't know anything more than that |
| 14:26.12 | Industrial | i see them mezz people |
| 14:26.18 | Industrial | sleep mezz |
| 14:26.44 | Kirkburn | ooh |
| 14:26.44 | Industrial | thats what i miss in wow |
| 14:26.52 | *** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower (n=chatzill@host-70-45-84-10.onelinkpr.net) |
| 14:26.52 | Industrial | mezz and stuns and shit from daoc |
| 14:26.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cmunn (n=cmunn@66.209.15.236) |
| 14:26.55 | Industrial | DaoC* |
| 14:26.55 | s|loup | the moonkin get 360% armament |
| 14:26.55 | Kirkburn | Priests could sleep once |
| 14:26.59 | Industrial | and speed buffs* |
| 14:27.00 | Industrial | ! |
| 14:27.18 | Industrial | i want speedbuffs :D |
| 14:27.30 | s|loup | and has a aura to get +3% crit chance |
| 14:27.32 | Josh_Borke | moonkin gets +3% spell crit |
| 14:27.36 | Kirkburn | http://www.blizzard.com/wow/screenshot.aspx?ImageIndex=49&Set=64 |
| 14:28.13 | Kirkburn | ^ hehehe |
| 14:28.33 | Josh_Borke | that's cute |
| 14:28.34 | Industrial | ahahahahahah |
| 14:28.42 | Industrial | :D:D |
| 14:28.54 | s|loup | hehe |
| 14:29.25 | cmunn | Can someone link just the image itself for my bandwidth impaired internets |
| 14:30.39 | Wobin_ | http://www.blizzard.com/wow/images/screens/insider/020/comics/ss49.jpg |
| 14:31.16 | MentalPower | http://www.blizzard.com/wow/images/screens/insider/020/comics/ss49.jpg |
| 14:31.22 | MentalPower | blast |
| 14:31.47 | Qaarh | harharhar |
| 14:32.47 | cmunn | Cute |
| 14:52.00 | Kirkburn | Great, Steam just made me flag one of my credit cards up as fraudulent use |
| 14:53.38 | Kirkburn | It's too stupidly precise |
| 14:53.53 | MentalPower | ok... |
| 14:54.12 | Kirkburn | "omg, you missed out a comma but I won't tell you! Denied" |
| 14:54.44 | Kirkburn | Woop, now it's declined another card |
| 14:55.23 | Maldivia | Lesson Learned: Don't use Steam... |
| 14:55.24 | Maldivia | ? |
| 14:55.58 | Josh_Borke | anyone good with bash scripting? ^_^ |
| 14:56.57 | Kirkburn | No, Steam is wonderful and cheap, but it's purchasing system is far too strict |
| 14:57.12 | Kirkburn | It also seems to do worse under load |
| 15:00.56 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth (n=kalroth@port114.ds1-hj.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 15:01.39 | Tain | I'm always wary of Steam because I hear a lot of people who have issues, but I haven't had so much of a hiccup myself. |
| 15:02.12 | Kalroth | Tain: the majority of people whining over Steam is those that suddenly have to pay for their software. :) |
| 15:04.58 | Kirkburn | lol |
| 15:05.26 | Kirkburn | I've had the payment problem before, eventually it worked, never found out why or how |
| 15:05.36 | Tain | For me just the fact that I was able to install some games on my new PC without finding the old CDs, downloading patches, etc. is worth it. |
| 15:06.13 | Kirkburn | I have 20 games ready to play on Steam |
| 15:06.48 | Kirkburn | Excellent value for money |
| 15:09.36 | Kirkburn | Ah, well, I've got a month in which to get a credit card working |
| 15:15.22 | Tain | Preloading HL2: Episode One now. |
| 15:16.45 | *** join/#wowi-lounge haste (n=haste@host-81-191-131-80.bluecom.no) |
| 15:31.21 | Kirkburn | Jack Thompson strikes again! http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/14462838.htm *sigh* |
| 15:32.20 | Kirkburn | Just a random quote from the article: "Incidently, Thompson said, the willingness-to-shoot rate was about 10 percent in the Civil War. Today, with video game training and other techniques, it's up around 90 percent." <-- what in hell does that mean? Only 10% of the army in the Civil War actually did anything?? |
| 15:33.13 | Kirkburn | By the way, we all "pose a public safety problem" |
| 15:34.31 | *** join/#wowi-lounge ][root][ (n=cmunn@216.79.148.128) |
| 15:35.36 | s|loup | bye |
| 15:42.34 | Wobin_ | Kirkburn: For guns? |
| 15:42.49 | Kirkburn | of course |
| 15:46.48 | Wobin_ | This is without a doubt, one of the best covers ever |
| 15:46.48 | Wobin_ | http://www.youtube.com/w/Total-Eclipse-of-the-Heart?v=Bqb34SZnaVA&search=total%20eclipse |
| 15:48.38 | Tain | That's rather disturbing. |
| 15:58.03 | Stylpe | Lille Lørdag! :D |
| 16:04.55 | groll | hmm has there been any patch the last day that change the lua in some way?` |
| 16:10.23 | Kirkburn | 1.10.2 is coming out |
| 16:10.36 | Adrine_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqO7zEWu0W0&search=warcraft :D |
| 16:11.02 | groll | my addon i wrote has just totally stopped working :/ |
| 16:11.03 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Ratbert_CP (n=KCummins@proxy-ce3.disney.com) |
| 16:11.10 | groll | and i got no clue why |
| 16:11.13 | Wobin_ | groll, what's that? |
| 16:11.30 | Wobin_ | Adrine_: hehe I love that video |
| 16:11.37 | Wobin_ | WTB gnome backup singers |
| 16:11.39 | groll | Wobin_ sec |
| 16:12.32 | groll | this one Wobin_ http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=4909 |
| 16:12.58 | groll | it's not much so if you could check if u got the time.. it just stopped working and it worked just fine like 4 days ago |
| 16:13.21 | groll | back in a lil bit need to check my laundry |
| 16:16.27 | Wobin_ | groll: I'd try, but servers are down for us =( |
| 16:16.37 | Qaarh | Adrine_, What can I say but "wow". I love it :) |
| 16:17.08 | Wobin_ | IT's such a catchy song |
| 16:17.20 | Qaarh | lol, and I died in game while watching it |
| 16:17.25 | Qaarh | whoops |
| 16:17.51 | Adrine_ | Very catchy :D |
| 16:20.35 | Wobin_ | I'm off to bed |
| 16:20.39 | Wobin_ | relatively early for once |
| 16:20.48 | Wobin_ | 'nite |
| 16:20.53 | Qaarh | nite |
| 16:28.30 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (i=usr6760@80.193.211.68) |
| 16:30.12 | groll | Wobin_ cant just check the code kinda? it aint much at all |
| 16:37.08 | groll | ok now all of a sudden it works :O |
| 16:45.24 | Tem | Brilliant |
| 16:45.33 | Tem | I want gnome backup singers |
| 16:46.01 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Wobin_ (n=Wobin@221.221.21.92) |
| 16:46.14 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Cide (i=Cide@81-226-233-5-no60.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 16:49.58 | Tem | hrm |
| 16:50.09 | Tem | I need to see the Battlefield Scrore Board |
| 16:50.13 | Tem | anyone got a screenshot? |
| 16:51.04 | Cide | check out any realm forums :) |
| 16:51.27 | Tem | oh good idea |
| 16:51.48 | B | pznohmfg ideas on Internet are so good! |
| 16:54.04 | Cide | http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/jjhohmann/WoW/WoWScrnShot_042906_021319.jpg |
| 16:54.18 | Cide | slightly modified by a mod, it seems |
| 16:54.41 | Tem | that's fine |
| 16:55.00 | Tem | Thanks Cide |
| 16:55.10 | Cide | I was wondering that too, and you're welcome :) |
| 16:55.49 | Tem | with history :) |
| 16:55.52 | Kalroth | could be class colour? |
| 16:55.53 | Cide | sweet |
| 16:55.59 | Kalroth | the + that is |
| 16:56.07 | Tem | I would hope not |
| 16:56.17 | Tem | since I can't tell what color any of them are supposed to be |
| 16:56.36 | Kalroth | some are pink, some are yellow, some are blue |
| 16:56.43 | Kalroth | .jpg makes it hard to see |
| 16:57.07 | Tem | .jpg + colorblind = Tem screwed |
| 16:57.17 | Kalroth | >< |
| 16:59.33 | Cide | probably is |
| 16:59.47 | Cide | but that's a stupid way to show it |
| 16:59.51 | Kalroth | indeed |
| 17:00.00 | Tem | hmm. I think I'll either color the whole name or put a class column |
| 17:00.12 | Kalroth | group them by class, yeah |
| 17:00.23 | Tem | you can group em by whatever you want |
| 17:00.29 | Tem | since clicking on a header will sort |
| 17:01.22 | Tem | I guess that's reason enough to add a class column and color the names |
| 17:02.36 | Tem | hmm |
| 17:03.06 | Adrine_ | http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/screenshots/images/basics/auctionhouses/ss0002.jpg |
| 17:03.11 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shouryuu (n=Shouryuu@163.239.97-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 17:03.39 | Tem | oooh |
| 17:03.43 | Tem | Adrine_: what is that? |
| 17:03.57 | Adrine_ | The auction house. |
| 17:04.08 | Tem | ... |
| 17:04.15 | Adrine_ | "[10:01] * Tem looks around for a screenshot of the AH" |
| 17:04.15 | Shouryuu | rawr |
| 17:04.20 | Adrine_ | Did I misunderstand? |
| 17:04.25 | Josh_Borke | well...he has a pont... |
| 17:04.31 | Tem | What is chaging the AH in that screenshot |
| 17:04.34 | Shouryuu | who doesn't have ponts... |
| 17:04.43 | Tem | s/chag/chang/ |
| 17:04.49 | Josh_Borke | wb Cairenn |
| 17:05.39 | Cairenn | thanks |
| 17:05.39 | Josh_Borke | ah, the high bidder portion? |
| 17:05.49 | Tem | the lines |
| 17:05.56 | Tem | well, the highbidder part too |
| 17:06.06 | Tem | I assume it's one addon doing both |
| 17:08.18 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Maldivia (i=the_real@85.24.45.86) |
| 17:08.29 | *** join/#wowi-lounge zespri|home (i=andrew@202.180.72.217) |
| 17:08.46 | Shouryuu | How do you write to "bare with someone" bare or bear? |
| 17:09.05 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (n=elkano@ip-213-135-2-163.handshake.de) |
| 17:09.31 | Cairenn | Shouryuu: context? |
| 17:09.50 | Shouryuu | to bare with something/someone |
| 17:09.56 | Shouryuu | "bare with me" |
| 17:10.00 | Adrine_ | "bear with", I believe |
| 17:10.03 | Cairenn | bear |
| 17:10.06 | Shouryuu | ok cool :P |
| 17:10.07 | Kalroth | roar! |
| 17:10.47 | Cairenn | sorry, just wasn't sure if you were meaning "bare" naked, "bear with me" "bear the load", that's why I asked for further context |
| 17:11.02 | Shouryuu | hehe np |
| 17:11.19 | Kalroth | to be bare with someone isn't the same as to bear with someone :) |
| 17:11.22 | Shouryuu | I always have problems with homonymes in english |
| 17:11.25 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 17:11.37 | Cairenn | Kalroth: precisely |
| 17:12.11 | Kalroth | can even make it worse; I can't bear to be bare with the bear! |
| 17:12.22 | Kalroth | of course, that's a little odd .. |
| 17:12.27 | Shouryuu | a *tad* |
| 17:12.44 | Cairenn | ewww, lol |
| 17:14.33 | Kaso | Dont be mean to the druids! |
| 17:15.19 | Maldivia | hmm ,does WoW support both UTF-8 and UTF-16 ? |
| 17:16.08 | Shouryuu | I saw that Cair and I will quote! " asdfdsf" |
| 17:16.08 | Tem | UTF-8 iirc |
| 17:16.40 | Cairenn | lol |
| 17:16.58 | Cairenn | not my fault the damn board is crraaaaawwwwwwwlling ... |
| 17:17.01 | Shouryuu | hehe |
| 17:17.22 | Shouryuu | I was just about to change my name to something like "Trolls, fear the forum raptor", and I saw that =P |
| 17:17.45 | Cairenn | hehehe, yeah, I just saw what Iriel said |
| 17:17.46 | Cairenn | hehehe |
| 17:18.12 | [MoonWolf] | Crawling in my skin, these wound they will not heal! |
| 17:18.51 | [MoonWolf] | I'm weird, and I am pround of it! |
| 17:19.07 | Shouryuu | Who isn't :P |
| 17:19.36 | [MoonWolf] | My invisible imaginary twin sister. |
| 17:19.47 | Josh_Borke | ... |
| 17:20.51 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Osagasu (n=Kronus@208.104.133.240) |
| 17:21.07 | Josh_Borke | shag == who again? |
| 17:22.54 | Tem | I think that's wereHampster |
| 17:23.07 | Tem | er, wereHamster |
| 17:23.24 | Tem | there is a reason that I should use autocomplete... |
| 17:23.47 | *** join/#wowi-lounge ForgottenLords (n=Forgotte@059.216-123-195-0.interbaun.com) |
| 17:24.16 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 17:38.52 | Stylpe | Lol, I just spent two hours trying to find out why one of my vars wasn't saving, and then I remembered I hadn't restarted WoW since I edited the .toc =( |
| 17:40.42 | [MoonWolf] | lol |
| 17:44.46 | Qaarh | so.. anyone have any suggestions on a good druid build? :) |
| 17:44.59 | Josh_Borke | why did they make that change again? so it would only read the toc when you login? |
| 17:45.00 | Cairenn | roll a hunter |
| 17:45.15 | Qaarh | Cairenn, I already have a hunter ;) |
| 17:47.54 | Cairenn | *grin* |
| 17:49.38 | Cide | druids are all about 51 points into restoration :) |
| 17:49.47 | Kalroth | what Cide said! |
| 17:49.54 | Stylpe | Well, I believe KIC is ready for release then. Yay! :D |
| 17:49.58 | [MoonWolf] | druids are all about wtfpwning in flag runs. |
| 17:50.07 | Stylpe | The new and improved KIC, of course |
| 17:50.53 | Stylpe | *crowd cheers* |
| 17:50.54 | [MoonWolf] | i keep forgetting what that stand for |
| 17:51.01 | Stylpe | KeepItCool =) |
| 17:52.18 | Kalroth | werd! |
| 17:57.46 | Tem | Josh_Borke: I believe it was a "technical difficulty" of adding Load On Demand |
| 18:08.11 | Wobin_ | KIC always makes me think it's Kael something |
| 18:16.47 | Josh_Borke | test |
| 18:16.49 | Josh_Borke | am i still here? |
| 18:17.00 | Cide | no |
| 18:17.01 | Kalroth | Nope! |
| 18:17.05 | Kalroth | Where are you, Josh? |
| 18:17.07 | Kalroth | I can't see you |
| 18:17.37 | Josh_Borke | wow |
| 18:17.40 | Josh_Borke | 2 minute reply |
| 18:17.43 | Cairenn | no "being here"-ness allowed! IP Banned! |
| 18:17.43 | Josh_Borke | network problems ftw :-) |
| 18:17.52 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=Tem@ip70-177-40-169.br.br.cox.net) |
| 18:17.55 | Josh_Borke | * Ping reply from Josh_Borke: 128.22 second(s) |
| 18:18.05 | Josh_Borke | it was sustained through my network not even being up! |
| 18:20.25 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@adsl-64-161-16-97.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) |
| 18:32.17 | Stylpe | Can anyone recommend a good but small image editor for Windows? |
| 18:32.27 | Kirkburn | Btw, excellent thread ... a GM responds to questions! http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?s=ba2b4723120202c5716dac114e7b9089&threadid=1858115&perpage=40&pagenumber=1 |
| 18:32.34 | Kirkburn | And it's a real GM |
| 18:32.42 | Kirov | Stylpe what kind of editing? |
| 18:32.59 | Stylpe | screenshot editing =P |
| 18:33.04 | Stylpe | Paint can't open TGA |
| 18:33.20 | Kirov | try Paint.net |
| 18:33.25 | Kirov | google it |
| 18:33.28 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Iriel (n=daniel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 18:33.32 | Kaso | Troopa anwsered my question i feel so speical :> |
| 18:33.39 | *** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 18:34.04 | Cairenn | Stylpe: http://www.irfanview.com/ |
| 18:34.39 | Iriel | Morning |
| 18:35.03 | Cairenn | hey Iriel :) |
| 18:38.20 | Kalroth | hi Irielious! |
| 18:39.15 | Cairenn | Irielious. I like that |
| 18:40.04 | Cairenn | good lord the blizz forums are slow today |
| 18:42.12 | Cairenn | molasses .. uphill ... in january ... in a snow storm ... |
| 18:42.21 | Adrine_ | both ways! |
| 18:42.22 | Kirov | Tem ? |
| 18:42.33 | Cairenn | Adrine_: *nod* |
| 18:42.50 | Tem | Kirov: some garbage about the illegals |
| 18:43.00 | Kirov | ah |
| 18:43.12 | Cairenn | Tem: ? |
| 18:43.30 | Kirov | Yesterday all the restaurants in the area were closed in protest. |
| 18:43.41 | Cairenn | whahuh? |
| 18:43.57 | Kirov | Mc Donald's and Safeway were basically the only things open. |
| 18:44.05 | Tem | some bullshit, Cairenn, the illegals are trying to take over the US |
| 18:44.05 | Iriel | Cairenn : http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/05/02/MNG4IIJ1BL1.DTL |
| 18:44.20 | Tem | it's completely rediculous |
| 18:44.40 | Tem | why the hell should they get special treatment? No one else did |
| 18:46.49 | Tem | anyway, I didn't meant to start a debate with that... I know not everyone here will agree with me |
| 18:47.01 | Shouryuu | I probably won |
| 18:47.03 | Shouryuu | t |
| 18:47.07 | Cairenn | s'okay Tem, no worries |
| 18:47.10 | Shouryuu | but no debate |
| 18:47.38 | Cairenn | I can't say much of anything, my hubby is working in the US, not illegally, but only just barely |
| 18:48.11 | Tem | well, my main thing is the US has had loads of immigrants from Europe and Asia |
| 18:48.15 | Tem | all legal |
| 18:48.36 | Shouryuu | no debate, no debate... |
| 18:48.43 | Tem | yes, sorry |
| 18:48.47 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 18:48.49 | Cairenn | the only reason hubby isn't illegal is a rather grey loophole |
| 18:49.14 | Tem | it's not all that difficult to get the guest worker status |
| 18:49.23 | Cairenn | hah, wanna bet? |
| 18:49.26 | Tem | no |
| 18:49.28 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 18:49.29 | Cairenn | he's been trying for 5 years now :p |
| 18:49.40 | Cairenn | next? |
| 18:50.01 | Wobin_ | Is there any way to print out itemlinks raw? |
| 18:50.11 | Kirov | Wobin - in-game? |
| 18:50.20 | Adrine_ | Wobin_: I just convert | to : and print 'em |
| 18:50.22 | Tem | string.format("%q",link) |
| 18:50.35 | Wobin_ | thanks =) |
| 18:50.41 | Tem | that *should* escape all the stuff |
| 18:50.44 | Tem | though it might not |
| 18:50.54 | Tem | you can always just use DevTools |
| 18:51.10 | Iriel | Eh? |
| 18:51.15 | Iriel | How would %q fix the links? |
| 18:51.23 | Tem | it escapes stuff for you |
| 18:51.42 | Tem | but then I guess the stuff you need to escape isn't lua stuff for it to even know |
| 18:51.54 | Iriel | | isn't a metacharacter to lua |
| 18:51.54 | Tem | yeah, screw it, just use DevTools_Dump(link) |
| 18:52.06 | krka | or convert | to || |
| 18:52.07 | groll | hmm anyone heard of no keybindings working after u log in or zone? need a reload to fix it |
| 18:53.23 | Iriel | groll : I haven't, no. |
| 18:53.45 | groll | ok sigh.. baah some addon is scewing up for me but i got nooo clue which one :P |
| 18:54.58 | Shouryuu | my internet is so slooowww |
| 18:55.05 | Iriel | your internet is for porn |
| 18:55.17 | Shouryuu | Oh noez! |
| 18:55.21 | Cairenn | hey, speaking of weird things ... *twice* last night I was in Orig when the Warchief Blessing thingy went off, and *twice* I didn't get the buff ... *any* idea what on earth could cause that? |
| 18:55.25 | Cairenn | ~for porn |
| 18:55.26 | purl | http://www.infested.dk/uploads/Forporn.avi |
| 18:55.30 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 18:56.04 | Adrine_ | Purl, what can't you do? |
| 18:56.15 | Shouryuu | I am not going to speak my mind |
| 18:56.40 | Stylpe | She can't remember what I was like before I went away for a while |
| 18:56.47 | Stylpe | ~Stylpe |
| 18:56.49 | purl | Somehow I forgot all the nice things there is to say about Stylpe =/ |
| 18:56.50 | groll | haha my old guild :D |
| 18:56.52 | groll | infested that is |
| 18:57.12 | Cairenn | <== lack of buff issue ... anyone? anyone? Bueller? |
| 18:57.21 | Adrine_ | What now? |
| 18:57.25 | Iriel | Cairenn : I have no idea, is it reputation or level based? |
| 18:57.27 | Stylpe | Cairenn, who do I need to talk to to get KIC moved to the Ace area of WoWI? |
| 18:57.30 | Adrine_ | Oh, that |
| 18:57.39 | Adrine_ | I con't know what it is, Cairenn....but the Alliance one is very bugged |
| 18:57.40 | krka | ~krka |
| 18:57.41 | purl | i heard krka is a semi-retired addon coder. made stuff such as AutoTravel, MapLibrary, ... not much else really |
| 18:57.51 | Adrine_ | If there is an Ony or Nef head up when someone else puts a head up, the buff doesn't trigger |
| 18:57.54 | krka | oh right |
| 18:57.59 | Cairenn | Iriel: nope, shouldn't be, I've gotten it on level 3s before |
| 18:57.59 | Adrine_ | Sometimes, it doesn't trigger anyway. It's super flaky. |
| 18:58.07 | krka | i wonder if i could use purl as my personal mental note |
| 18:58.12 | Cairenn | hrm, okay |
| 18:58.25 | Adrine_ | I suspect that a number of people turned in heads, and one was already up so no buff fired. |
| 18:58.58 | Cairenn | Stylpe: you just did |
| 18:59.04 | Stylpe | And check out how super sexy KIC has become: http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/preview.php?id=2742 |
| 18:59.18 | Stylpe | Cairenn, thanks =) |
| 18:59.24 | Cairenn | welcome |
| 18:59.25 | Shouryuu | Cairenn I've had the same problem |
| 18:59.50 | Shouryuu | And I'm 60 soooo |
| 18:59.52 | Cairenn | k, was just wondering, thanks guys |
| 19:00.14 | Shouryuu | I remember being in some weird place, just not infront of the AH, so I guessed it was normal |
| 19:01.26 | Shouryuu | man all my lightbulbs broke, it's so darrrkk |
| 19:01.50 | Adrine_ | If the Horde one is anything like the Alliance one, it's because a head was already up |
| 19:02.09 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth_ (n=kalroth@port114.ds1-hj.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 19:02.18 | Shouryuu | I think she means the rend buff |
| 19:02.34 | Cairenn | either |
| 19:02.49 | Cairenn | hey ForgottenLords, you there? |
| 19:02.54 | Shouryuu | Well I've never been here for an ony/nef buff =( |
| 19:03.36 | Stylpe | Is there a way to see detailed info on an addons rating? |
| 19:03.59 | Stylpe | on WoWI that is |
| 19:04.01 | Cairenn | ForgottenLords: I presume you've seen this, yes? http://wow.filenuts.com/1178.html |
| 19:04.09 | Cairenn | Stylpe: not really, that I am aware of |
| 19:04.59 | Stylpe | Just a little disappointed that KIC only has 3 stars =P |
| 19:05.09 | Shouryuu | KIC? |
| 19:05.13 | Shouryuu | ~KIC |
| 19:05.15 | Stylpe | KeepItCook |
| 19:05.19 | Cairenn | rofl |
| 19:05.20 | Stylpe | *Cool lol |
| 19:05.25 | Shouryuu | lol what's it do? |
| 19:05.52 | Stylpe | ~kic is KeepItCool, an addon by Stylpe that reminds you when your tradeskill cooldowns are up |
| 19:05.53 | purl | Stylpe: okay |
| 19:06.08 | Stylpe | since people keep asking about it =P |
| 19:06.39 | Stylpe | purl, no, kic is KeepItCool, an addon by Stylpe that reminds you when your tradeskill cooldowns are up. http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=4248 |
| 19:06.41 | purl | okay, Stylpe |
| 19:07.24 | Stylpe | speaking of Stylpe, I'm considering changing my nick to Mikal |
| 19:07.38 | Shouryuu | why? |
| 19:07.39 | Cairenn | Stylpe: why? |
| 19:07.39 | Stylpe | (my RL name, pronounced like Michael) |
| 19:07.44 | Cairenn | ah |
| 19:08.17 | Cairenn | hey Kalroth :) |
| 19:08.35 | Kalroth | why hello there! *wink* |
| 19:08.55 | krka | changing nicknames is almost never a good idea |
| 19:09.00 | Shouryuu | is there a way to report a mod on CG? |
| 19:09.04 | Shouryuu | krka I must agree |
| 19:09.09 | Stylpe | I know, but I kinda want to anyways |
| 19:09.14 | Shouryuu | hehe |
| 19:09.29 | Cairenn | Shouryuu: dunno, PM one of the staff I guess ... what's the problem? |
| 19:09.44 | Shouryuu | Model Changers are illegal right? |
| 19:09.53 | Kirkburn | Oooh, Amazon are gonna give me a replacement order :D |
| 19:09.54 | Cairenn | it's *still* grey |
| 19:10.00 | Cairenn | Kirkburn: YAY! |
| 19:10.03 | Shouryuu | Meh nevermind then |
| 19:10.13 | Shouryuu | For that grease CD? |
| 19:10.15 | Cairenn | that's why they are still up on WoWI |
| 19:10.16 | Kirkburn | lol |
| 19:10.24 | Cairenn | Kirkburn: that's decent of them |
| 19:10.27 | krka | Model Changer sounds like an awesome job |
| 19:10.32 | Adrine_ | Non-UI art replacement is not condoned. For the most part, though, I don't think aesthetic changes would be frowned upon. |
| 19:10.42 | Cairenn | krka: *snicker* |
| 19:10.50 | Adrine_ | I think they frown on it because of the potential for "brightskin" mods and the like |
| 19:10.53 | Kirkburn | Yeah, I just have to do a few things, and they'll resend it (might be all, might be just the missing parts, wouldn't mind either!_ |
| 19:10.57 | Adrine_ | THough that's less of an issue in an MMO with nametags. |
| 19:11.15 | Shouryuu | Adrine Yeah I guess. But isn't the problem that they can't differentiate aesthetic changes and "exploits" |
| 19:11.17 | Iriel | Kirkburn : I've always had a good experiences with amazon for returns |
| 19:11.32 | Adrine_ | Right, which is why they just blanket 'em all and say "don't do it" |
| 19:11.34 | Kirkburn | I'm very pleased :) |
| 19:11.44 | Iriel | Shouryuu : Having said that, we can help by not making a fuss about aesthetic addons |
| 19:12.15 | Cairenn | you can bet that the minute they finally all agree to out and out state that they are point blank not allowed, the ones on WoWI will be gone |
| 19:12.28 | Cairenn | until that time, though ... |
| 19:12.54 | krka | hmm |
| 19:12.55 | Shouryuu | Iriel *nod* |
| 19:12.57 | krka | did i miss something? |
| 19:13.03 | Cairenn | but at present, ask 5 different blizz staff and you'll get 8 different answers |
| 19:13.06 | Adrine_ | I still kinda want to write some kind of converter to the M2 format so that I can replace the Netherwind shoulders with 5-gallon water jugs. >_> |
| 19:13.06 | krka | aestethic addons? |
| 19:13.11 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 19:13.22 | Shouryuu | like changing how your swords look like |
| 19:13.23 | Cairenn | krka: change your nightsaber mount to look like a raptor |
| 19:13.26 | Adrine_ | krka: Like color replacements for armor sets, or replacing your weapons with models that look cooler |
| 19:13.33 | krka | ah |
| 19:13.55 | Wobin_ | nudie skins =) |
| 19:14.06 | Shouryuu | B00biez! |
| 19:14.09 | krka | w00t |
| 19:14.11 | krka | B00biz! |
| 19:14.13 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 19:14.20 | Shouryuu | We are such geeks |
| 19:14.22 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kremonte (n=dan@ool-18b8808d.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 19:14.29 | Kremonte | o noes they fixed item:0:0:0:0 ; ; |
| 19:14.30 | Cairenn | *that* replacement addon I denied :p |
| 19:14.35 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 19:14.36 | Josh_Borke | lol |
| 19:14.37 | Adrine_ | Yay, they did? |
| 19:14.37 | krka | aww :( |
| 19:14.42 | Adrine_ | Woo, closed holes :D |
| 19:14.51 | Adrine_ | (Faked item links rub me the wrong way) |
| 19:14.54 | Cairenn | not on my site, not a chance in hell |
| 19:14.55 | krka | cair is teh b00b1z h4t3r |
| 19:14.55 | Adrine_ | They were funny the first few times |
| 19:14.56 | Kremonte | yea i was about to poon some noobs in stv by saying You are under attack! in yellow in /3 |
| 19:15.05 | Kremonte | but alas, i dc'd ; ; |
| 19:15.10 | Shouryuu | hehe |
| 19:15.17 | Cairenn | krka: I like boobies just fine, in fact, I like them so much I own a pair ... |
| 19:15.22 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 19:15.27 | Kremonte | haha, nice one cair |
| 19:15.29 | Shouryuu | Zomg, where did they drop? |
| 19:15.39 | krka | nice one? you haven't seen the other one too+ |
| 19:15.40 | Cairenn | they better not have dropped! |
| 19:15.46 | Shouryuu | haha |
| 19:16.05 | Josh_Borke | lol |
| 19:16.11 | Cairenn | okay, I'll stop being rude now ... |
| 19:16.24 | Kalroth | awww |
| 19:16.27 | Kalroth | You meanie! |
| 19:16.27 | krka | omg what nightelf did you ninja for that? |
| 19:16.51 | Adrine_ | Yes, they're real. They're not mine, but they're real. |
| 19:16.57 | Adrine_ | (Cracks me up every time.) |
| 19:17.00 | Cairenn | hey now! |
| 19:17.01 | Cairenn | lol |
| 19:18.01 | krka | effect on males: +11 agility, -20 stamina? |
| 19:18.23 | Adrine_ | +75 spirit |
| 19:18.24 | krka | ok ill stop now |
| 19:18.42 | Cairenn | - eleventy bazillion int |
| 19:18.48 | Kalroth | hahah |
| 19:18.49 | Kremonte | nah nah |
| 19:18.53 | Kremonte | nothing to do with the stats |
| 19:18.59 | Kremonte | it's just a charm effect. :) |
| 19:19.06 | Adrine_ | More like a mez. |
| 19:19.13 | Kalroth | "zomg, r u relly a gurl??? wana raid wif us???" |
| 19:19.14 | Kremonte | which is what charm is? |
| 19:19.14 | krka | seems like a Fear to me |
| 19:19.28 | Kremonte | goes thru immunity tho |
| 19:19.39 | krka | nightelf males are immune, figure that... |
| 19:19.44 | Cairenn | hubby: "you're discussing your boobies in channel? hmmmm ... " |
| 19:19.50 | Adrine_ | krka: I was just trying to figure out how to make that joke :P |
| 19:20.01 | krka | hah! i beat you to it! |
| 19:20.16 | Kalroth | Cairenn: tell him that he can join it, it's ok |
| 19:20.19 | Kalroth | in* |
| 19:20.39 | Kalroth | unless he doesn't play WoW, then he'd be an outsider |
| 19:21.04 | Cairenn | he doesn't need to "discuss" them ... *wink* |
| 19:21.13 | krka | eww, gross |
| 19:21.29 | Tain | ewww girls gross |
| 19:21.33 | Tain | They have cooties. |
| 19:21.36 | zenzelezz | krka sounds jealous |
| 19:22.09 | krka | nah, i dont want a hubby |
| 19:22.15 | krka | they get too clingy |
| 19:22.56 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Shouryuu (n=Shouryuu@163.239.97-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 19:23.20 | Cairenn | lol, nice timing shouryuu |
| 19:24.04 | krka | i blame Wobin_ for bringing up nudie skins |
| 19:24.11 | Cairenn | indeed |
| 19:24.36 | Kremonte | NUDIE SKINS? LOOOOOOOOOOL! |
| 19:24.38 | Wobin_ | Aww |
| 19:24.56 | krka | wouldn't it be great if there RL nudie skins? i'd buy one! |
| 19:25.06 | krka | s/there/there were/ |
| 19:25.09 | zenzelezz | I don't get the deal with nude skins... if you need to see nude people, watch porn like everyone else ;-o |
| 19:25.12 | Wobin_ | They market them under "Birthday Suits" |
| 19:25.12 | Kirkburn | Inflatable doll, krka? |
| 19:26.56 | Tain | realdoll.com |
| 19:27.12 | Kirkburn | Tain, Ep1 finished preloading? |
| 19:27.50 | Tain | Yep! |
| 19:27.50 | Kalroth | zenzelezz: I think it's something about seeing your male friends play nude night elf females .. I don't know though >< |
| 19:27.52 | Cairenn | anyway, later guys, I'm out for a while |
| 19:27.53 | Tain | And I pre-ordered. |
| 19:28.01 | Kirkburn | :( |
| 19:28.13 | Kirkburn | 95% and my card's blocked :P |
| 19:28.14 | Stylpe | See ya, Cairenn =) |
| 19:28.18 | Tain | hehe |
| 19:29.15 | Kirkburn | Tain, you can play HL:DM now |
| 19:29.50 | Kirkburn | *shakes fist* |
| 19:32.15 | Tain | Yeah |
| 19:32.27 | Tain | Actually I fired up HL2 and just played a couple hours worth. |
| 19:32.59 | Iriel | I'm looking forward to episode 1 |
| 19:33.16 | Iriel | I played HL:Source over christmas |
| 19:33.20 | Iriel | I may re-play HL2 before EP1 |
| 19:33.33 | Tain | That's what I was thinking, Iriel. |
| 19:34.25 | Stylpe | If you're gonna replay HL", I suggest you get FakeFactory's Cinematic Mod |
| 19:34.28 | Stylpe | *HL2 |
| 19:34.42 | Wobin_ | Bah, I missed Shou |
| 19:34.54 | Iriel | Stylpe : What does it do? |
| 19:35.14 | Stylpe | It leaves the gameplay exactly the same, but upgrades all textures to super highres, adds new (better imo) sound effects, plus adds cinematic music |
| 19:35.24 | Stylpe | it wtfpwns |
| 19:35.52 | Stylpe | pretty big dl too, think it's like 1.5 GB |
| 19:36.00 | Stylpe | but totally worth it |
| 19:36.24 | Tain | mm looks like 200mb |
| 19:36.51 | Tain | oh there's different versions |
| 19:36.58 | Stylpe | yeah, be sure to get the latest |
| 19:36.58 | Tain | There's a 1.1gb |
| 19:37.50 | Kirkburn | woah |
| 19:39.07 | Kirkburn | I've got an older version of that ... the early version's female faces were *awful* |
| 19:39.10 | Stylpe | lessee, I have a fakefactory_cinematic_2.32_full.zip 1,16 GB |
| 19:39.32 | Kirkburn | Needs a lot of RAM I suspect! |
| 19:39.49 | Stylpe | I dunno if they've released any updates, this version is about a month old |
| 19:39.53 | Stylpe | Kirkburn, yeah =) |
| 19:40.16 | Stylpe | My old rig with 1 gig RAM and a GF 6600GT couldn't cope |
| 19:40.52 | Stylpe | my new one with 2 gig and a 7900GT OC runs it just fine though =) |
| 19:41.20 | Stylpe | At least get the new sounds and music |
| 19:41.34 | Stylpe | That doesn't take any resources =) |
| 19:42.04 | Wobin_ | Anyone able to help with a french or german translation? |
| 19:42.23 | netcurse | i can do both |
| 19:42.30 | Stylpe | You can?!? :D |
| 19:42.43 | Stylpe | You are my new best friend |
| 19:42.45 | netcurse | ya |
| 19:43.11 | Wobin_ | woohoo, would you mind translating a series of short lines for me? |
| 19:43.29 | netcurse | sure send me a pm on curse with the info |
| 19:43.34 | netcurse | and i ll do it |
| 19:43.35 | Wobin_ | k =) |
| 19:43.44 | Wobin_ | just Net, there, yeah? |
| 19:43.53 | netcurse | i m taking a night train to paris in 1 hour tho so hurry :p |
| 19:43.55 | Stylpe | Care to take a look at KIC? It has a nicely laid out localisation file, less than 100 strings |
| 19:43.56 | netcurse | ya |
| 19:44.03 | Stylpe | ~kic |
| 19:44.04 | purl | somebody said kic was KeepItCool, an addon by Stylpe that reminds you when your tradeskill cooldowns are up. http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=4248 |
| 19:44.09 | Stylpe | there's the link |
| 19:44.31 | netcurse | ok i will take a look it will be done for tomorow at last |
| 19:44.43 | Stylpe | I'll give you a big mention :D |
| 19:45.08 | Stylpe | saying 'Netcurse is awesome becaus ehe can do both german and french translations!' |
| 19:50.19 | Wobin_ | netcurse: sent |
| 19:50.44 | netcurse | allright |
| 19:55.58 | Kirkburn | Oooh, Outland has been removed in 1.10.2! |
| 19:56.31 | Adrine_ | Like, the geometry is gone? |
| 19:56.51 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (n=elkano@ip-213-135-2-163.handshake.de) |
| 19:57.22 | Kirkburn | Apparently |
| 19:57.45 | Josh_Borke | no one ever made it there, right? |
| 19:57.52 | Kirkburn | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general-en&t=987968&p=1&tmp=1#post987968 |
| 19:58.03 | Kirkburn | Map Viewer, illegal servers ... |
| 19:59.11 | Josh_Borke | but not like caverns of time or ZG is/was |
| 19:59.25 | Maldivia | hmm... it's orphan week ? |
| 20:00.15 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (i=usr863@80.193.211.68) |
| 20:03.41 | netcurse | done wobin |
| 20:05.55 | netcurse | got to go soon stylpe i ll be back soon, but on version 2 you have a special option to ask for localisation, we have made oa translation team since the site is multi langague and they als do other stuff like helping authors to localise addons |
| 20:06.14 | netcurse | they will* |
| 20:06.17 | netcurse | bbl |
| 20:06.24 | Stylpe | Nice =) |
| 20:06.37 | Wobin_ | netcurse: Brilliant, thankyou |
| 20:10.48 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=Tem@204.90.50.252) |
| 20:10.59 | ckknight | hey all |
| 20:15.36 | wereHamster | where is Outlands? |
| 20:16.24 | Iriel | off-planet |
| 20:16.34 | Kirkburn | (was) in the game files |
| 20:16.43 | Adrine_ | South of the maelstrom, as far as the files go. |
| 20:17.11 | Josh_Borke | Adrine_: huh? |
| 20:17.17 | Kirkburn | Huh? |
| 20:17.29 | Adrine_ | Outland was south of the Maelstrom in the game files. |
| 20:17.35 | Josh_Borke | oh, i see |
| 20:17.39 | Kirkburn | The Maelstrom was in the game files? |
| 20:17.41 | Adrine_ | The geometry stuff |
| 20:17.43 | Adrine_ | Well |
| 20:17.47 | Adrine_ | Where the Maelstrom would be on the map |
| 20:17.50 | Adrine_ | Bottom center of the world map. |
| 20:17.55 | Kirkburn | ah |
| 20:18.14 | wereHamster | so how did the prople know of the dinosaurs there? |
| 20:18.26 | Kirkburn | Dinosaurs?!? |
| 20:18.36 | Kirkburn | 3 centaurs afaik |
| 20:18.47 | Kirkburn | From illegal servers |
| 20:19.28 | Kirkburn | (if you use map viewer, no npcs exist) |
| 20:19.52 | Adrine_ | I don't think that mobs would show up on private servers unless placed there by server admins. |
| 20:20.17 | Kirkburn | I prefer to call them illegal servers :) |
| 20:20.42 | Tain | Yeah, you still have to place them. The world geometry is separate from creatures/npcs/clickables, etc. |
| 20:21.45 | Kirkburn | (otherwise nothing would move and loading would go rather quicker) |
| 20:21.58 | Adrine_ | I suppose that you could use a port method to go there on live servers, but I'm pretty sure that'd trigger GM alarms pretty quickly :) |
| 20:22.11 | Kirkburn | Like, immediately :P |
| 20:22.41 | Tain | People claim to still use teleport hacks without getting caught, but I doubt it. |
| 20:22.54 | Kirkburn | I linked a thread earlier with info from a WoW GM |
| 20:23.37 | Kirkburn | http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?s=ba2b4723120202c5716dac114e7b9089&threadid=1858115&perpage=40&pagenumber=1 |
| 20:24.03 | Wobin_ | raralrrarghaghs |
| 20:24.35 | Kirkburn | ... |
| 20:25.37 | Wobin_ | Something is screwd up with the chatbox |
| 20:25.40 | Wobin_ | er frame |
| 20:25.47 | Wobin_ | I'm having issues printing to it |
| 20:30.33 | Wobin_ | also having issues clicking on links |
| 20:32.28 | Kirkburn | I'm never able to click links on the first line :( |
| 20:32.39 | Kremonte | same |
| 20:32.54 | wereHamster | Industrial, you said you're an gnuplot expert.. right? |
| 20:33.06 | Industrial | wereHamster: that was a joke :( sorry :( |
| 20:33.28 | Industrial | cairenn said she likes that no-one tells eachother just how good they are to show off |
| 20:33.31 | Industrial | and i did for fun |
| 20:33.41 | Industrial | I'm not good at gnuplot, :( |
| 20:34.22 | wereHamster | http://dbservice.com/ftpdir/tom/afc.png .. I need to scale damping and buffer to be visible somehow, both values are in the range of 0 - 50 |
| 20:34.42 | Iriel | I know 'some' gnuplot |
| 20:35.08 | Iriel | wereHamster :Can you just do 2 plots? |
| 20:35.18 | Iriel | wereHamster: One with the axes on the right and the 0-50's |
| 20:35.26 | Iriel | wereHamster : and one with the axes on the left as now, with the other one? |
| 20:35.43 | Iriel | Overlay them with the same X axis (You'll likely want to make that explicit) |
| 20:37.37 | wereHamster | Iriel, do you think it's possible to do this with one plot command? or do I have to use gimp? |
| 20:38.02 | Kirkburn | That name will forever amuse me |
| 20:38.26 | Kirkburn | "Do I have to get out the gimp?" |
| 20:38.28 | Iriel | You can do it with one plot script |
| 20:43.25 | Iriel | wereHamster : You want to use "multiplot" I think |
| 20:44.37 | wereHamster | Iriel, thanks for the hint |
| 20:48.32 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=George@151.56.195.89) |
| 20:48.38 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cmunn (n=cmunn@c-68-63-221-162.hsd1.ms.comcast.net) |
| 20:51.43 | Kirkburn1 | Did I get kicked for making gimp-related jokes? :) |
| 20:53.37 | Industrial | Something being horizontal or vertical, is that direction, alignment or orientation |
| 20:53.45 | Industrial | direction is more like 'from left to right' |
| 20:53.59 | Industrial | alignment is more like 'next to this' |
| 20:54.03 | Industrial | so, orientation? |
| 20:54.04 | Industrial | :D |
| 20:54.53 | Josh_Borke | Industrial: i would agree with orientation |
| 20:54.57 | Industrial | ok |
| 20:57.04 | Iriel | orientation is H/V yes |
| 20:57.09 | Iriel | direction is L->R or R->L |
| 20:58.42 | *** join/#wowi-lounge snurre (n=snurre@AVelizy-153-1-22-91.w83-199.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:58.49 | Industrial | right |
| 20:58.57 | Industrial | sometimes you just have to ask ;) |
| 20:59.09 | Industrial | im taking a stab at my own button addon |
| 20:59.14 | Industrial | button bar* |
| 20:59.17 | krka | hm, the tabbed thingy at the wowwiki isn't completely n00bfriendly :/ |
| 20:59.34 | *** join/#wowi-lounge duke|ib (i=dukeku@c-67-160-162-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 21:03.12 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shouryuu (n=Shouryuu@163.239.97-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 21:03.23 | Industrial | I want this main bar part to be two rows of 10 buttons |
| 21:03.41 | Industrial | the bottom row is static and behaves like the blizzard action buttons |
| 21:03.42 | Wobin_ | I <3 http://membres.lycos.fr/darktemplars/accentConverter.php |
| 21:03.47 | Industrial | the top row changes with your form |
| 21:03.51 | Wobin_ | Most useful site ever |
| 21:03.58 | Industrial | normal/stealth/druid-shape/etc |
| 21:04.02 | Industrial | thats all |
| 21:04.05 | Industrial | :p |
| 21:07.04 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Suntiger (i=moonwolf@f176182.upc-f.chello.nl) |
| 21:10.23 | krka | some people are easily amused... a rogue keeps killing me in gadget while i'm coding |
| 21:10.32 | krka | not that i care :P |
| 21:10.33 | Shouryuu | lol |
| 21:10.44 | Industrial | take off your clothes |
| 21:10.55 | Industrial | waste of money |
| 21:10.57 | Industrial | i care |
| 21:11.00 | Industrial | (lol) |
| 21:12.14 | krka | you lose durability from pvp kills? |
| 21:12.20 | Industrial | dont you? |
| 21:12.22 | Adrine_ | No |
| 21:13.09 | Kirkburn1 | (I wasn't sure either) |
| 21:13.23 | Shouryuu | well you take dmg so after a while you do |
| 21:13.34 | krka | oh |
| 21:13.34 | Kirkburn1 | But not from PvP deaths? |
| 21:13.34 | Shouryuu | I mean your stuff does get hit on physically |
| 21:13.39 | Shouryuu | nope |
| 21:13.48 | Shouryuu | After a day of AV you have a repair bill |
| 21:13.55 | Kirkburn1 | (BGs would be awful otherwise!) |
| 21:14.01 | Shouryuu | yeah lol |
| 21:14.12 | Kirkburn1 | Imagine the repair bill |
| 21:14.13 | Industrial | does lua have 'elseif' ? |
| 21:14.15 | Industrial | :P |
| 21:14.20 | krka | yes |
| 21:14.22 | Industrial | i need a case but guess its not there |
| 21:14.25 | Industrial | switch* |
| 21:14.26 | Kirkburn1 | Or the fact that after 2 mins you would have no weapons :D |
| 21:14.32 | krka | switch is easy |
| 21:14.37 | krka | use a table |
| 21:14.52 | krka | local switchTable = {} |
| 21:14.58 | Industrial | right got it |
| 21:15.02 | krka | switchTable[value1] = function1 |
| 21:15.03 | krka | ... |
| 21:15.10 | krka | switchTable[key]() |
| 21:18.16 | Industrial | local orientations = {'H','V'} if not orientations[orientation] then orientation = 'H' end |
| 21:18.19 | Industrial | thats rather neat |
| 21:18.20 | Industrial | :D |
| 21:19.16 | Industrial | its with lua that i (re)discover these types of very simple constructs that are just.. pretty... |
| 21:19.44 | Shouryuu | that makes no sens to me but I'll just /nod |
| 21:20.07 | Industrial | ... im setting a default ... |
| 21:20.37 | krka | yay, got tabs working |
| 21:21.29 | Shouryuu | w00t |
| 21:21.39 | Shouryuu | The addon you're writting looks really cool btw |
| 21:22.09 | krka | you haven't seen it :P |
| 21:22.24 | Shouryuu | I've seen parts of it =P |
| 21:22.33 | krka | weird... the two first tabbuttons are above the frame, but the third is below it |
| 21:22.49 | Industrial | krka: screenshots! |
| 21:23.03 | Industrial | krka: how is your button addon doing, and what does it _do_ ?:D |
| 21:23.13 | krka | you haven't seen a tab button before? O_o |
| 21:23.16 | Osagasu | Iriel: did you have to choose a dinosaur? :P |
| 21:23.18 | Osagasu | >.> |
| 21:23.24 | Shouryuu | WoW http://www.curse-gaming.com/mod.php?addid=3514 |
| 21:23.46 | Industrial | krka: i mean your actionbutton addon |
| 21:23.53 | krka | coming along slowly but nicely |
| 21:23.56 | krka | working on the gui |
| 21:24.01 | Industrial | k |
| 21:24.17 | krka | FAIAP was actually originally part of the process |
| 21:24.28 | krka | but i decided it was worth being released on its own |
| 21:27.58 | Tain | FAIAP is so great it almost drives me to tears. |
| 21:28.20 | Kirkburn | Osagasu, they all got the same dino :( |
| 21:28.25 | Tem | krka: what's your action button addon do that's special? |
| 21:29.04 | krka | you'll see |
| 21:29.12 | krka | actually, nothing really special at all |
| 21:29.20 | krka | it'll just be done the way i want it done |
| 21:29.42 | Tem | heh |
| 21:29.48 | Tem | that's exactly why I'm writing one |
| 21:29.50 | krka | i'm using lua code to set up conditions |
| 21:29.58 | Tem | oh, good |
| 21:30.02 | Tem | maybe I won't need to then |
| 21:30.02 | krka | err... that is, you write the lua code in game |
| 21:30.06 | krka | (using FAIAP of course!) |
| 21:30.20 | krka | for instance, in the condition box for Polymorph i may write: |
| 21:30.54 | krka | UnitClassification("target") == "Humanoid" or UnitClassification("target") == "Beast" |
| 21:30.58 | krka | for a very simple example |
| 21:31.13 | Tem | PLAYER_TARGET_CHANGED |
| 21:31.25 | krka | which would mean that Polymorph would only be considered castable (and thus the icon would only be visible) if the condition holds |
| 21:31.43 | krka | you wrote the name of an event |
| 21:31.45 | krka | why? :) |
| 21:31.45 | Tem | krka: are you mimicing the event system that ItemRack has? |
| 21:31.54 | krka | i don't need no stinking event system :P |
| 21:32.06 | Wobin_ | what are you updating on? |
| 21:32.12 | Tem | ^^ |
| 21:32.48 | krka | OnUpdate |
| 21:32.57 | krka | ... and there i lost all my users ^_^ |
| 21:33.00 | Industrial | kek |
| 21:33.03 | Industrial | < Tem> that's exactly why I'm writing one |
| 21:33.05 | Industrial | zomg me 2 |
| 21:33.07 | Industrial | :D |
| 21:33.18 | Elkano | man, I hate blue teasing us for 1.11 :/ |
| 21:33.23 | Tem | k, guess I will have to right one |
| 21:33.32 | Industrial | Tem: if you show me yours ill show you mine |
| 21:33.34 | Industrial | ;D |
| 21:33.42 | Tem | mine is skelleton code atm |
| 21:33.46 | Industrial | same |
| 21:33.54 | Tem | it *can* create an action button OnDemand though |
| 21:34.14 | krka | right one or write one? |
| 21:34.17 | Industrial | is that CreateFrame('Button') ? |
| 21:34.19 | Elkano | increased stack size for some items, UI improvements, ... :/ can't wait for more... :) |
| 21:34.25 | Tem | s/right/write/ |
| 21:34.38 | krka | actually, doing this OnUpdate is more efficient than i thought it was |
| 21:34.42 | Tem | Industrial: CreateFrame("CheckButton") |
| 21:35.48 | krka | as long as i don't have any expensive conditions |
| 21:35.48 | Tain | Pssh can do all that with Visor already. |
| 21:35.48 | Industrial | Tem: k |
| 21:35.49 | KarlKFI | anyone tried making a dynamic dropdownmenu? |
| 21:35.49 | Industrial | Tem: i coudlnt find that in the visor code in the svn |
| 21:35.49 | Tem | Tain: didn't you "steal" that code from me? |
| 21:35.49 | Industrial | where in VisorButtons do you MAKE the buttons? |
| 21:35.49 | Industrial | :D |
| 21:35.49 | krka | i will provide a library field where you can enter helper functions + stuff to perform on events |
| 21:35.49 | krka | thus you can set states on events |
| 21:35.58 | Industrial | Tain: * |
| 21:35.58 | Tain | VisorButtons create code is in branches |
| 21:35.59 | Industrial | ahh |
| 21:36.06 | Tain | And no Tem, I didn't know you had any actual code. |
| 21:36.20 | Tem | yeah, I pasted it for you way back when I finished that part |
| 21:36.35 | krka | oh well, i don't really care that i'll be the only user of my addon |
| 21:36.37 | Tem | you were asking if anyone has sucessfully created an actionbutton in lua |
| 21:37.10 | Tem | krka: Code for yourself or you will be miserable no matter how many users you have |
| 21:37.13 | Tain | Oh I don't even remember seeing working code. I was asking because I was having trouble with some parts. |
| 21:37.35 | Tain | Of course I probably did see it and just don't remember, I stopped working on it for a month or so until just last week. |
| 21:37.46 | Tem | ah |
| 21:37.55 | krka | tem, that's what i've always done |
| 21:38.03 | Tain | It all works for me in my own testing though. So far. :) |
| 21:38.15 | Tem | my only problem is that I break CooldownCount |
| 21:38.21 | Tem | because I didn't name the model object |
| 21:38.23 | krka | except that i sometimes implement features people ask for, if they are sane ones |
| 21:38.42 | Tem | I implement features when I would use the feature |
| 21:39.02 | Industrial | http://wow.pastebin.com/695117 |
| 21:39.03 | Industrial | ;\ |
| 21:39.39 | Industrial | (i just opened my editor) |
| 21:43.31 | Shouryuu | night folks |
| 21:43.33 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Shouryuu (n=Shouryuu@163.239.97-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 21:43.55 | Industrial | .. silence .. |
| 21:43.58 | Industrial | is it that bad? :P |
| 21:46.22 | krka | only if you're a falling tree in the forest and your existence depends on it |
| 21:50.55 | JoshBorke | load out of date addons ftl :-( |
| 21:51.06 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cladhaire (n=jnwhiteh@cpe-24-59-191-241.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 21:51.26 | Industrial | hi clad |
| 21:51.59 | KarlKFI | oi. iriel's VirtualFrames makes use of his own reconstruction code, you can't just cut and paste it |
| 21:54.24 | Maldivia | isn't there a script, to convert a "user-defined" virtual frame ? |
| 21:54.50 | KarlKFI | ? |
| 21:57.16 | KarlKFI | what I'd really like is a way to convert xml to dynamic code |
| 21:57.25 | Industrial | how do i make a button with lua just like the blizzard actionbuttons |
| 21:57.38 | Industrial | that is just like* |
| 21:57.44 | KarlKFI | complicatedly |
| 21:57.45 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cladhair1 (n=jnwhiteh@cpe-24-59-191-241.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 21:57.46 | krka | sleep time! |
| 21:58.18 | Industrial | bah :( |
| 21:58.24 | Iriel | KarlKFI : It's embeddable tho |
| 21:58.28 | *** join/#wowi-lounge zespri (n=andrews@202.180.72.217) |
| 21:58.47 | Iriel | KarlKFI : And the 'data' is script-created from standard blizzard virtual frames |
| 21:59.04 | KarlKFI | i figured as much but you didn't include the script |
| 21:59.20 | Iriel | KarlKFI : I can mail it to you if you want it |
| 21:59.39 | KarlKFI | well, I'm not sure what I want yet. |
| 21:59.52 | krka | what language is it written in? |
| 21:59.53 | krka | Lua? :) |
| 21:59.53 | Iriel | KarlKFI : It will be included eventually, but until 1.11 we cant make everythything |
| 22:00.05 | Iriel | krka: It's XSLT |
| 22:00.09 | krka | ah |
| 22:00.23 | krka | XSLT seems cool, wish i knew more about it |
| 22:00.40 | Iriel | It's a handy tool to have in your toolbox, but it has its own set of limitations |
| 22:01.10 | Iriel | my "script" is actually an XML file and 2 XSLT files |
| 22:01.10 | krka | damn you for starting interesting things when i need to sleep :/ |
| 22:01.17 | Iriel | one of the XSLT files turns the XML file into another XSLT file |
| 22:01.34 | KarlKFI | well, what I was imagining was something I could copy and paste and instantiate on my own. Instead I found another layer of abstraction that I would have to learn. |
| 22:01.40 | Iriel | which is then included by the final one |
| 22:01.42 | Iriel | KarlKFI : I started that way |
| 22:01.48 | JoshBorke | *cry* fatal exceptions suck |
| 22:01.54 | KarlKFI | and to be honest I find it difficult to read your code iriel |
| 22:01.56 | Iriel | KarlKFI : But nested instantiation is far too complex to efficiently do in cut-and-paste code |
| 22:02.13 | Iriel | KarlKFI : I haven't put a whole lot of comments into that code yet, so I dont blame you for having trouble |
| 22:02.23 | Wobin_ | Iriel, a question from the bear in the other channel: unpack... is it bad always, or only for unpack(args) ? If he's already declared the table, is unpack alright? |
| 22:02.41 | Iriel | Unpack is never bad |
| 22:02.45 | Iriel | it's ... that's bad |
| 22:02.48 | KarlKFI | it's not just comments, it's the whole 1 letter varriables and weird indentaion that throw me off |
| 22:02.59 | krka | don't keep is guessing iriel, tell us what's bad! |
| 22:03.02 | krka | us |
| 22:03.32 | Tem | krka: "..." is bad |
| 22:03.37 | Tem | that's what Iriel mean |
| 22:03.37 | Tem | s |
| 22:03.50 | Wobin_ | hehe |
| 22:03.50 | Iriel | Tem: I'm sure he knows that and is being 'funny' |
| 22:03.59 | krka | you ruined my awesome joke :/ |
| 22:04.03 | KarlKFI | like for some reason you have both tab and space indents that don't mix well |
| 22:04.17 | krka | my awesome joke will be avenged some day |
| 22:04.17 | Iriel | KarlKFI ; It's an emacs thing, tabs are 8 characters |
| 22:04.22 | Tem | KarlKFI: that's emcas' fault |
| 22:04.27 | Tem | wow... |
| 22:04.30 | KarlKFI | it makes my editor puke |
| 22:04.34 | Tem | emacs's* |
| 22:04.34 | krka | run the lua code through FAIAP to get better indentation :P |
| 22:04.39 | Iriel | KarlKFI : What editor do you use? |
| 22:05.00 | KarlKFI | Smultron, but it looks the same in xCode |
| 22:05.08 | Tem | Iriel: mine does the same |
| 22:05.12 | Tem | your code is nearly unreadable |
| 22:05.31 | krka | just because 'yall refuse to use emacs :P |
| 22:05.36 | krka | emacs FTW |
| 22:05.50 | Tem | food |
| 22:05.52 | Tem | must have food |
| 22:06.05 | krka | emacs is food! food for thought |
| 22:06.11 | KarlKFI | i don't mind space tabing all that much, but mixing space and tab should be banned |
| 22:07.17 | KarlKFI | i'd actually prefer tabing over spacing, but as long as it's readable |
| 22:08.05 | KarlKFI | anyway... I still don't get how to use IrielVirtualFrames |
| 22:08.51 | Iriel | KarlKFI : What part is confusing you? |
| 22:09.03 | Kalroth | I bet it's the name! |
| 22:09.51 | KarlKFI | how do I install it... for my embedded libs you just had to put the folder in your addon folder and add a single xml line to the toc, but that doesn't look to be the case with yours |
| 22:10.29 | JoshBorke | wb Cairenn |
| 22:11.32 | Iriel | KarlKFI : At present, it's 2 steps, and that's the bit i have yet to clean up before it becomes non-dev |
| 22:12.29 | Cairenn | thanks Josh |
| 22:14.01 | KarlKFI | and those 2 steps are... |
| 22:14.24 | KarlKFI | yay: " The file "(null)" could not be opened. If this problem persists, you may be able to solve it by uninstalling and then reinstalling the game. If you are unable to correct this problem, please contact Blizzard Technical Support. (InstallerFile::Open)" |
| 22:14.37 | Kalroth | >< |
| 22:15.14 | KarlKFI | stupid patcher.. |
| 22:16.00 | KarlKFI | if I have to reinstall the game I'm gonna kill someone.. |
| 22:17.05 | Adrine_ | Use the repair utility |
| 22:17.18 | KarlKFI | that means I have to find the mac equivelent |
| 22:17.18 | Adrine_ | http://ftp.blizzard.com/pub/WoW/other/Repair.zip |
| 22:17.36 | Iriel | KarlKFI : 1) You include IrielVirtualFrames.lua, 2) you include BlizzardVirtuals.lua (or some subset thereof) |
| 22:17.55 | Cairenn | the repair utility now resides in the WoW folder, you no longer have to download it seperately |
| 22:18.36 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Warol_ (n=Warol@adsl-75-4-159-33.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:18.38 | KarlKFI | i dont see a repair util for mac |
| 22:18.43 | Kalroth | I like this one: http://acdev.org/sweet_error_message.png |
| 22:18.44 | Cairenn | bleh |
| 22:19.22 | Cairenn | (to KarlKFI not seeing a repair util for mac) |
| 22:19.47 | KarlKFI | and since it's named "(null)" i can't do anything about it |
| 22:19.52 | KarlKFI | time to check the tech forum |
| 22:20.38 | KarlKFI | ya, there's about 25 posts of people not being able to patch, gg blizz |
| 22:21.09 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Miravlix_ (i=dragon@0x3e42aafc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 22:21.48 | KarlKFI | it's because they didn't account for a moved or deleted Background Downloader |
| 22:21.55 | Cairenn | ah |
| 22:22.16 | KarlKFI | mine was for some reason renamed Background Downloader+ |
| 22:22.21 | KarlKFI | so it couldn't find it.. |
| 22:22.39 | *** topic/#wowi-lounge by Cairenn -> Mod Dev Discussions. |
| 22:28.10 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Warol_ (n=Warol@adsl-75-4-159-33.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:28.23 | zespri | So Iriel got op here. It's something new, I bet it happened within last week =) |
| 22:28.36 | zespri | Oh and Iriel, grats on your new shiny MVP status |
| 22:28.50 | Iriel | Cair op'ed me when I wasn't looking |
| 22:29.03 | Iriel | sometime during the weekend I think, I was working at the time |
| 22:29.14 | Iriel | late last week, maybe? |
| 22:30.50 | KarlKFI | iriel, in your templatetest how does VFTT get called? |
| 22:31.22 | Iriel | KarlKFI : by me calling it from the chat window, since dynamic tooltips dont work |
| 22:31.37 | Iriel | There's no magic there 8-) |
| 22:32.08 | KarlKFI | so I take it it doesn't do anything yet |
| 22:32.28 | Iriel | Well, it makes a frame and gives it font strings, but it's not usable due to the missing API functions |
| 22:32.37 | KarlKFI | mk |
| 22:34.00 | Iriel | I DONT expect you to be able ot use IVF in an addon you want to release today.. Tomorrow, well, that's a timeline I could work with 8-) |
| 22:34.40 | Iriel | I got the basic outline/proof of concept done just in time to have to start working for my real job a lot more than normal |
| 22:34.45 | Iriel | so i've had very little wow time |
| 22:34.56 | KarlKFI | tends to happen that way |
| 22:35.17 | KarlKFI | did you successfully make a dropdown? |
| 22:35.55 | Iriel | I didn't try a dropdown yet |
| 22:36.22 | Iriel | All of the blizzard virtuals are there so you could try yourself pretty easily (once you fix your wow) |
| 22:36.22 | zespri | So what id IVF? the way to uniformly create widgets without defining them in XML? |
| 22:36.57 | Iriel | It's a driver to take in a data structure defining a virtual frame, and to execute it in the same way the standard UI would |
| 22:37.02 | KarlKFI | i fixed my wow, it was just the "Background Downloader", I had renamed it "Background Downloader+" to get it to stop launching and slowing down my game |
| 22:37.24 | Iriel | That, combined with some XSLT scripts to create the source data directly from Wow XML files |
| 22:37.43 | zespri | what is virtual frame and what's the difference betwenn virtual and non-virtual frame? |
| 22:38.10 | Iriel | A virtual frame is one in the XML files with 'virtual="true"', it doesn't create an actual frame, rather it's a template for creating frames later |
| 22:38.56 | Wobin_ | So... you've got a xml interpreter? |
| 22:39.06 | zespri | Btw. I always wanted to know. If you create a widget with CreateBlaBla and then you hide, nil the refrence, etc, does it get garbage collected? |
| 22:39.29 | Tem | Cairenn: do you know if Bela has done the Compares for 0.10.2 -? 1.10.2 ? |
| 22:39.35 | zespri | so is it viable to create dynamic UI elements on demanbd and scrape them off when no longer needed? |
| 22:39.37 | Cairenn | Tem: dunno |
| 22:39.42 | Tem | s/-?/->/ |
| 22:40.07 | Wobin_ | zespri: I'm under the impression that frames, even when created by createblah can't be garbage collected |
| 22:40.09 | Iriel | zespri: No, they'r enever collected |
| 22:40.22 | Iriel | Once created a frame is always 'findable' |
| 22:41.18 | zespri | ok thanks. so it's not a good idea to keep creating new frames |
| 22:41.41 | Iriel | Not if you dont plan on using them |
| 22:41.45 | Iriel | Create what you need, and no more. |
| 22:41.50 | Iriel | That's a mantra to live by 8-) |
| 22:42.05 | Tem | but don't create them until you need them! |
| 22:42.13 | Tem | OnDemand ftw |
| 22:42.19 | zespri | does creating a frame takes up a lot of memory? |
| 22:42.23 | Tem | s/nD/n D/ |
| 22:42.25 | Tem | not really |
| 22:42.48 | Tem | In my very limited tests, the more you set on a frame the more memory it takes up |
| 22:43.28 | Wobin_ | The same as an XML defined one? |
| 22:43.45 | Iriel | They should be no different |
| 22:44.02 | Iriel | I haven't measured 'frame size' yet but I estimate the 'UI memory' impact as about 120 bytes |
| 22:44.07 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Warol (n=Warol@adsl-75-4-159-33.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:45.01 | Kirkburn | What's the version number of 1.10.2 ... the last test realm version was 5302, so if they're the same, no changes have been made |
| 22:45.20 | Tem | It looked like 108 ish to me without anything set |
| 22:45.27 | KarlKFI | TestDropDown: SetAllPoints: Failed: |
| 22:45.33 | Kirkburn | (5302 is on wdn) |
| 22:45.35 | Tem | but just giving it a parent seems to double it to 200ish |
| 22:45.42 | Tem | er, no |
| 22:45.51 | Tem | giving it a name seemed to double it |
| 22:46.14 | KarlKFI | i assume that's because I have a nil parent |
| 22:46.16 | Tem | I didn't have either the patience, the time, or the engergy to test further |
| 22:46.37 | zespri | Iriel -> "and to execute it in the same way the standard UI would" how do you know the way standsard UI would? |
| 22:46.41 | Iriel | KarlKFI : SetAllPoints has a REQUIRED attribute |
| 22:47.04 | Iriel | zespri: Research, experimentation, and asking slouken, thought he said "It does X, I think, i'm not sure" so I had to test it anyway |
| 22:47.21 | KarlKFI | well, i don't remember calling SetAllPoints, so it must be in your dynamic creation code |
| 22:47.42 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Ah.. I'll have to fix that 8-) |
| 22:47.48 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Until 1.11 it's hard to do "properly" |
| 22:48.22 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Which version of IVF do you have? |
| 22:48.37 | Iriel | KarlKFI : It should say: "Cannot SetAllPoints with no parent" |
| 22:48.53 | Tem | Kirkburn: 5302 is the live build |
| 22:49.03 | Iriel | Oh, perhaps it did 8-) |
| 22:49.51 | KarlKFI | seems to be a dozen 'Unsupported property' printouts |
| 22:49.59 | Iriel | KarlKFI : That's about right |
| 22:50.09 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Since I ENCODE all properties, even those we dont have support for yet |
| 22:51.26 | zespri | interesting piece of code if (allPoints or (allPoints == nil)) then |
| 22:51.37 | Iriel | why's that interesting? |
| 22:51.41 | cmunn | So, I think I may actually join a forum, which should I start looking around (for WoW UI dev) |
| 22:51.56 | Iriel | The standard WoW one? |
| 22:51.57 | zespri | not intuitive. is it the same as if (allPoints != false) then |
| 22:51.59 | cmunn | because it's a tautology |
| 22:52.14 | KarlKFI | ~= |
| 22:52.17 | Iriel | zespri: personally I find it reads MORE intuitively |
| 22:52.31 | cmunn | Hrm... I guess it isn't... |
| 22:52.31 | KarlKFI | you're weird |
| 22:52.33 | Kirov | heh |
| 22:52.36 | cmunn | LUA is weird. |
| 22:52.43 | Iriel | "If the flag is true or it is nil" |
| 22:52.48 | Iriel | versus "If the flag is not false" |
| 22:53.12 | Iriel | Even though they DO evaluate to the same value |
| 22:53.26 | KarlKFI | even so, with the first one your parens make it confusing |
| 22:53.53 | KarlKFI | if (allPoints) or (allPoints == nil) then LOOKS better |
| 22:54.02 | Iriel | Well, i'd likely write it as |
| 22:54.11 | Iriel | if ((allPoints) or (allPoints == nil)) then ... |
| 22:54.31 | KarlKFI | w/e |
| 22:54.49 | zespri | can allPoints be anything else but true false or nil? |
| 22:55.13 | zespri | I guess it can |
| 22:55.24 | zespri | ok, I agree - w/e =) |
| 22:56.08 | cmunn | i like blueberry muffins |
| 22:56.27 | Kirov | mmm |
| 22:56.47 | Kirov | I like them when they're covered in a thick layer of sugar |
| 22:56.57 | Iriel | Blueberries are overused |
| 22:57.20 | Kirov | Though personally I'm more partial to lemon poppy seed muffins |
| 22:57.57 | KarlKFI | i like sour punch twists |
| 22:58.14 | KarlKFI | mmm plastic coated in sugar |
| 22:59.33 | cmunn | Hrm... |
| 22:59.38 | cmunn | Sour Punch Twist Muffins... |
| 23:00.41 | KarlKFI | ha, i win! |
| 23:00.49 | Tem | Lol! |
| 23:00.53 | KarlKFI | now, how do i turn off these wanings |
| 23:00.59 | KarlKFI | warnings* |
| 23:01.11 | Tem | Iriel: you see that rogue's response to the Warrior macro thread? |
| 23:01.29 | Iriel | Edit the library and disable them 8-) (Then change the major version) |
| 23:03.39 | KarlKFI | why is the major version a string? |
| 23:03.57 | zespri | This innervate thing is puzzling. First it's 31 point talent, which suggests that it's a Very Good Thing, now they make it level 40 Base spell. I understand that people are confused (and I'm among them) on how this has happen. Did they really overlook it somehow and gave us shitty 31 point talent? |
| 23:04.12 | KarlKFI | and if i change it wont i have to change all of the calls to it in the other files.. |
| 23:04.33 | Adrine_ | I'm baffled that people are bitching about a) getting a 31 point talent for free, and b) are complaining that whole new ability has been added to the class. |
| 23:04.58 | KarlKFI | i know huh, inervate is uber |
| 23:05.02 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Because the major version identifies a 'branch' of the library |
| 23:05.02 | zespri | I"m not complaining, I just want to understend resoning behind the matter |
| 23:05.04 | Kirov | Adrine - I'm not |
| 23:05.36 | Iriel | KarlKFI : For a given major version, you have the most recent minor version instance, and the others are discarded |
| 23:05.48 | Iriel | KarlKFI : But different major versions co-exist |
| 23:05.56 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Independently, i'll note |
| 23:06.20 | zespri | How on earth you can make a 31 point talent a base 40 lvl spell? It's either the talent was shitty in the first place or the new spell is overpowered, and I'd rather beleive in the formet |
| 23:06.25 | KarlKFI | so i should change local VF = IrielVirtualFrames:GetInstance("IrielPrototype-dev"); at the top of the blizz virtuals too |
| 23:06.26 | zespri | *former |
| 23:06.43 | zespri | or they toned down innervate when made it just a base spell |
| 23:07.01 | Iriel | KarlKFI : Yes, you'd change all GetInstances to YOUR major version |
| 23:07.10 | KarlKFI | grr |
| 23:07.24 | Kirov | Innervate was always one of the more overpowered abilities Druids have. |
| 23:07.36 | Kirov | possibly one of the strongest 31 point talents in the game |
| 23:07.57 | End | I think blizzard made it available to all druids to try to force more druids to spec differently |
| 23:08.00 | zespri | then how the heck did theis happen, Kirov? anu idea? |
| 23:08.03 | Kirov | Consider the fact that many high end guilds required all their druids to be 31 resto just to have this one ability. |
| 23:08.24 | Kirov | Not 31 Resto? You didn't get to raid. |
| 23:09.10 | KarlKFI | unlike trhe pally where it makes no difference what you spec |
| 23:09.10 | End | well, that isn't universally true, Kirov... |
| 23:09.14 | Kirov | No other class has that kind of handicap when it comes to how they want to spec. |
| 23:09.24 | End | just almost universally :P |
| 23:09.37 | Kirov | End - that's true, we have about 3-5 druids, only 3 of them are resto at a time. |
| 23:10.14 | KarlKFI | i can spec reckonning, have zero points in holy and still main heal 10 man runs or MC or dps if i want.. |
| 23:10.26 | Kirov | Any of the druids we have who do BWL and AQ we don't force to be resto, but the MC raiders are often still required to be resto because they don't really have any other use in MC. |
| 23:12.02 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Miravlix (i=dragon@0x3e42aafc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 23:15.26 | KarlKFI | iriel, wanna do me a favor and run this through your template maker? http://wow.pastebin.com/695250 |
| 23:16.03 | Iriel | KarlKFI : I need the whole file <Ui> and all |
| 23:16.22 | Iriel | INCLUDING the namespace, XSLT is fussy |
| 23:16.56 | KarlKFI | eww... right forgot the earth templates |
| 23:18.38 | Kirov | Iriel - your new animated avatar keeps messing me up. |
| 23:19.06 | Kirov | I see that devilsaur and think "that's not iriel!" |
| 23:19.39 | Iriel | It's confusing me too |
| 23:20.38 | Kirov | Though, now that you are a devilsaur you can answer the age old question... do you all have stealth and are just too shy to use it when people get close? |
| 23:21.44 | Iriel | I'm not fully in touch with my devilsaur self yet |
| 23:25.59 | KarlKFI | iriel: how's this http://wow.pastebin.com/695266 |
| 23:26.30 | KarlKFI | spose KhaosLoginSelectionFrame might wanna be virtual |
| 23:26.37 | dieck | hm, is there any addon that can simplify rrq? I now have 960 dark iron residues for the Thorium Brotherhood and just became friendly. Do I have to "play" the next 2 hours repeating the quest for 4 residues each? |
| 23:27.01 | KarlKFI | TurnIn |
| 23:27.18 | Iriel | http://wow.pastebin.com/695271 |
| 23:27.33 | dieck | oh, thanks :) |
| 23:27.59 | Iriel | dieck : You still have to PLAY, you can just ease the repetition |
| 23:28.51 | Kirov | There are turn in mods that just require you to press a single keyboard button over and over, which helps alot |
| 23:29.18 | KarlKFI | ya iriel, that only caught the virtual frames, try this: http://wow.pastebin.com/695278 |
| 23:29.36 | zespri | Iriel, many addons use chat channels to comunicate data between players. There are zillion of libraries that do just this. Have you heard why blizz don't think that giving as a standard API for doing this is a natural and simple thing to do. Is it becuase as always there is no time, or there is a political reason such as interaddon comunication is not somehing that blizz want to encourage? |
| 23:29.53 | Iriel | It's only SUPPOSED to do virtual frames 8-) |
| 23:30.26 | KarlKFI | right, not a problem, i just made the big one virtual |
| 23:30.33 | Iriel | zespri: I dont KNOW why, but my guess is because (a) they're not in the business of supporting addons at the server level (b) it would take development and qa resources, quite significant ones perhaps and (c) we can already do it using channels |
| 23:31.49 | Iriel | http://wow.pastebin.com/695286 |
| 23:32.05 | KarlKFI | thx |
| 23:32.09 | Iriel | no problem |
| 23:32.17 | Iriel | Parse of '/tmp/karl2.xml' took 10 milliseconds. |
| 23:32.19 | Iriel | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:32.21 | Iriel | Total time took 60 milliseconds. |
| 23:32.22 | Iriel | 8-) |
| 23:32.40 | KarlKFI | it's a substantial chunk of virtual frame... 281 lines |
| 23:33.05 | Kirov | 60 milliseconds?! Kripes Iriel, optimize that code! |
| 23:34.39 | zespri | Well, if I was to do this without disturbing server architecture, I'd make a special hidden channel that is not visible to the lua but which is used similary internally. This would solve problem of not having enough chanells if I have 3 addons that uses 3 different comm libraries and this as well would make sure that everything implented properly, such as throttling and user don't get disconnects. By doing it this way problen (a) goes to non-existance |
| 23:34.52 | zespri | But I guess you have a point, thank you for sharing it with me =) |
| 23:35.02 | Iriel | How is that different from using one channel and naming it consistently? |
| 23:37.42 | zespri | it's a standartization question. If blizz made it for you you have the following benefits: 1) everybody knows exactky which implementation to use - the official one, compatibility proble solved. 2) The code is higher quality because blizzard normal can spend more resources to assure it then a random addon author |
| 23:38.30 | Iriel | But the problem with a 'common' channel is that you have to send data for all users to all users |
| 23:38.35 | Iriel | so it's a networking nightmare |
| 23:38.40 | Iriel | both for bandwidth and distribution |
| 23:38.42 | zespri | This is the same as when blizz pickups an addon function and implemet it in standard UI - everybody is happy when this happens, because now there is quality standard way |
| 23:39.07 | zespri | Isn't it what general channel does? |
| 23:39.11 | Kirov | Iriel - *cough*sky*cough* |
| 23:39.15 | Corrodias | only to people -on- the channel |
| 23:39.18 | Iriel | Possibly, but it's not being spewed into by scripts. |
| 23:39.54 | zespri | yeah, that might be a problem |
| 23:40.01 | zespri | ok |
| 23:40.27 | zespri | actually I think the disconnection thingy is there because for this very reason |
| 23:40.37 | zespri | to prevent networking nightmare |
| 23:40.52 | Kirov | I really prefer the idea of client-client communication via tells, though the initial sync can be a spam nightmare |
| 23:41.01 | Iriel | More or less, it's to prevent excessive consumption of client resources by one client |
| 23:41.51 | Kirov | Which reminds me, I need to test my hidden data transfer idea |
| 23:42.22 | KarlKFI | whats it do? |
| 23:42.27 | Kirov | well, two ideas |
| 23:42.44 | Kirov | one is using minimap pings to transmit data |
| 23:43.18 | Kirov | ping in locations extremely off the minimap to send 0-1s |
| 23:43.23 | Kirov | or possibly 0-3 |
| 23:44.04 | Kirov | Just for initial setup leading to client-client networking via tells |
| 23:44.22 | Kirov | the other was sending hidden characters in normal chat messages |
| 23:44.29 | KarlKFI | why? |
| 23:44.40 | Kirov | Karl - spam reduction. |
| 23:45.08 | Iriel | minimap pinging will be annoying |
| 23:45.16 | Iriel | because (a) it's got horrific overhead |
| 23:45.32 | Iriel | and (b) you break existing pings |
| 23:46.25 | norganna | and (c) it make a noise |
| 23:46.39 | Iriel | It's much less 'hidden' than using some random channel or a subtle message embedded in a n innocuous /p or /r message |
| 23:46.43 | Stylpe | Bah, my roommates want to move (taking me with them) and are totally rushing it and I'm not comfortable about it =( |
| 23:47.04 | Kirov | User might see a message that says "[MyMod] - Checking Version" but the actual message would be "¤¤··¶[MyMod] - etc" |
| 23:47.50 | Kirov | You can encode extra hidden data with the hidden characters with out the user seeing a huge message. |
| 23:48.25 | norganna | how does this work with foreign language versions of wow? |
| 23:48.36 | Kirov | norganna - that's the one issue. |
| 23:49.05 | norganna | i would make sure it doesn't interfere with the zhTW and zhCN versions |
| 23:49.08 | Kirov | Should be fine with any latin or germanic languages, but eastern languages kind of throw a wrench in the idea |
| 23:49.17 | Iriel | Unicode has plenty of space you could likely use |
| 23:49.35 | norganna | they have a font which is much more complete than our fonts are |
| 23:49.55 | Kirov | It's just a matter of finding which characters remain hidden on all clients |
| 23:50.03 | Kirov | \t for example is always hidden |
| 23:50.07 | Iriel | Unicode has lots of 'holes' |
| 23:50.08 | Kirov | so, that's one |
| 23:50.08 | norganna | the only reason our clients don't print anything out is the fonts we are using don't have the chars in them |
| 23:50.23 | zespri | I wonder how wow handles national fonts. On my pc I have no problem with typing in cyrilic and everybody can see what I'm saying in cyrilic. When my friends tried to type cyrilic he sees gibberish and everybody who recive his message see gibberish |
| 23:50.41 | zespri | I think this is because of system default locale in windows or something |
| 23:50.52 | norganna | if the UI has been altered for the chat window to use a more "complete" font, you may be spamming them with garbage. |
| 23:51.10 | norganna | wow uses UTF-8 |
| 23:51.32 | Kirov | norganna - \t is a safe one, and \r might work too |
| 23:51.43 | Kirov | not sure if that causes a disconnect like \n does, it might just be ignored |
| 23:51.58 | Kirov | Neither are "font" based |
| 23:53.06 | zespri | UTF-8 is encoding. How encoding translated to a particular font is another matter. If it is that simple why I see onr thing when typing and he sees completely another thing when typing the same? |
| 23:53.20 | Iriel | UTF-8 is an encoding of UNICODE |
| 23:53.57 | Iriel | As for the typing thing, it probably depends on whether you or they have international character typing enabled in your OS |
| 23:54.13 | norganna | some character sets work by remapping the "high" (>127) characters to a specific character set |
| 23:54.29 | zespri | well he can type the right characters in icq msword or notepad |
| 23:54.34 | norganna | unicode works by expanding the number of usable characters |
| 23:54.36 | zespri | with no problem at all |
| 23:54.38 | Kirov | \r doesn't cause a disconnect |
| 23:54.41 | Kirov | yay |
| 23:54.59 | KarlKFI | Iriel, errors: http://wow.pastebin.com/695317 |
| 23:55.19 | KarlKFI | any idea what they mean? |
| 23:56.27 | Iriel | Some are undoubtedly caused by the button/NormalText issue |
| 23:56.34 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Adrine_ (n=Adrine@208.187.119.42) |
| 23:57.04 | KarlKFI | ? |
| 23:57.26 | Iriel | Until we get 1.11 we cant get at the button FontString |
| 23:57.33 | Iriel | so you can't name it, but your virtualframe does |
| 23:57.54 | KarlKFI | can't get at it at all? |
| 23:58.07 | Iriel | No, we can configure its font, but we can't get to its text or name it |
| 23:58.35 | KarlKFI | does it have a default text? |
| 23:58.35 | Iriel | It doesn't get in the way TOO much |
| 23:58.48 | Iriel | Since you can do :SetText() on the button |
| 23:58.53 | *** part/#wowi-lounge Ratbert_CP (n=KCummins@proxy-ce3.disney.com) |
| 23:59.00 | Iriel | Essentially, in name = "EarthPanelButtonTemplate"; |
| 23:59.10 | Iriel | you have to take the name off the NormalText object |
| 23:59.25 | Iriel | just remove it from the lua description |
| 23:59.48 | Iriel | Specifically line 84 of the file I sent you |
