irclog2html for #wowi-lounge on 20060831

`00:00.09`	`cladhaire`	`BEcause it saves you LITERALLY two lines of code?`
`00:00.17`	`cladhaire`	`that seems absurd to me.`
`00:00.54`	`cladhaire`	`I don't disagree on your MAIN point`
`00:01.44`	`cladhaire`	`but would you not agree that the code to check for a true unhook opportunity is trivial?`
`00:01.44`	`Qzot`	`Actually, I am less concerned about saving the 2 lines of code, than I am about reliably testing the situation when you can't unhook. That would probably tip the issue for me. I would find it easier to verify that my code works in ALL cases, because there would only be one case.`
`00:01.59`	`ScytheBlade1`	`So here's an abstract question`
`00:02.03`	`ScytheBlade1`	`What exactly is UIParent?`
`00:02.10`	`Qzot`	`Yes, I agree that the check is trivial. (Otoh, you and I have both seen errors in trivial code, but I won't argue that one...)`
`00:02.38`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: The overhead incurred by the extra function call is specifically the reason the code is in there`
`00:02.40`	`cladhaire`	`its not a problem for UseContainerItem`
`00:02.47`	`cladhaire`	`but it is for other more critical hooks.`
`00:03.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Qzot, your earlier question ... no, no open beta is planned (or is that why you mentioned it?)`
`00:03.53`	`Qzot`	`I also agree that there are times when efficiency warrents complexity. I just feel that programmers tend to lean too much toward efficiency over complexity unnecessarily, so it's a knee-jerk reaction for me.`
`00:04.24`	`Qzot`	`Kirkburn: I just came across an Eyonix post to that effect. I hadn't known.`
`00:04.37`	`Kirkburn`	`Thought so :P`
`00:04.43`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: I look at complexity first`
`00:04.50`	`cladhaire`	`I dont optimize code I write unless ther'e a reason`
`00:05.10`	`cladhaire`	`and in most cases I 100% agree`
`00:05.21`	`cladhaire`	`I just believe firmly that this is one case where the complexity is warranted.`
`00:05.31`	`cladhaire`	`given its _relative_ complexity to the alternative`
`00:05.47`	`Qzot`	`I won't argue that point. I was actually responding to text in the URL you sent.`
`00:06.15`	`cladhaire`	`what portion of it`
`00:06.17`	`cladhaire`	`?`
`00:06.55`	`cladhaire`	`cause it seems to agree with both of us completely, and only telling the reader the ONLY time its safe to actually unhook, and in cases of uncertainty, of if you dont want to check, to use a wrapper that you can deactivate`
`00:07.00`	`Qzot`	`Which talks about important things to remember when hooking and unhooking, and contains no blazing RED TEXT that SCREAMS "You should only unhook if efficiency is a significant provable issue, and you are willing to incur extra testing cycles to insure that your software unhooks in both situations."`
`00:07.30`	`Qzot`	`Hmm. I disagree. I gives correct boundary conditions.`
`00:07.39`	`Qzot`	`s/I gives/It gives/`
`00:07.43`	`cladhaire`	`Whoa, what are you reading?`
`00:07.57`	`Qzot`	`http://wiki.wowace.com/index.php/Safe_Hooks`
`00:08.10`	`cladhaire`	`...`
`00:08.13`	`cladhaire`	`why blazing red text`
`00:08.25`	`cladhaire`	`there's no impact to unhooking when you can verify that its safe to unhook`
`00:08.32`	`cladhaire`	`as a matter of fact i would consider it good practice`
`00:08.33`	`Qzot`	`Nowhere do I see it say "It is safer to always leave the hook and deactivate it."`
`00:08.34`	`Kirkburn`	`It's devil-writing, is red text :P`
`00:08.51`	`cladhaire`	`if someone is reading that, I don't need to explicitly state that`
`00:08.55`	`cladhaire`	`because they're not dealing with it at all`
`00:09.06`	`Qzot`	`clad: That, I 100% disagree with. There is impact to being able to verify and test that the code is correct.`
`00:09.25`	`cladhaire`	`except when you can verify it is correct`
`00:09.25`	`cladhaire`	`100%`
`00:09.27`	`Qzot`	`Kirkburn: I'm joking about literal red text, of course.`
`00:09.31`	`cladhaire`	`that's the only reason i consider doing it.`
`00:09.35`	`cladhaire`	`its black and white, there's no gray area`
`00:09.49`	`Ratbert_CP`	`cladhaire: It is possible to construct a hooking chain that defies validation... :)`
`00:09.51`	`Kaelten`	`hows it goin?`
`00:10.01`	`Kirkburn`	`Qzot, I'm not joking that it's the text of the Devil, though :P`
`00:10.02`	`cladhaire`	`Kaelten: Tired :P`
`00:10.16`	`Kaelten`	`cladhaire: me too :s`
`00:10.18`	`cladhaire`	`Ratbert_CP: No it isn't.`
`00:10.18`	`Ratbert_CP`	`But you have to try...`
`00:10.41`	`cladhaire`	`Ratbert_CP: You can't defy the logic we use to check, unless you metatable the entire environment`
`00:10.52`	`cladhaire`	`in which case you get what youa sk for`
`00:10.54`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge nekoh (n=horizon@pD9E006C1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`00:10.55`	`Kaelten`	`just got done working 5th day in a row with two more to go. probably 20 or 25 more hours`
`00:10.59`	`Ratbert_CP`	`Save the initial function, and rehook it to itself after it's been hooked.`
`00:11.17`	`cladhaire`	`Ratbert_CP: Qualify that statement`
`00:11.20`	`cladhaire`	`please`
`00:11.21`	`Ratbert_CP`	`Wouldn't that make a hooked function appear unhooked?`
`00:11.23`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`00:11.40`	`Kirkburn`	`What about ... http://www.wowwiki.com/HOWTO:_Hook_functions_in_a_safer_way`
`00:11.43`	`cladhaire`	`not to the logic i use it wouldn't.`
`00:11.52`	`MentalPower`	`woudn't that call the original function twice?`
`00:11.55`	`Ratbert_CP`	`OK... Well... Hmmm... OK, I'm tired too... ;)`
`00:12.05`	`Kaelten`	`cladhaire: is there anway to get rid of the Stale Hook problem?`
`00:12.10`	`Kirkburn`	`(the page I linked is Mikk's view, and his alone)`
`00:12.29`	`cladhaire`	`Kaelten: Yeah, save the hook functions`
`00:12.34`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: I think most of us share that view`
`00:12.37`	`cladhaire`	`MentalPower: No it woulnd't.,`
`00:12.46`	`cladhaire`	`you could make it`
`00:12.54`	`cladhaire`	`but the point is, we wouldn't unhook in that situation, we'd deactivate`
`00:13.05`	`cladhaire`	`yeah, you don't ever see the handler in acehook or sea`
`00:13.20`	`cladhaire`	`its just an anonymous function`
`00:13.30`	`cladhaire`	`you can get at it, but again.`
`00:13.38`	`Ratbert_CP`	`Again, you'd have to try to break things...`
`00:14.02`	`Ratbert_CP`	`Anyway, I have to go or the wife will be quite upset with me...`
`00:14.31`	`Kirkburn`	`see ya`
`00:14.40`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: That page doesn't address the unhooking problem.`
`00:14.47`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: It addresses an entirely different problem`
`00:14.51`	`Bleeter`	`anyone know of a method by which I can convert the default UI clocks to localised time in the xrealm BG's? Oceania's clocks are set... somewhere to the US`
`00:15.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@204.90.50.252)`
`00:15.11`	`Kirkburn`	`cladhaire, okies, I don't really know what you're talking about, but the page name looked similar =)`
`00:15.29`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: I'm just trying to understand how you feel this makes an unmanageable situation`
`00:15.43`	`Kirkburn`	`I notice there are 73 people in the channel - are we close to some kind of record? :P`
`00:16.34`	`Kirkburn`	`Bleeter, not sure what you mean by " Oceania's clocks are set... somewhere to the US"`
`00:16.43`	`Qzot`	`clad: The other thing I should say, is that doing it via AceHook or SeaHook ups my feeling of security that the trivial lines of code have been written correctly. Simply because there's a lot more pressure on those lines to be correct.`
`00:17.16`	`Qzot`	`clad: Unmanagable is way too strong a word.`
`00:17.17`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: I know full well, Anduin and I spent a LOT of time together going through each others code`
`00:17.27`	`Qzot`	`clad: That matters.`
`00:17.29`	`Bleeter`	`Kirkburn: I join a BG, say at 9AM localtime, game clock and chat timestamps are 9AM. Soon as I join a battleground, the clock and the chat timestamps are some time in the US (I suspect US East, as I seem to recall that's where Khaz'goroth is housed).`
`00:17.47`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: But its a 100% straightforward implementation any way you look at it, the code is theoretically and empirically proven out.`
`00:17.53`	`Kirkburn`	`Ah, I see`
`00:17.55`	`Bleeter`	`Kirkburn: interestingly, Telo's Infobar continues to show the correct local time, so I'm gussing it might be possible to 'fix' this`
`00:18.13`	`Kirkburn`	`Yes, I think it's possible, but I forget how`
`00:18.21`	`Kirkburn`	`Have you looked at Telo's code?`
`00:18.35`	`Qzot`	`For a page on wowwiki, however, I would prefer that authors not be given even a tacit go-ahead to unhook. I'd prefer to tell them when and how they can unhook, but explain that it's probably preferable to (a) deactivate or (b) use a central facility.`
`00:18.39`	`Bleeter`	`that was my second stop after asking if anyone knew off the top of their head ;)`
`00:18.48`	`Kirkburn`	`heh`
`00:19.02`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight__ (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`00:19.27`	`Bleeter`	`of course, there's the trade off of being lua/xml newb vs whether blizz fix it (I did file a bug report) in a soonish update ;)`
`00:19.41`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: Well I agree, but I didn't know that page was there =)`
`00:20.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Don't have the same problem in the EU since all servers are on one time zone :P`
`00:20.11`	`Kirkburn`	`But I can see why it happens in the US`
`00:20.17`	`Qzot`	`clad: I suspect this all comes down to different assumptions about where risk lies. And, as I said, it's just not that big a deal for me. I run WoW addons that I know are completely crufty. Some of them aren't even mine. :P`
`00:21.00`	`Bleeter`	`I can remember the hell caused by EU TZ's when I was an online games sysadmin over there... it's not that easy on clusters where you're sharing buckets of data, etc., in multiple TZ's (particularly back in the bad days of Java 1.1 when TZ was hell)`
`00:21.26`	`Kirkburn`	`We still rock though =)`
`00:21.31`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: All I'm saying, is the check is as simple as comparing the global symbol to your handler's symbol.. if they are the same, then you can safely unhook. In ALL other circumstances (And indeed in the general case) you should deactivate rather than Unhook.`
`00:21.46`	`Kirkburn`	`It's bad enough with bloomin' daylight savings, time`
`00:22.11`	`cladhaire`	`Having a library that's proven out to provide exactly that makes sense to me.`
`00:22.20`	`Kirkburn`	`Countries don't even start it at the same time coughthe USAcough`
`00:22.20`	`Qzot`	`clad: I've never disagreed with that. But I still end up at a different place on relative risk. The point you raise is not the area where we evaluate differently.`
`00:22.28`	`cladhaire`	`AceHook wasn't written for Ace, it was written for me, out of need, and as an academic persuit.`
`00:22.29`	`Bleeter`	`throw in a head office in Sydney, home in Hobart, VP in Las Vegas, EU office in Dublin, whilst working in CET... and yeah, it's not my idea of fun ;)`
`00:22.39`	`Bleeter`	`*the different timezones are not my idea of fun`
`00:22.45`	`Kirkburn`	`=)`
`00:22.57`	`MentalPower`	`Am I late? http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14682657&pageNo=1&sid=1#0`
`00:23.12`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: Just be clear that I'm referring to a library that does this based on the hooks being used, not actively encouraging users to do it themselves.`
`00:23.15`	`Bleeter`	`late as in the late power mental power ;)`
`00:23.16`	`Kirkburn`	`Yes, MentalPower :P`
`00:23.30`	`Kirkburn`	`Look at the channel title :)`
`00:23.50`	`Bleeter`	`that's funny, mp. you were busy telling people to RTFM and /topic elsewhere ;)`
`00:24.08`	`Qzot`	`Maybe not "actively", but at least tacitly encouraging programmers to unhook functions themselves is my personal take on the wiki page.`
`00:24.51`	`MentalPower`	`Bleeter: yeah yeah`
`00:24.55`	`Qzot`	`As I said, doing it through a central facility shifts my perception of relative risk.`
`00:25.24`	`Kirkburn`	`Still, given it seems a big deal to everyone else ... Lua 5.1 ftw!`
`00:25.38`	`cladhaire`	`the SafeHooks page was meant to explain to people what the risk of unhooking functions is.`
`00:25.45`	`Kirkburn`	`And did I mention I've got a sticky on the EU forums now? =)`
`00:25.49`	`cladhaire`	`AS a general concept, to make them understand that just doing is it BAD(tm)`
`00:25.55`	`Qzot`	`I can't read intent from the page.`
`00:26.07`	`cladhaire`	`All teh page discusses is the concept of safe hooks`
`00:26.21`	`Kirkburn`	`It starts with 'in' and follows it closely with 'tent' ;)`
`00:26.24`	`cladhaire`	`How they work, an example of how you could write one, and the methods of unhooking`
`00:26.35`	`Qzot`	`To me, it says how and when you can safely unhook, assuming you've already made the decision to do so.`
`00:26.36`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: If you'd like, feel free to clarify, but it was written a long time ago.`
`00:26.44`	`Bleeter`	`last question: trying to track down the author of GEM to ask for a feature. His website's refusing to let me register. Short of buying an EU copy of WoW, does anyone have any contact with them?`
`00:26.55`	`cladhaire`	`Qzot: And I don't think that's a bad thing, considering if they're reading that page.. they're already unhookin safely, which is worse.`
`00:27.03`	`Kirkburn`	`I haven't heard anything about GEM in aaages`
`00:27.32`	`Bleeter`	`I'd rather use group calendar, but doesn't seem to support non-guildies reading the cal`
`00:27.43`	`Kirkburn`	`Left notes on the UI sites?`
`00:27.59`	`Bleeter`	`might just have to hack the code to stop the event messages being logged via chatlogging`
`00:28.07`	`Bleeter`	`i'll give that a go`
`00:28.12`	`Qzot`	`clad: I thinking you may be reading too much into my disagreement. I think we share the same general principles, but may have different values for some of our coefficients. :D`
`00:28.16`	`Bleeter`	`Kirkburn: thanks for your time, greatly appreciated :)`
`00:28.30`	`Kirkburn`	`I do my best :)`
`00:29.09`	`cladhaire`	`I can accept that =)`
`00:29.21`	`cladhaire`	`I just take it personally cause Anduin and I spent so much time on hooks =)`
`00:29.25`	`Qzot`	`clad: And the discussion forced me to check some Lua edge cases. I'm liking this little language more and more.`
`00:29.34`	`cladhaire`	`hehe`
`00:29.43`	`Bleeter`	`ot: if anyone uses the gaim chat program or the guifications plugin for it, feel free to /msg me for minor support stuff`
`00:29.46`	`Kirkburn`	`Bleeter, there are still lots of people registering on that forum btw`
`00:29.59`	`Kirkburn`	`Twelve people registered just today :/`
`00:30.03`	`Bleeter`	`Kirkburn: I can't get it to accept the anti-spam password :/`
`00:30.07`	`Qzot`	`I hadn't realized that Lua (correctly) deals with the inequality of two closures generated from the same function.`
`00:30.14`	`AnduinLothar`	`hookers? where?`
`00:30.15`	`Kirkburn`	`Ach, annoying - tried another browser?`
`00:30.27`	`Bleeter`	`Kirkburn: and two other OS's ;)`
`00:30.35`	`Kirkburn`	`woah, crazy`
`00:31.36`	`Qzot`	`AnduinLother: -.-`
`00:31.55`	`cladhaire`	`AnduinLothar: I'll buy you a hooker!`
`00:32.00`	`AnduinLothar`	`sweet`
`00:32.02`	`Bleeter`	`rugby field :P`
`00:32.13`	`AnduinLothar`	`make sure she's female`
`00:32.15`	`Nightdew`	`cladhaire: before or after use lol`
`00:32.17`	`cladhaire`	`damn.`
`00:32.26`	`AnduinLothar`	`;)`
`00:32.41`	`Qzot`	`Later, folks.`
`00:33.50`	`AnduinLothar`	`was he whining about our hooking informational pages?`
`00:35.28`	`Kirkburn`	`A discussion about http://wiki.wowace.com/index.php/Safe_Hooks actually :O`
`00:35.55`	`AnduinLothar`	`ah`
`00:36.08`	`AnduinLothar`	`not the wiki page i wrote then`
`00:36.18`	`Kirkburn`	`Which one is that?`
`00:37.26`	`AnduinLothar`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Hooks`
`00:37.27`	`Kirkburn`	`"HOWTO: Use function hooking libraries"?`
`00:37.31`	`AnduinLothar`	`aye`
`00:38.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`I see it's been rewritten anyway`
`00:38.29`	`Kirkburn`	`A lot fo your stuff remains`
`00:38.32`	`Kirkburn`	`*of`
`00:39.33`	`Kirkburn`	`Btw, just checking you saw the Lua 5.1 thing ...`
`00:39.38`	`AnduinLothar`	`yes`
`00:39.59`	`AnduinLothar`	`replacing pairs will be the death of me`
`00:40.03`	`Kirkburn`	`hehe`
`00:40.17`	`Kirkburn`	`How many addons are in Cosmos now?`
`00:40.19`	`Bleeter`	`silly question, but given the topic, I'm assuming that standard wow will also update to 5.1 when BC comes out ;)`
`00:40.28`	`Kirkburn`	`Bleeter, yup :)`
`00:40.33`	`AnduinLothar`	`gg reviwing 40k lines of code trying to update all the for loops`
`00:40.52`	`Kirkburn`	`ack, well at least you have plenty of warning :/`
`00:41.13`	`AnduinLothar`	`77 i believe`
`00:41.35`	`Kirkburn`	`Bleeter, I would guess that the new base code for BC (UI, etc) will be used in both version`
`00:41.59`	`Kirkburn`	`It would make little sense to maintain two code bases`
`00:42.54`	`Bleeter`	`indeed, 'for' the expansion should be 'from when the expansion is released' ;)`
`00:42.59`	`Bleeter`	`it's the sub-editor in me ;)`
`00:43.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Indeedy :P`
`00:44.40`	`AnduinLothar`	`mmm what single letter abrev should I use for raid warning on chat bar?`
`00:44.46`	`AnduinLothar`	`R and W are taken`
`00:45.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`A maybe..`
`00:45.32`	`Kirkburn`	`I can't think of anything better :/`
`00:47.20`	`AnduinLothar`	`is there an easy way to see if you're promoted?`
`00:47.22`	`AnduinLothar`	`in a raid?`
`00:48.05`	`AnduinLothar`	`ah IsRaidOfficer()`
`00:49.59`	`snurre-`	`ctprofiles is run by cide&ts, right?`
`00:50.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`yes`
`01:00.37`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Asni (n=insa@99.90-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`01:02.52`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Grem (n=admin@dyn-8-82.myactv.net)`
`01:03.13`	`Grem`	`Does anyone know how to trigger an event when I acquire a target?`
`01:03.42`	`Grem`	`and "PLAYER_TARGET_CHANGED" will not work, it only triggers when I change targets, not when I acquire a new one`
`01:03.56`	`Grem`	`I need to find a way to trigger an event when I have no target, but I click a new target`
`01:04.11`	`Kaso`	`Check it in OnUpdate maybe`
`01:04.43`	`AnduinLothar`	`Mikk_Pillow, when you get back I figured out why PQ is still disconnecting people`
`01:04.45`	`Grem`	`Check for what?`
`01:05.05`	`Warla`	`howdy`
`01:05.17`	`Warla`	`any reg expression champs here? :-)`
`01:05.24`	`Kaso`	`Check UnitName("target") in onupdate`
`01:06.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ding! One moment, Warla!`
`01:06.10`	`Warla`	`k :-)`
`01:06.15`	`Grem`	`hmm`
`01:06.19`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I just remembered, I have some of my old Regex php stuff on this computer!`
`01:06.20`	`Grem`	`Might not be a bad idea Kaso =)`
`01:06.24`	`Grem`	`Thanks, ill try that`
`01:06.38`	`Kirov`	`GeoDaMancer - regex > string.find`
`01:07.22`	`Warla`	`"Fire Damage +20" , "Spell Damage +30", "Healing and Spell Damage +18/Stamina +10"`
`01:07.29`	`Warla`	`those are all lines in tooltips`
`01:07.45`	`Warla`	`how can i find all lines that have "Damage +"`
`01:07.47`	`Warla`	`in it`
`01:08.01`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Php stuff, Kirov, not WoW based.`
`01:08.03`	`Warla`	`so it returns me as match the start of the line and the end of the line`
`01:08.11`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oh, never mind. xD`
`01:08.14`	`Warla`	`if "Damage +" is in it`
`01:08.38`	`Kirov`	`Warla - you want the number?`
`01:08.46`	`Warla`	`yea and the type`
`01:08.52`	`Warla`	`like Spell Damage +30`
`01:08.54`	`Bleeter`	`AnduinLothar: sweet :)`
`01:08.58`	`Warla`	`i need "Spell" and "30"`
`01:09.06`	`MentalPower`	`Warla: one sec`
`01:09.13`	`Warla`	`Fire Damage + 20 i need "Fire" and "20"`
`01:09.30`	`Kirov`	`Warla - MentalPower recently wrote something that does just that`
`01:09.36`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I thought you needed php stuff again, Warla. xD`
`01:09.57`	`Warla`	`yea`
`01:10.00`	`Warla`	`its for php`
`01:10.00`	`MentalPower`	`http://auctioneeraddon.com/trac/browser/trunk/itemizer/ItemScanner.lua?format=txt`
`01:10.12`	`MentalPower`	`ah, thats ingame`
`01:10.16`	`Warla`	`heh`
`01:10.33`	`Warla`	`i calc the +spell damage healing and stuff in php`
`01:10.38`	`Warla`	`its for this:`
`01:10.57`	`Warla`	`http://darky28.dyndns.org/chris/wowprofiles/?id=1`
`01:11.02`	`Warla`	`you can click on spell stats`
`01:11.24`	`MentalPower`	`you need to either parse the WDB files (not easy, but doable) or integrate my code into you data collection AddOn`
`01:11.27`	`Warla`	`so far it handles ALL the healing and spell damage off the regular items`
`01:11.28`	`Kirov`	`Warla - you're chunking out the full tooltip in-game, but you don't want to get the stats then too?`
`01:11.30`	`Warla`	`also all healing on enchants`
`01:11.37`	`Warla`	`but NOT spell damage on enchants and sets`
`01:12.00`	`Kirov`	`enchants are easy`
`01:12.05`	`Warla`	`Kirov ya its just the tooltip i export`
`01:12.22`	`MentalPower`	`my code scans the tooltip`
`01:12.33`	`Kirov`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/EnchantId`
`01:12.53`	`Warla`	`i know that page`
`01:13.03`	`Warla`	`my profiler page uses those ids to colorize the enchants`
`01:13.03`	`MentalPower`	`http://www.sourcepeek.com/wiki/ItemCache.wdb`
`01:13.22`	`cladhaire`	`he changed the name to sourcepeek?`
`01:13.25`	`cladhaire`	`probably a good idea`
`01:13.37`	`MentalPower`	`hackwow.com points to it`
`01:13.50`	`norgs_away`	`Warla: what do you need it for?`
`01:13.57`	`cladhaire`	`he's ridiculous =)`
`01:13.59`	`MentalPower`	`oh hey a norgs`
`01:14.06`	`norgs_away`	`hi mp :)`
`01:14.50`	`Warla`	`norgs`
`01:14.54`	`Warla`	`http://darky28.dyndns.org/chris/wowprofiles/?id=1`
`01:14.59`	`Warla`	`check this URL`
`01:15.07`	`Warla`	`click on caster stats`
`01:15.33`	`Warla`	`i wanna display the spell damage, fire damage, shadow damage, healing e.t.c`
`01:15.44`	`Warla`	`so far i made a nice filter in php`
`01:15.51`	`Warla`	`that scans the tooltips`
`01:16.03`	`Warla`	`now i need a nice regex for the enchant damage types + numbers`
`01:16.48`	`Warla`	`page is fucken slow b.t.w.. forgive me.. its on my laptop which is at home on my crappy internet line with crappy upstream`
`01:16.56`	`Kirkburn`	`To bed! G'night!`
`01:17.02`	`MentalPower`	`night Kirkburn`
`01:17.34`	`Kirkburn`	`Nightles ;P`
`01:18.16`	`Kirov`	`Warla - you should probably make the default stats shown be relatent to the class`
`01:18.23`	`norgs_away`	`ahahha`
`01:18.30`	`Warla`	`i have already`
`01:18.39`	`norgs_away`	`Warla: I did something similar to that`
`01:18.40`	`Warla`	`on warlocks you never see + healing or +frost damage`
`01:18.54`	`Kirov`	`Warla - Yes ... but I see your melee stats by default`
`01:18.55`	`MentalPower`	`Fatal error: Maximum execution time of 60 seconds exceeded in D:\Programme\xampp\htdocs\chris\wowprofiles\php\bags.php on line 68`
`01:19.05`	`Warla`	`yea`
`01:19.05`	`Warla`	`too many trying to load page`
`01:19.08`	`Warla`	`just retry ^^`
`01:19.17`	`Warla`	`as i said.. sucky laptop`
`01:19.44`	`Warla`	`melee stats i havent scanned`
`01:19.47`	`Warla`	`they are from spellbook`
`01:20.09`	`Warla`	`i can get dodge crit and parry and block e.t.c by other means..`
`01:20.38`	`Kirov`	`Warla - either way ... who cares what your warlocks % to dodge is`
`01:20.44`	`Warla`	`i do`
`01:20.47`	`Warla`	`i have a tank gear`
`01:20.50`	`Warla`	`that makes me 19% dodge`
`01:20.52`	`norgs_away`	`i have a modified version of lua which is safe for web use (it disables most of the same things that wow does) and then i got the wow addon BonusScanner and modified it to take a tooltip as input and spit back the item bonuses for said item.`
`01:21.03`	`Warla`	`and i had 6800 armor raidbuffed`
`01:21.03`	`Warla`	`^^`
`01:21.07`	`Warla`	`tanked luci that way`
`01:21.37`	`Warla`	`what i do NOT display is parry / block which is not possible on casters`
`01:21.49`	`Warla`	`only on melee that can parry or block e.t.c is shown`
`01:22.29`	`Warla`	`like on girlfriends pally here:`
`01:22.33`	`Warla`	`http://darky28.dyndns.org/chris/wowprofiles/?id=7`
`01:26.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies2\|away (i=yams@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`01:27.24`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Bleeter_ (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter)`
`01:28.01`	`chuckg`	`What happened to the "view unread posts" link at wowace forums?`
`01:28.09`	`chuckg`	`Was my favorite!`
`01:28.55`	`cladhaire`	`umm.. i used it today`
`01:29.10`	`chuckg`	`The link at the top is gone.`
`01:29.13`	`chuckg`	`And I don't see it anymore`
`01:29.30`	`cladhaire`	`http://www.wowace.com/forums/index.php?action=unread`
`01:29.34`	`cladhaire`	`did you change themes?`
`01:29.43`	`cladhaire`	`cause i see it right now.`
`01:29.45`	`cladhaire`	`are you logged in?`
`01:29.46`	`chuckg`	`Don't think so, it's the same colors.`
`01:29.53`	`chuckg`	`Ahhh.`
`01:29.55`	`chuckg`	`Know what it wasS?`
`01:30.00`	`chuckg`	`The down arrow thingy.`
`01:30.05`	`chuckg`	`Didn't know that was there!`
`01:30.25`	`cladhaire`	`hrm`
`01:30.26`	`cladhaire`	`k`
`01:30.34`	`chuckg`	`That's a silly button to have!`
`01:31.14`	`cladhaire`	`i have no idea what you're taling about =)`
`01:32.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies2 (i=yams@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`01:35.34`	`chuckg`	`The down arrow button at the top left?`
`01:35.42`	`chuckg`	`Click it, hides the "unread" stuff and your login name!`
`01:35.51`	`chuckg`	`Right next to home.`
`01:36.02`	`cladhaire`	`k`
`01:44.08`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge omega_red (n=opera@e1-217-P40.elartnet.pl)`
`01:44.13`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge omega_red (n=opera@e1-217-P40.elartnet.pl)`
`01:47.08`	*** join/#wowi-lounge KaoS` (n=[KaoS]`@about/apple/macbookpro/KaoS)
`01:48.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=geomancy@dialup-4.240.210.75.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`01:50.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Silv (n=Silvio@adsl-155-193-249.mem.bellsouth.net)`
`01:54.17`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Grem (n=admin@dyn-8-82.myactv.net)`
`01:55.08`	`Grem`	`Does anyone know if it's possible to create a frame in WoW that shows a 3d model of the mob you're targetting, and that allows you to right click him by right clicking the frame?`
`01:56.19`	`Grem`	`Im assuming you cant target mobs with the PlayerModel:SetUnit() function right?`
`01:58.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Bleeter (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter)`
`02:02.10`	*** join/#wowi-lounge KaoS` (n=[KaoS]`@about/apple/macbookpro/KaoS)
`02:02.18`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Bleeter (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter)`
`02:04.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=masked@c-24-19-169-1.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)`
`02:07.40`	`MentalPower`	`Grem: yes on the first, no on the second`
`02:07.47`	`Corrodias`	`oops`
`02:08.04`	`Corrodias`	`i accidentally inhaled a bit of vinegar+sugar+water stuff and completely lost my voice until i coughed it up`
`02:08.30`	`MentalPower`	`fun`
`02:08.46`	`Grem`	`MentalPower, if you cant target them with it, then you definitely cant right click them`
`02:09.10`	`Grem`	`I was hoping I could create a 'mini camera' in game`
`02:09.26`	`Corrodias`	`Grem: mini camera? ever seen "3d unit portraits" that are in some addons?`
`02:09.32`	`Grem`	`Yeah`
`02:09.39`	`Grem`	`But it doesnt show the background behind the unit`
`02:09.45`	`Grem`	`I want it to actually cut out a picture in your frame`
`02:09.47`	`Grem`	`and move it`
`02:09.48`	`Grem`	`lol`
`02:09.53`	`Corrodias`	`ah. hmm. yes, that's an interesting idea.`
`02:10.01`	`Grem`	`Or allow interacing with those 3d unit portraits`
`02:10.01`	`MentalPower`	`yeah, not possible`
`02:10.07`	`Grem`	`My real goal is to interact with them`
`02:10.33`	`Grem`	`There's no way to simulate a right-mouse click on your target is there?`
`02:10.39`	`MentalPower`	`nop`
`02:10.46`	`Grem`	`Even if it's linked to a hotkey?`
`02:11.07`	`MentalPower`	`not possible`
`02:11.09`	`MentalPower`	`at all`
`02:11.15`	`Grem`	`hmmm`
`02:11.17`	`MentalPower`	`zip, zilch, nada`
`02:11.24`	`Grem`	`=(`
`02:11.42`	`MentalPower`	`(at least not without resorting to out of game (illegal) hacks)`
`02:12.20`	`Grem`	`Is there anything out there that can do that?`
`02:12.24`	`Grem`	`Like Cosmos or anything`
`02:12.33`	`cladhaire`	`whats the goal?`
`02:12.37`	`cladhaire`	`sorry if i butt in late`
`02:12.41`	`Grem`	`To simulate a right click`
`02:12.58`	`Grem`	`example: Open NPC shopkeeper with a hotkey, instead of with a right click`
`02:13.04`	`cladhaire`	`no you can't.`
`02:13.08`	`norgs_away`	`nope`
`02:13.08`	`cladhaire`	`it was explicitly removed in 1.10`
`02:13.11`	`Grem`	`Hell, I just need a way to open a shopkeeper =)`
`02:13.12`	`MentalPower`	`and I've been saying, no, not possible`
`02:13.14`	`norgs_away`	`can't be done`
`02:13.15`	`cladhaire`	`or 1.9 even`
`02:13.15`	`Grem`	`Yeah`
`02:13.27`	`Grem`	`I understand it cant be done`
`02:13.33`	`Grem`	`But I was wondering if there was a way to do it anyway`
`02:13.35`	`Grem`	`;-)`
`02:13.40`	`cladhaire`	`no, there isn't.`
`02:13.41`	`norgs_away`	`ofc`
`02:13.49`	`cladhaire`	`"within" wow =)`
`02:14.39`	`norgs_away`	`you can use something like autoit to do it but that would break your aggreement and possibly get you banned`
`02:14.55`	`Grem`	`No I dont want that`
`02:15.11`	`norgs_away`	`lets make this succinct`
`02:15.42`	`norgs_away`	`the ability to do this from withing the scripting interface has been explicitly removed so as to make this impossible`
`02:16.21`	`Grem`	`Yeah, well, there's usually ways around everything =)`
`02:16.32`	`norgs_away`	`explicitly removed`
`02:16.44`	`norgs_away`	`there used to be ways around it, now there are not`
`02:16.46`	`Hexarobi`	`yes, the way is to install autoit or the like and risk getting banned`
`02:16.48`	`Grem`	`Id also like to emulate the main game frame`
`02:16.54`	`Grem`	`So that I can create mini-cameras on the screen`
`02:17.16`	`Grem`	`I assume there is some sort of 'Draw screen to frame' command`
`02:17.22`	`norgs_away`	`nope`
`02:17.43`	`cladhaire`	`you assume a lot`
`02:17.50`	`Grem`	`I know`
`02:18.01`	`cladhaire`	`almost all of which is not true, and outlined in the stickies in the forums =)`
`02:18.16`	`norgs_away`	`the best way is to not assume anything... actually go to wowwiki.com and look at what's possible`
`02:18.27`	`Grem`	`I have wowwiki.com memorized`
`02:18.35`	`cladhaire`	`whats the third argument to sendchatmessage?`
`02:18.53`	`Grem`	`It boasts that many functions on wowwiki are not listed to protect against 'hacking'`
`02:18.57`	`cladhaire`	`you lied =)`
`02:19.12`	`norgs_away`	`uhm`
`02:19.17`	`cladhaire`	`The rule is as such: Any movement, or mouse-click functino is protected.`
`02:19.46`	`cladhaire`	`So you can't move, move the screen, click on the screen or anything even remotely close to it and call the original function.`
`02:20.03`	`norgs_away`	`where does it mention this?`
`02:20.27`	`cladhaire`	`PROTECTED - This function can only be called by Blizzard signed addons (the AddOns/Blizzard_.../ ones). See Protected Functions.`
`02:20.32`	`cladhaire`	`That does NOT mean functions have been left out.`
`02:20.49`	`cladhaire`	`and it doesn't mention unlisted functions imo`
`02:20.53`	`Grem`	`Thats not what im talking about`
`02:20.56`	`norgs_away`	`i know it says that it won't list addons that are deemed illegal by blizzard, but as far as i'm aware every single available function is listed there`
`02:21.05`	`cladhaire`	`norgs_away: My understanding is the same.`
`02:21.58`	`Grem`	`Yeah, im not sure where I saw it at`
`02:22.02`	`Grem`	`Let me look and see if I can find the quote`
`02:23.16`	`cladhaire`	`Now if we want to talk whats actually possible, instead of hunting for magical hidden functions.. You can have some sort of overlay on the world frame, and accept clicks on it. If you happen to be moused over a unit when that happens, you could for example allow click-casting of spells in the 3-d World. The problem is, you can't allow it all the time, because then no one could click on the screen to change the view, etc.`
`02:23.41`	`cladhaire`	`You could provide a binding that changed the mode, but it seems of very limited use, hence why I haven't implemented it.`
`02:24.01`	`norgs_away`	`anyhow, if what you were asking for were possible, we would be honor bound to tell blizzard about it and get it disabled, becuase what you describe could be used to create a bot.`
`02:24.09`	`MentalPower`	`yes, every single function accessible from Lua (as scanned by Iriel and Legorol) is listed in one way or another in WoWWiki`
`02:25.01`	`MentalPower`	`every single function in the stock UI`
`02:25.22`	`cladhaire`	`norgs_away: And being good little anti-bot bunnies is what gets us so many presents come patch time =)`
`02:25.26`	`cladhaire`	`Not really, but it sounded good :P`
`02:25.37`	`Grem`	`Yeah MentalPower, I think you're right now, I either am thinking of a different site, or dont know what im talking about`
`02:25.39`	`Grem`	`Probably both`
`02:26.27`	`norgs_away`	`cladhaire: slouken is very good to us`
`02:26.36`	`cladhaire`	`norgs_away: Very true =)`
`02:27.12`	`cladhaire`	`norgs_away: I'm excited by the possibilities we have with the package system in 5.1.. maybe we'll clean up the namespace a bit more. It certainly makes coding namespace'd code just a slight bit cleaner`
`02:27.45`	`norgs_away`	`without slouken as our advocate, i think blizzard would have shut down the whole addon system long ago, instead of spending the time to secure and improve it.`
`02:28.40`	`cladhaire`	`Iriel: Your green is much sexier than the old zomg dark blue`
`02:28.43`	`cladhaire`	`imo =)`
`02:30.56`	`norgs_away`	`do you really think they will be doing package stuff? seems to me that that's one of the things they'd explicitly turn off (unless i'm thinking of something different to you)`
`02:32.30`	`cladhaire`	`No, i think it's perfect for it.`
`02:32.57`	`cladhaire`	`they can make require() not pull files, but let it grab from the packages table.`
`02:34.01`	`cladhaire`	`there's tons of info in pil second rev: http://www.inf.puc-rio.br/~roberto/pil2/chapter15.pdf`
`02:35.46`	`MentalPower`	`so this would mean native support for libraries?`
`02:36.23`	`cladhaire`	`somewhat`
`02:36.41`	`cladhaire`	`not with any manner of versino control, no.`
`02:38.49`	`cladhaire`	`ok, bedtime for cladhaire`
`02:38.55`	`clad\|sleep`	`nigth all`
`02:39.55`	`Nightdew`	`clad\|sleep: night`
`02:41.29`	`MentalPower`	`night clad\|sleep`
`02:43.31`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dorbak (n=dorbak@S0106000f6645fe8c.ed.shawcable.net)`
`02:45.44`	`dorbak`	`hey folks, got some good advice earlier, gonna try my luck again :) Is it possible to trigger the "chatbox edit" in a mod?`
`02:47.33`	`dorbak`	`It doesn't have to send the message, just bring it up with the person's name, and leave the rest to the user to finish typing in`
`02:48.31`	`MentalPower`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:49.50`	`dorbak`	`via a mod/lua script? DIdn't think that was possible :\`
`02:51.38`	`MentalPower`	`I'm just asking, you want the editbox prepopulated with "Tell: SomePerson"`
`02:52.22`	`dorbak`	`right :)`
`02:52.31`	`dorbak`	`then they can go and type in the rest and <enter>`
`02:53.00`	`MentalPower`	`SetItemRef("player:"..name, "\|Hplayer:"..name.."\|h["..name.."\|h", "LeftButton")`
`02:53.20`	`MentalPower`	`from FuBar_GuildFu`
`02:53.38`	`dorbak`	`will check it out! Thanks so much!`
`02:54.06`	`MentalPower`	`np`
`02:55.08`	`norgs_away`	`mp: you are so helpful!`
`02:55.19`	`Osagasu`	`Good lawd Kaelten, How many addons are you gonna put in OneBag?`
`02:55.40`	`MentalPower`	`norgs_away: and I should be finishing this monster commit for Auctioneer`
`02:55.55`	`norgs_away`	`is it scary?`
`02:56.11`	`norgs`	`ahh - dats better`
`02:57.37`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oh, is Auctioneer being updated?`
`02:58.01`	`MentalPower`	`yeah`
`02:58.11`	`MentalPower`	`it has like 5 new features`
`02:58.30`	`MentalPower`	`(the commit)`
`02:58.38`	`Corrodias`	`new features? :o`
`02:58.47`	`MentalPower`	`always :)`
`02:58.51`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yay, 'cause it stopped working right for me. xD`
`02:59.10`	`Corrodias`	`i can identify one minor bug with the version i'm using, but it's old anyway`
`02:59.44`	`MentalPower`	`3.6.1?`
`02:59.48`	`MentalPower`	`or earlier`
`03:00.02`	`MentalPower`	`anywho, whats the bug, I can tell you if its fixed or not`
`03:00.43`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I downloaded my version right after the new patch came out. It works, but not like it used to.`
`03:01.21`	`GeoDaMancer`	`When using the regular create auction it stopped filling in a defulat price when the item had not been seen.`
`03:01.33`	`Corrodias`	`when i mouse over an item with a very long tooltip such that it hits the top of the screen and has to move down a little to accomodate, the informatn tooltip doesn't move down with it`
`03:01.37`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`03:01.56`	`Corrodias`	`thus overlapping the other tooltip`
`03:02.01`	`MentalPower`	`Corrodias: fixed in the currently available release (3.6.1)`
`03:02.05`	`Corrodias`	`excellent`
`03:02.10`	`Warla`	`hey GeoDaMancer`
`03:02.28`	`Corrodias`	`by the way, in case anyone wonders, superinspect rules.`
`03:02.40`	`Warla`	`if i want that a string cannot have a space in front`
`03:02.44`	`Warla`	`how do i filter that`
`03:02.47`	`Warla`	`for example`
`03:02.51`	`Corrodias`	`kick people in the nuts for writing them`
`03:03.12`	`Warla`	`"set: xxxxx" and "(2) set: xxxxx"`
`03:03.18`	`Warla`	`i wanna search for set: xxxxx`
`03:03.30`	`Warla`	`but only if it has no space in front`
`03:04.58`	`MentalPower`	`%s*`
`03:05.35`	`MentalPower`	`that would match the leading space`
`03:05.46`	`MentalPower`	`wait, the * makes it optional`
`03:06.16`	`MentalPower`	`%s`
`03:06.36`	`MentalPower`	`grr`
`03:06.41`	`MentalPower`	`%s+`
`03:06.45`	`MentalPower`	`there that one`
`03:07.31`	`MentalPower`	`if there is a space, then it would return true, if there is no space it would return nil`
`03:10.21`	`Warla`	`k thx :-)`
`03:18.33`	`MentalPower`	`GeoDaMancer: I can't reproduce, so I guess its fixed in my test version`
`03:19.12`	`AnduinLothar`	`yay pq doesn't disc anymore when you joina grp`
`03:19.25`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Alright then, Ment.`
`03:19.41`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Anyone else having a problem with an attacking Macro canceling your attacking?`
`03:25.50`	`Corrodias`	`the last version of snafu was screwed up pretty badly, it seemed`
`03:25.56`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Snafu?`
`03:25.58`	`Corrodias`	`i wonder if it's been fixed, too.`
`03:26.31`	`Corrodias`	`an addon that monitors soulstones and can plug into fubar`
`03:26.39`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahhhh.`
`03:26.51`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Sort of like Shard Tracker, that was discontinued?`
`03:27.02`	`Corrodias`	`unfortunately, as of the version i'm using from maybe a week ago, having a soulstone on you causes you to get an infinite number of errors`
`03:27.25`	`Corrodias`	`which i would have -expected- to be tested, but apparently wasn't. then again, maybe it was some hilarious combination of addons that did it.`
`03:27.59`	`Gngsk`	`if you read the post the author made on wowace forums he said he's a novice coder`
`03:37.09`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tman (n=Tman@unaffiliated/tman)`
`03:37.15`	`Tman`	`oh neat`
`03:37.26`	`Corrodias`	`i don't, and that's not an excuse to release something completely broken. :/`
`03:37.28`	`Tman`	`WoW, right here on freenode`
`03:37.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@204.90.50.252)`
`03:37.49`	`Corrodias`	`however, i fully admit that it may be just an interaction with other addons that caused the problem`
`03:38.05`	`Corrodias`	`i am using somewhere around 120, not counting multiple addons as part of packages`
`03:40.02`	`Corrodias`	`or it may have been a small, silly error like the changelog mentions, forgetting to change a 3 to a 2. we'll see how it performs.`
`03:46.26`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower\|AFK (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`03:49.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Bleeter (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter)`
`04:02.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guillotine (n=chatzill@ns.motek-services.com)`
`04:03.15`	`Guillotine`	`question: is it possible that SEARCHING on the AH requires a keypress?`
`04:03.43`	`MentalPower`	`nop`
`04:03.57`	`MentalPower`	`that would break Auctioneer`
`04:04.10`	`Guillotine`	`thats what I thought`
`04:04.27`	`MentalPower`	`so don't do anything that would make blizz lockdown the QueryAuctions() function`
`04:04.32`	`MentalPower`	`please`
`04:04.41`	`Guillotine`	`though from my testing, it appears starting a new search needs one, but turning pages doesn't`
`04:06.45`	`Tman`	`are there any projects similar to the WoW UI Designer?`
`04:07.09`	`Guillotine`	`Tman: not that have been publicly announced yet`
`04:07.37`	`Guillotine`	`I remember almost a year ago someone else came in and said they were going to work on one, but I havn't heard anything about it sence`
`04:07.41`	`Tman`	`it's nice, but the friggin thing isn't open source (and doesn't run in wine yet either, as it's .NET + extra windows stuff which requires a non-existent wine-mono bridge or the ability to install MS .NET)`
`04:08.25`	`Tman`	`and I haven't used it in a few months but it felt a little unflexible... maybe I just didn't know everything it could do`
`04:08.33`	`snurre-`	`this guy is awesome, he refuses to make a ctprofile because he "dislike what those guys are doing"`
`04:11.29`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Vallerius (n=val@142-165-139-230.sktn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca)`
`04:11.29`	`Guillotine`	`and what exactly is it that 'those guys are doing'?`
`04:12.04`	`snurre-`	`no idea :p`
`04:12.11`	`snurre-`	`trying to find out, but he wont tell`
`04:12.37`	`dorbak`	`@MentalPower --- sorry, a bit of a delayed "Thank you", but your answer regarding the "Selfstarting" chat worked :) You are all very helpful --- thanks again!`
`04:13.03`	`MentalPower`	`heh, np, thats what the channel is for`
`04:13.20`	`dorbak`	`was just a bit tough to code while in MC :P`
`04:13.32`	`MentalPower`	`lol`
`04:14.01`	`Guillotine`	`MentalPower: And I don't think I CAN get them to lockdown QueryAuctions() function. as such a function doesn't exist :) I am attempting to get them to require a key press to buyout an item though`
`04:14.32`	`MentalPower`	`Guillotine: ehy?`
`04:14.38`	`MentalPower`	`why6*`
`04:14.41`	`MentalPower`	`why*`
`04:14.50`	`Guillotine`	`wooo! only 3 tries!`
`04:15.01`	`Guillotine`	`and its because I know I'm not the only one that has made an AH bot`
`04:15.51`	`MentalPower`	`QueryAuctionItems()*`
`04:16.05`	`MentalPower`	`your point being?`
`04:16.33`	`Guillotine`	`my point is just that I can't get that to work without a keypress :(`
`04:17.11`	`Vallerius`	`here's a fun one for the LUA wizards in the channel... I have a class method a:foo(). I want to pass a reference to this as an argument to another function. I'd expect this to be doSomething(a:foo) but that doesn't work. Is this doable?`
`04:17.17`	`Guillotine`	`heres my code: http://wowi.pastey.net/518 whats wrong?`
`04:18.07`	`Guillotine`	`Vallerius: Why would you pass a class method to a function?`
`04:18.12`	`Guillotine`	`might make it easier for us to figure out`
`04:18.26`	`Guillotine`	`or at least suggest an alternative`
`04:19.20`	`Vallerius`	`Guillotine: I'm in another method of the same object. What I really want to do is SomethingElse.registerCallback(self:foo)`
`04:21.34`	`Guillotine`	`I don't completely understand what you need, but have you checked out http://www.wowwiki.com/HOWTO:_Do_Tricks_With_Lua_Method_Notation ? That could well have what you need`
`04:25.15`	`MentalPower`	`Vallerius: #WoWAce has guys that are better suited to answer that question`
`04:25.45`	`Vallerius`	`Guillotine: Some neat tricks, but unfortunately not what I'm looking for. Thanks, though.`
`04:26.14`	`Vallerius`	`MentalPower: I'll try there, thanks. Been puzzling over this one for a while.`
`04:29.05`	`Guillotine`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:29.07`	`Guillotine`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:29.08`	`Guillotine`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:29.10`	`Guillotine`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:29.11`	`Guillotine`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:29.13`	`Guillotine`	`whoops ><`
`04:29.16`	`Guillotine`	`meant to do that in pastey`
`04:29.24`	`Guillotine`	`but anyway, now that its here, anyone see whats wrong with it?`
`04:30.50`	`Guillotine`	`I think I may be using C notation or java notation for the for in that :/ I get them all confused ><`
`04:32.17`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What error's being returned?`
`04:32.31`	`Guillotine`	`none`
`04:32.36`	`Guillotine`	`its jhust repeating 5972 times`
`04:32.56`	`Guillotine`	`4557 this time`
`04:33.13`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Does for automatically increment if no step is included?`
`04:33.32`	`Guillotine`	`it does in java...`
`04:33.38`	`Guillotine`	`or was that VB?`
`04:33.51`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Java does.`
`04:33.56`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is this for Lua?`
`04:33.58`	`MentalPower`	`yes it does`
`04:33.58`	`Guillotine`	`yes`
`04:34.12`	`Guillotine`	`so why would this be repeated so many times?`
`04:34.25`	`Guillotine`	`I checked and GetNumAuctionItems is returning 50 as it should`
`04:35.18`	`MentalPower`	`and its in an infinite loop?`
`04:35.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hah!`
`04:35.37`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Uhm, just a question.`
`04:35.53`	`GeoDaMancer`	`If you declare a variable of count inside a loop using count, does it over write or conflict?`
`04:36.36`	`Guillotine`	`dunno`
`04:36.42`	`Guillotine`	`but I didn't declare a variable there`
`04:36.58`	`GeoDaMancer`	`local ..., ..., count`
`04:37.00`	`Guillotine`	`just passed it to 2 functions`
`04:37.15`	`Guillotine`	`you're right...`
`04:37.18`	`Guillotine`	`wow`
`04:37.22`	`GeoDaMancer`	`You're using count in the for construct, then declaring it a second time. xD`
`04:37.23`	`Guillotine`	`didn't even notice that`
`04:37.31`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Heheheh.`
`04:38.00`	`Guillotine`	`<3 geo`
`04:38.10`	`Guillotine`	`you are my new hero. even if I don't think I've ever met you before`
`04:38.18`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Heh.`
`04:38.35`	`Guillotine`	`I swear, every single time I come here with a problem, it ends up being a stupid careless mistake. e.g. using "." instead of ":"`
`04:38.43`	`Guillotine`	`(that was my problem earlier today)`
`04:38.47`	`ckknight`	`hehe`
`04:38.48`	`ckknight`	`yea`
`04:39.20`	`ckknight`	`GeoDaMancer, it makes a new local`
`04:39.23`	`GeoDaMancer`	`My problem is normally... I transpose 'c' and 's'.`
`04:41.44`	`Guillotine`	`it still has the same problem`
`04:43.09`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hrmmm...`
`04:43.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is "list" an array?`
`04:43.21`	`Guillotine`	`ran 4597 times this last time`
`04:43.23`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Er, table?`
`04:44.12`	`norgs`	`Guillotine: you want the first value`
`04:44.22`	`norgs`	`the second one is the total number over all pages`
`04:44.34`	`Guillotine`	`ahhhhh`
`04:44.38`	`Guillotine`	`that explains it!`
`04:46.11`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oh, I didn't know what you were trying to do. xD`
`04:47.57`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is there a way to tell if an item is locked. As in... Needs to be picked?`
`04:48.17`	`norgs`	`yeah, the tooltip says "Locked"`
`04:48.43`	`MentalPower`	`theres a function that returns that info`
`04:48.48`	`MentalPower`	`check wowwiki`
`04:49.06`	`GeoDaMancer`	`No, that returns if it's locked as in awaiting equip.`
`04:49.23`	`MentalPower`	`or if its being moved`
`04:49.34`	`MentalPower`	`oh, nm`
`04:49.38`	`MentalPower`	`gotcha`
`04:49.51`	`MentalPower`	`rogue lockpick`
`04:50.49`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yeah.`
`04:52.58`	`norgs`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/API_GetContainerItemInfo -- there's a "locked" parameter here too, but it says that's for not able to split`
`04:53.26`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Like a quest item?`
`04:53.39`	`norgs`	`nah - like you've already picked it up`
`04:54.14`	`norgs`	`i don't know if it'll be possible other than reading the tooltip`
`04:54.15`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahh.`
`04:54.25`	`GeoDaMancer`	`That would probably be the easiest.`
`05:01.16`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Anyone know where that lottery function is going to be used?`
`05:01.43`	`MentalPower`	`giving out closed beta keys?`
`05:03.19`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oh! Guill. Does Auctioneer have anything for mass auctions?`
`05:03.34`	`norgs`	`pokies at the faire?`
`05:03.37`	`Guillotine`	`dunno. havn't used it in forever`
`05:03.53`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Aren't you working on it?`
`05:03.54`	`Guillotine`	`I know there was another addon I was using that had mass auctions`
`05:03.56`	`MentalPower`	`sorta`
`05:04.02`	`Guillotine`	`heh`
`05:04.16`	`Guillotine`	`heres the idea behind my addon...`
`05:04.18`	`MentalPower`	`if you alt+Shoft+click on items it will autoauction them for you`
`05:04.43`	`norgs`	`(but only if you have a shoft key on your keyboard :p )`
`05:04.57`	`Guillotine`	`you know how people transfer items between factions over the neutral AH by putting htem up really low then switching characters to buy them? my addon snipes those auctions and buys them out first :)`
`05:05.08`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hah!`
`05:05.10`	`MentalPower`	`yeah, they only sell those keyboards in the caribbean`
`05:05.17`	`Guillotine`	`though eventually I'd like to intigrate it into Auctioneer to be able to play the AH by itself`
`05:06.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Osagasu (n=Kronus@208.104.133.240)`
`05:07.01`	`Guillotine`	`Heres the current code: http://wowi.pastey.net/520 I've put in all the checks I can, but I keep having one bug I can't stop. The addon stops truning pages exactly 1 page after it finds something worth buying`
`05:07.31`	`Guillotine`	`now, I WOULD have it turn back a page, but then if it finds something on the last page, it will turn back a page and buy the wrong thing o.O`
`05:10.02`	`Iriel`	`Damn it, I left myself logged in all night and day didn't I?`
`05:10.19`	`Guillotine`	`I think so ;)(`
`05:11.01`	`Guillotine`	`so Iriel, since you're here... http://wowi.pastey.net/520 It stops turning pages 1 page AFTER it finds something to buy. I've tried every check I can think of, but its always 1 page after`
`05:12.20`	`Shadowed`	`nice name :p`
`05:12.56`	`Iriel`	`Isn't that because it doesn't exit the OnUpdate after finding the item, before calling the DoSearch ?`
`05:14.15`	`Iriel`	`I'm not entirely sure, looking at the code, when it's supposed to stop`
`05:14.31`	`Guillotine`	`hmmm`
`05:14.49`	`Iriel`	`So maybe I should ask "Which function is supposed to tell it to stop looking, and how?"`
`05:15.56`	`Guillotine`	`well, when it finds an item, it hides the frame calling the OnUpdate`
`05:16.01`	`Guillotine`	`shouldn't that stop it?`
`05:17.57`	`Iriel`	`That's called by the function called at line 40, right?`
`05:18.16`	`Iriel`	`The problem is, that line 46 is going to still get called, because OnUpdate isn't done`
`05:18.24`	`Iriel`	`Maybe a 'return' at line 41 would take care of your issue`
`05:18.48`	`Iriel`	`Though that may mess up the old page reference`
`05:18.50`	`Guillotine`	`I'll try`
`05:19.15`	`Iriel`	`if not that, then just putting an if in SnipeBot_DoSearch to make sure the frame is STILL visible before contiuing`
`05:19.42`	`Guillotine`	`ok`
`05:21.28`	`Iriel`	`I trust that AnalyzeItem will one day end up table driven?`
`05:22.20`	`Guillotine`	`is there a good reason it should?`
`05:22.24`	`norgs`	`btw iriel - that green in the new forums looks so sexy... much more so than even the blue...`
`05:22.35`	`Guillotine`	`for now, I was worrying more about buying the item the moment its spotted`
`05:25.13`	`Iriel`	`Guillotine : Just because the code seems like it could be table driven nicely.`
`05:25.32`	`Iriel`	`norgs : Thanks, i'm still not 100% convinced the green is as 'cool' as the blue, but it sure IS more noticable`
`05:25.48`	`norgs`	`nah - it's hawt!`
`05:26.44`	`norgs`	`i just looked at it again, and i agree with myself.`
`05:27.37`	`norgs`	`;)`
`05:28.05`	`Guillotine`	`You know what? it appears that the page is not being scanned until the nextpage button is being pressed`
`05:28.24`	`Guillotine`	`so the page has already turned and its scanning the previous page`
`05:29.18`	`Iriel`	`Ah, your code may be doing things too quickly`
`05:29.29`	`Esamynn`	`anyone know where the battlemap is defined in FrameXML?`
`05:29.52`	`Iriel`	`Interface/AddOns/Blizzard_BattlefieldMinimap/Blizzard_BattlefieldMinimap.xml`
`05:29.53`	`Iriel`	`I think`
`05:30.27`	`Iriel`	`Guillotine : I had to make sure Bookworm didn't get ahead of itself when it does auto page turning, it's very easy to outpace the asynchronous data update and confuse wow.`
`05:30.29`	`norgs`	`Guillotine: You need to check to see if the entry has loaded for each item.`
`05:30.41`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What's Bookworm?`
`05:30.52`	`Iriel`	`GeoDaMancer : It stores the contents of books for later perusal`
`05:30.53`	`Esamynn`	`oh, and ADdOn, right`
`05:30.58`	`Esamynn`	`thanks Iriel`
`05:31.04`	`Guillotine`	`The wierd thing was I was counting to see if it had scanned each and every item before it turned the page`
`05:31.06`	`norgs`	`basically Auctioneer checks to see if the (owner ~= nil) first`
`05:31.21`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I was going to write one of those.`
`05:31.32`	`GeoDaMancer`	`'Cause I was going through SM, and getting really friggin' pissed. xD`
`05:31.33`	`Esamynn`	`the tooltips on the battlemap are bugged`
`05:31.52`	`Shadowed`	`Esamynn how so?`
`05:32.02`	`Shadowed`	`I havn't noticed any problem with them lately`
`05:32.07`	`Esamynn`	`they are showing the wrong name for me`
`05:32.09`	`MentalPower`	`note that sometimes owner is always nil, and sometimes the entire line is nil`
`05:32.23`	`Shadowed`	`It's always done that`
`05:32.52`	`Shadowed`	`Are you in a raid group while inside the BG raid group?`
`05:33.06`	`Esamynn`	`no, in a raid group in Silithus`
`05:33.26`	`Shadowed`	`Do you have a few in silithus, and a few outside silithus?`
`05:33.44`	`Esamynn`	`just me and one other in silithus`
`05:33.48`	`Esamynn`	`others elsewhere`
`05:33.56`	`Shadowed`	`elsewhere = not in silithus though?`
`05:34.21`	`Esamynn`	`yes`
`05:34.48`	`Shadowed`	`Yeah, that's been an issue for a while. It's caused when you have people in your raid group in a different zone from you, it doesn't happen inside BG's anymore due to forced groups though`
`05:35.01`	`Shadowed`	`was going to make a fix for it, but just said screw it. wasn't really worth it in the end`
`05:43.44`	`Guillotine`	`well, g2g everyone :) I think I may do a re-write of most of my addon tomorow to fix the problems. gn all`
`05:44.03`	`Guillotine`	`P.S. still looking for someone to take over my leeroy addon. I'm still getting emails/PMs about it`
`05:46.27`	`AnduinLothar`	`lolz`
`05:46.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guillotine_ (n=chatzill@ns.motek-services.com)`
`06:02.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge nekoh (n=horizon@pD9E041D2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`06:16.42`	`MentalPower`	`gnight guys`
`06:16.49`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`night MP, night all`
`06:18.00`	`MentalPower\|ZZzz`	`night Cair`
`06:35.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Priam (n=vnabet@pc.yacast.fr)`
`07:01.47`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`in the category, or on the front page, left hand side`
`07:02.04`	`Shadowed`	`aren't you suppose to be sleeping`
`07:02.08`	`Shadowed`	`thanks`
`07:02.18`	`Shadowed`	`insomnia agian?`
`07:02.40`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`haven't tried yet`
`07:02.42`	`jaxdahl`	`anyone know of any other realm pages that list GMs/HWLs?`
`07:02.46`	`jaxdahl`	`i'm looking for a good template`
`07:02.49`	`Shadowed`	`ah`
`07:03.36`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`was just about to when your question came across the screen, so waiting now till you get it uploaded`
`07:03.48`	`Shadowed`	`thanks, should be up in a sec`
`07:04.10`	`Shadowed`	`should be up`
`07:04.15`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MoonWolf (n=moonwolf@f176182.upc-f.chello.nl)`
`07:04.17`	`Shadowed`	`"SSBattleground reformat"`
`07:04.45`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`approved`
`07:04.51`	`Shadowed`	`thanks`
`07:04.55`	`Shadowed`	`night cair`
`07:05.14`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`night night`
`07:07.35`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`OMG! what a thing to hear on the way up to bed ... theme from mars attack`
`07:07.49`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`wtf is the radio station I listen to thinking of?!`
`07:08.14`	`Shadowed`	`well, it is 12 AM`
`07:08.24`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`no, it's 3AM ;)`
`07:09.11`	`Shadowed`	`you're not helping yourself :p`
`07:10.39`	`jaxdahl`	`hm`
`07:10.41`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/User:Jaxdahl/Sandbox`
`07:10.46`	`jaxdahl`	`i want the table left aligned`
`07:10.55`	`jaxdahl`	`and the high warlords to be aligned at the top of the cell`
`07:11.52`	`jaxdahl`	`do we have icons for GMs and HWLs?`
`07:12.03`	`jaxdahl`	`a rank 14 icon rather`
`07:13.41`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Warla (i=Darky28@209-166.0-85.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`07:14.22`	`jaxdahl`	`ah here it is`
`07:14.23`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Template:Rank_14_Icon_Small`
`07:14.25`	`jaxdahl`	`no large icon?`
`07:17.12`	`jaxdahl`	`kind of early to add this? http://www.wowwiki.com/Category:WoW_Icons:_Inventory_Jewelry`
`07:18.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge wereHamster (n=tomc@gw.ptr-62-65-141-13.customer.ch.netstream.com)`
`07:22.18`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor (n=yo@dslb-088-064-185-068.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`07:22.57`	`wereHamster`	`<PROTECTED>`
`07:23.08`	`wereHamster`	`oops`
`07:24.36`	`krka`	`7join #xxx`
`07:24.37`	`krka`	`oops`
`07:25.35`	`wereHamster`	`xorg isn't as bad as xxx ..`
`07:27.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth (n=kalroth@195.215.170.222)`
`07:27.48`	`Mikk_Pillow`	`jaxdahl: feel free to upload =)`
`07:29.03`	`zinor`	`lol`
`07:29.07`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge krka (i=krka@c80-216-102-253.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`07:29.08`	`zinor`	`yahoo was using 700mb of memory, gg`
`07:29.11`	`zinor`	`all i did was sign in`
`07:29.27`	`Mikk_Pillow`	`maybe it was offloading some of the server process to your box? :-P`
`07:29.32`	`zinor`	`:s`
`07:29.36`	`zinor`	`must have been`
`07:29.39`	`zinor`	`seems to do that quite a lot ;)`
`07:29.42`	`Mikk_Pillow`	`haha`
`07:32.29`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge krka (i=krka@c80-216-102-253.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`07:33.49`	`jaxdahl`	`yeah, mikk`
`07:33.54`	`jaxdahl`	`i don't know where exactly to get the icon`
`07:34.18`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge krka (i=krka@c80-216-102-253.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`07:36.00`	`jaxdahl`	`Interface\Icons\....`
`07:36.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge krka (i=krka@c80-216-102-253.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`07:38.45`	`jaxdahl`	`this page is incompletE: http://www.wowwiki.com/WoWWiki:List_of_WoW_icons`
`07:40.23`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`<PROTECTED>`
`07:41.27`	`krka`	`wow, that's an incredibly difficult line to parse`
`07:41.43`	`Kalroth`	`krka: you should write a parser for that!`
`07:42.00`	`jaxdahl`	`am i looking in the wrong .mpq? interface.mpq`
`07:42.06`	`jaxdahl`	`i'm trying to find the rank 14 icon`
`07:42.11`	`Kalroth`	`jaxdahl: look in the patch mpqs`
`07:42.43`	`Kalroth`	`interface.mpq only contains the retail version data, any patch after that will use the patch file`
`07:42.49`	`jaxdahl`	`you sure about that?`
`07:42.54`	`Kalroth`	`99.9%`
`07:42.59`	`jaxdahl`	`don't they eventually integrate it into the main files?`
`07:43.02`	`Kalroth`	`nope`
`07:43.14`	`Kalroth`	`check the size of your patch file`
`07:43.19`	`Kalroth`	`it should be pretty big :)`
`07:43.35`	`jaxdahl`	`winmpq is choking`
`07:44.50`	`Mikk_Pillow`	`yeah it takes .. umm.. forever to open patch.mpq`
`07:45.53`	`Mikk`	`interesting. looks like they abandoned the idea of patch-2.mpq`
`07:46.14`	`jaxdahl`	`they do that for incremental test realm updates don't they?`
`07:46.27`	`jaxdahl`	`the id software way is the best way`
`07:46.31`	`Mikk`	`maybe incremental updates in general`
`07:47.06`	`Mikk`	`i was going to say "i never played on test" but i did try to connect there a while ago. iirc it never started downloading anything though.`
`07:48.20`	`jaxdahl`	`oh hey`
`07:48.24`	`jaxdahl`	`it's already on the wiki`
`07:48.25`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Pvprank14.jpg`
`07:48.36`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Pvprank15.jpg`
`07:48.42`	`Mikk`	`15?`
`07:48.49`	`jaxdahl`	`was never implemented`
`07:48.58`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Honor`
`07:50.23`	`Corrodias`	`well, there's no way i'd pvp enough to reach rank 11, i fear`
`07:51.05`	`Mikk`	`I PvPd enough to get the rank2 trinket. Took all of 2 BGs :-P`
`07:51.32`	`Corrodias`	`it takes a bit longer to get above 2`
`07:51.53`	`Mikk`	`(Where I mostly just aimed for the biggest cluster of enemies available and dotted + feared the hell out of them. And died. Wash, rinse, repeat :-P)`
`07:52.12`	`Corrodias`	`sounds like standard alliance strategy :)`
`07:52.54`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/User:Jaxdahl/Sandbox`
`07:53.12`	`Mikk`	`At the end I had people standing over me and shaking their fists and spitting for a good 10 seconds after I died :-)`
`07:53.13`	`jaxdahl`	`anyone know how to align the table to the left and have the rows be aligned to the top of their cells`
`07:53.30`	`Mikk`	`yes`
`07:53.43`	`jaxdahl`	`do tell`
`07:53.44`	`Mikk`	`i'll edit`
`07:53.47`	`jaxdahl`	`thanks`
`07:54.45`	`Mikk`	`done`
`07:54.49`	`Mikk`	`check diffs to see what i did`
`07:54.56`	`jaxdahl`	`as you can tell by the number of R14ers, KT is an old server`
`07:56.54`	`Corrodias`	`it says that only a certain percentage of the players should have each rank. that would just mean that KT is a high population realm.`
`07:57.06`	`Mikk`	`it's everyone that's attained it (and lost it)`
`07:57.20`	`Corrodias`	`ah`
`07:57.32`	`Mikk`	`i don't think it's possible to have that many R14s simultaneously on any server`
`07:58.33`	`Corrodias`	`is there any point at which the realm does not accept new characters?`
`07:58.40`	`Hatsuki`	`2 or 3 per faction`
`07:58.49`	`Hatsuki`	`R14 that is`
`07:58.55`	`Mikk`	`Corrodias: not to my knowledge`
`07:59.18`	`Mikk`	`but there's certainly a point when people start giving up. 200+ queue at any time of the day usually does it =)`
`07:59.18`	`jaxdahl`	`KT was locked for a bit when aq40 came out`
`07:59.27`	`jaxdahl`	`haven't had any queues in a long time`
`08:02.27`	`Corrodias`	`yeah, i remember the locking`
`08:04.09`	`jaxdahl`	`page is not so long now`
`08:04.10`	`jaxdahl`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Server:Kel%27Thuzad`
`08:04.18`	`jaxdahl`	`columnized the guild list and the rank 14 list`
`08:05.50`	`jaxdahl`	`note my guild, Banana Syndicate`
`08:05.57`	`jaxdahl`	`they have downed Rag, Nef, Twin Emps`
`08:06.04`	`jaxdahl`	`Anub and Faerlina`
`08:06.07`	`jaxdahl`	`but no Cthun`
`08:06.11`	`jaxdahl`	`or noth`
`08:06.55`	`Corrodias`	`E'T's page is a stub :(`
`08:07.47`	`jaxdahl`	`look at the progression of our realm`
`08:07.52`	`jaxdahl`	`a lot of guilds already in naxx`
`08:08.29`	`Corrodias`	`i'd be surprised if there weren't many`
`08:08.38`	`Corrodias`	`well, weren't some, anyway`
`08:08.57`	`Corrodias`	`AQ has been out for about 6 months`
`08:09.01`	`Corrodias`	`7 now`
`08:09.11`	`jaxdahl`	`these guilds are all active`
`08:09.23`	`jaxdahl`	`i remove ones that break up/disband`
`08:09.33`	`Corrodias`	`i wouldn't expect an inactive guild to hit a new instance :P`
`08:10.05`	`jaxdahl`	`AQ didn't open for us til march i think`
`08:10.12`	`Corrodias`	`all i'm saying is that if a new instance comes out, i fully believe that -some- guild is going to start attacking it, because after 7 months, -some- guild must have finished the last one`
`08:10.43`	`jaxdahl`	`Pacifist is a top 25 US guild`
`08:10.53`	`Corrodias`	`oh, dear, they made people wait that long?`
`08:10.58`	`Corrodias`	`what's a top 25 US guild?`
`08:11.05`	`jaxdahl`	`one that is working on 4 horsemen`
`08:11.17`	`jaxdahl`	`with all other naxx bosses down`
`08:12.44`	`Corrodias`	`bah, why is it that wow.com is always down at night...`
`08:13.44`	`Esamynn`	`night all`
`08:13.53`	`jaxdahl`	`anyway`
`08:14.08`	`jaxdahl`	`the icons are in Interface\PvPRankBadges\PvPRank__.jpg`
`08:14.12`	`jaxdahl`	`in patch.mpq`
`08:15.06`	`Kalroth`	`aye :)`
`08:15.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn (n=jbcc@d207-216-176-153.bchsia.telus.net)`
`08:21.38`	`Corrodias`	`why the hell did blizzard obviously favor some pets over others? ;.;`
`08:21.41`	`Corrodias`	`spiders get no love`
`08:22.56`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`becase no1 lloves spiders`
`08:25.16`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`wut kind of pet do u klobve then ?`
`08:26.34`	`jaxdahl`	`wolf = best pet`
`08:26.45`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`ya rly ?`
`08:26.53`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i thoghu every1 uses cats :P`
`08:27.29`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`(i personaly use a boar (nice tank))`
`08:27.41`	`jaxdahl`	`furious howl`
`08:27.50`	`jaxdahl`	`for your raid`
`08:28.08`	`Corrodias`	`sadly, jaxdahl is right, the wolf has a slight benefit in that.`
`08:28.17`	`Corrodias`	`while mr spider gets... bite. yay.`
`08:28.28`	`Corrodias`	`i really, really want Dash`
`08:29.14`	`jaxdahl`	`spider should get poison charge`
`08:29.19`	`jaxdahl`	`like the necro stalkers in naxx`
`08:30.09`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies (n=Mr_Rabie@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`08:30.53`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i think i want this pet`
`08:30.54`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`http://www.thottbot.com/?pet=Remote%20Control`
`08:32.45`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`the thotbott info about boars is incorrect ... :( it can learn 5 abileties not 3 :P`
`08:33.46`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies2 (i=yams@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`08:35.42`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dreyruugr (n=chatzill@68-171-44-192.vnnyca.adelphia.net)`
`08:39.39`	`Corrodias`	`it seems that, if i want a pet that's useful in all the ways i want, i'm limited to boar, cat, and wolf, and wolf is best for in a party`
`08:39.50`	`Corrodias`	`i despise the wolves, but it seems i have no real choice here.`
`08:45.21`	`Corrodias`	`one with a faster attack speed is a small benefit for pvp... but it's not really that important t oem`
`08:45.24`	`Corrodias`	`*to me`
`08:46.39`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`well raptors seem good`
`08:46.59`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i use a boar becase its t ouse to a aprty of pvp or raid but its good for solo as a tank`
`08:47.17`	`Corrodias`	`they all work fine as a tank; i just need them to hold aggro and i'm good`
`08:48.33`	`Corrodias`	`i hate waiting for the spider to crawl his way over to an enemy, and it just wouldn't do to -not- have Dash in pvp`
`08:48.45`	`Corrodias`	`dash/dive. i hate the flying pets, so Dash`
`08:51.40`	`kergoth`	`whats a good bar addon for the raid icons? is bananabar the way to go?`
`08:52.29`	`Corrodias`	`i hate playing this hunter. it's nothing but indecision.`
`08:52.40`	`Corrodias`	`bar addon for raid icons?`
`08:55.06`	`Corrodias`	`the cat + BW may be better for PvP than a wolf, though... fast attacks vs that god damn warlock`
`08:56.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Andalia (n=xx@p54AD9818.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`08:57.06`	`Corrodias`	`maybe i should use one of each...`
`08:57.17`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`broken tooth + bw = ~150-200 DPS`
`08:57.30`	`Corrodias`	`broken tooth doesn't hit any harder than other cats, just faster`
`08:57.37`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`yeah`
`08:57.49`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`hunter dont belong in pvpv !`
`08:58.00`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`player versus player versus`
`08:58.05`	`Corrodias`	`hmm, this ghostpaw alpha has a 1.3 AS like the cats... and he isn't too ugly`
`08:58.14`	`Corrodias`	`*most cats`
`08:58.59`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i dont really care about looks :P`
`08:59.32`	`Corrodias`	`kinda want one of these, but without the faster AS, he just would not be as useful in pvp: http://petopia.brashendeavors.net/html/skins/skin_wolfskindiseased.html`
`08:59.33`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`but if you get a slow cat, you can get the max benefit out of prowl`
`09:01.07`	`Corrodias`	`they need a 60 second AS cat`
`09:04.24`	`Corrodias`	`hmm. BW just says "Send your pet into a rage causing 50% additional damage for 18 sec.". does it accomplish this by halving the attack speed?`
`09:04.29`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`no`
`09:04.54`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`it does Damage *150%`
`09:05.09`	`Corrodias`	`then why do people say the pet attacks faster?`
`09:05.20`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`they're lying sumbitches`
`09:05.41`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`they probably notice he is because of the talent that increases attack speed by ~30% after a crit`
`09:06.17`	`Corrodias`	`interesting, interesting...`
`09:06.27`	`Corrodias`	`maybe that's all, maybe i misunderstood them`
`09:06.46`	`Corrodias`	`now i have a valid question in my mind of whether i should get BW or Scattershot.`
`09:07.32`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`scattershot is pretty damn hot`
`09:07.42`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`but i don't think i'd be able to live without bw`
`09:07.46`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`but then again i don't raid`
`09:07.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri (i=andrew@124.197.20.89)`
`09:07.49`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`on my hunter at least`
`09:08.49`	`Corrodias`	`BW really comes in handy, eh?`
`09:09.14`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`indeed`
`09:09.18`	`Corrodias`	`oh, any damage caused removes the scattershot effect. fuck that.`
`09:09.23`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`yeah`
`09:09.31`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`scattershot's more for 1v1 pvp`
`09:13.06`	`Corrodias`	`so. i can take a decent looking wolf, for both pvp and pve, or i can take a cool looking cat for pvp and, at level 46, a cool looking wolf for pve, and raise them with separate stats. that's a good idea, actually.`
`09:14.45`	`Corrodias`	`i think the priorities for pet training are different for pvp than they are for pve. actually, specific instances could use their own pets, even, like max FR for MC`
`09:17.05`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`my cat's pretty good all around`
`09:17.07`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i have a wolf`
`09:17.16`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`but i haven't really messed with him yet`
`09:17.59`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`my cat's got 30 to all resists, max claw, max bite, max growl, and max dash`
`09:18.08`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`good stam, i think 2nd to highest`
`09:18.11`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and decent armor`
`09:25.12`	`Corrodias`	`hmm`
`09:25.36`	`Corrodias`	`yes, i think i'm definitely going to go dual pet on this one`
`09:26.30`	`Corrodias`	`i'll dump that damn spider, as undeniably cool as he looks, and grab a nice cat for pvp and a wolf for pve`
`09:26.35`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Dolby-wowi (n=Dolby@CPE-70-94-30-72.wi.res.rr.com)`
`09:26.35`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Dolby-wowi] by ChanServ`
`09:27.00`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mery (i=metelman@p54AEEC8C.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`09:28.18`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`be nice if spiders had a web`
`09:28.25`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`to make up for the fact that they can't dash`
`09:28.26`	`Corrodias`	`yes!!!!`
`09:28.38`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`like a 30 yard range web effect for a few seconds`
`09:29.12`	`Corrodias`	`or a single enemy for, what, 10-15 seconds like the "net" effect some mobs have`
`09:29.32`	`Corrodias`	`whose duration is not affected by the target taking damage or anything`
`09:29.35`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`with a chance to break on damage`
`09:29.37`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`nah`
`09:29.42`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`that would be way overpowered`
`09:29.45`	`Corrodias`	`:(`
`09:30.01`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`have it have a DoT for like 30 damage that ticks and can break it too`
`09:30.26`	`Corrodias`	`ends up being a druid roots that works indoors`
`09:30.41`	`Corrodias`	`not bad, certainly worth keeping the damn thing`
`09:31.44`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i wish they'd remove the indoor requirement and the DoT from druid roots`
`09:31.46`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`so freaking lame`
`09:31.57`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`our only CC is DR and breaks after one tick or sooner half the time`
`09:32.54`	`Corrodias`	`if nobody's attacking him, mine usually lasts up to 4 seconds. oh boy.`
`09:33.08`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`yeah`
`09:33.11`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`that's one tick and a second`
`09:33.28`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`it's bar none the worst CC in the game`
`09:35.37`	`AnduinLothar`	`good for aq`
`09:36.18`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`eh`
`09:36.27`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`only a small part is outdoors and half the mobs are immune`
`09:36.58`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and a large portion of the rest are just highly resistant to Nature damage, which breaks it early or doesn't let it cast at all`
`09:37.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor (n=yo@dslb-088-064-185-068.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`09:38.19`	`AnduinLothar`	`whine whine whine`
`09:38.34`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`well, it's deserved when something's useless :P`
`09:38.34`	`AnduinLothar`	`pallies have no cc and no dash`
`09:39.20`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`no controllable cc, but that's part of your class design, it's not part of a druid's design`
`09:39.32`	`AnduinLothar`	`if you say so`
`09:39.37`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`they're supposed to have roots, but they're not supposed ot be so useless that you might as well not have them half the time`
`09:41.19`	`Corrodias`	`now i have to choose my cat's apperance.`
`09:41.53`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`what race/level are you?`
`09:43.40`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`so um`
`09:44.04`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i was listening to sounds in the .mpq files and was listening to random warcraft 3 files in it`
`09:44.14`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and paused it and forgot`
`09:44.33`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`then hit the play button on my keyboard on accident and all of a sudden a random troll grunt started looping`
`09:45.06`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`it was beyond bizzare`
`09:45.27`	`Corrodias`	`troll, level 33, currently`
`09:45.39`	`Corrodias`	`not afraid to level a pet a bit, so there are several interesting options`
`09:47.23`	`Corrodias`	`broken tooth is not on my list of attractive pets, no`
`09:59.49`	`zinor`	`Is anyone here good at cutting/editing videos?`
`10:17.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Warla (i=Darky28@6-119.2-85.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`10:39.45`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i gues thats a now :P`
`10:39.47`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`no`
`10:41.14`	`zespri`	`has anyone expirienced Auctioneer dc'ing you from wow?`
`10:41.40`	`zespri`	`during scan`
`10:42.02`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`not realy but iv maned to disconnect myzelf whit a self written addon :p`
`10:42.27`	`zespri`	`it's not an acivement, really =)`
`10:42.41`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`welll it was for me`
`10:42.50`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i still dont know how i did it lol`
`10:44.53`	`zespri`	`well there are three main way to do this that I know of: 1) trying to access item data that server hasn't "seen" since restart 2) sending \n to chat and 3) saturating alloting bandwidth for a given type of activity, such as sending chat messages, requesting /who data or AH data`
`10:45.22`	`zespri`	`alloted`
`10:53.10`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`hmm i probely did 2 then :P or 1`
`10:53.48`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`but wut do u mean by saturating ?`
`10:54.26`	`zespri`	`there is certain limits blizz impose on these acivities. If you do it more often you are dc'ed`
`10:54.47`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`hmm lucky that never hpapent to my SendAddonMessae\ge spam :p`
`10:54.57`	`zespri`	`and the exact limits are not known`
`10:56.59`	`zespri`	`yeah, you better off using Mikk's throttle library to be on the safe side`
`11:03.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth (n=kalroth@195.215.170.222)`
`11:05.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@r35h14.res.gatech.edu)`
`11:11.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`11:13.31`	`JoshBorke`	`morning`
`11:15.53`	`wereHamster`	`morning`
`11:17.48`	`Mery`	`morning`
`11:20.10`	`Kirkburn`	`morning`
`11:23.14`	`JoshBorke`	`is there a place on the wiki that lists valid parameters to WoW.exe? ie setting windowed/full screen mode?`
`11:24.57`	`wereHamster`	`a quick 'strings' on the exe revealed this: http://wowi.pastey.net/521`
`11:25.15`	`JoshBorke`	`danke :)`
`11:25.46`	`JoshBorke`	`hm, nolagfix? gametype?`
`11:25.55`	`wereHamster`	`may not be all options though..`
`11:26.03`	`JoshBorke`	`it got the ones i needed :)`
`11:26.19`	`wereHamster`	`nolagfix?`
`11:26.43`	`JoshBorke`	`fullscreen ;-)`
`11:27.15`	`JoshBorke`	`and i think windowed is also valid`
`11:29.34`	`wereHamster`	`more options: http://wowi.pastey.net/522`
`11:29.35`	`JoshBorke`	`windowed = good for development, fullscreen = good for raiding`
`11:30.05`	`AnduinLothar`	`yeah. I fullscreen when I raid`
`11:30.13`	`AnduinLothar`	`windowed the rest of the time`
`11:30.17`	`Kirkburn`	`Hey, why not make a page on that for the wiki?`
`11:30.18`	`JoshBorke`	`never realized the penalty`
`11:30.19`	`wereHamster`	`windowed-fullscreen is the best ;)`
`11:30.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge DarkImakuni (n=chatzill@host81-153-3-228.range81-153.btcentralplus.com)`
`11:30.42`	`AnduinLothar`	`and sometimes i run two clients in windowed :)`
`11:30.48`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: yea, i usually do windowed maximized. when i switch to fullscreen i get an extra 20 FPS!`
`11:31.01`	`AnduinLothar`	`meh i only gain 5-10`
`11:31.24`	`JoshBorke`	`i go from 40 to 60`
`11:31.42`	`JoshBorke`	`since i just tried it i can't say about a raid, but i'm usually around 15-20 in a raid :(`
`11:31.52`	`AnduinLothar`	`well. i got from 3-7 in bwl, heh`
`11:32.01`	`JoshBorke`	`5-10 in any sort of action`
`11:32.06`	`wereHamster`	`I don't see any difference, windowed is as fast as fullscreen ..`
`11:32.16`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: :P we can't all be as lucky :)`
`11:32.18`	`AnduinLothar`	`depends on your box`
`11:32.27`	`AnduinLothar`	`Mine's almost the same`
`11:32.28`	`Kirkburn`	`Depends on how frequently windows interrupts you :P`
`11:32.31`	`wereHamster`	`nah.. on the OS ^^`
`11:32.33`	`JoshBorke`	`yea, i'm positive i'm CPU limited on my box`
`11:32.46`	`Kirkburn`	`(damn people talking on IRC, flashing up the taskbar =)`
`11:32.54`	`JoshBorke`	`lol Kirkburn`
`11:33.02`	`AnduinLothar`	`my proc is slower than my gpu should be used with, lol`
`11:33.45`	`AnduinLothar`	`i'm sure a radeon 9800 would work nicely with a 2.0- 2.5 ghz box`
`11:33.57`	`AnduinLothar`	`instead it's stuck with a 1.6`
`11:34.34`	`AnduinLothar`	`wow insent especially cpu friendly`
`11:34.43`	`wereHamster`	`WoW uses bzip2 O.o`
`11:34.53`	`AnduinLothar`	`ut2k4 runs better than wow cause it's more gpu dependant`
`11:49.13`	`JoshBorke`	`indeed AL`
`11:52.56`	`AnduinLothar`	`so, what type of gamer are you? http://www.parksassociates.com/press/press_releases/2006/gaming_pr4.html`
`11:53.48`	`JoshBorke`	`gotta go, bye all :-)`
`11:53.48`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@r35h14.res.gatech.edu)`
`11:54.53`	`clad\|sleep`	`i guess i should go to work`
`11:54.58`	`clad\|sleep`	`considering i'm supposed to be ther ein 6 minutes.`
`11:55.01`	`clad\|sleep`	`screw them tho =/`
`11:55.02`	`AnduinLothar`	`I'm thinking every one of my roomies and I are power gamers`
`11:55.05`	`AnduinLothar`	`lol`
`11:55.10`	`AnduinLothar`	`hf clad`
`11:55.14`	`clad\|work`	`i'm not even dressed`
`11:55.20`	`AnduinLothar`	`It's 5am. I guess I should got o sleep..`
`11:55.34`	`clad\|work`	`AnduinLothar: If "fun" is "upgrading" hardware on NT 4.0 servers, then I'll have tons of it =/`
`11:55.34`	`AnduinLothar`	`<PROTECTED>`
`11:55.40`	`clad\|work`	`hehe`
`11:55.48`	`clad\|work`	`well have some good sleep =)`
`12:13.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@ohm.stl.gtri.gatech.edu)`
`12:24.31`	`wereHamster`	`how is '...' and 'arg' different in lua 5.0 and 5.1?`
`12:25.00`	`krka`	`arg is a table`
`12:25.02`	`krka`	`... is not`
`12:25.11`	`krka`	`you can do local a,b,c = ...`
`12:25.43`	`wereHamster`	`let's assume this lua 5.0 code: "function f(...) g(unpack(arg)) end" - how would it look like in lua 5.1?`
`12:25.45`	`AnduinLothar`	`i think he meant different between the versions`
`12:26.07`	`krka`	`function f(...) g(...) end`
`12:26.16`	`AnduinLothar`	`i think they are used identicly, but they are handled bettwer in 5.1 so as not to cause the garbage dump`
`12:26.44`	`wereHamster`	`and in lua 5.1, can I still access arg[1] ?`
`12:26.52`	`krka`	`let me check`
`12:27.59`	`wereHamster`	`seems so..`
`12:28.25`	`krka`	`hmm... weird that it doesn't cause garbage`
`12:28.51`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`Confusing :p`
`12:28.59`	`wereHamster`	`weird but nice`
`12:29.04`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`will 5.1 be in TBC or a wow path ?`
`12:29.23`	`AnduinLothar`	`wha?`
`12:29.51`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`it should get added in a patch :p there be lots of error them probely :p`
`12:30.01`	`AnduinLothar`	`oh patch`
`12:30.06`	`AnduinLothar`	`TBC`
`12:30.17`	`Kirkburn`	`All of WoW will be converted though`
`12:30.20`	`AnduinLothar`	`was confused by your typo`
`12:30.32`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`y rly ?`
`12:30.42`	`Kirkburn`	`When the expansion is released, everyone will be on 5.1`
`12:30.51`	`Kirkburn`	`(it would make no sense otherwise)`
`12:30.52`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`yrh`
`12:31.22`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`just wondering will wow:tbe player beable to play whit normal wow players :P`
`12:31.27`	`Kirkburn`	`Yes`
`12:31.51`	`Kirkburn`	`They just won't be able to go past level 60, or go to any TBC dungeons/areas`
`12:32.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Or take up jewelcrafting`
`12:32.08`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`omg image the inbalace :p`
`12:32.18`	`krka`	`hmm... you can't use both arg and ... it seems`
`12:32.18`	`Kirkburn`	`Everyone's gonna buy it anyway ;)`
`12:32.25`	`krka`	`i did some testing`
`12:32.36`	`krka`	`if the function uses ..., arg = nil`
`12:32.39`	`krka`	`otherwise, arg is the table`
`12:33.48`	`wereHamster`	`"function f(...) print(arg[1]) end f(12)" works..`
`12:33.52`	`krka`	`yes`
`12:34.08`	`krka`	`function f(...) print(arg[1]) local tmp = ... end f(12) does not`
`12:34.44`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`are there any other importent chnces ?`
`12:34.58`	`wereHamster`	`iterators`
`12:35.35`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies2 (i=yams@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`12:36.31`	`krka`	`better garbage collection`
`12:36.37`	`krka`	`#-operator`
`12:36.39`	`krka`	`modulo operator`
`12:37.23`	`AnduinLothar`	`what's # for>?`
`12:37.25`	`wereHamster`	`# does what?`
`12:37.30`	`krka`	`size of table`
`12:37.35`	`AnduinLothar`	`mmm`
`12:37.37`	`wereHamster`	`replacement for getn()`
`12:38.03`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`huh #(mytable) ?`
`12:38.08`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`or #mytable ?`
`12:38.11`	`wereHamster`	`#mytable`
`12:38.12`	`krka`	`both i think`
`12:38.18`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`wow weird`
`12:38.24`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`\o/`
`12:38.31`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`did they remvoe the table.n ?`
`12:38.34`	`AnduinLothar`	`will that work for non number indexed tables>`
`12:38.35`	`AnduinLothar`	`?`
`12:38.42`	`krka`	`i think so`
`12:38.43`	`krka`	`not sure`
`12:38.47`	`AnduinLothar`	`that would be nice`
`12:38.55`	`krka`	`indeed`
`12:39.32`	`wereHamster`	`'print(#{foo=1,bar=2,3})' => 1`
`12:39.49`	`krka`	`ah no...`
`12:39.51`	`krka`	`http://www.lua.org/manual/5.1/manual.html#2.5.5`
`12:51.38`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Insa (n=insa@99.90-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`12:57.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Nightdew (n=nightdew@c-69-241-14-232.hsd1.ga.comcast.net)`
`13:10.11`	`JoshBorke`	`morning`
`13:12.51`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	tableconstructor ::= `{� [fieldlist] `}� <- i never understood the ::=
`13:13.10`	`JoshBorke`	`it's a formal definition of the language`
`13:13.21`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`oke`
`13:16.08`	`AnduinLothar`	`specificly it's assignment in the formal language used to define the language`
`13:16.24`	`AnduinLothar`	`more of a 'consists of'`
`13:16.30`	`JoshBorke`	`i forget the name of the syntax`
`13:16.37`	`AnduinLothar`	`so did i`
`13:16.42`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`if i want to get the text of my button's frontstring thne do i got to use Button:GetFontString() or Button:GetText()?`
`13:16.42`	`AnduinLothar`	`learned it in compilers`
`13:16.52`	`JoshBorke`	`hehe, me too-`
`13:17.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's like an acronym..`
`13:18.06`	`JoshBorke`	`RH?`
`13:18.15`	`AnduinLothar`	`mmm no`
`13:18.35`	`AnduinLothar`	`Button:GetText()`
`13:20.26`	`JoshBorke`	`Backus-Naur Form?`
`13:21.25`	`AnduinLothar`	`there we go`
`13:21.28`	`AnduinLothar`	`ebnf`
`13:21.31`	`AnduinLothar`	`or bnf`
`13:21.36`	`JoshBorke`	`:-D`
`13:21.58`	`AnduinLothar`	`Describes the set of ?sentences? belonging to the language`
`13:25.52`	`AnduinLothar`	`Anyone wanna test a new version of damagemeters with me?`
`13:26.40`	`JoshBorke`	`ew`
`13:26.44`	`JoshBorke`	`DM, yuck`
`13:28.13`	`AnduinLothar`	`didn't you write the competition?`
`13:28.19`	`JoshBorke`	`nuh uh`
`13:28.27`	`AnduinLothar`	`what do you use?`
`13:28.30`	`JoshBorke`	`i use SW Stats`
`13:28.34`	`AnduinLothar`	`ah`
`13:28.44`	`JoshBorke`	`i would use Recap, but no syncing`
`13:29.00`	`AnduinLothar`	`i haven't tried SWS, but I've heard mixed reviews`
`13:29.11`	`JoshBorke`	`the interface is really weird`
`13:29.49`	`AnduinLothar`	`I just updated DM to use CTL and adden messages as well as added a few menu options I thought it needed`
`13:30.37`	`JoshBorke`	`i'd help, but i'm at work`
`13:30.55`	`AnduinLothar`	`also added optional auto-syncing, but I'm not sure if it needs more... or not`
`13:31.44`	`AnduinLothar`	`I get considerable fps lag on my slow machine when syncing, I was trying to make it process slower to fix that..`
`13:32.25`	`AnduinLothar`	`does sws sync automaticly or on demand?`
`13:32.30`	`JoshBorke`	`automagically`
`13:33.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`yeah, i've heard complaints that it syncs too much and uses up too much resources`
`13:34.37`	`JoshBorke`	`i haven't run into any problems with it, but that could be a possibility`
`13:36.20`	`JoshBorke`	`Mikk: ping`
`13:37.05`	`AnduinLothar`	`any idea when it syncs?`
`13:37.29`	`AnduinLothar`	`I've set this one to sync whenever you go out of combat, once every 3 min`
`13:38.33`	`AnduinLothar`	`I have no idea if the "RAID" addon works in battlegrounds or whether i need to use the "BATTLEGROUND" one tho`
`13:41.20`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Asni (n=insa@99.90-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`13:41.45`	`JoshBorke`	`i don't believe RAID will go to BATTLEGROUND inside a battleground`
`13:42.11`	`Thrae`	`RAID works whenever you have a raid, including the automatically made one with 1.12 BGs`
`13:42.26`	`JoshBorke`	`what if you are in a raid before you enter a BG?`
`13:42.42`	`Kalroth`	`You'll still be in that raid`
`13:47.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge DarkImakuni (n=chatzill@host81-153-3-228.range81-153.btcentralplus.com)`
`13:49.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge root__ (n=root@c-68-41-95-198.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`13:52.40`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge jaeger (n=jaeger@pdpc/supporter/bronze/jaeger)`
`13:53.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Beladona (n=sluster@24.129.136.26)`
`13:53.58`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Beladona] by ChanServ`
`13:54.03`	`jaeger`	`heyo, all`
`13:54.27`	`root__`	`yello`
`13:54.34`	`JoshBorke`	`morning`
`13:56.07`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge knodi (n=knodi@c-68-41-95-198.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`13:56.09`	`jaeger`	`Is there a decent tutorial online somewhere for making a scrollframe such as the one CT_RaidAssist uses for durability/version checks? I'd like to make something similar for a DKP list`
`13:56.53`	`jaeger`	`figured I'd check before I started digging through all the code, since it's rather extensive`
`13:57.38`	`[Ammo]`	`you can do it totally in .lua now`
`13:58.05`	`JoshBorke`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/HOWTO:_Make_a_Scrollable_List_Using_FauxScrollFrameTemplate is one option`
`13:58.15`	`[Ammo]`	`http://connected.dnd.utwente.nl/~wouter/Item.lua`
`13:58.22`	`[Ammo]`	`that's oRA2's item check scrollframe`
`13:58.41`	`[Ammo]`	`check the SetupFrames() function and the UpdateScrollBar() one`
`13:58.43`	`[Ammo]`	`mainly`
`13:58.47`	`jaeger`	`cool, thanks for both links, I'll check them out`
`14:02.00`	`jaeger`	`pretty slick`
`14:03.06`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge knodi (n=knodi@c-68-41-95-198.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`14:05.30`	`MentalPower`	`morning`
`14:05.44`	`jaeger`	`morning :)`
`14:12.11`	*** join/#wowi-lounge ag` (n=Andreas@0x535bbf4c.bynxx18.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk)
`14:14.00`	*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor` (n=aaaa@ip-80-226-241-24.vodafone-net.de)
`14:14.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge TS\|Skrom (n=Skrom@66.148.226.210.nw.nuvox.net)`
`14:14.38`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Elkano (n=elkano@ip-213-135-2-160.handshake.de)`
`14:28.15`	`JoshBorke`	`morning MentalPower`
`14:28.24`	`MentalPower`	`morning`
`14:30.17`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri\|home (i=andrew@203.184.63.117)`
`14:37.01`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`14:37.38`	`Kirkburn`	`Stupid bloody 'standby' mode, it never remembers to go back to dual-monitor mode :(`
`14:50.26`	`AnduinLothar`	`so is DamageMeters a combat mod or a data mod?`
`14:50.42`	`JoshBorke`	`what do you mean?`
`14:50.50`	`AnduinLothar`	`for wowi classification`
`14:51.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Combat, I'd say`
`14:51.10`	`Kirkburn`	`It's the more obvious way of defining it`
`14:52.01`	`JoshBorke`	`yea, combat`
`15:05.12`	`AnduinLothar`	`New DamageMeters 5.1.0 submitted to wowi`
`15:05.41`	`AnduinLothar`	`and now it's REALLY sleep time`
`15:05.49`	`AnduinLothar`	`i swear!`
`15:05.57`	`AnduinLothar`	`ahgo;ag lmigal 8am!`
`15:09.26`	zinor`	`haha`
`15:09.28`	zinor`	`greatest video ever`
`15:09.28`	zinor`	`http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733044300866646599`
`15:12.09`	`Kirkburn`	`Btw, Firefox 2 Beta 2 has just been released`
`15:12.41`	`DarkImakuni`	`Sweet!`
`15:13.34`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Cide (i=Cide@81-226-233-5-no60.tbcn.telia.com)`
`15:13.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Zinor, that IS a hilarious movie hehe`
`15:15.57`	`DarkImakuni`	`Welcome, Cide`
`15:16.03`	`Cide`	`hi`
`15:40.28`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ven (n=ven@dyndsl-085-016-089-158.ewe-ip-backbone.de)`
`15:48.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=gryphon@mail.alexdevco.com)`
`15:59.07`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`15:59.30`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge knodi (n=knodi@c-68-41-95-198.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`16:07.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (n=Jonathan@host81-159-1-145.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)`
`16:07.07`	`JoshBorke`	`morning Cairenn`
`16:07.09`	`JoshBorke`	`morning Cide`
`16:07.17`	`Cide`	`morning`
`16:07.34`	`Cairenn`	`hello guys`
`16:10.05`	`DarkImakuni`	`Evening all`
`16:10.09`	`Hexarobi`	`ya that was a good video`
`16:10.11`	`Hexarobi`	`mornin`
`16:17.14`	`JoshBorke`	`lol, that video is awesome`
`16:17.16`	`JoshBorke`	`even without sound`
`16:17.20`	`Cairenn`	`what video?`
`16:17.37`	`JoshBorke`	`http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733044300866646599`
`16:25.11`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: ping`
`16:26.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@204.155.78.126)`
`16:28.48`	`Hexarobi`	`the audio is funny tho, all the voices`
`16:29.48`	`wereHamster`	`JoshBorke, pong`
`16:30.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor (n=yo@dslb-088-064-185-068.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`16:32.08`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: is it alright if i plug HealWatch in your HealSync thread?`
`16:32.34`	`wereHamster`	`sure`
`16:33.02`	`Kirov`	`are there any functional differences between healwatch / healsync?`
`16:33.32`	`Kirov`	`It seems like they just have different visuals`
`16:33.47`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirov: functionality? i don't think so`
`16:33.53`	`JoshBorke`	`his just works :-D`
`16:33.55`	`JoshBorke`	`mine, not so much`
`16:33.58`	`Kirov`	`heh`
`16:34.17`	`Kirov`	`JoshBorke - hence the reason my girlfriend uses HealSync instead of HealWatch`
`16:34.18`	`JoshBorke`	`mine being HealWatch`
`16:34.41`	`JoshBorke`	`i mean, mine works for me, it's just i hardly ever use it :-D`
`16:35.04`	`Kirov`	`I installed HealWatch on her machine and she complained it never worked, so I installed HealSync and she loved it`
`16:35.12`	`wereHamster`	`I'm a warrior, so I neither can say that I'm using it ;)`
`16:35.19`	`Kirov`	`heh`
`16:35.33`	`wereHamster`	`at least I see who's healing me..`
`16:36.16`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirov: when did you install HealWatch?`
`16:36.35`	`Kirov`	`JoshBorke - hmm`
`16:36.40`	`Kirov`	`A while ago`
`16:36.47`	`Kirov`	`like, 4 months?`
`16:37.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge snurre (n=snurre@AVelizy-153-1-65-239.w86-205.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`16:37.40`	`JoshBorke`	`in a week or so i should be able to release version 1.0`
`16:38.00`	`JoshBorke`	`just gotta test the coms stuff`
`16:38.15`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: healsync is using the new SendAddonMessage, right?`
`16:39.18`	`wereHamster`	`yes`
`16:39.40`	`Kirov`	`Maybe you two should share the broadcast format`
`16:40.01`	`wereHamster`	`I'm usign CommChannel which uses a rather weird format :-/`
`16:40.15`	`Kirov`	`where does CommChannel come from?`
`16:40.20`	`JoshBorke`	`he wrote it :-D`
`16:40.23`	`wereHamster`	`from the ace svn`
`16:40.26`	`Kirov`	`or the iFrameFactory`
`16:40.34`	`wereHamster`	`that's mine, too`
`16:40.44`	`Kirov`	`I assume you use those for your other mods then`
`16:40.51`	`wereHamster`	`yes`
`16:41.12`	`wereHamster`	`IFF in coolDown`
`16:41.33`	`Kirov`	`one just doesn't generally see libs that aren't Ace or Cosmos`
`16:42.13`	`Kirkburn`	`Look at the last sentence on this page: http://www.wowwiki.com/Kaboom .... "On Wednesday, 30th August 2006, Kaboom! was one of the first guilds to be offered beta access to the Burning Crusade; the guild vowed to use the beta access to further roleplaying in Warcraft and to help create storyline reasons for the addition of the Outlands." Lucky bastards :O`
`16:42.15`	`wereHamster`	`hehe.. I'll never convert mine to Ace ;)`
`16:43.11`	`[Ammo]`	`which is probably why they are widely adopted :)`
`16:43.19`	`Kirov`	`an RP guild named "Kaboom!"?`
`16:43.42`	`wereHamster`	`I don't need publicity.. I write my addons for my guild and myself`
`16:46.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kalroth (n=kalroth@port114.ds1-hj.adsl.cybercity.dk)`
`16:50.08`	`JoshBorke`	`wereHamster: indeed`
`17:15.28`	`TS\|Skrom`	`erm... anyone know the version on the latest discord action bars?`
`17:15.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`their website is on "bandwidth exceeded" and I wanna make sure I get the most recent :D`
`17:19.17`	`Gryphen`	`3.16?`
`17:21.09`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that's what's on curse, but it's dated a while ago`
`17:21.20`	`TS\|Skrom`	`don't think there were any problems with DAB in the last patch though so that may be it`
`17:21.41`	`Kirkburn`	`He'd only got as far as a 1.12 beta afaik`
`17:23.09`	`zenzelezz`	`ffs, they upgraded my server's hardware yesterday, and today it's worse than before... nice job`
`17:23.36`	`Kirov`	`zenzelezz - seems to be the blizzard creedo these days`
`17:23.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`zenz I noticed that last night too`
`17:23.56`	`TS\|Skrom`	`(Not just being paranoid this time)`
`17:23.59`	`Kirov`	`"Lets replace all our HP servers with 486 Beowulfs!"`
`17:26.24`	`Gryphen`	`google cache shows 3.16 as of aug 25th`
`17:27.14`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirov: beowulfs are fun!`
`17:27.15`	`TS\|Skrom`	`thanks gryphen`
`17:28.28`	`Kaso`	`so, can someone tell me about time()`
`17:43.07`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - yeah, look up the c function strtime`
`17:43.16`	`Kirov`	`er strdate`
`17:43.18`	`Kaso`	`thanks`
`17:43.18`	`Kirov`	`something like that`
`17:43.22`	`Kirov`	`hold on`
`17:43.27`	`Kaso`	`hokay`
`17:44.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cogwheel (n=chatzill@intra.kistlerwine.com)`
`17:44.56`	`Kirov`	`http://lua-users.org/wiki/OsLibraryTutorial`
`17:44.57`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hola cog`
`17:45.03`	`cogwheel`	`morning`
`17:45.31`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - what are you using it for?`
`17:46.07`	`Kaso`	`i aint, cide did im just trying to decypher my Expense History saved`
`17:48.37`	`Kirov`	`hmm`
`17:48.40`	`Kirov`	`what's he using?`
`17:49.25`	`Kirov`	`oh, odd`
`17:49.36`	`Kirov`	`he's literally just using time() with no arguments`
`17:50.42`	`Kirov`	`as I understand it, time() with no arguments returns the time in seconds from epoch`
`17:50.47`	`Kirov`	`(in lua terms, that's the day lua was released)`
`17:51.07`	`Cide`	`yep`
`17:51.07`	`JoshBorke`	`erm, that's odd`
`17:51.26`	`JoshBorke`	`see, Cide agrees`
`17:51.32`	`Kirov`	`lol`
`17:53.25`	`Cide`	`date is used to format a string based on time`
`17:53.25`	`Kaso`	`trying to work out how much i've spent since i started naxx :>`
`17:53.25`	`Kaso`	`on repairs`
`17:55.48`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - check line 34`
`17:55.48`	`Kirov`	`formats the return from time() to y/m/d`
`17:55.49`	`Kirov`	`er`
`17:55.49`	`Kirov`	`m/d/y`
`17:55.49`	`JoshBorke`	`...`
`17:55.49`	`JoshBorke`	`backwards day or something?`
`17:55.51`	`Kirov`	`os.date is fun to play with`
`17:55.51`	`Kirov`	`bizarre "I can do anything!" function`
`17:55.51`	`JoshBorke`	`can it make me toast?`
`17:55.52`	`Kaso`	`os.date("toast please!")`
`17:56.25`	`Kirov`	`http://www.cppreference.com/stddate/strftime.html`
`17:56.45`	`Kirov`	`os.date() is basically a string.format with pre-existing values`
`17:58.21`	`Kirov`	`os.date("toast please! It's %X and I'm hungry!") is valid`
`17:58.29`	`Kaso`	`haha`
`17:59.21`	`Kirov`	there's also some oddites like "`t" which returns a table of all the values
`18:01.06`	`Kaso`	`so, to save me any work (im lazy) how can i convert a dd/mm/yy into date() return value`
`18:01.07`	`Kirov`	`I believe you can do things like "!%X" to return the time based on GMT`
`18:01.07`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - dd/mm/yy would be the return from date()`
`18:01.07`	`Kaso`	`hmm`
`18:01.50`	`Cairenn`	`btw, I'm presuming you guys have seen this, yes? "You can use the new "pairs(table)" semantic now, by the way. :)"`
`18:01.52`	`Kaso`	`then whats this 1134334862 crap!`
`18:01.59`	`Cide`	`you take date("*t")`
`18:02.13`	`Cide`	`parse the string ("xx/yy/zz")`
`18:02.18`	`Cide`	`replace the values into the table`
`18:02.22`	`Kirov`	`Cairenn - I was laughing at the post just before it about making two sets of code based on the build`
`18:02.26`	`Cide`	`and then pass the table into time or date (I forgot which)`
`18:02.46`	`Cide`	`not sure if there's an easier way (strtotime in php is useful for that)`
`18:02.53`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - what's the date you started naxx?`
`18:02.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge chuckg (i=chuckg@66-237-5-116.starstream.net)`
`18:03.08`	`Kaso`	`03 Jul 06`
`18:03.22`	`Kirov`	`Kaso - and it's the number of seconds since 21 July 01 or something like that`
`18:04.05`	`Cide`	`well, what you could do is just figure out the time value of 03 jul 06`
`18:04.19`	`Cide`	`and loop through the EH table and check if the time value is > that`
`18:04.32`	`Kirov`	`os.time() - os.time({day=4,month=4,year=2006})`
`18:04.32`	`Cide`	`if so, add the gold cost to your variable, and print it in the end`
`18:04.51`	`Kirov`	`er day=3`
`18:05.17`	`cogwheel`	`umm... forgive the lack of exposure to lua 5.1, but what is the "new" pairs(table) semantic?`
`18:05.28`	`Kaso`	`1144065600 yay!`
`18:05.31`	`Cide`	`july is the 4th month, too? :P`
`18:05.43`	`JoshBorke`	`lol`
`18:06.03`	`Kirov`	`If the time data from Expense history is > than that number, it's after you started`
`18:06.16`	`Cide`	`um`
`18:06.17`	`Kaso`	`1151928000 then seeing as kirov cant count!`
`18:06.26`	`Cide`	`wouldn't that be amount of seconds since that date`
`18:06.31`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - for k, v in tableName do .... for k, v in pairs(tableName) do`
`18:06.48`	`cogwheel`	`but we can do that anyway... :\`
`18:06.52`	`Cide`	`you shouldn't need the " os.time() - " part`
`18:07.25`	`Kirov`	`isn't time() the number of seconds from a specific date?`
`18:07.38`	`cogwheel`	`1/1/70 iirc`
`18:07.40`	`Kaso`	`god im confused`
`18:07.50`	`Cide`	`give me a sec :P`
`18:08.55`	`Kirov`	`ok, if everything got the time from 2 minutes ago (120) and wanted to find out what happened in the 30 seconds I'd get the time from 30 seconds ago (30) and do 120-30 to find out what's happened in taht last 30 seconds`
`18:12.00`	`Kirov`	`anything >90 is the last 30 seconds`
`18:12.00`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - yes`
`18:12.45`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - some people don't appear to realize this.`
`18:12.46`	`cogwheel`	`ah...`
`18:12.46`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - they thing ipairs and pairs are "new" to 5.1`
`18:12.46`	`Cide`	`/script local money = 0; local t = time({day=3, month=7, year=2006}) for k, v in ipairs(CT_EH_History["Swede@Doomhammer"]) do if ( v[3] >= t ) then money = money + v[1]; end end ChatFrame1:AddMessage(money)`
`18:12.47`	`Cide`	`replace "Swede@Doomhammer" with your choice, naturally`
`18:12.47`	`Kaso`	`haha thanks`
`18:12.49`	`Cide`	`that's all types of expenses though, but oh well`
`18:12.49`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Ratbert_CP (n=KCummins@proxy-ce3.disney.com)`
`18:12.50`	`Cide`	`will give you number of copper spent`
`18:13.05`	`Kaso`	`660g`
`18:13.05`	`Kirov`	`See, this is why I love being a hunter`
`18:13.05`	`Beladona`	`the old way of 'for k,v in t' is deprecated, and the new format 'for k,v in pairs(t)' is recommended per the manual`
`18:13.09`	`Cide`	`can also use ipairs when appropriate`
`18:13.29`	`Kirov`	`I think I've spent 1200g total, across all my characters since the addon was released.`
`18:14.06`	`cogwheel`	`It's been that way since 5.0... I guess it's just another case of RTFM... /sigh`
`18:14.25`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - lua has a manual?!`
`18:14.28`	`Kirov`	`zomg!`
`18:14.36`	`cogwheel`	`I honestly never knew you could do for k,v in t...`
`18:14.36`	`Kirov`	`didn't blizzard write lua for wow?`
`18:15.03`	`Kirov`	`they don't document anything!`
`18:15.03`	`Kirov`	`~botslap kirov`
`18:15.45`	`cogwheel`	`Serif font 4tw....`
`18:16.07`	`cogwheel`	`s/4tw/> joo/`
`18:16.50`	`TS\|Skrom`	`<PROTECTED>`
`18:17.32`	`zenzelezz`	`Silvermoon is unplayable...`
`18:17.53`	`cogwheel`	`I do all my movement with the mouse now... playing on a trackpad would be virtually impossible for me...`
`18:17.54`	`zenzelezz`	`wonder if it's the whole Frankfurt center`
`18:18.09`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower\|AFK (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`18:18.40`	`Hatsuki`	`same here`
`18:18.45`	`Hatsuki`	`lag killing`
`18:19.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh man, how could I forget to download hitsmode ><`
`18:19.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=tardmrr@204.90.50.252)`
`18:20.13`	`TS\|Skrom`	`gasp and group finder!`
`18:21.34`	`JoshBorke`	`TS\|Skrom: !!! get simple combat log :-D`
`18:22.42`	`perI`	`~botsnack`
`18:22.42`	`purl`	`perI: thanks`
`18:23.05`	`purI`	`~botslap`
`18:23.50`	`purl`	`Hey what was that for, puri?`
`18:23.50`	`purI`	`~slap`
`18:23.59`	`purI`	`damn it`
`18:23.59`	`Cairenn`	`><`
`18:23.59`	`purI`	`I LIVE!`
`18:23.59`	`purI`	`capital i ftw`
`18:24.02`	`purI`	`heh`
`18:25.51`	`Cairenn`	`<PROTECTED>`
`18:26.17`	`JoshBorke`	`lol`
`18:26.27`	`Kirov`	`Cairenn - has there been any actual word on this from Blizzard?`
`18:26.34`	`Cairenn`	`no, and there won't be`
`18:26.48`	`Kirkburn`	`WHo what where?`
`18:27.02`	`JoshBorke`	`RDX`
`18:27.14`	`Cairenn`	`http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14733440&sid=1`
`18:27.20`	`Kirov`	`My take on it is it's legal, but not something Blizzard is big on encouraging.`
`18:27.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Josh, what's simple combat log have that hitsmode does not?`
`18:27.51`	`Kirov`	`TS\|Skrom - a 1.12 toc?`
`18:28.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`18:28.08`	`Kirov`	`oh, and ACE!`
`18:28.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`is the SCT that's with cosmos the 5.0 version by chance?`
`18:28.33`	`Gryphen`	`no`
`18:28.48`	`Kirov`	`heh`
`18:28.52`	`Kirkburn`	`To Rum I would just say "try and it find out if anyone will pay for it". My guess is not.`
`18:29.00`	`Kirov`	`cosmos is going to be stuck with 4.0 for a long time I think`
`18:29.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=tardmrr@204.90.50.252)`
`18:29.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh?`
`18:29.16`	`Gryphen`	`or drop it`
`18:29.25`	`TS\|Skrom`	`What happened?`
`18:29.33`	`Kirov`	`TS\|Skrom - it's Ace?`
`18:29.39`	`Gryphen`	`it wasnt added in the normal fasion to start with`
`18:29.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh`
`18:31.00`	`Kirov`	`frk`
`18:31.13`	`Kirov`	`gfind and mod renamed`
`18:31.14`	`Kirov`	`heh`
`18:31.27`	`JoshBorke`	`i'm so confused`
`18:31.47`	`Cairenn`	`and this is new and different ... how?`
`18:31.55`	`Kirov`	`tableName.# the new length operator?`
`18:32.12`	`Cide`	`Kirov: isn't it #tableName?`
`18:32.21`	`Kirov`	`no idea`
`18:32.48`	`Cide`	`local WoWI-Lounge = { }; JoinChannelByName(#WoWI-Lounge)`
`18:32.50`	`Cide`	`ok, terrible joke.`
`18:32.53`	`Cide`	`~botslap`
`18:33.02`	`purl`	`ACTION cowers away from cide`
`18:33.02`	`Cide`	`~botslap Cide`
`18:33.07`	`Cide`	`~slap Cide`
`18:33.10`	`purl`	`ACTION slaps Cide, keep your grubby fingers to yourself!`
`18:33.11`	`Cide`	`he lives`
`18:33.19`	`JoshBorke`	`~literal botslap`
`18:33.21`	`purl`	`"botslap" is "<action>whimpers \|\| <action>cowers away from $nick \|\| <reply>Hey what was that for, $nick? \|\| <reply>OUCH! That hurt, $nick!"`
`18:33.46`	`Cide`	`I wonder why it did lower case first`
`18:35.07`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@204.90.50.252)`
`18:36.37`	`Kirov`	`hm`
`18:37.10`	`Kirov`	`so, no more bastardization of setn / getn for hash tables`
`18:37.26`	`Tem`	`yes, isn't that fantastic?`
`18:37.32`	`Tem`	`I hate setn`
`18:37.40`	`Kirov`	`why?`
`18:37.54`	`Kirov`	`you have a lot of mods that use tableName.n to hold data?`
`18:38.42`	`krka`	`i always kept my own counter :P`
`18:39.25`	`JoshBorke`	`i can't believe RDX is causing so much drama`
`18:39.51`	`Kirov`	`Really?`
`18:40.18`	`Kirov`	`How many people out there do you think are going, "hey, I could sell my mod and make moolah!"`
`18:40.23`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower\|ZZzz (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`18:40.32`	`Kirov`	`free monay!`
`18:40.55`	`JoshBorke`	`it's everyone else complaining about it`
`18:41.03`	`Cairenn`	`well, and it does get ugly and stupid, legally`
`18:41.09`	`Kirov`	`They're missing the whole "people use the mods _because_ they're free"`
`18:41.51`	`cogwheel`	`Think Mazzle will charge money?`
`18:41.53`	`Cairenn`	`the author has intellectual property rights, but the mod doesn't work without wow, so wow has some claim, and if they are "selling" the mod, what precisely are they "selling"?`
`18:42.29`	`cogwheel`	`Cairenn, I think that argument could be likened to selling software for Macintoshes...`
`18:42.31`	`krka`	`RDX?`
`18:42.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`cog XD`
`18:42.50`	`Kirov`	`www.rdx-raid.com if memory serves`
`18:43.03`	`krka`	`selling mods should be fine`
`18:43.13`	`krka`	`stopping piracy would be difficult... but whatever`
`18:43.22`	`Cairenn`	`depending on their phrasing when they "sell" the mod, they could be "selling" the copyright to the actual code itself, in which case ...`
`18:43.44`	`zenzelezz`	`awesomeness... three hours additional downtime for hardware upgrades, four hours additional downtime because of unexpected things, and today every single raid instance is lagging beyond what's playable`
`18:43.47`	`Cairenn`	`as I said, it just gets ugly and stupid, and they are WAY too little for Blizz to bother with, and they are WAY too little to try to fight Blizz over it`
`18:43.50`	`zenzelezz`	`two days gone thanks to these "upgrades"`
`18:44.25`	`Cairenn`	`Blizz isn't gonna say jack about it, "officially", until it gets to the point that lawyers get involved`
`18:44.38`	`Cairenn`	`and what's ever gonna bring it to that point?`
`18:45.44`	`cogwheel`	`Unless they make it possible to close source addons by allowing precompiled Lua, any for sale mod is doomed to failure given the vastness of the modding community.`
`18:45.50`	`Hatsuki`	`what's gonna prevent people from ripping/warezing mod? if you have access to source it's all over`
`18:46.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dreyruugr (n=chatzill@66.77.144.6)`
`18:47.54`	`Kirkburn`	`If someone wants to attempt selling an addon ... well, they'll almost certainly fail`
`18:48.00`	`Cairenn`	`legally, authors can go after anyone that rips their mods, but who the hell has that type of cash, or the time to constantly scour the web to find out if their mod has been ripped in the first place`
`18:48.49`	`Kirkburn`	`Especially with the rate of development of addons, it would be very very hard to track`
`18:49.04`	`Cairenn`	`when ripped mods come to our (WoWI's) attention, we do what we can to help the authors out, because we so firmly believe in authors' rights, but even so`
`18:50.54`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`18:53.22`	`Beladona`	`oh thats nice`
`18:53.30`	`Shadowed`	`?`
`18:53.31`	`Cairenn`	`Beladona: ?`
`18:53.53`	`Beladona`	`apparently CT_MasterMod generates an error if you have it and no other ct mods installed`
`18:53.57`	`Beladona`	`=P`
`18:54.10`	`Shadowed`	`why do you only have CT_Mastermod installed? :p`
`18:54.20`	`Cairenn`	`anyone know where the hell Legorol has been?`
`18:54.28`	`Shadowed`	`~seen Legorol`
`18:54.56`	`purl`	`legorol <i=legorol@cpc3-cmbg6-0-0-cust710.cmbg.cable.ntl.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #wowi-lounge, 7d 16h 57m 23s ago, saying: '"car with the arrow rolls down the slope"'.`
`18:54.56`	`Cairenn`	`...`
`18:54.56`	`Beladona`	`I was testing my addon's ability to add a button to the ct control panel, without installing the entire ct mod`
`18:54.56`	`Shadowed`	`purl doesn't know`
`18:55.07`	`purl`	`doesn't know is probably not at all`
`18:55.08`	`Beladona`	`which works just fine but...`
`18:55.08`	`Cairenn`	`I meant has anyone seen him anywhere besides in channel, obviously :p`
`18:55.11`	`Shadowed`	`i think that explains where he's been`
`18:55.14`	`Beladona`	`maybe his car rolled down the slope...`
`18:55.44`	`Cairenn`	`lol`
`18:56.12`	`Beladona`	`is Cide here?`
`18:56.16`	`Cide`	`yes`
`18:56.27`	`Beladona`	`did you see what I said about the MasterMod thing?`
`18:56.31`	`Cide`	`nope`
`18:56.34`	`Beladona`	`not that anyone would likely run it alone, but`
`18:56.40`	`Beladona`	`its still a functionality limitation`
`18:57.24`	`Beladona`	`I installed CT_MasterMod alone, to test an integration thing in one of my addons, and it threw an error, in line 127 of CT_Master.lua`
`18:57.38`	`Cide`	`heh, interesting`
`18:57.41`	`Beladona`	`which I assume is due to no other ct mods being installed except CT_MasterMod`
`18:58.04`	`Beladona`	`exact error`
`18:58.30`	`Beladona`	`Interface\AddOns\CT_MasterMod\CT_Master.lua:129: table index is nil`
`18:58.35`	`Beladona`	`sorry, it was 129 not 127`
`18:59.11`	`Cide`	`thanks`
`18:59.14`	`Cide`	`I'll take a look`
`19:00.30`	`TS\|Skrom`	`okay so stupid skrom story of the day`
`19:00.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I thought I had some bug bites on my leg about two weeks ago`
`19:01.11`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and carelessly scratched them... and they kept getting worse, scabbed over messes by the day`
`19:01.29`	`TS\|Skrom`	`finally on tuesday they start hurting.. like not just itching but painful hurting all day long`
`19:01.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`by the end of the day I can barely walk`
`19:03.56`	`Cairenn`	`and?`
`19:04.11`	`TS\|Skrom`	`sorry boss nearb y`
`19:04.22`	`Cairenn`	`ah`
`19:05.15`	`TS\|Skrom`	`okay she left, I hate that lol`
`19:05.21`	`Beladona`	`on the note of RDX though. If they can get away with charging for their work, others can get away with ripping it. So in essence they are promoting their own downfall`
`19:05.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`anywa y so I go to the hospital on tuesday night`
`19:05.43`	`Beladona`	`besides the point of no one wanting to buy something that can be obtained freely anyway`
`19:05.43`	`Shadowed`	`Beladona RDX is terrible`
`19:05.47`	`Shadowed`	`the code is HORRIBLE`
`19:05.50`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and it turns out they weren't bug bites, but in fact some kind of allergic reaction to a knee pad I had worn to work the pervious weekend`
`19:05.57`	`Beladona`	`oh I agree`
`19:06.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and it had blistered up kinda like poison ivy does`
`19:06.10`	`JoshBorke`	`o.O`
`19:06.14`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and by scratching it I had seriously infected it which is why it started hurting`
`19:06.18`	`Cairenn`	`heh, I was sitting here thinking "poison ivy"`
`19:06.47`	`JoshBorke`	`on the subject of RDX being terrible, I think it has some good ideas`
`19:06.57`	`Beladona`	`this is why Beladona likes to wash his hands ever couple hours`
`19:07.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`so now I've got 10 days of antibiotics and an oinment for teh rash ><`
`19:07.11`	`Cairenn`	`TS\|Skrom: fun fun`
`19:07.25`	`JoshBorke`	`didn't your mom ever tell you not to pick/scratch your scabs?`
`19:07.27`	`Beladona`	`your finger nails are on of the most dirty and nasty places for germs. Worse than a toilet seat in many cases`
`19:07.41`	`Shadowed`	`toilet seats are very clean actually`
`19:07.44`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I mean I'm not so stupid that I usually scratch bug bites til they get infected, it's just that this time I didn't realize... hey these aren't bug bites they are open blisters til it was too late`
`19:08.00`	`Beladona`	`depends on what it is being compared to Shadowed`
`19:08.08`	`cogwheel`	`The inside of keyboards are nasty....`
`19:08.16`	`Shadowed`	`compared to your face/hands`
`19:08.17`	`Beladona`	`but its also a perception thing`
`19:08.31`	`Beladona`	`most people would lick their finger nails before they would lick a toilet seat`
`19:08.32`	`Shadowed`	`yeah`
`19:08.36`	`Shadowed`	`that's true`
`19:08.46`	`Shadowed`	`hm`
`19:08.52`	`krka`	`people are too afraid of germs`
`19:08.58`	`Beladona`	`actually`
`19:09.00`	`Shadowed`	`chat mod causing issues with mine, and i can bet anything that it's because the chat mod does some sort of silly hooking`
`19:09.04`	`Beladona`	`I think people are too NOT afraid`
`19:09.43`	`Beladona`	`but then I can't stand things being dirty, or out of place. Not to the point of being a mental issue mind you, but still`
`19:10.49`	`krka`	`i don't like dirt that i can feel or see or smell... but invisible germs never bother me`
`19:10.56`	`krka`	`most likely won't kill me`
`19:11.14`	`Beladona`	`hey Cide - that issue with MasterMod may have been my own addon's use of the RegisterMod function, but it still shows that you should have a check to make sure that the mod name exists, or return nothing, rather than an error?`
`19:11.25`	`Beladona`	`just my thought`
`19:11.50`	`Beladona`	`why?`
`19:12.10`	`Shadowed`	`just annoying when uploading a fix that i don't want to change the file version for`
`19:12.21`	`Beladona`	`you commit something? it gets a new revision. Seems pretty standard to me`
`19:12.52`	`Shadowed`	`just was a small typo i was correcting, not really something that i find worth updating the version for`
`19:14.15`	`Cide`	`Beladona: all that is coded terribly, I'll rewrite it sometime`
`19:14.32`	`Beladona`	`sorry to give you more work =P`
`19:14.50`	`Beladona`	`not like you aren't already recoding tons of stuff`
`19:24.40`	`Cide`	`what? me recoding stuff? noo. :)`
`19:24.58`	`JoshBorke`	`TS is doing all the work, right?`
`19:25.01`	`JoshBorke`	`you're just the idea man ;-)`
`19:25.02`	`Cide`	`yup`
`19:28.23`	`Cairenn`	`Cide: have you had the bug report yet regarding Party Buffs and hunters' pets?`
`19:28.34`	`Cide`	`depends on which one`
`19:28.39`	`Cairenn`	`double icons`
`19:29.09`	`Cide`	`well, blizzard's frame shows pet buffs now`
`19:29.12`	`Cide`	`with debuff icons`
`19:29.19`	`Cide`	`I don't know if that's an intended feature or a bug`
`19:31.07`	`Cairenn`	`so you are aware of it already then, yes? says no more on the subject then, since it'd be redundant`
`19:32.29`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`hrm`
`19:32.49`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`is there a plugin for fubar that has time to level estimates? that's really the only thing i'm missing after converting from titan`
`19:33.34`	`JoshBorke`	`Mr_Rabies2: FuBar_ExperienceFu`
`19:33.50`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`it doesn't show time to level, at least i can't find it`
`19:33.57`	`Cairenn`	`cogwheel: lol, nice summary of the discussion held here`
`19:35.19`	`JoshBorke`	`it was there when i used it...`
`19:35.20`	`cogwheel`	`I try...`
`19:35.21`	`cogwheel`	`:P`
`19:40.50`	`Cide`	`Cairenn: well, yeah.. we don't know if the blizzard change is a bug or a feature.. though, it seems like a weird bug, but then again, the border's still red`
`19:41.02`	`Cairenn`	`nod`
`19:46.11`	`Shadowed`	`someone go yell at the poster in http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14622887&sid=1 for me`
`19:46.15`	`Shadowed`	`since he's apparently an idiot`
`19:46.50`	`krka`	`will that cure it?`
`19:47.08`	`Shadowed`	`not really, but still!`
`19:51.12`	`cogwheel`	`hmm... page is timing out...`
`19:54.22`	`cogwheel`	`and now i'm getting server errors :(`
`19:54.41`	`cogwheel`	`Blizzad stole my post!`
`19:57.21`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge _Valgrind (n=bortas@c-a70d70d5.09-31-6c6b7010.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)`
`20:00.39`	`cogwheel`	`Blizzad stole my post again! grrrrrrrrrrr`
`20:00.56`	`Cairenn`	`hi ... text editor ... duh`
`20:01.14`	`cogwheel`	`It's only a sentence long... but it keeps giving me server errors`
`20:06.07`	`Beladona`	`adios! time to go home!`
`20:07.09`	`JoshBorke`	`bye bela`
`20:07.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dreadlyone (n=deadly2@bas1-montreal19-1177818720.dsl.bell.ca)`
`20:15.00`	`wereHamster`	`so funny.. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7373128225578708570`
`20:15.45`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`<JoshBorke> it was there when i used it...`
`20:15.56`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`figured it out, i was using Fubar Experienced not ExperienceFu`
`20:20.13`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Qzot (n=nickell@sandbox.xerox.com)`
`20:20.41`	`Qzot`	`Heyo.`
`20:21.23`	`JoshBorke`	`ah`
`20:21.24`	`JoshBorke`	`morning`
`20:21.32`	`Cairenn`	`hi Qzot`
`20:22.25`	`Qzot`	`I get to sit in a meeting. :D`
`20:23.18`	`JoshBorke`	`AnduinLothar: ping`
`20:27.12`	`Kirkburn`	`Woo, WMP11 Beta 2 :)`
`20:30.00`	`_Valgrind`	`Tell if I got this right: I can include Ace2, Dewdrop, Compost and Jastle in my addon, but they will pick up a global version if there is one. Sounds to good to be true, but that is how I interpret FuBar's toc that I just opened to check for dependencies. :)`
`20:31.04`	`jaeger`	`the hell? I added a scrollframe and buttons to a previous frame and now it's gone missing... odd`
`20:31.36`	`cogwheel`	`so, if i'm reading the 5.1 manual correctly, '...' is now an operator that is essentially equivalent to unpack(arg)? e.g. function returnParams(...) return ... end will behave as expected?`
`20:32.04`	`JoshBorke`	`o.O`
`20:32.21`	`JoshBorke`	`_Valgrind: yes, if you set your addon to have those as an optional dependency`
`20:32.27`	`cogwheel`	`_Valgrind: that is correct. Each library checks to see if a newer version already exists`
`20:32.44`	`JoshBorke`	`_Valgrind: the embedded portion checks to see if there is a newer version available`
`20:33.04`	`_Valgrind`	`Excellent. I think I'll convert some of my addons to Ace later tonight. Thanks.`
`20:33.20`	`JoshBorke`	`np`
`20:33.28`	`cogwheel`	`JoshBorke, you don't even need to set the optional dependency... each instance of the addon will do the check and replace existing ones of a lower version...`
`20:33.30`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Some emporer in a dark and foreboding chair somewhere just cackled in glee`
`20:38.43`	`ckknight`	`Codayus, right`
`20:38.54`	`ckknight`	`_Valgrind, it's Jostle, not Jastle`
`20:39.08`	`JoshBorke`	`then why do they all have the libs as optional deps?`
`20:39.30`	`ckknight`	`in case you have it in your directory`
`20:39.37`	`ckknight`	`it'll check that one first`
`20:39.40`	`cogwheel`	`How's this for convoluted: print((function(...) return ... end)(1,2,3))`
`20:39.50`	`ckknight`	`hehe, cogwheel`
`20:39.51`	`kergoth`	`not very`
`20:39.55`	`kergoth`	`:P`
`20:41.24`	`cogwheel`	`I like that a lot better for hooking functions.... function newfunc(var, ...) stuff return oldfunc(var, ...) end instead of function newfunc(var, ...) stuff return oldfunc(var, unpack(arg)) end`
`20:41.56`	`kergoth`	`yep, lua 5.1 is nice`
`20:42.05`	`kergoth`	`... is weak though, they shoudlve added proper tuples`
`20:42.40`	`cogwheel`	`O.o I'm tired and that went right over my head...`
`20:42.44`	`kergoth`	`you cant have function(...) return function(...) end end for example, it gets quite confused`
`20:42.54`	`kergoth`	`needs a way to assign a name to ...`
`20:43.13`	`kergoth`	`</rant>`
`20:43.56`	`kergoth`	`s/\.$/for wow./`
`20:44.10`	`cogwheel`	`sry... no patterns :P`
`20:44.16`	`cogwheel`	`only literals`
`20:44.30`	`JoshBorke`	`testing.`
`20:44.37`	`JoshBorke`	`s/.$/blah./`
`20:44.43`	`JoshBorke`	`~botslap`
`20:44.46`	`purl`	`Hey what was that for, joshborke?`
`20:45.13`	`kergoth`	`~insult purl`
`20:45.14`	`cogwheel`	`~suck`
`20:45.16`	`purl`	`:(`
`20:45.31`	`cogwheel`	`~suck`
`20:45.34`	`purl`	`hey, i'm on lunchbreak, screw off`
`20:45.43`	`kergoth`	`purl sucks`
`20:45.44`	`purl`	`For $5 I'll do more than that!`
`20:45.58`	`TS\|Skrom`	`O.o`
`20:46.15`	`TS\|Skrom`	`./msg purl hey baby, a/s/l?`
`20:46.19`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er...`
`20:46.41`	`cogwheel`	`hehe... do other clients besides chatzilla turn O.o into an actual smiley icon that looks all confused?`
`20:46.43`	`kergoth`	`unknown/female/the ether`
`20:46.50`	`TS\|Skrom`	`trillian does`
`20:47.00`	`JoshBorke`	`bye all :-)`
`20:47.00`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@ohm.stl.gtri.gatech.edu)`
`20:47.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@adsl-68-127-184-151.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)`
`20:51.49`	`cogwheel`	`interesting.... I ran that code through luac5.1 and it has a reference to "arg"... I guess they still use that internally?`
`20:51.57`	`Thrae`	`Ahh, Disgaea 2 and Xenosaga III came today.`
`20:52.09`	`kergoth`	`cogwheel: no, arg can be kept around if it was compiled with a COMPAT_ option`
`20:52.14`	`kergoth`	`cogwheel: same for table.getn`
`20:52.34`	`kergoth`	`which is probably what blizz will be doing to retain compatibility with more scripts`
`20:52.44`	`cogwheel`	`This was in the standard 5.1 download... i'm surprised they would've compiled it that way...`
`20:52.50`	`kergoth`	`"standard"?`
`20:52.54`	`Thrae`	`BC Client is going to use Lua 5.1?`
`20:52.56`	`kergoth`	`there is no official binary distribution.`
`20:53.00`	`cogwheel`	`the one linked from lua.org`
`20:53.02`	`kergoth`	`perhaps you mean the luabinaries project`
`20:53.08`	`cogwheel`	`yeah`
`20:53.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@dialup-4.254.195.89.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`20:53.19`	`kergoth`	`Thrae: yep`
`20:53.20`	`kergoth`	`Thrae: :D`
`20:53.30`	`kergoth`	`i'm happiest about the incremental gc`
`20:53.39`	`kergoth`	`though ... will be nice too`
`20:53.49`	`kergoth`	`no more function foo(a1, a2, a3, a4, a5, etc) to avoid using ...`
`20:54.09`	`krka`	`i have discovered that you can use arg in 5.1... but not at the same time as ...`
`20:54.15`	`krka`	`example:`
`20:54.31`	`krka`	`function f(...) local a = ... return arg end`
`20:54.37`	`krka`	`function f(...) local a = 1 return arg end`
`20:54.41`	`krka`	`will return different things`
`20:54.50`	`krka`	`in the first example, it will return nil`
`20:55.13`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oh, really?`
`20:55.18`	`Thrae`	`We should give slouken a big batch of cookies, you know he's doing it for us...the addon customization engine has been pretty solid for a while.`
`20:55.18`	`krka`	`yes`
`20:55.24`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yay, that's as good as function overloading. : D`
`20:55.25`	`Shadowed`	`he wont let us`
`20:55.27`	`krka`	`basically, don't use both arg and ...`
`20:55.34`	`krka`	`and try to avoid arg :)`
`20:55.41`	`kergoth`	`unsurprising really, they probably just didnt want to put too much effort into making LUA_COMPAT_VARARG feature rich`
`20:55.49`	`kergoth`	`considering they want it out`
`20:56.07`	`kergoth`	`ah well`
`20:56.15`	`kergoth`	`no point using arg anyway, unless you're too lazy to convert old code`
`20:56.16`	`krka`	`yeah, i was pondering how they could keep arg and still save memory`
`20:56.20`	`krka`	`now i know :)`
`20:57.28`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What's the link to the explaination of the xml functions. I don' remember the guy, but it has like a listing of them all.`
`20:57.49`	`_Valgrind`	`ckknight: Noted. ;-)`
`20:59.13`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight_ (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`20:59.37`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I have a question, which is better. Saving then loading variables, or running a function to compile the information after launch?`
`21:01.08`	`cogwheel`	`probably depends on the situation...`
`21:01.30`	`cogwheel`	`is this what you were looking for geodamancer? http://www.wowwiki.com/Widget_API`
`21:02.18`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Nah, but I'll look at it. I don't remember the site.`
`21:02.49`	`cogwheel`	`oh... faraframse?`
`21:03.02`	`cogwheel`	`s/se/es/`
`21:03.05`	`cogwheel`	`http://fara.webeddie.com/ui/`
`21:03.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yeah, fara.`
`21:03.46`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I need to make a gui for my script. I'm screwing my other characters over. xD`
`21:05.13`	`cogwheel`	`man, i love having a part-time employed wife who stays home and plays with auctioneer all day... just got a text message from her: "A lvl 41 Epic (purple) shield I bought out for 30silver!!!"`
`21:05.18`	`cogwheel`	`XD`
`21:05.31`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What!?`
`21:05.42`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is she at one of the Linked places?`
`21:05.42`	`cogwheel`	`that's what i said!`
`21:06.14`	`krka`	`that's kinda cheap`
`21:06.29`	`_Valgrind`	`ckknight_: Do you keep a stable branch of FuBar and the FuBar plugins you write? I'm importing what my guild wants in our SVN repository from releases, and that seems like a vaste of time if you keep a stable branch I could just fetch your stables.`
`21:06.48`	`ckknight_`	`um, no`
`21:06.55`	`ckknight_`	`bleeding edge ftw.`
`21:06.55`	`_Valgrind`	`To bad. :-P`
`21:06.59`	`ckknight_`	`yea`
`21:07.04`	`ckknight_`	`but that's just how I roll`
`21:07.21`	`ckknight_`	`it's been just bug releases for a while now`
`21:07.23`	`cogwheel`	`heh... "kinda"... 23,667% profit!`
`21:07.26`	`ckknight_`	`so I wouldn't worry about it`
`21:07.53`	`_Valgrind`	`No, problem. I'll make a script that downloads the releases instead if I need to do it in batch for later.`
`21:11.19`	`ckknight`	`okay`
`21:11.26`	`TS\|Skrom`	`is it just me or does loch modan run out of quests really fast ><`
`21:11.39`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I don't know, I never go there.`
`21:11.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Westfall seems too, though.`
`21:11.50`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I thought I'd try it once`
`21:11.59`	`TS\|Skrom`	`yeah but ther's always redridge`
`21:12.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`can't quite start wetlands though`
`21:12.12`	`cogwheel`	`TS\|Skrom, have you been to the farstrider lodge?`
`21:12.18`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahhh.`
`21:12.37`	`TS\|Skrom`	`apparently not`
`21:12.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`where's that?`
`21:12.41`	`cogwheel`	`I usually go back and forth between westfall and loch modan 'till about 18-19`
`21:12.42`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Iriel (n=daniel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)`
`21:12.53`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Iriel] by ChanServ`
`21:12.57`	`cogwheel`	`Farstrider lodge is on the east side of the loch. it's where you get the quest for ol' sooty`
`21:12.59`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Do you know where Iron Brand's site is?`
`21:13.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`bah was windowed out and almost got wtfpwned by a trogg XD`
`21:13.11`	`cogwheel`	`I never even knew about it untill about my 5th char`
`21:13.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`It's south east of there.`
`21:13.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm at the excavatiuon atm`
`21:13.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Alright, head south east, and look at the map, I think you can see part of the symbol for the place on it.`
`21:13.54`	`GeoDaMancer`	`There're like three, or four quests there.`
`21:14.09`	`Hexarobi`	`ol' sooty!`
`21:14.09`	`TS\|Skrom`	`good to know`
`21:14.17`	`cogwheel`	`<3 Coreiel ... " Moving to the UI/Macros forum. Please think of this yourself next time. ;)"`
`21:14.46`	`GeoDaMancer`	`You know, I didn't know there was anything in the Gold Coast quarries until two days ago.`
`21:15.25`	`cogwheel`	`I didn't know sunder armor could be applied more than once 'till my second warrior was about 40... XD`
`21:15.36`	`cogwheel`	`(my first warr only got to 38, btw)`
`21:15.58`	`TS\|Skrom`	`omg... I had this trogg at 4 hit points and he reisted like 7 spells in a row ><`
`21:16.07`	`cogwheel`	`lol`
`21:16.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that's what I get for picking on an 18 at level 14 ><`
`21:16.45`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Heheheh.`
`21:16.49`	`Hexarobi`	`trogg start`
`21:16.59`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hrm methinks I'm a little low for the excavation ><`
`21:17.49`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yeah... Then you're a bit high for the farstrider. It's killing the bears, and birds in the area.`
`21:18.07`	`Hexarobi`	`the hunter quests dont start there till lvl 15`
`21:18.25`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I didn't know that.`
`21:19.09`	`TS\|Skrom`	`grrr I need a wand >< which is why I went to the excavation in the first place XD`
`21:19.26`	`Hexarobi`	`ya at lvl 15 u start quests, get a nice agi bracer i think, and maybe a new belt? then final quests gets a nice guy and bigger ammo pouch`
`21:19.46`	`Hexarobi`	`those were a blast on my hunter`
`21:22.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`not having my five button mouse is driving me batty ><`
`21:22.18`	`Kirov`	`forums go boom?`
`21:22.43`	`cogwheel`	`kirov, more like POP! .... POP POP...... POP POP..... POPOPOP!`
`21:22.58`	`Kirov`	`TS\|Skrom - I have an 8 button mouse. <3`
`21:23.11`	`TS\|Skrom`	`O.o`
`21:23.13`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`21:23.21`	`Kirov`	`Logitech MX510`
`21:24.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`sweet aunt jemima!`
`21:24.07`	`cogwheel`	`I recently changed over to using my mouse for movement and my KB exclusively for abilities. Luvin' it, but strafing is relatively impossible without sacrificing abilities (and my main's a lock so...)`
`21:24.10`	`TS\|Skrom`	`does wow support all 8 buttons?`
`21:24.26`	`zenzelezz`	`argh, Thundgot asking us to do traceroutes again... I'm worried this latency problem after yesterday's upgrade will last >.<`
`21:24.31`	`Kirov`	`TS\|Skrom - nope`
`21:24.34`	`Kirov`	`Only 5`
`21:24.35`	`TS\|Skrom`	`darm :(`
`21:24.45`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er darn`
`21:25.00`	`Kirov`	`I have them bound to random key combinations`
`21:26.48`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`21:28.00`	`cogwheel`	`~emulate cogwheel`
`21:28.01`	`purl`	`ACTION Look... I .... use... a lot... of .... elipses...........`
`21:29.24`	`Kirkburn`	`What, exactly, is an elipsis when it's at home?`
`21:29.38`	`cladhaire`	`cogwheel: I posted clarification in the 5.1 thread (after your last post)`
`21:29.50`	`cogwheel`	`i caught that... thanks :)`
`21:30.12`	`cogwheel`	`kirkburn, do i sense a PUNch line coming?`
`21:30.33`	`TS\|Skrom`	`maybe, but I wouldn';t be worried, kirk didn't train in fist weapons`
`21:30.46`	`cogwheel`	`~rimshot`
`21:30.49`	`purl`	`ch-ch-chhh`
`21:31.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Shockingly, no >.< I can't search online atm cos WMP11 is installing`
`21:31.31`	`cogwheel`	`Microsoft wh***`
`21:31.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`.~emulate Kirkburn - I am Microsoft's Poster Child`
`21:31.36`	`cogwheel`	`:P`
`21:31.38`	`cogwheel`	`lol`
`21:32.08`	`Kirkburn`	`Actually ...`
`21:32.13`	`Kirkburn`	`~emulate Kirkburn`
`21:32.15`	`purl`	`That sounded more normal in my head ...`
`21:32.15`	`cladhaire`	`cogwheel: I had to check twice, when I tried with my initial lua binary, i got the same behavior you did.. =)`
`21:32.36`	`Kirkburn`	`Me, MS fanboi? Neva!`
`21:33.22`	`Kirkburn`	`Right, restarting!`
`21:33.32`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hahaha`
`21:33.40`	`cogwheel`	`I need to SS that...`
`21:33.41`	`cogwheel`	`lol`
`21:33.45`	`TS\|Skrom`	`you can tell he's an MS fanboi since he's cheerful about restarting!`
`21:34.12`	`cladhaire`	`haha`
`21:34.32`	`cladhaire`	`what should i have for dinner.`
`21:34.53`	`cogwheel`	`Redridge Goulash`
`21:35.09`	`cogwheel`	`Can't go wrong with buzzard meat, pig snouts, and spider meat...`
`21:36.35`	`cladhaire`	`the forums are craptastic today`
`21:36.37`	`Tain`	`I just turned the oven on for a frozen pizza.`
`21:37.08`	`Hexarobi`	`cogwheel, where did you get a recipie for hotdogs?`
`21:37.47`	`cogwheel`	`Well, my dad's name is Frank so...`
`21:38.06`	`Hexarobi`	`i wish i had a first name =(`
`21:38.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`21:38.21`	`Hexarobi`	`it'd be o-s-c-a-r`
`21:39.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower (n=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`21:41.19`	`cladhaire`	`mmm chicken patty on wheat roll with a half pound of broccoli`
`21:41.38`	`Cairenn`	`wb mp`
`21:41.58`	`Tain`	`I was with you until you mispelled bacon as "broccoli"`
`21:42.17`	`cladhaire`	`Tain: Hrm.. good point.`
`21:43.10`	`MentalPower`	`thanks Cair`
`21:50.19`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge TS\|Skrom (n=Skrom@66.148.226.210.nw.nuvox.net)`
`21:50.43`	`cogwheel`	`kergoth: print(((function(...) return function(...) return ... end end)())(1,2,3)) seems to work as expected for me....`
`21:51.52`	`cogwheel`	`oic...`
`21:51.59`	`cladhaire`	`Corrodias: Where did kergoth speak? =)`
`21:52.13`	`cladhaire`	`damnit`
`21:52.16`	`cladhaire`	`cogwheel: Where did kergoth speak?`
`21:52.31`	`cogwheel`	`print(((function(...) return function() return ... end end)(1,2,3)()) doesnt`
`21:52.57`	`cogwheel`	`about an hour and 10 mins ago :P`
`21:53.20`	`kergoth`	`er, what i meant was, its not possible to access the outside closure's arguments, because its impossible to name the tupleish ... without constructing a table to grab them`
`21:53.23`	`kergoth`	`:\`
`21:53.42`	`cogwheel`	`yeah... that's what my second example suggests`
`21:54.07`	`kergoth`	`rici proposed adding a real immutable tuple type to the language`
`21:54.11`	`kergoth`	`would be incredibly useful`
`21:54.14`	`kergoth`	`got shot down though :'(`
`21:54.18`	`cladhaire`	`it'll get there`
`21:54.21`	`cladhaire`	`its in common lisp isn't it =)`
`21:54.30`	`Iriel`	`Would it be worth the complexity, I suppose that's the real question`
`21:54.51`	`Iriel`	`And anyway, since it could become an upvalue anywhere it's really "useful", you'd need to make it a table anyway`
`21:55.46`	`Iriel`	`an immutable tuple isn't going to save you any memory allocation woes`
`22:04.02`	`cogwheel`	`I still wish there were some way to do function(...) a = {...} return function() return unpack(a) end end without the table constructor which is essentially equivalent to the old style vararg`
`22:04.23`	`clad\|gym`	`well, where you need to do that you can just name each argument like we do now`
`22:04.41`	`clad\|gym`	`I agree, that would be nice, but not really possible with what we have`
`22:04.46`	`Cairenn`	`" WoW Lua 5.1 is currently compiled with these options:`
`22:04.46`	`Cairenn`	`#define LUAI_GCPAUSE 200`
`22:04.46`	`Cairenn`	`#define LUAI_GCMUL200`
`22:04.46`	`Cairenn`	`#undef LUA_COMPAT_GETN`
`22:04.46`	`Cairenn`	`#undef LUA_COMPAT_VARARG`
`22:04.47`	`Cairenn`	`#undef LUA_COMPAT_MOD`
`22:04.49`	`Cairenn`	`#undef LUA_COMPAT_LSTR`
`22:04.51`	`Cairenn`	`#undef LUA_COMPAT_GFIND`
`22:04.53`	`Cairenn`	`There are also these changes:`
`22:04.55`	`Cairenn`	`Added difftime()`
`22:04.57`	`Cairenn`	`Added gmatch() as an alias for str.gmatch()`
`22:04.57`	`clad\|gym`	`yay!`
`22:04.59`	`Cairenn`	`Added strmatch as an alias for str.match()`
`22:05.01`	`Cairenn`	`Added strrev() as an alias for str.reverse()`
`22:05.03`	`Cairenn`	`The alias mod() now maps to math.fmod()"`
`22:05.13`	`Iriel`	`But also, from a language perspective, you can't do it without creating a collectable object`
`22:05.31`	`Iriel`	`because the stack which ... references ceases to exist when the outer functin stops executing, but the inner closure might still need it`
`22:05.48`	`Iriel`	`thus my comment earlier that having some magic tuple type doesn't buy you anything anywhere that it/'s actually useful`
`22:06.15`	`clad\|gym`	`thanks for the paste Cairenn =)`
`22:06.32`	`Cairenn`	`you guys would see it soon enough`
`22:06.48`	`Cairenn`	`I didn't really need to copy it over`
`22:07.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Insa (n=insa@80.200.68.172)`
`22:08.15`	`zenzelezz`	`I'm sure it was entirely accidental`
`22:11.22`	`clad\|gym`	`Iriel: Make sure when we get there, that we say that table.setn() will be done, string.gfind and the change in nested comments.. those'll bite more than one person :P`
`22:12.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri (i=andrew@124.197.4.80)`
`22:13.07`	`Iriel`	`Yeah, I should be in the beta so I'm going to make sure I document the pain and suffering differences.`
`22:13.52`	`Kirkburn`	`So basically, one day, when WoW converts to 5.1 - are loads of addons going to break - or can it be prepared for?`
`22:14.09`	`clad\|gym`	`it can be prepared with local aliases =)`
`22:14.17`	`clad\|gym`	`kinda :P`
`22:14.42`	`Kirkburn`	`So ... er ... to all intents and purposes ... no-one will =P`
`22:14.44`	`Iriel`	`There are very few places where things will break 'unexpectedly'`
`22:14.59`	`Iriel`	`or should I say 'in a way that cannot be coded against'`
`22:15.11`	`Iriel`	`the ... part is really it, and very few people use ... due to its issues`
`22:15.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@204.155.78.126)`
`22:15.16`	`Hexarobi`	`as opposed to the rest of the planet, where things break expectedly?`
`22:15.53`	`Kirkburn`	`Pedantic bastard :P`
`22:16.08`	`Iriel`	`I picked a bad word with 'unexpectedly' 8-)`
`22:16.10`	`ckknight`	`Iriel, I hope they break the vararg compatibility`
`22:16.18`	`clad\|gym`	`string.gfind, math.mod, and [[[[Comment]]]] are really it.`
`22:16.21`	`ckknight`	`but how likely do you think that is?`
`22:16.25`	`clad\|gym`	`ckknight: Welcome to 10 minutes ago =)`
`22:16.25`	`Shadowed`	`not very :p`
`22:16.28`	`cogwheel`	`ckknight missed the boat`
`22:16.29`	`clad\|gym`	`they did`
`22:16.34`	`clad\|gym`	`he posted, cair pasted`
`22:16.35`	`clad\|gym`	`=)`
`22:16.44`	`clad\|gym`	`no compat flags are defined`
`22:17.07`	`clad\|gym`	`oh and table.setn`
`22:17.08`	`cogwheel`	`or more pedantically, all compat flags are undefined :P`
`22:17.13`	`clad\|gym`	`correct =)`
`22:17.19`	`Kirov`	`Can someone explain what's good about about the new method for the dumb people? (me)`
`22:17.29`	`ckknight`	`cogwheel, ah.`
`22:17.46`	`cogwheel`	`function(...) dostuf end no longer creates a table`
`22:17.47`	`clad\|gym`	`Kirov: Right now, if you want to write a functnoi that takes variable arguments, a table is created that holds them`
`22:17.50`	`ckknight`	`Kirov, efficiency and such`
`22:17.59`	`clad\|gym`	`in 5.1 we can now access the variable arguments "on the stack" without creating a table.`
`22:18.19`	`Kirov`	`how does one access them?`
`22:18.22`	`MentalPower`	`yes, but the part that I don't understand is how`
`22:18.24`	`cogwheel`	`...`
`22:18.25`	`clad\|gym`	`...[1]`
`22:18.26`	`clad\|gym`	`...[2]`
`22:18.34`	`MentalPower`	`wait a sec`
`22:18.35`	`ckknight`	`lol, cogwheel: All our cookie are belong to you`
`22:18.36`	`ckknight`	`hehe.`
`22:18.40`	`MentalPower`	`sisn't that still a list?`
`22:18.41`	`cogwheel`	`or a, b, c, d, e = ...`
`22:18.43`	`MentalPower`	`isin't`
`22:18.48`	`Kirov`	`interesting`
`22:18.50`	`ckknight`	`select(..., 1), I thought`
`22:18.50`	`ckknight`	`isn't it?`
`22:18.54`	`clad\|gym`	`No, its a pseudo variable.`
`22:19.02`	`clad\|gym`	`you can access it in a number of ways.`
`22:19.06`	`MentalPower`	`oh, interesting`
`22:19.07`	`Iriel`	`... is a new keyword that provides access to the varag stack`
`22:19.09`	`Iriel`	`it's not a variable`
`22:19.15`	`Iriel`	`it just smells like one`
`22:19.20`	`MentalPower`	`thanks Iriel that mekes sense`
`22:19.28`	`MentalPower`	`makes*`
`22:19.44`	`clad\|gym`	`oh, you can't index it.`
`22:19.45`	`clad\|gym`	`my mistake.`
`22:19.57`	`Kirov`	`so...`
`22:20.02`	`clad\|gym`	`you can select it, and assign it`
`22:20.07`	`clad\|gym`	`local a,b,c,d = ...`
`22:20.11`	`clad\|gym`	`or select(..., 1)`
`22:20.33`	`Kirov`	`does #... work?`
`22:20.38`	`ckknight`	`select(..., '#') gets the length, doesn't it?`
`22:20.41`	`cogwheel`	`it's semantically equivalent to unpack(arg) afaik`
`22:21.02`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri\|home (i=andrew@124.197.20.124)`
`22:21.02`	`ckknight`	`cogwheel, right, only more efficient since no table is created`
`22:21.29`	`Kirov`	`for i=1, select(..., #) do?`
`22:21.38`	`Kirov`	`or for i=1, #... do`
`22:21.46`	`Kirov`	`or either`
`22:21.47`	`clad\|gym`	`i'm playing with it`
`22:21.58`	`cogwheel`	`slouken just answered...`
`22:22.00`	`Iriel`	`... is a list, just like you get from return 1,2,3,4,5,6`
`22:22.17`	`cogwheel`	`for i in select("#", ...) do local v = select(i,...) end`
`22:22.23`	`ckknight`	`ah, right`
`22:22.31`	`ckknight`	`select(i, ...), not select(..., i)`
`22:22.49`	`cogwheel`	`i'm just quoting the pirate...`
`22:23.00`	`ckknight`	`which way is it?`
`22:24.26`	`Kirov`	`<3 the pirate - "The alias mod() now maps to math.fmod()"`
`22:24.45`	`ckknight`	`it's definitely select(i, ...)`
`22:24.53`	`ckknight`	`what's the difference between math.mod() and math.fmod()?`
`22:25.03`	`Kirov`	`ckknight - 5.0 and 5.1`
`22:25.12`	`ckknight`	`okay`
`22:25.13`	`Kirov`	`it's the same function renamed`
`22:25.19`	`ckknight`	`in the CLI, it's both in 5.1`
`22:25.25`	`ckknight`	`math.mod == math.fmod`
`22:25.46`	`Iriel`	`math.mod is a compatibility crutch for math.fmod`
`22:26.00`	`ckknight`	`okay`
`22:26.15`	`Tain`	`When I first started looking at Lua 5.1 I just got annoyed at all the things I couldn't do in WoW and stopped looking at it.`
`22:26.29`	`ckknight`	`same here`
`22:26.42`	`Kirov`	`math.mod is only there if LUA_COMPAT_MOD is defined, which it's not`
`22:27.04`	`ckknight`	`two best things I can think of is incremental GC and ...`
`22:27.16`	`clad\|gym`	`thats the whole reason we asked for it.`
`22:27.21`	`Kirov`	`what does incremental GC do?`
`22:27.27`	`Iriel`	`It's entirely possible that wow has math.mod = math.fmod in it`
`22:27.48`	`clad\|gym`	`Kirov: Basically, when memory is allocated the GC does some collection at that point, rather than stopping the entire thread and running one big sweep`
`22:28.00`	`clad\|gym`	`which should alleviate some of the "GC" freezes people see.`
`22:28.03`	`MentalPower`	`woudn't that make the "#undef LUA_COMPAT_MOD" pointless?`
`22:28.07`	`Kirov`	`Iriel - as per the 5.1 manual and what the pirate's said, mod() == math.fmod(), but math.mod == nil`
`22:28.24`	`Kirkburn`	`Lol! It's Bill Gates playing Doom and talking about games back in 1995 =) http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1690609421579845295&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en`
`22:28.25`	`MentalPower`	`not pointless, academic`
`22:28.42`	`Kirkburn`	`(watch until 2:30 at least)`
`22:30.08`	`Kirov`	`You guys know who Tim Sweeney and John Carmack are, right?`
`22:30.44`	`Tain`	`John Carmack wants to make me his bitch.`
`22:31.19`	`Kirkburn`	`No idea whatsoever. Didn't John Carmack invent the car?`
`22:31.25`	`zenzelezz`	`I thought that was John Romero Tain?`
`22:31.26`	`Kirov`	`sigh`
`22:31.36`	`ckknight`	`John Carmack is pretty pimp.`
`22:31.36`	`Kirov`	`John Romero == ass`
`22:31.37`	`cogwheel`	`John carmack invented the john...`
`22:31.43`	`Kirov`	`John Carmack == kicks ass`
`22:31.46`	`Kirkburn`	`Tim Sweeney - hmm, was he the inspiration for Sweeney Todd?`
`22:32.00`	`ckknight`	`we had a day where everyone dressed up as a superhero and my roommate dressed up as John Carmack`
`22:32.02`	`Kirov`	`Carmack, excluding the speech impediment, is a cool guy.`
`22:32.05`	`Tain`	`Ah they all run together to me`
`22:32.15`	`ckknight`	`they didn't believe his black shirt + tattered jeans waas a good costume, though`
`22:32.22`	`Kirov`	`Tim Sweeney wrote the Unreal engine`
`22:32.26`	`zenzelezz`	`Kirov: yes, but I believed they used to hype Daikatana or something by "John Romero will make you his bitch"... or something`
`22:32.46`	`Kirov`	`zenzelezz - like I said, John Romero == ass`
`22:32.53`	`Kirov`	`He's still an ass.`
`22:33.04`	`zenzelezz`	`never said otherwise =)`
`22:33.06`	`Tain`	`The only gods I acknowledge are Sid Meier and Richard Garriot from pre 90s`
`22:33.17`	`zenzelezz`	`Chris Sawyer :-o`
`22:33.18`	`Kirov`	`Tain - heh`
`22:33.20`	`Iriel`	`What about Molenyeux?`
`22:33.27`	`Kirov`	`fuck Molenyeux`
`22:33.28`	`Kirkburn`	`I was sure Tim Sweeney was a barber ...`
`22:33.30`	`Iriel`	`and err, Will Wright`
`22:33.38`	`Kirkburn`	`Molyneux? Damn frenchies ...`
`22:33.39`	`Kirov`	`Will Wright is the man`
`22:33.44`	`Tain`	`Yeah Will Wright too.`
`22:33.46`	`Kirkburn`	`Will Wright? They never do ...`
`22:33.54`	`Tain`	`I don't even hold Sims Online against him.`
`22:34.04`	`Iriel`	`TSO wasn't his fault, that was EA`
`22:34.05`	`Kirov`	`Tain - He didn't work on it at all.`
`22:34.21`	`zenzelezz`	`everything EA touches withers and rots`
`22:34.22`	`Tain`	`That's why I don't hold it against him. But he did give it the goahead.`
`22:34.24`	`zenzelezz`	`it's a rule of life`
`22:34.37`	`Kirkburn`	`(I feel I should point out I know all of those people :P )`
`22:34.59`	`Iriel`	`Know personally, or know of?`
`22:35.13`	`Kirkburn`	`EA isn't thaat bad. Just in some cases ...`
`22:35.35`	`zenzelezz`	`true, only 95% of the cases`
`22:35.39`	`Tain`	`I'm of the opinion that EA has caused far more harm than good in the last 10 years, when it comes to video games.`
`22:35.42`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - EA games are good in spite of the company, not because of it.`
`22:35.56`	`Kirov`	`If you've ever worked for EA, there's to very different parts of it.`
`22:35.57`	`Kirkburn`	`Who exactly is funding Spore then?`
`22:35.59`	`Tain`	`Actually no 10 years is no good.`
`22:36.04`	`Tain`	`The last say 3 years.`
`22:36.12`	`Kirov`	`The side that gets the money, and the side that doesn't.`
`22:36.12`	`Tain`	`Which is an eternity in video games!`
`22:36.22`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - EA`
`22:36.28`	`Tain`	`That's completely irrelevant, Kirov.`
`22:36.29`	`Iriel`	`Spore still runs a risk of being stillborn though`
`22:36.30`	`zenzelezz`	`I will not submit to Spore hype until it's released and can prove itself worthy`
`22:36.39`	`Tain`	`The only thing that matters to the customer is getting a good game for their money.`
`22:36.55`	`Tain`	`The rasons why it is that way isn't the customer's problem, or concern.`
`22:37.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Look, I'm just sayng don't give in to the idea of companies being 'evil', okay`
`22:37.05`	`Kirov`	`Tain - All that matters to EA is that the games they spend money on sell.`
`22:37.07`	`Gryphen`	`mmm rasons`
`22:37.23`	`Tain`	`Of course they sell, that's why they're still around.`
`22:37.28`	`Tain`	`That doesn't make the games good.`
`22:37.29`	`Kirov`	`If they think a game will sell just because of it's license, they don't do shit.`
`22:37.38`	`Kirkburn`	`Microsoft isn't 'evil', and neither is 'EA' .... it's those who 'direct' the company`
`22:37.45`	`zenzelezz`	`the good games coming under the EA label are almost all the first in what becomes a series - a company has a good idea, needs a publisher, goes to EA and wham! You have <game name> 2006-2020 plus expansions`
`22:37.48`	`Kirov`	`They get it out the door and wipe their hands of it, then rake in the cash`
`22:38.00`	`zenzelezz`	`and every single sequel is purely a milk cow`
`22:38.08`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Qzot (i=user@sandbox.xerox.com)`
`22:38.14`	`Kirov`	`zenzelezz - usually EA goes to them, actually.`
`22:38.21`	`Kirkburn`	`If EA made bad games, people wouldn't be buying them (generally)`
`22:38.23`	`zenzelezz`	`well, probably`
`22:38.27`	`Qzot`	`Heyo.`
`22:38.29`	`zenzelezz`	`EA don't make games`
`22:38.29`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - not true`
`22:38.32`	`Tain`	`There's some things they could put a lump of shit in a box and sell it and people would still buy it.`
`22:38.43`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - some really really bad games have sold really really well.`
`22:38.45`	`Kirkburn`	`EA do make games, there are EA dev houses`
`22:38.52`	`Kirov`	`Why? Because of an attached license.`
`22:38.55`	`Kirkburn`	`Kirov, I said generally`
`22:38.56`	`Tain`	`Madden NFL 2007 Shitty Shit Lump Edition! Bam, sells a million copies.`
`22:39.01`	`Qzot`	`Tain: My wife and I have been buying fertilizer, yes. In a bag, actually.`
`22:39.08`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - PC market vs. Console market.`
`22:39.13`	`Kirov`	`PC market buys good games`
`22:39.21`	`Iriel`	`There's a difference between game N in a franchise, and a game with a bunch of hype`
`22:39.28`	`Kirov`	`Console market doesn't give a shit about good games.`
`22:39.31`	`Iriel`	`Spore will have to actually be good, or it will fail`
`22:39.40`	`Kirov`	`Iriel - PC game`
`22:39.44`	`Tain`	`That's not true, Kirov.`
`22:39.51`	`Kirkburn`	`Stop making massive generalizations. Good console games sell well, bad ones don't.`
`22:39.56`	`Tain`	`You might not care about good console games, that doesn't mean other people don't.`
`22:40.08`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - the best console games I've ever played sold like crap`
`22:40.14`	`zenzelezz`	`I don't mean to generalize... it's just that everything from EA sucks! ;)`
`22:40.19`	`Kirov`	`Tain - I make console games for a living.`
`22:40.20`	`Kirov`	`:P`
`22:40.25`	`Qzot`	`Um.`
`22:40.25`	`Tain`	`good for you.`
`22:40.33`	`Tain`	`That has no bearing on your understanding of the free market.`
`22:40.35`	`Kirov`	`The games I made were crap`
`22:40.37`	`Kirkburn`	`That's because they didn't get enough publicity, but not because companies are evil`
`22:40.41`	`Qzot`	`Is this the right channel to discuss WoW addon issues?`
`22:40.44`	`Kirov`	`They sold really fucking well`
`22:40.45`	`Tain`	`That's a whole separate series of college courses.`
`22:40.49`	`Iriel`	`Qzot: Yes, mr sarcasticd`
`22:40.51`	`Kirkburn`	`Qzot, not at the moment :P`
`22:40.59`	`Qzot`	`Oh. :(`
`22:41.15`	`Kirkburn`	`Guys, open your minds, please :)`
`22:41.21`	`zenzelezz`	`never!`
`22:41.22`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Fandyllic (n=Fandylli@63.175.18.130)`
`22:41.28`	`Kirkburn`	`Zomg!`
`22:41.33`	`zenzelezz`	`we're coders, we're not supposed to be open-minded`
`22:41.35`	`Tain`	`Some of what I'd consider the best console games didn't sell well, and some of what I'd consider trash did. and vice versa`
`22:41.42`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic fell for my evil trick ;)`
`22:41.49`	`Fandyllic`	`lol`
`22:41.58`	`Fandyllic`	`just visiting, mostly`
`22:41.59`	`zenzelezz`	`he just wants to bash EA like the rest o fus`
`22:42.01`	`zenzelezz`	`*of us`
`22:42.18`	`Iriel`	`Are we sure he's not FandyIlic?`
`22:42.18`	`Fandyllic`	`no idea what the conversation is about, but I HATE EA!`
`22:42.23`	`Qzot`	`sigh`
`22:42.28`	`Kirov`	`There are good things happening inside of EA.`
`22:42.29`	`Iriel`	`Qzot: What's your issue?`
`22:42.33`	`Iriel`	`Qzot: I'm not ignoring you 8-)`
`22:42.34`	`cogwheel`	`You know, if EA is willing to invest the kind of money they do into Wil Wright, i can't complain`
`22:42.38`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic is an admin/bureaucrat at the wowwiki`
`22:42.55`	`zenzelezz`	`is he the one responsible for imposing the Kirkburn regime?`
`22:43.01`	`Fandyllic`	`Kirkburn tricked me`
`22:43.02`	`Qzot`	`I want to discuss YAWATQDNHTTI, unless it's already been done.`
`22:43.15`	`AnduinLothar`	`>.<`
`22:43.16`	`Iriel`	`What does it stand for?`
`22:43.20`	`Kirkburn`	`Hey, I thought pink polka dots for the main page looked good :(`
`22:43.25`	`zenzelezz`	`yet-another-stupid-abbreviation`
`22:43.25`	`zenzelezz`	`surely`
`22:43.32`	`MentalPower`	`YAWATQDNHTTI, huh?`
`22:43.34`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - Will Wright convinced them to make Sims, a game they didn't think would sell at all, and they refused to market. When it came out it took #1 spot in sales for almost 4 years straight.`
`22:43.40`	`zenzelezz`	`nothing ever starts with "YA" unless it means "Yet Another"`
`22:43.41`	`Qzot`	`Yet Another WoW Addon That Qzot Does Not Have Time To Implement. :D`
`22:43.48`	`Fandyllic`	`uh oh, do i need to watch the Main Page on WoWWiki more closely?`
`22:43.50`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - For that, Will Wright basically got a free card to do anything he wanted.`
`22:43.50`	`Iriel`	`Ah, which one this time?`
`22:44.06`	`Tain`	`Is it an addon to make cupcakes? With chocolate frosting?`
`22:44.08`	`cogwheel`	`and he deserved it :)`
`22:44.08`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, you've joined on the tail end of a conversation about games. _Normally_ we talk about addon stuff. Normally. cough`
`22:44.09`	`AnduinLothar`	`I never have time to implement more. you think that's stopped me?`
`22:44.31`	`Kirov`	`Spore looks cool, sounds cool, but I have dire concerns about it.`
`22:44.39`	`Qzot`	`Shared drag-and-drop whiteboard for raids. Can drag and drop raid member names, marker icons, and a few other icons.`
`22:44.50`	`AnduinLothar`	`someone made one`
`22:44.53`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, I protected lots of the important pages from being moved to aid us in the fight against vandals :)`
`22:44.57`	`MentalPower`	`wasn't cide working on that?`
`22:45.02`	`Kirov`	`It looks like an awesome enviroment to make a game with, but there's no game there.`
`22:45.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Mikk is currently watching Doom :P`
`22:45.03`	`Fandyllic`	`cool`
`22:45.04`	`Qzot`	`That's exactly why I'm asking this crowd.`
`22:45.07`	`AnduinLothar`	`No, I saw someone else made one`
`22:45.16`	`AnduinLothar`	`with actual raid instance maps`
`22:45.26`	`Kirov`	`Cide was working on one a while ago, I think he scrapped it or at least put it on the back burner for a while`
`22:45.31`	`Qzot`	`Even cooler. For boss fights?`
`22:45.36`	`Kirov`	`But yeah, someone released one recently.`
`22:45.38`	`MentalPower`	`I've only heard of Cide's, based on some line drawing code from Iriel`
`22:45.39`	`Cide`	`it's on ice`
`22:45.45`	`Cide`	`while I work on ctra2`
`22:45.57`	`Cide`	`it might make its appearance there, depending on whether I have time or not`
`22:46.15`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, generally me and/or Mikk are on here, lurking :)`
`22:46.15`	`Qzot`	`I wasn't thinking about lines. Just names and icons.`
`22:46.17`	`AnduinLothar`	`zomg v2!?`
`22:46.28`	`MentalPower`	`Cide: BTW, hows CTRA2 comming along?`
`22:46.33`	`Cide`	`not bad`
`22:46.38`	`Cide`	`school's sucking up some time though`
`22:46.54`	`Fandyllic`	`AnduinLothar = KarlKFI?`
`22:46.56`	`Kirov`	`CTRA2 is actually being worked on by Cide's clone coding army`
`22:46.57`	`Cide`	`still have a fair bit to go but most stuff is in`
`22:47.02`	`Kirkburn`	`Indeed, Fandyllic`
`22:47.03`	`AnduinLothar`	`yes fan`
`22:47.09`	`Cide`	`Kirov: I wish that was the case ;)`
`22:47.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GremWarsong (n=admin@dyn-8-82.myactv.net)`
`22:47.16`	`MentalPower`	`heh, I hear ya, school is leeching time away from my coding too`
`22:47.33`	`Kirkburn`	`(multiple personality syndrome, I'm sure of it)`
`22:47.38`	`Kirov`	`Cide - or, perhaps Cide's clone army is going to school for him?`
`22:47.39`	`GremWarsong`	`Does anyone know why "PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED" event is only called when the first person joins my group, and not when other people join after the first?`
`22:47.48`	`Qzot`	`You should be writing these addons for school projects. :D`
`22:47.50`	`Cide`	`Kirov: that'd be even better`
`22:47.56`	`AnduinLothar`	`pretty sure it's the same personality, just different names`
`22:47.59`	`Cide`	`heh, our programming assignments are like..`
`22:48.00`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - RAID_ROSTER_UPDATE`
`22:48.04`	`Cide`	`"implement a binary search"`
`22:48.08`	`Cide`	`I did that in 20 minutes`
`22:48.18`	`AnduinLothar`	`lol gg`
`22:48.18`	`GremWarsong`	`Kirov, what if it's not a raid??`
`22:48.21`	`Qzot`	`You're in the wrong class.`
`22:48.24`	`Kirkburn`	`AnduinLothar, sure one isn't evil? Do you have a false beard on your desk?`
`22:48.24`	`AnduinLothar`	`that's liek freshman yr`
`22:48.32`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - the PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED is valid`
`22:48.34`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=tardmrr@ip70-177-40-169.br.br.cox.net)`
`22:48.38`	`Kirov`	`or should be`
`22:48.56`	`AnduinLothar`	`writing a compiler was at least somewhat challenging last year`
`22:49.00`	`GremWarsong`	`Its not valid`
`22:49.08`	`GremWarsong`	`Its only calling when the first person joins the group`
`22:49.09`	`Cide`	`only class with enough applicants though :(`
`22:49.15`	`GremWarsong`	`Future group members joining does not call the event`
`22:49.26`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - give me a sec`
`22:49.27`	`Qzot`	`Cide: :( Sounds like you're at the wrong school, then.`
`22:49.33`	`Cide`	`well, kind of`
`22:49.41`	`Cide`	`writing a compiler sounds fun`
`22:49.53`	`Cide`	`in any case, time for bed. later`
`22:49.54`	`Qzot`	`Used to be fun. Too easy these days.`
`22:50.10`	`Fandyllic`	`i feel sorry for anyone actually trying to talk about WoW interface issues... heh`
`22:50.20`	`Qzot`	`Unless you write a compiler for a language other than Brainfk in Brainfk.`
`22:50.22`	`zenzelezz`	`"wite a standards compliant compiler"`
`22:50.24`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, so basically if you want to get hold of us and berate us for our wiki actions, here's where to do it :P`
`22:50.42`	`Fandyllic`	`will do ;-)`
`22:50.52`	`AnduinLothar`	`it was fun till i had to remember what I learned about how MIPS worked and implement it in java`
`22:50.56`	`Kirkburn`	`Do you code addons at all?`
`22:51.06`	`Fandyllic`	`no`
`22:51.14`	`Fandyllic`	`but i'm curious`
`22:51.37`	`Fandyllic`	`i have a coworker who says he has some addons, but isn't ready to release them publically`
`22:52.02`	`Miravlix`	`Tja, codeing addons is kinda like chasing Michael Schumacher on foort and expecting to win.`
`22:52.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)`
`22:52.05`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net`
`22:52.07`	`AnduinLothar`	`there's never a 'good' time to release software`
`22:52.12`	`Fandyllic`	`lol`
`22:52.18`	`Tain`	`"When it's done."`
`22:52.23`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's never done`
`22:52.32`	`Tain`	`I have no problem with that.`
`22:52.35`	`Qzot`	`AnduinLother: When the platform has been de-supported?`
`22:52.43`	`Tain`	`Stops you from having to support users.`
`22:52.46`	`AnduinLothar`	`and by the time it is 'done' it's no longer useful`
`22:53.05`	`Fandyllic`	`that's the Microsoft way... look at Vista... heh`
`22:53.37`	`Kirkburn`	`lol`
`22:53.40`	`ckknight`	`just release something and call it a beta`
`22:53.44`	`ckknight`	`or "leak" it`
`22:53.44`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - As far as I can tell it should still be firing.`
`22:53.46`	`ckknight`	`;-)`
`22:53.47`	`AnduinLothar`	`there you go`
`22:53.48`	`Fandyllic`	`my coworker does know his WoW, though... raiding Naxx and got to High Warlord`
`22:54.00`	`AnduinLothar`	`like gmail`
`22:54.04`	`AnduinLothar`	`eternally beta`
`22:54.11`	`GremWarsong`	`Kirov, its not firing, ive tested it a couple times =(`
`22:54.14`	`Fandyllic`	`yeah, Google is the all beta, all the time company`
`22:54.26`	`GremWarsong`	`It fires when I invite a guy, which starts a party`
`22:54.27`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: Can you post your code?`
`22:54.30`	`Kirkburn`	`True, do they ever release finished products? :/`
`22:54.32`	`GremWarsong`	`but as I invite more people, it does not`
`22:54.36`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - Blizzard's own interface works off of that event. Unless it fires, new party members won't get shown.`
`22:54.55`	`AnduinLothar`	`but you can't ahte google. they make their coders work on a side project one day out of the week`
`22:54.56`	`GremWarsong`	`My code is just your average wait for next event code`
`22:55.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge jaeger (n=jaeger@pdpc/supporter/bronze/jaeger)`
`22:55.17`	`Kirkburn`	`AnduinLothar, that's probably why everything's in beta ;)`
`22:55.26`	`Fandyllic`	`Google is a zoo, i work down the street from them`
`22:55.27`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: Can we see your average wait for the next event?`
`22:55.28`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - are all the party members showing in your UI?`
`22:55.30`	`AnduinLothar`	`i want to get payed to work on side projects`
`22:55.38`	`GremWarsong`	`Yes Kirov`
`22:55.49`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - wowi.pastey.net`
`22:55.53`	`Kirov`	`can you post your code there?`
`22:55.58`	`GremWarsong`	`A piece of my code, sure`
`22:56.11`	`Iriel`	`Another bay-arean Fandyllic - or a satellite campus?`
`22:56.27`	`Fandyllic`	`i prefer Bay-Aryan ;-) j/k`
`22:56.30`	`AnduinLothar`	`oh btw I updated DamageMeters at like 8am this mornign if anyone's interested. It's on wowi`
`22:56.45`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - whatwhat?`
`22:56.46`	`Kirkburn`	`lol`
`22:57.00`	`Kirkburn`	`AnduinLothar, doesn't sleep, he codes.`
`22:57.06`	`AnduinLothar`	`ya, basicly`
`22:57.08`	`Iriel`	`heh`
`22:57.18`	`Fandyllic`	`roundhouse coding?`
`22:57.22`	`AnduinLothar`	`8am-3pm i 'slept'`
`22:57.36`	`Kirkburn`	`I bet your have a pen and notepad by your bed`
`22:57.47`	`Kirkburn`	`Sorry, make that a 'laptop'`
`22:57.48`	`AnduinLothar`	`actually i have my computer next to my bed`
`22:57.51`	`GremWarsong`	`http://wowi.pastey.net/536`
`22:57.59`	`Kirkburn`	`:D`
`22:58.01`	`AnduinLothar`	`I can use my desktop from my bed`
`22:58.03`	`Iriel`	`Fandyllic : if that was a yes of sorts, then welcome, this channel needs as much of a bay area bias as possible`
`22:58.11`	`AnduinLothar`	`and i've been wearing the same pj's for 2 days now..`
`22:58.14`	`Kirkburn`	`No it doesn't, it needs Brits.`
`22:58.20`	`GremWarsong`	`Duh`
`22:58.21`	`GremWarsong`	`Im an idiot`
`22:58.32`	`Iriel`	`I'm both`
`22:58.35`	`Iriel`	`so hah`
`22:58.37`	`GremWarsong`	`well, nm`
`22:58.39`	`GremWarsong`	`It should be working`
`22:58.43`	`Kirkburn`	`An idiot and british? :P`
`22:58.46`	`Iriel`	`err, no`
`22:58.49`	`GremWarsong`	`At first I Thought it had something to do with the 'must be group leader' IFs`
`22:58.50`	`Iriel`	`bay-arean and british`
`22:58.55`	`GremWarsong`	`but it seems like its all in line`
`22:58.56`	`Fandyllic`	`but is it an east bay bias, a peninsula bias or ick, marin`
`22:59.00`	`Kirkburn`	`sure, sure, that's what you meant ;)`
`22:59.10`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - I love the comments on the addon - "This does not support fubar 2.0 :("`
`22:59.12`	`Iriel`	`Well, I live in the east bay and work in SF, so I dont really care.`
`22:59.12`	`Kirov`	`awesome`
`22:59.18`	`Iriel`	`other than, ick, marin`
`22:59.28`	`ckknight`	`Kirov, ?`
`22:59.37`	`AnduinLothar`	`i love how they blame me for breaking the fubar mod, lol`
`22:59.38`	`GremWarsong`	`Kirov: http://wowi.pastey.net/536`
`22:59.45`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - looking at it`
`22:59.54`	`Kirov`	`ckknight - AL's DamageMeters`
`22:59.57`	`AnduinLothar`	`I'm like.. no shit it doesn't work with an old versions`
`23:00.02`	`Fandyllic`	`is fubar ready for prime time... seemed sort of alpha last i checked`
`23:00.11`	`Kirkburn`	`Most certainly it is`
`23:00.13`	`ckknight`	`Fandyllic, should be fine.`
`23:00.14`	`Iriel`	`cogwheel : Really, I didn't realize you were another leftcoaster`
`23:00.28`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@dialup-4.254.198.247.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`23:00.29`	`AnduinLothar`	`lol leftcoaster?`
`23:00.30`	`ckknight`	`it's basically done`
`23:00.36`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, I recently went from Titan to FuBar, it's sooooo much better`
`23:00.37`	`Fandyllic`	`hmm, i really like titan... i should check out fubar`
`23:00.40`	`AnduinLothar`	`sounds like a 6-flags ride`
`23:00.48`	`cogwheel`	`yep. Even drove to blizzcon last year :)`
`23:00.49`	`Qzot`	`this:RegisterEvent("PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED"); doesn't need to be executed twice, but shouldn't hurt anything.`
`23:00.50`	`Iriel`	`sometimes it feels like a 6 flahs ride!`
`23:00.58`	`Iriel`	`cogwheel : Me too`
`23:00.59`	`ckknight`	`the only time I plan to update it here on out is for bugfixes or library upgrades`
`23:01.01`	`GremWarsong`	`ohh, didnt see that Qzot`
`23:01.18`	`Kirov`	`I moved from InfoBar to TitanBar`
`23:01.22`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, this is a useful place to get the latest versions of Ace addons (which FuBar and it's plugins are): http://svn.wowace.com/files/`
`23:01.23`	`cogwheel`	`hehe... felt like a 6 flags ride a few weeks ago...`
`23:01.24`	`GremWarsong`	`But yeah, that shouldnt effect anything, PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED is definitely getting called after the first player joins the group`
`23:01.25`	`Kirov`	`I never liked titan`
`23:01.30`	`AnduinLothar`	`I was about 15 miles from BlizzCon but i could go cause i was broke :(`
`23:01.34`	`cogwheel`	`had a 4.7 earthquake while i was playing wow`
`23:01.41`	`ckknight`	`Fandyllic, only for bleeding edge stuff, though.`
`23:01.51`	`ckknight`	`Kirov, feel free to use FuBar :-P`
`23:01.58`	`Kirkburn`	`Going from Titan to FuBar is like a revelation - you have so much more choice over everything!`
`23:02.08`	`Kirov`	`ckknight - I do now, actually`
`23:02.13`	`ckknight`	`alright`
`23:02.16`	`Fandyllic`	`what if i don't like choice? ;-)`
`23:02.25`	`Kirkburn`	`Then you're stoopid ;)`
`23:02.31`	`ckknight`	`I made FuBar because I didn't like Titan's speed and memory issues`
`23:02.35`	`ckknight`	`really.`
`23:02.37`	`Fandyllic`	`:-P`
`23:02.41`	`ckknight`	`the wh`
`23:02.41`	`AnduinLothar`	`is there a choice to have a nice looking bar graphic yet?`
`23:02.45`	`Kirov`	`I went from InfoBar to Titan, got disgusted, went back to InfoBar ... and now I'm using FuBar ever since someone asked me to make a plugin for it for STranq, been using it since`
`23:02.49`	`ckknight`	`yea, AnduinLothar`
`23:02.54`	`ckknight`	`there's a few skins out there`
`23:03.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Where, where?`
`23:03.11`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: I assume you've been the party leader while testing?`
`23:03.17`	`Fandyllic`	`i'll have to review the fubar plugins... my setup is sorta messed, sinc emy hard drive died...`
`23:03.21`	`GremWarsong`	`Yes Qzot`
`23:03.31`	`Kirkburn`	`(I keep meaning to make a background myself)`
`23:03.32`	`GremWarsong`	`Im always party leader`
`23:03.33`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: And just as a double-check, can you check the raid tab, and make sure you aren't in a raid?`
`23:03.41`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - what's the point of the not UnitExists("party"..GetPartyLeaderIndex()") ?`
`23:03.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I was wondering, with fubar, and titan bar, do they actually function like an action bar?`
`23:03.49`	`Kirov`	`Oh, I see the bug`
`23:04.11`	`GremWarsong`	`To make sure that it works if im not group leader or not in a party`
`23:04.19`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, either check out the list on WoWI, and you can also look at the ace svn I linked earlier for the absolute most up-to-date versions (which may have bugs, but probably won't)`
`23:04.27`	`ckknight`	`hang on, gonna make a skins package now`
`23:04.36`	`jaxdahl`	`if someone else reported their location to you via an addon and you compared that with your own location, what would the +/- error be in calculating the distance? would it be different in an instance as well?`
`23:04.55`	`Kirkburn`	`Not possible in an instance`
`23:05.01`	`Fandyllic`	`i assume WOWI = wow-interface.com?`
`23:05.01`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - You want the "or" there to be an "and"`
`23:05.03`	`GremWarsong`	`And no Qzot, im not in a raid group`
`23:05.06`	`Kirkburn`	`Fandyllic, yeah`
`23:05.21`	`Kirkburn`	`Without the hyphen`
`23:05.23`	`GremWarsong`	`no I dont Kirov`
`23:05.34`	`Fandyllic`	`oh yeah, duh`
`23:05.39`	`Kirkburn`	`=)`
`23:05.56`	`Iriel`	`jaxdahl : If you can GET a coordinate, and you've calibrated for the zone, then the accuracy will be smaller than foot (assuming you dont truncate the coordinate in transmission)`
`23:06.00`	`GremWarsong`	`I want the events to call only when im a party leader, or when im not in a party at all`
`23:06.07`	`Iriel`	`jaxdahl : But, as noted, instances dont give you locations`
`23:06.19`	`Fandyllic`	`which sux`
`23:06.44`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - Then if( IsPartyLeader() or NumPartyMembers() == 0 )then`
`23:06.54`	`Kirov`	`er, GetNumPartyMembers`
`23:06.57`	`GremWarsong`	`Same difference`
`23:06.59`	`Qzot`	`Your test, I'm guessing, should work, GremWarsong, buy you could also use...`
`23:07.13`	`GremWarsong`	`It also does not trigger if people leave the party`
`23:07.20`	`ckknight`	`http://svn.wowace.com/files/FuTextures-r9687.zip <-- a bunch of textures for FuBar`
`23:07.21`	`GremWarsong`	`Unless it's the last person in the party, causing the party to completely disband`
`23:07.24`	`jaxdahl`	`thanks iriel`
`23:07.24`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: IsPartyLeader() or not UnitExists('party1')`
`23:07.27`	`GremWarsong`	`So it only trigger when a party starts, and when a party ends`
`23:07.34`	`effj`	`Function to get date?`
`23:07.38`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah, that could work also Qzot`
`23:07.44`	`ckknight`	`AnduinLothar, there's a titan clone skin in there`
`23:07.51`	`AnduinLothar`	`cool`
`23:07.54`	`GremWarsong`	`But this definitely works as is, because other events in that chunk trigger no problem`
`23:08.24`	`Kirov`	`CHAT_MSG_ADDON?`
`23:08.31`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah`
`23:08.35`	`GremWarsong`	`Those trigger constantly`
`23:08.43`	`jaxdahl`	`kind of early to add this? http://www.wowwiki.com/Category:WoW_Icons:_Inventory_Jewelry`
`23:08.43`	`GremWarsong`	`So its definitely not escaping the IF sequence`
`23:09.05`	`Kirkburn`	`ckknight, you're awesome`
`23:09.12`	`ckknight`	`it's true.`
`23:09.22`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - what about me?`
`23:09.24`	`Esamynn`	`Good afternoon all`
`23:09.36`	`Kirkburn`	`Btw. have you abandoned DurabilityFu and AmmoFu?`
`23:09.41`	`Fandyllic`	`ok, gotta stop playing IRC hooky at work... please add useful info to WoWWiki... we don't want to give those buttheads at wikipedia to many reasons to unlink it`
`23:09.50`	`Kirkburn`	`Kirov, you're ... um .... do I use your addons? Um?`
`23:09.58`	`GremWarsong`	`I honestly think that PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED is bugged`
`23:10.00`	`effj`	`Iriel, quick question for you since you so neatly asked my last question; getting the date? Is there a readymade function for this?`
`23:10.03`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Fandyllic (n=Fandylli@63.175.18.130)`
`23:10.10`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - common, you know you use ... um ... something ...`
`23:10.25`	`Kirkburn`	`Yeah ... um ... I probably do. Kirov, you're awesome too!`
`23:10.30`	`Kirov`	`yay!`
`23:10.36`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: Add some print statements. Start splitting the problem in half.`
`23:10.50`	`GremWarsong`	`The PartyChat is my print statement`
`23:10.58`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - What addon do you use the most?`
`23:11.03`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: Add more print statements.`
`23:11.07`	`GremWarsong`	`Where?`
`23:11.26`	`Qzot`	`Before the if-check. Just after the if-check. Print out the event received. Etc.`
`23:11.29`	`GremWarsong`	`There is no suitable spot to place more checks`
`23:11.30`	`ckknight`	`Kirkburn, someone else should've claimed those by now, if not, I'll make sure someone does`
`23:11.33`	`GremWarsong`	`ah`
`23:11.40`	`Kirkburn`	`Err ... I use half of Cosmos, lots of FuBar ... umm ...hmm`
`23:11.51`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - I wrote Cosmos then`
`23:11.53`	`Kirov`	`all of it`
`23:11.58`	`Kirkburn`	`Awesome`
`23:12.00`	`ckknight`	`wow, Kirov`
`23:12.03`	`ckknight`	`you suck.`
`23:12.08`	`Kirov`	`wait, damn it`
`23:12.17`	`Kirov`	`I wrote the good parts!`
`23:12.25`	`ckknight`	`there are good parts?`
`23:12.36`	`Kirov`	`I wrote the autoupdater!`
`23:12.38`	`ckknight`	`hehe`
`23:12.39`	`Kirov`	`wait, shit`
`23:12.40`	`Esamynn`	`considers*`
`23:12.44`	`ckknight`	`okay, Kirov`
`23:12.46`	`Esamynn`	`~lart kirov`
`23:12.47`	`Kirkburn`	`Oh the satire`
`23:12.52`	`ckknight`	`I believe that you wrote the good parts of Cosmos`
`23:12.55`	`ckknight`	`all the good parts`
`23:13.02`	`Kirov`	`ckknight - hahaha`
`23:13.03`	`Esamynn`	`lol`
`23:13.10`	`Kirov`	`sweet`
`23:13.22`	`ckknight`	`I'm alluding to the fact that you didn't write anything for Cosmos`
`23:13.22`	`Esamynn`	`or at least you would have if there WERE any.... ;)`
`23:13.24`	`Kirkburn`	`Meanwhile, back on planet earth ...`
`23:13.32`	`ckknight`	`hehe`
`23:13.44`	`Kirkburn`	`... AnduinLothar is quietly seething`
`23:13.51`	`Esamynn`	`Kirkburn:Planet Earth is boring!`
`23:14.00`	`AnduinLothar`	`actually i wasn't reading`
`23:14.02`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - I can't test right now, but I'm fairly sure it does do that event.`
`23:14.09`	`Esamynn`	`AnduinLothar: good, don't`
`23:14.11`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - probably for the better`
`23:14.15`	`Kirkburn`	`Well, I trued Zog but they said I was too 'freaky' for them`
`23:14.22`	`Kirkburn`	`*tried`
`23:14.22`	`AnduinLothar`	`I don't read anything ck says. He hates me`
`23:14.26`	`ckknight`	`yea, I'm just dicking around`
`23:14.31`	`ckknight`	`ah, it's not true`
`23:14.41`	`Kirkburn`	`Aww, it's a love- ... ah I mean hate-hate relationship =) Awwwwww`
`23:14.53`	`Kirov`	`ckknight doesn't hate you AnduinLothar, he just hates everything you've ever created, and your mother.`
`23:14.55`	`GremWarsong`	`np Kirov`
`23:15.01`	`ckknight`	`not his mother.`
`23:15.02`	`GremWarsong`	`Ill look into it more Kirov and do as you suggested`
`23:15.07`	`GremWarsong`	`Thanks for the help guys, im going to head out! =)`
`23:15.18`	`AnduinLothar`	`my mother's a nice woman, it's hard to hate her`
`23:15.20`	`Qzot`	`Kirov: Did you say you saw the bug? I sure don't...`
`23:15.22`	`Kirkburn`	`I don't know what I'd do without Cosmos, it's great :)`
`23:15.23`	`ckknight`	`and this is just a case of "love the sinner, hate the sin"`
`23:15.23`	`Esamynn`	`you know, somehow I expected the patch from 1.5.1 to 1.12 to be larger than 464MB`
`23:15.34`	`Kirov`	`Qzot - I thought I did, but really I'm just an idiot.`
`23:16.10`	`Qzot`	`Anyone who wrote all the good parts of the cosmos can't be a compleat idiot.`
`23:16.55`	`Kirkburn`	`Kirov, you're also Brodrick, no?`
`23:16.56`	`GremWarsong`	`Hey Kirov`
`23:16.56`	`Kirov`	`Qzot - I think I have a pinky toe that's got an IQ of 90`
`23:17.01`	`GremWarsong`	`It triggers if it's outside the IF statement`
`23:17.03`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - yeah`
`23:17.20`	`GremWarsong`	`But no manner of Print will work inside that IF statement`
`23:17.45`	`GremWarsong`	`so something in that IF statement is causing the PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED to not call`
`23:17.49`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: That means your test doesn't work as you thought it did.`
`23:17.55`	`GremWarsong`	`Right`
`23:18.00`	`GremWarsong`	`So what's the problem then?`
`23:18.09`	`GremWarsong`	`He's always party leader`
`23:18.12`	`GremWarsong`	`So it should be triggering`
`23:18.19`	`AnduinLothar`	`LOL, no wonder PQ's not working`
`23:18.25`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - there might be some oddity with PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED and Leader not working`
`23:18.31`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's only registered to read msgs from RAID`
`23:18.32`	`Qzot`	`Well, it is triggering. Because the print before the if is working.`
`23:18.36`	`GremWarsong`	`That could be true Kirov`
`23:18.40`	`AnduinLothar`	`smacks head`
`23:18.40`	`GremWarsong`	`yes Qzot, it's triggering`
`23:18.44`	`GremWarsong`	`but not inside the IF statements`
`23:18.46`	`Kirkburn`	`AnduinLothar, nicely done, nicely done`
`23:18.58`	`GremWarsong`	`Its not triggering inside the IF statements while im leader`
`23:19.10`	`Qzot`	`In the print before the if check, print the value of "IsPartyLeader()" and the value of "UnitExists('party' ... blahblahblah)".`
`23:19.11`	`AnduinLothar`	`I knew it had to be something stupid.. cause i could see the messages being transmitted..`
`23:19.15`	`Kirkburn`	`Kirov, does it help that i've thought of getting lootlink frequently?`
`23:19.22`	`GremWarsong`	`Solid plan Qzot`
`23:19.27`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - lol, sure`
`23:19.35`	`Kirkburn`	`:)`
`23:19.37`	`Kirov`	`Kirkburn - My suggestion is don't if you value your script memory`
`23:19.53`	`Kirov`	`it's and ugly ugly hack of memory mismanagement`
`23:19.57`	`Corrodias`	`i, on the other hand, don't mind spending memory for convenience :)`
`23:20.26`	`Kirkburn`	`heh`
`23:20.29`	`Kirov`	`25kb increasing with LLe, by itself, not to mention it weighs in at around 60 megs`
`23:20.40`	`Esamynn`	`Kirov: you mean like the current version of Gatherer??? ;)`
`23:20.41`	`Kirov`	`at least with my 48000 items`
`23:20.49`	`Kirkburn`	`mmm, nice`
`23:21.06`	`Kirov`	`I'm waiting for Itemizer to come out so I can make a version with a good UI`
`23:21.16`	`GremWarsong`	`IsPartyLeader() is always returning nil`
`23:21.19`	`GremWarsong`	`even while im party leader`
`23:21.19`	`Corrodias`	`i don't use LLe`
`23:21.33`	`Corrodias`	`i see no purpose to keeping track of every different enchanted version of each item`
`23:21.44`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - on any event, or just PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED`
`23:21.56`	`GremWarsong`	`Just on PARTY_MEMBERS_CHANGED`
`23:22.05`	`Kirov`	`Corrodias - was requested, but it can be turned off easily enough.`
`23:22.20`	`Corrodias`	`LL (not enhanced) does not consume any memory while idling. i can't imagine what LLe is doing.`
`23:22.28`	`Qzot`	`Kirov: I'm guessing that there must be some other event for passing the party leader hat, and the group is being formed before the client knows who is the leader.`
`23:22.31`	`Corrodias`	`well, no noticable amount, anyway`
`23:23.01`	`Kirkburn`	`I want otravi_CastingBar updated :(`
`23:23.16`	`Kirkburn`	`That way I can finally get rid of Ace 1.3.1`
`23:23.30`	`GremWarsong`	`not true Qzot`
`23:23.44`	`GremWarsong`	`because it still returns nil even while im party leader inviting people after the first`
`23:23.51`	`Kirov`	`Corrodias - If there haven't been any new items seen in the last few seconds, it's the same as LL, but LLe does things like mouseover scanning and breaks up item parsing over time to try and get around the bugs concerning the full tooltip not getting sent all at once.`
`23:24.07`	`Corrodias`	`interesting`
`23:24.18`	`Kirov`	`Corrodias - so, some times it'll chunk the same item over and over for a couple of seconds.`
`23:24.32`	`Kirov`	`MentalPower has a much nicer aproach for dealing with that.`
`23:24.35`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge jaeger- (n=jaeger@ip68-13-247-165.ok.ok.cox.net)`
`23:24.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dorbak (n=dorbak@S0106000f6645fe8c.ed.shawcable.net)`
`23:25.19`	`dorbak`	`howdy folks, I've got another question :)`
`23:25.33`	`GeoDaMancer`	`We might well have an answer.`
`23:25.40`	`GremWarsong`	`So how can IsPartyLeader() only return NIL during PARTY_MEMBER_CHANGED events?`
`23:26.00`	`Kirov`	`dorbak - sure`
`23:26.00`	`Qzot`	`Try (GetPartyLeaderIndex()==nil) as your leadership or solo test.`
`23:26.07`	`dorbak`	`multiple dimensioned arrays --- they look tough to implement, at least, they look much different than I"m used to in other languages. Anyone have any suggestions as to which mod to look at for hints?`
`23:26.35`	`Kirov`	`dorbak - they're not difficult at all.`
`23:26.36`	`MentalPower`	`not really that hard`
`23:26.40`	`Kirov`	`what are you trying to do with them?`
`23:26.55`	`MentalPower`	`sometable = { foo = {}, bar = {} }`
`23:27.06`	`dorbak`	`lol, I can't wrap my head around them :P Basically, I want to be able to "group" tells together by username`
`23:27.06`	`MentalPower`	`err... thats nested arrays`
`23:27.15`	`Qzot`	`Or sometable = {{}, {}, {}, }`
`23:27.32`	`MentalPower`	`yeah, Qzot's is the real solution`
`23:27.46`	`ckknight`	`yea, cause then you can sometable[1][2]`
`23:27.52`	`GremWarsong`	`wow Qzot`
`23:27.54`	`dorbak`	`The way I was envisioning it would be to have one array for my base array, containing name, number of messages (if needed), and then an array of those messages`
`23:27.59`	`GremWarsong`	`Qzot, its STILL not working`
`23:28.02`	`GremWarsong`	`even when it equals nil`
`23:28.09`	`GremWarsong`	`What sense does that make`
`23:28.14`	`Kirov`	`sure it does`
`23:28.16`	`GeoDaMancer`	`If you need to use something specific, like a name though... sometable = {["Some Name"] = {}};`
`23:28.17`	`Qzot`	`Re-paste, please.`
`23:28.30`	`Kirov`	`On PARTY_MEMBER_CHANGED all the leader information is getting nilled for some reason`
`23:28.46`	`MentalPower`	`whispersTable = { personA = { "Tell #1", "Tell #2", "Tell #3" }, personB = { "Tell #1", "Tell #2", "Tell #3" }, personC = { "Tell #1", "Tell #2", "Tell #3" } }`
`23:29.01`	`GremWarsong`	`Hell, I can just put the PARTY_MEMBER_CHANGED outside the if`
`23:29.04`	`GremWarsong`	`and solve it that way`
`23:29.10`	`Qzot`	`Um. No.`
`23:29.13`	`Kirkburn`	`zomg, 1st of september!`
`23:29.24`	`AnduinLothar`	`NOOO NOT YET!`
`23:29.26`	`AnduinLothar`	`still 31`
`23:29.28`	`AnduinLothar`	`:P`
`23:29.31`	`ckknight`	`not for another 10 and a half hours`
`23:29.35`	`Qzot`	`Grem: The values are not changing by virtue of testing with the if.`
`23:29.38`	`cogwheel`	`WoW.... kirkburn lives in the future...`
`23:29.40`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - that would fix it, and setup a timer to do all your functions in like 0.1 seconds`
`23:29.47`	`MentalPower`	`remember remember the first of november :)`
`23:29.47`	`Kirov`	`GremWarsong - but this is a weird bug`
`23:29.54`	`GremWarsong`	`yeah Kirov, I have Chronos timers`
`23:29.57`	`Kirov`	`MentalPower - so, how _is_ itemizer`
`23:30.02`	`Qzot`	`GremWarsong: They're changing in Blizz' client code, which is calling your Lua code.`
`23:30.12`	`dorbak`	`so, if I get you right, if personB sends a new message, I'd insert it into the table by writing whispersTable[2, {"newmessage"}? (and that's where I'm unsure)`
`23:31.03`	`GeoDaMancer`	`tinsert(whispersTable[2], "New Message")`
`23:31.07`	`MentalPower`	`its up to a more functional state, all of the decoding functions are done (except the ones that re-generate the tooltip), I'm currently working on the GUI`
`23:31.08`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I think that'd work, at least.`
`23:31.19`	`Qzot`	`dorbak: table.insert(whispersTable[playerName], message)`
`23:31.21`	`dorbak`	`good grief, is it that simple?`
`23:31.30`	`MentalPower`	`table.insert(whispersTable.personA, "New Whisper")`
`23:31.33`	`dorbak`	`lol, I need to read up on it so more :)`
`23:31.51`	`MentalPower`	`Qzot wins again!`
`23:31.52`	`GeoDaMancer`	`xD Three answers that equate to the same.`
`23:32.05`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Didn't mine come out first?`
`23:32.16`	`Qzot`	`Any of them work.`
`23:32.25`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ye-up.`
`23:32.37`	`GeoDaMancer`	`tinsert is just shorthand for table.insert. xD`
`23:33.10`	`dorbak`	`Thank you so much again`
`23:34.46`	`ScytheBlade1`	`So, I've saved the X, Y coords of a specific frame (MinimapCluster) to be exact. I saved them with GetLeft() and GetTop(). However, SetPoint("TOPLEFT", "UIParent", "TOPLEFT", X, Y) isn't quite working how I want it to :/`
`23:34.55`	`ScytheBlade1`	`It doesn't move that frame back to where it was :P`
`23:34.57`	`ScytheBlade1`	`* :/`
`23:35.10`	`ScytheBlade1`	`Am I doing this completly wrong?`
`23:36.57`	`Iriel`	`ScytheBlade1 : You're likely not adjusting for scale`
`23:37.11`	`Iriel`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/UI_Coordinates`
`23:37.41`	`MentalPower`	`GeoDaMancer: yes, but theres no whispersTable[2] table`
`23:37.42`	`ScytheBlade1`	`Iriel, thanks, I'll give that a read`
`23:37.46`	`Qzot`	`ScytheBlade1: It's been a while, but don't you also have to clear any current set points?`
`23:38.06`	`ScytheBlade1`	`Qzot, yup, I'm doing that..`
`23:38.18`	`Qzot`	`ScytheBlade1: Okie doke.`
`23:38.26`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I was using the index that he was using in his question is all.`
`23:38.38`	`AnduinLothar`	`lol so, has anyone tried a fresh isntall of DM? I don't even know what those bars at the top ARE. lol`
`23:39.21`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - they look like the send and process bars`
`23:39.26`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's the send and recieve bars.. they're spazzing out`
`23:39.39`	`Qzot`	`dorbak: You might first want to do: whispersTable[playerName] = whispersTable[playerName] or {}`
`23:39.58`	`Qzot`	`dorbak: This is to guarantee that there's a player-specific table to insert data into.`
`23:40.09`	`AnduinLothar`	`it must be confused`
`23:40.15`	`dorbak`	`ok`
`23:40.50`	`dorbak`	`I'm assuming that if I do that and whispersTable[playerName] already exists, it will be cleared out?`
`23:41.05`	`dorbak`	`probably will want to check to see if that entry exists`
`23:42.20`	`Iriel`	`dorbak : No, that line only resets it if it's not there`
`23:42.45`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - my only guess is that some sort of saved data from an old version isn't playing nice`
`23:42.52`	`Iriel`	`Personally I'd do: local playerWhispers = whispersTable[playerName]; if (not playerWhispers) then playerWhispers = {}; whispersTable[playerName] = playerWhispers; end`
`23:42.56`	`Kirov`	`AnduinLothar - I think he's upgrading from 4.0`
`23:42.59`	`Iriel`	`Because I feel it's more obvious, and it takes less time`
`23:43.04`	*** join/#wowi-lounge KaoS` (n=[KaoS]`@12.145.0.2)
`23:43.21`	`AnduinLothar`	`damn it. i left debug on`
`23:43.49`	`Iriel`	`AnduinLothar : Make debug state a saved variable`
`23:44.10`	`AnduinLothar`	`it is`
`23:44.10`	`Kirov`	`My debug var is the chatframe to spam to`
`23:44.12`	`Kirov`	`:)`
`23:44.13`	`AnduinLothar`	`that's the problem`
`23:44.27`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's set in the code`
`23:44.28`	`Iriel`	`Then why's it an issue`
`23:44.32`	`GeoDaMancer`	`This is a weird question, and more to do with actual play. If you're a rogue, and use like Gouge to stun your opponent can you then use stealth?`
`23:44.40`	`Iriel`	`Well, then it's not a saved variable if it's set in the code 8-)`
`23:44.52`	`AnduinLothar`	`it's both`
`23:44.59`	`Kirov`	`GeoDaMancer - no`
`23:45.05`	`Iriel`	`GeoDaMancer : No, you can't stealth from combat, you'd have to disengage and then stealth, or just vanish`
`23:45.07`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Shucks. xD`
`23:45.22`	`AnduinLothar`	`ah, it's cause of the niling`
`23:45.23`	`AnduinLothar`	`damn`
`23:45.28`	`AnduinLothar`	`defaults aren't working`
`23:45.34`	`Kirov`	`GeoDaMancer - If you stun someone and run away, youll fall out of combat if you don't do anything for 6 seconds and are far enough away.`
`23:45.34`	`Iriel`	`That nilling is all your damn fault`
`23:45.38`	`Iriel`	`I wish you'd never asked for it`
`23:46.03`	`MentalPower`	`I second that motion`
`23:46.07`	`Kirov`	`third`
`23:46.07`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I didn't really want to leave combat, because then the oppoent would start to regen at normal rate.`
`23:46.19`	`Kirov`	`Luckily I use a table for all my stuff so I don't have to deal with it.`
`23:46.55`	`Iriel`	`Kirov: You've just been lucky, or you check for a nil value after ADDON_LOADED and fix it`
`23:47.40`	`Kirov`	`Iriel - I check for nils`
`23:47.55`	`Kirov`	`mainly for my own bone-headedness`
`23:48.12`	`Kirov`	`mymodsavedtable.anothertable = nil`
`23:48.15`	`Kirov`	`opps, errors!`
`23:48.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Parak (i=PROFI@user-0cev737.cable.mindspring.com)`
`23:51.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Er, is there a way to view the interface art after it's been unpacked with the interface design helper thing-a-ma-jigger?`
`23:51.45`	`MentalPower`	`XnView`
`23:51.46`	`Kirov`	`GeoDaMancer - there's a couple of third party tools`
`23:51.58`	`MentalPower`	`it works for most BLP files`
`23:52.03`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Thankees.`
`23:52.57`	`wereHamster`	`can this be possible? WoW renders the world into a Pbuffer and then uses glCopyTexSubImage2D to copy the pbuffer to a texture and render it to the main drawable? 'destroying' glCopyTexSubImage2D makes the world black and only the UI remains visible..`
`23:53.49`	`Iriel`	`wereHamster : It could be I suppose, does that change if you disable the fullscreen glow?`
`23:55.17`	`wereHamster`	`yep, disabled all effects/shaders and world is visible now`
`23:56.07`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Ratbert_CP (n=KCummins@proxy-ce3.disney.com)`
`23:56.46`	`wereHamster`	`we (me and another wine developer) are trying to find out why enabling the UI will make the framerate drop to 50% or even less if lots of frames are visible.. with no luck so far`
`23:57.24`	`Kirov`	`Does CreateFrame on tooltips work?`
`23:57.51`	`Kirov`	`Didn't they have some problems with the functions not getting setup on them correctly, or is that fixed?`
`23:58.15`	`ckknight`	`Gratuity seems to do it fine`
`23:58.26`	`ckknight`	`it's a tooltip scanning library`
`23:58.37`	`Kirov`	`know of it`
`23:58.45`	`ckknight`	`makes the tooltip all in lua`
`23:59.25`	`MentalPower`	`Kirov: it was fixed`

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