irclog2html for #wowi-lounge on 20061006

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00:09.04Merynight all
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01:32.09IndustrialIs there an addon that repeats selling messages to /2 in given intervals?
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01:53.20PlorkyeranChronos/Timex?
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03:08.36Cairennkrka: ping?
03:10.20zenzelezzI can't seem to make up my mind about this book... reached about 2/3 through it, then haven't touched it for weeks... keep wondeing if I should try to finish it or just not bother :-o
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03:25.48tyroneyJust to be safe; I don't need to toss any parens around the part after the "and", right?
03:25.49tyroneyif newTarget and newTarget~=this.lastTarget then
03:27.25Beladonaneed to? no ~ but it would be cleaner for code readability
03:27.39tyroneyYeah, I guess it would.
03:27.49MentalPowerno need but.... what bela said
03:32.56Thrae|Detachedhttp://wow.blupp.net/item.php?id=338479
03:34.43zenzelezzreminds me of that sword or whatever it was called "Machete of Two Thousand Worries" in Anarchy Online
03:34.46zenzelezzalthough that one sucked
03:34.56ThraeIt's from the recent South Park episode ;)
03:37.55TainI really liked Anarchy Online.  I very honestly feel that if it had spent six more months in development it could have really taken the world by storm.
03:39.37zenzelezzI love it, but too many of my friends left :-/
03:40.33TainI started at retail (well in beta too).  Everyone I played with left before me, and I still only got up to level 47.  Atrox Enforcer
03:41.48zenzelezzI played a fixer
03:41.57zenzelezzwhen I went to WoW I felt so utterly slow
03:42.21TainWoW is the slowest game I've ever played.
03:42.40zenzelezzstill, when you're used to playing a class with 2000+ runspeed... :)
03:43.02zenzelezzand it took me ages to remember that an Anarchy Online "profession" is a WoW "class" o_O
03:43.03ThraeYou've obviously never played EQ...
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03:43.04TainI thought City of Heroes was slow, after playing WoW for a while I didn't even feel the need to get a travel power right away like I used to.
03:43.18TainWell Thrae I played a Shaman in EQ. :)
03:43.54ThraeSo you can eat your foot?
03:43.58TainI was never without SoW.   And my first alt was a Bard.
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03:44.20ThraeAh right
03:46.14zenzelezzit confused me at first how there's no skill requirement for most things in WoW... no more "just 8 more points in MG/SMG!" like you had to do with everything in AO
03:46.23TainEQ was also funny in that you could do different speed hacks.  I never did stuff like that to get an advantage in the game, but I played with things from sheer overwhelming curiosity to see what things did.
03:46.47TainI once took fatal falling damage in EQ from running too fast into a tree.   That is a true story.
03:46.57zenzelezzO_O
03:47.02XuerianROFL
03:48.22TainAO was even worse for speed hacks though, really.  When I played originally at least.
03:48.37zenzelezzhow so Tain?
03:49.43TainThe old speedhack program that worked in Ultima Online still worked in AO.  It basically just tricked the computer into thinking it ran faster and sent coords to the server faster, and if the server didn't do sanity checking it just said.. ok!
03:50.05zenzelezzaha, heh
03:50.24TainIncidentally it worked in Motor City Online which was supposed to be a MMO racing game, and just destroyed it.
03:50.30zenzelezznot aware of anything like that while I was playing... everyone just pestered us fixers instead
03:50.37zenzelezzNCU GSF HOT plz
03:51.11TainAO was fun because it was nuts how much you could buff your stats to equip weapons 50-100 levels higher than you.
03:51.31zenzelezzhehe
03:52.34TainIt frustrated me because AO had some great ideas that no one else to this day has done, but there were so many problems.
03:53.58zenzelezzI'm interested to see if they've learned from the experience with AO in Age of Conan, but I have no interest in playing that game
03:54.58TainWell I got an email that my CoH account was activated for free for the weekend and I'm sorely tempted. :)
03:55.41zenzelezzmy experience with non-AO MMOs is somewhat odd... I love WoW, but neither SWG nor EQII held me for more than two weeks
03:56.03TainThey're doing something no one else has tried yet, giving people rewards for continuous subscription.  So if your account has been active for x amount of time your chars gain different things.
03:56.47TainSWG I personally think started out with some good ideas, but rather than flesh them out they ditched it all and made the game trashy.
03:57.11XuerianGuildwars has done that, but with hardly anything at all (Non-combat pets, year-old character)
03:57.35Thrae"Didn't Darth kill all the Jedis?" "Yeah, but you can help revive them if you raise your Cooking to 10000!"
03:57.38TainAnd no matter what else EQ2 does the only thing that ever stuck with me that I absolutely love is critical failures on tradeskills that harm you.
03:57.44Mr_Rabies2too bad guild wars has the worst pve in existance /l.
03:57.58XuerianWorst PvE, best PvP
03:58.02XuerianOr it had it, anyway
03:58.21XuerianWas very good in alpha/beta =\
03:58.24TainI do own Guild Wars and I think it's a good game, but it's a gmae that you have to play with other people.  If you're looking to just solo around and not do much it's not very fun.
03:58.28ThraeDAoC Mass PvP > *
03:58.46XuerianSeeing as I've never played DAoC... :P
03:58.51Mr_Rabies2i liked gw before i played wow in e3 for everyone
03:59.23Mr_Rabies2but after playing wow, all i like is the pvp
03:59.24zenzelezzI find it funny how you can cast Beast Lore on druids in shapeshift forms
04:00.02TainDAoC never pushed the envelope enough.  It launched at a time where it was different than EQ and had some great features, but didnt' offer enough.
04:00.27Tullerbleh, I played AC :)
04:00.27TainWhat happens down the road in a game doesn't matter, it's the launch that makes or breaks it.  Companies need to learn that.
04:01.06ThraeI think WoW's PvP is better then DAoC's just because I'm not a tactical mastermind. If you are a true hardcore PvP'r, DAoC is for you...they're insane over there, Korean insane.
04:01.09Mr_Rabies2wow had a rocky launch but succeeded massively
04:01.12TainAC was another one.  AC  could have killed EQ dead, in my opinion.  If it simply waited six months before it launchd and actually released content in the game.
04:01.31zenzelezzWoW? Rocky?
04:01.42TainWoW's launch was fine compared to others.
04:01.45ThraeTain: That's not necessarily fair. Blizzard Entertainment was one of the biggest names in MORPGs, while Mythic Entertainment was a no-name company.
04:01.59zenzelezzfrom what I've heard, it's hard to compete with AO's launch in terms of problems
04:02.20Tainzenzelezz: AO's launch was horrible, but it was second to World War II Online
04:02.36zenzelezzreally? I never heard much about WW2O
04:02.38IrielTo the earlier comment - Guild wars just isn't an MMO, it's a regular network play game in MMO clothing.
04:02.45TainThrae: But we're talking years difference in launch times.
04:02.53TullerWW2O - reformat hard drive due to bug
04:02.58zenzelezzlol
04:03.01zenzelezzthat is bad
04:03.01Mr_Rabies2WoW was almost unplayable at launch
04:03.19TainNo, WoW wasn't.  Well compared to some other launches.
04:03.23Mr_Rabies2until the second wave of servers rolled out
04:03.32TainHell, EQ was almost unplayable at launch.
04:03.42Mr_Rabies2wow's problem wasn't coding but lack of foresight in demand
04:03.51TainI remember buying it, playing for a few hours, and thinking, "What the hell did I waste my money on this for?"
04:04.06Tullerbut as far as AC beating EQ, I don't think it could have.  The styles were different, with AC having much more solo stuff.  AC2, I think, served as a WoW pre alpha :)
04:04.10zenzelezzI don't think anyone had expected WoW to take off like it did
04:04.14IrielWhat? WoW's launch was smooth apart from the server load and increased lag.
04:04.25IrielIt was a little while post launch when the servers started freaking out
04:04.51ThraeTain: Yeah, which means WoW got time to make up for the mistakes made by the MMORPGs before it, DAoC was still relatively new after EQ. It -was- pretty innovative for its -time-. By the time WoW rolled out, DAoC's Mass Player vs Player had already been updated to be the most unique of all MMORPGs, and still is.
04:05.05TainTuller: But at the time AC launched people were sick of EQ.  They really were.  It was a time before any EQ expansions, people were begging for something.  AC could have provided that, but it launched with so little actual content that people went right back to EQ.
04:05.12Mr_Rabies2yeah, when they had to stop production temporarily to manage server problems
04:05.29TainAnd once EQ started pushing out expansions it kept people thinking they couldn't throw away the time investment in their characters.
04:06.01zenzelezzdoesn't EQ have like 50 expansions by now? o_O
04:06.19Mr_Rabies2like...7?
04:06.23Mr_Rabies28 maybe?
04:06.30zenzelezzstill many :)
04:06.31TainThrae: DAoC's realm pvp is a great thing, but people also wanted pve end-game, which DAoC didn't provide.
04:06.54Mr_Rabies2one thing that wow really floors me in is animations
04:07.03zenzelezzhow so?
04:07.07Mr_Rabies2it might not have the polycount that EQ2 does, but by god, the animations are fluid
04:07.17ThraeTain: The best of both worlds still doesn't exist, in my opinion. WoW's PvE is good, but it's mass PvP still sucks balls.
04:07.18zenzelezzagreed
04:07.26Mr_Rabies2it's got some of the most fluid, realistic animations despite being cartoony
04:07.34IrielMr_Rabies2: Quality over Quantity
04:07.50Mr_Rabies2there's some places that really need some texture work
04:07.56Mr_Rabies2i'm looking at you stormwind castle
04:08.00TainI agree Thrae, but I'd still argue that to be really successful PvP is a secondary thought.
04:08.03zenzelezzI had to swallow my words about WoW's graphics once my friend sent me a copy of the game, it really feels different when playing than the impression I had from screenshots
04:08.20Mr_Rabies2other than those few spots, really nice textures and animations despite not being "next gen super realistic looking"
04:08.24Mr_Rabies2yeah
04:08.30Mr_Rabies2wow can't been seen purely from screens
04:08.41Mr_Rabies2be seen*
04:09.21ThraeI think they're both equally important, but no one has stepped up to the plate yet...
04:09.37zenzelezzfor the most part I love how WoW's armor sets and weapons look more powerful as you level... AO lacked that
04:09.40TainYeah, but I have to admit there was a much different feeling playing WoW in a more third person view based environment as EQ where you really started first person.
04:10.05Mr_Rabies2i really like how Diablo II did character look as you advanced
04:10.20Tuller?
04:10.26Mr_Rabies2your stance changed from being this wimpy little guy holding a mace barely to having a kickass battle stance and stuff
04:10.52TainThrae: It might be just my opinion but I really think pvp is a completely minority population that has to be satisfied.  The masses want PVE.
04:10.58Mr_Rabies2and if you were a "hardcore" char, the stances as you leveled were amazing looking
04:11.07TullerI never noticed that
04:11.31Mr_Rabies2they were most noticable in the lobby where you see different levels/geared guys side by side
04:11.49Mr_Rabies2my druid was pretty awesome looking with a wolf head helm and huge axe and stuff
04:12.03TainOf course I still think Phantasy Star Online was one of the great unappreciated online games as well. :)
04:12.23ThraeI have that for my Dreamcast, never played it since I got in late.
04:12.26Mr_Rabies2PSO has about zero replay value though
04:12.33Tullerwhat?
04:12.46Mr_Rabies2i bought version 1 and 2 for xbox and played it for about 15 mins
04:12.51ThraePSO had about as much replay value as Diablo
04:12.52Mr_Rabies2biggest waste of cash ever
04:13.03TainThat's one person's opinion.
04:13.08TainI played countless hours.
04:13.10Mr_Rabies2i played it a decent amount on dreamcast though
04:13.22Mr_Rabies2i mean, i had no reason to replay it after maxing a char out
04:13.31Mr_Rabies2no reason to start over
04:13.35TainAh then we just have different reasons to play.
04:13.42Mr_Rabies2i liked the end fight, it was really freaking epic
04:13.45zenzelezzI had a friend who used to say that PSO's loot was influenced partially by some attribute of the character, so people would reroll until they go the "good" one
04:13.47TainI played because I liked playing with other people I was playing with.
04:14.00Mr_Rabies2i played with one guy i knew irl, that was fun
04:14.08Mr_Rabies2and joining the japanese servers was pretty entertaining
04:14.21TainIt was, zenzelezz.  There were things that influenced the types of loot you got.  I don't think it was ever worth rerolling, personally.  But it's true.
04:14.29Tullertain: that's generally why people continue to play ANY mmo
04:14.48Mr_Rabies2you char's sign or whatever was based around his name
04:14.55ThraeThat's one thing I still think FFXI does a bit better then WoW, you can really have some epic end-boss battles in their dungeons.
04:15.01Mr_Rabies2and your mag got specific stuff around that sign and some other things
04:15.08Mr_Rabies2i liked the mag raising :D
04:15.21TainTuller: I don't think so.  It's the reason I play, but I think more people get obsessed with their characters, not just playing with people for fun.
04:15.38Mr_Rabies2eh i did in diablo
04:15.41Mr_Rabies2and did for a bit in wow
04:15.43Mr_Rabies2but not anymore
04:16.04Mr_Rabies2i got jaded seeing healbot set after healbot set i didn't want and stopped caring about loot
04:16.18ThraeI'm waiting for a MMORPG that introduces attack animations which stop time for their duration.
04:16.32TainFFXI to me was just too slow.  I mean I think WoW is a little absurd in how fast you can level, but FFXI is at the other end of the spectrum.
04:16.39ThraeFor high level end bosses, of course.
04:16.55Mr_Rabies2time lapse <_<
04:16.58zenzelezzThrae: not sure I understand how you mean
04:17.18Thraezenzelezz: Have you ever played any Final Fantasy game 7 or higher?
04:17.23zenzelezzno
04:17.28TainTime Lapse?  We playing Magic: The Gathering now?
04:17.41ThraeTain: Chronomaggus
04:17.57Mr_Rabies2that's something i hated about the final fantasy games
04:18.02TullerFFXI's nice thing is combo attacks, I think.
04:18.19Mr_Rabies2summons that are basically unskippable cutscenes that you get entirely tired of watching
04:18.26Mr_Rabies2until you get boost, it's really annoying
04:18.50TainChromag is a sissy.  I thought I'd like his random power stuff until it was just all almost the same strategy no matter what.
04:18.51XuerianAnimation speed slowing can be halarious in games. "Bullet Time" in Soldat for one... Everyone is almost dead, all of a sudden... Cinematic mode! bullets bouncing off the wall, limbs flying, blood spraying everywhere, then everything falls to the ground covered in red :P
04:18.56Mr_Rabies2and it's only not annoying once you get boost because you want to hammer the keys as fast as possible to boost during the unskippable cutscene
04:20.29ThraeWell, for those unaware of normal console RPGs, one eyecandy is to have certain animations stop time until completed. Picture this, time stops, camera focuses on Ragnaros and the closest player. Ragnaros picks up the player and throws him/her into the lava, then causes the lava to explode in a huge stream, causing 99999 damage to that player and ~1000 damage to everyone nearby the lava.
04:21.03XuerianOhh. That would be hellish =|
04:21.05Mr_Rabies2it would be entertaining the first time, but after that, annoying :[
04:21.15Mr_Rabies2like the MAG specials in PSO
04:21.20Mr_Rabies2i wanted to skip those soo much
04:21.25TainAnd a big gripe I have with console RPGs is sometimes not being able to skip those long cutscene attacks.
04:21.41ThraeMr_Rabies2: Why does everyone quote Final Fantasy 8 to say the entire Final Fantasy series sucks? FF8 is well-known by fans to be the worst in the series.
04:21.51Mr_Rabies2i didn't say the series sucked
04:22.03Mr_Rabies2i just said that was part of the series i hated
04:22.06ThraeWell, the idea with a MMORPG to make it cool while not making it too long as to be prohibitive.
04:22.20TainFF8 sucked, but screw you all, FF7 was absurdly overrated.
04:22.46zenzelezzregarding cutscene(ish) stuff, the one thing I hated about the KotoR games was talking to wookiees... minutes of moaning/groaning sounds
04:22.47Mr_Rabies2i liked 9 pretty well from what i played
04:22.47ThraeI think NOT having some flashy animations makes it worse -- you can basically play WoW while looking at the ground and not miss much.
04:23.02Mr_Rabies2i gave up on console RPGs a while ago
04:23.17Industrialff sucks the end. i bet in ffMMDXIIV you still get to save a stupid chick
04:23.18TainThat is true Thrae, and I have done that to gain fps
04:23.39Mr_Rabies2if i wanted a long involving story, i'd read a book and be more entertained, without all the frustration of the boss fights that ensue
04:23.43ThraeIn fact, a time-freezing animation might be a blessing since it won't hurt FPS as the server animation doesn't need to be updated ;)
04:23.49Industrialoverdone story and it began with zelda
04:23.51Industrialwich also sucks
04:23.53Industrialand mario
04:23.54Industrialditto
04:23.54Industrial.
04:24.07TainOf course Ind has to go too far.
04:24.11Industrial;P
04:24.16Mr_Rabies2i liked Grandia more than FF by a landslide
04:24.20TainSuper Mario Bros had the best story!
04:24.30ThraeXenosaga is a good story-game :D
04:24.33Tain"I'm sorry Mario, our Princess is in another castle."
04:24.41Mr_Rabies2<Thrae> Xenosaga is a good story
04:24.42Mr_Rabies2fixed
04:24.56Mr_Rabies2it's not a game, it's a dvd with some special features of running through halls and fighting things
04:25.15ThraeYou're thinking of Xenosaga Episode I...II & III have a much better fighting engine
04:25.29TainI'm playing Enchanted Arms (well will be once my Xbox 360 is returned from repairs) and Disgaea 2.
04:25.50Mr_Rabies2i heard disgaea 2 was pretty good
04:25.53Mr_Rabies2the translating crew threw in a lot of easter eggs i heard
04:26.08TainBy the way, if anyone's contemplating buying an Xbox 360... buy the extended warranty.  Seriously.  Buy it.  You *require* it.
04:26.22ThraeI bought La Pucelle Tactics after playing out Disgaea and starting on Disgaea 2.
04:26.42TainDisgaea was one of my favorite RPGs ever.  Disgaea 2 follows in the same vein.
04:26.56TainNot as good so far, but worth it.
04:27.10Mr_Rabies2i want a 360, i'm seeing if they decide to drop the price once the wii hits
04:27.10ThraeTo say Disgaea and Disgaea 2 are "tactical" games isn't really accurate, I'm not sure what to call them.
04:27.30zenzelezzalthough the story wasn't all that, I don't think any game has kept me so scared while playing as AvP2 did, especially the human campaign. Had to keep taking breaks and calm down
04:27.43Mr_Rabies2AVP2 is an adrenaline rush
04:27.47Mr_Rabies2AVP1 is TERRIBLE
04:27.58Mr_Rabies2never play it, the ai is the worst thing i've ever seen
04:28.18ThraeLike in Disgaea 2 my Magic Knight is killing everything in 1 hit at Level 12 ;)
04:28.58Mr_Rabies2i love grandia's fighting engine
04:29.12Mr_Rabies2probably the best console rpg fighting engine other than straight realtime
04:29.16ThraeWasn't Grandia for the Saturn?
04:29.22Mr_Rabies2uh, i think initially
04:29.25Mr_Rabies2and PSX
04:29.32ThraeOh yeah.
04:29.33Mr_Rabies2no random encounters
04:29.39Mr_Rabies2you can see the enemies wandering around
04:29.53Mr_Rabies2if you attack them before they aggro or from the behind, you get an initiative
04:29.54TainDisgaea 1 was worse for that Thrae once you got Majins
04:29.56ThraeYeah, I hate random encounters. I'm glad the FF series is finally trying to get rid of them.
04:30.17ThraeTain: I never even bothered with Majins, just leveled up Laharl to an insane level.
04:30.23Mr_Rabies2you have a bar at the bottom that scrolls across based on certain factors that shows when each character's turn to attack is
04:30.41ThraeBut I haven't beaten Baal yet in Disgaea 1, since I don't want to abuse 9999 Surt ;)
04:31.07Mr_Rabies2you have to know when to use combos to do max damage or do criticals to set their little bar back enough to not get oneshotted by a giant particle beam and stuff
04:31.12TainThe Majin ... ah whatever it was, I don't even remember now, was really absurdly more powerful than anything else.  It literally was easy mode.
04:31.38TainBut I'll still give a nod to one of my personaly favorites, the first Suikoden.
04:32.10ThraeBy the time you got the Majin, the game was basically over anyway. Disgaea 2 has MUCH more replay value.
04:32.45Mr_Rabies2oh dreamcast, how i miss you :[
04:32.54Mr_Rabies2i'm watching some grandia 2 cutscenes
04:33.07zenzelezzthe closest thing I've ever been to a console is my Amiga 600 :-o
04:33.43TainI loved Laharl. "No, I think I'll just call you Mid-Boss"
04:34.13ThraeTain: Did you watch the anime?
04:34.31TainI didn't, I didn't know there was one until just recently.
04:35.29AnduinLotharlol. new spam email format subject: New message from Jeffrey on MySpace sent on Oct 05 23:10:00 MSK 2006
04:35.51AnduinLotharImportant to note I dont have a MySpace account
04:36.04TainEveryone has a MySpace account!
04:36.33zenzelezzI think I can count on one hand the number of times I've even visited MySpace
04:36.59ThraeI have a Monster.com account, and got solicted on my spam email address to take a money laundering job from Latvia (some might remember this country from the old show, Taxi)
04:37.00TainI had to create a MySpace account to view the profile of a band that I took pictures for.
04:37.08TainI was annoyed.
04:37.17Mr_Rabies2oh yeah, grandia 1 and 2 are partially voice-acted :D
04:37.54zenzelezzI don't remember that country from that show, but I remember it from geography in school O_o
04:37.59*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (n=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)
04:38.29ThraeI probably retain what I learned there, but the time I spent there is a blank.
04:39.34zenzelezzI remember being tossed out of the school library once in high school because we ordered pizza in there
04:40.55Mr_Rabies2http://youtube.com/watch?v=3Jje6NhyyFE weee...grandia 2, fighting the heart of an evil god thing that happens to look like a boat/tentacle monster
04:41.04ThraeDammit! The new WoW Forum's coding deletes your entry in the new post form box if you press Forward and Back.
04:41.21ThraeI was writing something, waited too long and it logged me out, so I lost my post.
04:42.12Cairenntext editor + copy & paste ftw
04:42.27ThraeWell this was my first post with the new forums, heh.
04:42.52Cairennand now you know :)
04:44.06Mr_Rabies2man, now i wanna fire up my dreamcast and play some grandia 2
04:44.53zenzelezzdo beasts retain their resistances when tamed?
04:45.30Mr_Rabies2no.
04:45.35Mr_Rabies2not anymore
04:45.46zenzelezzno point taming this wolf then :-/
04:45.52zenzelezz100 all resistances
04:45.56Mr_Rabies2now they start at 0 and you can train in some of them
04:46.31Mr_Rabies2for TP
04:47.21Mr_Rabies2there's no real reason not to use a cat now, unless you like the boar charge
04:47.24zenzelezzyup, know that... would just have been nice if they did retain their "wild" stats
04:48.26zenzelezzin a group PvE situation, is it necessary to have Cower; or can you do without?
04:48.35Mr_Rabies2cower is worthless
04:48.57Mr_Rabies2if your pet is pulling aggro the warrior sucks
04:49.24Mr_Rabies2my cat has bite, claw, growl, and dash
04:49.45Mr_Rabies2with an addon that toggles autocast based on focus, always keeping enough focus to growl
04:51.10zenzelezzinteresting, thanks =)
04:51.37Mr_Rabies2http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=4869
04:52.10Mr_Rabies2petextend is what i use for pet management
04:52.20Mr_Rabies2helps a lot
04:57.48kergothpetextend is very useful indeed
04:59.02tyroneyI like crabs.
05:12.06Mr_Rabies2petextend is most of what smartpet once was, and some more
05:15.08zenzelezzwhat about talents, are things like Great Stamina or Natural Armor worth the cost?
05:34.20Corrodiasi haven't played my hunter again since "the change", when i rearranged my keybinds again so i can't use control+1 to make my pet attack
05:34.45Corrodiasand +2 to make him come back. i hope smartpet or petextend has a good "toggle attack" keybind, but i don't remember.
05:36.52zenzelezzthere is a pet attack keybind in the stock UI
05:36.57zenzelezzI've mine set to shift+A
05:37.21zenzelezzdon't know about the stop/return though
05:42.22Corrodiasarr.
05:42.37Cairenn.rra
05:42.46Corrodiaswell, it's easy enough to rebind "special bar" buttons 1 and 2
05:47.41Cairennhttp://www.vampireposers.com/albums/userpics/10001/family_planning.jpg
05:47.59zenzelezzlol
05:48.00Corrodiashah
05:49.24Cairennand much too funny considering the link however Kirk put up all those hours ago today
05:51.49zenzelezzyour "however" has me a little confused at what you're saying
05:52.13Cairennerrr, yeah, that shouldn't have been in there
05:52.35Cairennhttp://feministing.com/archives/005806.html (nsfw) is the one I was referring to
05:52.53zenzelezzoh yeah, I remember now
06:09.37MentalPowerOMG... That video is awesome!
06:09.45norgsyeah
06:09.52norgswatching it at the moment
06:11.41Cairennmy favorite line of the whole thing is at the very end
06:12.01Cairenn|sleepnight guys
06:12.19Mikmann Cairenn|sleep :)
06:12.20zenzelezznight
06:12.36Mr_Rabies2well this is traumatizing
06:12.55norgsheheh - you're right - that last line is great
06:13.01norgsnite cair
06:13.10krkaCairenn|sleep: pong!
06:16.37MentalPowerkrka: check your e-mail
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06:18.07MikmaCairenn: wb!
06:18.15Cairennheh, thanks
06:18.29Cairenndamn people ponging me just as I'm trying to go to bed
06:18.33MentalPowerCairenn: you sleep fast!
06:19.40Mr_Rabies2http://nutop.shackspace.com/apoc.gif
06:20.02krkawhat did i do? :(
06:20.29Cairennponged me as I was going to bed
06:20.55Cairenns'okay, you aren't the first, you won't be the last
06:21.02Cairennseems to always be the way
06:23.22krkasuch are the rules of the ping/pong protocol!
06:24.28Cairennindeed
06:25.29MikmaCairenn: i have a solution for you. don't use away-nicks :D use /away reason , then people don't know you are going away
06:25.51Cairennmeh
06:25.57Mikma<PROTECTED>
06:36.26Cairenn|sleeptrying this again ...
06:36.52Endping! no, wait jk
06:37.03Cairenn|sleep*grin*
06:37.11Mikmaawaynick spotted!
06:37.15MikmaCairenn|sleep: ping!
06:37.32MentalPowernight Cair :)
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06:39.04krkaouch
06:39.43Mikmadon't worry, she's not that mean :)
06:40.07krkayou tricked me!
06:40.26Mikmalawl, that means i pwned j00! ;)
06:52.34MentalPower|ZZzzok I'm out guys, gnight
06:53.09zenzelezznight
06:53.12KemayoIt's sad.  I just checked, and Auctioneer takes up almost as much memory as all my other addons combined.
06:53.17KemayoGoodnight!
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06:59.07ckknighthey all
06:59.23zenzelezzheya
06:59.33KemayoWelcome.
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07:06.17UE|Firega-Stonemhey
07:06.41UE|Firega-Stonemanyone have any tutorials for sendaddonmessage????
07:06.49UE|Firega-StonemI cant get the thing to work correctly
07:10.15fox689hey what is the macro command to use an item
07:10.29fox689?
07:11.23UE|Firega-Stonemdont know :(
07:11.31fox689k
07:18.39Kirochi|Sleepinghello you guys
07:19.56UE|Firega-Stonemhello
07:20.09UE|Firega-Stonemkirochi do you know how to use the sendaddonmessage?
07:20.20Kirochino
07:20.26Kirochiis this a lua or irc function ?
07:20.30UE|Firega-Stonemlua
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07:20.48UE|Firega-Stonemman need to figure this out
07:20.58Kirochilol, I know as much of lua as you do traditional uzbek dances
07:21.12UE|Firega-StonemI have this kick but 4hm mod but i cant send my start command to the rst of the raid
07:24.07IrielUE|Firega-Stonem: What are you trying to do?
07:24.37UE|Firega-Stonemi'm
07:24.46UE|Firega-Stonemtrying to sync the start of multiple addons
07:25.20UE|Firega-Stonemso basically we have this strategy that starts when the 4hm are engaged so i want the raid leader to beable to press start and have it broadcast to start to all the members
07:25.31UE|Firega-Stonemi dont want to do on agro because thats to inaccurate
07:25.59IrielWouldn't you just do SendAddOnMessage("YourAddOnName", "Some Message", "RAID")
07:26.12Irieland of course make sure you registered for the CHAT_MSG_ADDON event
07:26.26UE|Firega-Stonemyea then you pull the args out
07:26.32UE|Firega-Stonembut for some reason thats not working
07:26.49IrielDid you check you didn't typo your prefix
07:26.55Irielare you SURE you registered for the event
07:27.07UE|Firega-Stonemya.
07:27.12IrielAre you SURE you're checking the args in the right order (arg1 is the prefix, arg2 the message, arg3 the type, arg4 the sender)
07:27.18IrielAre you sure you're testing in a party or raid?
07:27.30UE|Firega-StonemThats what I'm runing through now
07:27.39UE|Firega-Stonemi made a seperate addon to handle my communications
07:27.52UE|Firega-Stonemjust trying to find a tutorial on how it works.
07:27.55IrielI dont believe YOU receive the addon messages you send
07:28.01Irielhttp://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11621317&sid=1
07:28.06IrielThat has all the details you should need
07:28.18Irielsee the 'Communications' piece in the first post
07:28.53KirovYou do, actually
07:29.01IrielKirov: Handy to know
07:29.14UE|Firega-Stonemlolz is that kirov from gorgon?
07:29.15KirovI swap RAID for GUILD whent testing sometimes
07:29.20UE|Firega-Stonemyea
07:29.22IrielKirov: I would imagine you need to be in a party or raid to receive party or raid messgae, etc?
07:29.24KirovHeya Firega
07:29.31UE|Firega-Stonemlol hey kirov :)
07:30.05UE|Firega-Stonemyea thats what i'll do
07:30.06fox689anyone know how to script macros?
07:30.20UE|Firega-Stonem^ these guys do
07:30.32fox689yay!
07:30.51KirovI know nothing
07:31.07fox689I'm trying to use several different items that are on idependant cooldowns
07:31.21fox689independant*
07:32.15Kirovk
07:32.40ckknightindependent.
07:32.56fox689I knew something was still wrong with it
07:36.46Eufedid any1 here check out the rdx mod?
07:37.13Eufespecificaly Alerts objects in it
07:37.34Kirovnope
07:38.50Eufeguy that wrote that is realy pr0 with lua...studiying it I kinda learned to thing in diferent way when doing a lua adons :)
07:39.12Eufebut the more I study it, the more bug I'm finding :(
07:39.55Eufething=think :P
07:42.17KirovEufe - Word of advice, if you really want to learn how to make the most inefficient code possible, keep reading the RDX stuff.
07:42.54zenzelezzsounds bad
07:43.52Eufenah, I'm not using anything else then the Alert object...and I'm not using it, I just stole some ideas from it
07:44.14Eufeand for the alerts its not that inefficient
07:46.08EufeI'm actualy writing my own version of the mods that I have installed, but for which I think are poorly writen
07:46.32Eufeor for the ones that have tooooo much overhead for the things I'm using
07:46.35UE|Firega-Stonemhey kirov
07:46.49Eufeexample is zuxanas citizen model
07:46.51UE|Firega-StonemI jsut cant get this damn thing to work can i pm it to you on the asgard forums?
07:47.05UE|Firega-StonemOMFG
07:47.05Kirover, just ask here
07:47.09UE|Firega-StonemNVM
07:47.11UE|Firega-Stonem...
07:47.31UE|Firega-Stonemtypo ftl
07:47.40Kirovhehe
07:47.52UE|Firega-Stonemi had ChAT_MESSAGE_ADDON instead of CHAT_....
07:48.01zenzelezzinteresting, I believe someone asked if you were sure you hadn't typoed =D
07:48.48Eufec/p events from WoWWiki...always...even if you know what to type, just c/p....thats my word of advice :P
07:50.55UE|Firega-Stonemdammit
07:50.58UE|Firega-Stonemstill not working
07:52.06KirochiWoWwiki's down
07:52.17KirovFirega - what's the problem?
07:56.03UE|Firega-Stonemcheck your tells
07:56.06UE|Firega-Stonemor your message
07:56.09UE|Firega-Stonembasically
07:56.12UE|Firega-Stonemi cant receive events
07:57.40UE|Firega-Stonemcan i paste my code here without folkes getting mad?
07:57.54UE|Firega-Stonemwell i'll get kicked for spam
07:57.58UE|Firega-Stonemits like 20+lines
07:58.06zenzelezzhave a look at the topic
07:58.45UE|Firega-Stonemkk one sec
08:00.06UE|Firega-Stonemhttp://wowi.pastey.net/1372-2899
08:00.43KirovFirega - what frame is calling these?
08:02.10UE|Firega-Stonemi'm doing it from command line but the frames set onevent is bound correctly
08:02.16UE|Firega-Stonemone sec i'll pasty that code too
08:03.11KirovIf you're runing tester_OnLoad() then "this" is some random blizzard frame instead of your frame you actually want registered
08:03.32UE|Firega-Stonemhttp://wowi.pastey.net/1373-2uvo
08:03.46UE|Firega-Stonemoh k
08:03.49UE|Firega-Stonemwhats should that be then?
08:04.09UE|Firega-Stonemliek where do i do my register then?
08:06.10KirovFirega - that appears to all be setup correctly btw
08:06.45Kirovso, not sure what's up
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08:07.34UE|Firega-Stonemyea this is iratating me to death
08:07.39UE|Firega-Stonemi just cant recieve
08:07.48UE|Firega-Stonemsend comes back with no errors
08:09.42UE|Firega-Stonemdo you have any addons that I oculd see that use this command?
08:11.01KirovSimpleTranqShot
08:11.12Kirovgive me a sec
08:11.23UE|Firega-Stonemkk :)
08:14.25UE|Firega-Stonemwow i just defined retarded again
08:15.12Kirovhmm?
08:15.23KirovYou do that al lot
08:15.34zenzelezzlol
08:15.39UE|Firega-Stonemi was sending CHAT_MESSAGE_ADDON instead of CHAT_MSG_ADDON
08:15.51KirovWell, you were receiving
08:15.58UE|Firega-Stonemyep i am now
08:16.07UE|Firega-Stonemsexy sexy sexy
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08:16.14UE|Firega-Stonemthanks for your help
08:16.19UE|Firega-Stonemand yea first time in lua
08:16.25UE|Firega-Stonemwtb java lolz
08:18.24Kirovtime for me to get some sleep
08:18.43Kirovnight
08:18.47UE|Firega-Stonemnight
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09:06.41TemKirkburn: poke
09:14.29UE|Firega-Stonemhey
09:14.37UE|Firega-Stonemanyone know how to make a window resizable?
09:17.30UE|Firega-Stonemanyone?
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09:25.19IndustrialUE|Firega-Stonem: look at tinytip
09:25.23Industrialcode i mean
09:26.27Industrialerrr tinytip
09:26.31Industrialim really sleepy
09:26.35Industrialmeh never mind
09:26.48UE|Firega-Stonemk
09:28.17UE|Firega-Stonemtinytip doesnt have a xml frame
09:45.07[Ammo]that's because xml frames are nolonger needed
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09:59.52whoughtonstonages!
09:59.55whoughtonerr, stoneages
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10:01.53Industrial:P
10:02.16whoughton:-o
10:02.35Industrial12pm im seriously fucked up right now
10:02.47whoughtonlol, 3:30 in the afternoon here
10:02.52whoughtonand they don't sell alcohol today
10:02.58Industriallike, if i let my head hang ill sleep
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10:03.20Industrialbut i did level 50-52 today, hah!
10:03.21Industrial:P
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11:54.10whoughtonwow
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12:03.54JoshBorkemorning
12:04.02zenzelezzheya
12:04.15zenzelezzhm, don't bears usually have higher armor than hitpoints?
12:06.21Maldiviahmm, the supposed total lockdown of spell casting and targeting functions looks to be true :|
12:06.43Kasois this what Kirkburn was saying yesterday then went scarily silent about?
12:06.43zenzelezzhm?
12:08.01Maldiviabasically, that functions like CastSepllByName, UseAction etc are being protected
12:08.09Kasowhat the fuck
12:08.14Kaso50% of addons wont work
12:08.22zenzelezzwhen?
12:08.37Maldiviawell, to what extend I don't know yet, since it's still all hush hush since of the NDA
12:08.44Maldiviaexpansion
12:08.44Kasomm
12:08.47Kasowhere'd you find out
12:08.53Kaso(if you dont mind saying)
12:09.06Maldiviawell, there are numerous "rumours" post on the forums
12:09.27Maldiviaand got the framexml files from a person who shall remain unmentioned
12:09.40zenzelezzI find it hard to believe they'd go that far, but I guess we'll see
12:10.35Kasowe'll have to see i guess, but it does sound very limiting if it was
12:10.58Kasoi mean, at least 3/4 of my addon folder wouldnt work if it was complete lockdown
12:11.08Maldiviabasically, it destroys all "click to cast" addons, aswell as decursive etc
12:11.28AnduinLotharhow recent is the code you have?
12:11.31Kasowhat about addons that just Hook UseAction etc to get spell casting infomation
12:11.40MaldiviaAnduinLothar: from the patch 2 days ago
12:12.12Maldiviaaccording to the forums, there's a toggle for how you can use he function in and out of combat
12:12.50AnduinLotharI'll reserve judgement until beta
12:13.03Kirochiwho hoo
12:13.11MaldiviaPersonally, I don't mind them breaking decursive
12:13.13nevcairielis the beta under an NDA as well ?
12:13.13Kirochihave you guys seen the wow south park episode ?
12:13.18Maldiviabut click casting, that's just plain mean ;|
12:13.24AnduinLotharnever know what kind of things they might be toying with in alpha
12:13.39nevcairielbut i liked decursive in some fights :/
12:14.10MaldiviaI've never used decursive, and recent that kind of addons, that auto-selects spell and target for you
12:14.13AnduinLotharimo the fact that decursive is required by guilds means that the game mechanic is broken.
12:14.15Kasoi'll get mass dispell, i dont mind not having decursive :>
12:14.26KasoKirochi : it sucked
12:14.27nevcairielmeh.
12:14.35nevcairielwtb mass-disple for druids
12:14.43MaldiviaAnduinLothar: I don't use it, and still I'm often on top of the decursing charts at the end of fights...
12:15.03nevcairielyou have decursing charts? oh my.
12:15.04Kirochi"gawd that was such an über pwnage"
12:15.26Kasothe only time i really use Decursive is in alterac valley, just stand behind the pack mashing the button
12:15.45Maldivianevcairiel: toyed around with SW Stats, and found it had that option - was a good way to see who was slacking in decurse-encounters
12:16.02nevcairielwell with raids getting smaller, i guess the need for decursive gets smaller.
12:16.08Maldiviatrue
12:16.15Maldiviaor well, not really
12:16.16nevcairielwe all just need to l2dispel
12:16.27Maldiviasince the number of decurses will also be smaller
12:16.58nevcairielmass dispel of the priests only does magic-debuffs right?
12:17.03Kasoyah
12:17.05Kasoor buffs :>
12:17.09MaldiviaKaso: decursive will be deadly in expansion :)
12:17.35MaldiviaKaso: hehe, consider doing a mass dispel, and hitting 3 Unstable Afflictions :)
12:17.46Kasoowch, true
12:17.49nevcairielhm lots of debuffs and buffs which are new in expansion have effects on dispel
12:17.54KasoThe other day Kirk mentioned Macros when he was being hushhush about this, have you "heard" anything about that
12:18.01nevcairielmaybe its really their way of getting rid of it
12:18.11Beladonayou guys do realize that a vast majority of leaked info is incorrect, or may have been right at one time, but has changed. There is a reason they don't go public with info right away. What might be true one day, may not be true next week
12:18.27MaldiviaBeladona: we know
12:18.30nevcairielits not like we have anything else to talk about :)
12:18.30Beladonathats why they have people testing it
12:18.46Maldivianevcairiel: exactly :)
12:19.14Beladonaand whoever the guy is that spread this rumor needs to be shot, especially if it is true, and he is telling NDA stuff
12:19.36MaldiviaBeladona: if you were a Dane, I'd refere you to the song by TV-2 where they sing "Come, let's complain, that's what we do best" (translated from Danish, ofcourse)
12:19.36Beladonabut anyway, heading to work, be back soon
12:20.06nevcairielblizzard will shot him already, if they find out
12:20.08Beladonalol
12:20.10nevcairieland its more then a rumor
12:20.50Beladonaand I agree with Andiun -- I personally banned decursive in my guild
12:21.04Beladonanot because Blizz may or may not like it
12:21.13MaldiviaI haven't banned it in my guild, but I have told them that they should strongly reconsider...
12:21.16Beladonabut because it promotes stupid player syndrome
12:21.59nevcairieli could never get our moron priests to remove decursive, or even if they would, we would die because noone dispells anymore :D
12:22.11Beladonawhen a guy says "I don't know what spell to use to get rid of that poison" and then says "nm, I will just get decursive" -- I have a problem
12:22.46MaldiviaBeladona: Naah... then it's time to find another player to replace him :)
12:23.04Beladonathats what I mean by my having a problem -- with him
12:23.07Beladonahehe
12:23.19Beladonaokies bbs
12:24.41Maldiviaohh, and the information might not have come from anyone playing the beta, since you could download the client and actually play on the test servers using it - for a while anyway, until Blizzard found out and patched it :)
12:24.59Maldivia(why do I always find out such information too late)
12:26.15nevcairielheh
12:26.19zenzelezzperhaps that was why Kirk also said "nvm" and went silent?
12:26.27Maldiviadunno
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12:34.50InchonI'm surprised the info took this long to leak out
12:35.21Maldiviacould be a recent change, or could just be something they are trying out...
12:35.35MaldiviaWe don't know what the end result will be until the patch is released
12:36.28Inchonit would be nice if they'd be a bit more open from the addon point of view during their development
12:36.48Inchonbut I guess perhaps they've invited the more well known addon writers to alpha or beta
12:37.35nevcairielbut i dont play on US, and EU is screwed anyway and always
12:37.37Inchontrust me nev, it's easier to just make friends with an employee ;)
12:37.53Inchonhowso?
12:38.00[Ammo]EU's support/input is mostly ignored
12:38.18nevcairielsee UI forum on US
12:38.30nevcairielthere are those MVPs who actually know stuff, and CMs who actually care
12:38.33[Ammo]same with the test servers on EU, no support no nothing
12:38.35nevcairielsee UI forum on EU
12:38.40Inchonhunh, never bothered to check the EU side :(
12:38.47nevcairielyou will see nothing :D
12:38.48Kasoour point exactly ;>
12:38.59KasoYah, i'm jumping on EU sucks bandwagon
12:39.52[Ammo]reason blizzard stated was 'the devs are american's and can't speak all your languages'
12:39.59Kasolike there have been a couple times when bugs and stuff are mentioned on EU forums, they go un-heard unless Maldivia is nice enough to use his US account to relay it
12:40.04[Ammo]and us europeans playing on english servers can't speak english I guess' :)
12:40.08Inchonlol ammo
12:40.22Inchondevs don't speak english though
12:40.27Inchonthey only know yiddish
12:40.48nevcairielive talked briefly to a german CM on an after-show event on the GamesConvention back in august. but he didnt tell much.
12:40.59[Ammo]so we get an unsupported testserver that just 'is' to please the masses willing to try out an epix'd character
12:41.14[Ammo]where normal testing is impossible due to the large amount of retards coming on the servers
12:41.22[Ammo]and nothing being done about it, because they're unsupported
12:41.23MaldiviaKaso: yeah, I try to relay what I find, and that has not been mentioned on the US forums :|
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12:41.54nevcairielEU test servers are basicly big pvp battlegrounds for the stupid masses
12:42.01[Ammo]yeah
12:42.02MaldiviaKaso: but recently, there hasn't been much response to the bug reports I've done :|
12:43.15Kasospeaking of this: There was a thing a while back, someone reported wow.exe memory leak when using SimpleHTML thing or something along those lines, do'y remeber anything about that
12:43.33Maldivianot really
12:44.53nevcairielive had a weird fatal yesterday, anyone had that one before?
12:44.54nevcairielThis application has encountered a critical error: Not enough storage is available to process this command
12:45.42nevcairiel(i wonder if they actually read the bug reports you send with that tool)
12:46.23Maldiviahmm, you running low on disk space on your harddrives?
12:46.47nevcairielno drive below 4GB free space
12:47.15nevcairieljust happend when i joined AV and ran into the first group of enemys
12:48.10Maldiviahmm.....
12:48.31nevcairieli droped from all other bg queues, but other then that, whatever
12:49.00MaldiviaNow I know who has information about the security model in the scriting interface :)
12:49.33Inchonany alpha tester
12:50.29Maldiviaperhaps - but people in this channel...
12:50.48InchonI only know 1
12:50.52Maldiviabut I should probably refrain from telling the names
12:51.42Inchonso I guess you're verifying that there are changes? ;)
12:52.44MaldiviaI don't know
12:53.47Inchonheh
12:55.39InchonI wonder if the green-texter's get auto-invited to alpha/beta
12:55.58Maldiviathe only ones that get auto-invited are those on the "auto-invite list"
12:56.14Maldiviaand the winners of certain compititions
12:56.57Maldiviathe "auto-invite list", also known as the "Blizzard Friends List": http://www.blizzard.com/support/?id=awr0698p
12:57.15Inchongoing and looking for iriel...
12:57.30Maldiviahe's there
12:57.41Maldiviaso are some of the other MVPs
12:57.43Beladonamonkeys!
12:57.49Inchonheh, I always thought iriel was a she
12:57.56Beladonaerm, no
12:58.13Inchonso the green texter's are always friends
12:58.23Maldivia<PROTECTED>
12:58.34Maldivia"Daniel" kind of gives it away...
12:58.38Beladonathe green texters are just people considering to be "respected" in the community, and know what they are talking about
12:58.54Inchonbut they all seem to be on the friends list
12:58.57Maldiviathen why am I not green... Ohh... nevermind :)
12:58.59Beladonabut I guess you can call them friends, since Blizz gave them the green text
12:59.08Inchonwhat ever happened to KyanMehwulfeTheRed
12:59.36Inchonhe was everywhere in original beta
13:00.36Beladonagreat, slow browsing here at work, and it seems to be atdn doing it
13:00.40Beladonabastiges
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13:10.51LegoroloHullo!
13:10.58LegoroloDoes anyone else have problem logging in to WoW EU forums?
13:11.17MaldiviaLegorolo: is today your billing day?
13:11.33Legoroloumm.. possibly
13:12.19Legoroloi thought that only affects US users
13:12.20Inchonhh
13:12.20Legoroloi never had this problem, but then again my billing date is once every six months, so i could just have missed it by luck
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13:52.55Maldiviahmm, the more I look at the rumoured changes, the more I actually like them :)
13:59.38TS|SkromO.o
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13:59.45AnduinLotharwell there's 1/4 of them..
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14:01.01FISKER_Q2/4 now
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14:02.45AnduinLotharlike a quintuple split, hawt
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14:08.58Kirochi~sickometer Kirochi
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14:48.54malrethOMG!!! Blizzard is removing all spells with BC!! they're ruining teh game!!!
14:49.09malrethmy cousin, greg told me
14:49.33malrethi play a mage. this is a slap in the face. how can I play if there are no more spells?
14:50.30jimzy?
14:50.38Tuplad!
14:50.51jimzyur smoking crack
14:50.53malrethugh! NERFED!
14:51.08malrethalso, you should totally take me seriously
14:51.13malrethpurl, me
14:51.15purlnever take malreth seriously
14:51.18malrethsee!
14:51.23Tupladpurl, me
14:51.24purlhttp://www.taikamaailma.org/gallery/Sekavaa/1080065830042.jpg
14:51.24Legorolomalreth: you heard it wrong, it's not spells they are removing, it's weapons!
14:51.25malrethwait!
14:51.30Legoroloit's a slap in the face for melee classes
14:51.33TupladIMBA
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15:26.59[RTE]hello fellow modders
15:27.37[RTE]Folks, I need a BIG favour
15:27.46malreth[RTE]: It's awful! They're nerfing weapons in BC!!! no more weapons!
15:27.55cogwheelXD
15:28.01malrethLegorol said so
15:28.08[RTE]My account was hacked yesterday and I have found the trojan responsible
15:28.13malrethouch!
15:28.18Mikmagz
15:28.40[RTE]is there someone here who can disassemble this trojan and try toi figure out where does it send the info?
15:28.48malrethhttp://www.sysinternals.com/Utilities/RootkitRevealer.html
15:29.01MikkZzz[RTE]: What do you hope to gain by that?
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15:29.23MikkZzzChances are it's to an IRC channel on some wonky network, or to some webmail address that's read via a proxy
15:29.33malrethhttp://www.majorgeeks.com/download3155.html
15:29.37MikkZzzI.e. untraceable unless you start examining boxes down the chain
15:30.20[RTE]well, I do not want to try to find them, I know it is almoust hopeless
15:30.40[RTE]what I want to do is spamm them with usless info at least
15:30.58[RTE]this way this particular trojan may be rendered usless
15:32.00malrethusing hijackthis and rootkitrevealer will help you find the files on your drive
15:32.16malrethusually, most trojans will have a config file somewhere
15:32.21[RTE]I already have found them
15:32.26malrethit'll contain the... info
15:32.27[RTE]aha
15:32.28malrethyeah
15:32.43malrethread through the config files and find out if it's an irc channel or what
15:32.57malrethit's usually pretty obvious...
15:33.09Maldiviascan the exe file for strings
15:33.14malreththat too
15:34.22[RTE]the file is only 24k and is called svch0st.exe
15:34.45[RTE]thre has to be a "resurector" somewhere in the runtime, but I was not able to find it
15:34.54Maldiviavery common file name for vira/trojans
15:37.12*** join/#wowi-lounge Bh (i=fy@cpe-67-10-171-71.houston.res.rr.com)
15:42.10[RTE]alright, here's the result of the scan:
15:42.11[RTE]HKLM\S-1-5-21-1409082233-1202660629-682003330-1003\Software\SecuROM\!CAUTION! NEVER DELETE OR CHANGE ANY KEY*5/16/2006 8:48 PM0 bytesKey name contains embedded nulls (*)
15:42.11[RTE]HKLM\SYSTEM\ControlSet001\Services\sptd\Cfg12/4/2006 3:11 PM0 bytesAccess is denied.
15:42.34[RTE]looks like 2 regestry entries, but address seems wrong
15:43.19*** join/#wowi-lounge Beladona (n=Beladona@24.129.136.26)
15:43.19*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Beladona] by ChanServ
15:43.55[RTE]I've found the second one, but not the first one
15:44.07Beladonapoing!
15:47.22[RTE]alright, I've found ptipbmf.dll in my run, any idea what that is?
15:51.46zenzelezzlooks like a driver of some sort from the Google results
15:55.51MaldiviaRTE: You have a Promise raid controller ?
15:55.57[RTE]yeah, thats it
15:56.06cogwheelHehe... who knew my rogue alt would come in this handy? http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=32273782&postId=322110057&sid=1
15:56.06[RTE]I just looked into the instalation log files
15:57.05*** join/#wowi-lounge wereHamster (n=wereHams@gw.ptr-62-65-141-13.customer.ch.netstream.com)
15:58.26[RTE]Alright, so far I have only found that svch0st.exe file and thats it :(
16:03.03[RTE]<DO NOT CLICK!!!> http://us.hacker2008.com/Img/wow/img_b.asp was in the svch0st file
16:06.21Tupladwhy wouldnt I click it ?
16:06.34[RTE]hell knows what it does
16:07.12Tupladclick on it and find out >:)
16:07.12[RTE]I'm pritty sure it is just an asp script the receives and filters the info, but still
16:07.31malrethhacker2008? oh please
16:07.44malrethi'll click
16:07.52[RTE]I already did
16:07.55[RTE]empty page
16:08.06malretheh... yeah
16:08.19[RTE]looks like a backdoor
16:08.38*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=gryphon@mail.alexdevco.com)
16:08.48XuerianThen you're probably right about it being a receiving page :P... I believe I removed a svch0st from my or someone else's computer at some point.... /shrug. I just root them out tehn yank them out by said roots :)
16:08.57*** join/#wowi-lounge Royal (n=m@cp291458-a.landg1.lb.home.nl)
16:09.21[RTE]I want REVENGE!
16:09.57[RTE]ip: 61.145.116.10
16:10.06[RTE]anyone got a T1 line? :)
16:10.20MaldiviaHow do you know my IP?
16:10.25Maldivia:)
16:10.30[RTE]=P
16:17.52MaldiviaRTE, you've been hacked by some Chinese...
16:18.13Maldiviainetnum:      61.144.0.0 - 61.147.255.255          descr:        China Telecom
16:18.23MikkZzzIf I poke some friends, I probably have a few gigabits of backbone connectivity... why? :-P
16:19.19[RTE]I already called in a favour :) in about 2 hours they gona get some heavy traffic
16:19.31Cairenn|sleeplol, nice [RTE]
16:19.48[RTE]morning Cairen
16:20.05[RTE]"Mess with the best, die like the rest" :D
16:20.07Mikkbetter to just send the isp an abuse report
16:20.15Mikkhave em yank whatever's thre
16:20.20[RTE]like that's gona do something?
16:21.19Mikkbetter than DoSing the target _and_ hurting the ISP in the process
16:22.12[RTE]should I send the info to Blizz or some goverment authority?
16:22.36Mikkyou don't want to let blizzard know that your account has been tampered with
16:22.42Mikkthat just results in it being shut down
16:22.52[RTE]it already is
16:22.57Mikkah
16:22.58[RTE]they killed all my chars
16:23.06Xueriano_0
16:23.12XuerianOwch.
16:23.40Mikkthen by all means give blizzard what you have
16:24.13[RTE]at this point I would rather take my chance with Blizz restoring it then leveling them all up over again
16:24.28Mikkindeed
16:24.37Mikkdo you know what you downloaded to get this trojan?
16:25.11[RTE]no idea
16:25.21[RTE]it must have been on my machine for a while
16:26.33Cairennand yes, pass the info along to the service provider as well.  most have an abuse policy that this will be breaking
16:27.39[RTE]I think Blizz will pass that info along the proper chains
16:27.49Cairennnot their job
16:27.55[RTE]darn
16:28.03Cairennthey might, but why not make sure?
16:28.25[RTE]true, anyone knows the email of ChinaTelecom admin?
16:28.31malrethhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penis_removal
16:28.41cogwheelO.O
16:28.48Xuerianuh
16:28.57Cairenn[RTE]: http://www.chinatelecom-h.com/
16:29.22Mikkabuse@chinatelecom-h.com
16:29.45Irielouch! What did I do?
16:30.31malrethBlizzard is deleting all spells and weapons from the game and also Lucifron will show up every time you log in and mass aoe curse you and 25 of your friends and 25 of their friends.
16:30.31[RTE]thanks Mikk
16:30.36*** join/#wowi-lounge leech2k (n=leech@deathgrab.com)
16:30.38malrethit was in the forums today so i know it's true
16:30.40Mikkhttp://www.abuse.net/lookup.phtml
16:31.10Mikkactually they don't have an entry so forget that
16:31.17Maldiviamalreth: what if you dont have 25 friends?
16:31.20Mikkabuse@domain.tld is pretty standard tho
16:31.31malrethwho doesn't have 25 friends?
16:31.39malrethoh...
16:31.47malreth:D
16:32.00Maldivia:)
16:32.16malrethwell, since you'll cause fewer people to get aoe cursed, more people will want to be your friend... up to a point
16:32.20malreththen they'll hate you
16:32.33malrethit's a self-balancing system
16:33.12MaldiviaCan't we make it a petition so it curses out enemies instead... then I'd get a lot of friends! :)
16:33.22Mikk[RTE]: CC it to anti-spam@ns.chinanet.cn.net also
16:33.32malretheasy.. just make friends of your enemies
16:34.02malreththat's why there's that saying... "keep your friends close and your enemies closer so that they get cursed"
16:35.12*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn|Vista (n=Kirkburn@82-32-40-219.cable.ubr06.azte.blueyonder.co.uk)
16:35.58[RTE]blizz's report email is hacks@blizzard.com ?
16:36.37Cairennyup
16:36.43Kasoi love cladhaire's post on the forums.
16:37.40*** join/#wowi-lounge Nochni (n=Inchon@222.165.183.194)
16:38.11Cairennhilarious, what?
16:39.12Kasouh?
16:39.50Cairennit's an expressioin
16:39.54Cairennjust agreeing with you
16:40.12Kasooh ok then
16:40.37XuerianStereotypical british "Wot" expression, no? :P
16:40.42Cairennindeed
16:40.43[RTE]alright, wheels are turning
16:40.44Kirkburn|VistaWot wot wot?
16:40.55[RTE]let's hope that at least something will be done
16:41.04Kirkburn|Vista(cue stereotypical british noseyness)
16:41.25Cairenn[RTE]: *nod*
16:41.38Cairenn[RTE]: good work tracking it back to the source, so it can get shut down
16:41.59[RTE]btw, got email from blizz, they say investigation and restoration of accoount will take 10-15 days /sad
16:42.17Cairennbut better than never getting it back at all
16:42.18[RTE]thanks, but unfortunatelly it is a dead end :(
16:42.35[RTE]Technical Contact:
16:42.35[RTE]hksafe
16:42.36[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.36[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.36[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.36[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.38[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.40[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.42[RTE]<PROTECTED>
16:42.50Xueriano_0
16:43.48[RTE]at least they did not clean out my bank account
16:45.21[RTE]Cairenn: yeah, I guess
16:46.28[RTE]alright, later yall
16:47.28malrethhe had some good stuff...
16:48.39Cairennlol
16:59.17*** part/#wowi-lounge Tuplad (n=tuplad@d54C52170.access.telenet.be)
17:00.19*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower|AFK (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)
17:01.10*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@204.155.78.140)
17:01.37*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower|AFK (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)
17:05.19cogwheelhttp://boortz.com/more/funny/redneck_pics_limo5.html
17:06.12*** join/#wowi-lounge lacindas (n=m0ney_d@76.19.51.225)
17:06.49*** join/#wowi-lounge koomi (n=koomi@e177204137.adsl.alicedsl.de)
17:06.50koomialoha
17:06.57Cairennhi koomi
17:07.06Mikmalol that was neat
17:07.09Mikmatrojans <3
17:20.18*** join/#wowi-lounge Inchon (n=Inchon@222.165.183.194)
17:20.46AnduinLotharAnyone alive that might want to play with a BankManager Pre-release and give me some user feedback?
17:21.17TS|Skrom`rofl I just one shot our priest in ST with a 3542 aimed shot
17:21.31AnduinLotharouch
17:21.50fox689"HEAD SHOT!"
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17:29.27*** part/#wowi-lounge Tuplad (n=tuplad@d54C52170.access.telenet.be)
17:31.41Kirochi~nickometer Kirkburn|Vista
17:32.07cogwheel~nickometer |Vista
17:32.43KirochiAw kay
17:32.53Kirochi~nickometer |
17:32.59Kirochi:p
17:33.15Elkano~nickometer purl
17:33.31Kirochi~sickometer purl
17:33.39Kirochidarn
17:33.44Kirochithis should exist
17:34.54fox689purl is 2000.000% sick, Kirochi
17:35.24Kirochi:p
17:35.31fox689I shoulda thrown in a 1 at the end
17:35.44fox689200.001%, oh well
17:35.51fox6892000.001*
17:36.14KirochiHey you guys I'm just creating a less-biased WoW called Horde of Warcraft, anyone wants to help ?
17:38.42Kirochi...
17:38.45axxoany bar mod, that will let me show a x*y button grid, and show them on mouse over, and allow a 'sticky' button so they stay visible? and thats not discord from hell
17:38.50Kirochi*crickets chirping*
17:43.14*** join/#wowi-lounge Qzot (n=nickell@sandbox.xerox.com)
17:43.32QzotHeyo.
17:43.53Cairennhi Qzot
17:43.59JoshBorkehola!
17:45.30*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower|ZZzz (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)
17:45.41QzotThanks.
17:46.42QzotAnyone have a sharp stick I can poke in my eye?
17:46.55QzotOr a JNI manual would work just as well, actually.
17:46.56cogwheel======================>
17:47.06Cairennwill this work?
17:47.16QzotOh. Never mind. I *have* a JNI manual.
17:49.35QzotHmm. I wonder if I could take this JNI book, snort the shredded contents up my nose, and extract them through my mouth. And if that would help...
17:50.11*** join/#wowi-lounge malreth (n=triti@cpe-72-179-20-11.austin.res.rr.com)
17:50.53Inchonwho on earth cares for JNI?
17:51.10*** join/#wowi-lounge Plorkyeran (n=Knightki@155.33.136.174)
17:51.38QzotNot me, certainly.
17:52.50malrethi neither care nor not care
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17:54.05MikkI make heavy use of all my books beginning with "J"
17:54.11MikkThey tend to be pretty thick
17:54.16MikkSo they make excellent monitor stands
17:54.19JoshBorkelol
17:54.41JoshBorkeMikk: new request for WoWBench: threaded XML parser so it speeds up the load in
17:54.58Mikkhaha
17:55.08Mikkactually, the biggest problem is RAM crunching
17:55.09JoshBorkeMikk: <3
17:55.24JoshBorkeMikk: meh, i've got enough on my WoWBench machine :-D
17:55.32*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower|ZZzz (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)
17:55.36MikkErm, pardon, wrong term
17:55.50MikkThe biggest problem is Lua's memory management coupled with how much data I'm parsing in
17:56.17JoshBorkeMikk: just send the corrections to lua upstream ;-)
17:56.29MikkI tried taking a snapshot of the env after loading FrameXML once
17:56.32MikkAnd restoring it
17:56.45MikkTaking the snapshot took only marginally less time than parsing the XML to begin with
17:56.48MikkAnd so did restoring it
17:56.58MikkSo you'd need to reload like 20 times to see a speedup
17:58.16MikkI do have a wild plan of dumping the Lua env state to disk tho
17:58.22Mikk(Or another RAM buffer)
17:58.28MikkJust memcpy()ing it over ought to be a nice increase
17:59.07*** join/#wowi-lounge Cairenn (n=Karen@CPE00045a2bfcbc-CM000f212f84be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
17:59.07*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Cairenn] by ChanServ
17:59.58Mikk(On a sidenote, try the "-q" switch. Works with most addons)
18:00.59*** join/#wowi-lounge End (n=end@72.25.151.58)
18:02.48JoshBorkeI use it :-) i'm still impatient
18:05.52*** join/#wowi-lounge End_ (n=end@72.25.151.58)
18:06.30Mikkhehe
18:06.56Endwhat the hell, I'm connected twice
18:07.03End_hi there everyone!
18:07.07End*wink*
18:07.11MikkThe memcpy approach would certainly speed up multiple char loading
18:07.41koomiis there a way to see/figure out memory consumption in lua?
18:08.05malrethyes... but the numbers are meaningless
18:08.24koomiso i can see but not figure actual usage? :)
18:08.25kergoth"The problem with political jokes is they get elected."
18:08.27*** part/#wowi-lounge End_ (n=end@72.25.151.58)
18:08.59malrethDEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(gcinfo())
18:09.05malrethi think i have that right
18:09.09malrethoff the top of my head
18:09.52Mikkkoomi: The problem is that you're sharing mem space with all the other addons. It's hard to tell what's "your" usage and what's someone else's usage
18:10.05MikkHaving said that, there's a couple of debugging addons that attempt it
18:10.10Endsee, it's like a bowl of soup....
18:10.11End;p
18:10.12MikkMeasuring RAM increase on startup
18:10.19MikkMeasuring RAM increase on events
18:10.32malrethand when you take function hooking into account... even if you could figure out 'your' memory usage, it might actually be someone else's memory usage
18:10.33MikkBut keep in mind that Lua is garbage collected, so what it really does measure is RAM churn
18:10.50Mikk<PROTECTED>
18:11.20MikkE.g. if you hook ChatFrame_OnEvent, and do all your work there, it'll seem like FrameXML starts using more RAM, and you use none
18:11.22malrethalso, in The Burning Crusade... RAM is going away
18:11.28Mikkhaha
18:11.40malrethit's being replaced with olive loaf
18:11.41koomiMikk: well. just loading mine should give me an idea on how much mem is used, right?
18:11.42cogwheelalong with weapons?
18:12.17Endembedded libs make it confusing too, since multiple addons have a copy of the lib for at least a little bit
18:12.25Mikkkoomi: http://www.wowace.com/files/index.php?path=%21%21Warmup/
18:12.49JoshBorke...malreth
18:13.11Mikkkoomi: http://www.wowace.com/wiki/Ace2_Memory_Concerns explains the problem with embeddable libs very well also
18:13.28Mikk(err.. no, rephrase.. there's no problem with embeddable libs. the problem is MEASURING it accurately.)
18:13.55Endwell, remember, some of your copies get destroyed
18:14.41malrethyou are now golden, brown, and delicious!
18:14.52JoshBorkemmm, i'm so delicious i could eat myself!
18:15.09Xuerian.....
18:16.06JoshBorkeanybody got a copy of the ChatFrame lua code hanging around?
18:16.18malrethuh... yeah
18:16.34JoshBorkethat i can wget from somewhere?
18:16.36*** join/#wowi-lounge Beladona (n=Beladona@24.129.136.26)
18:16.36*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Beladona] by ChanServ
18:16.37JoshBorke^_^
18:17.12malrethwell, easy place is http://wdn.wowinterface.com/
18:17.19JoshBorkereally i just need FloatingChatFrame.lua
18:17.55Beladonahttp://wdn.wowinterface.com/code/live/FrameXML/FloatingChatFrame.lua
18:18.51JoshBorkedakne :-)
18:19.31JoshBorkeoh wow, it's pretty too!
18:19.48malrethBela, you should add Bitstream Sans Mono to the CSS
18:19.56malrethTrebuchet is nice, but...
18:20.04Beladonalol
18:20.27XuerianIf you're a medieval army, maybe
18:20.40BeladonaI take it you don't have Segoe UI
18:20.50Xuerian<3
18:23.48Beladonamalreth, what OS are you on?
18:23.51*** join/#wowi-lounge hugo (i=hugo@hugo.scnet.cz)
18:23.55hugohi
18:24.01Gryphenheya
18:24.14malrethright now? OS X
18:24.21Beladonafigured
18:24.38malrethyou could tell because of my elegance in IRC
18:25.09Beladonano, because Bitstream isn't a common font in windows
18:25.24malrethit isn't common on OS X either.
18:25.32malrethVera Sans Mono, that is
18:25.36Beladonathen why would I put it in my css? lol
18:25.55malrethbecause it's the font that Real Programmers (tm) use
18:26.04Beladonauhh huh
18:26.06malrethpurl uses it
18:26.12cogwheelI use Vera Sans Mono in MonoLua
18:26.12malrethand he knows everythign!
18:26.25malreths/ign/ing/
18:26.34malrethsee! he knew what I meant to say!
18:26.51cogwheel~purl
18:26.52purlrumour has it, purl is not one of the smart ones
18:26.54Beladonais there a list somewhere with the common base fonts used in OSX, and Windows?
18:27.28cogwheelInteresting forum icon... http://forums.contractoruk.com/images/smilies/extras/suicide.gif
18:28.38Beladonapoing! http://www.wpdfd.com/editorial/osxfonts.htm
18:30.14malrethhmm...
18:30.20malrethone sec... gonna check something
18:30.32Beladonahttp://www.wpdfd.com/editorial/wpd0704news.htm
18:30.40Beladonagood writeup on fonts common to both
18:31.05cogwheelzapfino > all
18:31.21*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@user-0cei8bp.cable.mindspring.com)
18:35.01PlorkyeranFixedsys > all
18:35.12GeoDaMancerGah!
18:35.17*** join/#wowi-lounge dreyruugr (n=chatzill@66.77.144.6)
18:36.09cogwheelPlorkyeran: sadly, Opera 8 & 9 have problems rendering certain fonts, and all Helvetica comes out as Fixedsys on my computer :(
18:36.25cogwheelotherwise i'd be using it instead of FF probably.
18:36.35PlorkyeranI wish I had that bug :P
18:36.44PlorkyeranI strongly dislike Helvetica for some reason
18:37.16PlorkyeranAlthough reading blocks of text in fixedsys is kinda hard
18:38.52Mikkcogwheel: Eh?
18:39.31cogwheelMikk, it's only on windows machines which don't have Helvetica installed by default. The Helvetica font comes from HP printer software, and for some reason Opera chokes on it
18:39.41JoshBorkestupid stubs in wowbench :-(
18:39.53Mikkhmwa?
18:39.59Mikkthe _notimplemented ones?
18:40.01JoshBorkeGetChannelList() returns nil
18:40.04Mikkah
18:40.09Mikkfix it =)
18:40.27JoshBorkeanyone in game want to tell me what GetChannelList returns? specifically the type on the first field (and the value)
18:41.02Mikk1, "General", 3, "LocalDefense"
18:42.15JoshBorkeerm, it's not even implemented.
18:43.01JoshBorkewhere do i add functions that aren't in the lua files?
18:43.28TS|Skromhuh?
18:43.56TS|Skromnm
18:43.59JoshBorkehm, _in WoWBench_, where do i add functions that aren't defined anywhere :-D
18:44.09TS|Skromneeded to scroll up and see you were talking about wowbench and not wow ><
18:45.24*** join/#wowi-lounge Asni (n=insa@179.80-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)
18:46.25Mikkapi.lua mostly
18:46.33Mikkalphabetic order, simply =)
18:48.39JoshBorkefull and dud are my only options?
18:49.09JoshBorkefor descriptions :-)
18:49.59Mikkhalf
18:50.50JoshBorkehm, i guess i should really label it DUD since it doesn't return modifiable information
18:52.15GeoDaMancerMerf.
18:53.15GeoDaMancerI think I've messed up somewhere in my math. ^^; My DPS meter is very inaccurate, biased towards the last damage. <.< Is that good, or bad do you think?
18:53.45*** join/#wowi-lounge Shabador (n=shabador@ti400720a080-5027.bb.online.no)
18:54.24JoshBorkeGeoDaMancer: what is teh function you're using to calculate DPS?
18:54.34JoshBorkeis it an average or what?
18:55.08GeoDaMancerIt's sort of an average over the last battle. It calculates heavy on the damage, I believe, but I haven't tested it in battle, 'cause I'm rather lazy. xD
18:55.22GeoDaMancerAnd because I don't feel like getting beat on to test it. xD
18:55.38*** join/#wowi-lounge leech2k (n=leech@deathgrab.com)
18:55.44malretheh, just use an exponential smoothed weighted moving average
18:56.12GeoDaMancerUhm, when hit, it saves the damage from the hit, and the time, then on the next hit it calculates the damage per second between the last hit, and this hit, the averages it over the battle.
18:56.36malrethaverage of averages?
18:56.48GeoDaMancerHuh?
18:57.02JoshBorkea very simple function is (total damage)/(total time)
18:57.18GeoDaMancerThat would probably be better.
18:57.30GeoDaMancerAt least work a bit better. xD
18:57.32malrethGeoDaMancer: yeah, the way you described it is you're taking an average of averages...
18:57.56JoshBorkeif you check out Borked_Monitor (on wowi) it has a floating exponential decaying average
18:58.01GeoDaMancerOh, yeah. xD Taking the average DPS, which is the average damage per second. xD
18:58.11GeoDaMancerFor the thirty second tracking?
18:58.35JoshBorkei only track up to 15 seconds
18:58.45GeoDaMancerAlright, but still. xD
18:58.54GeoDaMancerWhat's the link to the wow-i page? xD
18:59.27JoshBorkehttp://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?s=&id=5236
18:59.29malrethi wrote one here: http://www.wowace.com/forums/index.php?topic=2023.0
18:59.30GeoDaMancerThat would probably work better for my purposes, elsewise in a long battle the DPS meter would get -really- skewed.
18:59.40JoshBorkemalreth's is probably better
18:59.55malrethit's several posts down
19:00.07malrethlocal trend = 0
19:00.08malrethfunction Aegis:ExponentialWeightedMovingAverageWith10PrecentSmoothing(value)
19:00.08malreth<PROTECTED>
19:00.08malrethend
19:00.08GeoDaMancerI figured.
19:00.24GeoDaMancero.o I don't have Aegis.
19:00.30Beladonaok malreth, I removed Trebuchet MS, and added Tahoma, hows that
19:00.38malrethdon't worry about the Aegis thing...
19:00.46malreththe math is what matters
19:00.49GeoDaMancerThat's for your script, right?
19:01.08JoshBorkewow, that's way simpler than the math i use...
19:01.11JoshBorketime to update...
19:01.25GeoDaMancerValue is what, though?
19:01.37malreththe exp weighted moving average with 10% smoothing is designed to be simple
19:01.48malrethit's what accountants used to use to average spreadsheet values..
19:01.55malrethback when spreadsheets were made of dead trees
19:02.00malrethand they used pens
19:02.09malrethso you had to have really really really easy math
19:02.09GeoDaMancerI still do that. >.>
19:02.33malreththere's a shortcut to doing it in your head that's stupidly easy
19:02.34GeoDaMancermalreth, my only problem is I'm not sure what the variable value is for. xD
19:02.56JoshBorkehrm, that's already what i'm doing :-/
19:02.56malrethoh... you'd have to read the thread... the code was written for that guy's specific problem
19:03.15GeoDaMancerAhhh, I think I get it, the value is whatever you're trying to average out. >.>
19:03.18malreththe code isn't the BEST way of doing it
19:03.36malrethbut the trend variable contains the current average... well, the current trend
19:03.50GeoDaMancerThat works much better than what I have.
19:04.13GeoDaMancerThe trend is what I need, rather than the average, since the trend would better reflect what's going to happen in the future. >.> Which is what my script is for.
19:04.17malrethit would be better if it didn't rely on a local variable
19:04.27malrethsince it means you can only do one trend analysis at a atime
19:04.36malrethwhich is a critical shortcoming
19:04.53malrethbut rewritten to use a lua closure or an object, it would be even better
19:05.06GeoDaMancerWell, I'd write it into a function, and have the trend stored in a table, while the trend and value fed into the function. >.>
19:05.32MikkBeladona: Idea: Link to http://www.wowwiki.com/Interface_Custommization rather than the wowwiki front page?
19:05.36malrethwell, hope it helps.
19:05.46GeoDaMancerLua has objects besides tables? o.O
19:05.58GeoDaMancerIt looks like it will, mal, thanks.
19:06.08malrethhttp://www.lua.org/pil/6.1.html
19:06.14BeladonaMikk
19:06.19Beladonathat page is blank?
19:06.25malrethclosures are a powerful feature in the lua language
19:06.33*** join/#wowi-lounge Cairenn (n=Karen@CPE00045a2bfcbc-CM000f212f84be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
19:06.34*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Cairenn] by ChanServ
19:06.35malrethbut it can be tough to use them well...
19:06.42Beladonanm, one too many m's in your link
19:06.56malreththey're like a 3 segment polearm
19:07.40GeoDaMancerI hate Lua's documentation. xD
19:08.09malreththat's not lua's docs... it's the PIL book
19:08.15malrethcheck it out
19:10.25GeoDaMancerHrm, so a closure is a function saved as a variable, almost?
19:11.12malrethbigger than that
19:11.31GeoDaMancerIt's a funky version of OOP.
19:12.28malrethyou can do object like things with them
19:12.41malrethsuch as protected or private variables
19:12.58GeoDaMancer*Nods.* Such as OOP in Java. xD
19:13.43malreththe newCounter() example on that page is a good one
19:13.56malrethit returns a function
19:13.56GeoDaMancerYep.
19:14.07GeoDaMancerIt's rather interesting. I does? *Missed that.*
19:14.24GeoDaMancerWow, yeah.
19:14.47malrethnot a whole lot of languages support closures
19:14.57JoshBorkehrm, so what's faster? for i = 1, arg.n, 2 do or local i = 1 while arg[i] do ?
19:15.02GeoDaMancerThat is seriouslly cool. >.> If I can harnass the power of that! HAHAHAH!
19:15.19malrethfor-loops compile to more efficient bytecode than while loops
19:15.37malrethbut not by much
19:15.47malreththe difference is very slight
19:16.09JoshBorkehm, is that because a for loop can do a better job of unlooping?
19:16.10malrethbut, i prefer for-loops anyways since they look cleaner
19:16.27malrethlua doesn't unfold loops
19:16.30GeoDaMancerUnlooping? >.>
19:16.55GeoDaMancerAnd anyway, you can make a for loop into a while loop rather easily. <.<
19:17.04JoshBorkeand vice-versa, i know :-)
19:17.21GeoDaMancerI end up using way too many while loops. xD
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19:19.09malrethsorry... the wiki says different:
19:19.10malrethfor loops are quite a bit faster than while loops, since they have specialized virtual machine instructions.
19:19.17malrethi guess they're faster than i thought
19:19.27malrethhttp://lua-users.org/wiki/OptimisationCodingTips
19:19.32Kasoso:
19:19.48Kasowe were talking about the Nameplate frames the other night
19:20.12Kasodid anyone say they were going to use em do healing - over - head stuff?
19:21.32JoshBorkei've used them occasionally
19:21.37malrethoh... you didn't hear
19:21.43JoshBorkei expect them to be patched in a future patch
19:21.51malrethblizzard is removing healing from the game in Burning Crusade
19:22.00GeoDaMancerHealing?
19:22.01malrethbut they're moving graveyards closer
19:22.02Kasoha
19:22.17KasoJoshBorke whatcha mean
19:22.22malreth10 second run from GY to boss in most cases
19:22.34GeoDaMancer*Lost*
19:22.42malrethit's true!
19:22.44malrethpurl, me
19:22.52purlmalreth has been level 46 for longer than the World of Warcraft has been out
19:22.52GeoDaMancerHuh?
19:23.04malrethno, purl... that's useless information that no one needs
19:23.12JoshBorkeKaso: based on what Gello posted, using the bars you could determine where on the screen a named player is located.  since all of the bars are anchored to the bottomleft
19:23.37JoshBorkeso in PvP you could have a big red circle hovering over a unique player so you could always find them
19:23.57JoshBorkeassuming they are on your screen in some place
19:24.04Kasohow would they patch it out though?
19:24.08malrethand within range
19:24.12JoshBorkei have no idea :-/
19:24.22malreththe healthframes don't show up until you're really close to someone
19:24.29Kaso20yrds
19:24.39Kasoi think maldivia said it was that last night
19:25.23Kasobut yeh it poses some interesting posibilties
19:25.48Kasoi might do a SCT like thing with the healing numbers above the heads and the size done by CheckInteractDistance
19:26.03JoshBorkeo.O that'd be cool
19:26.04Maldiviathe nameplate range... yeah 20yds
19:26.12PlorkyeranNon-shitty healthbars for everyone within 20 yards would probably be possible
19:26.27PlorkyeranGet the health % from the statusbar value
19:26.35GeoDaMancerOh, now I get what you people are talking about. Although Malreth confused me. xD
19:26.50malrethi have that effect on a lot of people
19:26.53JoshBorkeoh good, we have another distance check :-D
19:27.12GeoDaMancerWhat was that about no healing in the BC? xD
19:27.14JoshBorkeIfHasNamePlate then distance ~= 20 yards
19:27.18Kasowasnt there a max number of nameplates on screen?
19:27.23JoshBorkethe sky is falling
19:27.36PlorkyeranI think it's just that it runs out of space for them :P
19:27.59malrethpurl, Burning Crusade?
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19:31.23malrethpurl, Burning Crusade?
19:31.24purlwell, burning crusade is an expansion pack for the successful MMO, World of Warcraft, by Blizzard. Reportedly, it will break all addons, not allow you to target anyone, cast any spells, use any weapons, heal any friends, randomly curse you and 25 of your friends and 25 of their friends, chat, or log off.
19:31.42malreth~botsnack
19:31.42purlmalreth: thanks
19:31.49malrethno, thank you!
19:32.00XuerianHaha
19:32.26GeoDaMancerHa-Hah! That's great.
19:33.09*** join/#wowi-lounge _aLEX (n=Alexandr@d83-179-194-186.cust.tele2.fr)
19:33.42cogwheelIt seems to me that forum mods are moving threads into UI & Macros from other places
19:33.47cogwheelcontributing to our pain
19:33.54GeoDaMancerOh shite. That's rather useful. >.> x = x or v... xD
19:34.14cogwheelGeoDaMancer: you never read PIL 'till now? :)
19:34.37GeoDaMancerNope. I only read the documentation when I finally need to. xD
19:35.09cogwheelI'm partial to    CastSpellByName(condition and "Spell 1" or "Spell 2") myself :)
19:35.42GeoDaMancerShe-it! That'd be so much simpler than what I have. o.O;
19:36.23malrethyep... it's a nice way to do the C-style ternary operator
19:36.33malrethx ? y : z
19:36.49GeoDaMancerI hate that, actually. xD
19:36.57malrethx and y or z (provided that y is not nil)
19:37.19cogwheelyou learn to love it when you're trying to cram as much as possible into 255 characters ;)
19:37.22PlorkyeranI've wanted lua-style boolean operators in basically every language I've used :P
19:37.32GeoDaMancerHeh.
19:37.53GeoDaMancerI don't like Lua, actually. It's way too... Unstructured, I guess. Well, it's syntax is so different.
19:37.55PlorkyeranThey're more readable than piles of ?: and can save a lot of copying and pasting
19:38.50PlorkyeranLua's strange because it feels like every feature of it I like was just a lucky side effect of something else
19:39.42GeoDaMancerHeh. I wish it had more support for the { } as do/then and end. xD
19:40.01QzotIs there a wiki how-to on getting mouse position within a frame, correctly accounting for scaling issues?
19:40.05malrethooh... just read about this one that i hadn't thought of...
19:40.06malreth<PROTECTED>
19:40.06malreth<PROTECTED>
19:40.06malreth<PROTECTED>
19:40.06malreth<PROTECTED>
19:40.06malreth<PROTECTED>
19:40.27GeoDaMancerWhat's that for?
19:40.54malrethif you have a value that you need to calculate but it's really complicated
19:41.09malrethyou might be tempted to write that as
19:41.26hugohey, i cant script im just player, im looking for some lua script that allow me to make custom aliases, like in the file i write something like alias ch chatlist , and when in game i use /ch 1 it send command /chatlist 1
19:41.33hugoanyone know how to do that please ? ;]
19:42.10malrethlocal zz = (x + y + z)^3 + (x + y + z) + math.sqrt(x^2 + y^2 + z^2)
19:42.30TS|Skrommalreth that was dangerous
19:42.44TS|Skromright after someone who admist to not being a scriptor chats... you go and do something like that
19:42.48TS|Skromyou could have exploded his brain!
19:42.51TS|Skromshame on you!
19:43.04PlorkyeranActually, that reminds me a lot of scheme
19:43.37malrethPlorkyeran: actually, on the wiki page that describes this pattern, it mentions that too!
19:43.42QzotIs there a wiki how-to on getting mouse position within a frame, correctly accounting for scaling issues?
19:43.44malreth(let ((n (+ x y z))
19:43.44malreth<PROTECTED>
19:43.44malreth<PROTECTED>
19:43.45malreth)
19:44.15Plorkyeraneww, newline before ) is bad
19:44.21PlorkyeranIt makes you actually look at the parens :P
19:44.34malrethparens is all i ever see when i look at lisp
19:45.06PlorkyeranSetting them to a faded color helps a lot
19:45.46malrethhugo: there's no easy way to do what you ask
19:46.00malrethbut... it can be done
19:46.25hugoi need somethink that works from a scripter where i could just rewrite the aliases :-o
19:47.24TainSo did we get any solid news on what this disabling all click casting stuff in the expansion is about?
19:47.31PlorkyeranNo
19:47.42QzotTain: ??
19:47.48malreththere are nda breaking posts from people in the alpha that haven't been confirmed
19:48.07TainYeah I know, that's why I figured I'd see if anyone here heard any more. :)
19:48.08Qzotmalreth: Link?
19:48.24QzotTain: I doubt anyone here who knows would break NDA.
19:48.30PlorkyeranIf the posts are true they're trying to not kill clickcasting, though
19:48.52TainNo, but people around here are more intelligent about it and would have ways of suggesting perhaps one wouldn't have to worry.
19:48.52QzotIs there a wiki how-to on getting mouse position within a frame, correctly accounting for scaling issues?
19:48.54malretha lot of the bitching and moaning is way overblown
19:49.06QzotTain: There ya go.
19:49.48malrethTain: one thing that was mentioned on a forum somewhere was: "iriel, gello, etc aren't complaining so i'm not worried"
19:49.55malrethand i agree with that
19:50.08TainI'd never expect someone to actually break an NDA in here.
19:50.15QzotIriel has not said he's in the alpha, afaik.
19:50.27TainPart of the NDA is typically not telling anyone you're part of it.
19:50.29malreththat being said, I am not under and NDA
19:50.30IrielQzot: See my coordinate system page for the underlying concepts
19:50.41malrethso i'll tell you this
19:50.44QzotI'm under an NDA.
19:50.55QzotBut not Blizzard's.
19:50.56malrethBurning Crusade will prevent you from even using a web browser
19:50.57IrielQzot: There's some code that does it in StatRings but I wouldn't expect decyphering it to be worthwhile
19:51.22TainOne thing I do know is something prevents me from running WoW and Eve Online at the same time.
19:51.23QzotIriel: Is it just dividing by a scale I snag from somewhere?
19:51.25malrethFirefox developers are pissed... Microsoft is going to sue
19:51.26TainMy PC goes *boom*
19:52.02IrielQzot: Pretty much (GetLeft, GetBottom, GetEffectiveScale are all you should need)
19:52.02malreththat's because Eve Online is better
19:52.19TainDifferent!  NOt really even comparible.
19:52.28QzotIriel: Ah. I'm only seeing GetCursorPosition. Those must be frame methods.
19:52.34malrethTain: no... Better.
19:52.52malrethWoW is but a pretender. It's not even fit to be called a 'game'
19:52.58IrielQzot: they are,  you comapre the cursor position against the numbers you derive from those frame methods
19:53.24IrielQzot: Or you scale the mouse coords and translate based on the frame coord
19:55.27TainAhhh!  The pain!  Ewe Boll is doing a Bloodrayne sequel
19:56.07IrielYou mean one wasn't enough!
19:56.13IrielDear god that man is a sadist
19:56.31TainI think he's just doing it on purpose now.
19:56.44malrethdamn germans
20:03.16QzotIriel: Experimentally, this seems to work. Look good to you?
20:03.19MentalPower|ZZzzCairenn, can you get to datavertex??
20:03.34Cairennchecking
20:03.49Cairennnope
20:04.50MentalPowerk,thanks
20:16.31*** join/#wowi-lounge Xuerian (n=Xuerian@12-196-151-225.psknet.net)
20:16.53KasoI write java, and im not wearing any pants, or so my tshirt alleges, free stuff owns!
20:17.14cladhaireKaso: I just got a textbook for fre.
20:17.15Kaso(bare in mind where im from pants are underwear :>)
20:17.17cladhairemine's less exciting.
20:17.36Kasoha
20:17.52Kasoto be honest i might get more use out of a textbook
20:18.10*** join/#wowi-lounge SlackerJer (n=slackerj@slacker.ucdavis.edu)
20:22.45cladhaireI just had "Compiler Construction: Principles and Practice" by Kenneth C. Louden" delivered.
20:22.48cladhaire*shrug*
20:24.53IrielI need to get in on that gig
20:25.02malrethwriting books?
20:25.22Kasogetting free tshirts?
20:25.32malrethwearing underwear?
20:25.33Irielgetting free books
20:26.30TainYay my new DL DVD burner with Lightscribe is here!
20:27.05cogwheelHehe... my wife worked for O'Reilly for about 6 months
20:27.15cogwheelmy shelves are packed with free books XD
20:27.55malrethoh man... that's awesome
20:27.55cogwheelI even had the opportunity to go to Foo camp, but decided to play WoW instead XD
20:28.03malreththat is less awesome
20:28.08Tainthat alone would be worth taking a temp job at O'Reilly for.
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20:34.02cogwheelmalreth: it's slightly more awesome than you might think since she plays wow too, but wouldn't be interested in foo camp...
20:34.23malrethmy wife plays wow too
20:34.30malrethactually, i lied. i have no wife
20:34.50[floyd]:D
20:34.52cogwheel:)
20:34.57Mikma~malreth
20:34.58purlmalreth is always right
20:35.52IrielYay, it's payday
20:36.11malrethbleh... working for the state sucks... i only get paid at the end of the month
20:38.51cogwheelwhy did all the "zomg i'm quiting" people have to come to the UI & Macros forum?
20:39.15malrethoh, i'm just makin fun of them left and right
20:39.21malrethhttp://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=32103871&postId=321112992&sid=1#36
20:39.28cogwheeli just read that ;)
20:40.21malrethi wonder exactly how far I can go before I get a warning or a forum suspension... i've been keeping it toned down
20:42.50cogwheelI have a very strong feeling that it's true... Though it's just that much more frustrating to see people disregarding their NDAs
20:44.11PlorkyeranThis is the type of thing that shouldn't really be leaked, too
20:44.24KirovYou must not read general forum much, malreth
20:44.32KirovEvery other post is "fuck you blizzard"
20:44.34PlorkyeranAs the "leaked" post says they aren't done with the stuff to soften it
20:44.54malrethyeah, but swearing actually does lead to being actioned
20:45.45KirovFrom the forums, sure
20:46.00malrethi just really wanna call a bunch of these people the pussies that they are
20:46.20cogwheelseriously...
20:46.23KirovAnd he didn't actually swear, he just said "F Blizzard"
20:46.39malrethoh, i'm not complaining about him
20:46.44KirovWhich, you know, could mean something like "Funny Blizzard"
20:47.06malrethi just want to know how far *I* can take flaming a person before i get reported...
20:47.14Kirovlol
20:47.20cogwheelu toh
20:47.28cogwheelblizzards internet r broke
20:47.37cogwheelnm it's back now
20:50.24*** join/#wowi-lounge artyom (n=sirlasal@CBL217-132-203-51.bb.netvision.net.il)
20:51.33Plorkyeran4. Resilience decreases your chance to be crit, and reduces the amount of damage crits do to you (both effects apply to spell and melee crits). Talents that affect crit chance still do what they always did, they increase your crit %.
20:51.43PlorkyeranApparently it does more than we thought
20:51.54malrethhmm...
20:52.53PlorkyeranReducing crit damage is a decent way of making sure damage doesn't scale high enough to allow 1-shotting ever again
20:53.00PlorkyeranAnd it doesn't effect shadow priests at all :P
20:53.25*** part/#wowi-lounge artyom (n=sirlasal@CBL217-132-203-51.bb.netvision.net.il)
21:00.28Tain"Looks like you're about to get pwned."
21:01.01malrethhehehe
21:01.38malrethmy fiancee and i screamed out "TRADE LAG!" when Lenny was stuck there holding the sword of 1000 truths
21:02.30TainThat really was an awesome episode.  The way Cartman starts talking all monotoned made me laugh so hard
21:05.10malrethTweak as a Gnome: AAAH! I'M ON FIRE!
21:05.33KirovI think the mom's response is the best thing in the episode
21:05.55Kirov"But his character is going to die in game if we don't do something soon!" "So?"
21:06.20Mikmai thought the whole damn episode sucked. hard
21:06.46malrethi don't think it was as good as Scott Tenorman Must Die...
21:06.53malrethand it lacked a certain something
21:07.54Mikmathe best southpark i have seen was propably the Lord of the rings -episode
21:07.54malrethbut, based on the reactions from my non-wow playing friends... if you didn't laugh at a lot of the stuff in the episode... they were probably making fun of you.
21:08.17malrethi wished that they actually killed kenny somehow, though
21:08.48Mikmamalreth: nothing actually 'touched' me in that episode and i think it wasn't even funny
21:09.05malrethlike his arm exploding from carpal tunnel or something
21:09.25malrethand then cartman has to two-box in order to keep Blessing of Salvation up or something
21:09.40malrethand THEN he has the diarrhea
21:10.20Mikmai would have understood the episode if the guy killing them would have been ie. a tauren
21:10.34Mikmabut the same faction? pff mmm'kay, drugs are bad
21:10.37malrethsee.... they're making fun of that
21:11.01Mikmafun of what
21:11.19malrethof the people who say, "it's not possible for a human to kill other alliance players."
21:11.24KirovThe whole episode is about how the dramatic events in-game are completely pointless.
21:12.08KirovSwelling music, the terrible advisary, everyone taking it so seriously ... and in the end, it didn't really matter that much.
21:12.26malretheven after the climax of the episode... the evil player is killed and he... just sat there just as motionless as when he was playing
21:12.42malrethalmost as if he really was life-less
21:12.59KirovI was expecting him to just res and keep killing stuff
21:14.36malreththat really would have punctuated the futility of the game
21:24.29*** join/#wowi-lounge Abenadi (n=mtgother@wsip-70-166-187-15.ph.ph.cox.net)
21:26.26AbenadiJust released v1.0 of my combat log grapher, "Graphic Violence" - http://www.curse-gaming.com/en/wow/addons-5424-1-graphic-violence.html  Thanks everyone in here who helped me along the way as this is my first decent-sized addon.
21:26.43cogwheelHeh... i just read that on the forum and was looking at the SS :)
21:26.53Abenadi: )
21:27.09KirovAbenadi - cool
21:27.17AbenadiI used irfanview batch conversion to make the animated gif, <3 that feature
21:28.46AbenadiBunch of stuff I still have to learn how to do but its unbugged enough for public consumption : )
21:29.18GeoDaMancerHey, Mal, I have a question about the exponential thing you showed me earlier.
21:29.38malrethfire away
21:30.00*** join/#wowi-lounge malreth (n=triti@cpe-72-179-20-11.austin.res.rr.com)
21:30.04GeoDaMancerSince the trend starts at Zero, until it progressed a bit, wouldn't it be slightly biased towards that value?
21:30.12malreth:p
21:30.53malrethonly for a while... that's what the 10% smoothing is for
21:31.22malrethvalues that are 9 or 10 samples old provide no influence
21:31.33KasoWhy does the dtframestack tooltip always appear in a random location for me
21:31.34GeoDaMancerTrue enough.
21:31.54malrethand you can play with the smoothing value to increase or decrease the sample period
21:32.13malrethbut 0.1 works out well enough, i believe
21:32.22GeoDaMancerI hadn't thought of it that way.
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21:37.57cogwheelO.o
21:38.11cogwheelthat's the second time i've gotten "The topic you're trying to post to has been deleted"
21:41.16malrethwoo! BSG tonight!
21:41.20malrethi cannot wait
21:41.36malrethi'm gonna watch it 5 times
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21:44.22malrethlater all
21:44.51cogwheelOh yeah! I forgot about that!
21:45.25cogwheel(and at first thought he said Wsg... i was like /why would you want to watch a WSG match 5 times?/ )
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22:07.20Mr_Rabies2hrm
22:07.38Mr_Rabies2i don't know where this was posted, but please don't let it be true:
22:07.44Mr_Rabies2"Essentially, we don't want UI mods to make combat-sensitive decisions for players and as such, we've made some changes that block functionality that we feel is counter to the spirit of these philosophies. As such, addons and macros will no longer be capable of casting spells or targeting units."
22:09.09[floyd]:/
22:09.14GeoDaMancerThat'd be messed up.
22:09.44cogwheelyou guys missed the boat :)
22:09.59cogwheelthat's what everyone has been talking about on the forums all day
22:10.18cogwheelThough the posts have been getting deleted
22:10.22GeoDaMancerHeh.
22:10.29GeoDaMancerI don't look at the forum. xD
22:10.40cogwheelnot even the UI & Macros one?
22:11.02Cairennuntil there is an official announcement from Blizzard, anything else is FUD
22:11.42cogwheelI do have to say, though, it is in keeping with their attitude toward mods like Decursive
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22:12.10IndustrialQuestion: Is it true that when available/usable Backstab is always better (in damage output) then Sinister Strike?
22:12.23cogwheel(the threads on the forums went into a bit more detail than the summary you gave, Mr_Rabies2)
22:12.32Mr_Rabies2yeah that was only part of it
22:12.44Mr_Rabies2i'm getting it from somethingawful's wow subforum
22:13.01Mr_Rabies2Hi there, this notification is meant to inform you of some significant changes regarding the way we're handling UI addons. Over the last few years, we've seen a number of awesome, gameplay-enhancing UI mods along with a fair number of UI mods that run counter to our philosophies regarding what addons should and shouldn't be able to do.
22:13.01Mr_Rabies2Essentially, we don't want UI mods to make combat-sensitive decisions for players and as such, we've made some changes that block functionality that we feel is counter to the spirit of these philosophies. As such, addons and macros will no longer be capable of casting spells or targeting units.
22:13.01Mr_Rabies2That being said, our programmers have implemented a host of new functionality in order to allow many popular and benign UI mods to continue to function (once those mods are updated to take advantage of the new functionality), and will be providing some follow-up information on these forums as to how to take advantage of the new functionality.
22:13.43Cairennspeculation & hearsay, or else someone broke NDA and discussion of leaked info isn't allowed here, you guys know that
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22:16.39Cairennlol
22:16.46ckknighthey all
22:16.58Cairennhi ckknight
22:17.20Mr_Rabies2we can only hope it's false though, i mean, that doesn't seem very much like something blizzard would do
22:17.25GeoDaMancerHeheheheh.
22:17.29cogwheelI disagree
22:17.43GeoDaMancerIf they do, I'm back to trying to actually pay attention to all of the cool downs of all of my mods. -_-
22:18.23cogwheeland Cairenn, since we have no way of knowing whether it's an actual leak, is it really wrong for us to be talking about it?
22:18.40cogwheelat least as a speculative discussion?
22:18.57Cairennspeculation is fine, keep it reasonable though
22:19.55cogwheelIt's been pretty well established that blizzard doesn't "like" mods like Decursive. Honestly, I'm glad I don't play a healing class because I wouldn't want to be forced to use it by a raiding guild.
22:20.40Mr_Rabies2it's pretty much necessary for the fights now
22:20.48Mr_Rabies2without it, they'd need to retune things
22:21.04Mr_Rabies2because you'd either not be getting healed or not getting cleansed
22:21.09cogwheelThey've said fairly explicitly that they don't design encounters with mods in mind
22:21.30Mr_Rabies2eh, i'd like to see a blue geared guild kill luci without anyone cleansing
22:22.06cogwheelConsidering we downed him with 28 people, i'm sure it's doable with 40 and no decursive... :\
22:22.47Mr_Rabies2i wouldn't dispel curses if i had to do it manually and watch health bars.
22:22.48Mr_Rabies2it's too much
22:22.56Mr_Rabies2i'd dispel myself and that's about it
22:23.07cogwheelPerfectRaid makes it nice :)
22:23.19cogwheelpeople get highlighted when they're cursed
22:24.03Mr_Rabies2when 20-30 people are cursed and i've gotta watch who's cursed and who needs healing, healing will come first
22:24.36cogwheelmages don't heal XD
22:24.44Mr_Rabies2druiiiid.
22:25.04Mr_Rabies2you'd need druids and mages decursing if there was no decursive
22:25.13Mr_Rabies2and i bet most of them wouldn't do it
22:25.27cogwheelThat's assuming you're anal and want everyone alive at the end.
22:25.30Mr_Rabies2i personally wouldn't, because it's far too much micromanagement
22:25.49cogwheelI guarantee you any of those encounters are doable without any mods
22:25.51Mr_Rabies2it's like playing wackamole with two paddles on two tables at once
22:26.29Mr_Rabies2and only being able to use one paddle at a time
22:26.38dreyruugrthat's why people assign things
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22:26.51dreyruugri.e. "You heal and decurse groups 4 and 5."
22:26.59dreyruugrinstead of "everyone spam decursive."
22:28.07Mr_Rabies2for most fights, that wouldn't be enough healing if you had half of them decursing
22:28.24dreyruugrwell, think of it this way
22:28.46dreyruugrI guarentee you that Blizzard makes their test department complete all raid content without the use of AddOns
22:28.57dreyruugrSo trust me when I say, you can do it too. :)
22:29.06Mr_Rabies2you'd have a lot less people playing healers if groupbuttons, decursive, and pretty much all other healer supporting addons were disabled
22:29.17Mr_Rabies2it depends on the gear they give them
22:29.24cogwheelMr_Rabies2, you don't need EVERYONE completely free of debuffs for the entire encounter
22:29.27Mr_Rabies2if they're in full tier 1 fighting luci, of course they can do it without mods
22:29.40Mr_Rabies2some fights, you do, cog
22:29.42cogwheelas long as you can keep enough people alive to deliver the killing blow, there's nothing to it
22:29.52dreyruugr"healer supporting"?  Do you mean "healer playing" addons?
22:30.01GeoDaMancerYou're all level 60 by the time you take him on, right?
22:30.18Mr_Rabies2groupbuttons isn't a healer playing addon, it's a healer support addon
22:30.25cogwheelGear ~= skill...
22:30.29Mr_Rabies2eh
22:30.34Mr_Rabies2i doubt it'll happen
22:30.38cogwheelWe spent about 5 weeks on Razorgore before we finally got him down
22:30.44Mr_Rabies2but if it does, i'll probably never healbot on my druid again
22:30.50cogwheelOur equipment did not change very much in that time
22:31.04Mr_Rabies2razor's not a heal/decurse fight
22:31.13cogwheelthat's not the point
22:31.27cogwheelthe point is people will learn to work without decursive if it breaks
22:31.47axxoppl will find ways around blizzards restrictions
22:31.50Mr_Rabies2and a lot won't, therefore less healers, which is already a big problem
22:32.01cogwheelBesides, who's really going to be going to MC after BC comes out anyway?
22:32.24axxoi will
22:32.31Mr_Rabies2yeah, most guilds will probably use stuff warden can't detect, if fights are similar in amounts of decursing/healing needed
22:32.40PlorkyeranNo EM will make more people useless than no decursive
22:34.31Mr_Rabies2and stuff like groupbuttons
22:34.44Mr_Rabies2or other click cast addons
22:35.14Mr_Rabies2everyone would be dps because they'd rather not be further victimized and would actually like to see what happened in fights for a change
22:35.22Mr_Rabies2that's already happening now with all these healer support addons
22:35.29Mr_Rabies2without them, there'd be very few healers
22:35.30Plorkyeranrank selection mods just make bad healers more mana efficient
22:35.33cogwheeli don't understand the problem with click cast... what's the difference between holding shift and pressing the mouse button versus pressing the mouse button and pressing 2?
22:36.12PlorkyeranThere are healers who can't heal more than one or two people without a EM at all
22:36.26Mr_Rabies2i don't use the EM, because you know the guy on the EM is getting spammed by heals
22:36.35PlorkyeranFor a while there were people asking for CTRA's EM in 5-man parties :P
22:36.41Mr_Rabies2i watch the bars, and shift click on those bars that are getting low
22:36.54Plorkyerancogwheel> I seriously doubt they have a problem with clickcasting
22:37.00PlorkyeranIt's just that it's hard to not break
22:37.13Mr_Rabies2well, if that email's true, they'd be removing the functionality of it
22:37.27cogwheelPlorkyeran: i meant the problem people have that it will be broken...
22:37.27Mr_Rabies2if that happened, i'd be mostly feraling places with some healing support
22:37.58cogwheelSHIFT+CLICK is no easier imo than CLICK->3
22:38.12Plorkyeranclick -> 3 changes your target
22:38.28cogwheel3->CLICK then...
22:38.32GeoDaMancerIs it wrong that my Priest has a higher amount of HP than my Warrior?
22:38.37PlorkyeranThen it casts heals on your current target
22:38.45cogwheelonly if they're friendly
22:39.01cogwheelwhy would you need to have one person targeted at all times?
22:39.01PlorkyeranSuch as if you're targetting the tank...
22:39.16Mr_Rabies2cog, have you done raid instances as a healer before?
22:39.30cogwheelAll i'm getting at is that there are other ways of doing things
22:39.45cogwheelyou can have a unit frame set up for the tank, and be just as effective.
22:39.55Mr_Rabies2i wouldn't heal if healing was even more frustrating and thankless than it already is
22:40.07Mr_Rabies2it's right on the verge for me as it is now
22:40.40PlorkyeranAlso, non-clickcasting requires two hands
22:41.03cogwheelso does click casting unless you only want to use a maximum of 5 spells (with an uber mouse)
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22:41.55Mr_Rabies2generally you use 3 spells and dispels if you're healing
22:42.00PlorkyeranYes, and my most common spells are bound to those buttons
22:42.41cogwheeland my most common spells are bound to      aoeui   (the left-hand home row of dvorak layout...)
22:42.54PlorkyeranIn PvP I generally don't downrank, which only leaves three heals
22:43.33PlorkyeranIn PvE being able to move quickly is nowhere as important, so it's not really a problem
22:43.42Mr_Rabies2i auto downrank to save space
22:43.54Mr_Rabies2i could manage without it, but i'd rather have some hostile abilities on my action bars
22:44.23Mr_Rabies2it generally does a pretty good job
22:44.26cogwheelI have a 6x4 grid of spells bound to the whole left side of my keyboard and use my mouse for movement
22:44.43Mr_Rabies2overheals by about 200-400, which is just enough to cover cast time in a lot of places
22:45.25Mr_Rabies2http://www.discordmods.com/GroupButtons/Screenshots/gb1.jpg is an example of groupbuttons
22:45.40Mr_Rabies2you can physically click the portraits to cast stuff bound to click actions
22:45.52Mr_Rabies2or you can use those buttons
22:45.56PlorkyeranI generally do pure mouse movement on alts, but it makes it hard to click on party frames while moving
22:46.03Mr_Rabies2i use the buttons in 5mans,  mouse actions in raids
22:46.18Mr_Rabies2because most of the time in raids, i cast healing touch and rejuv
22:46.44GeoDaMancerYou know, they need to update the booklet that comes with WoW. >.>
22:47.05Mr_Rabies2you mean ressing at the spirit healer doesn't break your stuff 75%?
22:47.09PlorkyeranI assume TBC will come with an updated manual
22:47.11Mr_Rabies2and you don't lose exp for dying?
22:47.24GeoDaMancerI hope, because it says that BFD is in Darkshore. xD
22:47.29Mr_Rabies2well
22:47.30Mr_Rabies2it kinda is
22:47.35Mr_Rabies2its' right on the border
22:47.46GeoDaMancerI mean, at the corner, where Bashar
22:47.49GeoDaMancerwhatever is. xD
22:47.57PlorkyeranIt was kinda out of place there
22:48.28PlorkyeranMade finding groups for BFD kinda suck as you'd constantly get people about 10 levels too low wanting to come
22:48.38GeoDaMancerAhhh. It was there for a while?
22:49.02GeoDaMancerI always thought that having all of those.. What'cha call 'ems, the nagas there made no sense.
22:49.07Mr_Rabies2when was it there? beta?
22:49.19PlorkyeranUntil 1.1 iirc
22:49.33PlorkyeranIt was at the northern tip of darkshort
22:49.48Mr_Rabies2i was level 30 around xmas
22:50.02Mr_Rabies2i got the game on december 11, was 1.1 out by then?
22:50.18GeoDaMancerI think so. I know it was out by february.
22:50.27Plorkyeran1.1 was the release version
22:50.33GeoDaMancer'Cause BFD has always been where... Ahhh.
22:50.51Plorkyeran1.0 was open beta
22:51.21Mr_Rabies2i remember being ecstatic when i logged in to find out roots were castable from all sides instead of just in my field of vision
22:51.27Mr_Rabies2i think that was patch 1.2?
22:51.40Mr_Rabies2i was like level 12 at that time
22:52.01cogwheelI bought the game on Jan 5 and patch 1.3 was the first patch I dealt with
22:52.07PlorkyeranAll druid spells used to be castable from anywhere :/
22:52.13PlorkyeranMoonfire kiting was fun
22:53.17Mr_Rabies2you can still do it if you strafe kite :P
22:53.43Mr_Rabies2full run speed and you can still cast behind you in a lot of cases
22:53.44PlorkyeranYeah, but it's less awesomly stupid
22:53.59PlorkyeranAlthough in exchange druids no longer suck in every way
22:54.03GeoDaMancerBAH! This quest is seriously getting on my nerves. xD
22:54.13Mr_Rabies2oh man, that's entertaining, throwing a watermelon up in the air and blasting it with a revolver before it hits the ground
22:54.26Mr_Rabies2garry's mod :P
22:54.36Kirov*few*
22:54.42GeoDaMancerHeheheh,
22:55.26Mr_Rabies2woo it's even more fun with explosive barrels
22:55.33Mr_Rabies2not as hard to hit though
22:55.37Mr_Rabies2explosive whisky jug!
22:56.35Mr_Rabies2oops
22:56.39Mr_Rabies2dropped it on my feet
23:03.22*** join/#wowi-lounge fox689_ (i=user@ip106-228.pft.WKU.EDU)
23:04.52IndustrialIs it possible to know if you are behind a target? I wanna make 1 button for backstab/sinister strike.
23:05.36Industrialmaking a macro with /script CastSpellByName('Backstab') /script CastSpellByName('Sinister Strike') didnt work
23:05.45cogwheelnope
23:05.57Industrialnope as in i cant?
23:06.03cogwheelthat should work, though it's much more simple to do    /cast Backstab    /cast Sinister Strike
23:06.11Cideit won't work
23:06.11Industrialhm
23:06.12cogwheelnope as in it's not possible to know if you're behind a target
23:06.12Kirovneither will work though
23:06.24Cidesince it has to wait for confirmation whether you actually are behind the target or not, before proceeding or erroring
23:06.37cogwheelah
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23:08.06GeoDaMancerDoesn't it need to be CastSpellByName("Backstab")?
23:08.23cogwheelGeoDaMancer: you didn't read PIL, did you?
23:08.25cogwheelXD
23:08.35GeoDaMancerNope, not all of it. I got busy with other things. xD
23:08.40cogwheel'string' == "string"
23:08.49GeoDaMancerAh. I've been dealing with Java too much.
23:08.53KirovCastSpellByName'Backstab' is even valid
23:08.59IndustrialKirov: ack really?
23:09.01Industrialthats ew :|
23:09.09cogwheel"with \"quotes\"" == 'with "quotes"'
23:09.54cogwheelcalling a function with a string directly has its uses...
23:10.27cogwheelI thought AceLocale's use of it was pretty nifty (barring performance concerns)
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23:10.55PlorkyeranThat was one of the few legitimate uses I've seen
23:11.11cogwheelit's extremely useful for saving space in macros :)
23:11.36*** join/#wowi-lounge Mery (i=metelman@p54AEDD6B.dip.t-dialin.net)
23:11.40PlorkyeranUsually it's Rowne-style "Look, I just rewrote CTRA in 12 characters" stuff
23:11.48Industrialwhy are macros so limited I mean they are saved ina fricken text file
23:11.50Industrial:|
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23:13.01Industrialhm, why not relay macros content to your lua file and just let a macro do /addon #
23:13.17Industrialmeh distraction
23:13.23Cidelikely an underlying design decision as much as a storage space decision
23:13.42IndustrialSo no way to crunch rogue spells into one button?
23:13.42Cides/as much as/rather than/
23:13.47ckknightIndustrial, L"x" => L("x")
23:13.48Meryand maybe they discussed / are still thinking about storing macros on the server
23:13.54GeoDaMancerFucking prospector!
23:13.58ckknightthat's how AceLocale used to work
23:14.00ckknight:-P
23:14.11IndustrialYou can do ambush+backstab depending on if you are hiding
23:14.29Industrialbut any more? :D
23:14.50GeoDaMancerIndy, you can with conditionals.
23:15.04GeoDaMancerThat's what I have setup for my rogue, he'll do certain things depending on conditions. xD
23:15.18Industrialcould you pastebin it? :o
23:15.30GeoDaMancerEr, I have a rather long one. ^^;
23:15.39Industrialoh
23:15.57GeoDaMancerIt's a multi-part addon I've been working on for all of my character classes. xD
23:16.08Industrialctl+a,ctrl+c,ctrl+v?
23:16.09Industrialoh
23:16.11Industrialheh
23:16.18Industrialwell doesnt matter :>
23:16.32GeoDaMancerIt doesn't do backstabbing and stuff like that, 'cause of the 3-D space issue.
23:17.00GeoDaMancerIf you need one for Sinister Striking/Eviscerating or whatever your prefered mode of killage is, that's rather easy though.
23:17.39IndustrialI usually just mash sinister strike
23:18.03Industrialbut thought maybe I can up my damage outpt by choosing things in a smart way
23:19.54GeoDaMancerFor the longest time I had one that would check if I could SS, or Riposte, and did Riposte if it could be, SS if it couldn't, then Evis on 5 Combo.
23:20.33IndustrialI just found a macro
23:20.41Industrial/cast Shoot Bow /cast Shoot Crossbow /cast Shoot Gun /cast Throw
23:20.55Industrialwhy is this possible but backstab/sinister strike isnt?
23:21.01GeoDaMancerThat will do the one you're equipped with, because they throw errors right away.
23:21.10Industrialah righr
23:21.13GeoDaMancerThe one you want only throws an error after it's gone to the server.
23:21.15IrielBecause backstab actually gets cast, and the server has to deny it.
23:22.40GeoDaMancerYummy, Mage Royal.
23:26.12GeoDaMancerGAH!
23:28.13CideIndustrial: like I said before :)
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23:30.03KasoGeoDaMancer i grinded my epic mount with a macro like that
23:30.15*** join/#wowi-lounge KaoS` (n=[KaoS]`@about/apple/macbookpro/KaoS)
23:30.16Kasospammed it while watching tv or whatever :>
23:30.28IndustrialCide: yeah
23:30.35GeoDaMancerHeh. I made a better one.
23:30.40Industrial^^
23:30.49Industrialim gunna make some class specific things now too
23:30.50GeoDaMancerIt has kicking capabilities. ^.^
23:31.02Industrialin my idInterface mod
23:31.03Industrial:P
23:31.12Mr_Rabies2isbuffactive is a fun addon for macros :o
23:31.22GeoDaMancerYeah. xD
23:31.36Industrialis is fast, though?
23:31.49GeoDaMancerisBuffActive? Or Mine?
23:32.25Mr_Rabies2with isbuffactive i made my hunter's melee attacks spammable by one key
23:32.43IndustrialGeoDaMancer: IsBuffActive
23:32.54Mr_Rabies2fast?
23:32.57GeoDaMancerRather fast.
23:33.06GeoDaMancerIt just checks the tolltip for the buffs.
23:33.12Mr_Rabies2yeah
23:33.35Mr_Rabies2/script if (IsBuffActive("Hunter's Mark", "target")) then CastSpellByName("Concussive Shot"); else CastSpellByName("Hunter's Mark(Rank 1)"); end;
23:33.52Mr_Rabies2that's not the macro i use, just an example of how it works
23:34.41IndustrialMr_Rabies2: yeah but I mean that it has to loop through all the targets buff and debuffs every time you make a call
23:34.59Industrialits not just a table lookup, sadly
23:35.13Mr_Rabies2/cast Mongoose Bite
23:35.13Mr_Rabies2/script if (IsBuffActive("Wing Clip", "target")) then CastSpellByName("Raptor Strike"); else CastSpellByName("Wing Clip"); end;
23:35.22Industrial(Wouldnt it be kickass to have a Player and Target object available? =P)
23:35.35Mr_Rabies2in isbuffactive, there is
23:35.50Mr_Rabies2/script if (not IsBuffActive("Arcane Intellect", "target")) then CastSpellByName("Arcane Intellect(Rank 1)"); end;
23:36.19Mr_Rabies2if you don't use , "target" then it's player
23:36.20GeoDaMancerI think it breaks/returns once it finds the buff in question, so it doesn't always look through them all.
23:36.48Mr_Rabies2what do you mean, geo?
23:37.13Mr_Rabies2once it hits the debuff it stops, so yeah, you can't really specify if it's YOUR wing clip, but still
23:37.40Mr_Rabies2it's really nice for making easymode addons
23:37.46GeoDaMancerMultiple Wing Clips can be on an enemy?
23:38.01Industrialhttp://pastey.net/1388
23:38.07Industrialit makes 4 loops per call
23:38.17Mr_Rabies2targetnearestenemy, if buffisactive, hunter's mark, cast hunters mark, else, cast autoshot
23:38.25Mr_Rabies2oh and throw a pet attack in there somewhere
23:38.30Mr_Rabies2= easymode hunter grinding
23:38.31Industrialtry mashing a button
23:38.51GeoDaMancerActually, it only invokes one.
23:39.13GeoDaMancerSince it can -only- go into one if in the whole thing.
23:39.25Industrialwell yeah
23:39.36GeoDaMancerSo it's fairly fast.
23:39.44Mr_Rabies2so is lua 5.1 backwards compatible with lua 5.0?
23:39.58Mr_Rabies2we won't have to upgrade every addon we have once bc hits will we?
23:40.13Mr_Rabies2cause i know about as much lua as i do spanish
23:40.18Industrialdepends on the authors
23:41.07jaxdahli think most will need to be updated
23:41.09jaxdahlmight be possible to write automated converters
23:41.11Mr_Rabies2damn :[
23:41.21Mr_Rabies2cause a lot of mine are discontinued
23:41.26jaxdahlto update the order of arguments
23:41.30Mr_Rabies2like isbuffactive for example :P
23:41.45jaxdahlor the itemlevel thingy
23:42.32Mr_Rabies2is there an itemlevel addon?
23:42.41Mr_Rabies2is there anywhere that breaks down how item budgets work?
23:42.50jaxdahlwell,
23:43.00jaxdahlslouken said you can get the item level of an item now
23:43.05jaxdahlwith an in-game function
23:43.10Mr_Rabies2nice
23:43.13jaxdahland that breaks the order of the arguments that are returned
23:43.15Industrialmax buffs and debuffs is 16 right?
23:43.24jaxdahlIndustrial, on a boss, it's 16
23:43.27Mr_Rabies2buffs is some huge number
23:43.30jaxdahlon a player, it's something like 32-40
23:43.31Mr_Rabies2debuffs are 16
23:43.35Mr_Rabies2on mobs, yeah
23:43.35Industrialok
23:43.58Mr_Rabies2and the buffs are huger now because enchants don't count towards them now
23:44.11jaxdahltemporary enchants yea
23:44.12Mr_Rabies2is there anything on wow wiki on item budget or anything?
23:44.23jaxdahlhttp://www.wowwiki.com/Formulas
23:46.06QzotLater, gang.
23:46.13XuerianCya
23:46.40Mr_Rabies2hrm, another unanswered question that maybe someone would be able to answer, how the hell does pet focus work?
23:46.45Mr_Rabies2is it like energy?
23:47.00Mr_Rabies2or is it like a combo between energy and rage, where it regens naturally, but also regens on hits?
23:47.08PlorkyeranYes, but it's something shitty like 24 focus every 5 seconds
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